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Anywhere.] 02:32 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 02:32 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Client Quit] 02:34 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 02:49 -!- Livestradamus [~Livestrad@user/livestradamus] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:50 -!- Livestradamus [~Livestrad@user/livestradamus] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 02:51 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 02:55 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 03:27 -!- Mercury [~root@31.125.90.17] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 03:39 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #26976: ci: Cache package manager install step (master...2301-ci-cache-apt-馃毚) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26976 03:41 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 03:48 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:06 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@d75-156-179-9.abhsia.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 04:09 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@user/AaronvanW] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:11 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@d75-156-179-9.abhsia.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:32 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 04:37 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 04:40 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@user/AaronvanW] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 04:43 -!- Guest76 [~Guest76@14.32.133.72] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 04:44 -!- Guest76 [~Guest76@14.32.133.72] has quit [Client Quit] 04:50 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #26977: ci: Fetch no git history, unless lint (master...2301-ci-no-hist-馃彞) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26977 04:53 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 04:54 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 04:59 -!- vasild [~vd@user/vasild] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:09 -!- vasild [~vd@user/vasild] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 05:10 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@user/AaronvanW] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:14 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:14 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 05:17 -!- qxs [~qxs@gateway/tor-sasl/qxs] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 05:18 -!- cryptapus [~cryptapus@user/cryptapus] 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has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 06:52 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 06:56 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 06:57 -!- halosghost [~halosghos@user/halosghost] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 06:57 -!- bugs_ [~bugs@user/bugs/x-5128603] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 06:58 -!- jon_atack [~jonatack@user/jonatack] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:00 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver@77-174-98-73.fixed.kpn.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:09 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:15 < bitcoin-git> [gui] john-moffett opened pull request #705: doc: Fix comment about how wallet txs are sorted (master...2023_01_FixIncorrectCommentTTM) https://github.com/bitcoin-core/gui/pull/705 07:24 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:25 -!- Pasha [~Cory@068-187-125-109.res.spectrum.com] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:27 -!- Cory [~Cory@068-187-125-109.res.spectrum.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:28 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver@77-174-98-73.fixed.kpn.net] has left #bitcoin-core-dev [Closing Window] 07:29 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 07:39 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke opened pull request #26978: ci: Fix BOOST_TEST_RANDOM (master...2301-ci-boost-test-random-馃徔) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26978 07:42 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 07:46 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 07:55 -!- szkl [uid110435@id-110435.uxbridge.irccloud.com] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 08:05 -!- fjMSX [~hypni2p@89-179-32-81.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Quit: 校褕'谢歇鞋 褩蟹 褦褌芯泄 IRC 褋械褌褩] 08:06 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 08:10 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:28 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 08:31 -!