--- Day changed Wed Apr 25 2018 00:04 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has joined #lightning-dev 00:20 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:23 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has joined #lightning-dev 00:29 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC46A3A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lightning-dev 00:29 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC46A3A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Changing host] 00:29 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has joined #lightning-dev 00:30 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:32 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has joined #lightning-dev 00:37 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:38 -!- DrOlmer [~DrOlmer@unaffiliated/drolmer] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 00:46 -!- tryphe_ [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:47 -!- tryphe_ [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has joined #lightning-dev 00:47 -!- tryphe_ is now known as tryphe 00:47 -!- bitonic-cjp [~bitonic-c@92-111-70-106.static.v4.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #lightning-dev 00:49 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:50 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has joined #lightning-dev 00:57 -!- meshcollider [uid246294@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-yajttqzutqlytdwm] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 01:17 -!- melvster [~melvin@ip-86-49-18-198.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #lightning-dev 01:20 -!- orange_ [3ef58f1a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.245.143.26] has joined #lightning-dev 01:36 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@xdsl-188-155-63-9.adslplus.ch] has joined #lightning-dev 01:42 < orange_> @ZmnSCPxj "if the hop node dies but the receiver successfully receives it" the payment will eventually succeed onchain and the payer will learn the preimage? The payer can't know if any htlcs are already fulfilled or will succeed before timeout. Requesting a refund by asking the payee to route back the same paymenthash tlc over a different route evens out the outcome: either the payee (did) never reveals the preimage and the 01:43 < orange_> payment attempt times out (fail) or the payee does/did reveal the preimage and effectively receives a payment from itself. If a stuck payment attempt can (somehow?) be invalidated (refund promised) the payer could safely request a new invoice without waiting for htlc timeout 01:48 -!- bitonic-cjp [~bitonic-c@92-111-70-106.static.v4.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 01:48 -!- bitonic-cjp [~bitonic-c@92-111-70-106.static.v4.ziggozakelijk.nl] has joined #lightning-dev 01:55 -!- mholter [~mholter@87-100-133-142.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 01:59 < orange_> requesting a conditional refund promise: in case a stuck payment attempt will succeed (for w/e reason) it will be send back. 02:04 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lightning-dev 02:04 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Changing host] 02:04 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has joined #lightning-dev 02:11 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@37.58.58.232] has joined #lightning-dev 02:15 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@37.58.58.232] has quit [Client Quit] 02:18 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 2.1] 02:19 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has joined #lightning-dev 02:28 -!- deusexbeer [~deusexbee@093-092-177-246-dynamic-pool-adsl.wbt.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 02:29 -!- deusexbeer [~deusexbee@080-250-077-030-dynamic-pool-adsl.wbt.ru] has joined #lightning-dev 02:33 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has joined #lightning-dev 02:40 < lndbot> orange_, the base case is: if the receiver has only received preimage, it’s option is to claim on chain and reveal to all upstream participants simultaneously, or allowing the htlc to expire. consider then, if the receiver has a signed commitment with the HTLC funds already in their favor, then it is now the intermediaryoption between the prior two cases. if the latter happens, they will have already sent money without themselves getting pa 02:40 < lndbot> cheat themselves by not settling, as the expired htlcs are refunded along the rest of the path. remember that this refund can propagate immediately between nodes that are not misbehaving. so, in the worst case, the time at which the sender could safely try again is roughly the timeout of the HTLC upstream of the closest, misbehaving node to the source. however, if the payee is not misbehaving, then an intermediary failed, and the payee is will not b 02:40 < lndbot> failure due to the use of onion routing. for any real-time service, this has no effect on the user experience (the service would load as if nothing happened), even if the ack takes a while to settle or (perhaps even better!) refunded. in this case the failing node will have paid for your service instead 02:59 -!