--- Day changed Fri Dec 05 2008
00:03 < ybit> bkero: you said something about full faith if some guy is appointed under obama?
00:03 < ybit> did you guys forget about him appointing the sexist summers?
00:06 < ybit> can't say i have full faith in any government with the head getting advice from a sexist
00:09 < ybit> but he did backtrack, so i shouldn't call him that
00:10 < fenn> ybit: did you actually read what summers said?
00:11 < ybit> yeah
00:11 < ybit> no scientific basis
00:12 < fenn> anyway, is it so unusual for a presidential candidate to take advice from the president of harvard?
00:13 < fenn> oo, and he was secretary of treasury under clinton
00:15 < ybit> yep, i knew that as well
00:28 < bkero> ybit: Lawrence Lessig
00:28 < bkero> Also, I'm staring at a reprap right now
00:31 < fenn>  /me scowls at bkero
00:35 < kanzure_> organic transistors pressed in a water bottle
00:35 < kanzure_> come on .. that has to be exciting to at least a few of you
00:36 < bkero> fenn: :P
00:36 < bkero> fenn: Nothing wrong with the reprap.  The self
00:36 < bkero> self-replicating hubajoo is half correct, but mises the mark. :P
00:36 < fenn> i'm just scowling because you have a reprap and i dont
00:37 < bkero> lol I see
00:37 < bkero> I wonder if a reprap has ever made anything besides itself.
00:37 < kanzure_> it has never made itself
00:38 < bkero> I wonder if it has ever machined parts to construct a replica of itself.
00:38 < kanzure_> From what I recall, machining isn't the issue
00:39 < fenn> reprap cant machine anything either
00:39 < kanzure_> well, right, but I don't recall machining being a requirement to make a reprap
00:39 < fenn> hmm
00:39 < kanzure_> unless you count the electronics, which may or may not require machining in its dependency chain
00:39  * bkero wouldn't know, haven't made one.
00:40 < bkero> It is one of my plans to make a 5 dimension CNC mill
00:40 < fenn> why 5 axis?
00:40 < bkero> For some of my modeled objects, a 4-dimension compatible toolpath won't cut it
00:41 < bkero> I could run it in 4 dimension, but I'd need to rotate and calibrate halfway through.
00:41 < fenn> i'm curious what sort of objects you're making that require 5 axes
00:41 < kanzure_> heh
00:42 < bkero> A miniature cylinder head
00:43 < fenn> how is that impossible with 4?
00:43 < fenn> or do you think you're going to do it all in one setup? (hah)
00:44 < bkero> The valve bores aren't straight
00:44 < kanzure> Valve in a cylinder?
00:44 < kanzure> or is this a cylindrical tip for a mill that you want to make with your 5-axle cncer?
00:45 < bkero> Valve above the cylinder.  Cylinder head for an itnernal combustion engine
00:46  * kanzure does a happy dance. box2d approved for "research purposes" haha
00:46 < fenn> so uh, if the valves aren't perpendicular to the axis of the camshaft.. blah whatever
00:47  * fenn wishes bkero the best on his CNC adventure
00:47 < bkero> I'm at the phase of getting a manual mill, and aquiring stepper motors.
00:47 < bkero> I'm working on my beagleboard wearable computer first
00:47 < fenn> what mill are you looking at?
00:47 < kanzure> watchya think about the chitosan 150 nm nanoimprinting stuff, fenn?
00:47 < bkero> $150 number from harbor freight
00:47 < fenn> wah! you stealing all my projects now or what?
00:47 < fenn> beagleboard..
00:48 < bkero> fenn: I ordered a beagleboard, myvu crystals, built a battery pack already, and got a gpio bluetooth controller
00:48 < kanzure> I'd do a wearable if I actually knew how to make the wearable component. fenn showed me a helmet mask that might be retrofitted to do the monocular view, but I'm still skeptical on that one
00:48 < bkero> I'm currently trying to source miniature bluetooht half keyboards that I can strap to my leg.
00:48 < kanzure> haha
00:48 < bkero> kanzure: http://www.myvu.com look at the crystals
00:48 < kanzure> bkero: did you get that from us?
00:48 < bkero> 640x480, vga input
00:48 < kanzure> the half kb strapon
00:49 < kanzure> idea.
00:49 < bkero> kanzure: No, I got that from the cowboy bebop movie, a couple years ago and somehow dredged it up
00:49 < fenn> is this the mill you're getting? http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=47158
00:49 < kanzure> fenn: maybe we were both getting that from the bebop movie?
00:49 < kanzure> bkero: why do you want full glasses?
