--- Log opened Fri Oct 09 00:00:41 2020
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00:14 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke closed pull request #20103: test: Enable mocktime RPC for all test chains (master...2010-testMockAllChains) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20103
00:14 < vasild> hi
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00:17 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #20112: test: Speed up wallet_resendwallettransactions with mockscheduler RPC (master...2010-testFasterMock) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20112
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00:18 < sipa> vasild: morning
00:18 < vasild> evening :)
00:18 < vasild> (for you)
00:19 < vasild> is it on purpose that WriteCompactSize() can write big numbers, but ReadCompactSize() cannot read them?
00:22 < sipa> vasild: i think in the compactsize-is-only-for-sizes setting we used to have, the issue just didn't occur
00:22 < sipa> as it's not possible to have such a big object to begin with
00:22 < vasild> yeah, so writecompactsize was never called with big numbers
00:23 < sipa> indeed
00:23 < sipa> (and the usage in bip152 is restricted to 16-bit numbers, which obviously won't have any problems)
00:23 < vasild> I will steal that commit https://github.com/sipa/bitcoin/commit/6edfab492aa67e421af556728c1b8b4d17826b80
00:27 < vasild> I am just curous - any idea what are those high service flags 0x800043d and 0x800000d that cannot be a result of bitwise-or-ing NODE_* flags?
00:27 < vasild> of course any peer is free to claim whatever they want in their service flags, including 0xfffff...
00:28 < sipa> some high bits are used for private extensions
00:28 < sipa> not sure what this is
00:28 < vasild> ok
00:29 < hebasto> sipa: good idea to rename CompactSize
00:29 < sipa> vasild: what software/user agent reports these?
00:29 < vasild> I did not record that
00:30 < vasild> just added printf() in CAddress::unserialize to see what is coming in from the network
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00:34 < vasild> now I did -addnode=62.107.200.30:8333 to see the user agent
00:34 < sipa> they're uninteresting
00:35 < sipa> my dns seed crawler sees them too
00:35 < sipa> but they're from a variaety of innocently-loking user agents
00:35 < vasild> but now getnetworkinfo shows
00:35 < vasild>     "addr": "62.107.200.30:8333",
00:35 < vasild>     "services": "000000000000040d",
00:35 < vasild> :-O
00:35 < sipa> hmm
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00:35 < vasild> yeah, and innocent     "subver": "/Satoshi:0.20.1/",
00:36 < sipa> are they being rumoured with this bit set... but then not reported in the version message?
00:36 < hebasto> could this hurt the network?
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00:38 < vasild> sipa: must be that or something else I am missing
00:38 < sipa> i don't think so
00:38 < vasild> I just saw:
00:38 < vasild> CAddress::unser: time=1602210665, services=67109901, addr=178.128.96.96:8333
00:38 < vasild> from my printf
00:38 < vasild> shutdown, restart with -addnode=178.128.96.96:8333
00:38 < vasild> and getpeerinfo:     "addr": "178.128.96.96:8333",
00:39 < vasild>     "services": "000000000000000d",
00:40 < vasild> we don't do any "filter away any unknown service bits before displaying in getpeerinfo, right?
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00:41 < sipa> vasild: i don't think so
00:43 < vasild> just for reference, here is my dummy printf() in CAddress unserialize: https://bpa.st/JYYA
00:45 < sipa> looks right
00:48 < vasild> ok, assuming they get gossiped with the flags but are later not present in the version message when we actually connect
00:49 < sipa> perhaps some broken software is relaying them with that bit set
00:50 < vasild> wumpus: just to confirm - yes, 0.20 would start on a 0.21-modified-peers.dat as if that file was not present, I also think it is ok. Except the obscure/scary deserialize error messages
00:50 < sipa> perhaps we can give a nicer error message in the future for upgrades
00:50 < sipa> but for old software it's too late
00:50 < vasild> given I will be modifying #19954 I will add one line at the start of unserialize to check if the version is too high
00:51 < gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19954 | tor: complete the TORv3 implementation by vasild · Pull Request #19954 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
00:51 < vasild> exactly
00:51 < vasild> and print something like "detected file format of peers.dat from the future: 4, I can only understand up to 3, starting operation as if peers.dat is empty"
00:52 < hebasto> sipa: if their software is broken should we discourage those peers?
