--- Log opened Sun Mar 07 00:00:49 2021
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03:06 <@cdecker> The backup contains a full snapshot of the active DB (~/.lightning/bitcoin/lightningd.sqlite3) so if that's ~83MB in size we can't get smaller than that even by compacting. I'm not a fan of pruning data from the backup since we'd have to reconstruct that data on restore, slowing it down considerably, and worse it adds the potential for introducing
03:06 <@cdecker> errors which can be catastrophic
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03:13 < jasan> I see. Thank you for explanation cdecker !
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03:30 < jasan> Just please see also my point of view: maybe I am comparing uncomparable, but from the user perspective all one needs for on-chain backup is 12-24 words mnemonic which can be written on paper. On the other hand it seems to me that the lightning node needs much more data to restore. Of course a real comparison (without SPV) would include the whole chainstate with at least minimal pruned blocks
03:30 < jasan> (now ~4.7GiB) whereas the C-Lightning node's backup file can get "16Gb big" as HelloShitty reported. Just thinking aloud and wondering if it would be possible to design something which would do off-chain transactions similar to Lightning but will have much lower space requirements in long-term. Please suggest any reading for me. (Think I am a random first-time channel visitor for a moment.)
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04:37 < HelloShitty> jasan: I was unaware of your reply here
04:37 < HelloShitty> somehow my irssi in not notfying me when I'm tagged
04:38 < HelloShitty> The other day I did what cdecker told me. I just removed the old plugin dir, and cloned the most recent one from darosior repository. But when I start lightnind, I get quite a few errors sometimes
04:39 < HelloShitty> So, I deleted all plugins I wasn't using from the plugins dir and left only the 'summary', 'backup' and I think one more plugin, iirc
04:40 < HelloShitty> still, when I start lightningd, I get errors for the few first attempts. After a few attempts the deamon starts and all goes fine, I think
04:40 < HelloShitty> but I don't know why I get errors in the first few attempts trying to start the lightning daemon
04:41 < HelloShitty> Anyway, about the backup, I'm going to check how big is my lightning.sqlight3 file
04:41 < HelloShitty> s/sqlight3/sqlite3
04:42 < HelloShitty> ouch... My ~/.lightning/bitcoin/lightnind.sqlite3 is 80MB
04:43 < HelloShitty> but my c-lightningd.sqlite3 backup file is now 17GB
04:44 < HelloShitty> I have now only 6 channels open and for some reason I haven't been bale to forward any payments for quite some time now. Probably almost a month now. :(
04:50 < jasan> HelloShitty: Ah, that is interesting that the backup file takes so much even though the db file is just 80MB big.
05:20 < jasan> /topic Next meeting here @8PM UTC Monday Mar 8
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08:54 < HelloShitty> The worst is the errors I get when starting lightnind. And then, I terminate the daemon and start it again and after a few attempts like these, the daemon eventually starts with no problems
09:02 < jasan> HelloShitty: Interesting. Please paste the log to bin.idrix.fr
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09:16 < HelloShitty> The 17Gb file?
09:17 < HelloShitty> or the debug.log?
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09:18 < HelloShitty> my debug.log file is 250Mb
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09:35 < jasan> HelloShitty: Yes. That log contains everything. What about just tail(1)-ing it?
09:35 < jasan> Maybe a bit more than a default tail so that I can see the errors…
09:40 < HelloShitty> jasan: errors about th plugins?
09:44 < HelloShitty> My debug file contains all the gossip the daemon spits out
09:44 < HelloShitty> so, every channel update, every channel state change, etc, is in there
09:58 < HelloShitty> jasan: I was digging in the debug.log file and I found some of the error messages regarding the plugins when I start lightnind
09:59 < HelloShitty> but when I see them in the console, they seem nastier that this:
09:59 < HelloShitty> 2021-03-06T08:59:24.816Z INFO    plugin-backup.py: Killing plugin: Could not register method "backup-compact", a method with that name is already registered
09:59 < HelloShitty> I'm trying to isolate the part of the debug file that might be of interest and will update the chunk of it where I can see errors related to plugins
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10:45 < HelloShitty> jasan: I'll send the link to your pvt
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10:56 < spinza> hi, i reactivated an old ligthning node and all funds have been returned to me bar one channel.  funds look like they are still in channel, but not sure how to get at them.  node's channels are all 0.