00:49 < bkero> kanzure: Because they're $300, and I know they work, and they're a good resolution
00:49 < bkero> Ideally I'd want a HUD I can see through
00:49 < kanzure> but they're full glasses ..
00:49 < bkero> But that seems to be out of my budget
00:49 < fenn> kanzure: i never saw the cowboy bebop movie (well, i saw the first five minutes)
00:50 < kanzure> maybe it was in the first five minutes
00:50 < kanzure> however, I've never seen it, so nevermind :)
00:50 < bkero> The similarity was the thigh-mounted halfkeyboards
00:50 < kanzure> hah, I just got it
00:50 < kanzure> "kb strapon"
00:51 < bkero> Have you guys sourced another HUD?
00:51 < kanzure> yes
00:51 < kanzure> it was on hackaday a year ago
00:51 < fenn> the private eye?
00:51 < fenn> that's been out of production for decades
00:52 < kanzure> no, the private-eye was somebody else
00:52 < kanzure> but something like it would be awesome.
00:52 < kanzure> (with better resolution of course ..)
00:52 < fenn> why is VGA "highest resolution" in 2008?
00:52 < kanzure_> http://hackaday.com/2007/10/07/25-head-mounted-display/
00:52 < kanzure_> http://jakeofalltrades.wordpress.com/2007/09/30/25-head-mounted-display/
00:52 < fenn> srsly.. am i the only person who ever thought of putting DLP chips in HUD glasses?
00:52 < kanzure_> wait, this might be the wrong one
00:53 < kanzure_> if it's not the monocle it's wrong
00:53 < bkero> Fairly low ersolution :/
00:53 < bkero> Although absurdly cheap
00:53 < kanzure_> http://www.i-glassesstore.com/ig-hrvpro.html
00:54 < kanzure_> screw it, just get the mount
00:54 < kanzure_> "$1,299" haha (on that last link)
00:54 < bkero> Yea
00:54 < kanzure_> and then replace it with a screen from a cell phone
00:54 < bkero> The myvus are vga+svideo in, and 640x480
00:54 < bkero> Although I would really prefer something I could see through.
00:54 < fenn> 1.44 Million Pixels!!!11
00:55 < kanzure_> [LH-GVD310A] for $130
00:55 < kanzure_> hrm
00:55 < bkero> ???
00:55 < kanzure_> http://www.chinavasion.com/product_info.php/pName/video-headset-30-inches-2m-away-full-colour-av-interface/
00:56 < kanzure_> 30 inch screen? wtf?
00:56 < bkero> A name like chinavision scares the shit out of me
00:56 < kanzure_> I read it first as 'china invasion'
00:56 < fenn> it's actually chinavasion
00:56 < kanzure_> hah
00:56 < kanzure_> three different interpretations
00:57 < bkero> I've had one beer and am hopped up on hacking endorphins from being at NYC Resistor.
00:58 < kanzure_> http://www.philoneist.com/50226711/wearable_ipod_headset_displays_video.php
00:58 < kanzure_> oh look
00:58 < kanzure_> it's not a visor?
00:58 < kanzure_> that looks like a monocular display to me
00:58 < kanzure_> 'EyeBuds'
01:00 < bkero> lol
01:00  * fenn yawns
01:00 < fenn> another stupid looking head mount display
01:00 < fenn> the way i see it, there's two use cases
01:00 < fenn> 1) you're in a hard-hat or helmet zone
01:01 < fenn> 2) you're an everyday guy on the street and dont want 9 zillion people asking you why you're wearing that thing
01:01 < kanzure_> around here in Austin the majority of us either go naked or with golden ssj2 hair, so it's natural
01:03 < kanzure_> "According to eMagin, the Eyebud 800 delivers a viewing experience as if viewing a 105-inch screen from 12 feet, offering a 40-degree field of view of whatever is playing for up to 6 hours. Also, the monocle viewing piece can be worn on either the left or right side, "
01:03 < kanzure_> http://www.infosyncworld.net/resources/products/emagin/emagin_eyebud_800_pt00.jpg
01:03 < kanzure_> bigger image of that first one
01:03 < kanzure_> http://igargoyle.com/archives/450ipodscreen_garyjones.jpg
01:03 < fenn> but super saiya armor would be so uncomfortable in the texas heat, and the blue/orange gi + scouter would send a confusing message
01:03 < bkero> Eyebud just sounds painful
01:03 < bkero> I believe everybody would think you were a homosexual.
01:04 < kanzure_> ooh
01:04 < fenn> bkero: it might just be the default in austin
01:04 < kanzure_> http://groups.google.com/group/Wear-Hard
01:04 < kanzure_> behold
01:04 < kanzure_> the revival of wear-hard
01:04 < kanzure_> with lots of spam. Sigh.
