--- Day changed Fri Jan 26 2018 00:08 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:10 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@p98110-ipngnfx01marunouchi.tokyo.ocn.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:20 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has joined #lightning-dev 00:28 -!- lxer [~lx@ip5f5bf6f0.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #lightning-dev 00:31 -!- quantomworks [ac491d06@gateway/web/freenode/ip.172.73.29.6] has joined #lightning-dev 00:32 < quantomworks> How do I set my lightning node's name on sites like https://lnmainnet.gaben.win/ ? 01:00 < lndbot> you must specify your node alias 01:00 < lndbot> how depends on which node implementation you are running 01:16 -!- sandeep [~d1g1t@pdpc/supporter/active/d1g1t] has joined #lightning-dev 01:19 -!- jtimon [~quassel@41.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lightning-dev 01:20 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 01:21 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [Client Quit] 01:23 < quantomworks> lndbot: Using this guide https://medium.com/@dougvk/run-your-own-mainnet-lightning-node-2d2eab628a8b that references this git https://github.com/dougvk/lightning-node 01:23 < quantomworks> Any idea? 01:23 < quantomworks> I dont see anything like that in a help command 01:24 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 01:30 -!- vicenteH [~user@195.235.96.150] has joined #lightning-dev 01:32 < quantomworks> gah in some log I saw it downloading repos but I cant find it... 02:13 -!- wumpus [~quassel@pdpc/supporter/professional/wumpus] has joined #lightning-dev 02:15 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@ppp-94-64-157-186.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lightning-dev 02:15 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@ppp-94-64-157-186.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Changing host] 02:15 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@unaffiliated/cogito-ergo-sum/x-7399460] has joined #lightning-dev 02:22 -!- eck [~eck@fsf/member/eck] has quit [Quit: we out here] 02:22 -!- eck [~eck@fsf/member/eck] has joined #lightning-dev 02:23 -!- jtimon [~quassel@41.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:00 -!- eck [~eck@fsf/member/eck] has quit [Quit: we out here] 03:02 -!- eck [~eck@fsf/member/eck] has joined #lightning-dev 03:06 -!- nirved [~nirved@2a02:8071:b58a:3c00:f4f2:ba98:2efd:8dc5] has joined #lightning-dev 03:09 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@unaffiliated/cogito-ergo-sum/x-7399460] has quit [] 03:16 -!- dimsumcode [~dimsumcod@pool-96-241-129-137.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 03:16 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 03:18 -!- dimsumcode [~dimsumcod@pool-96-241-129-137.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lightning-dev 03:45 -!- Emcy_ [~Emcy@unaffiliated/emcy] has joined #lightning-dev 03:45 -!- Emcy [~Emcy@unaffiliated/emcy] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 03:55 -!- Deelight [~Deelight@75.68.86.79.rev.sfr.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 04:04 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [] 04:13 -!- riclas [~riclas@148.63.37.111] has joined #lightning-dev 04:22 -!- kunla [~kunla@bl13-61-148.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #lightning-dev 04:29 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 04:30 -!- sstone [~sstone@3.46-14-84.ripe.coltfrance.com] has joined #lightning-dev 04:30 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [Client Quit] 04:32 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 04:38 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:39 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 04:46 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 04:48 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has joined #lightning-dev 04:49 -!- Amperture [~amp@24.136.5.183] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:49 -!- Amperture [~amp@24.136.5.183] has joined #lightning-dev 04:56 -!- Pavle [~pavle_@unaffiliated/pavle/x-4679000] has joined #lightning-dev 05:02 -!- Pavle [~pavle_@unaffiliated/pavle/x-4679000] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 05:07 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 05:13 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 05:14 -!- riclas [~riclas@148.63.37.111] has quit [] 05:30 -!- vitaminc [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 05:31 -!- vitaminc_ [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 05:44 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@77.119.130.148.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 05:44 -!- jtimon [~quassel@41.31.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lightning-dev 06:14 -!- meshcollider [uid246294@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mqidncykihhitkxp] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 06:18 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@77.119.130.148.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 06:22 -!