--- Log opened Wed Nov 25 00:00:26 2020
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02:07 < waxwing> phantomcircuit, it isn't bizarre though, right; to have the anti-DoS effect, the eth payment for the gas for the invalid tx has to be embedded in the blockchain to be a valid payment.
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02:08 < waxwing> so it's not 'blocks can have invalid txs' it's more like 'they *have* to have invalid txs'. i was reading about this last night, in the context of this soft fork discussion. it's all pretty confusing.
02:11 < gmaxwell> yes, though the anti-dos effect isn't particularly necessary.
02:11 < gmaxwell> it just papers over limitations in their implementations.
02:12 < waxwing> i was sitting in bed trying to figure this out and i just got more and more confused lol
02:13 < gmaxwell> e.g. they could just as well queue transactions in priority order based on an estimate of the income from them and then spend as much time processing transactions out of that queue as they care to use.
02:13 < gmaxwell> if some account triggers invalid behavior, you just remember that and heavily downrank that account in further processing.
02:14 < Emcy> gmaxwell seen this https://store.steampowered.com/app/1256230/Hyperbolica/
02:14 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ Hyperbolica on Steam ]
02:14 < gmaxwell> Emcy: yeah, for some reason the version shipped with fedora just crashes for me.
02:14 < Emcy> its on repos? hm
02:14 < gmaxwell> it was actually reading the hyperbolica webpage that clued me into the hyperbolic minecraft.
02:15 < gmaxwell> oh! wait different game
02:15 < gmaxwell> sorry, what I was thinking about was uhh hyperrogue
02:15 < Emcy> yeah this isnt out yet
02:15 < Emcy> it sims spherical ie positive curve space too
02:16 < Emcy> its even weirder
02:17 < Emcy> someone pointed out these games are only hypebolic in x/y, z is still euclidean
02:18 < Emcy> probably cos hyperbolic space in all directions is unnavigable for monkey brains
02:18 < gmaxwell> hyperbolic descent
02:19 < gmaxwell> now that would be a game.
02:19 < Emcy> eeesh
02:19 < Emcy> 6dof games confuse me enough lol
02:19 < Emcy> forsaken remastered is on steam though
02:20 < gmaxwell> I really enjoyed descent.
02:21 < Emcy> i got a psx copy i think
02:21 < Emcy> o wow all descent games are on steam too
02:22 < gmaxwell> well no shock, if there is a button on the internet where if people press it they'll give you money, some will press it at random.
02:22 < gmaxwell> so you want to maximize the amount of buttons on the internet that give you money, if you want a lot of money. :P
02:23 < Emcy> https://store.steampowered.com/bundle/5605/The_Descent_Classic_Collection/
02:23 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ The Descent Classic Collection on Steam ]
02:24 < Emcy> theres lots of classic old games that are not published on steam though. A lot of the time you just have to wait for Nightdive to buy the rights, update it and republish it
02:24 < Emcy> gog.com tends to be better for the older stuff obviously, since thats what gog was created for
02:24 < Emcy> but recently i looked to see if anyone was selling Dark Earth digitally, and no dice
02:28 < belcher> im finding it really interesting looking at the fees as a % of miner income
02:28 < belcher> 9.7% average over the last 144 blocks, 7.2% over the last 2016 blocks
02:28 < belcher> the whole idea of fees taking over from inflation seems to be right on track
02:30 < waxwing> muh death spiral
02:32 < waxwing> this site is interesting .. 0kb.club
02:33 < gmaxwell> waxwing: "death spiral" https://www.google.com/search?q=usd+price+in+btc
02:33 < Entitlement> gmaxwell - [ usd price in btc - Google Search ]
02:34 < gmaxwell> jesus fuck, empty webpages can have content now?!
02:35 < waxwing> lol so i'm not 100% an idiot, i was very confused
02:35 < gmaxwell> I'm pusing F12 and still don't understand how it works.
02:36 < gmaxwell> so the headers reference a style sheet but firefox doesn't show a request for it.
02:36 < gmaxwell> via a "Link:" header.
02:36 < Emcy> https://store.steampowered.com/app/273600/Descent_FreeSpace__The_Great_War/ Freespace was a 'descent' game too, very famous game single handedly mainstreamed the cockpit viewpoint spaceship genre
02:36 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ Descent: FreeSpace – The Great War on Steam ]
02:37 < gmaxwell> okay, hitting disable cache lets me see the request for hte CSS.
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02:38 < Emcy> belcher yes the fees are starting to work!
02:38 < waxwing> gmaxwell, where do i disable cache? i'm on FF too
02:38 < belcher> its been like that for months/years i just didnt look at the data before
02:38 < Emcy> most bullish signal possible for bitcoin imo
02:38 < waxwing> oh i see it yeah
02:39 < belcher> though i still wonder what happens if we get an empty mempool say on sunday night when theres no inflation
02:39 < belcher> i guess miners still mine for a little bit just because of the 100 block coinbase locktime
02:39 < Emcy> yes its been a while since fees became non-trivial. Even the incremental move from trivial to non-trivial fees did a LOT to reallign miner incentives in the system as it was designed
02:39 < gmaxwell> belcher: need a perpetual backlog.
02:39 < belcher> and miners consider their incentives long-term, not just over the course of an hour or two
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02:40 < gmaxwell> We could already have one, with a bit of smarter wallet practices... like agressively spending extra outputs during minfee periods.
02:41 < Emcy> belcher i think there will come a time [sooner than ppl might think] when the mempool will never run dry again
02:42 < belcher> another effect that somewhat-self balances is hashrate dropping reduces the supply of block space
02:42 < belcher> so if you really do get a sunday night when mempools are empty, some asics might turn off or slow down, leading to fewer blocks and the mempool building up again slowly
02:42 < Emcy> i guess worst case scenario, enough miners shut down due to lack of available feeage that the chain more or less stops for a while until enough build up for a miner to fire up again?
02:42 < gmaxwell> yep
02:43 < Emcy> it would screw with the issuance schedule a lil bit but nothing untoward probably
02:43 < gmaxwell> wouldn't be a problem until issuance is really low in any case.
02:43 < belcher> yeah if inflation is meaningful then all this is irrelevant
02:44 < Emcy> i think i read that a large miner cant just switch off instantly anyway though because things would catch fire
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02:45 < belcher> iv never mined myself, but supposedly asics have different settings regarding hashrate and power consumption
02:46 < gmaxwell> well not 'instantly' perhaps, but in seconds, sure.
02:46 < gmaxwell> belcher: some in the past have... e.g. spondooles. none of the bitmain stuff does AFAIK.
02:46 < Emcy> its all run so close to efficiency maximising zero engineering margins that big instantaneous load changes would start fires in the facility......like a giant electrical water hammer
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02:48 < Emcy> whats the deal with this 0kb site
02:48 < Emcy> it is indeed a blank page
02:48 < gmaxwell> Emcy: in firefox you get a page of text.
02:48 < gmaxwell> because it uses a http header to trigger the loading of a seperate css file that has the text.
02:50 < Emcy> its just an external resource?
02:50 < Emcy> i cant select the text lol
02:52 < Emcy> this is why i like reader mode in vivaldi, it can pretty reliably pick the article body text out of the dom and present it nicely for sites that pout and refuse to show anything unless you agree to 100mb of javascript
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03:06 < gmaxwell> Sooo... no one has heard from Francis Pouliot in the last month?