01:05 < fenn> wear-hard is dead?
01:05 < fenn> the original i mean
01:05 < kanzure_> http://igargoyle.com/archives/geowearable.jpg <- what's going on here? It looks like it's on a very flimsy connection behind the ear
01:09 < fenn> that's a microoptical (defunct brand)
01:09 < fenn> it clips on the glasses
01:10 < fenn> just a wire going behind the ear
01:10 < fenn> i think maybe he had some kind of extra wires going to the display for some reason
01:11 < kanzure> I think myvu is doing some false advertizing
01:11 < kanzure> I don't see the monocle on their site
01:12 < kanzure_> oops, different company
01:12 < kanzure_> http://www.engadget.com/2006/01/02/emagins-eyebud-for-the-ipod/
01:14 < fenn> much prefer this: http://www.tribuneindia.com/2003/20031204/biz2.jpg
01:14 < fenn> (microoptical)
01:14 < kanzure_> http://www.3dvisor.com/
01:14 < kanzure> fenn: that's sign of OCD for elegance right there :)
01:15 < fenn> what, not having a big ugly thing strapped to my face?
01:15 < fenn> it's sheer pragmatism, my dear
01:16 < kanzure> argh, even "eyebud" is linking over to their full-visor only
01:16 < fenn> even better would be to just pipe the image up through fiber optics somehow
01:18 < fenn> is there some brick-and-mortar store where you can actually try these things out?
01:18 < fenn> i mean it's not like shopping for a new monitor
01:21 < kanzure> Gary Jones. I'm going to hunt down this bastard.
01:24 < kanzure_> http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/ces/live-from-ces-eyebud-800-146626.php
01:24 < kanzure_> eyebud 800 supposedly
01:24 < kanzure_> 24 bit SVGA 800x600
01:27 < fenn> i wonder where they source the OLED display.. since Osram closed the only(?) OLED factory
01:27 < fenn> er, OLED display factory
01:28 < kanzure> well I can't seem to find where to buy an 'eyebud 800' on the net
01:28 < kanzure> so maybe that answers your question
01:28 < kanzure> when did Osram close?
01:28 < fenn> last year
01:28 < kanzure> that might explain it.
01:29 < fenn> Osram is a lighting company and decided to get out of the display business, so they sold the rights, and it probably just got swept under the rug from there
01:30 < kanzure_> http://www.nikon.com/about/news/2008/1007_up300_01.htm
01:30  * kanzure_ bows to Nikon
01:31 < kanzure_> $678 price tag
01:31 < kanzure_> blah
01:31 < kanzure_> http://www.upstore.jp/
01:32 < fenn> hmm looks like sony has jumped on the OLED display ride
01:33 < kanzure_> http://www.upxup.jp/
01:33 < kanzure_> http://www.upxup.jp/news/
01:36 < fenn> $700 isnt bad, relatively speaking
01:36 < fenn> but it's only 640x480
01:36 < kanzure_> http://www.flickr.com/photos/21355799@N02/2964777100/ 
01:36 < kanzure> I guess I just want the plastic more than anything
01:37 < kanzure> I should be able to source my own microdisplay
01:37 < kanzure_> http://www.gizmag.com/nikon-media-port-up/10461/
01:37 < kanzure_> in fact it looks like it's just a simple mount on the side of headphones
01:37 < kanzure_> why didn't I think of that
01:38 < fenn> sure, gumstixk would fit in headphones just fine
01:38 < kanzure_> "
01:38 < kanzure_> Gumstix develops and sells small, low cost, highly functional Linux computers for rapid product development and production systems."
01:38 < kanzure_> "
01:38 < kanzure_> Biologically inspired by the common carp, the robotic, gumstix-driven fish could avoid objects and swim around a specially designed tank entirely of their ."
01:39 < fenn> yes, people with too much money again
01:39 < kanzure_> Every time on the internet that I find something dropping off in mid-sentence, I inadvertedly imagine the author having a horrible, horrible and untimely death.
01:40 < fenn> or perhaps it's a superhero, slaughtering idiot bloggers and preventing us all from egregious mental harm
01:40 < kanzure> I think this could be solved by a simple hole drilled into the side of a headphone case (remove the speaker first to prevent damage)
01:41 < kanzure> and then a small screw and small washer to mount a plastic piece that extends out and somehow carries the microdisplay
01:41 < fenn> it's more complicated than that, you have to drive this display somehow
01:41 < fenn> (fancy electronics)
01:41 < kanzure> not just some pins from a PIC/AVR/beagle/arduino?
