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10:54 < kanzure> All this moving around makes me forget things.
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11:30 < kanzure> https://www.lib.utexas.edu/etd/d/2007/kurtoglut41118/kurtoglut41118.pdf 
11:30 < kanzure> "A computational approach to innovative conceptual design" (Tolga Kurtoglu, 2007)
11:30 < kanzure> Seems to be an explanation of Matt Campbell's work at the Automated Design Lab, under the disguise of a student's thesis.
11:31 < kanzure> basically it uses a "graph grammar", which seems to just mean a text-based interface to graph manipulation, where the graph represents some functional system that is being designed
11:32 < kanzure> page 82 (offset: +20) shows that they just throw the components into a big pot, get out about 8000 results for that particular problem, then apply special algorithms or parameters or something to sort through the generated designs to come up with something good
11:33 < kanzure> which sounds like a good time to mention the 'semantic search facilitator' project / autogoogler thingy, but I realize that I don't actually have any code for it (oops)
11:40 < kanzure> Hm. I was going somewhere with that. 
11:58 < kanzure> oh, maybe it was something about the fablab plans. Since fablab has all of their software up on their site for various CAM/CAD conversions, modeling and so on, it might be interesting to throw the full toolchain together from 'semantic search facilitator' or their 'automated' design methodology (just generate everything) and wire it into 'fablab'/fabuntu
12:01  * kanzure wonders if you can map 3D space into a filesystem (plan9?) so that /mnt/maxtor/ would refer to the physical hard drive location
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12:57 < kanzure> Hey pks.
13:10 < pks> howdy
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13:49 < kanzure> ybit: Do you have literature access now?
13:50 < kanzure> I was thinking of making a zip with the papers cited in http://www.neuroinf.org/pipermail/comp-neuro/2008-July/000922.html but I'm not sure I want to do it at the moment.
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14:00 < ybit> kanzure, yeah, i do, i've had accesss for awhile now
14:54 < pks> did any of you enter that io9.com "build a lifeform" contest?
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15:01 < kanzure> pks: I might have. I don't remember.
15:02 < kanzure> some of us were talking about submitting some stuffs to them
15:02 < kanzure> did we get around to that or not?
15:05 < pks> hm, speaking of that, spore is coming out shortly (sept 7th)
15:14 < kanzure> Somebody was talking with me about Spore at ArmadilloCon, he was pointing out that Spore kind of screwed up a bit
15:14 < kanzure> they should be making it a bit more of a GA with more incentives for user generated content
15:14 < kanzure> or something, I wish I had his idea written down
15:23 < pks> a GA?
15:24 < kanzure> genetic algorithm
15:24 < kanzure> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetic_algorithms
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15:33 < kanzure> Hey newgenome.
15:33 < newgenome> yup
15:44 < pks> I've never seen Drew Endy talk about transhumanism
15:45 < pks> but I'm pretty sure he's a proponent
15:45 < pks> he's hinted at it in a few interviews
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15:48 < kanzure> pks: I've noticed the same as well.
15:49 < pks> have you read "the singularity is near" kanzure?
15:49 < kanzure> yes
15:49 < kanzure> btw, the singularity is near has a dedication in the front
15:50 < kanzure> or maybe it's the "thanks"
15:50 < kanzure> but it's to "David Dalrymple"
15:50 < kanzure> David has showed up in here a few times before :)
15:50 < kanzure> so the book is kind of a "must know" thingy
15:50 < kanzure> even if it's kinda wrong
15:50 < pks> I just started it...
15:50 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/fernhout/ for a critique of the singularity is near from a F/OSS perspective
15:50 < kanzure> oh
15:50 < kanzure> well, carry on :)
15:51 < pks> I feel like Kurzweil is too optimistic about tech implants for humans
15:51 < kanzure> what's he saying?
15:51 < kanzure> or give me a page number
15:52 < pks> one sec, I'll see if I can find a specific example
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15:55 < pks> meh, I can't find a specific example without rereading
15:57 < kanzure> we were digesting the book like rabid enzymes back up in California for the summer project
15:58 < pks> lol
15:58 < pks> what summer project?
15:58 < pks> and I like the biopunk-esque analogy
15:59 < kanzure> I was working for the Singularity Institute on "The Uncertain Future", a site that would help users reason about probability distributions for their expectations of the developments of various awesome technologies such as ai, intelligence augmentation, multigeneration in vitro embryo selection, neuromorphic ai, brain simulation, etc.