03:06 < gmaxwell> I've checked with a number of people that I know talk to him and no joy.
03:07 < Emcy> no email response
03:07 < gmaxwell> I emailed him, no reply. Right.
03:08 < gmaxwell> (two days ago)
03:10 < Emcy> no tweets for a months
03:10 < Emcy> twitter header "i will not live in the pod molon labe"
03:10 < Emcy> oof. maybe he went off the deep end
03:10 < gmaxwell> he's been a big anti-mask/anti-lockdown protestor I hope he didn't get himself sick or arrested.
03:11 < gmaxwell> his medium account is also inactive for a month.
03:11 < Emcy> so the current best guess is hospital or jail
03:12 < belcher> he's pretty young though, seems unlikely covid would put him in hospital.. more likely he'd get it, recover and go back to claiming its nothing
03:12 < belcher> unless you mean the police beat him up
03:12 < Emcy> >Blocking mainstream media Twitter handles does nothing. You must block the individual journalists themselves. That really pisses them off they are entitled little bitches.
03:12 < Emcy> lol
03:13 < Emcy> belcher well french police go hard when they need to
03:13 < gmaxwell> I think he's in monteral, the police there are pretty thuggy.
03:13 < Emcy> oh canadian french
03:13 < gmaxwell> (as in ... both times I've been to montreal I've seen the police clubbing protestors first hand... I don't think I can say that for any other city. :) )
03:14 < belcher> you'd think he'd upload selfies of a broken jaw or whatever though... not silence
03:14 < belcher> it seems unlikely to me idk
03:14 < Emcy> unless he physically cant
03:14 < gmaxwell> belcher: agreed.
03:14 < Emcy> doesnt explain why some random is claiming hes advising people against taproot tho
03:15 < gmaxwell> my sick comment was intended to mean got the vid... some young people do get sick.
03:15 < Emcy> unless thats just a lie
03:15 < gmaxwell> Emcy: pretty clever trick if people knew he was incommunicado...
03:15 < belcher> he was pretty anti-bcash and anti-segwit2x iirc, its pretty unlikely he'd be anti taproot
03:16 < Emcy> yes. that sounds plausible
03:16 < gmaxwell> belcher: exactly. Though he might have some contrarian hyperbolic view, but that doesn't explain why he seems unreachable too.
03:16 < gmaxwell> belcher: you saw the thread right?
03:16 < belcher> no?
03:16 < gmaxwell> belcher: https://twitter.com/RoninNode/status/1329981683869872129
03:17 < gmaxwell> basically a bunch of twitter nobodies claiming vaguely that Pouliot convinced them against taproot privately, and ignoring any request for clarification.
03:17 < Emcy> hes gonna be mad if/when he gets back
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03:23 < gmaxwell> at first I thougt may he got himself twitter suspended by reposting the nypost story, since some of the last tweets from him were about that.
03:23 < gmaxwell> but it doesn't explain why he's inactive elsewhere too.
03:24 < queip> than random isn't CEO of blockchair?   btw bcashers recently a bit mad on him since blockchair shows BCHN prices in some places when exploring BCHA (due to  too much work, he exaplined)
03:25 < gmaxwell> queip: no, different random twitter thread!
03:25 < gmaxwell> I found this one by searching twitter to see if "blockchain but we covered up part of the end" guy's toxin had spread.
03:26 < queip> only thing schools should teach is for people to demand logical arguments, and otherwise do not trust
03:30 < waxwing> why does it matter what pouliot said or didn't.
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03:38 < pipirella> another bitcoin bro who cannot behave as a grownup, I'm shocked
03:39 < waxwing> i'm not putting the guy down, just argue the merits, not he-said she-said
03:40 < Emcy> waxwing i think were trying to work out if there is a underhanded black pr campaign afoot against taproot
03:40 < belcher> it doesnt matter but dumb people might be convinced by "he said" so its worth letting francis know that someone is using his name in this way
03:40 < Emcy> or if someone like poulliot is just confused
03:40 < gmaxwell> waxwing: or or just find out what he said in order to figure out if there are merits.
03:40 < waxwing> oh yeah if someone is misreporting what he said then for him, he needs to know it, good point.
03:41 < pipirella> he's an influencer
03:41 < waxwing> point is if someone says 'pouliot convinced me privately that taproot is shit' then ask them about what exactly they were convinced of, it doesn't matter who it was that convinced them.
03:41 < waxwing> and if they literally have no idea except 'Mr X told me' then they're children, ignore them
03:42 < buZz> influencer is just a word for a advertizer, not someone productive
03:42 < pipirella> buZz: that's my point
03:42 < gmaxwell> waxwing: well as you can see, thats what people in the thread did and got evaded.  The potential concern there is creating an astroturf "everyone knows taproot is bad" situation.
03:42 < gmaxwell> without even being able to pinpoint something concrete.
03:43 < pipirella> and seriously gmaxwell, the more you engage in this, the more the shitcoiners will kick and scream
03:43 < pipirella> :)
03:43 < queip> luckily for Bitcoin, everyone who makes mistakes and trusts them will lose own money. Thanks free market
03:43 < gmaxwell> Advertising is, sadly, pretty effective... and usually works via that kind of familiarity field effect, rather than logical argument.
03:44 < gmaxwell> pipirella: well my 'engagement' with it is just talking about it here. (and pinging pouliot via email, unsuccessfullly)
03:44 < gmaxwell> I wouldn't dare give that idiocy airtime by saying anything about it someplace visible.
03:45 < pipirella> gmaxwell: yeah
03:46 < gmaxwell> e.g. even when I debunked that blockchair CEO's claims, I did so in an preexisting (most recent but somewhat old) thread on reddit about taproot.
03:46 < gmaxwell> (helps that there really wasn't another logical place, I couldn't respond to his post on rbtc)
03:47 < pipirella> the blockchairman needed a slap
03:47 < pipirella> and you do explain in a very easy to understand way
03:48 < gmaxwell> LOL deadalnix with an unintentional damning with weak defence https://twitter.com/deadalnix/status/1331459937529188354
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03:51 < Emcy> pipirella letting bad thought patterns and 'received wisdom' fester never reduces its prevalence
03:51 < Emcy> ive seen this first hand
03:52 < pipirella> well the guy with the crazy hair is obvisously just trying to make a name for himself by using strong words
03:52 < Emcy> but theres also a gambit where you try and get some well known opponent to engage your bullshit which can paradoxically legitimise it, regardless of what you actually said
03:52 < Emcy> i could see people trying that with gmax
03:53 < Emcy> you have to be judicious with what you engage with and not
03:53 < pipirella> yes, this is a fresh young mc on the hiphop scene trying to make a name for himself by going at the OG's
03:54 < Emcy> i think someone claiming pouilot is advising against taproot when no one can get hold of him is worth engaging with
03:54 < Emcy> and so was the blockchair guys bullshit
03:55 < Emcy> pipirella yeah i guess you could put it like that
03:55 < pipirella> the hair in blockchair
03:55 < Emcy> weird psych tricks that works in paradoxical ways
03:58 < gmaxwell> Emcy: here is more of this pouliot stuff: https://twitter.com/lokul/status/1330410824633098241
04:08 < Emcy> hm seems to claim twitter booted francis
04:08 < Emcy> but the account isnt locked
04:09 < Emcy> i dont know if i could say this account is a fake maxi account or what
04:12 < Emcy> all you really have to do is have an aged account and mouth the words and retweet lots of stuff from known bitcoiners
04:12 < Emcy> or maybe francis really has withdrawn from public fora but is talking to handfuls of people on skype
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04:21 < pipirella> ok guys
04:21 < pipirella> what about ethereum proof of stake?