01:42 < kanzure>  /parallax?
01:42 < fenn> ugh
01:42 < kanzure> really.
01:42 < kanzure> huh.
01:42 < fenn> parallax = beginner attempt at VLSI
01:42 < kanzure> right right
01:42 < fenn> anyway..
01:42 < kanzure> but Austinites get free shit for mentioning parallax, so :/
01:42 < fenn> PIC would be fast enough to do like Atari style graphics
01:43 < kanzure> what, refresh rate ?
01:43 < kanzure> oh, also memory size
01:43 < kanzure> hrm
01:43 < kanzure> not going to do 800x600 on a PIC :)
01:43 < fenn> what you really want is some kind of FPGA to take a regular video signal like HDMI and turn it into whatever weird protocol/signal your display needs
01:44 < fenn> but FPGA's draw a lot of power so better hope it fits in a CPLD
01:44 < kanzure> CPLD?
01:44 < fenn> small FPGA, sorta
01:45 < bkero>  Beagles :)
01:45 < bkero> Or arduino
01:45 < kanzure> And what about the 800x600 stuff going on there?
01:45 < kanzure> or greater
01:46 < fenn> what about what?
01:46 < kanzure> on an arduino
01:46 < kanzure> what's the memory size and have people had these things driving video displays?
01:46 < kanzure> at any respectable resolution?
01:46 < fenn> no
01:46 < bkero> Beagle has a 32MB framebuffer, it'll do 1280x1024@32
01:46 < fenn> arduino has like 128k memory max
01:46 < kanzure> hehe 128k
01:46 < bkero> I'm diong 1680x1050x48
01:47 < kanzure> 32 MB framebuffer is good
01:47 < kanzure> people used to be able to cheaply pick up 16 MB PCI cards :/
01:47 < kanzure> to add monitors to a box
01:47 < fenn> beagle could easily output a gazillion pixel display, but you have to figure out how to interface it
01:47 < kanzure> yeah, fancy wiring tricks
01:47 < bkero> kanzure: You can get $25 video cards to add monitors to a box
01:47  * kanzure remembers back when he was trying to wire up his N64 controller to RS232
01:47 < bkero> fenn: It has an HDMI output :)
01:48 < fenn> oh btw beagle has s-video out too, so most pre-built HUD's will work
01:48 < bkero> Yup
01:48 < fenn> i'm gonna wait at least until they release the 256MB RAM beagle
01:49 < kanzure> s-video out too? yay
01:50 < bkero> Rev C is rumoured to have 256
01:50 < bkero> I really don't need 256 though.  128 is fine for a framebuffer for a terminal
01:50 < bkero> BTW the graphics chipset has 3d accel and h264 accel :)
01:50 < bkero> So it can play 720p
01:50 < kanzure_> http://www.msefi.com/index.php open fuel injection project
01:51 < bkero> I have a megasquirt running my car
01:52 < kanzure_> opera:illegal-url-25
01:52 < kanzure_>  http://www.open-ecg-project.org,
01:52 < kanzure_>  http://www.open-ecg-project.org
01:53 < kanzure_> bah
01:53 < kanzure_> as of Dec 3rd
02:48 < kanzure_> http://metamodern.com/ Drexler blogs
02:49 < kanzure_> heh, he mentions Paul Rothemund :)
02:49 < kanzure_> (hi Paul!)
02:55 < bkero> paul
02:55 < kanzure> yeah, I was talking with him over the summer about me research
02:56 < bkero> How many projects do you have university funding for now?
02:56 < kanzure> I'm working under at least two grants, if that's what you mean.
02:57 < kanzure> I count multiple projects under each grant though
02:57 < kanzure> NSF and DARPA at the moment.
03:11 < ybit> they are both supporting what exactly?
03:11 < kanzure> Me.
03:12 < ybit> heh, which of your projects? :)
03:13 < kanzure> VOICED and the bioreactor/biodesel/fuel stuff.
03:14 < ybit> fav. open manufacturing site?
03:14 < kanzure> ?
03:14 < kanzure> fav?
03:14 < ybit> sure
03:15 < kanzure> what does fav mean?
