--- Day changed Wed Oct 29 2008 00:13 < xp_prg> ppk what up man? 00:20 < kanzure_> Argh. 00:20 < kanzure_> Microsoft's latest commercials of "I'm a PC" consists of people sending in their webcam vids 00:20 < kanzure_> at the end of the commercial, it's 00:20 < kanzure_> "UPLOAD YOURSELF @ MICROSOFT.COM" 00:21 < kanzure_> t54r 00:21 < kanzure_> oops .. threw keyboard. 00:33 < bkero> lol jon hodgman 00:33 < bkero> is a dick 00:33 < kanzure_> ? 00:33 < kanzure_> Context? 00:34 < bkero> You said "I'm a PC" 00:34 < kanzure_> I don't get it. 00:34 < bkero> I watched his TED talk, and his Daily Show interview. 00:34 < bkero> He acted like a dick on both occasions. 00:39 < kanzure_> How does that make him a PC? 00:40 < bkero> He plays the role of a PC in the Apple ad campaign. 00:41 < kanzure_> The PC has a TED talk? How ironic. 00:42 < kanzure_> Haha. News flash. Showing the stories "at 11". "Tired of people stealing your presidential ads? See how one woman solved it ... .. I figure they can't steal my grass". ON THE CONTRARY. :) 00:43 * kanzure_ pictures goons stealing sections of grass. 00:48 < bkero> Sneaky goons 01:39 < xp_prg> ppk where are you man?! 03:41 < gene_> you there Kanzure? 04:09 < gene__> you there kanzure? 04:09 < gene__> can I have the powerpoint that is improved so I can add to it 04:45 < gene__> kanzure, I found a new seperation technique 04:56 < wrldpc> Does anyone read http://everything2.com/ ? 05:11 < gene__> Kanzure 05:11 < gene__> you there? 07:26 < fenn> lol winblows http://www.intelliadmin.com/blog/2008/10/smb-vulnerablity-found-emergency-patch.html 08:36 < UtopiahGHML> anybody made something out of biobricks so far? 08:37 < UtopiahGHML> sth physical I mean 09:14 < UtopiahGHML> kanzure_: http://seedea.free.fr/wiki/index.php?n=Oimp.CAST since you said "so, as to what you're looking for, that's, optimally, what I should have been doing for the past three or four years" 09:22 < fenn> should rename it "clippy" 09:23 < UtopiahGHML> I don't remember you could edit the suggestions from "Clippy" 09:23 < UtopiahGHML> what is your suggestion anyway? 09:23 < fenn> i just think it's a bad idea 09:24 < fenn> i want the computer to get out of my fucking way 99% of the time 09:24 < UtopiahGHML> it's not instrusive, as said in the page you can ignore it 09:24 < fenn> not true, i can't ignore anything 09:25 < UtopiahGHML> and the more you ignore it, the less it proposes anything 09:25 < UtopiahGHML> (see the treshold level based on user response) 09:26 < fenn> i'd rather have a bell i could ring to summon the servant 09:27 < UtopiahGHML> my point : if you want to suggest sth do it, if you want to say sth is bad and you could do this instead Im listening. 09:28 < fenn> i often press the 'tab' key to complete a word, it's automatic/reflexive, doesn't change on me "adaptively" 09:28 < UtopiahGHML> how do you think the dictionnary of word is created if not based on your usage? 09:28 < fenn> it's based on the possible choices 09:29 < UtopiahGHML> well check the algo in Vim or other FOSS that propose completion 09:29 < UtopiahGHML> they are often ordered based on your usage 09:29 < UtopiahGHML> (also FF awesome bar, Vimperator completion, etc) 09:29 < fenn> i havent used vim completion, but i'd be surprised if it changed on you 09:30 < UtopiahGHML> it does "change" on you, it's empty when you start a document 09:30 < UtopiahGHML> if I type blabla uto[C^N] it does nothing 09:30 < UtopiahGHML> if I type blabla utopiah uto[C^N] it completes with utopiah 09:31 < fenn> nope it always picksthe first word in the doc 09:31 < fenn> foo fwee frob f^N gives me a list: foo fwee frob 09:31 < fenn> even if i pick fwee multiple times 09:32 < UtopiahGHML> well the list is still based on your usage 09:32 < UtopiahGHML> have you type chinese pinyin ? 