--- Log opened Sat Oct 08 00:00:15 2016 00:05 -!- waxwing [~waxwing@93-33-110-54.ip44.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:08 -!- mol [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 00:12 -!- droark [~droark@host191-16-static.241-95-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: ZZZzzz…] 00:20 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@2602:306:b8e0:8160:c85b:d2b5:5264:c8ea] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 00:22 -!- pero0 [~pero@CPE002191140490-CM84948c5e90c0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 00:23 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xycauybpoluydiht] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:24 -!- Starduster [~guest@unaffiliated/starduster] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:28 -!- Guyver2 [~Guyver2@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: :)] 00:33 -!- bsm1175321 [~mcelrath@108.21.236.13] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:44 -!- bsm1175321 [~mcelrath@108.21.236.13] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:45 < kanzure_> are we using #bitcoin-workshops 00:55 -!- kanzure_ is now known as kanzure 00:56 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:56 -!- adiabat [~adiabat@159.203.193.74] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:57 -!- belcher [83af1c9e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.131.175.28.158] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:58 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:00 < maaku> https://arxiv.org/abs/1609.09047 01:00 < maaku> Best. Abstract. Ever. 01:02 -!- Starduster [~guest@unaffiliated/starduster] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:03 < kanzure> .title 01:03 < yoleaux> [1609.09047] Quantum Tokens for Digital Signatures 01:08 -!- echonaut [~echonaut@46.101.192.134] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:09 -!- echonaut [~echonaut@46.101.192.134] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:10 -!- mol [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:11 -!- pero [~pero@unaffiliated/pero] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:11 -!- mol [~molly@unaffiliated/molly] has quit [Client Quit] 01:11 -!- echonaut [~echonaut@46.101.192.134] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:12 -!- echonaut [~echonaut@46.101.192.134] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:15 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:17 -!- xissburg [~xissburg@unaffiliated/xissburg] has quit [Quit: leaving] 01:17 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:43 -!- arowser 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connection] 14:11 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 14:15 -!- MoALTz [~no@78-11-247-26.static.ip.netia.com.pl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 14:20 -!- Dizzle [~Dizzle@2605:6000:1019:4099:cc15:523e:e1ed:6cd0] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 14:39 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 14:43 -!- waxwing [~waxwing@93-33-110-54.ip44.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 14:45 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 14:46 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@cpe-23-240-155-236.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 14:58 -!- JHistone [~JHistone@cpc104808-sgyl39-2-0-cust135.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:03 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:05 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 15:08 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@89-96-136-66.ip12.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 15:23 -!- bsm1175321 [~mcelrath@89-96-136-66.ip12.fastwebnet.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 15:23 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@89-96-136-66.ip12.fastwebnet.it] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:26 -!- GGuyZ [~GGuyZ@213.57.221.54] has quit [Quit: GGuyZ] 15:39 < uiuc-slack3> i think mimble wimble doesn't provide any better scalability or privacy than say 15:39 < uiuc-slack3> bitcoin with utxo commitments in the blocks 15:39 < uiuc-slack3> and miners are asked to forget history 15:39 < uiuc-slack3> it has similar properties, just by checking the UTXO set + an SPV proof you can be sure about the amount of work, and that there is no inflation, and you don't necessarliy get to see any of the history 15:40 < kanzure> there's some small block history growth stuff 15:40 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/milan/mimblewimble/ 15:40 < uiuc-slack3> i know, im reading that, this is a response to reaidng that transcript :slightly_smiling_face: 15:41 < cjd> hmm if you're right then UTXO set only is actually cheaper than MW because MW requires that you keep these empty-string-sigs around forever 15:42 < cjd> but MW is private and fungible 15:42 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 15:44 < uiuc-slack3> it's "private" because you are hoping miners forget history and transactions they saw, and because you are deciding to be satisfied checking only "partial" correctness of the chain (i.e., that there is no inflation, but not necessarly checking that all the signatures are valid and coins haven't been stolen) 15:45 < uiuc-slack3> i.e. it's only private if you are making some extra assumptions, not because the protocol brings it 15:45 < cjd> yeah but it's not private because you sit there with a node and collect transactions 15:45 < cjd> everyone needs to verify the block when it's mined so you need to send everyone the transactions that moment 15:46 -!