- belcher_ [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has joined #lightning-dev 06:24 -!- ghost43 [~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:24 -!- simlay [~simlay@gateway/tor-sasl/simlay] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 06:24 -!- ghost43 [~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer] has joined #lightning-dev 06:25 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has joined #lightning-dev 06:25 -!- simlay [~simlay@gateway/tor-sasl/simlay] has joined #lightning-dev 06:35 -!- sandeep [~d1g1t@pdpc/supporter/active/d1g1t] has quit [Quit: sandeep] 06:36 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@77.119.130.148.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 06:42 -!- finkan [~finkan@194-103-214-178.kund.ipswe.com] has joined #lightning-dev 06:45 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@77.119.130.148.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:53 -!- chrismezzz [c434025d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.196.52.2.93] has joined #lightning-dev 06:56 < chrismezzz> Hey all, I'm a noob trying to follow this guide: https://medium.com/@dougvk/run-your-own-mainnet-lightning-node-2d2eab628a8b I've got the docker instance set up and am connected via SSH w/ putty. I've got the bitcoin core node synced, but i have no idea what to do with the "lightning cli" setup step 06:58 < chrismezzz> With code like "#!/usr/bin/env bash docker run --rm --network container:bitcoind_mainnet -v /scratch/bitcoin/mainnet/bitcoind:/data dougvk/bitcoind:latest bitcoin-cli "$@"" Am i supposed to replace the #! part with my directory? Does a single # denote a comment? 07:14 < lxer> chrismezzz: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebang_(Unix) 07:15 < lxer> it is sometimes at the top of a script. not when you run a command directly 07:20 -!- Pavle [~pavle_@unaffiliated/pavle/x-4679000] has joined #lightning-dev 07:21 < chrismezzz> thanks lxer 07:22 -!- sangoma [69e93108@gateway/web/freenode/ip.105.233.49.8] has joined #lightning-dev 07:23 -!- jb55 [~jb55@70-36-49-138.dyn.novuscom.net] has joined #lightning-dev 07:23 -!- sstone [~sstone@3.46-14-84.ripe.coltfrance.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:23 -!- wraithm [~wraithm@unaffiliated/wraithm] has joined #lightning-dev 07:34 -!- lxer [~lx@ip5f5bf6f0.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 07:35 -!- Pavle [~pavle_@unaffiliated/pavle/x-4679000] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:40 -!- Neo_ [b93b26de@gateway/web/freenode/ip.185.59.38.222] has joined #lightning-dev 07:41 < Neo_> 101 07:52 -!- lxer [~lx@x4db4da9d.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 07:54 -!- Neo_ [b93b26de@gateway/web/freenode/ip.185.59.38.222] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 07:56 -!- Murch [~murch@c-73-223-113-121.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lightning-dev 08:02 -!- tumi [tumi@u.nix.is] has joined #lightning-dev 08:09 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:09 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 08:11 -!- chrismezzz [c434025d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.196.52.2.93] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 08:12 -!- alexann [~Alex@77.29.198.107] has joined #lightning-dev 08:15 -!- Alex_ [~Alex@46.217.110.88] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 08:20 -!- justus [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:25 -!- jb55 [~jb55@70-36-49-138.dyn.novuscom.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 08:25 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:26 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has joined #lightning-dev 08:29 -!- lxer [~lx@x4db4da9d.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 08:32 -!- ralphthe1inja [~lms@c-6469e555.03-130-6e6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lightning-dev 08:32 -!- ralphthe1inja is now known as ralphtheninja2 08:35 -!- sangoma is now known as Ingoma 08:35 -!- lxer [~lx@x4db4da9d.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 08:37 -!- kexkey [~kexkey@173.209.61.61] has joined #lightning-dev 08:40 -!- justus_ [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 08:48 < tuxcanfly> jimpo: should BIP 158 be updated to mention the special case for OP_0? 08:48 -!- justus_ [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 08:48 -!- justus_ [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 08:52 -!- justus_ [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:52 -!- justus_ [~justus@x55b437c9.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #lightning-dev 08:58 -!- jb55 [~jb55@d108-172-210-7.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #lightning-dev 09:05 -!- grafcaps [325a53e5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.50.90.83.229] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:08 -!- Ytxyyuu [~Ytxyyuu@78-71-46-150-no260.tbcn.telia.com] has joined #lightning-dev 09:10 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [] 09:13 -!