09:32 < UtopiahGHML> or japanese kanji 09:32 < fenn> yes 09:32 < UtopiahGHML> they are ordered based on frequency of usage 09:32 < fenn> i think that depends on what software you are using 09:33 < fenn> bah i can never remember how to enable it 09:33 < UtopiahGHML> your point being? 09:33 < fenn> point being: it's quite possible to ignore good UI design 09:33 < UtopiahGHML> (to go back to having computer assistance on current task) 09:35 < UtopiahGHML> so, what should I do? 09:36 < fenn> make a list of possible actions that doesn't change (this can be ordered by frequency of usage ahead of time, as long as it's not "adaptive") 09:36 < fenn> at least it shouldn't change without explicitly being told to change 09:37 < UtopiahGHML> (oh btw is there a way to have statistics on corrections applied thanks to FF dictionnaries?) 09:37 < fenn> i have no idea 09:37 < UtopiahGHML> Id love to have the list of my top mistakes! 09:38 < fenn> maybe you type "teh" all the time and dont even know it :) 09:38 < UtopiahGHML> well I don't use autocorrect so I guess Id know it 09:39 < UtopiahGHML> personnal -> personal etc... 09:39 < fenn> since google translate began working with japanese text, i've forgotten all my kanji :\ 09:39 < UtopiahGHML> have you tried https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/7208 ? 09:39 < UtopiahGHML> Kanji-lish : Firefox add-on that allows you to practice Japanese kanji while you read English (or other languages). 09:40 < fenn> kanjilish? i just looked at that yesterday, sounds interesting 09:40 < fenn> i'd rather do something with squid since i hate FF 09:40 < UtopiahGHML> basically your suggestion is to have a fixed behavior from the software part? 09:40 < fenn> yes 09:40 < fenn> deterministic 09:41 < UtopiahGHML> well if you understand the underlying adapting algorythm it still is deterministic. 09:41 < fenn> behavior should be deterministic, even with random input 09:42 < fenn> do you understand why i'm making a big deal about it? 09:42 < UtopiahGHML> because it's cognitively easier on your part 09:42 < fenn> yes, and my fingers can't look at the screen 09:42 < UtopiahGHML> ?! 09:43 < fenn> so when i'm typing some long complex sequence with multiple predictive shortcuts, i dont have to look and make sure the computer is doing what it did last time 09:46 < UtopiahGHML> well you type while looking at the screen, not the keyboard, I don't get it 09:46 < fenn> but i'm not thinking about what's on the screen, i'm thinking about what i'm trying to do 09:47 < fenn> if i have to look at the screen and figure out what the computer thinks i want, then it interrupts my train of thought 09:48 < UtopiahGHML> what about having the suggestions at the end of the task, queueing them? 09:48 < fenn> that might work, but i dont know how to do it(?) 09:49 < UtopiahGHML> (I added http://seedea.free.fr/wiki/index.php?n=Oimp.CAST#Suggestion , is it correct?) 09:51 < fenn> you should read this if you're interested in UI: http://jef.raskincenter.org/humane_interface/summary_of_thi.html 09:51 < fenn> (yes that's correct) 09:51 < fenn> hmmm threaded IRC conversations.. 09:52 < UtopiahGHML> (reading the summary, thanks) 09:52 < UtopiahGHML> ? 09:59 < fenn> kate (text editor) has a list of files that are open, you switch to them by clicking on the name... the background of the filename changes color depending on how often you visit that file 10:09 < UtopiahGHML> ideally beside trying not to be instrusive, I should have a way to detect when to avoid giving any message to the user, I actually wrote sth about that a while ago but on paper, never typed it 10:09 < UtopiahGHML> at that time my walls were my wiki ;? 