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00:55 < vasild> maybe a honest/legit/unbroken peer is just relaying some shi^H^Hstuff that was given to him by a broken/malicious guy
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00:56 < vasild> we don't want to flag the legit peer as misbehaving
00:56 < hebasto> right
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00:56 < vasild> or also those high service bits could have some purpose, I guess, it is not certain that they are due to broken or malicious software
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00:57  * hebasto "hidden service" :D
00:58 < vasild> did somebody develop a decentralized instant message chat application using bitcoin p2p network, sneaking the data via the service bits?
00:59 < MarcoFalke> it would be good to log the peer that sent the high bits
00:59 < sipa> MarcoFalke: unfortunately, they're most likely not the ones who introduced it
01:00 < vasild> what happens if a node receives via gossip the same address:port but with different service bits?
01:01 < MarcoFalke> does addrman correct the service bits when a version msg is received?
01:01 < vasild> that too!
01:01 < sipa> they get OR'ed together
01:01 < sipa> but i hope that on an actual connection, it's overwritten
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01:02 < vasild> they get OR'ed :( so a node cannot correct his by re-advertising it regularly. Once somebody adds some high bits to his addr:port, it is over.
01:02 < sipa> we should fix that
01:03 < sipa> whatever we receive from the node itself should be written exactly into addrman
01:03 < vasild> change to "newer one overwrites old one"?
01:03 < sipa> i think OR'ing makes sense for rumoured addr messages
01:04 < vasild> I agree that if we connect directly then whatever the peer says is to overwrite the other stuff
01:04 < sipa> but if we receive information from the IP itself (on an outgoing connection), it should overwrite
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01:13 < jonatack> catching up with the discussion... yes, the issue I reported is the DB:deserialise error messages and peers.dat being recreated; bitcoind operates fine otherwise. We can't fix the older software, but we can communicate the situation clearly to users (and hopefully fix it henceforth). 
01:16 < wumpus> sipa: it's more of a warning message anyway isn't it, people that don't regaularly check the log won't even notice it
01:16 < wumpus> vasild: thanks for confirming, I think there's no problem in that case at all
01:17 < wumpus> if you say "error" I was expecting some kind of emergency shutdown, that *would* be scary, it simply saying that it's unable to load the file and start from scratch isn't scary as such
01:18 < vasild> y
01:18 < jonatack> well, anyone who greps the past log for errors will see
01:18 < jonatack> ERROR: DeserializeDB: Deserialize or I/O error - ReadCompactSize(): size too large: iostream error
01:18 < jonatack> Invalid or missing peers.dat; recreating
01:18 < wumpus> yes
01:19 < vasild> I though jonatack's disk has developed bad sectors :-D
01:19 < jonatack> that allcaps screaming ERROR is a bit worrisome :D
01:19 < vasild> thought
01:19 < wumpus> I agree it could have been avoided with a version marker
01:20 < wumpus> jonatack: that's nothing, those errors used to appear for malformed incoming *network packets*
01:20 < wumpus> ERRORS i mean
01:21 < wumpus> debug.log used to be one big file full of screaming :)
01:21 < jonatack> hehe
01:21 < jonatack> the halloween release
01:22 < wumpus> change the bitcoin logo for a 🎃
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01:23 < jonatack> fewer color change proposals :)
01:25 < fanquake> orange.bikeshed.com
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02:03 < vasild> jonatack: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/19954#discussion_r502280047 "I test if my suggestions compile before making them"... and I did not test that it does not compile before I replied :-/
02:04 < vasild> I guess it compiles because stream is a pointer which remains unmodified (the pointer itself) after the call to stream->ignore()
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02:04 < vasild> but anyway, semantically we do modify the state of the stream by the ignore() call, so I dont think it should be tagged with const
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02:33 < jonatack> vasild: no worries, it's an edge case question, was just to learn
02:35 < vasild> jonatack: my reasoning is "if a method changes the object in a way that can be observed from outside, then it should not be const"
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02:39 < jonatack> right. looking at it led me to https://isocpp.github.io/CppCoreGuidelines/CppCoreGuidelines#con2-by-default-make-member-functions-const and http://www.cplusplus.com/forum/general/12087/
02:40 < jonatack> am re-reviewing 19954
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03:00 < jonatack> vasild: nice, in my testing the patch has fixed the DB deserialize errors and peers.dat messages
03:01 < vasild> \o/
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03:03 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/380705ef4f00...6854dbdc88d7
03:03 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 2dc79c4 Hennadii Stepanov: doc: Update and improve files.md