- Guest5245 [~raj@2602:ffb6:4:e396:f816:3eff:fea0:378a] has quit [Quit: ZNC 1.8.2+deb2+b1 - https://znc.in] 08:32 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 08:35 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke pushed 4 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/835212cd1d8f...9a288430df93 08:35 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fa0f043 MarcoFalke: Add BlockManager::LoadingBlocks() 08:35 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master fae71fe MarcoFalke: Add BlockManager::GetPruneTarget() 08:35 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master faf7b4f MarcoFalke: Add BlockManager::IsPruneMode() 08:35 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] MarcoFalke merged pull request #26900: refactor: Add BlockManager getters (master...2301-blockman-fun-馃挱) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26900 08:55 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 08:59 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:06 -!- jarthur [~jarthur@user/jarthur] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 09:22 -!- andrew_mo_ [~andrew_mo@node-1w7jr9yi65te4g0dnwoa02b1l.ipv6.telus.net] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 09:36 -!- cbdc-core-dev [~cbdc-core@103.211.190.109] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 09:38 < cbdc-core-dev> Central bank digital currencies (CBDCs) are digital versions of fiat currencies that are issued and regulated by a country's central bank. 09:38 < cbdc-core-dev> They have potential to improve freedom and privacy as mentioned by bitcoin developers. Can we create a github repo like some gov agency to keep it open source and still kill bitcoin? 09:38 < cbdc-core-dev> Maybe cfields and kanzue might know more about it 09:38 < cbdc-core-dev> I can open an issue if we support CBDC in bitcoin core as bitcoin is just gold and we can have some currency to transact. 09:39 < cbdc-core-dev> * kanzure 09:39 < kanzure> huh? 09:39 < cbdc-core-dev> lol 09:40 < kanzure> you're welcome to start a different project, but i don't see how your messages are related to bitcoin core software development 09:40 < cbdc-core-dev> kanzure: you like cbdc? 09:41 < cbdc-core-dev> why are you sending me DM for another shitcoin like webcash.org ? 09:42 < cbdc-core-dev> do you even moderate bitcoin-dev mailing list? 09:42 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] achow101 pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/9a288430df93...483a4bb8197a 09:42 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 14ce843 fanquake: doc: add new NO_* options from #26833 09:42 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 44f3c7d fanquake: contrib: remove install_db4.sh 09:42 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 483a4bb Andrew Chow: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#26834: contrib: remove install_db4.sh 09:42 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] achow101 merged pull request #26834: contrib: remove install_db4.sh (master...remove_install_db4) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26834 09:42 -!- b_101_ [~robert@185.242.5.35] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 09:42 < jamesob> cbdc-core-dev: let's keep it on-topic and civil in here 09:42 < cbdc-core-dev> are you even eligible to do it? 09:43 < cbdc-core-dev> civil? lmao 09:44 -!- b_101 [~robert@193.37.254.131] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:45 < cbdc-core-dev> luke-jr was asked to leave bitcoin bips editor permissions, why dont you leave it as well? 09:45 -!- andrewtoth_ [~andrewtot@gateway/tor-sasl/andrewtoth] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:45 < cbdc-core-dev> or you want me post everything? 09:45 < cbdc-core-dev> you dont deserve it 09:46 < cbdc-core-dev> work for some gov dept where things work slowly and need permissions 09:46 < cbdc-core-dev> core devs lol 09:46 -!- cbdc-core-dev [~cbdc-core@103.211.190.109] has left #bitcoin-core-dev [] 10:02 -!- Guest6 [~Guest6@2603-8001-1d02-31e8-68d6-61a9-b1ef-50c6.res6.spectrum.com] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 10:05 -!- Guest6 [~Guest6@2603-8001-1d02-31e8-68d6-61a9-b1ef-50c6.res6.spectrum.com] has quit [Client Quit] 10:14 -!- salvatoshi [~salvatosh@genymobile-2-6-86.fib.nerim.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:17 -!- MrFrancis [~MrFrancis@2001:8a0:fa4c:901:c102:c312:f2c5:e464] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 10:22 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:22 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 10:28 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:33 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 10:37 -!- as2333 [~as2333@host159.181-12-227.telecom.net.ar] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 10:40 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 10:46 -!