10:10 < UtopiahGHML> hard to run a search on that :( 10:10 < UtopiahGHML> I wanted to add higher-res picture and IDs (like barcode) with meta-data but, just too much work obviously. 10:12 < fenn> you just need VR goggles and a digital pen 10:13 < fenn> seems hard on the posture though 10:16 < UtopiahGHML> huhu I need high-res camera + trippod + tech recognition + semantic engine + API for SecondLife and that's it, so easy ;) 10:25 < fenn> i think the "Normal human inertia" comment was about groupthink more than habituation 10:30 < UtopiahGHML> well I still think that in most environment we have strong resistance to change, no? 10:35 < wrldpc> anybody got artilect war or ending aging in pdf? 10:41 < faceface> its not much, but at least its more than nothing. http://biocourse.org/index.php/H%2B 10:55 -!- Utopiah is now known as UtopiahGHML 10:56 < UtopiahGHML> sorry switched to mozilla.org instead of opening a new server session 10:56 < UtopiahGHML> (Ill contact the Hunspell resp to see how I could get stats data from this) 11:00 < faceface> how do I find the mime type of a link? 11:00 < faceface> file --mime tells me "application/vnd.rn-realmedia" 11:00 < faceface> but not sure if the webserver is saying that when I grab it 11:03 < UtopiahGHML> supposed to be in the header 11:05 < faceface> how do I see the header? 11:06 < fenn> telnet to port 80 :) 11:06 < UtopiahGHML> if you just want to check it telnet could be a simple option 11:06 < UtopiahGHML> else you just use your favorite language then http query the server and extrat the header 11:09 < faceface> HEAD 11:09 < faceface> application/octet-stream 11:45 < kanzure_> Huh. Marshall Brain was at singsummit. 11:47 < UtopiahGHML> Solar Cells- Materials, Manufacture and Operation http://knowfree.net/2008/10/29/solar-cells-materials-manufacture-and-operation.kf 11:52 < UtopiahGHML> Content : * organic and dye sensitized cells 11:52 < kanzure_> UtopiahGHML: Could you email that link to me? 11:52 < UtopiahGHML> mailto:? 11:52 < kanzure_> kanzure@gmail.com 11:52 < UtopiahGHML> do you have a delicious account? 11:53 < kanzure_> Yes, but delicious is the devil and should go to hell. 11:53 < UtopiahGHML> (cause I have bindings so it's faster for me) 11:53 < kanzure_> Bah, bindings. 11:53 < kanzure_> You're probably just using webscraping tools. 11:53 < UtopiahGHML> in FF I type D and I just have to add for:kanzure [Enter] and it's done 11:53 < kanzure_> (I can't afford the HTML overhead that would be caused because I use 2.8+ MB of bookmarks.) 11:54 < UtopiahGHML> and fields are filled with selected data before typing D 11:54 < UtopiahGHML> Ill just mailto with url as the subject then 11:54 < kanzure_> uhm, that's probably a bad idea 11:54 < kanzure_> my intention in receiving the email is to be able to clicky the link :) 11:54 < kanzure_> I'm still having shell troubles, you see. 11:55 < UtopiahGHML> title=subject and content=link then 11:55 < kanzure_> k 11:55 < UtopiahGHML> what's the keyword for content though, I forgot 11:56 < kanzure_> fenn: What if we threw in an extension to firefox that makes it cache all tabs to hdd above five tabs or whatever the limit is where it begins to croak? 11:57 < UtopiahGHML> anywya, sent 12:02 < fenn> kanzure_: you dont have a mouse? 12:05 < fenn> woah check out the solar cells on that one 12:06 < fenn> possibly the second most obnoxious file sharing site ever 12:18 < kanzure_> I have a mouse somewhere. 12:19 < kanzure_> I set up a mousetrap with some cheese, but it's just been getting green and moldy 12:20 < kanzure_> "Brain scans of people full of hate show distinct hate signatures" 12:20 < kanzure_> Hahah. 12:20 < kanzure_> I wonder what my signature is. 12:20 < kanzure_> "Good god! This man hates everything!" 12:29 < fenn> Sir! I've detected an alien lifeform, showing unusual hate signatures! 