--- Log opened Thu Aug 17 00:00:31 2023
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00:59 < PaperSword> Does Bitcoin Core check to ensure the y component of an uncompressed public key is valid for P2MS?
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03:04 < PaperSword> And nope https://mempool.space/testnet/tx/f58ebcc90e1173770202dbde22521ed0e516c7c450cd92ccc99a430cbb845a54
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03:04 < theStack> PaperSword: txs with output scripts containing not-on-curve pubkeys are standard-valid, if that's what you're asking
03:05 < PaperSword> Yeah they are just tested and found out. 
03:05 < PaperSword> Is there a reason why?
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03:11 < PaperSword> Wait so if the pubkeys are invalid are they prunable?
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06:45 < achow101> PaperSword: you can unsubscribe from the discussion if it's getting too noisy
06:47 < achow101> we do moderate, but only stuff that's obviously bad. if it gets really heated we'll lock it temporarily
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06:57 < provoostenator> At some point I'll just have to accept the Matrix bridge is not coming back...
06:57 < PaperSword> @achow101 Thank you! None of the content is bad per say, just IMO more 'heated' than what I am used to. None the less I am very glad that discussion is happening and have learned so much from it!
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07:00 < achow101> #startmeeting
07:00 < TheCharlatan> hi
07:00 < brunoerg> hi
07:00 < darosior> Hi
07:00 < gleb> hi
07:00 < lightlike> hi
07:00 < achow101> #bitcoin-core-dev Meeting: achow101 _aj_ amiti ariard aureleoules b10c BlueMatt brunoerg cfields darosior dergoegge dongcarl fanquake fjahr furszy gleb glozow hebasto instagibbs jamesob jarolrod jonatack josibake kallewoof kanzure kouloumos kvaciral laanwj LarryRuane lightlike luke-jr MacroFake Murch phantomcircuit pinheadmz promag provoostenator ryanofsky sdaftuar S3RK stickies-v sipa theStack TheCharlatan vasild
07:01 < furszy> hi
07:01 < PaperSword> hi
07:01 < dergoegge> hi
07:01 < achow101> there is one pre-proposed meeting topic this week. Any last minute topics to add to the list?
07:01 < _aj_> hi
07:01 < jamesob> hi
07:01 < achow101> #topic package relay updates (glozow)
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07:02 < cfields> hi
07:02 < PaperSword> #topic https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/28217#
07:03 < achow101> I think glozow is not here today. #28199 is still the priority pr and has a few reviews.
07:03 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/28199 | test: tx orphan handling by glozow · Pull Request #28199 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
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07:03 < achow101> #topic BIP 324 updates (sipa)
07:05 < achow101> The last major crypto pr was merged last week, so the current priority is now #28165
07:05 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/28165 | net: transport abstraction by sipa · Pull Request #28165 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:05 < sipa> hi
07:06 < sipa> i'm currently working on 28165 and 28196 (the latter has the option to experiment with)
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07:06 < sipa> 28165 is i think mostly independently-useful improvements (though inspired by the needs of bip324)
07:07 < achow101> sipa: is #28100 something people should look at too?
07:07 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/28100 | crypto: more `Span ` modernization & follow-ups by sipa · Pull Request #28100 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:07 < lightlike> (28165 needs rebase after merge of #27981 a few hours ago)
07:07 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27981 | Fix potential network stalling bug by sipa · Pull Request #27981 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:07 < sipa> lightlike: ah thanks, will do today
07:07 < sipa> achow101: possibly - i'm happy to continue with bip324 stuff without 28100 so it's not a blocker
07:07 < fanquake> 28100 is about done anyays after the current comments are addressed
07:08 < sipa> but i think it's nice, as throughout this effort lots of parts of the crypto/ codebase have been converted to use Span<std::byte> based interfaces, which work really nicely
07:08 < sipa> except ChaCha20 itself hasn't
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07:09 < achow101> #topic libbitcoinkernel updates (TheCharlatan)
07:09 < TheCharlatan> No updates on the priority PR #27866
07:09 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27866 | blockstorage: Return on fatal flush errors by TheCharlatan · Pull Request #27866 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:10 < TheCharlatan> Been working on pruning the boost multi index headers from our header tree.
07:10 < TheCharlatan> So far, I have a working proof of concept. Will spend the next week polishing this to something presentable.
07:10 < TheCharlatan> Once that's done we can look towards wrapping up stage 1 of the project.
07:10 < sipa> TheCharlatan: what's the reason for that?
07:10 < sipa> (pruning multiindex)
07:10 < _aj_> what does pruning mean? limiting or removing entirely?
07:11 < TheCharlatan> So we can ship the library without exporting boost.