03:03 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 6854dbd fanquake: Merge #20076: doc: Update and improve files.md
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03:03 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake merged pull request #20076: doc: Update and improve files.md (master...201004-files) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20076
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03:05 < jonatack> vasild: restarting on, say, 0.18.1, I see "ERROR: DeserializeDB: Deserialize or I/O error - CAutoFile::read: end of file: iostream error" and "Invalid or missing peers.dat; recreating", as we mention in the new release notes, but not on 19954 after `cp onion_private_key onion_v3_private_key`
03:06 < jonatack> \o/ indeed :)
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03:08 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/6854dbdc88d7...12a1c3ad1a43
03:08 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 99992e7 MarcoFalke: doc: Collect release-notes snippets
03:08 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master faa0847 MarcoFalke: doc: Add release notes for #20101
03:08 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 12a1c3a fanquake: Merge #20107: doc: Collect release-notes snippets
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03:09 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake merged pull request #20107: doc: Collect release-notes snippets (master...2010-docRelSnip) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20107
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06:09 < achow101> #proposedwalletmeetingtopic: wallet.dat vs wallet.sqlite
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06:36 < hebasto> gh silently fails to "Load more..." of "52 hidden items" on #19988 (
06:36 < gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19988 | Overhaul transaction request logic by sipa · Pull Request #19988 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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07:29 < jonatack> hebasto: saw the same yesterday, i gave up trying to see the discussion :/
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08:10 < vasild> gh censorship!
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08:18 < michaelfolkson> I don't see how Core is still managed on GitHub in 10 years personally. But will be a massive headache whenever it does move. Ideally done when things are quiet (not with a potential soft fork on the horizon)
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08:33 < jonatack> ISTM that GitHub is now starting to hide ACKs and re-ACKs as "one similar comment"
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08:59 < wumpus> I'm not sure moving is that much of a headache, many projects have done this, it's just that the only thing after github that makes sense is self-hosting something like gitlab or gitea, which has quite a lot issues of its own, e.g. who hosts the instance
09:02 < wumpus> I have a weird issue on my freebsd node: it kept making outgoing connections at a rate of ~2 per second, the whole log is full of it, and it wasn't accepting any new blocks. I hope it's not a problem with the TorV3 PR.
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09:03 < wumpus> also, it segfaulted on shutdown (I can't reproduce this, unfortunately, so don't have a traceback)
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09:12 < sipa> wumpus: ugh
09:14 < wumpus> 2020-10-09T15:06:40Z New outbound peer connected: version: 70015, blocks=651964, peer=1018923 (full-relay)
09:14 < wumpus> that peer id says enough I think
09:15 < jonatack> wumpus: huh. i have not been seeing that issue with 19954 (on debian)
09:15 < wumpus> it's not happening on my other TorV3 node though so there's no clear correlation
09:16 < wumpus> jonatack: right, it might be a local issue for that node
09:16 < wumpus> currently building plain master
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09:32 < luke-jr> wumpus: I'm not sure self-hosting is really an improvement over GitHub, aside from the platform presumably being free software
09:33 < luke-jr> the goal is probably a decentralised system, but that doesn't exist yet afaik
09:34 < vasild> there were some attempts to make decentralized alternative of github
09:34 < wumpus> luke-jr: it's an improvement in that we'd have direct control over the software, so it can't say, start hiding consecutive ACKs behind our back
09:34 < vasild> wumpus: I have this sysctl on fbsd: kern.corefile=/coredumps/%U.%N.%P.core
09:35 < wumpus> vasild: good idea
09:35 < vasild> and /coredumps has 1777 perms so that anybody can plant files in it
09:35 < luke-jr> wumpus: whoever is hosting can, whether that's GitHub or ⁇?
09:35 < wumpus> luke-jr: sure, but if it's one of us they're likely going to be more recentive to these kind of complaints than a big corporation
09:36 < vasild> ulimit -c is "unlimited" but I don't think I configured that myself, maybe it is the default
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09:37 < wumpus> same here, it even said in dmesg that it had dumped core but couldn't find the core file
09:37 < sipa> it dumped Core
09:37 < luke-jr> they tend to be big files
09:38 < vasild> does bitcoind change the working directory at startup? to ~/.bitcoin? or to the root /?
