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04:43 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:43 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:45 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:54 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 04:56 -!- Pasha [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:58 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:00 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:01 -!- Pasha [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 05:02 -!- MoALTz_ [~no@78-11-180-214.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:03 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:05 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:06 -!- MoALTz [~no@78-11-180-214.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:18 < kanzure> is there any multiparty OTR implementation? 05:19 < btcdrak> kanzure: the only think I heard of was this https://github.com/cryptocat/cryptocat/wiki/mpOTR-Project-Plan 05:24 < nsh> it's a difficult problem 05:25 < nsh> i had a vague notion that perhaps you could attack it using borromean rings but i haven't elaborated that 05:28 < nsh> previous/current efforts: https://whispersystems.org/blog/private-groups/ 05:30 < nsh> matt green navel-gazes: http://blog.cryptographyengineering.com/2014/07/noodling-about-im-protocols.html 05:33 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 05:34 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:36 -!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@4.31.27.193] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:38 < nsh> .title https://mail.mozilla.org/pipermail/deuxdrop-planning/2011-November/000013.html 05:38 < yoleaux> notes from mpOTR (multi-party off-the-record) paper reading relating to our conversation crypto 05:54 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 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08:18 < bsm1175321> Multiparty OTR would be badass. 08:20 -!- wallet42 [~wallet42@p4249133-ipngn24701marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:22 -!- JayDugger [~jwdugger@108.19.186.58] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:22 -!- JayDugger [~jwdugger@108.19.186.58] has left #bitcoin-wizards [] 08:28 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2606:6000:6783:ff00:8890:c896:c1dd:657e] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:41 -!- wallet42 [~wallet42@p4249133-ipngn24701marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:44 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:a52c:df3d:3b2c:5d38] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:53 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 08:54 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:05 -!- PRab [~chatzilla@c-68-34-102-231.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:17 -!- coinoperated [~coinopera@c-73-163-103-87.hsd1.dc.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:18 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2606:6000:6783:ff00:8890:c896:c1dd:657e] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 09:19 -!- jtimon [~quassel@103.red-80-26-235.adsl.dynamic.ccgg.telefonica.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:20 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 09:21 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:22 -!- MrHodl [~fuc@91.210.105.101] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:23 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:30 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 09:30 -!- voxelot [~voxelot@2606:6000:6783:ff00:8890:c896:c1dd:657e] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:30 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 09:32 < rasengan> I would just do the simple solution for multiparty Otr heh just send same msg to everyone using otr lol 09:33 -!- roconnor [~roconnor@host-45-58-255-95.dyn.295.ca] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:35 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:35 -!- smk [b2a2c75f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.162.199.95] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 09:36 < phantomcircuit> rasengan, that's really the only sane way to do it 09:36 < phantomcircuit> but it leads to questions like, do we care if i send different people different messages? 09:36 < phantomcircuit> how do we decide group membership? 09:37 < rasengan> true have to generate hash to authenticate msg is the same 09:37 < nsh> consistency of transcript (does everyone think the same conversation happened) and weak or strong repudiability and the same degree of authentication, forward-secrecy and protection of long-term identities 09:37 < nsh> does not scale if you do a naive generalisation to two-party like that 09:37 < nsh> things start to go potentially wrong in different ways 09:38 < nsh> *of two-party 09:38 < phantomcircuit> nsh, it scales O(n) which isn't great but also isn't terrible 09:39 < phantomcircuit> the bigger issue is whether everybody saw the same thing 09:39 < bsm1175321> The requirement of forward secrecy seems to be incompatible with multi-party. 09:39 < nsh> i meant that none of those properties remain exactly as strong 09:39 < nsh> or at least, you have to give up some to retain others 09:40 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:45 < phantomcircuit> bsm1175321, there has to be a design decision made between guaranteeing to multiple parties that they all got the same message and forward secrecy 09:45 < phantomcircuit> (i think, maybe someone has a clever design that does both) 09:46 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@128-79-141-196.hfc.dyn.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: laurentmt] 09:48 -!- brg444 [415ce066@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.92.224.102] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:06 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 10:14 -!- Burrito [~Burrito@unaffiliated/burrito] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:15 -!