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05:13 < real_or_random> faster and better bulletproofs: https://eprint.iacr.org/2019/944
05:13 < nsh> supersonic bulletproofs
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05:17 < sarang> Rocket proofs?
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05:26 < nsh> hyperloop / fish-cannon proofs
05:29 < aj> pewpew proofs, like the ray guns in starwars
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10:47 < tromp> what would be the actual improvement for 64-bit rangeproofs, perhaps the most widely used application of BPs ?
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10:48 < andytoshi> 64-bit BP rangeproofs vs what? the rangeproofs that are currently deployed in elements/liquid?
10:48 < tromp> current BP vs that 944 paper on 64-bit rangeproof
10:49 < tromp> such as in liquid
10:50 < andytoshi> my expectation, though i haven't read the paper, is that BPs will still win for 64-bit rangeproofs
10:50 < andytoshi> because the rangeproofs are not just R1CS, there are some other hacks to drop extra data (which is why the general ZKPs are bigger than the rangeproofs even if you're just proving the rangeproof circuit)
10:51 < andytoshi> and i don't see any way that non-R1CS constraints could give you smaller rangeproof circuits (though maybe i'm just not creative enough)
10:51 < tromp> that would explain why the paper doesn't mention application to rangeproofs...
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11:58 < sarang> Table 3 seems to suggest verification improvement for aggregate range proofs (skimmed to find it; still reading through)
11:59 < sarang> (page 13)
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12:25 < andytoshi> oh lol they have a space in "range proof"
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12:48 < digi_james> instagibbs: Would this pay-to-contract scheme work? P + H(P|c1)G + H(P|c2)G for multiple commitments c1, c2 ... or are nested hash expressions necessary, such as H((P+H(P|c1))|c2)
12:48 < sipa> digi_james: Wagner's attack will kill you
12:48 < digi_james> lol
12:49 < sipa> you need to nest it
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12:50 < digi_james> Thanks a lot.
12:51 < sipa> digi_james: actually, it works, but only if you reveal all c1s when opening the commitment
12:51 < sipa> which kinda defeats the purpose
12:51 < sipa> all c's
12:54 < sipa> oh, no, it doesn't work at all; if you know the private key to P, you can construct ci's efficiently such that the result matches any given point that you have the DL for
12:58 < digi_james> Hm, even if all ci's are nested in H(...|ci) ?
12:58 < sipa> if you nest it it works
12:58 < sipa> that's definitely fine, as it's just p2c recursively
13:00 < digi_james> ok, if I don't, I have secret + H(P|c1) + H(P|c2)  ... how can that match a given scalar target?
13:00 < digi_james> the scalar which is the secret to the "given point that you have the DL for"
13:01 < sipa> wagner's algorithm :)
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13:02 < digi_james> Right, regardless how many commitments are already revealed. I see what you meant before.
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13:20 < instagibbs> yeah it doesn't work at all
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--- Log closed Wed Aug 21 00:00:46 2019