- mholter [~mholter@87.100.133.142] has joined #lightning-dev 03:02 -!- kcud_dab is now known as bad_duck 03:15 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 03:17 -!- jtimon [~quassel@142.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lightning-dev 03:17 -!- nodweber [~nodweber@80.83.137.122] has joined #lightning-dev 03:20 -!- wbnns [sid105317@21/bitcoin/binns] has quit [] 03:21 -!- wbnns [sid105317@21/bitcoin/binns] has joined #lightning-dev 03:26 -!- jerseykx [sid110825@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-wgzdqmajqhictqse] has quit [] 03:27 -!- jerseykx [sid110825@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xqwwhyuvehvxqyhl] has joined #lightning-dev 03:27 -!- rusty [~rusty@pdpc/supporter/bronze/rusty] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 03:28 -!- jtimon [~quassel@142.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 03:31 -!- zmanian [sid113594@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gyohfjpohzldpqdp] has quit [] 03:31 -!- zmanian [sid113594@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-xfwkdewzdvtqfulu] has joined #lightning-dev 03:32 -!- aawdwdw [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lightning-dev 03:32 -!- aawdwdw [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Client Quit] 03:46 < rompert> ZmnSCPxj: thank you for your elaborate answer the other day 03:57 -!- rusty 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joined #lightning-dev 06:12 -!- jtimon [~quassel@142.29.134.37.dynamic.jazztel.es] has joined #lightning-dev 06:18 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 06:20 -!- Aaronvan_ [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 06:24 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:24 -!- shesek [~shesek@unaffiliated/shesek] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:27 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@37.58.58.232] has quit [Quit: laurentmt] 06:27 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 06:27 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #lightning-dev 06:27 -!- tiagotrs [~user@p5DC47789.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Changing host] 06:27 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has joined #lightning-dev 06:30 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@37.58.58.232] has joined #lightning-dev 06:31 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 [chris@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/chrisstewart5/x-62865615] has joined #lightning-dev 06:39 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 06:39 -!- Tralfaz [~none@199.19.94.193] has joined #lightning-dev 06:46 -!- shesek [~shesek@bzq-84-110-55-120.red.bezeqint.net] has joined #lightning-dev 06:46 -!- shesek [~shesek@bzq-84-110-55-120.red.bezeqint.net] has quit [Changing host] 06:46 -!- shesek [~shesek@unaffiliated/shesek] has joined #lightning-dev 06:47 -!- dougsland [~douglas@c-73-234-93-65.hsd1.nh.comcast.net] has joined #lightning-dev 06:52 -!- Tralfaz [~none@199.19.94.193] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 07:11 < bitonic-cjp> What happens when funds are locked in HTLCs, but the preimage isn't provided? Where can I find this in lightning-rfc? 07:13 < bitonic-cjp> From what I understand, in this scenario, at least one channel has to be closed on-chain (containing the HTLC), and proof of this is transmitted to other nodes to prevent forced-closing of the other channels. 07:14 < bitonic-cjp> I expected this in BOLT02, but I can't find it there. 07:16 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@178.197.231.150] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 07:17 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@178.197.231.150] has joined #lightning-dev 07:21 -!- CubicEarths [~cubiceart@178.197.231.150] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 07:36 -!- mholter [~mholter@87.100.133.142] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 07:56 -!- scalability-junk [sid6422@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ibvbajkgmvxnspkp] has quit [] 07:56 -!- scalability-junk [sid6422@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-vorasjxuqporowhh] has joined #lightning-dev 08:02 -!- Netsplit over, joins: instagibbs, ianthius, BCBot, knocte_, roasbeef, betawaffle, wraithm 08:03 -!- 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mholter [~mholter@87-100-133-142.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:40 -!- orange_ [3ef58f1a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.62.245.143.26] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 08:53 -!