04:21 < pipirella> what will happen to the eth price?
04:26 < buZz> try ##altcoins perhaps ;)
04:26 < buZz> eth isnt a btc fork
04:27 < gmaxwell> Considering how up for revision ethereums rules are perhaps it could one day be one.
04:27 < buZz> :P
04:27 < gmaxwell> :p
04:27 < buZz> it might help their scalability
04:28 < buZz> maybe they could just revamp it entirely as a layer2(or 3) on top of btc
04:28 < buZz> would make more sense to me
04:30 < gmaxwell> I like that eth and bch exist, they pull a lot of sleeze out of bitcoin.
04:30 < Emcy> could try finding pouliots skype name and calling him, if they claim hes contactable that way?
04:31 < Emcy> might just be his email addres minus the domain part
04:33 < gmaxwell> yeah, maybe will do tomorrow.
04:33 < gmaxwell> wait. skype still exists?
04:34 < buZz> yeah microsoft wont let it die
04:34 < Emcy> its but an 8 billion dollar 5 letter brand now
04:34 < queip> tu-du wupu, tu-du wupu.  tu-du wupu, tu-du wupu.
04:34 < Emcy> but it still nominally exists
04:35 < pipirella> buZz: thanks for reminding us
04:37 < queip> https://twitter.com/SallyMayweather/status/1331266762600558594/photo/1
04:37  * queip flips table
04:38 < queip> all this ancaps-turned-retarded should get the rope right after jurnos and influencers. in minekraft
04:38 < Emcy> that guy is vers friend
04:38 < Emcy> to the extent ver can form friendships
04:39 < queip> do otherwise intelligent people really do not really get it that some viruses have higher rate of transmissions and other have lower?
04:40 < Emcy> i read once that measles was such an insane virus that a single active particle made a successful infection
04:40 < Emcy> r number of >20 or something
04:40 < Emcy> it had to go
04:40 < pipirella> people die from hot weather, car accidents and the flu, all the time, every year and no one gives a shit
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04:40 < pipirella> we are lucky covid wasn't another spanish flu
04:41 < gmaxwell> hope we don't get something 10x three years from now
04:41 < gmaxwell> and lots of people will be like "that covid thing was overhyped, we made it fine!"
04:41 < Emcy> what...
04:42 < pipirella> it's just a matter of time until measles ebola aids which also makes your thumbs fall off
04:42 < pipirella> some super virus
04:42 < pipirella> or that deat fungi thing which appeared in hospitals a few years ago
04:42 < pipirella> death*
04:43 < pipirella> motivating a lockdown is like motivating financial stimulus, "if we hadn't done anything we would be worse off!" yeah that might very well be the case, but it is not a very good explanation
04:44 < pipirella> statistics will be pretty clear sometime during next year, we will see just how bad the rona was
04:45 < Emcy> ive been operating on the assumption that this is a once in a lifetime event
04:45 < pipirella> the actions taken, are hopefully once in a lifetime
04:46 < pipirella> i mean, lockdowns? in the democratic western countries?
04:46 < Emcy> and i just need to do my bird and be glad this isnt victorian britain
04:46 < pipirella> I didn't know it was legally possible
04:47 < Emcy> pipirella maybe its not but it doesnt take much of an exigent circumstance to show what a fiction things like legality are
04:47 < pipirella> indeed
04:47 < queip> pipirella: for example poland does it illegaly. that's what you get for socialists and commies in gubirm
04:48 < gmaxwell> do any of you live where actual lockdown is real?
04:48 < pipirella> no
04:48 < queip> gmaxwell: I know people who have court cases for e.g. not wearing a mask
04:48 < pipirella> lockdown is impossible in sweden, but they can limit crowds, never disallow them
04:48 < queip> it was illegal  for few days to travel outside of city or smth, and for some time it was illegal to travel to buy non-essential things
04:49 < queip> but most shops did closed
04:49 < gmaxwell> It isn't real here. I mean, yes, they close bars/entertainment/etc. but in reality enough people are worried most of those would likely be unprofitable to open.  Because necessarily people need to go out to carry essential tasks, in practice that means anyone can do pretty much anything that doesn't result in a public gathering.  You might be asked to provide an excuse, but in reality no on is
04:49 < gmaxwell> stopped.
04:49 < queip> then many figured out how to work around the laws and reopenned in some funny form, like in trailers, with max customers = 1 at a time
04:50 < gmaxwell> yeah and a lot of things reopened with some less or more plausable virus theater.
04:50 < pipirella> they stopped serving alcohol at bars after 10 in the evening, but they do serve low-alcohol beer and soda
04:50 < queip> well here most shops in shopping centers are closed, not just bars&cinemas
04:50 < queip> I think now perhaps it was better to SHUT. DOWN. EVERYTHING. for 1 month and then just guaranteen everyone entering country
04:51 < queip> instead we get yaer of slowly fucking economy
04:51 < Emcy> gmaxwell yes
04:51 < Emcy> re: actual lockdowns
04:51 < gmaxwell> So from my perspective what lockdown is == closing big public gathering places (which I think many more people would agree is prudent) + give everyone a solid excuse to say no to participating in stuff they're not comfortable with.
04:52 < queip> also they should do that legally. pass a bill, have a senate and president sign it, give it like 5 days of vacati legis or what ever it's called
04:52 < queip> instead gov now e.g. closed all furniture shops by a tweet "oh yeah guys in 15 minutes it will be illegal to have such shops opened. LOL."
04:52 < queip> it was literally done at 23:45 and started being (illegally) enforced at 00:00
04:53 < pipirella> gmaxwell: yeah, that's reasonable things
04:53 < buZz> queip: they dont do press releases of changes in your nation?
04:53 < queip> buZz: they tweeted it
04:53 < pipirella> I think you can put limits on companies, but you have to compensate them if they do actual useful things, but government should be careful about restricting personal freedoms
04:53 < buZz> so no press releases?
04:54 < queip> buZz: dunno if there was also a press conference about it, probably no
04:54 < buZz> tweeting is just a forum, thats not a press release
04:54 < queip> this is all totally illegal
04:54 < buZz> queip: a -press release- would be the normal method of telling the public
04:54 < Emcy> in january, my gas boiler has to be inspected by law. ive tried to get them to delay it but i dont think they will
04:54 < buZz> a tweet is just someone reminding you
04:54 < queip> buZz: there was no prior notification of that fact before the tweet that in 15 minutes law changes
04:55 < buZz> what nation is this in?
04:55 < pipirella> polski
04:55 < queip> think Soviet, but people are less oblivious
04:55 < buZz> you think?
04:55 < queip> and less creative in cheekeebreeke all problems and many still demand handouts
04:55 < Emcy> i have no choice but to move everything i need to cook out of the kitchen into the living room and seal the kitchen off, the boiler is in there. I also have to seal up the existing entrance to the space under the stairs where the gas inlet is, and cut another entrance via the kitcen thru the plasterboard.