12:32 < fenn> > The copyright belongs to the photographer. 12:32 < fenn> New Buffer Modified 12:32 < fenn> If you hand someone the camera and tell them what to do, are they they photographer or are you? What if you grab a passer-by's camera to take a picture of something? What if you grab a passer-by and ask them to take a picture of something with their camera? 12:33 < fenn> we're so screwed 13:02 < UtopiahGHML> fuck copyright 16:00 < kanzure__> fenn: Source? 16:01 < fenn> sifter mailing list.. think it was brandyn 16:01 < fenn> the question was then answered; for the curious, the copyright belongs to whoever pressed the shutter button 16:01 < gene_> are you there kanzure? 16:02 < kanzure__> fenn: Meh. 16:02 < kanzure__> gene_: Yes. 16:02 < kanzure__> gene_: Graphene day is on the 31st, by the way. Flyers are up by the elevators @ ETC floor 2. 16:02 < gene_> yeah I saw that 16:02 < gene_> could you open of google chat for a second? 16:03 < gene_> or is that even working for you? 16:03 < kanzure__> Yes, I can at the moment. 16:03 < gene_> I found a new separation process that looks very energy efficient 16:03 < kanzure__> Why can't you tell me here? 16:03 < gene_> ok 16:04 < gene_> so there is this seperation process called froth floation where you bubble air through the algae to cause it to froth 16:04 < gene_> and extract the froth 16:04 < fenn> mmm algae shake 16:05 < kanzure__> "Kelp shake". 16:05 < kanzure__> (meep) 16:05 < gene_> it cost $30 for ton of algae 16:05 < gene_> in 1957 16:05 < kanzure__> Is this separation or harvesting? 16:05 < fenn> what kind of algae? 16:05 < gene_> figure has been adjusted for inflation 16:06 < gene_> separation is harvesting right? 16:06 < kanzure__> Not really. 16:06 < gene_> harvesting 16:06 < gene_> can you send me the current powerpoint? 16:06 < kanzure__> http://heybryan.org/bioreactor/2008-10-28.ppt 16:07 < gene_> I'll add froth flotation and the stuff I have to it 16:07 < gene_> I also found some important figures on harvesting 16:07 < kanzure__> How are you caculating $30/ton? 16:08 < kanzure__> *calculating 16:08 < gene_> a paper told me 16:08 < fenn> dry weight? 16:08 < fenn> (does dry weight include volatile oils?) 16:09 < fenn> istr most algae oil is low molecular weight 16:09 < fenn> um, but i guess they've genengineered that problem away 16:10 < gene_> http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=1057831&blobtype=pdf 16:10 < gene_> this paper told me 16:10 < gene_> and I adjusted for inflation 16:10 < kanzure__> http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/picrender.fcgi?artid=1057831&blobtype=pdf 16:10 < kanzure__> oops, stupid double click 16:11 < gene_> centrifuging cost $300 per dry ton 16:11 < gene_> in 1957 16:11 < gene_> figure adjusted for inflation 16:11 < kanzure__> I'm more interested in the price function, i.e. "cost is a function of X, Y, Z" not random dollar signs. 16:12 < kanzure__> I'm sure you could make an argument that centrifugation cost is a function of cost per kilowatt hour, but then where's the equation of kilowatt hour per multiple of g' you need to clump some density/concentration/mass of algae to visible diameters? etc. 16:12 < kanzure__> Nice paper. 16:14 < fenn> fish tank filter 16:14 < fenn> "skilter" 16:14 < kanzure__> I'm going to be adding some prices for flocculants sometime within the next hour to the presentation, so you'll need to push your changes to me. 16:14 < gene_> oh 16:14 < gene_> wait 16:14 < gene_> on flocculants 16:14 < kanzure__> ? 16:14 < gene_> UV light can cause algae to flocculate 16:15 < kanzure__> Yes, you said that yesterday. 16:15 < gene_> so can interrupting the co2 supply to the algae culture 16:15 < kanzure__> Yes, we've been testing that with the group. Remember? 