- MrFrancis [~MrFrancis@2001:8a0:fa4c:901:c102:c312:f2c5:e464] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 10:46 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/compare/483a4bb8197a...4b51290f7195 10:46 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master faa65f1 MarcoFalke: ci: Fetch no git history, unless lint 10:46 < bitcoin-git> bitcoin/master 4b51290 fanquake: Merge bitcoin/bitcoin#26977: ci: Fetch no git history, unless lint 10:46 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] fanquake merged pull request #26977: ci: Fetch no git history, unless lint (master...2301-ci-no-hist-馃彞) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26977 10:50 -!- MrFrancis [~MrFrancis@2001:8a0:fa4c:901:c102:c312:f2c5:e464] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:00 < achow101> #startmeeting 11:00 <@core-meetingbot> Meeting started Fri Jan 27 19:00:23 2023 UTC. The chair is achow101. Information about MeetBot at https://bitcoin.jonasschnelli.ch/ircmeetings. 11:00 <@core-meetingbot> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick 11:00 < achow101> #bitcoin-core-dev Wallet Meeting: achow101 _aj_ amiti ariard BlueMatt cfields Chris_Stewart_5 darosior digi_james dongcarl elichai2 emilengler fanquake fjahr furszy gleb glozow gmaxwell gwillen hebasto instagibbs jamesob jarolrod jb55 jeremyrubin jl2012 jnewbery jonasschnelli jonatack josibake jtimon kallewoof kanzure kvaciral laanwj larryruane lightlike luke-jr maaku marcofalke meshcollider michagogo moneyball morcos Murch nehan NicolasDorier 11:00 < achow101> paveljanik petertodd phantomcircuit promag provoostenator ryanofsky sdaftuar S3RK sipa vasild 11:00 < S3RK> hi 11:00 < furszy> hi 11:01 < achow101> There's one preproposed wallet meeting topic: hd key rotation vs new wallet (achow101). Anything else to add to the list for today? 11:01 < S3RK> If we have time, I'd be curious to discuss apporach for #22693 11:01 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22693 | RPC/Wallet: Add "use_txids" to output of getaddressinfo by luke-jr 路 Pull Request #22693 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:02 < achow101> #topic hd key rotation vs new wallet (achow101) 11:02 <@core-meetingbot> topic: hd key rotation vs new wallet (achow101) 11:03 < achow101> in #26728, S3RK brought up the question that there isn't a well defined use case for having key rotation, as all of the cases that we've brought up are sufficiently handled by making a new wallet 11:03 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/26728 | wallet: Have the wallet store the key for automatically generated descriptors by achow101 路 Pull Request #26728 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:03 -!- Guest43 [~Guest43@191.96.218.134] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:03 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:04 < achow101> if that's the case, then we could simply the implementation to not allow key rotation and just instruct people to use new wallets 11:05 < achow101> I've had conversations with sipa and luke-jr about this in the past, but I think everything that was discussed could also just work with using a new wallet? 11:06 < S3RK> yes, I think it's preferrable to have a simpler implementation if all the use cases are covered by creating a new wallet 11:06 < S3RK> One thing I wonder is key rotation during encryption 11:07 < sipa> a new wallet means losing tx history? 11:08 -!- MrFrancis [~MrFrancis@2001:8a0:fa4c:901:c102:c312:f2c5:e464] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 11:08 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:08 < achow101> iirc the main point was that a user would want to rotate keys when if they think their keys were compromised, but then it follows that making a new wallet is better than rotating as there is less likelihood of reusing potentially compromised keys afterwards 11:08 < achow101> sipa: with multiwallet, does that really matter? The old wallet can still be loaded and history viewed. 11:09 < sipa> it also requires moving all the funds over 11:09 < S3RK> I guess I'd like to understand first when people feel like they need to rotate HD key 11:09 < provoostenator> hi 11:09 < sipa> i think periodically rotating keys makes sense as a security safeguard, even without any known compromised keys 11:09 < sipa> but if you it involves losing history and moving all funds over, that's a lot less appealing 11:11 < S3RK> it might be a stupid question, but safeguard against leaked keys? IIUC you're saying there is some risk of the keys being compromised so I'd like to rotate them, but the risk is not high enough to warrant extra caution to avoid mixing utxos unintentionally 11:11 < achow101> but what kind of safeguard does that provide? istm you would do it because maybe something was compromised, but if that's the case, wouldn't you want to move all of the funds to the new key(s) 11:11 < sipa> hmm, that's a fair point 11:11 < S3RK> yes 11:11 < provoostenator> The wallet could encourage such moving in other ways of course. 11:12 < S3RK> we have sendall now to facilitate migration 11:12 < provoostenator> But a fresh wallet makes that more intuitive. 