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| nsh | Succinct Arguments from Multi-Prover Interactive Proofs and their Efficiency Benefits -- https://eprint.iacr.org/2012/461.pdf | 10:24 |
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| lmatteis | hi guys. | 11:21 |
| lmatteis | have been working on this for the past few months and was wondering what you guys think | 11:21 |
| lmatteis | http://lucaa.org/docs/kudos.pdf | 11:21 |
| lmatteis | (i'm not a researcher, just a beginner undergrad that's why i put university affiliation) | 11:22 |
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| fkhan | should add a biblio when you have time | 11:23 |
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| lmatteis | fkhan: yes it's far from done. related work section has some empty [] that i need to cite | 11:23 |
| fkhan | yeah, i just usually do a literature check before reading to get an idea where the ideas are built from, helps me read some papers at least | 11:25 |
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| lmatteis | essentially what i'm aiming for is a decentralized reddit using a blockchain (for tracking points) and a distributed hash table (DHT) for actually serving the post content (such as the actual comment and the HTTP URL it points to if there's one) | 12:54 |
| lmatteis | and transactions in the chain contain a reference which is essentially the key of the DHT key-pair | 12:54 |
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| nsh | .seen zooko | 15:20 |
| yoleaux | I saw zooko 13 Jul 2015 11:03Z in #bitcoin-wizards: <zooko> :-) | 15:20 |
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| kanzure | if you have multiple proof-of-work algorithm variations, how would you judge the relative merit between their outputs? i can only think of arbitrary answers. | 17:40 |
| gmaxwell | For what application? | 17:40 |
| kanzure | eh, just your typical "reset pow to fiddle with decentralization" (loosely- nothing specific) | 17:41 |
| gmaxwell | I know nothing but $arbritary for that. (For hashcash you can just blinding increment the cost when the rate is high in order to rate limit requests; esp if you can distinguish bad requests after the fact.) | 17:42 |
| kanzure | i have heard the idea to "flip the switch" and go to a different pow algorithm before, but it seems more natural to have a geometric drop-off of one pow algorithm while switching to another, or keeping sha256 pow and then adding another one instead of just a hard switch | 17:42 |
| kanzure | and by "adding" i mean "blocks can be verified using this second verification method" i guess | 17:43 |
| gmaxwell | kanzure: if you're thinking about concurrent-- you're aware that the whole argument for "Multiple algorithims to improve decentralization" is probably totally busted, right? Needing more circut area increases R&D costs and one time mfg costs, but not operating; and thus probably is a centeralizing force (fewer parties can make hardware). | 17:43 |
| gmaxwell | Oh a transistion, well for that you can have a programmed ratio that changes over time. | 17:44 |
| kanzure | is a ratio equally busted, or less busted? | 17:44 |
| gmaxwell | I think as a transition mechenism that could work. The argument I was giving above basically only holds for the system that has multiple ones in the steady state. | 17:45 |
| kanzure | right, also i want to clarify i definitely don't mean "sha256 AND scrypt == 1 hash" | 17:45 |
| nsh | hmm | 17:46 |
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| kanzure | also i'm curious how controversial alternative-pow proposals have been in the past. | 17:48 |
| kanzure | obv. it pisses off miners but... ratios seem less likely to, since they already factor hardware depreciation into their plans anyway? | 17:48 |
| kanzure | *transitory ratios | 17:48 |
| alpalp | Changing the algorithm has pretty big incentives on any investment on the new algorithm since what's to stop you from changing it again? | 17:49 |
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| kanzure | well, probably nothing | 17:50 |
| kanzure | but allocating 1% of blocks to sha256-next mig-- actually you don't need to allocate BTC supply to it, you could allocate some chunk of the transaction fees. | 17:51 |
| gmaxwell | I tried to get litecoin to change their POW to make a best effort attempt to make good on their social contract of <s>GPU</s> <s>FPGA</s> ASIC proofness but they did not decide to do so. | 17:52 |
| nsh | who's you? the miner signs away some of their transaction fees, or some fraction of blocks get mined under a secondary hash by difficulty equivocation? | 17:53 |
| kanzure | well i think this would just be a systemic detail, not something miners would be able to control, although a voluntary mechanism would also be curious | 17:54 |
| nsh | voluntary mechanism seems nontrivial | 17:55 |
| nsh | winning a lottery is easy to do for yourself, hard to do for someone else | 17:55 |
| nsh | well, actually i guess miners could include the lowest hash presented by a connected node | 17:56 |
| nsh | so you can voluntarily objectively reward other participants | 17:56 |
| nsh | but it's still voluntary, which is an issue | 17:57 |
| nsh | a problem with allowing more than one type of hash to mine a block is that each block measures the global hashrate only for a single hash type, so you have a harder block period convergence problem | 17:59 |
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| kanzure | re: relative merit, that was some thought along the lines of "BTC has to be allocated between them in some split" | 18:06 |
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