16:15 < gene_> btw 16:15 < gene_> ok 16:15 < gene_> so 16:15 < gene_> what's the lowest pH they have grown algae at? 16:17 < gene_> 2? 16:17 < gene_> and has it ever foamed at low pH's 16:18 < fenn> you can buffer the solution with carbonate 16:18 < kanzure__> fenn: We're doing carbonation studies at the moment. 16:18 < kanzure__> fenn: By "we" I mean the guys that have been on the project longer than me I guess. 16:18 < fenn> the algae lab? 16:19 < kanzure__> uh, yeah, call it that I guess 16:19 < fenn> what do they call themselves? 16:19 < gene_> how low Kanzure? 16:20 < fenn> 2 is pretty low, i doubt carbonic acid would even get that low 16:20 < kanzure__> I don't have the results. 16:21 < gene_> I think they were able to grow it at 2 16:21 < kanzure__> They were growing at 7 to 9 at one point. 16:21 < fenn> at 10 atm CO2 the pH is only 3.4 16:22 < gene_> have you ever noticed a ring of green around the top of the tank? 16:25 < gene_> I also found a number on harvesting 16:36 < kanzure__> What's the function? 17:42 < kanzure__> fenn: http://heybryan.org/graph/sbml_notes.txt Any ideas on changing the species identifier of an object added to the reactants/products list of a reaction object? They want you to call createReactant()/createProduct() and have an object returned, but it looks like 'species' (the variable of the returned object) is protected and there's no public function for modifying it. Thoughts? 17:42 * kanzure__ goes to chem 18:02 < UtopiahGHML> is there a registery that maps biobricks to some mathematical/programming_language functions? 18:03 < UtopiahGHML> sth not too low level :-x 18:47 < fenn> kanzure__: i doubt it's protected, try help(createReactant()) to see what's there 18:47 < fenn> probably a documentation error 18:49 < fenn> i wonder why they have a different class for SpeciesReference 18:50 < fenn> instead of something like Reaction(products=[1,2,3], reactants=[4,5,6]) 18:52 < fenn> XML can do that right? 18:54 < fenn> 18:55 < fenn> def libsbml.Species.setCharge libsbml.Species.setCompartment libsbml.Species.setHasOnlySubstanceUnits libsbml.Species.setInitialAmount libsbml.Species.setInitialConcentration 18:55 < fenn> ^^ is that not what you want? 18:56 < fenn> from http://sbml.org/Software/libSBML/docs/python-api/classlibsbml_1_1_species.html 18:58 < fenn> so should end up looking something like createReactant().species.setFoo 18:58 < fenn> (foo) 19:17 < kanzure__> http://www.molecularassembler.com/Papers/MinToolset.pdf 19:18 < kanzure__> http://www.thoughtware.tv/videos/watch/2992-Wearable-Computing-Goes-Wireless Olympus HUD 19:19 < kanzure__> LCD images are reflected on a 3.2mm-wide small optical bar located in front of pupils. 19:19 < kanzure__> while watching a 3.8-inch screen located 50cm ahead. 19:19 < kanzure__> Hrm. 19:19 < kanzure__> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WYmLEAR5X5I 19:20 < kanzure__> Anyway, thanks fenn. 19:25 < fenn> huh i wonder what resolution 19:27 < fenn> 521 x 218... we are almost back to 1980s tech :\ 19:27 < fenn> oh oh wait maybe it's 854 x 480 19:29 < fenn> no 19:29 < fenn> what's with these tech companies with no websites 19:44 < UtopiahGHML> Fuel Cell Projects for the Evil Genius http://e-booklovers.blogspot.com/2008/10/download-fuel-cell-projects-for-evil.html 19:49 < UtopiahGHML> Sentient Creatures presents: Bio-Art - Joe Davis and Robert Zwijnenberg http://transition.turbulence.org/blog/2008/10/22/live-stage-bio-art-amsterdam/ 19:50 < UtopiahGHML> Textiles Futures Research Group Presents: What Future for Living Textiles? http://transition.turbulence.org/blog/2008/10/20/what-future-for-living-textiles-london/ 20:42 < gene_> Kanzure should I get numbers on hexane solvent extraction 21:30 * xp_prg misses ppk 21:38 < willPow3r> xp_prg, russian techno group? 