04:56 < Emcy> then i have to live without a kitchen for 2 weeks, probably 3 before i feel ok about it
04:56 < Emcy> thank god the bathroom taps are potable too
04:56 < Emcy> hows that for a lockdown?
04:56 < queip> Emcy: ?
04:57 < Emcy> thats my shitty fucking life now
04:57 < buZz> Measures in Poland will be tightened from Saturday until at least the end of the month, Prime Minister Mateusz Morawiecki announced on Tuesday, adding that the current tightening in Poland is “the penultimate step before a total national lockdown.”
04:57 < buZz> i see a press release queip
04:57 < buZz> guess you just missed it
04:57 < queip> buZz: no
04:57 < queip> they change rules each few days
04:57 < buZz> no?
04:57 < buZz> yes, news does keep changing
04:57 < queip> furniture shops being closed was one of such instant tweeks
04:57 < buZz> thats why you watch em daily :P
04:58 < queip> and even if they would call a press conference at 23:45 that in 15 minutes it's illegal to shop furniture, in addition to tweeting it, still the problem remains
04:59 < queip> law should not change in 15 minutes. and writting something in internet, or telling it to press, is not a legal form of changing law
04:59 < buZz> they did similar here in .nl , announced all coffeeshops would be closed from march , ~12hr after press release
04:59 < queip> you need to pass a bill or resultion. most of this stuff needs full new bill
04:59 < buZz> it was a fun 12 hrs
04:59 < buZz> i made so much money, lol
05:00 < queip> buZz: was it at least legal?
05:00 < buZz> everyone in panic if they could have enough weed to 'last corona'
05:00 < buZz> queip: hm? no , weed isnt legal in .nl
05:00 < buZz> its 'allowed'
05:00 < queip> buZz: was such change in law done in legal way
05:00 < buZz> its more legal in US
05:00 < buZz> pandemics allow different measures
05:01 < queip> in Poland you could - you need to declare state of emergency. But they refused to do it, so all this is totally illegal
05:01 < buZz> the shops affected are mostly all compensated
05:01 < buZz> unless they had dubious accounting
05:02 < buZz> they've now written a new law here , to make it legal to make masks mandatory
05:02 < buZz> in some public areas
05:03 < buZz> nearly everyone already wears masks in the places affected, voluntary
05:03 < buZz> so not much would change
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05:19 < Emcy> >https://old.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/k0dyq5/satoshi_nakamoto_lived_in_london_while_working_on/
05:19 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ Satoshi Nakamoto Lived In London While Working On Bitcoin. : btc ]
05:19 < Emcy> this stupid shit again
05:20 < Emcy> >Well yeah, that's because it's Adam Back. Probably controversial around here but all the evidence points to him. US intelligent agencies already discovered this somewhere between 2011 and 2013 after they gathered more evidence from gavin, and it's one of the reasons why he (had to) set up blockstream.
05:20 < Emcy> hurrdurr
05:21 < queip> >Who cares? Someone who has the 1 million coins.
05:21 < queip> >His name is Craig Wright.
05:22 < queip> (got -2 but still lol)
05:24 < Emcy> ;;tlast
05:24 <@gribble> 19242.96
05:24 < queip> Satoshi is the biggest troll on  humanity and [future] historians, besides that medieval(?) book in unknown alphabet and language about fauna/flora/and stuff (Voynich manuscript)
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05:28 < Emcy> https://twitter.com/nikzh/status/1331339880664797185 this guy is just fudding hard recently what an asshole
05:46 < buZz> queip: if you're polish, i wanna thank your culture for the song 'lipka zielona' :P
05:46 < buZz> stuck in my ear for over a month now
05:46 < buZz> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nbmb0a1NFjU
05:50  * pipirella pops the zubrowka
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06:58 < chmod> Ping
06:58 < chmod> Works.
07:12 < gmaxwell> Emcy: Francis Pouliot is also not recieving signal messages.
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07:13 < gmaxwell> Emcy: I'm think Adam was living in north america at the time the bitcoin whitepaper came out.
07:13 < Emcy> lol
07:14 < gmaxwell> Emcy: though ... not that this contradicts anything: the dumb analysis they are linking to actually agrees strongly with north america, not london.  Wright was in AU at the time, which is right out.  I heard that wright is throwing a fit about that publication in his private chat channels.
07:14 < Emcy> someone also said you wrote the whitepaper and the only reason he got downvoted is how much the rest of them hate you lol
07:14 < gmaxwell> lol
07:14 < gmaxwell> I wouldn't have used Word.
07:14 < Emcy> didnt know it was written in word
07:16 < Emcy> people who are still trying to ID satoshi still dont get bitcoin i guess
07:16 < gmaxwell> (actually I think technically openoffice)
07:16 < Emcy> to paraphrase a great 21st century philosopher: it doesnt matter who he was, what mattered was his plan
07:16 < gmaxwell> but with a formatting template that made it look like a latex formated doc.
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07:19 < Emcy> so pouliots phone is off too?
07:20 < Emcy> thats all really strange, hes off the grid
07:20 < Emcy> and now people are claiming they told him taproot sucks
07:20 < Emcy> he told them*
07:21 -!- brtastic1 is now known as brtastic
07:22 < gmaxwell> well, I'm not worried about the taproot thing now. Just kinda concerned about him
07:23 < gmaxwell> looks like he used github on nov 2nd
07:23 < Emcy> rona has been hard on a lot of people mentally, even if you never catch it
07:23 < Emcy> especially if you think its a NWO scheme to reset society or something
07:25 < Emcy> which is frankly not outside of credibility anymore, if you allow that the virus itself is real and wasnt planned or anything
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07:36 < Emcy> ;;tlast
07:36 <@gribble> 19289.58
07:36 < chmod> 19300.230
07:37 < Emcy> youre a bot after all
07:38 < gmaxwell> ;;tlast
07:38 <@gribble> 19307.23
07:38 < gmaxwell> slow bot
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08:02 < grubles> ;;ticker --high
08:02 <@gribble> 19490.0
08:03 < grubles> so we exceeded ATH?
08:05 < rabidus> nope afaik
08:07 < queip> 19.6 is the targett
08:08 < Emcy> .price bch btc
08:08 < deb0rah> binance 0.01791000 [-1.29%] | bittrex 0.01791162 [-1.34%] | southxchange 0.01775384 [-2.60%] | livecoin 0.01745588 [+0.02%] | hitbtc 0.01786000 [-1.04%] | graviex 0.01750425 [-10.34%] | poloniex 0.01771122 [+1.31%] | kraken 0.01791000 [0.00%] |
08:09 < Emcy> https://old.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/k0szvk/stop_spamming_egon/
08:09 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ Stop spamming egon : btc ]
08:09 < Emcy> lool
08:10 < gmaxwell> lol complaining already
08:10 < nkuttler> ath was above 20k on some exchanges
08:11 < Emcy> lets call it 20k
08:12 < nkuttler> (if somebody wanted to stay anonymous it would make sense to use popular software and a timezone with many related people)
08:13 < nkuttler> yeah, the 20k on those were due to circumstances iirc
08:13 < nkuttler> like low local supply and such
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08:15 < grubles> lol r/btc hates egon now. awesome.
08:18 < buZz> didnt break 19k6 yet?
