--- Log opened Wed Mar 18 00:00:25 2020 03:02 -!- kanzure_ [~kanzure@unaffiliated/kanzure] has joined ##ctv-bip-review 03:04 -!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: kanzure 04:53 < bsm117532> I don't object to key re-use for miners -- here it's technically necessary. 04:54 < bsm117532> Isn't channel rebalancing interactive though? How do the miners find each other, and how do you know the channels have been updated? 04:54 < bsm117532> Is knowledge that the channels have been appropriately updated necessary to write a new coinbase? 06:12 -!- kanzure_ is now known as kanzure 06:44 -!- kanzure [~kanzure@unaffiliated/kanzure] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 06:46 -!- kanzure [~kanzure@unaffiliated/kanzure] has joined ##ctv-bip-review 12:12 < jeremyrubin> The protocol for creating coinbases is firewalled from the channel update state 12:12 < jeremyrubin> channel update state is opportunistic 12:13 < jeremyrubin> These are just regular lightning channels 12:13 < jeremyrubin> So this is general software a lightning user would want 12:14 < jeremyrubin> E.g., if I have N channels of different states and I want to redeem X Bitcoin, what's the most efficient way to do that 13:46 < bsm117532> This is your "non-interactive channels" idea? 13:56 < bsm117532> I really don't understand this. Trolling through all your use cases on utxos.org, I still don't understand it... 13:56 < bsm117532> I don't think any of the pages there provide a clear-enough description of how these channel states work... 13:56 < bsm117532> Can you elaborate? 13:59 < bsm117532> In none of your examples do you display actual scripts. Maybe it's obvious to you, but I think your use cases on utxos.org would strongly benefit from writing down the actual scripts involved, and a bit more elaboration... 17:14 < jeremyrubin> OK 17:14 < jeremyrubin> Yeah it's that 17:14 < jeremyrubin> Most people I've chatted with have gotten the gist, but that's good feedback that's it's still too abstract for you 17:14 < jeremyrubin> The scripts are in the diagrams for the most part btw 17:15 < jeremyrubin> But if you need actual bitcoin scripts to understand it & transactions can put it together 17:24 < jeremyrubin> to be clear most other BIPs people don't have the bar of having working code for every possible use case, just a strong enough guideline to get the gist. E.g., probabaility weighted huffman coded trees for taproot have not been implemented, but are easy to see they can work 17:44 < bsm117532> Yeah I hear ya. Frankly all your "use cases" are, I think, not strictly necessary to motivate CTV and confuse the audience. 17:44 < bsm117532> "What is this for?" I hear from the back of the room. (laundry list follows) 17:45 < bsm117532> That said, I do want to help you put the best case forward, because I want it for vaults. But what I hear is a lot of "not-vaults" and I'm not sure the rest is the best motiviation. ;-) --- Log closed Thu Mar 19 00:00:28 2020