--- Day changed Thu May 25 2017 00:03 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 00:19 -!- jtimon [~quassel@117.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 00:35 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:47 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 00:50 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tmxiuzjmrhfvvvzx] has joined #lightning-dev 01:17 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 01:44 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 02:06 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has joined #lightning-dev 02:38 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #lightning-dev 03:07 -!- jtimon [~quassel@117.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lightning-dev 03:22 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:26 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:32 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 06:37 -!- jannes [~jannes@095-097-246-234.static.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:43 -!- jannes [~jannes@095-097-246-234.static.chello.nl] has joined #lightning-dev 07:01 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 07:23 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has joined #lightning-dev 07:30 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has quit [Quit: laurentmt] 07:48 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:19 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 08:45 -!- abpa [~abpa@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lightning-dev 08:45 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has joined #lightning-dev 08:59 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 09:48 -!- dstadulis [~dstadulis@184-23-190-30.vpn.dynamic.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 09:51 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has joined #lightning-dev 09:51 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@176.158.157.202] has quit [Client Quit] 10:01 -!- juscamarena [~justin@47.148.176.74] has joined #lightning-dev 10:02 -!- juscamarena is now known as Guest72157 10:02 -!- juscamarena_ [~justin@47.148.176.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 10:05 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #lightning-dev 10:05 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 10:29 -!- deusexbeer [~deusexbee@093-092-179-139-dynamic-pool-adsl.wbt.ru] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 10:42 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 11:00 -!- starkness [~starkness@cpe-66-108-98-69.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #lightning-dev 11:22 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tmxiuzjmrhfvvvzx] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 11:59 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:19 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 13:06 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 13:33 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:43 -!- dstadulis [~dstadulis@198-27-188-46.static.sonic.net] has joined #lightning-dev 14:38 -!- deusexbeer [~deusexbee@093-092-179-139-dynamic-pool-adsl.wbt.ru] has joined #lightning-dev 14:44 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 15:18 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 15:41 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #lightning-dev 15:56 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mgqffioejdiubxzi] has joined #lightning-dev 16:13 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 16:38 -!- jannes [~jannes@095-097-246-234.static.chello.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:40 < dstadulis> in this lecture (at this time stamp https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lgYYz3y_hY&t=336 ), tdryja mentions that channel exhaustion, in adversarial conditions, is a risk to the counterparty to the exhausting party 16:41 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:44 < dstadulis> Is that because the exhausting party has not yet revoked the exhausting payment (by divulging their commitment revocation key)? i.e. the best the receiving party could do is broadcast Commitment_transaction(-1) and they risk losing the amount of funds between the last, exhausting commitment and the second from the exhausting commitment? 16:45 < dstadulis> or is channel exhaustion a risk for another reason 16:58 -!- abpa [~abpa@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 17:43 -!- deusexbeer [~deusexbee@093-092-179-139-dynamic-pool-adsl.wbt.ru] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 18:20 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #lightning-dev 18:42 -!- Ylbam [uid99779@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mgqffioejdiubxzi] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 19:34 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 19:41 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:46 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 19:48 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 19:48 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 20:09 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20:20 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has joined #lightning-dev 20:21 -!- jtimon [~quassel@117.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20:42 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 21:10 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has joined #lightning-dev 21:29 < dstadulis> Thinking about it/discussing it more, If Alice exhausts a channel to bob, but broadcasts an outdated commitment transactions (to her favor) it's only a risk to bob if A.) the marginal transaction fee cost to submitting his penalty transaction is higher than relative to the transaction fee cost when a cooperative close would have happened B.) Bob for some reason is unable to submit his penalty transaction (off line, lost 21:29 < dstadulis> penalty transaction) 21:30 -!- RubenSomsen [~RubenSoms@1.217.138.142] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 21:33 < dstadulis> A.) it seems to be relative risk / a cost benefit issue: Does the marginal value gained from the exhaustion commitment outweigh the transaction fee of broadcasting the penalty transaction B.) seems to be a castostrophic issue that is independent of exhaustion or not (if you're not online you can broadcast the initial commitment) 21:35 < dstadulis> The solutions seems to be: the commitment before exhaustion should have enough margin to pay for fees to submit the penalty transaction, so the exhausting party can't free-ride by broadcasting an outdated commitment 21:56 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #lightning-dev 22:02 -lightningrfc:#lightning-dev- [lightning-rfc] rustyrussell pushed 1 new commit to master: https://git.io/vHG8P 22:02 -lightningrfc:#lightning-dev- lightning-rfc/master 13326cc ZmnSCPxj: Enable travis to spellcheck BOLT#10 to 99. 22:06 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 22:18 -!- Guest72157 is now known as juscamarena_ 22:25 -!- ThomasV [~ThomasV@unaffiliated/thomasv] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 22:52 -!- starkness [~starkness@cpe-66-108-98-69.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: starkness] 23:29 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:31 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 23:51 -!- BashCo [~BashCo@unaffiliated/bashco] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]