09:38 < wumpus> sipa: heh
09:38 < wumpus> vasild: no, it doesn't
09:38 < wumpus> thinking of it, probably daemonize() does though
09:38 < vasild> so the core should probably in the current directory where you started it
09:38 < luke-jr> I know Linux is capable of dumping core into a gdb process directly
09:39 < wumpus> yes, daemon() changes the working directory to /, it has no write access there, so I guess it just lost it
09:43 < wumpus> I've set vasild's sysctl parameter now so next time it should go to /coredumps/
09:44 < vasild> mkdir /coredumps && chmod 1777 /coredumps
09:45 < sipa> comic relief: https://twitter.com/real_or_random/status/1314596135395262467
09:45 < vasild> remember to rm /coredumps/* periodically because it grows and grows over time ;)
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09:47 < vasild> wumpus: but if dmesg says something like "pid 94776 (conftest), jid 0, uid 0: exited on signal 11 (core dumped)
09:47 < vasild> with "(core dumped)" at the end then it must be somewhere
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09:53 < wumpus> vasild: I couldn't find it at least, but, I 'make clean'ed so deleted the binary by now so I guess there's no point even if I still found it
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09:54 < luke-jr> hmm
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09:54 < luke-jr> does C undefined behaviour extend to compile time?
09:54 < luke-jr> can the compiler explode the system when you try to compile it?
09:55 < sipa> luke-jr: no
09:55 < sipa> (afaik)
09:56 < wumpus> don't give compiler authors any ideas
09:58 < luke-jr> nuts, could have submitted a patch to GCC to erase everything when it encounters mem*
09:58 < luke-jr> XD
09:58 < luke-jr> wumpus: hey, at least I didn't suggest telemetrics on UB?
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10:01 < wumpus> the most disappointing thing about the whole C UB sitution is how little, historically, C compilers have attempted to detect and reject it, I mean if mem* is only reserved for system functions, fair enough, but make it an error or warning.
10:01 < wumpus> but no they really like their random explosions :)
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10:04 < sipa> the reason i suspect is that they don't want programs to misbehave if memslartbartfast suddenly becomes a new standard library function in C2043, and your code is already using it
10:06 < luke-jr> they probably would prefer a C22 compiler is C99-compatible too
10:07 < luke-jr> by making mem* UB, a C22 memfoo doesn't break C99 code
10:08 < luke-jr> (same thing, but from another angle)
10:09 < sipa> i guess a better alternative would be to have a way for the STL to declare "reserved but unused" name patterns to the compiler, so it can error if you use a reserved name, rather than needing to resort to the super-heavy "UB" hammer
10:09 < wumpus> looks like I have the same problem again after merging 19954: my node keeps making outgoing connections, but never gets any blocks
10:10 < sipa> hmm
10:10 < sipa> this looks familiar
10:10 < wumpus> somehow it's dropping all outgoing connections immediately, it stays at 1-3
10:10 < sipa> Murch: do you remember someone on bitcoin SE complaining about similar behavior?
10:10 < wumpus> it does succesfully accept incoming connections but that doesn't help
10:11 < luke-jr> wumpus: to clarify, you mean without 19954 it was okay?
10:11 < wumpus> luke-jr: yes, without that it seemed to be okay
10:11 < wumpus> it did receive a few blocks
10:12 < wumpus> but no crash at shutdown this time
10:13 < wumpus> but it does look like 19954 is the problem, will try again without that
10:13 < sipa> oh, ok
10:13 < sipa> in that case what i remember seeing must have been unrelated
10:13 < wumpus> probably, unless this triggers a similar condition
10:14 < wumpus> I did already try deleting peers.dat
10:16 < achow101> anyone ever see "corrupted size vs. prev_size in fastbins" on stderr before? it's showing up on a change to sqlite wallet that I'm working on
10:18 < sipa> achow101: i wouldn't know what prev_size or fastbins are
10:18 < wumpus> googling it, it's a glibc heap corruption error
10:18 < achow101> it seems to be coming out of libc
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10:18 < wumpus> but to answer your questino, no, I've never seen it
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10:19 < achow101> great..
10:19 < luke-jr> valgrind it
10:20 < achow101> good idea
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10:28 < roconnor> very early on, the glasgow haskell compiler had an infamous bug where it would delete the source file if you tried to compile it and it had a type error.