08:18 < buZz> pfff
08:18 < buZz> thats it, its over
08:18 < buZz> no new ATH in 2020
08:18 < buZz> :)
08:19 < nkuttler> bitcoin ded
08:20 < nkuttler> i think i'll buy for 1k at ath, just for lulz
08:20 < gmaxwell> we're way above OTH by many reasonable ways of calculating though.
08:21 < buZz> hush, reason
08:21 < buZz> we need emotions now
08:21 < buZz> :)
08:21 < nkuttler> inflation?
08:21 < queip> most people I know in btc (just normies) are selling now
08:21 < gmaxwell> like if you converted bgold+btcd+bitcoinx+sbtc to btc right after they were created, you'd have 20% more bitcoin and the current price would effectively be $22,981 in dec-2017-dollars.
08:21 < queip> but then again, such people's supply will run out and price keeps pushing
08:22 < nkuttler> gmaxwell: that's... creative
08:22 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: yeah, lol or if you instead price in percentage of existing USD. :P
08:22 < buZz> gmaxwell: oooo that would be a fun chart
08:22 < buZz> btcusd over time, adding the usd profits of selling the forks
08:22 < nkuttler> you could argue though that bch and stuff pulled in new people
08:22 < buZz> yeah from bitconnect
08:23 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: I got about 20% from those forks, and maybe an average of 14% on bch earlier (though that was before the ATH price)... plus a bunch from those S2X futures.
08:23 < buZz> how is ye'olde Roy Murphy?
08:24 < gmaxwell> buZz: Wazzaaa waaazza waaazzuppp?
08:24 < gmaxwell> (though in my case I converted them all to USD, which was a good deal until basically right now. :P)
08:25 < nkuttler> wait, all forks other than bch were ~20% btc together?
08:25 < buZz> hmmmz, seems Roy Murphy doesnt use twitter anymore :P
08:25 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: yes.
08:25 < nkuttler> :|
08:25 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: if you sold them early near their peak prices.
08:26 < nkuttler> seemed like a hassle at the time..
08:26 < buZz> this channel was specifically made to assist people doing so, nkuttler ;)
08:26 < gmaxwell> they added up, there was a lot of them
08:26 < queip> !tlast
08:26 <@gribble> 18999.15
08:26 < queip> RIP
08:26 < nkuttler> buZz: why did nobody tell me?
08:26 < buZz> nkuttler: :(
08:26 < nkuttler> damn..
08:26 < buZz> it was -the only- topic in here back in those days
08:26 < buZz> nobody cheered the forks on
08:26 < buZz> it was 100% 'how do i claim and dump'
08:27 < gmaxwell> yeah I recently updated the topic to make that more clear: NO BUY. ONLY SELL.
08:27 < nkuttler> i remember installing a bitcoin gold wallet but then thinking.. nah, not worth the risk of running malware
08:27 < gmaxwell> Bitcoin Gold once traded at 8% of Bitcoin, super bitcoin at 2%, bitcoin diamond at 5% (they issued 10x diamond per bitcoin), BitcoinX at 6% of bitcoin (1000x multiplier)... etc.
08:27 < buZz> hehe
08:27 < queip> nkuttler: buy more computers
08:27 < buZz> i'm sad i didnt sell my BCH above 0.2 btc a piece :(
08:27 < nkuttler> that too
08:27 < nkuttler> ah, whatever. still doing fine
08:27 < queip> and move real btc first
08:27 < buZz> we cant all be gmaxwell :D
08:27 < gmaxwell> Yea, I sold some BCH at .2 though some as low as .04.
08:28 < buZz> nkuttler: yay fine :D
08:28 < queip> that's annoying as fuck with sweeping btc first
08:28 < buZz> gmaxwell: didnt you sell BCH for way above that -before- the fork?
08:28 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: yeah, lol, I actually went and rewrote the signing code for each one. fortunately they were all about the same as the bcash code... with just a fw lines diffent.
08:28 < queip> imagine countries without income tax nor other taxes on this so it is x5 less mess
08:28 < gmaxwell> buZz: no I sold S2X before the fork that didn't happen. I *tried* to sell BCH to roger/etc before the fork but no joy.
08:28 < buZz> ooo, right
08:28 < queip> buZz: max was around 0.30, on futures
08:28 < buZz> i mixed the forks up
08:28 < queip> buZz: but of course it was super risky
08:29 < queip> also didn't ver promise to exchange 1:1?
08:29 < gmaxwell> buZz: I mean a goodly chunk of my bch sells were near $4000/coin-- the vs BTC ratio doesn't tell the whole story. :)
08:29 < buZz> queip: yeah sad, i COULD have sold for 0.25 on exchange but was just minutes too late :(
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08:29 < nkuttler> yeah, i had just started a new job when all this forking started..
08:29 < queip> remember b2x futures?
08:29 < gmaxwell> Many people tried to push Ver into a 1:1 exchange but I don't think anyone got him to make good on it.
08:29 < gmaxwell> B2X futures were awesome.
08:29 < queip> I think they never quite died below 0.001? but ofc with no chain it is all meaningless
08:30 < queip> btc1 btc2 ::D
08:30 < gmaxwell> they also ran between 0.1 and 0.2.
08:30 < queip> we want to be political correct
08:30 < gmaxwell> I wish I'd been willing to expose more of my coins to bitfinex risk.
08:30 < queip> look at us being politically correct and neutral
08:30 < queip> btc1 btc2
08:30 < queip> good that 1 was bitcoin.  could gone with universe 1 and universe A
08:31 < gmaxwell> It was super shady that the b2x futures dropped like a lead balloon like an hour before the email canceling it.
08:33 < gmaxwell> speaking of drops
08:33 < gmaxwell> .tlast
08:33 < gmaxwell> ;;tlast
08:33 <@gribble> 18925.84
08:33 < buZz> see, called it
08:33 < buZz> 17:18:42 < buZz> no new ATH in 2020
08:33 < gmaxwell> buZz: we got more than a month to go.
08:33 < buZz> 3k in december? :D
08:34 < gmaxwell> nkuttler: but yeah, the forks were a huge pita and also extremely profitable.
08:35 < queip> buZz: we just need to tweet we after all confirm CSW is Satoshi and BSV is the way
08:35 < queip> breaking news from btc developers
08:35 < gmaxwell> I bet it would have no market effect.
08:35 < queip> in reality I think at least -30% as it catches traction of crypto press
08:36 < queip> interesting social experiment, 3rd reason to do it
08:36 < gmaxwell> Considering that there has been little to no price action over announcements of serious technical issues...
08:39 < queip> is bsv marketing even alive nowdays?
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08:39 < lnd-bot> [lndmon] carlaKC opened pull request #61: config: allow specifying of macaroon directory and name (master...macaroon-dir) https://github.com/lightninglabs/lndmon/pull/61
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08:41 < gmaxwell> the cultists are still making noise but it seems pretty dead.
08:41 < Emcy> >I actually went and rewrote the signing code for each one.
08:41 < Emcy> see how many people on earth can do this
08:41 < gmaxwell> well several people in here could do it, it's mostly copy and paste. Also I was being excessively paranoid.
08:42 < gmaxwell> and also didn't want to move all my bitcoin.
08:42 < Emcy> could you blame someone who known enough to know the risks of coin splitting, not to bother putting their btc at risk, even for 20%
08:42 < gmaxwell> but yeah, it's totally understandable.