- c-cex-yuriy 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Bitcoin, as a proxy for hashcash, isn't as good because you have to wait for the confirmation time. 16:19 < adlai> conf time puts a base cost, that of the tx fee confirmable within your maximal latency tolerance 16:19 < maaku> adlai: i declare that communications to me must include a solved block on tip with myself as the coinbase payout 16:19 < adlai> please don't be elitist, what if some poor souls who can't afford their own ants want to responsibly disclose your fuckups? 16:20 < bsm1175321> adlai: You can't have it both ways. Sybil resistance implies resource expenditure. 16:20 < bsm1175321> It's not elitist, it's reality. 16:21 < belcher> all communications to me must be using your real name on facebook.com 16:22 < adlai> resource expenditure can be measured in a variety of ways. i'm suggesting that using a more liquid/fungible market (btc tx fee) is an arbitrarily/arguably better critereon than one much less so - sha256d hashpower 16:22 < bsm1175321> belcher: good luck getting crypto verification of that. 16:22 < adlai> /invite bsm1175321 #tlsnotary-chat 16:33 -!- alpalp [~alp@104-54-235-28.lightspeed.austtx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Changing host] 16:33 -!- alpalp [~alp@unaffiliated/alpalp] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:34 -!- smk [5d735527@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.115.85.39] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:35 -!- zookolaptop [~user@2601:281:8001:26aa:3497:5ba3:9f3c:cb4e] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:48 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ncktcpssejohvedr] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 16:51 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:55 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:00 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:03 -!- stevenroose [stevenroos@bnc1.sollidi.us] has quit [Disconnected by services] 17:03 -!- stevenroose|BNC [stevenroos@bnc1.sollidi.us] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:05 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:10 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:304:cff8:1580:a52c:df3d:3b2c:5d38] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:13 -!- adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.3] 17:14 -!- adlai [~adlai@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:23 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Excess Flood] 17:23 -!- adam3us [~Adium@63.138.18.50] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:24 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:29 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 17:30 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 17:32 -!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@107.77.160.40] has quit [Quit: GGuyZ] 17:34 -!- brg444 [415ce066@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.92.224.102] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:37 -!- GAit [~GAit@2-230-161-158.ip202.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 17:38 -!- gocrazy [~gocrazey@104.156.228.94] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:42 -!- smk [5d735527@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.115.85.39] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:48 -!- phy1729 [~phy1729@freenode/staff/phy1729] has left #bitcoin-wizards ["WeeChat 1.2"] 18:04 < adlai> has there been any documentation of sybil attacks against bitmessage? 18:08 -!- btcdrak [uid115429@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fzphogalqxypmnno] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:08 -!- bliljerk101 [~bliljerk1@c-71-60-0-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 18:10 -!- bliljerk101 [~bliljerk1@c-71-60-0-241.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:12 < pigeons> i havent looked at it in a long time, it used to take a whole lot of bandwidth to forward every message for the whole network, and to send a mesage you had to request a pubkey first so you could tell when the recipeinet came online and what node you first saw the pubkey from 18:12 < pigeons> but i dont remember anything about sybil attacks 18:13 < adlai> well it uses naive PoW... you could make a BM-spamASIC the moment widespread use began 18:16 < adlai> BTC at least has dynamic difficulty adjustment. so i guess the ideal sybil-resistent nonglobal channel should have identity-based btc-style "difficulty"? 18:20 -!- Amino_ [56a0ac16@gateway/web/cgi-irc/kiwiirc.com/ip.86.160.172.22] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:24 -!- adlie [~adlie@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:24 -!- adlie [~adlie@unaffiliated/adlai] has quit [Client Quit] 18:25 -!- pozitrono [~nu@109.201.143.40] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:25 -!- adlie [~adlie@unaffiliated/adlai] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:26 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 18:26 -!- dEBRUYNE [~dEBRUYNE@56-197-ftth.onsbrabantnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 18:31 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 18:33 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:36 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 18:41 -!- copumpkin [~copumpkin@unaffiliated/copumpkin] has quit [Quit: My MacBook Pro has gone to sleep. 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http://znc.in] 23:06 -!- tjader [~tjader@189.60.213.1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:09 -!- p15 [~p15@93.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 23:18 < ThomasV> Luke-Jr: thanks 23:30 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 23:33 -!- frankenmint [~frankenmi@67-5-247-11.ptld.qwest.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:39 -!- p15 [~p15@101.91.145.64.client.static.strong-tk2.bringover.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:47 -!- chjj [~chjj@unaffiliated/chjj] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:50 -!- melvster [~melvster@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:53 -!- ebfull [~sean@73.34.119.0] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] --- Log closed Mon Jan 11 00:00:01 2016