16:00 < pks> cool
16:00 < pks> did you meet eliezer yudkowsky?
16:00 < kanzure> yes
16:00 < pks> i have a bunch of respect for that guy
16:00 < kanzure> I see.
16:01 < pks> that's....ambiguous
16:01 < Nofaris_> What do you see?
16:01 < kanzure> Eliezer was surrounded by people that couldn't go five minutes without mentioning his name. 
16:01 < kanzure> It was a ... cult.
16:01 < kanzure> an ai cult ;-)
16:01 < pks> haha
16:02 < kanzure> "Quick! Let's check overcomingbias!"
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16:10 < Nofaris> Where does the name kanzure come from?
16:13 < Nade> all this stuff is a long way off
16:15 < kanzure> Nofaris: 2003-05-21 --> http://forum.thegamecreators.com/?m=forum_view&t=7659&b=2
16:15 < kanzure> I know that being young is no excuse for being stupid, but I was pretty stupid, so please be kind when reading that post.
16:15 < kanzure> (I was 13)
16:15 < kanzure> Nade: Intelligence augmentation isn't all that far off especially since we can simulate brains and do implants and so on.
16:15 < kanzure> multigeneration in vitro embryo selection is easily done
16:16 < kanzure> Brain simulation just needs more hardware -- some researchers have it basically "down to an art" but don't have the scaleup required. Markram was thinking of doing direct circuits in FPGAs or even outside of FPGAs to represent each of the algorithms and so on.
16:16 < kanzure> to get the speed/computations he needs.
16:16 < pks> have you ever made a game kanzure?
16:16 < kanzure> oh yes, many
16:16 < pks> you have them online?
16:17 < kanzure> I've lost many of them over the years, but let me see.
16:17 < kanzure> http://web.archive.org/web/*/morph.hey.nu/dbzinsane/ was my 2D DBZ RPG
16:17 < kanzure> http://web.archive.org/web/*/devskills.sytes.net/7k/ was my 2D space shooter 
16:18 < kanzure> http://web.archive.org/web/*/animeu.hey.nu/grak/ was my 2D MMORPG :-). It got to the point where I was buying out some art, music, etc.
16:18 < kanzure> I still know the artist, Blake, and the musician, Vincent, as well as a few of the people who were helping me do the programming. 
16:19 < kanzure> most of the code is locked on an old laptop hdd that has either died or lost an old IDE cable or something
16:19 < pks> that's cool
16:19 < kanzure> I also had a 3D adventure game going in "Dark Basic" when I was 12, until somebody clued me into some real programming and I hung out on the allegro.cc community for a few years
16:19 < pks> usually amateur mmos don't amount to anything, they're wayyy too difficult and time consuming
16:19 < kanzure> well, 
16:19 < kanzure> I was stupid and had OOP madness
16:20 < kanzure> "Everything's an object!"
16:20 < pks> well I think games are the optimal way to teach certain kinds of material
16:20 < kanzure> it didn't go too well :)
16:20 < kanzure> was slow, laggy, lua scripting + tons of objects => failure
16:20 < pks> yeah, none of them do though
16:20 < kanzure> right
16:20 < kanzure> one of my favorites was a dysfunctional game where you would try to draw a path to pop the most balloons with a straight line, or something
16:21 < kanzure> there was some feature where you had to click the balloons/circles 
16:21 < kanzure> and it was supposedly novel gameplay
16:21 < kanzure> but it must have been too novel since I've now forgotten what the hell I was doing
16:21 < kanzure> one of those "do a game in 48 hours" things ;-)
16:21 < pks> yeah
16:21 < pks> I want something like Iron Chef for game development
16:22 < pks> make a game in like 5 hours
16:22 < kanzure> an angry chinese man yelling at you?
16:22 < pks> it would be neat to see some higher profile designers doing something small and unique
16:27 < kanzure> no arguments there
16:40  * kanzure has somewhat fixed calendar.pl .. http://heybryan.org/projects/calendar/
16:41 < kanzure> I'm currently testing with two origin events that conflict with one another. Followed by two more which do not conflict. I haven't tried three conflicting events all at the same time .. I'm assuming this works since a three-conflict is just broken up into a conflict, followed by another conflict on the next recursion down anyway, right?
