--- Day changed Mon Dec 01 2008 00:23 < fenn> who's keeping who out of jobs? 00:24 < kanzure> "the new master race" 00:26 < fenn> oh i see 00:27 < fenn> i really dont think genetics should be a part of "transhumanism" until we can actually do something useful 00:27 < kanzure> transhumanism is too vague, what are you talking about? 00:27 < fenn> til then it's just medicine 00:29 < fenn> after all, eugenics isn't really going to help anyone who's already been born 00:29 < kanzure> that's a nice counter argument to set people straight. 00:30 < fenn> free gene surgery for anyone that wants it! 00:35 < fenn> my problem with arguments against eugenics is you can say pretty much the same thing about cars or organic food or college education 00:36 < kanzure> meh, the issue IMHO is that WTA is giving out material that makes people think it's about eugenics and government politics 00:36 < fenn> i dont mind communist utopia dreamers, and we really "should" all have access to these things too 00:36 < kanzure> when in reality the idea is personal enhancement, as personal as my computer's configuration 00:37 < fenn> WTA just wants to take over the world 00:37 < fenn> one donation at a time :P 00:38 < kanzure> how much pain have they caused me over the years by now 00:38 < kanzure> "lots" ? 00:38 < fenn> sue! 00:38 < kanzure> heh 00:38 < fenn> millions of dollars worth of emotional damage i'd say 00:38 < kanzure> sign here: --> ________________________ 00:38 < kanzure> NOTE: DO NOT TAKE PEN TO MONITOR 00:39 * fenn re-caps sharpie 00:40 < fenn> both parents gone, i'm eating vegan food, and money in my pocket. i declare this a successful thanksgiving 00:40 < kanzure_> http://www.ualberta.ca/~cwant/blender/stl.py for face in mesh.faces: 00:40 < kanzure_> self.writeFace(mesh.vertices[face[0]],mesh.vertices[face[1]],mesh.vertices[face[2]]) 00:40 < kanzure_> if mesh.vertices[face[3]]: 00:40 < kanzure_> self.writeFace(mesh.vertices[face[0]],mesh.vertices[face[2]],mesh.vertices[face[3]]) 00:41 < kanzure_> didn't know STL was so simple 00:41 < fenn> yep 00:41 < fenn> that's the point after all 00:41 < fenn> clockwise/ccw lets you know which is inside or outside (i think) 00:42 < kanzure_> http://www.ennex.com/~fabbers/StL.asp 00:43 < kanzure> bleh, I said I'd have this done by tomorrow, it's supposed to be simpler than this 00:44 < kanzure> what's so hard about giving a program a list of points and then spitting out a 3D file format that is universally globally loved and accepted by everything 00:44 < fenn> well? 00:50 < fenn> hmm. two hours and two gigs of swap later, and acrobat isnt done converting this djvu->ps file 00:50 < kanzure> wee, zip -R papers.zip papers/ is the wrong way to do it. zip -r is for recursion. 00:50 < fenn> i hate pdf as much as the next guy, but what is the point of djvu? 00:51 * kanzure is the next guy evidently. 01:00 < fenn> huh. origami has the same vertex-to-vertex requirement as STL 01:01 < kanzure> remember me talking about unfolding 3D objects earlier today? 01:01 < kanzure> ahem. 01:10 < kanzure> in ASCII STL files, what's facet normal n_i, n_j, n_k supposed to be? 01:10 < kanzure> the n coords in particular, what do these represent? 01:12 < kanzure_> 'In both ASCII and binary versions of STL, the facet normal should be a unit vector pointing outwards from the solid object. In most software this may be set to (0,0,0) and the software will automatically calculate a normal based on the order of the triangle vertices using the 'right hand rule'. ' 01:16 < fenn> i,j,k are vector coordinates like x,y,z 01:17 < fenn> facet normal is the vector perpendicular to the plane of the triangle 01:17 < kanzure> yes yes, wikipedia has schooled me. 01:19 < Ghost`> Vegan food! Awesome 01:19 < Ghost`> I wish i had the money to get organic too 01:23 < fenn> eggplant stew. i added caraway seeds though, which were totally not what i thought they would taste like 01:26 < Ghost`> let me translate those names, justa sec =) 01:28 < Ghost`> hmm.. sounds nice.. 01:29 < Ghost`> caraway seeds (just a sec) 01:31 < Ghost`> ahh nice 01:31 < Ghost`> my father likes caraway a lot 01:31 < fenn> i do too, usually, but these were very bitter 01:32 < Ghost`> lol 01:37 < Ghost`> oh.. just thought to clarify something i said earlier, might have been misunderstood.. 01:37 < Ghost`> I said I only started downloading movies and series, etc, because the really important (for me anyway) I already did... besides wikipedia, and a more comprehensive dictionary (ies) 01:46 < fenn> it is often the case that there are no intermediate states -- no subsets of the creases -- that can be folded together, which would form the individual steps. For such a model, the only way to assemble the model is to precrease all of the creases, then gently coerce them all to come together at once with a minimum of bodging. 