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07:11 < fanquake> 👍
07:11 < TheCharlatan> It's pruning the definitions from the headers.
07:11 < sipa> but multi-index is headers-only, right?
07:12 < _aj_> so only including multi_index from cpp files, not .h files?
07:12 < fanquake> Yea all of our Boost usage is headers only
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07:12 < TheCharlatan> _aj_ yes
07:12 < sipa> aahh, by exporting you mean from the library's *include* files?
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07:12 < sipa> not the library binary
07:12 < TheCharlatan> yes :)
07:12 < sipa> that makes sense!
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07:14 < achow101> #topic assumeutxo updates (jamesob)
07:14 < achow101> looks like there's been movement on #27596
07:14 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27596 | assumeutxo (2) by jamesob · Pull Request #27596 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:14 < jamesob> Still on #27596. Few people doing review (ryanofsky, fjahr) and provoostenator doing testing
07:14 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27596 | assumeutxo (2) by jamesob · Pull Request #27596 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:15 < jamesob> Sjors reported  a stallout after ibd completion but I'm not really understanding the logs he pasted in
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07:15 < achow101> i've started looking at it as well
07:16 < jamesob> 👍
07:16 < achow101> #topic Ad-hoc high priority for review
07:17 < achow101> Anything to add or remove from https://github.com/orgs/bitcoin/projects/1/views/4
07:17 < provoostenator> jamesob: the shutdown stalled so I had to force quit, but it worked fine at restart.
07:18 < PaperSword> @jamesob I will compile and test.
07:18 < jamesob> provoostenator: do you think the coinscache might have been flushing? how long did you wait?
07:18 < jamesob> PaperSword: thanks
07:19 < PaperSword> you can log coinscache flushing with the USDT tacepoint script right?
07:19 < jamesob> yeah, though there should be a lower-tech way to do that... maybe we should log to the standard facilities if the flush duration is over some length of time
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07:20 < PaperSword> contrib/tracing/log_utxocache_flush.py it works incredibly well IMO
07:21 < PaperSword> was using it with sjors DB_CACHE issue 
07:21 < provoostenator> james: this was a pruned node, so it would have flushed a bunch of times. I also think it was more than 24 hours after IBD finished, but not 100% sure.
07:21 < jamesob> provoostenator: so you triggerd a shutdown, but then the shutdown process hung? or it hung during normal operation?
07:22 < cfields> If we're done with ad-hoc review items,  I have a quick item.
07:22 < achow101> #topic PR#27260 (PaperSword)
07:22 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27260 | Enhanced error messages for invalid network prefix during address parsing. by russeree · Pull Request #27260 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:22 < achow101> cfields: there's a preproposed topic first
07:23 < cfields> 👍
07:23 < PaperSword> I was wondering mostly about relevance of this?
07:23 < achow101> can you be more specific?
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07:24 < PaperSword> Was wondering if this is something that should be continued to be worked on mostly?
07:24 < PaperSword> Luke has reviewed some items in this PR, and those issues were addressed. 
07:25 < sipa> PaperSword: that's up to whomever contributes individually
07:25 < PaperSword> Okay!
07:25 < PaperSword> That concludes my request
07:26 < achow101> #topic #28217 (PaperSword)
07:26 < sipa> the project does have a few projects that we choose to focus on, but aside from that, everyone decides for themselves where they spend time
07:26 <@gribble> https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/28217 | set `DEFAULT_PERMIT_BAREMULTISIG` to false by Retropex · Pull Request #28217 · bitcoin/bitcoin · GitHub
07:26 < achow101> I assume this is about moderation?
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07:27 < PaperSword> Sort of. It's a great issue to discuss though the nuances seem to get drowned out in the more charged statements. 
07:27 < PaperSword> One thing I didn't understand was is there a reason for not checking for a valid Y component to an uncompressed pubkey
07:27 < PaperSword> https://mempool.space/testnet/tx/f58ebcc90e1173770202dbde22521ed0e516c7c450cd92ccc99a430cbb845a54
07:28 < sipa> i don't think that's actually relevant
07:28 < PaperSword> Okay
07:28 < achow101> iirc it's kinda expensive
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07:28 < PaperSword> Yes, uses base blockdata only and each outpoint has to hit dust when relaying. 
07:28 < sipa> a bit, yes
07:29 < sipa> but the big problem, i think, is about changing the policy is the first place
07:29 < PaperSword> absolutely 
07:29 < sipa> so really the answer to why is the Y component not checked, i think, is because the Y component was not checked in the past
07:30 < PaperSword> It could be of interest, because by checking it during relay would not allow others to use the Y component for extra byes of arb storage.