11:12 < Murch1> Hi 11:12 < sipa> another downside is that if somehow someone still sends coins to the old wallet after rotation, you may not notice if it's a separate wallet, and you don't keep all the old ones loaded and watched 11:12 < S3RK> :waves: 11:13 < provoostenator> And the old wallet might fall behind the prune window too if it's not loaded, making it very painful to access unexpected payments to it. 11:13 < provoostenator> (though that's fixable) 11:14 < achow101> with multiwallet and the settings.json stuff, it's not that hard to keep multiple wallets loaded automatically 11:14 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:14 < Murch1> Would it be possible to monitor multiple wallets, but to only have one active in the sense that you are using its UTXO Pool to send and its addresses to receive? 11:15 < sipa> a wallet can contain multiple SPKMs 11:15 < sipa> so you can do all that already, within a single wallet 11:15 < achow101> Murch1: yes, multiwallet 11:15 < S3RK> the problem I see with one wallet is that you don't have any separation between "old" spkms and "new" ones 11:15 < sipa> well multiwallet is something else still, as API wise those are completely separated 11:15 < S3RK> if you rotate more than one time it can easily become a mess 11:15 < sipa> S3RK: active and inactive ones? 11:16 < achow101> with rotating by using a new wallet, it would become obvious when something was sent to the old one 11:16 < S3RK> you can still spend from inactive spkms 11:16 < achow101> as the tx shows in the old wallet's history and not the new one's 11:16 < sipa> right 11:16 < achow101> even with inactive spkms, we don't distinguish in the tx history unless you go look at the address and then getaddressinfo it and compare the descriptors 11:16 < sipa> and in case you rotate because of compromise, you probably actually do want to see payments to the old one as separate 11:17 < sipa> "crap, i need to move more funds over now" 11:17 < S3RK> sorry :D 11:17 < sipa> having some mode to mark a wallet as compromised, so that all funds sent to it are automatically transferred elsewhere may be useful too... 11:19 < S3RK> but are there cases when people want to rotate without keys being compromised? 11:19 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:19 < Murch1> Sure, e.g. if you鈥榬e still on a legacy wallet and want to move to a descriptor wallet maybe? 11:19 < achow101> Murch1: strictly speaking, it doesn't have to. but it's a lot easier to implement migration in that way 11:20 < sipa> S3RK: Well, historically, pre-HD wallets had a "feature" that they get "unstolen" over time, as change outputs and new receives would over time end up in new keys that an old stolen backup did not contain. 11:20 < achow101> we rotate on encrypting, but considering the above conversation, that maybe doesn't make sense anymore? 11:21 < sipa> This discussion I think started from the question whether wallet migration is ever not strictly an upgrade, and one example is that if the migration only supports going to HD wallet, this "unstealing" effect that the user (very questionably, hypothetically) could be relying on, disappears. 11:22 < achow101> sipa: arguably it disappeared a long time ago when the default keypool was bumped up to 1000 11:22 < sipa> It's very questionable as it only works on pretty high-turnover wallets anyway, with unclear timelines, and only when an attacker gets access to private keys and then bides their time without actually stealing. 11:22 < S3RK> that sounds like an argument for non-HD wallets, which is separate from the question of whether HD key rotation within same wallet is a valid use case 11:23 < sipa> S3RK: I don't think so. Because the extent to which these non-HD wallet had that feature was really accidental, and unreliable. 11:23 < sipa> If we actually want it as a feature, key rotation is the proper solution. 11:24 < S3RK> hm... key rotation when exactly? 11:24 < sipa> periodically 11:24 < S3RK> sounds like non-HD to me :D 11:24 < achow101> that doesn't sound like a feature that even makes sense to rely on, even with periodic key rotation 11:24 < sipa> Hmm, no, not all. The point is that it'd need to be time or volume based or so, not transaction count based. 11:25 < achow101> you'd still have to have a high turnover wallet 11:25 < achow101> and coin selection that selects older coins 11:25 < Murch1> And then you need to make a new backup setup at the same time 11:25 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:25 < sipa> Anyway, I also see the point of view that key rotation in this sense isn't actually a desirable feature, even when done properly, and the only reasonable way to get "unstealing" protection is actually migrating to a new wallet entirely from time to time. 11:27 < achow101> also, we can add it in later if there is a genuine use case for it 11:27 < achow101> for #26728, I'll remove the key rotation handling stuff. we can always reintroduce it 11:27 < Murch1> achow101: We have `maxHeight` now ;) 11:27 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/26728 | wallet: Have the wallet store the key for automatically generated descriptors by achow101 路 Pull Request #26728 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:28 < Murch1> Or minConf which is very similar 11:28 < S3RK> Murch1: I don't follow, how this is relevant? 