03:15 < ybit> the one you visit most often
03:15 < kanzure> the mailing list I guess
03:15 < kanzure> but I just read that in my inbox
03:15 < ybit> no particular site
03:15 < ybit> http://p2pfoundation.net/Open_Manufacturing doesn't have much
03:15 < kanzure> I play around with p2pfoundation.net I guess
03:15 < kanzure> try http://p2pfoundation.net/Product_Hacking
03:15 < kanzure> http://p2pfoundation.net/Category:Design
03:16 < kanzure> http://groups.google.com/group/openmanufacturing
03:16 < bkero> NYC Resistor also has some 2-axis CNC mills
03:16 < bkero> Wait, there's a third access
03:16 < bkero> *Axis
03:33 < wrldpc_> http://digg.com/gadgets/Open_Source_DIY_EEG_Machine_OpenEEG
03:33 < wrldpc_> old news
03:33 < wrldpc_> i submitted it anyway though ... nothing on digg about it
03:33 < kanzure> EEG != ECG per-se.
03:33 < wrldpc_> yeah linked to that openECG proj. in the comments too
03:34 < kanzure> I'm still not a big fan of EEG.
03:34 < kanzure> What was EEG originally designed for anyway?
03:34 < kanzure> I mean, it's never really used for anything good
03:34 < kanzure> usually people are trying to "read teh minds" from a single electrical potential aggregate signal out of 100 billion neurons and god knows how many trillions of synapses 
03:34 < kanzure> but this is generally _wrong_
03:34 < wrldpc_> rudimentary brainwave ... yeah
03:34 < wrldpc_> lol where's the DIY fMRI?
03:35 < kanzure> there was an article in SciAm recently about a portable fMRI
03:35 < kanzure> but it was closed source.
03:35 < wrldpc_> it's low resolution but it's still kinda neat .. oh yeah?
03:35 < kanzure> Something more readily doable by an amateur might be the EROS stuff
03:35 < wrldpc_> there was an article in techreview about a DIY MRI some guys at MIT built.
03:35 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Brain_imaging
03:35 < wrldpc_> nice
03:35 < kanzure> link?
03:35 < wrldpc_> standby
03:37 < wrldpc_> http://www.technologyreview.com/Biotech/20548/page1/
03:38 < wrldpc_> what was jihad talking about he threw together an electron tunneling microscope?
03:38 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/instrumentation/instru.html for diy STM, SEM, ATM stuff.
03:39 < kanzure> or maybe it's the other way around
03:39 < wrldpc_> "There is currently no text in this page, you can search for this page title in other pages or edit this page."
03:39 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/instru/instrumentation.html
03:39 < wrldpc_> cool
03:48 < wrldpc_> bryan bishop the scientific iron mystic fire wizard higher physics titan who supply the missions
03:52 < kanzure> What's this about, wrldpc_ ?
03:52 < wrldpc_> i just made that up
03:52 < wrldpc_> synthesize antidotes from viper venom
03:53 < wrldpc_> pardon my poetry, sir
04:06 < kanzure> Woah, xmms is blown from my box. What's going on? apt-get install xmms doesn't do anything, and apt-get install xmms2 only gets me the server daemon.
04:08  * kanzure had to do a dpkg -i --ignore-depends=libglib1.2 xmms_1.2.10+2006..
04:11 < kanzure> oddly my playlist was preserved
04:17 < xp_prg> anyone know a good place to get car insurance on the internet?
04:45 < bkero> kanzure: You should try mpd :)
04:45 < bkero> xp_prg: I've had good luck with progressive
04:46 < bkero> MUCH cheaper than other places
04:46 < bkero> My first bill was $250 for 6 months
04:50 < gene> kanzure want to know how to get some chitosan quick n easy?
04:52 < gene> nevermind found it in bulk as a supplement
04:52 < gene> http://www.vitacost.com/NSI-Chitosan
04:52 < gene> you can sell anything as a supplement
04:52 < gene> absolutely anything
04:53 < gene> even ground up shrimp exoskeletons
04:56 < gene> check this out sunlight pumped laser http://www.opticalfutures.com/harvesting_solar_with_lasers
05:28 < gene> http://www.belmont.k12.ca.us/ralston/programs/itech/SpaceSettlement/spaceresvol2/thermalmanagement.html
05:28 < gene> ORBITAL VERSION
05:28 < gene> hehehehehehehehe......
05:54 < bkero> I'm thinking about making a trip to AZ to get an implant
06:02 < ppk> what kind?
06:03 < ppk> rfid?
06:09 < bkero> Magnetic
06:09 < bkero> http://www.wired.com/gadgets/mods/news/2006/06/71087
06:14 < gene> Make sure the mod parlour you go to uses clean equipment
06:14 < gene> you would't want any infection now would you
06:15 < gene> why do you wan to implant a magnet in your hand?
06:19 < ppk> that's really cool
06:19 < bkero> I hack hardware a lot
06:19 < bkero> It would really help in diagnosing circuits
06:20 < ppk> I'd be concerned about not being able to do certain things though
06:20 < bkero> Like what?