10:57 < spinza> i mean node channel counts on getinfo
11:00 < spinza> i opened a copy of the sqlite db and it lists the output as relating to a channel and the channel is also listed in the db.
11:00 < jasan> hmm, interesting, what evidence there is regarding the fact that there is one channel still open (not-returned), spinza ?
11:01 < spinza> well all the other channels had a tx out, then anoter tx and then a final tx returning to the lightningd wallet
11:01 < spinza> this one only has the first 2
11:02 < spinza> under listfunds the funds are listed as unconfirmed despite multiple rescan
11:03 < spinza> i don't think the address in question is part of the lightningd wallet
11:03 < jasan> and the channel is not visible when "lightning-cli listchannels" is run?
11:04 < jasan> what about "lightning-cli close CHANNELID 3" which gives three seconds to cooperatively close it, but then will immediately do non-cooperative close?
11:04 < spinza> listchannels shows many many channels
11:05 < spinza> i'll try close
11:05 < jasan> spinza: so try to find this one, given some known value from listfunds as you say
11:06 < spinza> channel is from 2019 to give you some idea
11:08 < spinza> i found the short channel id and lightning-cli listchannels | grep [shortid] gives me nothing
11:10 < jasan> ah, yes listchannels gives channels in all network
11:10 < jasan> sorry
11:10 < jasan> lightning-listchannels  - Command to query active lightning channels in
11:11 < jasan>        the entire network
11:11 < jasan> so that command is not helpful here I guess
11:11 < jasan> try "lightning-cli listchannels [shortid]
11:12 < jasan> SYNOPSIS
11:12 < jasan>        listchannels [short_channel_id] [source]
11:12 < achow101> what is failcode 4103?
11:13 < jasan> $ git grep -w 4103
11:13 < jasan> gossipd/gossip_store_wire.csv:msgtype,gossip_store_delete_chan,4103
11:13 < jasan> gossipd/gossip_store_wiregen.h:        WIRE_GOSSIP_STORE_DELETE_CHAN = 4103,
11:13 < spinza> lightning-cli listchannels [shortid] > gives me empty jason
11:13 < spinza> or even json
11:13 < jasan> spinza: hmm
11:14 < spinza> maybe jasan lol
11:14 < spinza> should i try this?  "lightning-cli close CHANNELID 3"
11:14 < jasan> sure
11:15 < jasan> that's how I cleansed my old channels on testnet/signet
11:15 < jasan> sure one can do it on mainnet
11:15 < spinza> would the id be the same as the id in the channel table in the db?
11:16 < jasan> Yes.
11:16 < jasan> The short one preferably.
11:16 < jasan> But long id works as well.
11:17 < spinza> Json with message: Short channel ID not found
11:17 < jasan> try the long one maybe
11:19 < spinza> don't have it, or how do i extract from sqlite?
11:19 < spinza> seems to be encoded in sqlite
11:19 < jasan> no idea from sqlite
11:20 < jasan> years ago I did something similar and cdecker knew how to decode it from sqlite
11:22 < jasan> But generally i think that if your node does not know about the channel, it should not be alive. And if it knows about it it should be listed in 'listpeers'
11:23 < spinza> node it's been offline for some time 
11:23 < spinza> channel is listed in db but now peer linked to it in db
11:23 < spinza> *no peer
11:25 < spinza> listed as state 10
11:26 < spinza> the output is also listed in the output table
11:27 < jasan> spinza: hmm, doc/HACKING.md
11:27  * jasan never did too much of that sqlite hacking
11:27  * jasan has to go to bed now
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11:29 < spinza> tx jasan that shows how to decode sqlite fields at least
12:02 < spinza> I found the peer and it's still online!
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13:07 < spinza> ok, here is what I will try.  first wait for node to sync up.  then move all available funds off the node
13:08 < spinza> then going to add a db record for the peer and then enable open the channel in the db while it's off
13:08 < spinza> then startup and close the channel...
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--- Log closed Mon Mar 08 00:00:51 2021