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06:32 < bsm117532> "stability" is a red herring that for some reason finance types buy into.  No assets are stable.  Even fiat currencies have wonky swings.
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06:33 < bsm117532> Instead of achieving stability by pegging (which has a failure condition where collateral runs out), it should be achieved by having a robust derivatives market.
06:34 < bsm117532> The ability to place orders on *both* sides of the market allows more effective arbitrage and damps price swings.
06:38 < bsm117532> On another topic...
06:39 < bsm117532> I'm very excited by the bulletproofs paper.  But, they focused mostly on proof size rather than speed.  Has anyone done any benchmarks comparing to zkSNARKS or other ZKP systems?
06:40 < bsm117532> Also what's the status of the code, is it available yet?  (andytoshi, gmaxwell, sipa)
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06:50 < bsm117532> Answering my own question https://github.com/bbuenz/BulletProofLib
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08:37 < maaku> bsm117532: see citation number on in the paper
08:37 < maaku> *number 1
08:37 < maaku> for the code, see #secp256k1
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08:54 < bsm117532> Is this proof system specific to the secp256k1 curve?
09:02 < sipa> no
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09:56 < piano7> https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2425270
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10:05 < bsm117532> piano7: that's funny...I actually put an interest rate into the satoshi code a while back.  But this manipulation only affects *perception* not any of the economic in/outputs, and therefore will only affect price stability for irrational market participants.
10:06 < bsm117532> The divisibility in bitcoin is sufficient though.  This is just an overall normalization factor.
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10:53 < sipa> bsm117532: bulletproofs just need a DLP hard group
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11:21 < kanzure> .title https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/lightning-dev/2017-November/000804.html
11:21 < yoleaux> [Lightning-dev] General question on routing difficulties
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17:27 < Taek> I would argue that there's minimal merit to Tether having a blockchain. When an asset like tether is traded on a blockchain, you only need to check with the third party for redemption
17:27 < Taek> but if there's not a blockchain and instead just a central ledger owned by  tether, you need to check in with the third party every time that you make a transaction
17:28 < Taek> Tether can still refuse to redeem transactions they don't like, so that minimizes the impact
17:28 < sipa> indeed, there is no point
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17:29 < sipa> in particular, any system that only supports trading a single issued asset relies on the issuer anyway for the entirety of its value premise
17:30 < Taek> right but for example the tether central server can experience downtime that will not interrupt trading
17:30 < Taek> (I say this not knowing the implementation details of the tether blockchain - it may be that every block needs to be signed, which defeats the purpose)
17:30 < sipa> nope, it's mastercoin
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17:31 < sipa> but problems with reliability you solve with redundancy
17:31 < sipa> it doesn't change the trust question
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17:37 < waxwing> i think a chaumian token system makes sense for that kind of thing.
17:39 < sipa> yes!
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17:41 < waxwing> yes, see: truledger, loom (old days), or opentransactions. not commenting on whether any of them are any good, but it's a shame that kind of system hasn't developed for assets.
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20:52 < poorlad__> can someone either give me btc or info as to where there underground stuff people are making millions from is
20:55 < kanzure> no, wrong channel
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--- Log closed Sun Nov 26 00:00:26 2017