- quantomworks [ac491d06@gateway/web/freenode/ip.172.73.29.6] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 09:14 -!- freerkk [577b0232@gateway/web/freenode/ip.87.123.2.50] has joined #lightning-dev 09:14 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:18 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 09:20 < tuxcanfly> actually nevermind that's correct... but this comment in btcd is misleading - "builder.go:192 // Ignore errors and add pushed data, if any" 09:21 -!- Murch [~murch@c-73-223-113-121.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Snoozing.] 09:24 < tuxcanfly> as per the BIP if there's any err, push data should _not_ be added 09:25 -!- mughat [~textual@x1-6-28-c6-8e-30-bf-4a.cpe.webspeed.dk] has quit [Quit: My iMac has gone to sleep. 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E.g. today I got WIRE_PERMANENT_NODE_FAILURE on mainnet y'alls 10:48 < lndbot> Is that lnd specific? I heard from someone that clightning doesn’t have that requirement 10:49 -!- vicenteH [~user@195.235.96.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 10:52 < spudowiar> @alexbosworth I believe c-lightning also has that requirement but will aim to remove it soon 10:52 < spudowiar> Where soon == indefinite amount of time ;) 10:56 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 11:01 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 11:01 -!- lxer [~lx@x4db4da9d.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:09 -!- marcoagner [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/marcoagner] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:10 -!- marcoagner [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/marcoagner] has joined #lightning-dev 11:10 -!- wraithm [~wraithm@unaffiliated/wraithm] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 11:20 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [] 11:24 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 11:27 -!- lxer [~lx@ip5f5bf6b5.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has joined #lightning-dev 11:30 -!- vitaminc_ [~vitaminc@pool-71-114-78-15.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lightning-dev 11:30 -!- vitaminc1 [~vitaminc@pool-71-114-78-15.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined #lightning-dev 11:33 -!- jb55 [~jb55@2605:8d80:4c3:20f:a2af:bdff:fef0:c102] has joined #lightning-dev 11:34 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [] 11:35 -!- vitaminc2 [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has joined #lightning-dev 11:35 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 11:35 -!- vitaminc3 [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has joined #lightning-dev 11:37 -!- vitaminc1 [~vitaminc@pool-71-114-78-15.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:38 -!- vitaminc_ [~vitaminc@pool-71-114-78-15.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:40 -!- vitaminc3 [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has quit [Client Quit] 11:40 -!- vitaminc2 [~vitaminc@192.5.151.254] has quit [Quit: leaving] 11:49 < mlz> if you run Eclair desktop app with bitcoin core, only one tx straight from bitcoin wallet to opening a channel, and ofc only on testnet for now 11:49 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has quit [] 11:49 -!- anome [~anome@unaffiliated/anome] has joined #lightning-dev 12:01 -!- meshcollider [uid246294@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mnwigqwpsdphtdgd] has joined #lightning-dev 12:02 -!- marcoagner [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/marcoagner] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:10 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 12:10 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 12:11 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 12:11 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 12:11 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 12:11 -!- 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[~kunla@bl13-61-148.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] 14:51 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 14:53 -!- spudowiar [~spudowiar@unaffiliated/saleemrashid] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.0.1] 14:54 -!- grafcaps [6889c2ff@gateway/web/freenode/ip.104.137.194.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 15:01 -!- ralphthe1inja [~lms@c-6469e555.03-130-6e6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #lightning-dev 15:01 -!- ralphthe1inja is now known as ralphtheninja2 15:07 -!- Murch [~murch@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Snoozing.] 15:08 -!- Murch [~murch@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lightning-dev 15:09 -!- bajohns [bajohns@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/bajohns] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 15:29 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@KD182251140216.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 15:29 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@KD182251140216.