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10:32 < luke-jr> XD
10:37 < sipa> roconnor: type errors are *really* frowned upon
10:41 < achow101> ah, I had a double free
10:43 < sipa> achow101: see youtube link above
10:44 < achow101> heh
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11:34 < wumpus> gah, the peer keeps disconnectiong outgoing connections without logging the reason at all (even with debug=net)
11:35 < sipa> wumpus: and just with #19954 ?
11:35 < gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/19954 | tor: complete the TORv3 implementation by vasild · Pull Request #19954 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
11:35 < wumpus> sipa: yes
11:35 < wumpus> without it, it makes outgoing connections succesfully
11:36 < sipa> bizarre, and ungood
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11:40 < Murch> sipa: I don't remember any recent posts to that effect.
11:44 < wumpus> curiously it even happens with listen=0
11:46 < wumpus> well maybe not so curiously because it's about outgoing connections but at least it's not the tor bind stuff itself that interferes
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11:50 < jonatack> wumpus: when did the issue start? since the latest 19954 pushes? 
11:51 < wumpus> jonatack: I think so, do we have a previous version of the PR somewhere?
11:51 < wumpus> I'm pretty sure this node was running with TORv3 succesfully at some point
11:52 < wumpus> will try to bisect the commits
11:53 < jonatack> there were a couple of important changes this week: on tuesday and today, iirc
11:53 < wumpus> first I'll try testing the branch itself instead of the branch merged on top of master
11:54 < wumpus> to rule out a silent merge conflict
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11:57 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] jonatack opened pull request #20115: cli: -netinfo quick updates/fixups and release note (master...netinfo-fixups) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20115
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12:00 < meshcollider> #startmeeting
12:00 < lightningbot> Meeting started Fri Oct  9 19:00:07 2020 UTC.  The chair is meshcollider. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
12:00 < lightningbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic.
12:00 < achow101> hi\
12:00 < meshcollider> #bitcoin-core-dev Wallet Meeting: wumpus sipa gmaxwell jonasschnelli morcos luke-jr sdaftuar jtimon cfields petertodd kanzure bluematt instagibbs phantomcircuit codeshark michagogo marcofalke paveljanik NicolasDorier jl2012 achow101 meshcollider jnewbery maaku fanquake promag provoostenator aj Chris_Stewart_5 dongcarl gwillen jamesob ken281221 ryanofsky gleb moneyball ariard digi_james amiti fjahr 
12:00 < meshcollider> jeremyrubin emilengler jonatack hebasto jb55 kvaciral ariard digi_james amiti fjahr jeremyrubin lightlike emilengler jonatack hebasto jb55 elichai2
12:00 < jonatack> hi
12:00 < hebasto> hi
12:00 < meshcollider> 2:09 AM <achow101> #proposedwalletmeetingtopic: wallet.dat vs wallet.sqlite
12:01 < meshcollider> #topic wallet.dat vs wallet.sqlite
12:01 < achow101> for sqlite wallets, there's been an ongoing question of whether the sqlite wallet files should be named wallet.dat or wallet.sqlite
12:02 < hebasto> what are pros and cons of each approach?
12:03 < achow101> the PR currently implements wallet.dat. ryanofsky has been arguing for wallet.sqlite in his review comments
12:03 < achow101> i wanted to hear what everyone else thinks
12:03 < Murch> hello
12:03 < hebasto> I've just started to review that pr, so have no opinion
12:03 < achow101> for wallet.dat, the arguments are to maintain backwards compatibility with external documentation and tooling, as well as not causing a problem with a specific downgrade scenario
12:04 < meshcollider> Yeah calling it wallet.dat has the advantage that automatic backup scripts, etc. will continue working fine, and also that users are already conditioned to protecting wallet.dat files
12:04 < achow101> for wallet.sqlite, it's a clearer naming convention, follows sqlite naming convention, and can't be confused with bdb
12:05 < jonatack> hm, good arguments for both
12:05 < achow101> wallet.sqlite also avoids a different set of compatibility prolems
12:05 < sipa> yeah, i'm very much in the middle
12:06 < sipa> some of the naming conventions and expectations around them were already broken when we moved to per-wallet directories
12:06 < sipa> and i don't recall that causing many issues for users
12:06 < achow101> relevant commens. for wallet.dat: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/19077#issuecomment-705180018 for wallet.sqlite: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/19077#pullrequestreview-504980287