11:28 < sipa> I don't think it's crazy to have a way to explicity rotate a wallet, which would involve re-generating all descriptor keys, possibly move all coins over, possibly make sends to the old ones automatically trigger a transfer, and then force a new backup. 11:28 < sipa> But that's a big feature. 11:29 < furszy> but that would periodically reveal all your balance in a large tx 11:29 < furszy> i mean, all your history to everyone 11:30 < sipa> Well, there are many ways the transferring could be done, but indeed - doing it in a privacy-preserving way would complicate it even further. 11:30 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 11:30 < furszy> yeah sure, make smaller changeless sends over time. 11:31 < achow101> just make a bunch of 1 in 1 out txs moving each utxo individually :) 11:32 < sipa> and send them all at the same time? ;) 11:32 < provoostenator> With random delays and fees. 11:33 < provoostenator> And via the new coinjoin implementation :-) 11:33 < achow101> #topic approaches for #22693 (S3RK) 11:33 <@core-meetingbot> topic: approaches for #22693 (S3RK) 11:33 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22693 | RPC/Wallet: Add "use_txids" to output of getaddressinfo by luke-jr 路 Pull Request #22693 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:33 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/22693 | RPC/Wallet: Add "use_txids" to output of getaddressinfo by luke-jr 路 Pull Request #22693 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:33 < S3RK> yep, so I'm not a huge fan of the current approach and I see another one suggested by furszy and yet another one by achow101 11:34 < achow101> that last commit is extremely bleh 11:34 < S3RK> we already have avoid reuse feature with bool stored in mem within address book 11:34 < S3RK> we can reuse/extend that 11:35 < Murch1> "Murch: I don't follow, how..." <- If you want to prioritize spending the coins in your old wallet, you set the `minConfs` to the time before your new wallet was created 11:35 < S3RK> Murch1: got it 11:35 < S3RK> or we can track use script as achow101 suggested 11:35 < furszy> have to admit that I don't remember what I commented there. Guess that I said to reuse the value that we are already storing in the addressbook 11:35 < achow101> S3RK: I generally don't like shoving these things into the address book since that ends up being displayed to the user 11:36 < S3RK> right, that's the part I don't like about current implementation. but allow me a stupid question first to help guide my thinking 11:36 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:36 < S3RK> what do we want to actually achieve with this PR? 11:36 < S3RK> maybe that's wrong timing because we need to ask Luke 11:37 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@user/AaronvanW] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:38 < S3RK> to my best understanding we want a warning when the address we _send to_ has been used already. Is that correct? 11:38 -!- markus3489986934 [~markus@191.96.218.134] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:38 < achow101> it's to enable #15987 11:38 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/15987 | Wallet, GUI: Warn when sending to already-used Bitcoin addresses by luke-jr 路 Pull Request #15987 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:38 < achow101> S3RK: yes 11:38 < S3RK> why would a sender care? 11:39 < S3RK> Isn't this receivers responsibility? 11:39 -!- Guest43 [~Guest43@191.96.218.134] has quit [Quit: Client closed] 11:39 -!- BitcoinCharlie [~BitcoinCh@adsl-178-39-110-172.adslplus.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:39 < achow101> I think it's useful in some cases 11:40 < achow101> e.g. it can remind the sender to double check that the address is up to date 11:41 < S3RK> hm.. ok. So the address in question has nothing to do with the wallet, in that case it's indeed seems weird to store the info in the address book 11:41 < achow101> there are some services which give out new addresses and stop watching txs to old ones (or are unable to credit the payers to old addresses), so it could remind the sender that they should check the address is correct 11:41 < S3RK> got it, thanks 11:42 < furszy> well, the addressbook contains "send" addresses. 