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:32 -!- e4xit [~e4xit@cpc92716-cmbg20-2-0-cust45.5-4.cable.virginm.net] has joined #lightning-dev 15:38 < e4xit> how do i unlock funds in channels which are "ONCHAIND_THEIR_UNILATERAL" and "ONCHAIND_MUTUAL" in c-lightning 15:39 < lndbot> e4xit, how many confs does your commitment txn have? 15:39 < e4xit> ooooh good question 15:40 < e4xit> how do i check. I did it about 5 days ago so should have a decent number (you mean channel fund tx right?) 15:40 < lndbot> I think the timelock is somewhere between 100-144 blocks. once that expires your funds should be available again 15:41 < e4xit> oh ok. is that as the channel did not accept my open request so my funds are locked until then> 15:41 < lndbot> no, funding is for opening a channel 15:41 < lndbot> for unilateral, one of the parties broadcasts a commitment txn 15:42 < lndbot> for mutual, it is a signed txn spending from the funding txn 15:43 < e4xit> ok well this was a node I tried to fund (a channel with) instead of going to NORMAL (like my other channel did) this one went straight to OUR_UNILATERAL 15:45 < e4xit> lndbot when you say commitment tx do you mean commiting btc to lightning network? 15:45 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 15:45 < lndbot> here is the file where those constants are defined https://github.com/ElementsProject/lightning/blob/master/onchaind/onchain_types.h 15:46 -!- daouzo235 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 15:47 < e4xit> ah thanks, I had only found peer_state.h which didn't make it too clear 15:48 < e4xit> I take it ONCHAIND_MUTUAL == MUTUAL_CLOSE in onchain_types.h 15:49 -!- bajohns [bajohns@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/bajohns] has joined #lightning-dev 15:49 < lndbot> the commitment txn is one that keeps the state of the balances in the channel. if you’re familiar with the bar tab analogy, it is the the tab. either party can broadcast the commitment txn unilaterally, without the other peer being online 15:49 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 15:50 -!- marcoagner [~user@gateway/tor-sasl/marcoagner] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:52 < e4xit> lndbot sorry I still don't quite get which part you are referring to there :( I tried to open a channel 4 or 5 days ago with a peer and new getpeers shows 4 entries for that one node: 1 x ONCHAIND_OUR_UNILATERAL and 3 x OPENINGD. It's been stuck there for all that time since 15:53 < e4xit> 'close' doesn't work on it 15:54 < lndbot> sorry e4xit, probably not the best person to ask for how/why it got there, just trying to explain what state it seems to be in 15:54 < e4xit> lndbot np thank for your help. so do I understand right that it's stuck in the funding channel stage with that node? 15:59 < lndbot> the states seem to indicate its stuck closing 16:01 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #lightning-dev 16:01 < e4xit> lndbot oh ok. I can still see the 3 failed txs in listpayments. Can I force close using the tx hashes anyhow? I can't see a command that might let me do that 16:02 -!- wraithm [~wraithm@unaffiliated/wraithm] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 16:06 -!- Murch [~murch@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Snoozing.] 16:09 -!- nirved [~nirved@2a02:8071:b58a:3c00:f4f2:ba98:2efd:8dc5] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:11 < BlueMatt> oh, something for 1.1, instead of making short_channel_id link individual on-chain transactions with a persistent node id, we should bulletproof it 16:11 < BlueMatt> roasbeef: I figure you'd love to ^ :p 16:14 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:14 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:14 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:14 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:15 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:15 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:15 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:15 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:15 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:16 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:16 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:16 <+roasbeef> BlueMatt: oooOOOOOooo 16:16 <+roasbeef> well atm it just "points" to an on-chain transaction for validation/DoS-prevention reasons 16:16 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has joined #lightning-dev 16:16 -!- kiltzman [~k1ltzman@95.215.47.208] has quit [Max SendQ exceeded] 16:17 <+roasbeef> hmm, based of commitments, there may be something tehre 16:17 <+roasbeef> especially if we can just aggregate batches of proofs 16:20 < BlueMatt> roasbeef: yes, but you can bulletproof to fix the DoS issues just fine 16:20 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has joined #lightning-dev 16:21 < BlueMatt> roasbeef: my understanding is even single-bulletproof for it would be on the order of 100-200ms to validate an output exists in a hash-tree-of-the-utxo-set 16:23 < BlueMatt> so even the aggregation may not be neccessary 16:23 <+roasbeef> but could still come into play, if say i'm giving you all the info and you have nada 16:24 <+roasbeef> ahhh, I see where you're going with this, would also address some of the privacy issues with the topology being fully opne 16:24 < BlueMatt> sure, yea, but you can ban a peer that relays you something that doesnt validate, so...they can only burn 100ms * number of ips they have 16:24 <+roasbeef> but then with taht, also proofs of closings? 