12:06 < sipa> though, the specific "wallet.dat must be protected with your life" filename convention remained
12:06 < luke-jr> meshcollider: it is already wrong and risks corruption to copy wallet.dat directly
12:06 < fjahr> hi
12:07 < hebasto> if users adopted per-wallet dir, we could expect such adoption for .sqlite
12:07 < sipa> luke-jr: it doesn't if you do it while bitcoind is shut down
12:07 < meshcollider> luke-jr: that doesn't stop users doing it
12:07 < luke-jr> meshcollider: breaking such scripts would be an advantage to renaming
12:07 < sipa> luke-jr: i couldn't disagree more with that
12:07 < luke-jr> a possible issue is restoring though
12:07 < achow101> luke-jr: but breaking such scripts would probably result in backups not being made, which is dangerous
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12:08 < luke-jr> achow101: most likely would result in errors instead of possibly-corrupt backups
12:08 < achow101> I would be surprised if said scripts failed in a way that was obvious to the person running it
12:08 < luke-jr> O.o
12:08 < sipa> luke-jr: i agree that we should discourage bad practice, but (a) not by making decisions that can actually cause people to lose money and (b) i disagree this is unsupported - it's only supported when bitcoind is not running though
12:08 < meshcollider> And there are also other tools I imagine, not just backup scripts, which look for wallet.dat by default 
12:08 < luke-jr> if a cronjob fails, typically you get an email
12:09 < luke-jr> sipa: at least some versions would reuslt in corruption even if bitcoind exited cleanly
12:09 < achow101> luke-jr: fwiw I have a system backup cronjob and I don't know when/if it fails until I check the logs, and that happens maybe once every 6 months
12:09 < sipa> how so?
12:09 < luke-jr> sipa: we used to not flush/close the db
12:09 < luke-jr> achow101: you should fix that :p
12:09 < sipa> luke-jr: i believe that was very briefly the case, in ancient times
12:09 < achow101> luke-jr: right, but that's an example of a backup script failing and the user not knowing
12:10 < luke-jr> I suppose people doing backups wrong, are also likely to do error notifications wrong
12:10 < sipa> people will do lots of things wrong
12:10 < sipa> doesn't mean we shouldn't do a best effort to avoid them losing money
12:10 < luke-jr> but wallet.dat are currently in a dedicated directory
12:10 < luke-jr> there's no need for that for sqlite, right?
12:11 < sipa> that's a good question
12:11 < achow101> luke-jr: yes, but I think it would be more confusing to users if we stopped doing that
12:11 < sipa> hmm
12:11 < jonatack> modulo the risk of users losing money if renamed, a risk i don't feel competent to evaluate, i tend to agree with ryanofsky's arguments
12:12 < sipa> to me, that'd be one of the advantages of sqlite... not needing a directory for every wallet anymore
12:12 < luke-jr> btw, even if it's wallet.sqlite, it's not like we're renaming without the user knowing
12:13 < luke-jr> wouldn't you expect anyone setting up a backup script to check that it works when they create the wallet, at least once? :P
12:13 < achow101> luke-jr: not necessarily. they'd need to read the release notes, and who the hell does that?
12:13 < luke-jr> achow101: you're seriously suggesting automatically transforming BDB to sqlite?
12:14 < luke-jr> without user interaction?
12:14 < achow101> luke-jr: there's no transformation
12:14 < achow101> what I mean is that sqlite would be default for descriptor wallets, but the only way you would know that is to read the release notes
12:14 < luke-jr> ok, so wallet.dat would remain wallet.dat even if new wallets are wallet.sqlite…
12:14 < achow101> existing wallets are unaffected
12:15 < luke-jr> so the only way someone should lose data is if they never check for a successful backup ever..
12:15 < achow101> sipa: I suppose that getting rid of the wallet directory thing would solve both of these problems
12:15 < luke-jr> or  maybe are backing up numerous wallets and expect newly created ones automatically included
12:16 < achow101> luke-jr: when we get around to implementing bdb to sqlite migration, there could be problems there with the rename
12:17 < luke-jr> achow101: but we get the chance to tell users when they opt into it
12:17 < achow101> true
12:17 < luke-jr> a reason not to rename: acting on file extensions has been kindof deprecated for a long time?
12:18 < achow101> there's also the problems with restoring, and that one downgrade case where a new wallet.dat is made
12:19 < meshcollider> IMO we should get rid of individual directories for sqlite, I don't think that would be confusing
12:21 < achow101> meshcollider: that still has the backup and restore problems, although not the downgrade one if we name the file as the wallet name
12:26 < achow101> any other comments on this topic?