07:30 < achow101> if you do want it checked, use a hybrid key? lol
07:30 < sipa> PaperSword: that's exactly what the controversy is about, it wouldn't change anything
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07:31 < provoostenator> I don't think it makes sense to use relay policy to "fight" market forces. You'll just end up with private relay networks, which in turn
07:31 < luke-jr> of course it would
07:31 < provoostenator> means worse fee estimation, and maybe even pinning issues.
07:32 < sipa> indeed
07:32 < luke-jr> provoostenator: if miners maliciously try to bypass the network, it's at least clear they are acting maliciously, rather than a passive indifference
07:32 < luke-jr> and that alone may be sufficient
07:32 < PaperSword> Okay. current implementations of stamps and these protocols seem to only use 33 bytes per outpoint
07:32 < sipa> i very much doubt that
07:32 < sipa> given that they're already convincing miners to do whatever
07:33 < provoostenator> Full RBF is indicator of those dynamics.
07:33 < luke-jr> they're not
07:33 < luke-jr> there's a few bad actor pools, but many are not actively going around things
07:33 < PaperSword> What about the fact that items in the UTXO set that have an invalid Y coordinate could never be signed for?
07:33 < provoostenator> Also, it's not malicious if users are settings allow bare multisig to true.
07:33 < luke-jr> provoostenator: full RBF is not the same thing
07:33 < PaperSword> Would they then be prunable?
07:34 < sipa> PaperSword: P2PK and k-of-n P2MS with n-k+1 invalid, i think could be pruned yes
07:34 < darosior> PaperSword: you may be interested in reading the discussion in https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/24106. Some of the arguments from here may apply.
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07:34 < PaperSword> Thank you @darosior
07:34 < luke-jr> provoostenator: it's malicious to setup private relay networks to mine attacks on Bitcoin that the community is actively trying to mitigate
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07:35 < provoostenator> But it's not miners setting those up.
07:35 < sipa> luke-jr: you holding that opinion is irrelevant to people's behavior :)
07:35 < luke-jr> provoostenator: isn't that the argument being made? [10:31] <provoostenator> I don't think it makes sense to use relay policy to "fight" market forces. You'll just end up with private relay networks, which in turn
07:35 < sipa> (even though i largely agree, for some definition of attacks)
07:35 < provoostenator> All miners need to do is to not upgrade and/or manually set this setting. And then other users will get those transaction to them. Why would they not mine them
07:36 < luke-jr> sipa: yes, but it's not irrelevant to the big picture and sensible default policies
07:36 < PaperSword> Why would a P2MS or P2PK outpoint that could never be signed for be relayed IMO.
07:36 < vasild> hi
07:36 < _aj_> provoostenator: "why would they not mine them" -- because they have a long term investment in bitcoin, and they believe mining those txs is bad for that investment, same as the reason why people would want to remove the spam in the first place
07:37 < provoostenator> If we removed the setting entirely, maybe that changes the morality a bit.
07:37 < luke-jr> _aj_: +1
07:37 < sipa> PaperSword: why are OP_RETURNs relayed? they also can't be spent
07:37 < luke-jr> though in those cases, those miners can already not-mine them
07:37 < PaperSword> They are prunable, and pruned 
07:37 < sipa> your question is about relayed, not about pruning :)
07:38 < provoostenator> _aj_ they can already choose not to mine them and leave the money on the table.
07:38 < PaperSword> tuche :D
07:38 < luke-jr> unfortunately, I have to leave early :< but hopefully my points have been made, and others can continue
07:38 < PaperSword> Okay then why can one do 196 bytes using p2ms using invlid pubkeys but only 80 bytes with OP_RETURN
07:38 < dergoegge> can we move on?
07:39 < PaperSword> sure
07:39 < sipa> PaperSword: i think this is becoming more a question for the ML
07:39 < PaperSword> ML sorry?
07:39 < sipa> mailing list
07:39 < sipa> bitcoin-dev
07:39 < PaperSword> I will submit. 
07:39 < PaperSword> Thank you.
07:39 < sipa> i would encourage you to first read the ongoing discussion already :)
07:39 < sipa> and yes, we could prune some more unspendable outputs, but that's an implementation detail inside bitcoin core, which imho shouldn't really interact with questions about relay policy
07:40 < achow101> #topic cfields thing
07:40 < cfields> heh
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07:40 < cfields> Just wanted to make a quick announcement to the wider group that we now have a clang-tidy plugin merged and hooked up to c-i. This means that we can now add our own (simple) compiler rules and have them enforced. It's most immediately useful for linting, but it could also enforce constraints that aren't possible with code alone.  For now we only have one simple check.