- Xexe [~weechat@unaffiliated/xexe] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 08:54 -!- Aaronvan_ [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:54 -!- mholter [~mholter@87-100-133-142.bb.dnainternet.fi] has joined #lightning-dev 09:03 < ysangkok> afaik it's the HTLC-timeout transaction, it's in BOLT-03 09:03 -!- bitonic-cjp [~bitonic-c@92-111-70-106.static.v4.ziggozakelijk.nl] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:04 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 09:07 -!- schnerch- [~schnerchi@2a01:4f8:c0c:afe::2] has joined #lightning-dev 09:09 -!- jonasschnelli_ [~jonasschn@2a01:4f8:172:10da::2] has joined #lightning-dev 09:09 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 09:11 -!- _flow__ [~none@salem.informatik.uni-erlangen.de] has joined #lightning-dev 09:13 -!- cdecker [~cdecker@mail.snyke.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 09:13 -!- cdecker [~cdecker@mail.snyke.net] has joined #lightning-dev 09:15 -lightningrfc:#lightning-dev- [lightning-rfc] sstone opened pull request #417: BOLT4: `channel_update` is mandatory in `UPDATE` error messages (master...bolt4-mandatory-channel-update-1) https://git.io/vpcw8 09:19 -!- interfect[m] [interfectm@gateway/shell/matrix.org/x-xjjbohydfumsyyuu] has joined #lightning-dev 09:24 -!- laurentmt [~Thunderbi@37.58.58.232] has quit [Quit: laurentmt] 09:26 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 09:45 -!- mholter [~mholter@87-100-133-142.bb.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 09:53 -!- GTHaxor1 [~GTHaxor@c-73-171-122-48.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #lightning-dev 09:53 -!- GTHaxor [~GTHaxor@c-73-171-122-48.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 09:56 -!- 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[~jonasschn@2a01:4f8:172:10da::2] has quit [Changing host] 10:29 -!- jonasschnelli_ [~jonasschn@unaffiliated/jonasschnelli] has joined #lightning-dev 10:29 -!- jonasschnelli_ is now known as jonasschnelli 10:34 -!- tryphe [~tryphe@unaffiliated/tryphe] has joined #lightning-dev 10:44 -!- irate_min [~iratemin@47-33-152-40.dhcp.knwc.wa.charter.com] has joined #lightning-dev 10:47 -!- iratemin [~iratemin@213.152.161.35] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 10:48 -!- GTHaxor1 is now known as GTHaxor 11:02 -!- irate_minority [~iratemin@213.152.161.133] has joined #lightning-dev 11:04 -!- irate_min [~iratemin@47-33-152-40.dhcp.knwc.wa.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 11:07 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has joined #lightning-dev 11:31 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 11:33 -!- intcat [~zshlyk@gateway/tor-sasl/intcat] has joined #lightning-dev 11:42 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 11:47 -!- tiagotrs [~user@unaffiliated/tiagotrs] has joined #lightning-dev 11:51 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:52 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 11:56 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:37 < bad_duck> I have a channel in state "ONCHAIN:Tracking our own unilateral close" / "ONCHAIN:2 outputs unresolved: in 100 blocks will spend DELAYED_OUTPUT_TO_US (6b56820edeabb2c09483646921c7b2fb1a08549db3a227c6ff62849e406f1f62:0) using OUR_DELAYED_RETURN_TO_WALLET" <-- is there a way to know who spend the funding output ? 13:02 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has joined #lightning-dev 13:08 -!- AaronvanW [~AaronvanW@unaffiliated/aaronvanw] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:14 -!- irate_minority [~iratemin@213.152.161.133] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 13:43 -!- AaronvanW 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has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 15:57 < roasbeef> bad_duck: if your node need to wait the csv delay, then that means _you_ spent the funding output 16:06 -!- sh_smith [~sh_smith@cpe-76-174-26-91.socal.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:08 -!- sh_smith [~sh_smith@cpe-76-174-26-91.socal.res.rr.com] has joined #lightning-dev 16:11 < bad_duck> roasbeef: thx, (and indeed, the other side has this status : "ONCHAIN:Tracking their unilateral close") 16:24 -!- asdf__ [806e4395@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.110.67.149] has joined #lightning-dev 16:25 -!- qwertyasdf_ [806e4395@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.110.67.149] has joined #lightning-dev 16:25 -!- belcher [~belcher@unaffiliated/belcher] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:29 -!- asdf__ [806e4395@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.110.67.149] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:29 -!- qwertyasdf_ [806e4395@gateway/web/freenode/ip.128.110.67.149] has quit [Client Quit] 16:35 -!- Chris_Stewart_5 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