--- Log opened Tue Jun 19 00:00:50 2018 00:01 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:09 -!- ynakasone [~ynakasone@KD111239149093.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:11 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:28 -!- Krellan [~Krellan@2601:640:4000:9258:214e:c5e5:8920:cfd1] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:37 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 00:37 -!- helo [~helo@unaffiliated/helo] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:38 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:39 -!- helo [~helo@unaffiliated/helo] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:41 -!- tromp [~tromp@ip-217-103-3-94.ip.prioritytelecom.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:42 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 00:42 < RubenSomsen> waxwing: Your statement about graftroot seems accurate to me. Regarding M of N Schnorr, I also haven't seen anyone explain it, but I imagine it may work like this: A, B, and C want to do 2 of 3. A splits up her privkey into a1 + a2 = a, gives a1 to B, and a2 to C. B and C split their key similarly, and now 2 of 3 can sign for ABC. For things like 2 of 4 you'd have to split your key up multiple times (i.e. to BC, 00:42 < RubenSomsen> CD, and BD you give a1 + a2 = a3 + a4 = a5 + a6 = a). Note that I am just speculating, am probably oversimplifying, and I have no idea how (in)secure this is. 00:45 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 00:45 < aj> waxwing: M-of-N schnorr: lagrangian polynomial interpolation (ie, same as shamir secret sharing, but better since you can keep making sigs without having to reveal the key to anyone) 00:46 < aj> waxwing: that sounds like the natural way of thinking about graftroot to me? key P could be keys P,Q and R via arbitrary multisig/script rules too of course 00:46 < RubenSomsen> sounds like I was totally off haha 00:47 < aj> RubenSomsen: not totally off, that's a way of doing it too :) 00:48 < RubenSomsen> Regardless of how it's done, it always requires interaction, right? A can't make a 2 of 3 without communicating with B and C. 00:49 < aj> RubenSomsen: 2-of-3 means A and B can sign without communicating with C at all 00:50 < aj> RubenSomsen: depending on how the initial setup's done, A,B,C might have to all communicate to generate the initial address; or it might be only C needs to communicate with A and B (ie, A and B setup a 2-of-2 and then give C some info so A+C and B+C works as additional alternatives) 00:52 < RubenSomsen> Right, that answers my question, thanks. I was thinking of a scheme at some point where you'd lock up money before one of the parties had access to the private key, but that wouldn't work. 00:53 < RubenSomsen> I guess maybe your second example could still work... hmm 00:53 < aj> RubenSomsen: (you could also have a trusted key-distribution-node that sends the private keys to A,B,C so everyone talks to T initially, but not each other) 00:55 < RubenSomsen> Trusted as in trusted hardware? Does the node learn the private keys? 00:56 < aj> RubenSomsen: yeah, the trusted key-distribution-node generates and knows all the private keys in that case 00:57 < aj> RubenSomsen: (presumably destroys its copy of them after sending them out or something, but ...) 00:57 < RubenSomsen> Gotcha, I mean I understand the trade-offs involved. 00:59 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 00:59 -!- p0nziph0ne [p0nziph0ne@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:09 -!- vicenteH [~user@97.red-83-50-45.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:11 -!- p0nziph0ne [p0nziph0ne@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:21 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:22 -!- BashCo_ [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:23 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 01:25 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 01:35 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:50 -!- PdeClown [~sapperdef@212-43-60-43.pz.ddns.bulsat.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:50 -!- PdeClown [~sapperdef@212-43-60-43.pz.ddns.bulsat.com] has quit [Changing host] 01:50 -!- PdeClown [~sapperdef@unaffiliated/pdeclown] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 01:53 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 01:57 -!- PdeClown [~sapperdef@unaffiliated/pdeclown] has left #bitcoin-wizards [] 02:02 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:02 -!- vicenteH [~user@97.red-83-50-45.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 02:03 -!- vicenteH [~user@97.red-83-50-45.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:05 -!- TheoStorm [~dnaleor@host-lzquwqj.cbn1.zeelandnet.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:06 -!- ynakasone [~ynakasone@KD111239149093.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:07 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 02:25 -!- kabaum [~kabaum@2.69.139.113.mobile.tre.se] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:36 -!- thrmo [~thrmo@unaffiliated/thrmo] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:46 -!- eamonnw [~eamonnw@iceland.sdf.org] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:50 -!- jtimon [~quassel@40.28.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:59 -!- rusty [~rusty@45.124.203.40] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 02:59 -!- rusty [~rusty@45.124.203.40] has quit [Changing host] 02:59 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:07 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:09 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:37 -!