07:40 < cfields> I'll open a PR to expand the README so it's clear what it can and can't do (sorry, I meant to have that done by now). If anyone has any use for additional checks (besides the ones Marco has proposed), please ping me after the meeting or mention it in that PR once opened.
07:40 < dergoegge> 🎉
07:40 < cfields> That's all :)
07:41 < TheCharlatan> wootwoot
07:41 < sipa> cfields: can you give a quick cool example of what's possible with this?
07:41 < PaperSword> nice
07:41 < achow101> neat
07:41 < cfields> sipa: the initial one, for example, enforces that there's a "\n" at the end of every logprintf...
07:42 < fanquake> the checks that exist in LLVM: https://clang.llvm.org/extra/clang-tidy/checks/list.html
07:42 < fanquake> for inspo
07:42 < cfields> Another simple example would be enforcing some variable naming convention.
07:42 < fanquake> (and to ensure we don't recreate things that already exist)
07:42 < sipa> cfields: shouldn't we change LogPrintf to automatically add a \n in that case? (unrelated to your topic, but...)
07:42 < cfields> sipa: lol, that would work too :)
07:43 < _aj_> cfields' way has less churn?
07:43 < cfields> This was just an excuse for a first simple check.
07:43 < sipa> the reason we didn't do that, i thought, was because there were a few LogPrintf outputs that were split over multiple calls
07:43 < Earnestly> (For that kind of automatic transformation, coccinelle exists)
07:43 < sipa> but if there aren't any, let's just get rid of the requirement to have a \n
07:43 < lightlike> then we'd need a linting rule that enforces there aren't *two* \n at the end
07:43 < sipa> cfields: neat as an example still, though
07:44 < vasild> This is somehow related to https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/27825
07:44 < dergoegge> vasild: yea that can probably be closed now
07:44 < vasild> \o/
07:44 < achow101> any other topics to discuss today?
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07:45 < jamesob> good old /* Continued */
07:46 < achow101> #endmeeting
07:46 < vasild> sipa: people will keep adding "\n" by habit so then a rule will be needed that there is no trailing \n and that really would have to be enforced to avoid double \n in new code, or annoying review comments to remove \n
07:46 < sipa> vasild: i was assuming LogPrintf would just add a \n if there weren't one already
07:46 < sipa> ;)
07:47 < vasild> ;-)
07:47 < lightlike> would be awful if we had to change each existing LogPrintf...
07:47 < cfields> jamesob: fyi,  those /* Continued */ are gone because clang-tidy is smarter than our python scripts.  We now opt-out with // NOLINT(bitcoin-unterminated-logprintf)
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07:48 < vasild> wow!
07:48 < cfields> lightlike: actually that's something else clang-tidy could do very easily.  If you can describe the change, via AST it's trivial to use it to transform the entire codebase programatically.
07:48 < fanquake> enhanced scripted-diff
07:49 < lightlike> cfields: sure, but the PR to do that would conflict with almost every other PR...
07:50 < cfields> fanquake: Yep, I plan on PR'ing that as well if anyone is interested. You could assert that the transform generated the expected changes. Mostly useful for huge changes like the log example above.
07:50 < cfields> lightlike: right, that's why realistically checking the "\n" was the simpler thing to do. 
07:51 < Earnestly> clang-query(1) is a relatively new tool which lets you play with matchers and such
07:51 < vasild> cfields: Thank you!
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07:52 < cfields> Earnestly: yes,  clang-query is essential for testing queries without recompiling every time.
07:53 < cfields> (You can copy/paste our query from the cpp into clang-query and it should just work.  It's quite convenient)
07:53 < cfields> vasild: thanks for testing!
07:54 < vasild> I didn't test it (yet)
07:54 < cfields> vasild: whoops, I thought I remembered you chiming in.  nm :)
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07:58 < cfields> sipa: here's another very simple example that's imo interesting for us: https://clang.llvm.org/extra/clang-tidy/checks/modernize/make-shared.html
07:58 < cfields> we could essentially use it to enforce policy in our codebase, rather than just documenting it.
07:59 < cfields> (in this case, the example policy is obviously to always use make_shared rather than new)
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08:00 < cfields> I don't mean that example is interesting, just that it very simply shows how new code policy could be introduced/enforced.
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08:13 < jon_atack> Hi! I think I've noticed a related subtle logging rule the new plugin could enforce or that the macro could be smarter about.
08:13 < jon_atack> If the string argument following the Log* call is on a separate line rather than the same line, logsourcelocations=1 doesn't work.
