--- Log opened Mon May 04 00:00:10 2020
00:18 < darosior> Educob2: I you founded the channel from 1 to 2 and only passed 1000msat : you need to fill the reserve before putting capacity to l2
00:18 < Educob2> I am going to start the nodes from scratch. Thanks
01:23 < Educob2> 2nd notofication now works. Thanks
01:44 < Educob2> But the issue remains that when node 1 pays an invoice of 100msats it really spends 1000msats while node 2 acknowledges invoice paid but has our_amount_msat=0msats.
01:44 < Educob2> I think this is a huge issue.
01:47 < darosior> Educob2: Maybe `our_reserve_msat` increased ?
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01:52 < Educob2> In node 1 it has diminished 1000msatosh. In node 2 is still 0msat
01:54 < Educob2> node 1: "our_amount_msat": "1999999000msat",. Node 2: "our_amount_msat": "0msat", eventhough listinvoices says: "amount_received_msat": "102msat", (in previous attempt it said 100msat)
01:54 < Educob2> Either something is wrong in my node configuration or there is critical issues in c-lightning.
01:55 < zmnscpxj_> We sometimes overpay slightly for privacy reasons.  It obscures who the payee and payer is
01:55 < zmnscpxj_> we do not suppress this overpaying in the direct payment case because it prevents the payee from reliably guessing that the payer is a direct one.
01:56 < zmnscpxj_> Did you check `our_amount_msat` before paying?
01:56 < Educob2> Ah. So the extra msats is just "bad" reporting.
01:56 < Educob2> Node 1 before sending was 2000000000msat.
01:56 < zmnscpxj_> hard to choose. the payee got more than the expected amount, which the payee likes
01:56 < zmnscpxj_> hmmm
01:57 < zmnscpxj_> could be a jump in reserves due to the recent issue with locking channels.... maybe?
01:57 < Educob2> Both times node 1 lost 1000msato instead of 100 and node2 receives nothing even though it reports invoice as paid
01:57 < zmnscpxj_> not certain  anymore, ignore me ^^
01:57 < Educob2> locking channels?
01:58 < Educob2> sub satoshi don't work. 
01:58 < zmnscpxj_> Well, yes.  sub-satoshi is rounded down
01:58 < zmnscpxj_> ah
01:58 < zmnscpxj_> subsatoshi amounts
01:58 < zmnscpxj_> yes
01:58 < zmnscpxj_> sub-satoshi is rounded down to nearest satoshi onchain
01:59 < zmnscpxj_> because onchain cannot represent subsatoshi
01:59 < zmnscpxj_> eventually it "adds up" correctly but only if it is completely offchain
01:59 < zmnscpxj_> once you drop onchain, because onchain does not represent satoshi amounts, you get nothing
01:59 < zmnscpxj_> so it is correct
01:59 < zmnscpxj_> so if you keep doing 100x 100msats you will get approximately 10sat onchain
02:00 < zmnscpxj_> or maybe you need to get even more, because of dust limits
02:00 < zmnscpxj_> basically, the idea was that subsatoshi amounts are so small, and onchain fees so large (larger than subsatoshi amounts!!) that you would not be bothered about subsatoshi rouddown
02:01 < zmnscpxj_> the act of closing the channel involves channel fees much larger in effect than the subsatoshi rounddown, which losees at most 1 satoshi
02:01 < zmnscpxj_> whereas the channel close is paying hundreds of satoshi in fees
02:01 < zmnscpxj_> so the less than 1% loss is considered negligible
02:01 < zmnscpxj_> does that explain the behavior?
02:03 < zmnscpxj_> You *can* pay subsatoshi amounts, but you will only really feel it if there are large numbers of them, so it is more for large amounts of micropayments
02:03 < Educob2> Yes. but what about lighting network for micropayments like paying every minute of watching a movie. Would that work with what you describe?
02:03 < zmnscpxj_> If a movie is a hundred minutes or so? Then the total is no longer subsatoshi, right?
02:03 < zmnscpxj_> ultimately it is the total that you can actually commit onchain
02:04 < zmnscpxj_> someone can get a few minutes of movie "for free", true, but only by closing the channel, which incurs fees to them that are much larger than the cost of the few minutes of movie
02:04 < zmnscpxj_> so yes, they can steal from you by spiting their own noses
02:05 < zmnscpxj_> that is the reason why we did not remove subsatoshi amounts in Adelaide 2018 meetup
02:05 < Educob2> So you are saying that eventhough the node 2 didn't receive the 1st 100msats, eventually it will receive the right amount after many times receiving subsats????
02:05 < zmnscpxj_> yes
02:05 < Educob2> Wow!!!! Thanks!!!!
02:06 < zmnscpxj_> I mean, that is what micropayments are
02:06 < zmnscpxj_> right?
02:06 < zmnscpxj_> np
02:06 < Educob2> Yes. that what it should be.
02:06 < Educob2> I am going to run a test sending 100msats many times.
02:06 < Educob2> You have been most helpful. Thanks a lot
02:08 < Educob2> Anyway it feels weird that node 2 doesn't say it received 100msats (or 102msats). I will test the repeated sending.
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02:13 < zmnscpxj__> glad I cleared that up
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02:58 < darosior> Educob2: Yes it is you did open an issue, right ?
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04:42 < Educob2> Yes. I opened an issue. 
04:42 < Educob2> I will make the test and close it.
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10:08 < Educob2> Hi darosior. You were right. I sent like 40 times 100msats and now I have 4000msats. Everything clear now. Thanks.
10:25 < sr_gi> Hey guys, I've seen that the node_factory fixture for pyln-testing has the scope set to function. Is there any way to reuse the nodes created through the factory so I can split the tests?
10:25 < sr_gi> I can work around it with global variables and such, but I was wondering if there was a cleaner way
10:46 < darosior> Educob2: cool :-)
10:47 < darosior> sr_gi: it's a pytest fixture which I think is only passed to test_xxxxx() functions, but maybe cdecker has an idea ?
10:48 < darosior> > I can work around it with global variables and such, but I was wondering if there was a cleaner way  => Yeah or a biigg function ^^
10:48 < darosior> Is the node_fctory setup **that** long for you ?
11:03 < sr_gi> Without dev flags takes ~1-1.5 min to init the tests, but it's mainly to avoid setting up the tower every time
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14:35 < darosior> sr_gi: Then you probably want to add a new pytest fixture, it's pretty straightforward
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--- Log closed Tue May 05 00:00:11 2020