06:20 < ppk> like getting an MRI
06:20 < gene> what if you want to take apart a harddrive?
06:20 < ppk> in case of an emergency
06:20 < bkero> An emergency MRI?
06:20 < ppk> lol
06:20 < ppk> if I suffered from a stroke or something
06:20 < ppk> and they wanted an image
06:21 < bkero> Questionable whether it would be torn out or not
06:21 < gene> you should just get a magnetic ring instead
06:21 < bkero> That's not really the same thing :/
06:21 < gene> it would fly probably turn into a bullet
06:21 < gene> however
06:22 < gene> there are magnetic metamaterials
06:22 < gene> that might do the trick
06:22 < bkero> ?
06:22 < ppk> o
06:22 < ppk> they talk about MRIs 
06:22 < ppk> in the second page
06:25 < gene> a magnetic metamaterial might be able to cloak the magnet from the MRI magnetic field
06:26 < gene> but you might just get a magnetic ring instead
06:27 < gene> in fact if you hold a neodyium magnet near the base of a halogen light you can feel the oscillating 60 hz magnetic field
06:29 < gene> http://arxivblog.com/?p=80
06:29 < gene> magnetic metamaterial
06:30 < gene> I mean magnetic cloaking
06:32 < bkero> ...
06:33 < bkero> You want me to implant a sheet of lead that's cooled to superconducting temperatures?
06:54 < gene> no
06:55 < gene> you put your hand in it when you get an mri
12:18 < kanzure_> "
12:18 < kanzure_> The problem is that verification requires a specification, and a specification that is complete enough to be correct is also complete enough to be automatically implemented through stepwise transformation (though it may be inefficient)."
12:27 < kanzure_> "Kanjiteru aizu"
12:41 < kanzure_> http://www.allproducts.com/manufacture97/headphone/product1.jpg Shouldn't this work? except for the poor plastic connection
12:56 < kanzure_> " DIY Touchscreen Eee PC" <- heh
13:01 < kanzure_> http://www.natureinterface.com/e/ni04/P063-065/0104_063+01.jpg eyetrek ($700, no longer made, some in stock in a few places online though)
13:01 < kanzure_> http://www.vrealities.com/eyetrek.html
13:05 < kanzure_> http://vrealities.com/i-port.html iport. price: $6500
13:05 < kanzure_> hahah.
13:05 < kanzure_> but otherwise basically what I'd want.
13:08 < kanzure_> http://www.creativedis.com/
13:09 < kanzure_> http://vrealities.com/vr1monocular.html another one for $1400..
13:10 < kanzure_> http://vrealities.com/eyetopcentra.html ah, here's one for $300
13:10 < kanzure_> http://www.helihobby.com/html/eyetop.html
13:13 < kanzure_> some reviewing: http://www.yb2normal.com/eyetop.html
13:13 < kanzure_> http://salestores.com/eyetopbu.html here's one for $170
13:14 < kanzure_> http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_trksid=m38&_nkw=eyetop&_sacat=See-All-Categories $200 on ebay ..
13:15 < kanzure_> http://www.google.com/product_url?q=http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-43310-8196-0/2%3Fmpre%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fcgi.ebay.com%252Feyetop-video-glasses%252C-used-once.-lists-%2524399_W0QQitemZ130271853847QQcmdZViewItem&fr=AGlbdEUn2N2LU-enr_gP_FTbtR1fEmJh68mZ269UWZXHtBbO1iAyFA6KrJXUUj4VfFjq2GCkE36jP4OrWDm7Ncn0DNmsbdqkRL6jdt2uD5Hbn4_t5LywX8GU5xB7eQmyomJiP9Hb80scMvRpJHrcPKM0mOqJxPjp5U3F-VkJWql_mQy9R7XT81gF-r43wO4ucGcAgVMYSkbOBtf4sT8nCD16-C63LHO6NX3n5YUEg6
13:15 < kanzure_> bastards
13:15 < kanzure_> somebody got them for $80 :)
15:13 < bkero> Not bad
16:58 < kanzure_-> Hello.
17:04 < kanzure_-> eMagin got back with me, they don't sell the monocular advertized item.
17:11 < bkero> :/
17:11 < bkero> But they have it advertized on their site?
17:18 < gene> kanzure could you send me the chitosan paper
17:22 < kanzure_-> it wasn't a paper :(
17:22 < kanzure_-> it was a talk
17:22 < kanzure_-> bkero: They're jerks, I know.
17:22 < kanzure_-> bkero: Check out "eyeport" though.