11:42 < S3RK> but IIUC the warning should happen regardless of whether we spent to this address before or somebody else 11:42 < S3RK> or not? 11:42 < achow101> furszy: those are the explicit destinations. this would include the other addresses in our own incoming too, i.e. the previous sender's change 11:43 < achow101> S3RK: probably, but that's a lot of storage 11:44 < achow101> i think ideally it would check against every output in the blockchain, but that's a lot of data 11:44 < S3RK> yes, does any of the node indexes cover that? 11:44 < achow101> no 11:44 < furszy> so, seeking to make chain addresses index? 11:45 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 11:45 < furszy> if that is the goal, it doesn't sounds to be something that should be placed in the wallet 11:45 < S3RK> yep, that's my thinking at the moment 11:46 < S3RK> unless we want to restrict the search space to only wallet txs, but then I'm not if that satisfies the requirements 11:46 < achow101> I think that's something to ask luke in the pr 11:47 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:47 < furszy> yeah, I thought that was restricted to already used destinations only 11:48 < S3RK> yes, I think we need luke's input here 11:48 < S3RK> I don't have more questions on this topic 11:49 < achow101> anything else to discuss today? 11:49 < furszy> just a small reminder 11:49 < furszy> we still have #26699 bugs in master. 11:49 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/26699 | wallet, gui: bugfix, getAvailableBalance skips selected coins by furszy 路 Pull Request #26699 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:50 < achow101> furszy: master only? 11:51 < achow101> I can add it to the 25.0 milestone 11:51 < furszy> IIRC yes, I think that 25685 wasn't included in 24 11:51 < furszy> otherwise we would have users complaining already 11:51 < furszy> *would be having 11:51 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:51 < achow101> added it to the milestone so we won't forget it for the next release 11:52 < furszy> thx 11:52 < achow101> #endmeeting 11:52 <@core-meetingbot> topic: Bitcoin Core development discussion and commit log | Feel free to watch, but please take commentary and usage questions to #bitcoin | Channel logs: http://www.erisian.com.au/bitcoin-core-dev/, http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/ | Meeting topics http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedmeetingtopics.txt / http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-core-dev/proposedwalletmeetingtopics.txt 11:52 <@core-meetingbot> Meeting ended Fri Jan 27 19:52:28 2023 UTC. 11:52 <@core-meetingbot> Minutes: https://bitcoin.jonasschnelli.ch/ircmeetings/logs/bitcoin-core-dev/2023/bitcoin-core-dev.2023-01-27-19.00.moin.txt 11:52 < S3RK> thanks, topic for the next time -> #25634 11:52 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/25634 | wallet, tests: Expand and test when the blank wallet flag should be un/set by achow101 路 Pull Request #25634 路 bitcoin/bitcoin 路 GitHub 11:53 < achow101> S3RK: use #proposedwalletmeetingtopic so the topic list gets updated 11:55 < S3RK> #proposedwalletmeetingtopic blank wallet flag, how to differentiate blank and newly created wallets 11:58 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@187.183.43.178] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 11:59 -!- vasild [~vd@user/vasild] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 12:00 -!- halosghost 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12:54 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 12:54 < bitcoin-git> [bitcoin] mzumsande opened pull request #26982: p2p: 25880 fixups (stalling timeout) (master...202201_fix_stalling_test) https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/26982 12:59 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@2804:14d:5281:8ae2:477:c38e:8bc5:df7d] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:01 -!- markus3489986934 [~markus@191.96.218.134] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 13:03 -!- Norrin [~NorrinRad@gateway/tor-sasl/norrinradd] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 13:04 -!- ___nick___ [~quassel@cpc68289-cdif17-2-0-cust317.5-1.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:05 -!- markus3489986934 [~markus@191.96.218.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 13:05 -!- brunoerg [~brunoerg@187.183.43.178] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 13:08 -!- AmunRa [~NorrinRad@gateway/tor-sasl/norrinradd] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 13:09 -!- PaperSword [~Thunderbi@securemail.qrsnap.io] has quit [Ping 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-!- fjMSX [~hypni2p@89-179-32-81.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 23:47 -!- fjMSX [~hypni2p@89-179-32-81.broadband.corbina.ru] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:47 -!- andrew_mo_ [andrew_mo_@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/andrewmo/x-47904524] has joined #bitcoin-core-dev 23:51 -!- andrew_mo_ [andrew_mo_@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/andrewmo/x-47904524] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] --- Log closed Sat Jan 28 00:00:27 2023