--- Log opened Fri Sep 02 00:00:07 2022
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06:46 < Guest72> hey
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07:05 < Guest7257> anyone on?
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07:07 < nsh> no table service on irc. people respond if things are said that arise their interest
07:08 < Guest7257> has anyone ever heard of a low-level attack which involves changing the ciphertext parameters on an externally connected drive, effectively rendering it unable to be decrypted by the proper key?
07:17 < nsh> is this a general question about disk encryption, not about bitcoin/blockchain/elliptic-curve-cryptosystems?
07:17 < nsh> might be better to ask in #crypto
07:18 < nsh> encryption is sensitive to changes in metadata and encrypted data so in general if enough bits are twiddled then decryption becomes impossible. this can be accounted for by redundancy/error-correction/coding but at the cost of storage and encoding/decoding computational complexity
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07:37 < Guest7257> a drive containing a large amount of crypto currency may have been attacked using this type of technique. i was wondering if anyone has heard of anything similar happening to help understand what the attack is beyond sabotage.
07:38 < nsh> what makes you think attacked rather than accidental corruption?
07:39 < Guest7257> there is error correction, so the atttack involved changing parameters and re-computing the error correction. accidental corruption would have been fixable
07:39 < nsh> the good and bad thing about wallet data is that you can replicate and distribute it. the thing to learn would be not to depend completely on the operation of a single device
07:39 < Guest7257> CRC of the parameters
07:40 < nsh> someone could do that without having enough access to simply steal the funds?
07:40 < Guest7257> yes in this case, due to multiple layers of encryption
07:40 < Guest7257> it might have been successful otherwise
07:40 < nsh> and there is no backup available?
07:40 < Guest7257> if that was strategy
07:41 < Guest7257> it appears to have affected multiple drives indiscriminately including some backups
07:41 < nsh> ouch :(
07:41 < nsh> keeping things at the same site reduces the usefulness of redundancy/backups
07:42 < nsh> best practice is to backup 'off-site' in a different physical security compartment to minimise risk
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07:59 < Guest72> does anyone know of techniques/technology to read data that was overwritten on thumb drive? does physical location in memory change on some of these overwrites?
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08:01 < nsh> the first thing to do it not use it
08:01 < nsh> because you risk destroying any redundancy in between the physical and logical layers 
08:01 < nsh> next to make as low-level as possible a clone of the physical memory
08:01 < nsh> and then to work out what's possible from how the device is specified
08:02 < Guest72> "next to make as low-level as possible a clone of the physical memory" -> can you elaborate on what you mean by this?
08:02 < nsh> but basically that translates to pay someone who has taken the time to figure these things out a reasonable margin if successful and possibly a retainer if not
08:02 < nsh> so e.g. a solid state drive doesn't just write the bits directly to the flash memory
08:02 < nsh> it does some relatively complex load balancing and coding
08:03 < nsh> so there's a chance, but the more you write to the device the lower the prospects become
08:03 < nsh> there exist dedicated digital forensics hardware and software which can try to clone the physical state of the device as far as possible 
08:04 < nsh> and then you can try to recover data without risking further corruptions over a copy in a simulated device driver
08:04 < nsh> there exist people who specialise in recovering cryptocurrency data
08:04 < Guest72> where can i find this hardware and software? and do you know of any experts in this area?
08:04 < nsh> so it depends on how much it's worth
08:04 < Guest72> $20 million
08:04 < nsh> just search for cryptocurrency data recovery / digital forensics
08:04 < nsh> there's on person i can try and remember the name of
08:05 < nsh> this guy https://www.youtube.com/c/JoeGrand
08:06 < nsh> but i'd ask about in various forums like bitcointalk or reddit.com/r/bitcoin and other places like that (i'm not good at coming up with lists of things sorry)
08:06 < nsh> Joe's twitter: https://twitter.com/joegrand?lang=en
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--- Log closed Sat Sep 03 00:00:08 2022