17:23 < gene> those bastard
17:23 < kanzure_-> gene: they go from crushed crab shells in the lab
17:24 < kanzure_-> to printed organic transistors
17:24 < gene> I know that
17:24 < gene> you dissolve the crab shells in acetic acid
17:24 < kanzure_-> I just thought it requires some re-emphasis :) because it's so neat :-)
17:24 < kanzure_-> yep
17:24 < gene> describe the process
17:24 < kanzure_-> he didn't
17:24 < gene> ok
17:25 < gene> how do did they get pattern the chitosan
17:25 < gene> water?
17:26 < gene> was it this: https://buffy.eecs.berkeley.edu/PHP/resabs/resabs.php?f_year=2007&f_submit=one&f_absid=101364
17:27 < gene> damn still requires metal and a substrate
17:29 < gene> http://www.physorg.com/news147698448.html
17:30 < gene> we may not need ligase
17:37 < UtopiahGHML> is there a non gregorian H+ style calendar?
17:37 < UtopiahGHML> something that wouldn't start with the Christ "birth" and that woulnd't center around sun
17:38 < UtopiahGHML> but using a scale based on evolution pace, eventually... non human-centric
17:43 < Phreedom> http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/12/04/1625226&from=rss
17:43 < Phreedom> this is a very promising development
17:43 < Phreedom> abstracting away the site is going to be cool
17:44 < Phreedom> laying this on top of something like i2p can provide privacy
17:44 < Phreedom> and using semantic search can erase boundaries between different repos
18:29 < kanzure_-> Phreedom: the gittorrent guy is referenced on http://heybryan.org/exp.html already, at debian re: redlining the internet infrastructure for a week
18:30 -!- UtopiahG1ML is now known as UtopiahGHML
19:13 -!- gene_ is now known as gene
19:23 < Phreedom> kanzure_-: you're everywhere
19:40 -!- UtopiahG1ML is now known as UtopiahGHML
19:46 < kanzure> yes :)
21:38 < fenn> UtopiahGHML: unix epoch
21:39 < UtopiahGHML> yep I thought about it, sth like it's exponential or sth
21:39 < fenn> UtopiahGHML: 100ksec day, Ms week, 100Ms year etc
21:40 < fenn> only really matters if you have an orbital colony
21:40 < fenn> or some other non-earth-surface scenario
21:42 -!- gene_ is now known as gene
21:44 < fenn> UtopiahGHML: unix epoch is used in day-to-day business in the book "a deepness in the sky"
21:45 < fenn> which is about human trading routes between the stars, and how to hack an information age emergence
21:46 < fenn> and mind control
21:47 < UtopiahGHML> fenn: ok for unix epoch as a starting point but unix time is linear, my question is also regarding evolution and it's pace, maybe just adding a second as if it was the same speed than before provide a dangerous bias
21:47 < fenn> well, it's not mind control so much as "applied autism"
21:48 < fenn> you're worried a second is too long?
21:48 < fenn> may i introduce you to my friends milli, micro, nano, femto, pico, and zepto
21:49 < fenn> oo can't forget atto
21:49 < UtopiahGHML> that's not the point
21:49 < UtopiahGHML> the point isn't precision
21:50 < fenn> i'm not following
21:50 < fenn> a second is basically a cognitive time constant for a baseline human
21:50 < fenn> so what's wrong with prefixes of that?
21:50 < UtopiahGHML> which is good for synchronization amongst
21:51 < UtopiahGHML> but which I think gives us a bias regarding evolution
21:51 < fenn> sfw
21:52 < fenn> we also have biases in meter, gram, becquerel, and every other dimensional unit
21:52 < fenn> you have to start somewhere
21:54 < fenn> and while it would be cool to give dimensions in 10^34 planck_lengths, i question the rationale
22:10 < UtopiahGHML> fenn: well that would definitely not be enough and perfect but I think that with an exponential scale one would consider the present moment more carefuly based on the future consequences and I think, in a time (like always?) where organism evolve and the amount of resources available are limited, it could give interesting insights to be use to think in such a way.
22:14 < UtopiahGHML> Id tend to think that you either become more effective or you slowly die.
22:15 < kanzure_-> ffs, "your computation will be done in 3.80265176 years. have fun with that job security."
22:16 < fenn> UtopiahGHML: what do you mean 'exponential scale'? is log base 10 not good enough, and it has to be log base e?
22:16 < kanzure_-> fenn: huh, eric hunting makes his living off of textbook sales, helped raise a company from $10k/yr to $2 mil/yr
22:17 < fenn> how did he manage that?
22:17 < kanzure_-> fenn: and what d oyou think about that eyeport?
22:17 < kanzure_-> Don't know.