21:38 < xp_prg> ppk is a guy who has been helping me 21:47 < willPow3r> what is it that you're working on? 21:47 < xp_prg> a front end for bio bricks configuration and then saving to sbml 21:55 < willPow3r> biobricks == interesting 21:56 * willPow3r just looked into it for 1st time 21:57 < UtopiahGHML> willPow3r: any idea of what you would want to build it with those? 21:57 < UtopiahGHML> -it 21:59 < willPow3r> there seem to be a plethora of possibilities 21:59 < UtopiahGHML> an entire world of possibilities? :) 22:01 < willPow3r> maybe even an entire galaxy of possibilities 22:01 < willPow3r> and if you've played spore, you know how massive that truly is 22:03 < willPow3r> you could build protein synthesizers with biobricks 22:03 < UtopiahGHML> let's just say a dimension, so what do *you* want to build? 22:04 < willPow3r> then again, i don't really know enough about it to even guess at the possibilities 22:12 < UtopiahGHML> have you seen Casshern? 22:15 < willPow3r> sci-fi anime? 22:15 < UtopiahGHML> was a japanese action movie 22:15 < bkero> There's a ton of bad sci-fi anime. 22:15 < bkero> There's a TON of bad anime. 22:15 < UtopiahGHML> There's a TON of bad stuff. 22:16 < bkero> Ok 22:16 < bkero> The majority of anime is terrible. 22:16 < UtopiahGHML> That's why you usually look for reviews, ratings, etc... 22:16 < willPow3r> samurai champloo was the only one i liked 22:16 < bkero> willPow3r: Have you seen Bebop? 22:16 < UtopiahGHML> the majority of the majority of everything is terrible... 22:16 < willPow3r> nope, heard it was good though 22:17 < bkero> UtopiahGHML: The proportion of shit to good in anime is much higher than most other subjects I can think of. 22:17 < UtopiahGHML> Ghost in the Shell, Lain, Akira, Ergo Proxy, etc... 22:17 < bkero> willPow3r: If you liked Champloo, watch Bebop. Champloo is good, but Bebop is better. 22:19 < willPow3r> cowboy bebop? 22:20 < bkero> Yes 22:20 < bkero> It comes on top of Hellsing for it's amazing soundtrack. 22:21 < bkero> I can pretty much put 5 cowboy bebop albums in a playlist and let it run for hours. 22:21 < willPow3r> is it like underground hiphop? 22:21 < bkero> No, sir. 22:22 < bkero> Bebop is not underground hip hop. 22:22 < bkero> It's much better. :) 22:22 < willPow3r> that was one of the reasons i liked champloo 22:22 < bkero> You might not appreciate the jazz then. 22:22 < willPow3r> jazz is good 22:22 < bkero> Watch Cowboy Bebop. You won't regret it. 22:22 < willPow3r> i'll download it tonight from usenet 22:22 < bkero> You can even watch the dub without a problem. 22:23 < bkero> The animation was made to be dubbed, and it worked excellently in comparison to other dubs. 22:54 < willPow3r> has anybody looked into djvu format rather than pdf? 23:06 < kanzure_> Yes. 23:06 < willPow3r> results? 23:08 < kanzure_> Nobody stores files in djvu. 23:08 < kanzure_> That's the results. 23:08 < kanzure_> But yes, I have used djvu and the djview apps 23:09 < kanzure_> dea-ja-view app thingy 23:09 < willPow3r> pdf still takes the cake then i take it 23:29 < wrldpc> does anyone have a link to Cumbers' biomining mock-up? 23:46 < drazak> wrldpc: which kind of biomining? 23:46 < wrldpc> it's a system that was going to be open source to track where samples are etc 23:46 < drazak> ah cool 23:48 < kanzure_> wrldpc: Yes. 23:48 < kanzure_> http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Moontank 23:48 < kanzure_> That might have a link to his work. 23:51 < xp_prg> kanzure_ how goes the sbml python stuff? 23:51 < kanzure_> You're not doing it any more? 23:52 < xp_prg> no I am, I thought I saw you asking questions about it and thought you were doing it now 23:52 < xp_prg> specific coding questions if I recall 23:52 < xp_prg> dude I am doing it relax :>