16:25 <+roasbeef> so like a merkalized type txid that allows easy proofs of showing an output has been spent 16:25 <+roasbeef> mhmm 16:25 < BlueMatt> who cares? it resolves the dos issues of opening, the watch-other-peoples'-channels-for-closing doesnt matter that much 16:26 <+roasbeef> so then you don't care about pruning down when the chans are just not there, or inactive, etc 16:27 < BlueMatt> yea, i mean thats up to the peer that announced it 16:27 < BlueMatt> you shouldnt auto-prune 16:27 < BlueMatt> especially since you should accept channels between established peers that have no valid short_channel_id 16:27 < BlueMatt> or a non-bitcoin short_channel_id 16:28 < BlueMatt> ideally you should accept a node_id into your routing table for any node that can show one channel to an existing node with a bulletproof of it being on-chain, and then from there accept up to n channels per (peer_a, peer_b) pair 16:28 < BlueMatt> irrespective of if they're on bitcoin or not 16:28 < BlueMatt> also ideally mobile clients/web clients/whatever and such dont ever announce their presence on the routing table 16:29 < BlueMatt> and just fill in the routing hints in payment info for last-hop 16:29 < BlueMatt> that should be sufficient for routing tables to be light enough to work well up to many, many nodes, and after that you'll need smarter routing table pruning anyway 16:29 <+roasbeef> yep, mobile/laptop doesn't need to advertise at all, ours only does atm, as we haven't yet implemented using routing hints when sending, or adding them when generating payerwqs 16:30 < BlueMatt> ha! my router does :p 16:30 <+roasbeef> it was added late in the spec :p 16:30 <+roasbeef> (hints or even adding the private bool) 16:31 < BlueMatt> but, yea, doesnt need to be there until there are mobile clients, really.... 16:32 < BlueMatt> the 1.1 spec should have some SHOULDs for route-holding, imo 16:32 < BlueMatt> eg the "nodes SHOULD accept a node_id into your routing table for any node that can show one channel to an existing node with a bulletproof of it being on-chain, and then from there accept up to n channels per (peer_a, peer_b) pair" 16:33 <+roasbeef> well would need commitments first... 16:34 < BlueMatt> commitments to what? 16:34 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has joined #lightning-dev 16:34 -!- wraithm [~wraithm@unaffiliated/wraithm] has joined #lightning-dev 16:35 <+roasbeef> dem utxos 16:35 < BlueMatt> nono, you'd want to use your own utxo merkle tree cause you'd want to use a hash function which is designed to be fast in a bulletproof 16:35 < BlueMatt> so it probably wouldnt be committed 16:35 <+roasbeef> which isn't committed at all? 16:36 < BlueMatt> why does it need to be? you just need to be able to get it 16:36 <+roasbeef> how does anyone verify the authenticity of it then? 16:36 < BlueMatt> i mean you could get any full node to generate it? 16:36 <+roasbeef> sure, and just trust that they did it correctly? 16:36 < BlueMatt> a mobile client could just ask 4 static .onion endpoints for them.... 16:36 < BlueMatt> I wouldnt assume you'd ask a full node over the p2p net 16:37 <+roasbeef> how do I know they're proving against the proper root? 16:37 < BlueMatt> more like either ask your local full node, or ask a static host 16:37 < BlueMatt> I think you'd have to relay the utxo hash and block height being proven against with the proof 16:37 <+roasbeef> what I'm saying is, if there's no penalty in creating an "invalid" proof, then how can anyone trust it at all? 16:37 < BlueMatt> then you can verify that the hash matches the utxo hash at that block height (or, to handle reorgs, maybe block hash) 16:38 <+roasbeef> just like with the old getutxos p2p message, it wasn't authenticated 16:38 < BlueMatt> I assume anyone who relayes an invalid proof would get banned immediately 16:38 < BlueMatt> if you prove to a hash which doesnt match the hash at the block hash that is relayed with the proof, that is invalid and you are banned 16:38 <+roasbeef> how does anyone verify the hash at that block hash? 16:39 < BlueMatt> and nodes with full nodes will get their own utxo hash data locally, so they know it, and if they arent full they can ask a static, semi-trusted set of servers to provide that data 16:39 < BlueMatt> mattsutxohashes.onion, etc 16:39 <+roasbeef> idk this is a pretty weak model, if we're comfortable with this, let's just reintroduce the getutxo message and call it a day 16:40 < BlueMatt> huh? getutxo was bad *because* it was over p2p and encouraged people to trust random nodes they found on the internet 16:40 < BlueMatt> not like signed data coming from the application developers..... 