--- Log opened Tue Sep 27 00:00:31 2022
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06:56 < pinheadmz_> roasbeef in bolt-simple-taproot am I understanding correctly that Alice gives Bob a nonce that he signs with? And vice versa?
06:56 < instagibbs> it's following MuSig2, which allows for presharing of public nonce before message is known
06:58 < instagibbs> so message pattern is roughly: share(during setup/reestablishment), sign+share, sign+share and so on
06:59 < pinheadmz_> i think i understand that musig2 starts by sharing and comitting to nonces, so they can't be used to negate other users keys etc
06:59 < pinheadmz_> but reading the bolt,
07:00 < pinheadmz_> looks like Alice sends bob her public key along with 2 musig nonces
07:00 < pinheadmz_> and one of those 2 nonces is what bob signs one of the commitment txs
07:00 < pinheadmz_> the other nonce alice uses to sign so bob can verify
07:00 < pinheadmz_> then bob sends back to alice, his public key and 2 more nonces, for the opposite
07:02 < instagibbs> MuSig2 has a public nonce, which is two curve points, per signer
07:04 < pinheadmz_> and then, IIUC, bolt-taproot has TWO of those musig public nonces, one for me and one for you
07:04 < pinheadmz_> so IIUC, we each partially sign each commitment tx with one nonce provided by the *other* party
07:04 < instagibbs> LN today uses two separate transactions for state, "local" and "remote", so you need two 
07:04 < instagibbs> + more for htlc sigs
07:05 < pinheadmz_> https://github.com/lightning/bolts/blob/4ab4b8fb455d96b5abff554fa68819f60be42aa1/bolt-simple-taproot.md#rationale
07:06 < instagibbs> you have four nonces(ignoring htlcs) in parallel. two of them sign your "local" commitment tx, two sign the "remote" commitment tx
07:09 < pinheadmz_> ok we're on the same page. so my question is: does alice create a signature using a nonce that bob gave her?
07:10 < instagibbs> https://github.com/jonasnick/bips/blob/musig2/bip-musig2.mediawiki#nonce-aggregation
07:10 < instagibbs> those two sections should explain explicitly 
07:13 < instagibbs> roasbeef is just naming things in the BOLT to make it clear the difference between the two nonces, since they cannot be "mixed"
07:14 < instagibbs> one is for local(the verification one), and one is for remote(the one you sign with and send)
07:15 < instagibbs> in the local case, going to chain you indeed sign using the nonce, right before broadcast
07:18 < pinheadmz_> ok so I send you two nonces (A, B) and you send me two nonces (C, D). Then I sign one commitment with NonceAgg(A, C) and you sign the other commitment with NonceAgg(B, D) ...?
07:19 < instagibbs> yeah, as long as each side agrees on which go together
07:20 < pinheadmz_> ok thanks. and then as general musig2 question: all parties always sign with a complete aggregate nonce ?
07:20 < pinheadmz_> i mean, we dont aggregate the nonces AFTER aggregating signatures to produce the final output
07:20 < pinheadmz_> (if thats even mathematically possible idk)
07:21 < instagibbs> "session context" is required to partially sign, and context requires aggregated nonce
07:21 < pinheadmz_> got it
07:25 < pinheadmz_> and in musig2 its safe for the first party to send their public key and their nonce pair at the same time? I thought one of the complications with musig was that this enabled the next party to maliciously create their own pubkey/nonce that could break the first party's security?
07:26 < pinheadmz_> or is that solved in musig2 specifically, i see something about a secnonce in there, just beginngin to understand...
07:31 < instagibbs> https://github.com/jonasnick/bips/blob/musig2/bip-musig2.mediawiki#modifications-to-nonce-generation
07:31 < instagibbs> https://github.com/jonasnick/bips/blob/musig2/bip-musig2.mediawiki#public-key-aggregation
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--- Log closed Wed Sep 28 00:00:32 2022