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| petertodd | anyone know of some up-to-date UTXO age distribution graphs? (or better yet, UTXO priority distribution graphs) | 01:57 |
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| iddo | petertodd: not sure if this could be helpful: https://oxt.me/charts , it has BDD | 02:05 |
| petertodd | iddo: not quite what I need, but thanks all the same!w | 02:18 |
| iddo | yes it's just some old link that i bumped into and bookmarked, i don't have anything better :( | 02:19 |
| petertodd | iddo: bdd unfortunately doesn't work for what I'm trying to figure out, because the metric could be almost entirely a few large, old, txouts being spent, with the vast majority of txouts not being included in themetric | 02:19 |
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| iddo | ok if i understand correctly that site does averaging, and you need data without averaging.. | 02:22 |
| iddo | how difficult is it to parse the blockchain and do it yourself? :) | 02:22 |
| petertodd | iddo: it's not *that* difficult, but I was hoping to avoid doing that work - I'll probably just have my paper say those stats need to be analysed in the "Future Work" section :) | 02:23 |
| petertodd | (I was hoping to have finished this on sunday...) | 02:24 |
| iddo | you can try reversed roles, instead of other people hiring you to do all sorts of tasks, you can hire someone to do tedious work for you:) | 02:25 |
| petertodd | iddo: heh, I'm not even getting properly paid for this! BTCC is the only entity sponsoring my Bitcoin work right now, and this month I'm going to spend a lot more time working on Core than the 15hrs/month they're paying for | 02:28 |
| petertodd | this paper alone has probably been 15-20 hours of work | 02:28 |
| iddo | what's the paper about? if it's not a secret | 02:29 |
| iddo | is it the solution to all of our problems..? :) | 02:29 |
| petertodd | iddo: I'm finally writing up TXO commitments - the solution to all of our problems | 02:29 |
| iddo | ok i googled, looking here http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/mit-bitcoin-expo-2015/peter-todd-scalability/ | 02:31 |
| petertodd | oh cool! I'd forgotten about that | 02:32 |
| smooth | iddo: its very easy to use the restful api in core, i did it last year in few hours to measure somethign similar | 02:33 |
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| iddo | ok.. | 02:34 |
| iddo | petertodd: TXO commitments require consensus on the UTXO set? | 02:35 |
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| petertodd | iddo: yup... but uh... bitcoin requires consensus on the UTXO set in general! :) | 02:35 |
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| iddo | i mean, consensus on a particular representation of UTXO set, which bitcoin doesn't require now.. | 02:36 |
| petertodd | yeah, TXO commitments definitely sets that in stone | 02:37 |
| iddo | would it be a controversial softfork? miners will need to do a little more work to verify that the committed UTXO set is in the right format, but SPV clients benefit a lot? | 02:39 |
| iddo | also, can it be done as a softfork? so old clients won't reject this new stuff? | 02:39 |
| petertodd | yes! so far no-one has come up with a way to make TXO commitments fast enough; my paper is proposing a way to sidestep the problem | 02:39 |
| petertodd | yup, this is 100% a soft-fork | 02:40 |
| iddo | cool | 02:40 |
| iddo | i remember that you once told me that the complex ways to represent UTXO are overkill, simple way is probably better.. | 02:41 |
| petertodd | yeah, though just wait till you see what my paper proposes - I may be a bit of a hypocrit there :) | 02:42 |
| iddo | ok:) | 02:42 |
| iddo | btw here is my new work, nothing really useful like that stuff that you do though... | 02:44 |
| iddo | behold, bitcoin beacon http://arxiv.org/abs/1605.04559 | 02:44 |
| petertodd | oh good - I was hoping someone would write up that idea properly! | 02:45 |
| petertodd | anyway, bbl, better finish this paper off before I get distracted :) | 02:45 |
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| kanzure | "In case the adversary has an infinite budget, we provide an impossibility result that stems from the similarity between the Bitcoin model and Santha-Vazirani sources." | 08:24 |
| kanzure | "bitcoin beacon" http://arxiv.org/abs/1605.04559 | 08:24 |
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| kanzure | about txo commitments: | 08:28 |
| kanzure | https://s3.amazonaws.com/peter.todd/bitcoin-wizards-13-10-17.log | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=314467.0 | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://botbot.me/freenode/bitcoin-core-dev/2015-12-28/?msg=56907496&page=2 | 08:29 |
| kanzure | about utxo commitments: | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/User:Gmaxwell/namecoin_that_sucks_less | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1048021.0 | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1056866.0 | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1129695.0 | 08:29 |
| kanzure | http://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2013-November/003714.html | 08:29 |
| kanzure | https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/pull/3977 | 08:30 |
| kanzure | http://rustyrussell.github.io/pettycoin/2014/11/29/Pettycoin-Revisted-Part-I:-UTXO-Commitments.html | 08:30 |
| kanzure | http://gnusha.org/bitcoin-wizards/2015-09-18.log | 08:30 |
| kanzure | http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/irc/bitcoin/scalingbitcoin-review.pdf | 08:31 |
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| kanzure | "Making UTXO Set Growth Irrelevant With Low-Latency Delayed TXO Commitments" https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2016-May/012715.html | 10:31 |
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| kanzure | petertodd: have you looked at bramc's high-performance merkle set stuff? | 10:36 |
| kanzure | petertodd: https://github.com/bramcohen/MerkleSet | 10:37 |
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| kanzure | about smart contracts and bitcoin https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1427885.msg14601127#msg14601127 | 12:55 |
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| petertodd | kanzure: yeah, I discussed it with bramc at the practical crypo conf a few months ago in stanford | 13:01 |
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| petertodd | kanzure: keep in mind, I mainly wrote that paper because I wanted to dispell the idea that TXO commitments weren't possible; I'd be delighted if a sufficiently high performance implementation was available to avoid the delay trick | 13:02 |
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| fluffypony | http://blog.coinfabrik.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/ECDSA-Security-in-Bitcoin-and-Ethereum-a-Research-Survey.pdf | 15:14 |
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| kanzure | fluffypony: if i hadn't stopped to read it, i would have pasted that a few minutes earlier. drats. | 15:20 |
| fluffypony | does this mean I beat kanzure at typing ? | 15:21 |
| fluffypony | :-P | 15:21 |
| nsh | 'Using the computer algebra system PARI, one easily verifies that #E(F_p) = 1.r with prime r = 2^256 - 2^219 - 1' | 15:27 |
| nsh | if it was that easy, they could have linked to a transcript | 15:27 |
| nsh | here's one for interest: http://people.math.umass.edu/~siman/10.797N/pari-session | 15:30 |
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| c0rw1n | fluffypony: only if you manage to type while sleeping | 15:46 |
| fluffypony | lol | 15:46 |
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| --- Log closed Wed May 18 00:00:17 2016 | ||
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