16:40 < BlueMatt> and its just for dos protection 16:40 < BlueMatt> not like you'd use it for anything else 16:40 < BlueMatt> and if you have a full node you wouldnt even use it for that 16:41 -!- wraithm [~wraithm@unaffiliated/wraithm] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 16:41 <+roasbeef> well this is about those that dont' have full nodes, full nodes aren't impacted by just still using the short chan id 16:41 < BlueMatt> we *do* have a getutxo in bitcoind rpc, and people allowing queries to it where the server signs seems perfectly great for some narrow applications, especially if its cross-checked across several parties 16:41 < BlueMatt> huh? no, the problem with short chan id is that it blows up your privacy 16:42 < BlueMatt> *everyone* is fucked by short chan id 16:42 <+roasbeef> that too, but atm it's required for lighter clients 16:42 < BlueMatt> especially someone with multiple channels, it ties a number of on-chain txn together by one static node id 16:42 <+roasbeef> yeh 16:42 < BlueMatt> yes, I'm suggesting a way to avoid it for light clients :p 16:42 < BlueMatt> I dont think "10 mutually-distrusting entities running servers which help with your anti-dos" is a bad security model..... 16:43 < BlueMatt> especially since it can all be generated air-gapped and served statically 16:43 < BlueMatt> GET /utxo-set/${BLOCK_HASH} ...... 16:45 < BlueMatt> hell, thats more decentralized than mining right now so probably better-than-spv security :p 16:46 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 16:48 -!- Oyvkva [~oyvkva@46.101.218.71] has joined #lightning-dev 16:49 -!- e4xit [~e4xit@cpc92716-cmbg20-2-0-cust45.5-4.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 16:49 <+roasbeef> hmmm....me gusta 16:55 <+roasbeef> LowMC/MiMC/this thing based off the legendre are possible candiates for compression of the hash func: https://eprint.iacr.org/2016/542.pdf (generaly survey), https://eprint.iacr.org/2016/492.pdf (MiMC), 16:57 -!- ralphtheninja2 [~lms@c-6469e555.03-130-6e6b701.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has quit [Quit: leaving] 16:59 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@i114-188-236-55.s41.a027.ap.plala.or.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 17:11 -!- lxer [~lx@ip5f5bf6b5.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 17:14 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 17:15 -!- riclas [riclas@148.63.37.111] has joined #lightning-dev 17:19 <+roasbeef> or even just a zero knowledge accumulator really 17:23 -!- Murch [~murch@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined #lightning-dev 17:24 -!- jojeyh [~delphi@2602:306:b8b6:b970:80:2a10:c5f5:c650] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:42 -!- Murch [~murch@96-82-80-28-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Quit: Snoozing.] 17:55 -!- daouzo235 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 17:55 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@ppp-94-64-157-186.home.otenet.gr] has joined #lightning-dev 17:55 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@ppp-94-64-157-186.home.otenet.gr] has quit [Changing host] 17:55 -!- Cogito_Ergo_Sum [~Myself@unaffiliated/cogito-ergo-sum/x-7399460] has joined #lightning-dev 18:02 -!- spinza [~spin@196.212.164.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 18:16 -!- bajohns [bajohns@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/bajohns] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. 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ZZZzzz…] 20:48 -!- alexann [~Alex@77.29.147.121] has joined #lightning-dev 20:51 -!- Alex_ [~Alex@77.29.84.5] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 21:03 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@i114-188-236-55.s41.a027.ap.plala.or.jp] has joined #lightning-dev 21:04 -!- jb55 [~jb55@70-36-49-138.dyn.novuscom.net] has joined #lightning-dev 22:00 -!- Ytxyyuu [~Ytxyyuu@78-71-46-150-no260.tbcn.telia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 22:08 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:09 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has joined #lightning-dev 22:13 -!- dabura667 [~dabura667@i114-188-236-55.s41.a027.ap.plala.or.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:18 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #lightning-dev 22:25 < meshcollider> cubancorona: you might have better luck asking in #c-lightning :) 22:52 -!- daouzo23 [~daouzo23@91.141.1.127.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 23:17 -!- ghost43 [~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:18 -!- ghost43 [~daer@gateway/tor-sasl/daer] has joined #lightning-dev 23:20 -!- cubancorona [49ca9483@gateway/web/freenode/ip.73.202.148.131] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 23:38 -!- Murch [~murch@c-73-223-113-121.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #lightning-dev 23:45 -!- cubancorona_ [49ca9483@gateway/web/freenode/ip.73.202.148.131] has joined #lightning-dev