08:42 < gmaxwell> also if you didn't have that much btc, it didn't pay that well
08:43 < gmaxwell> like if someone 'only' had a tenth of a bitcoin, then getting a couple percent of that might not have been worth the time.
08:43 < Emcy> sure
08:43 < gmaxwell> I hated doing it.
08:43 < Emcy> i can imagine
08:44 < Emcy> even if you know things inside out, it just takes a brain fart
08:44 < gmaxwell> but like, when else in my life have I been paid thousands of dollars an hour for sitting in my kitchen in my underwear.
08:44 < buZz> we assisted tons of people in here, to sign and move funds
08:44 < buZz> and restore them after obvious fuckups
08:45 < waxwing> also while 10-20% on a very non-volatile asset is too good to pass up, it's less so with an extremely volatile asset. i think a lot of the people who didn't bother were quite rational, taking into account all the factors.
08:45 < queip> gmaxwell: onlyfans+grindr
08:45 < gmaxwell> queip: not with my figure. :P
08:45 < buZz> airbuttandpenis
08:45 < queip> +opencv
08:45 < gmaxwell> haha
08:47 < Emcy> i was gonna say
08:47 < Emcy> guys dont pull in the big bux on those sites :p
08:48 < gmaxwell> man, see, we just figured out an actual application for genderswap image filter.
08:48 < queip> in future you don't even need to be anyone, just nvidia AI models
08:48 < buZz> bearded ladies on the other hand ..
08:49 < gmaxwell> now the fact that the ladies of text-chat-cybersex all being dudes can also apply to cams.
08:49 < queip> would be funny if nv would quit gfx card model to focus on AI onlyfans
08:49 < queip> market
08:49 < buZz> i worked at a pornproducer for some time (sysadmin) and the ppl with the most gorgeous voices operating those sexlines, were so hilariously ugly
08:50 < buZz> all fine ppl though
08:50 < queip> 2 sysadmins and new internet 1:15:00
08:50 < gmaxwell> buZz: I think being physically large probably improved the voice quality, more resonant. :)
08:50 < queip> 2 sysadmins and new intern 1:15:00
08:50 < Emcy> queip one of the highest viewed/paid accounts on chaturbate is a virtual anime character
08:50 < buZz> 2 sysadmin, 1 male-male usb cable
08:50 < Emcy> real women have been complaining about it bitterly lol
08:51 < queip> funny. though remember many did not asked for all this wymyn&anti-man world
08:51 < Emcy> https://images.xbiz.com/images/news/250195/680x383.jpg/t/1581528795
08:51 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ jpeg (680 x 383) ]
08:51 < Emcy> probably a dude behind it lmao
08:53 < gmaxwell> once men can convincely pretend to be women on cams I assume they'll take it over... plenty of pervy men that will do it for less income because they're getting off on it.
08:56 < Emcy> https://youtu.be/nMVH25rvjRc maybe its already happened
08:58 < gmaxwell> lol
08:59 < Emcy> hormones + voice training can eventually fool anyone
08:59 < Emcy> "magical anti-cis-tamines"
08:59 < gmaxwell> I think fwiw, bitcoin diamond is still like 6% or something like that, it's not obvious from the exchange rate because its a 10000x multiplier or something like that.
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09:01 < Emcy> are the chains even still moving for these forks
09:01 < gmaxwell> Does chatroulette still exist?
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09:01 < gmaxwell> Emcy: they're still on exchanges, so I assume?
09:02 < Emcy> i cant beleive theyre still trading
09:03 < gmaxwell> cost noting to keep them up basiclly, esp if you don't care if they're secure/working/etc.
09:04 < Emcy> you you think its weird that massive and obvious technical failure of these coins basically doesnt move price at all
09:04 < Emcy> its weird
09:05 < Emcy> even etherium died 2 weeks ago, and it wasnt priced in
09:06 < Emcy> like never mind the coins essentially being a form of fiat, the spot price itself as a seperate entity is pure fiat
09:06 < Emcy> so only bitcoin takes a price hit if something goes wrong huh?
09:08 < queip> gmaxwell: I know omegel or how it's called is up
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09:14 < Emcy> buZz i cant even watch the gangster party line on youtube without signing in anymore
09:14 < Emcy> they fixed the embed trick :(
09:15 < Emcy> going to the dogs
09:15 < queip> I've read YT now demands to show them gov ID card for some 18+ content
09:15 < queip> I hope this is the case, and YT can slowly die out among less normie users
09:15 < Emcy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx1J2CzNnS8
09:15 < gmaxwell> there is 18+ content on yt?
09:15 < Emcy> the phone number is real also, theres a site where you can play clips of ppl who called it
09:16 < gmaxwell> is that the garfield thing?
09:16 < Emcy> no its just a mild comedy video but now youtube is advertiser friendly so
09:16 < gmaxwell> no lol
09:16 < Emcy> oh
09:17 < Emcy> youtube has 18+ content?
09:17 < gmaxwell> I guess I did know that some things were restricted, e.g. the garfield thing I was referencing.
09:17 < queip> well Im not sure. Other "you must sign in" content doesnt require no such thing currently
09:17 < buZz> Emcy: not even with youtube-dl ?
09:17 < Emcy> i mean ive seen people getting killed and stuff on there before but theyre a lot better at taking that down now
09:18 < Emcy> youtube-dl is rip
09:19 < buZz> Emcy: youtube-dl is revived
09:19 < buZz> github said 'sorry' after EFF sent them a letter
09:19 < Emcy> lol
09:19 < queip> github restored it afaik
09:19 < Emcy> what a palaver
09:20 < gmaxwell> it's pretty funny watching all the bchers cheering on the miner dos attacking abc and saying they're a hero and stuff.
09:21 < gmaxwell> kinda tempte to go convince some bitcoin miner to do that to bch, just because the 180 deg flip would be funny.
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09:22 < gmaxwell> example thread: https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/k0gzyn/just_wanted_to_say_thank_you_to_the_anonymous_abc/
09:22 < Entitlement> gmaxwell - [ Just wanted to say thank you to the anonymous ABC miner! : btc ]
09:22 < Emcy> amaury should have known some bastardly miner would do something like that to his chain, because he trucked with them for so long and saw multiple hash wars
09:22 < gmaxwell> or maybe just dig up some old thread where they slander luke for doing something similar to CLC.
09:22 < gmaxwell> the dos is mostly ineffectual... just delaying txns somewhat.
09:22 < queip> most damage would be to publish chain B that reorgs last 10 blocks and at same time publish different chain B2 that reorgs 11 blocks but is mostly based on chain B right?
09:22 < gmaxwell> but cashies are crowing about it like it's a big victory.
09:23 < gmaxwell> queip: yea, you can permasplit bcash that way.
09:23 < queip> so some nodes follow B, some B2, and some are commited to original (A) because that is what they seen and finalized
09:23 < queip> double power for 11 blocks, including tripple power for like 2 blocks at end
09:23 < gmaxwell> and for optimal damage map the network and try to make sure each partition contains some miners and some big exchanges.
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09:23 < Emcy> speak of the devil
09:24 < queip> wouldn't you need eclipse
09:24 < queip> or.. ok yea
09:24 < gmaxwell> queip: no because you can just transfer the forks basically all at once.