- NewLiberty_ [~NewLibert@cpe-23-240-155-236.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 15:46 < amiller> right, so this is true of both UTXO-bitcoin and MW 15:47 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 15:47 < cjd> when you get a new block in MW land, all transactions in that block have already been merged into a "ring" 15:48 < amiller> if the transactions propagated around the P2P network before being mined, then everyone already saw them 15:48 < amiller> you can forget them shortly after, but what difference does that make 15:48 < cjd> I don't propigate your transaction, I merge it with whatever I have in memory and propigate the result 15:49 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@cpe-23-240-155-236.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 15:50 < cjd> https://icrypt.ca/paste/id/YHSsFacuAnsb#mAEw6CpORiPaQyWTT+fivsG4CTswRvLQOvB1PcN3nJw= 15:51 < cjd> Part of an argument to the European Commission about why they should fund research around End-to-End Encryption and Zero Knowledge Cloud Services 15:52 < uiuc-slack3> if our memory pools are similar 15:52 < uiuc-slack3> and i send you a "compressd block" or hwatever with one new tx output 15:52 < uiuc-slack3> and 1 new txinput 15:52 < uiuc-slack3> then that mapping is pretty clear right 15:53 < cjd> right 15:53 < cjd> if there was a way to merge transactions (in a single block) then MW and your scheme would be equivilant I think 15:58 -!- Cory [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:58 -!- torsthaldo [~torsthald@31.169.51.195] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 16:00 -!- Pasha [~C@unaffiliated/cory] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:03 -!- crossing-styx [~crossing-@user173.77-105-202.netatonce.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 16:04 -!- crossing-styx [~crossing-@user173.77-105-202.netatonce.net] has quit [Client Quit] 16:07 -!- Pasha is now known as Cory 16:12 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 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ZZZzzz…] 22:20 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:20 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:20 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:20 -!- zooko [~user@2601:281:8000:5c39:4f36:603e:3f03:eba1] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:23 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:28 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [~Chris_Ste@unaffiliated/chris-stewart-5/x-3612383] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:31 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 22:36 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:37 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:38 -!- bsm117532 [~mcelrath@static-108-21-236-13.nycmny.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:44 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 22:46 -!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:48 -!- droark [~droark@host191-16-static.241-95-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:50 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:52 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 22:55 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:55 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host] 22:55 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 22:58 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 23:07 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:09 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:12 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:14 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 23:15 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 23:22 -!- mountaingoat [~mountaing@unaffiliated/mountaingoat] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:24 < instagibbs> I don't understand why people assume transaction propagation would be identical to today. If *nothing* else, hosted wallets would be doing aggregations themselves. It would be nearly zero work. 23:28 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gxiuryxrsjphpsfr] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 23:30 -!- NewLiberty [~NewLibert@cpe-23-240-155-236.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 23:35 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:36 -!- mountaingoat [~mountaing@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/mountaingoat] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:37 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:38 -!- CrazyTruthYakDDS [uid67551@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-nyhvfyyckasleafm] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:39 -!- droark [~droark@host191-16-static.241-95-b.business.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Quit: ZZZzzz…] 23:45 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:45 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host] 23:45 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:48 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 23:50 -!- Emcy [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:50 -!- Emcy [~MC@cpc3-swan1-0-0-cust1003.7-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host] 23:50 -!- Emcy [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 23:51 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:52 -!- Emcy_ [~MC@unaffiliated/mc1984] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 23:53 -!- Alopex [~bitcoin@cyber.dealing.ninja] has joined #bitcoin-wizards --- Log closed Sun Oct 09 00:00:16 2016