01:49 < kanzure> I knew it! .. I was feeling kind of cheaty when I was precreasing my superdog origami shape yesterday 01:51 < fenn> kanzure: http://chosetec.darkclan.net/origami/ironman/ 01:51 < fenn> that guy has some totally awesome origami 01:53 < kanzure> Hah. 01:54 * kanzure is listening to the Iron Man 2008 soundtrack at the moment 01:54 < fenn> http://chosetec.darkclan.net/origami/brain/ 01:55 < kanzure_> http://heybryan.org/books/music/01%20-%20Driving%20With%20The%20Top%20Down.mp3 01:55 < kanzure> I like the title: "The long term effect of an MIT education" 01:55 < kanzure> *origami brain* 02:01 < kanzure> hm, what's that gimp tool that takes an image and converts it into an outline form? 02:03 < fenn> autotrace 02:03 < fenn> it's part of inkscape (and imho works better if you use it in inkscape) 02:23 < Ghost`> I like the title: "The long term effect of an MIT education" 02:23 < Ghost`> LOL.. this is the title for what? 02:29 < kanzure> Look at the link. 02:29 < kanzure> the origami/brain/ link that fenn gave 02:30 < kanzure> fenn: ! I finally got STL output, load it up into blender and I see a damn cube. why do I see a damn cube. 02:32 < fenn> are your normals the wrong way? 02:32 < kanzure> it said my normals may be 0 0 0 02:34 < kanzure> http://viewstl.sf.net/ 02:35 -!- genehacher is now known as gene 02:40 < kanzure> viewstl correctly counts the number of polygons 02:40 < kanzure> but doesn't show anything. 02:40 < fenn> try changing the order you write the vertices 02:42 < gene> what are you doing? 02:43 < kanzure> generating an STL file 02:43 < gene> why are you using STLs? 02:43 < kanzure> because VTKs were taking too long 02:43 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/bioreactor/membraneless_filtration/mytest.stl 02:43 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/bioreactor/membraneless_filtration/spiralgen.pl 02:43 < kanzure> spiralgen isn't really spiralgen though, it's more like "make one cross section" 02:44 < gene> did you make a model of a spiral? 02:44 < kanzure> gene: the issue at the moment is that even though I'm making an STL file, blender & viewstl doesn't show it 02:44 < gene> use art of illusion 02:44 < gene> there 02:45 < gene> there's a thing on the Reprap website on how to view STLs 02:45 < kanzure> why wouldn't blender show it though 02:45 < kanzure> I suspect it's my generator that is somewhat wrong 02:45 < kanzure> blender just loads up a whole friggin' cube 02:45 < gene> because blender got fucked up 02:45 < kanzure> and that's not what I'm displaying 02:45 < kanzure> *what I'm generating 02:46 < kanzure> why did you write it in Processing? 02:46 < kanzure> and does it have STL/3DS/X/VTK output? 02:46 < gene> no 02:46 < kanzure> It has to be in a format that openfoam's mesher is going to be able to use 02:46 < gene> it should draw a spiral 02:46 < gene> why? 02:47 < kanzure> for CFD. 02:47 < gene> because I've been playing around with processing 02:47 < kanzure> can't just have a pretty picture :/ 02:47 < gene> someone found out how to CFD in processing 02:47 < kanzure> sure, if you write your own PDE solver 02:47 < fenn> someone found out how to fold animals from uncut pieces of paper.. 02:47 < gene> it isn't optimized so openFoam makes sense 02:48 < kanzure> fenn: still oogling? 02:48 < fenn> no, i'm done 02:48 < kanzure> oo-gl-ing. 02:49 < fenn> uh, what? 02:49 < kanzure> eyeing, I guess 02:49 < fenn> well, i feel like i understand how it works now at least 02:50 < fenn> i can look at a crease pattern and see how to translate it into 3d 02:50 < fenn> i still think it's a total waste of time 02:50 * kanzure wants a program to fold crease patterns into shapes. 02:50 < kanzure> for what use? 02:50 < fenn> for making paper models 02:51 < gene> there's a program that already does that 02:51 < kanzure> yeah, we're talking about it. 02:51 < fenn> treemaker doesnt show you the 3d end result 02:51 < fenn> (does it?) 02:51 < kanzure> webEOS shows you a 2D end result 02:51 < gene> in fact there's a program that can figure out how to fold stuff using cells 02:51 < kanzure> treemaker has a 2D view as well, but it sucks 02:51 < kanzure> gene: why not just tell us the program 02:52 < gene> because I don't remember the program 02:52 < gene> it was in Seed 02:52 < kanzure> magazine? 