09:24 < queip> I guess spamming txes to fill 32 MB at 10 and 11 th block to slow down propagation too?
09:25 < gmaxwell> like open ten connections, send a block on each except for the last byte. then give out the last bytes in the orders you want them  seen.
09:25 < gmaxwell> you can also advertise blocks to nodes you don't want to get them, then don't send them and force them to time you out.
09:25 < gmaxwell> you can't get 100% targeting but you can get pretty close.
09:26 < gmaxwell> e.g. I offer fork a and b to every node in the network. they'll all request them from me. Then I only reply to the one I want them to have.
09:26 < gmaxwell> if someone else gets and offers, they won't request until they time out
09:27 < gmaxwell> if the attacker is really successful they'll get half the exchanges and half the hashpower into each partition. They might run for a while and not even notice.
09:28 < gmaxwell> then they won't be able to resolve it because either side costs someone a lot of money.
09:28 < gmaxwell> so aybe it turns into BCHN1 and BCHN2 after that. :P
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09:30 < gmaxwell> esp if you were borrowing a moderate sized bitcoin pool so you could add another 100% of bch's hashrate, you could keep each side going at 10 minutes per block.
09:31 < Emcy> if it hasnt happened by now it probably wont
09:31 < Emcy> theyve had the stupid 10 block window thing for 2 years
09:33 -!- kristapsk_ is now known as kristapsk
09:34 < Emcy> >I'd rather have BCH and see it grow steadily than not having any and watch it grow parabolically. I missed out on $350 BTC and I'm not making that mistake twice.
09:35 < gmaxwell> Emcy: namecoin went like 4 years with zero security before it got attacked.
09:35 < Emcy> i bet this warped 2nd chance fomo stuff drives a lot of what keeps bch going
09:35 < Emcy> yeah but namecoin was uncontroversial
09:36 < Emcy> bcash is controversial but not enough for anyone to divert some btc hashpower to attack it it seems
09:37 < Emcy> maybe if theyd accepted the ifp as a direct attack on btc miners that would have happened. maybe that did happen
09:41 < Emcy> midnight look what i ran into https://a.uguu.se/JtnSAFrp.png
09:41 < Entitlement> Emcy - [ png (614 x 265) ]
09:41 < Emcy> i did a double take lol
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12:21 <@midnight> Emcy: that would be infuriating. I would be targetting that user and only that user in every possible way, forever.
12:21 -!- mode/#bitcoin-forks [-o midnight] by midnight
12:22 < midnight> The rules say we can't target the user inside the user's own faction territory, but they don't say anything about targetting him on the battlefront.
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12:55 < midnight> Emcy: please tell me you returned the favour and showed him what ps2 was all about, because then it implies he doesn't play very much or is a newb and it's more likely it was actually him
13:04 < queip> what game is that anyway?
13:09 < queip> some big AWS part failed and notably cippled ETH 2.0 ?
13:25 < grubles> us-east-1 had an outage i guess
13:26 < grubles> and it affected some eth2 thing on infura
13:26 < grubles> eth2 testnet
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14:21 < pigeons> Wow they really have never changed their complexity and misdirection and vaporware game: https://www.trustnodes.com/2020/11/19/vitalik-buterin-ditches-sharding
14:21 < Entitlement> pigeons - [ Vitalik Buterin Ditches Sharding – Trustnodes ]
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15:05 < andytoshi> i finally got around to exposing the borromean ring sigs that gmaxwell wrote as part of the elements rangeproofs 5 years ago https://github.com/ElementsProject/secp256k1-zkp/pull/110
15:05 < Entitlement> andytoshi - [ Expose Borromean ring signature and de-anonymization functionality by apoelstra ... ]
15:05 < andytoshi> istr some years ago we had some interesting thoughts about how to use these
15:08 < queip> "secp256k1_gej *pubs;" will give a chuckle all polish readers ;)
15:09 < andytoshi> will it? we've been using that type and that variable name for many years :P
15:09 < queip> it means "secp256k1 is gay"
15:09 < andytoshi> this is why i come to #bitcoin-forks for crypto review :)
15:09 < queip> what it stands for in the code btw?
15:10 < andytoshi> gej is "Group Element in Jacobian coordinates"
15:13 < queip> why leave  it as TODO, to switch secp256k1_memcmp_var to constant time?
15:13 < queip> (assuming it is up for review as is)
15:15 < andytoshi> because it's a very minor issue, and a PITA to fix, and the signing code itself is already not constant-time with respect to the signer index
15:21 < queip> andytoshi: maybe a nit pick, but if you care to validate some inputs like pointers != NULL, wouldn't it make sense to check integers are in reasonable range,  for some theoretical attempts to overflow
15:23 < andytoshi> what does "reasonable range" mean?
15:25 < andytoshi> the only integers passed into these functions are buffer sizes
15:25 < queip> things like n_pubkeys. maybe define it. and set to like million, or to things >>4 from what you think could overflow
15:25 < andytoshi> why can't you have a million pubkeys?
15:25 < buZz> you totally can
15:26 < andytoshi> queip: there are probably some places where you can get overflow by setting n_pubkeys so close to the limit of size_t, that when i multiply by the pubkey size, that triggers an overflow
15:26 < queip> this lib intends to support 32 bit architectures, or only ones with size_t >=64 bit?
15:27 < andytoshi> but the result will be well-defined and will simply cause the code to return 0
15:27 < andytoshi> hmm i should check on that actually
15:29 < queip> for 32b, as small as 134 million overflows.  probably /2 if someone does unneeded "signed", and some margin of safety and it might make sense to clearly define max number on this to be around 10-60 millions. e.g. nice round 16777216
15:30 < andytoshi> lol i am not going to hardcode a max value based on assumptions about the architecture
15:30 < queip> some would say this is not needed nick picking. but there again, we then hit bugs like msg len overflow exploit in early OTR lib
15:30 < andytoshi> i'll just check for overflow and make sure the code bails out if it happens
15:31 < queip> sounds good too. this is lowest level right? so some actuall coin and protocol would impose other limits
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16:35 < grubles> https://www.talospace.com/2020/11/guix-port-to-openpower.html
16:35 < Entitlement> grubles - [ Guix port to OpenPOWER ]
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16:37 < lnd-bot> [lnd] wpaulino opened pull request #4804: discovery: adhere to proper channel chunk splitting for ReplyChannelRange (master...proper-gossip-query-reply-chunk-splitting) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/4804
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16:43 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef merged pull request #4752: features+invoices: force MPP payload inclusion for non-keysend payments (master...require-payment-addr) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/4752
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16:43 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef pushed 8 commits to master: https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/compare/ef503bf14e66...8921f81d979f
16:43 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 82ccab6 Olaoluwa Osuntokun: feature: flip the required bit for payment addr in invoices/payload
16:43 < lnd-bot> lnd/master baeceb2 Olaoluwa Osuntokun: lnwire: add new RequiresFeature method
16:43 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 530059f Olaoluwa Osuntokun: invoices: force MPP payload inclusion for non-keysend payments
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16:47 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef merged pull request #4777: GitHub: build release binaries and upload to release (master...gh-release-build) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/4777
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16:47 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef pushed 3 commits to master: https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/compare/8921f81d979f...7c6db24b89b8
16:47 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 4246238 Oliver Gugger: GitHub: build release binaries and upload to release
16:47 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 8fea653 Oliver Gugger: release: skip version check in automated builds
16:47 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 7c6db24 Olaoluwa Osuntokun: Merge pull request #4777 from guggero/gh-release-build
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17:02 < lnd-bot> [lnd] cfromknecht opened pull request #4805: Makefile: set NUM_PARALLEL_TRANCHES to 1 (master...parallel-one-itest) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/4805
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17:07 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef merged pull request #4786: discovery: rate limit incoming channel updates (master...rate-limit-channel-updates) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/4786
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17:07 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef pushed 2 commits to master: https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/compare/7c6db24b89b8...cefbf5f63711
17:07 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 791ba3e Wilmer Paulino: discovery: rate limit incoming channel updates
17:07 < lnd-bot> lnd/master cefbf5f Olaoluwa Osuntokun: Merge pull request #4786 from wpaulino/rate-limit-channel-updates
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18:19 < queip> @brian_armstrong is good?  https://twitter.com/brian_armstrong/status/1331744884856741888?s=20  This proposed regulation would, we think, require financial institutions like Coinbase to verify the recipient/owner of the self-hosted wallet, collecting identifying information on that party, before a withdrawal could be sent to that self-hosted wallet.