16:55 < fenn> pks: wil wright's "small and unique" game: http://www.stupidfunclub.com/
17:00 < Nofaris> Weird
17:01 < kanzure> so, would somebody be willing to break my calendar.pl script for me?
17:01 < kanzure> I guess I need to come up with an interface for making new events now
17:01 < kanzure> it's not that hard to figure out the file format
17:03  * kanzure just got the Singularity Summit 2008 announcement email
17:03 < fenn> which yaml library should i get?
17:04 < kanzure> I just did cpan -i YAML
17:04  * fenn tries libyaml-perl
17:05 < kanzure> um, just in case I was being stupid
17:05 < kanzure> I reuploaded calendar2.pl
17:05 < kanzure> I don't know if I uploaded it after I shouted hurray
17:05  * fenn grumbles something about git
17:05 < kanzure> rawr
17:06 < kanzure> where was that cheatsheet I had .. hm ..
17:06 < fenn> it seems that lately everything i do sends this poor laptop into fits
17:06 < kanzure> clean the fan?
17:07 < fenn> fan? what fan?
17:07 < fenn> it doesn't lock up, just 100% cpu usage for like 5 minutes upon installing a package
17:07 < kanzure> I have two
17:07 < kanzure> (fans)
17:08 < kanzure> note that it's a pentium 4 hyperthreading beast, so this thing generates heat faster than a soldering iron
17:08 < fenn> old lappy, i just bought a new micro-atx board so lets hope it works
17:09 < kanzure> also, in the running dir don't forget to mkdir calendars
17:09 < kanzure> wait
17:09 < kanzure> no, that's the old version
17:09 < kanzure> no mkdir required.
17:09 < fenn> it said something about genesis.evt but didnt make any files
17:09 < kanzure> correct
17:10 < kanzure> genesis.evt is just something I was using to make sure all the schedules were originally the same variable
17:10 < kanzure> it doesn't generate files because I'm just printing it out, line 111 should be the open/close file handling routines of lines 137-140 inclusive
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17:13 < kanzure> hi hi hi
17:14 < fenn> so, it sees a conflict between 1 and 2, is it supposed to do something about it?
17:14 < kanzure> it should do something about it
17:14 < kanzure> you should see: genesis.evt,1.evt,3.evt
17:14 < kanzure> and genesis.evt,2.evt,3.evt
17:14 < fenn> no genesis.evt
17:15 < kanzure> do you see the lines saying: "Hm. It must be done: " in the output?
17:15 < fenn> i'm running calendar2.pl btw
17:15 < fenn> Hm. It must be done: genesis.evt,2.evt,3.evt
17:15 < fenn> ok, so uh, that was the output right?
17:15 < kanzure> right
17:15 < kanzure> there should be one that has s/2/1/ in the output too ...
17:17 < fenn> i think its needs a pointy clicky :)
17:17 < kanzure> bah! mortals!
17:19 < kanzure> wget http://heybryan.org/projects/calendar/calendar2.pl --output-document=calendar2.pl 
17:19 < kanzure> has better output now
17:19 < kanzure> and uhh, if I can remember how to name initialize this git repository
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17:24 < fenn> may i suggest using unix timestamps instead of local time?
17:25 < kanzure> I was googling around for good stuff and couldn't find much
17:26 < ybit> kanzure, why were you wondering if i still had access to online journals?
17:26 < kanzure> ybit: maybe you wanted to eat the files
17:27 < ybit> ah, i do, but no room right now 
17:27 < ybit> which reminds me, i need to order the power supply today
17:27  * ybit is off to eat with family
17:32 < kanzure> fenn: git clone http://heybryan.org/projects/calendar/calendar.git
17:32 < kanzure> *maybe*
17:36 < kanzure> fenn: can you find me how to implement unix timestamps?
17:36 < kanzure> oh
17:36 < kanzure> you're talking about the files?
17:37 < kanzure> I thought you meant lines 10 and 11 heh'
17:44 < kanzure> hm
17:44 < kanzure> http://www.utexas.edu/oncampus/calendar/20080830/e5231
17:44 < kanzure> take a look at the "Download" linkage
17:44 < kanzure> http://www.utexas.edu/oncampus/calendar/save/20080830/e5231
17:45 < kanzure> it's a somewhat usable format, hurray
17:47 < pks> http://lolcode.com/
17:47 < kanzure> is bkero multiplying?
17:51 < kanzure> oh
17:51 < kanzure> it's iCalendar format
17:51 < kanzure> for the iPhone.