- thrmo [~thrmo@unaffiliated/thrmo] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:40 -!- d9b4bef9 [~d9b4bef9@web501.webfaction.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:41 -!- d9b4bef9 [~d9b4bef9@web501.webfaction.com] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 03:48 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [~chris@unaffiliated/chris-stewart-5/x-3612383] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:00 -!- kabaum [~kabaum@2.69.139.113.mobile.tre.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:13 -!- p0nziph0ne [p0nziph0ne@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 04:18 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@185.94.189.189] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:19 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@185.94.189.189] has quit [Client Quit] 04:25 -!- nuncanada [~dude@179.235.129.226] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:25 -!- p0nziph0ne [p0nziph0ne@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/p0nziph0ne] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 04:29 -!- nuncanada [~dude@179.235.129.226] has quit [Client Quit] 05:00 -!- dougsland [~douglas@c-73-234-93-65.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:09 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [~chris@unaffiliated/chris-stewart-5/x-3612383] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 05:11 -!- SopaXorzTaker [~SopaXorzT@unaffiliated/sopaxorztaker] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:14 < kanzure> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJRjo5Dy3IM 05:14 < yoleaux> Verifying Quantum Proofs with Entangled Games - YouTube 05:16 -!- vicenteH [~user@97.red-83-50-45.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:30 -!- kabaum [~kabaum@94.234.33.116] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:51 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [~chris@unaffiliated/chris-stewart-5/x-3612383] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 05:51 < Chris_Stewart_5> I remember awhile back a discussion about wishing we used 0xff as the marker byte instead of 0x00 for segwit. Does anyone remember where this conversation took place? 05:53 < kanzure> please state your questions in the form of their proper answer 05:55 < Chris_Stewart_5> Why was 0x00 chosen as the marker byte isntead of 0xff 05:55 < Chris_Stewart_5> kanzure: ^ 05:56 < kanzure> apologies, i was joking around (stating a question in the form of an answer would eliminate the need to ask anything); also i don't actually recall either. 05:56 < Chris_Stewart_5> Sorry, my joke detector isn't as sharp this early in the morning :-). 05:57 < Varunram> I thought for once you mistyped kanzure ;) 06:01 -!- kabaum [~kabaum@94.234.33.116] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:10 -!- quer [~quer@unaffiliated/quer] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 06:34 < andytoshi> waxwing: m-of-n schnorr: https://github.com/apoelstra/secp256k1/blob/2018-04-taproot/src/modules/musig/main_impl.h 06:37 < waxwing> andytoshi, thx 06:37 < waxwing> RubenSomsen, aj thx also 06:41 < andytoshi> today i'm writting API docs for that .. i'll also add a markdown file explaining the algo and justification 07:12 -!- vicenteH [~user@54.104.135.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:38 -!- Krellan [~Krellan@2601:640:4000:9258:214e:c5e5:8920:cfd1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 07:49 -!- brianhoffman [~brianhoff@pool-173-66-26-200.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:49 -!- brianhoffman [~brianhoff@pool-173-66-26-200.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:19 -!- Noldorin [~noldorin@unaffiliated/noldorin] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 08:34 -!- Guyver2 [AdiIRC@guyver2.xs4all.nl] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:04 -!- Krellan [~Krellan@2601:640:4000:9258:214e:c5e5:8920:cfd1] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 09:08 -!- son0p_ [~ff@adsl201-232-238-252.epm.net.co] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:47 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:47 -!- sn0wmonster [~yeti@taskhive/lead/sn0wmonster] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:48 -!- kristofferR [~kristoffe@45.37-191-172.fiber.lynet.no] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 09:57 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:04 -!- Krellan [~Krellan@2601:640:4000:9258:214e:c5e5:8920:cfd1] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:06 -!- Krellan [~Krellan@2601:640:4000:9258:214e:c5e5:8920:cfd1] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:25 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:27 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 10:27 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@c-73-181-185-197.hsd1.wa.comcast.net] has joined #bitcoin-wizards 10:31 < arubi> Chris_Stewart_5, it's because 0x00 might look like a valid-ly encoded non-witness unfunded transaction. an 0xff instead would be non ambiguous. 0xff means that the varint being encoded as "num inputs" is so large that the transaction itself can't be valid, so it must be the marker. 10:31 < arubi> it's not an issue for transaction coming over the wire, just those passed into decoderawtransaction (and the likes) 10:36 < arubi> oh, if the question is "why was 0x00 chosen", well I think it's just that nobody saw this ambiguity happening 10:37 < Chris_Stewart_5> arubi: Yes that is kind of what I was asking about. 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