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18:40 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef merged pull request #3367: Batched graph updates (master...batched-graph-updates) https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/pull/3367
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18:41 < lnd-bot> [lnd] Roasbeef pushed 8 commits to master: https://github.com/lightningnetwork/lnd/compare/cefbf5f63711...7e298f143425
18:41 < lnd-bot> lnd/master fb9218d Conner Fromknecht: discovery/gossiper: channel announcements can't be outdated
18:41 < lnd-bot> lnd/master d1634b5 Conner Fromknecht: batch: add external batching engine for bbolt operations
18:41 < lnd-bot> lnd/master 9cfe08c Conner Fromknecht: channeldb/graph: split out cache updates for policy changes
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19:32 < queip> !tall
19:32 < queip> !tlast
19:32 <@gribble> Bitstamp BTCUSD last: 17350.01, vol: 10012.16 | Bitfinex BTCUSD last: 17382.0, vol: 15755.45 | Gemini BTCUSD last: 17308.78, vol: 2935.12 | Volume-weighted last average: 17363.35
19:32 <@gribble> 17263.61
19:35 < queip> bch tried to warn us
19:35 < queip> if only we listened
19:43 < queip> .price bch btc
19:43 < deb0rah> binance 0.01582300 [-11.68%] | bittrex 0.01576995 [-11.99%] | southxchange 0.01646674 [-9.82%] | livecoin 0.01560011 [-9.98%] | hitbtc 0.01583900 [-11.52%] | bleutrade 0.01569588 [-9.42%] | graviex 0.01750425 [-7.87%] | poloniex 0.01586498 [-11.90%] | kraken 0.01582000 [-12.50%] |
19:43 < queip> heh
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20:47 < gmaxwell> queip: standard pattern, the shitcoins that come along with bitcoin's rises tend to drop harder and longer when bitcoin drops.
21:29 < Hash> What is a shitcoin?
21:30 < Hash> Don't kill me.
21:35 < lemmi> Hash: all the unnecessary forks that don't add anything valuable to the game
21:38 < Hash> https://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-drops-1000-sharpest-decline-3-weeks
21:38 < Entitlement> Hash - [ Bitcoin Price Drops $1,000 Before Recovering in Sharpest Sell-Off in 3 Weeks - C... ]
21:39 < Hash> What is your prediction for bitcoin?
21:39 < lemmi> well, not limited to forks. any coin really that is just some variant on current ideas, that isn't really changing anything nor providing a good playground for actual research
21:41 < lemmi> is this considered news?
21:41 < Hash> https://coinmarketcap.com/new/
21:41 < Entitlement> Hash - [ New Cryptocurrencies Listed Today And This Week | CoinMarketCap ]
21:42 < Hash> jeezua
21:45 < Hash> https://twitter.com/Transpersonal/status/1331829961519370240
21:45 < Hash> Hodl on. Otherwise you'll regret not having btc when it's $500k or higher
21:45 < Hash> LOL
21:47 < lemmi> under the assumption that bitcoin actually spreads in usage, that number isn't too ridicolous. but that might still take a while to get there
22:05 < gmaxwell> Welcome to the channel lemmi and hash, I don't think I've seen you here before.
22:06 < gmaxwell> Hash: yeah, as lemmi said, basically stuff that exists to ride on the hype of cryptocurrency... which don't have much other than hype going for them.
22:08 < lemmi> gmaxwell: i'm not *exactly* new here. but i just checked my logs and i have been idling since i joined in january :D
22:09 < Hash> gmaxwell: it's me!
22:09 < Hash> chmod/chown/Hash/EnchanterTim
22:10 < Hash> What sort of man am I who can make fire without flint and tinder?!
22:10 < lemmi> gmaxwell: but thanks for the welcome :D
22:13 < gmaxwell> If you're feeling fire after using tinder, you should probably see a doctor.
22:16 < Hash> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPGf6RebLhM
22:16 < Hash> lemmy
22:16 < Hash> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJzSVD1YkHc
22:16 < Hash> Who would win in a wrestling match, Lemmy or God?
22:17 < Hash> I'm old. I know 90s movies.
22:18 < Hash> trick quewstion!
22:18 < Hash> lemmi is god! ha.
22:19 < lemmi> wait.. i don't know that movie
22:20  * lemmi appends it to the list
22:21 < gmaxwell> never seen it either, presuably because it has Adam Sandler and I've seldom found him funny. :)
22:24 < Emcy> gosh i hope the new bill & ted film isnt shit
22:25 < gmaxwell> omg there is going to be a new bill and ted film?
22:25 < gmaxwell> unpopular opinion: I liked bogus journey.
22:25 < cncr04s> There was a new one released this year
22:26 < gmaxwell> NO WAY
22:26 < Emcy> https://youtu.be/1gPGeAYo3yU
22:26 < cncr04s> yes way
22:26 < Emcy> yeah but now theyre like 40
22:26 < cncr04s> 50
22:26 < gmaxwell> EXCELLENT!
22:27 < Emcy> but is ti good
22:27 < gmaxwell> I mean, does it have to be /good/ to be enjoyable?
22:28 < cncr04s> I didnt think it was a waste of time to watch
22:28 < Emcy> i mean does it respect the source material
22:28 < Emcy> mainly
22:28 < Emcy> thats all i want
22:28 < cncr04s> its enyoyable if you are nostalgic about the orignals
22:28 < gmaxwell> good enough for me
22:29 < Emcy> whoa its already released
22:29 < Emcy> months ago lol
22:29 < cncr04s> reboot and or remake seems to be the thing these days
22:29 < Emcy> when all the cinemas were closed
22:29 < Emcy> bogus dude!
22:31 < Emcy> Budget	$25 million[1]
22:31 < Emcy> Box office	$38.1 million[2][3]
22:31 < Emcy> keanu reeves must have done this practically for free
22:48 < Emcy> ;;tlast
22:48 <@gribble> 17941.22
22:48 < Emcy> number go down
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23:10 < midnight> i liked the first one; the obnoxius live-action series with the bad replacements was. so terrible. :(
--- Log closed Thu Nov 26 00:00:27 2020