17:51 < kanzure> huh
17:51 < kanzure> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICalendar RFC 2245 
17:51 < kanzure> 2445
17:55 < kanzure> should I just use vcal format or stick with me yaml?
17:55 < kanzure> either way I'll have a user interface that hides the file format anyway
17:56 < kanzure>  http://www.perl.com/pub/a/2005/08/18/ical_dot.html 'A somewhat trivial example of this sort of creation is an application that converts iCalendar data into a directed graph, readable by an application such as GraphViz'
17:56  * kanzure wonders about graph grammars for manipulating calendars
17:59 < kanzure> http://thegestalt.org/simon/perl/ics2graphviz
18:02 < kanzure> assuming this works, how about some scoring metrics ?
18:32 < fenn> kanzure: unix time stamps: perl -e 'print time . "\n"'
18:34 < fenn> avoids all those nasty time zone issues
18:48 < elias`> 3~
18:49 < elias`> shouldn't have had this window in focus anyway :s
18:57 < kanzure> the university goes to great lengths to make it a pain to get their course listing database
18:57 < kanzure> although I see some human contents in the HTML, so there's at least a human on the other side
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20:21 < Nade> anyone ever built a brain machine?
20:21 < Nade> or dream machine
20:21 < kanzure> Which one?
20:22 < Nade> those flashing led type sunglasses
20:22 < kanzure> Hm.
20:22 < Nade> i was a bit bored so i've been playing with an arduino :)
20:23 < Nade> i got the leds flashing and i've tried several different frequencies but they're not having much effect on me
20:23 < kanzure> you could make some electrodes :-)
20:23 < kanzure> heh
20:23 < kanzure> remember, it's also possible that it's bullshit
20:23 < Nade> that is quite likely
20:24 < Nade> althogh aparently there's some science behind it
20:28 < Nade> i guess i found out that i'm not really epileptic
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21:11 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/~bbishop/docs/courses.html
21:11 < kanzure> The dataset is tainted now that mostly everything is closed, but meh.
21:12 < kanzure> I guess we can randomly populate the open/close statuses for testing purposes.
21:40 < kanzure> sometime earlier today the idea came to me that you could fake "mind uploading" in a geeky way by having a live cd with neuroscience software on it
21:41 < kanzure> "brain on a disc" and dazzle some people
22:07 < fenn> call it 'uprap'
22:08 < kanzure> rap?
22:09 < fenn> like reprap, because it's not really mind uploading
22:09 < kanzure> why is reprap with a rap anyway
22:09 < fenn> but you can issue press releases all you want
22:09 < kanzure> this is appealing
22:09 < fenn> rap for rapid prototyper
22:09 < kanzure> see! see!
22:10  * kanzure notes the easy linux live cd creator scripts out there
22:12 < fenn> use fsv for the file browser and 99% of people will be astounded
22:12 < kanzure> fsv?
22:12 < fenn> like in jurassic park
22:12 < kanzure> http://nooface.net/3dui.shtml
22:13 < kanzure> ooh
22:13 < kanzure> yep
22:20 < kanzure> http://www.linux-live.org/#
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22:26 < ybit> wow, how did you know that fenn
22:26 < kanzure> Hey Chris.
22:26 < ybit> ...that fsv was used in jurassic park
22:27  * kanzure doesn't actually know who ChrisMT is
22:29 < fenn> ybit: because it says 'as seen in jurassic park' on just about every reference to fsn on the internet
22:30 < ybit> fenn: hehe
22:30 < ybit> guess it makes sense
22:31 < ybit> xcruiser is nice
22:31 < ybit> it was with some version of damn small linux i used once
22:32 < fenn> there was another 3d filesystem browser for irix called "button"-something  that was actually useful
22:33 < fenn> good lord they're still making irix and people are actually releasing new software for it
22:35 < kanzure> wikipedia says otherwise
22:35 < kanzure> halted in 2006 by SIG
22:35 < kanzure> except for people with bug bucks
22:35 < kanzure> guess that counts.
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22:46 < ybit> http://www.csistick.com/details.html
22:49 < kanzure> uhm, encryption?
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23:22 < kanzure> Hi lkj
23:23 -!- lkj is now known as ybit
23:28 < kanzure> btw,
23:28 < kanzure> I just uploaded 200 MB of neuro papers
23:28 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/~bbishop/docs/neuro/
23:28 < kanzure> Have fun.
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