08:14 < MacroFake> cfields: I think modernize-make-shared disabled Wnarrowing, so I am not sure if there are any benefits to using it 
08:14 < jon_atack> example separate line:
08:14 < jon_atack> 2023-08-17T03:35:25.306155Z [scheduler] [net_processing.cpp:5170] [operator()] [net] Protecting from eviction last remaining cjdns outbound peer=36 that relays transactions: [fc70:704d:b268:cdbf:d622:ea9f:db12:859e]:8333 (outbound-full-relay)
08:14 < jon_atack> and same line:
08:15 < jon_atack> 2023-08-17T11:56:10.285371Z [msghand] [net_processing.cpp:2801] [UpdatePeerStateForReceivedHeaders] [net] Protecting from eviction for bad or slow chain outbound peer=1154 net=i2p, peeraddr=wxtdi7pvtcd5vnnhcuwy7uffdjjeky7jjqn7mgnksnz4micqkvoa.b32.i2p:0 (outbound-full-relay)
08:15 < cfields> MacroFake: yeah, I didn't mean _that_ example at all. Sorry. I was just showing the _kind_ of thing we could enforce.
08:15 < MacroFake> ah ok
08:15 < jon_atack> sorry, bad paste
08:16 < jon_atack> but "operator()" is printed rather than the source method
08:17 < MacroFake> jon_atack: That shouldn't be related to a newline in the C++ source code
08:19 < jon_atack> MacroFake: Sorry, I may have misdiagnosed, just saw it in a change I made locally. Will look.
08:19 < MacroFake> I presume operator() means you are inside a lambda
08:21 < cfields> blah,  I really shouldn't have used the log example in the meeting. It's much more than a linter heh.
08:21 < jon_atack> yes, inside a m_connman.ForEachNode in EvictExtraOutboundPeers
08:23 < MacroFake> cfields: There may be a chance we can use native C++20 instead of the bitcoin-unterminated-logprintf tidy rule
08:23 < MacroFake> I'll look into that once and if we have C++20
08:23 < sipa> wen c++20?
08:24 < MacroFake> Generally it seems preferable to enforce all rules at compile time in the compiler, as opposed to a separate linter executable
08:24 < MacroFake> sipa: I'll open a pull in two weeks, and see what everyone thinks for 27.0
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08:26 < cfields> sipa: anything you wish you could enforce with Span? Either in the impl or with what callers do with them?
08:28 < MacroFake> cfields: We'll switch to std::span, soon :)
08:28 < sipa> cfields: lifetimebound being actually enforced would be nice :p
08:29 < MacroFake> sipa: See https://discourse.llvm.org/t/rfc-lifetime-annotations-for-c/61377 ;)
08:30 < sipa> that looks promising
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08:33 < cfields> MacroFake: well presumably if there was some semantic we wanted it would apply to span as well.
08:34 < cfields> sipa: i didn't realize it didn't work
08:34 < sipa> cfields: it works, but only in fairly narrow cases, iirc
08:35 < cfields> ah ok
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13:43 < andytoshi> is nobody else having compiler errors related to https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/28168 ?
13:44 < andytoshi> test/script_tests.cpp: In member function ‘void script_tests::script_json_test::test_method()’:
13:44 < andytoshi> test/script_tests.cpp:933:44: error: invalid initialization of reference of type ‘const std::string&’ {aka ‘const std::__cxx11::basic_string<char>&’} from expression of type ‘const unsigned char [215625]’ 933 |     UniValue tests = read_json(json_tests::script_tests);
13:46 < achow101> andytoshi: make clean first
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13:47 < andytoshi> achow101: oh, thanks!
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15:34 < ne0h> i am trying to make a program that connects to the bitcoin network to collect new transactions in the mempool and new blocks in real time, but I am having trouble getting it going. My version message doesn't get a response... I suspect it's something to do with the formatting or something, but i have tried a few things and nothing has worked so far, if anybody could help me get this running it would be quite appreciated
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15:55 < fjahr> This channel is particularly for development of bitcoin core, an alternative implementation of the protocol is out of scope. I would recommend you post your question on bitcoin stack exchange. And fwiw, you should also check if you can achieve your goal by just using bitcoin core's zmq interface, then you won't need to think about version messages etc.
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23:46 < PaperSword> Decode raw transaction is showing 3 uncompressed pubkeys in a <1 p1 p2 p3 3 OP_CHECKMULTISIG > in decoderawtransaction is showing as nonstandard. Is that true?
23:47 < PaperSword> https://mempool.space/testnet/tx/6da498d6bfb7058931bc917529c5241e689c8a85f369a2aeab6386d2a909a5fe#flow=&vout=0
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--- Log closed Fri Aug 18 00:00:32 2023