02:52 < gene> http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/~rad/phd/Progmat/thesis/origami.html 02:52 < gene> found it 02:53 < kanzure> yeah, the MIT amorphous computing group 02:53 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Amorphous_computing 02:54 < kanzure> there was no download though 02:55 < gene> now if we could only grow cell sheets as strong as paper 02:55 < fenn> cells can grow though, unlike paper 02:55 < fenn> so you can make a sphere with no creases 02:57 < gene> now what does it take to grow wood in a dish 02:57 < fenn> heh vat-grown lumber 02:58 < fenn> plywood would work better i think 02:59 < fenn> or rolled tubes 03:03 < kanzure> okay, I'm going to go eat, then read through a few thousand pages of Hofstadter, and simultaneously somehow come up with the super big ADL presentation I'm doing tomorrow 03:03 < kanzure> yay deadlines 03:03 < kanzure> "I love the wooshing sound they make" 03:09 < bkero> kanzure: Have you read An Eternal Golden Braid? 03:10 < fenn> that's the assignment 03:10 < bkero> It's painful 03:10 < bkero> I've read the first few chapters and did some of the exercises 03:14 < drazak> do you guys know of any researcher sin buffalo? 03:20 < kanzure> yes 03:24 < drazak> who? 03:24 < drazak> I live in buffalo, and I'm trying to get in some place and clean glassware and stuff 03:24 < kanzure> VOICED guys in buffalo 03:24 < kanzure> ah, wrong type of lab my friend 03:25 < drazak> anything biochemical/medical whatever 03:33 < Ghost`> thousands?! 03:34 < kanzure> <-- can read fast when he's physically coerced into doing it. 03:35 < Ghost`> lol 03:35 < Ghost`> but 03:36 < Ghost`> hofstadter really have those many pages?! 03:57 < percent> hey, fags 03:57 < percent> what's up? 03:57 < percent> you guys busy being GAY? 03:57 < percent> I'm having problems with ARCING in my VACUUM FURNACE 03:57 < percent> and all the PHD students are too DUMB to realize it has JACK SHIT to do with the fucking VACUUM 03:59 < percent> I literally had two phd students argue with me for ten minutes, insisting that the pressure readout was in torr, not mmHg 03:59 < percent> they would not listen to me when i told them that they were the same thing 04:10 < kanzure> grr 04:10 < kanzure> next time I'll be sure to open the file 04:10 < kanzure> because "0 1 0" for every vertex point is obviously wrong. 04:10 < kanzure> *vertice. 04:15 < percent> kanzure: Are all phd students stupid 04:22 < kanzure> Yes, except for the one that did phdcomics. He was secretly the smart one. 04:26 < kanzure_> http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=1096 04:30 < kanzure_> http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=1093 oh god it's true. 04:41 < kanzure> Hrm, why don't we have a proper transhuman webcomic yet 04:41 < kanzure> it'd be ridiculously easy to do 04:41 < kanzure> a few panels about mainchar's crazy idea, last two panels about the consequences 04:42 < kanzure> I used to run a webcomic involving characters that I had met online 04:42 < kanzure> it ran for ~20 strips 04:52 < kanzure> hm, when I use CADpart.py in /usr/share/vtk/Rendering/Python/, it shows a triangle going through a rectangle 05:14 < gene> this reminds me of how mistreated our sonicator is kanzure 05:14 < gene> it has fucking pits in it 05:43 -!- percent is now known as jihaaad 09:13 < willPow3r> http://www.zoomilife.com/2008/11/25/battery-life-breakthrough-could-increase-li-ion-capacity-by-1000/ 09:14 < bkero> If I had a nickel for every time I've heard that. 09:14 < willPow3r> you'd have a nickel? 09:15 < bkero> I'd have enough nickels to make a bag of realistic proportions to teabag you with. 09:16 < willPow3r> fortunately, it doesn't require many nickels to do that 12:19 < drazak> lol 12:19 < drazak> that percent dude, maybe someone should tell me that torr=mmhg 13:37 < kanzure> fenn: zip stopped at 2.1 GB for the zip file. 13:37 < kanzure> fenn: Any ideas on how to tell zip to stagger the zipping process so that when the file size limit is reached, it starts a new file to archive in? 13:37 < kanzure> and it was getting about 6% compression on each file 13:44 < kanzure_> http://brain-game.sf.net/ http://neocortex.sf.net/ hierarchical bayesian memory-prediction-framework re: Jeff Hawkins 13:44 < kanzure_> I wish I had a neat name like Vernon Mountcastle 14:28 < kanzure> Heh. Sending in a book review an hour before the deadline and the professor replies within 2 minutes .. yeah. 15:04 < Utopiah> someone know a script to visualize the genesis of a wikipedia page? adding/removing/re-organizing information in a fast animation (javascript/flash or even a generated video) with indicators (like stability of a specific sentence, tags, etc...) ? 15:20 < Utopiah> (sth like http://www.research.ibm.com/visual/projects.html but thanks to which we can directly see the article evolve till its current state) 18:58 < gene> you there kanzure 19:07 < gene> ... 19:08 < gene> kanzure? 20:34 < gene> kanzure?