12:27 < meshcollider> Did this help make a decision ;)
12:27 < achow101> not really
12:27 < fjahr> I'm undecided as well, sorry
12:28 < achow101> I'll experiment with a no wallet directory approach and see how big the diff is
12:28 < meshcollider> Yeah that sounds good
12:28 < meshcollider> Any other topics then?
12:29 < jonatack> fjahr: at some point, sometime, we should maybe discuss #18418
12:29 < gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/18418 | wallet: Increase OUTPUT_GROUP_MAX_ENTRIES to 100 by fjahr · Pull Request #18418 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
12:30 < jonatack> perhaps Murch can look at it
12:30 < jonatack> (just a thought, no need to duscuss now)
12:30 < fjahr> Yeah, thanks, I guess at the moment nobody has time but maybe in 2 weeks
12:32 < meshcollider> Ok let's discuss it next time then :) 
12:32 < meshcollider> #endmeeting
12:32 < lightningbot> Meeting ended Fri Oct  9 19:32:38 2020 UTC.  Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot . (v 0.1.4)
12:32 < lightningbot> Minutes:        http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2020/bitcoin-core-dev.2020-10-09-19.00.html
12:32 < lightningbot> Minutes (text): http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2020/bitcoin-core-dev.2020-10-09-19.00.txt
12:32 < lightningbot> Log:            http://www.erisian.com.au/meetbot/bitcoin-core-dev/2020/bitcoin-core-dev.2020-10-09-19.00.log.html
12:32 < jonatack> o/
12:32 < meshcollider> Thanks all
12:33 < meshcollider> \o 
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12:58 < luke-jr> btw, I wonder if creating a wallet is really the right response to not finding one named :P
13:02 < roconnor> In a different program I complained where running an obviously read-only operation would create a new file if the required file didn't exist.
13:02 < achow101> luke-jr: it definitely isn't and we should remove that behavior
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15:21 < sipa> wumpus: any progress?
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17:58 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] leozz37 opened pull request #20116: Implemented GitHub Actions workflow for MacOS and Ubuntu (master...github-actions) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20116
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18:02 < yanmaani> I'm getting weird errors while building Bitcoin Core, but everything seems to work fine
18:02 < yanmaani> > /usr/bin/ld: error: leveldb/libleveldb.a(libleveldb_a-crc32c.o): <corrupt x86 feature size: 0x8>
18:02 < yanmaani> for what seems to be every .o file
18:02 < yanmaani> didn't find anything about it on the Internet. Is this a known issue?
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18:14 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake closed pull request #20116: Implemented GitHub Actions workflow for MacOS and Ubuntu (master...github-actions) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/20116
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18:17 < sipa> vasild: i was wrong; when making an outbound connection, we overwrite the addrman services with the peer's reported ones
18:17 < sipa> see CAddrMan::SetServices
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19:23 < Murch> jonatack: okay, put it on my list
19:25 < fanquake> Murch: I just put something on your list
19:31 < Murch> sorry, I meant that I had put it on my list. I realize now that the conjugations of this particular irregular word make my brevity particularly misleading
19:32 < sipa> lalalala http://ncf.idallen.com/english.html 
19:33 < Murch> Yes, let's all learn Esperanto or Klingon
19:33 < Murch> Although, this had nothing to do with homophones or irregular pronunciation :p
19:34 < sipa> put and put are arguably homophones 
19:35 < Murch> more importantly for my communication mishap, they're homonyms
19:35 < fanquake> Murch: I wasn't trying to correct your spelling hah, I meant I'd  just tagged you in #20040.
19:35 < gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/20040 | wallet: Refactor OutputGroups to handle fees and spending eligibility on grouping by achow101 · Pull Request #20040 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
19:36 < Murch> fanquake: I thank ye kindly!
19:36 < achow101> moar refactor
19:42 < fanquake> I've passed on more feedback to GitHub, now that we're seeing even  more comment related issues: https://0bin.net/paste/9HgV-Dyl#sZlLldWLuSFQGiT1-yYS5ikMyCIIkRLd5lK3fuAD/ql & https://imgur.com/a/mUVsDSX.
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21:49 < tryphe> sipa, such a great piece
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22:06 < tryphe> or how about white night, wight knight
22:08 < tryphe> or white knight and wight night :D
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--- Log closed Sat Oct 10 00:00:42 2020