22:17 < kanzure_-> but it's not enough apparently for him to get his own workshop, so it doesn't even sound too terribly successful (though positive growth is better than none at all)
22:17 < fenn> apparently he had really good credit, accidentally
22:17 < kanzure_-> why isn't he in here anyway
22:17 < fenn> some people dont like irc
22:18 < fenn> i cant blame them, seeing what a time waste it is 90% of the time :)
22:18 < kanzure_-> impossible?
22:18  * kanzure_- is presently 'wasting' time
22:19 < kanzure_-> huh, I'm on windows now, why aren't I using chrome?
22:20 < gene> want some chitosan?
22:20 < kanzure_-> http://voiced.device.mst.edu/groups/VisualizeIT/wiki/ac2f0/ some stuff from voiced of late.
22:21 < kanzure_-> gene: I don't precisely recall how they were doing their writing process.
22:21 < kanzure_-> I know they were doing imprinting, but how did they make their layers on which to imprint?
22:21 < kanzure_-> At the start of the talk the guy was talking about heating up nano-electrodes and then melting away the chitosan polymer at that location
22:21 < kanzure_-> and something like 10 to 100 nm distance away wouldn't be affected by the extreme heat thanks to the polymer itself.
22:22 < kanzure_-> so maybe he was using some voltage => electrode => thermal/heat method to do patterning of his polymer to imprint with??
22:22 < kanzure_-> that's a pretty tiny area to hope you get right with a metal pin, frankly.
22:22 < fenn> how does it turn into a transistor is what i want to know
22:23 < kanzure_-> I wish I was paying more attention
22:23 < kanzure_-> something about another bioactive compound to make up a gap
22:23 < kanzure_-> it's an organic transistor, so it's slow, but it does do, say, ~60 hertz
22:24 < kanzure_-> not quite something you'd use for microprocessors (it's also leaky, but good for things like infrared detection - he's "selling" it to the military as biosensor stuff more than anything (I'd be ok with slow computers though))
22:24 < kanzure_-> I wish everybody was required to give me their powerpoints when they do presentations.
22:25 < kanzure_-> berkeley
22:25 < kanzure_-> http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/
22:25 < kanzure_-> http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/project/list_projects_by_director.php?PersonID=1086 <- This was the presenter
22:26 < kanzure_-> oh wait, maybe it was this guy: http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/project/list_projects_by_director.php?PersonID=703
22:27 < kanzure_-> "A Cyborg Beetle: Insect Flight Control by a Neural Stimulator"
22:27 < kanzure_-> http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/project/zoom.php?urlmyprojectID=BPN451&URLnode=3
22:28 < fenn> heh "rotating raman spectrometer/microfluidics chip on a CD-ROM" (literally)
22:28 < fenn> http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/project/list_projects_in_thrust.php?thrustID=13&PHPSESSID=5e5a8e5b65ee70b40023dca3705514e6
22:28 < kanzure_-> http://www-bsac.eecs.berkeley.edu/project/show_all_projects_table.php
22:29 < kanzure_-> Quite a number of projects
22:29 < kanzure_-> what's going on here?
22:29 < kanzure_-> "On-Chip DNA Transformation by Local Heat Shock and Cell Cryopreservation"
22:29 < fenn> berkely gets a lot of DARPA grants
22:31 < kanzure_-> http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive.php?comicid=1097 <- good times. "Prof. Jones, I'm shocked that you don't know what my research is about!"
22:41 < fenn> the problem with cyborg beetles is they only live for 20 days, but if you could freeze them it wouldnt matter so much
22:53 < fenn>  interpreting accelerations produced by human gestures as musical signals to allow realtime musical performance. Aquisition of these high resolution acceleration signals is achieved by square millimeter size MEMS sensing devices.
22:55 < fenn> that was '05, i wonder if they succeeded
22:56 < fenn> '03 i mean
23:00 < kanzure_-> "
23:00 < kanzure_-> "thaw the beetles!"
23:00 < kanzure_-> "this means war. thaw the beetles!"
23:00 < kanzure_-> Hey Splicer.
23:01 < kanzure_-> re: human gestures as musical signals. That's interesting. What is the sensor? Vern Graner here in Austin has done ultrasound sensors for playing musical instruments, but your hand has to be in front of the sensor (and it's just a distance calculation)
23:01 < kanzure_-> uh, not an ultrasound sensor, I guess that's really an ultrasound generator + receiver too.
23:15 < fenn> lots of ways to make an accelerometr
23:15 < fenn> simplest is just a ball on a stick
23:15 < fenn> ball flexes the stick because its mass is greater
23:17 < kanzure_-> oh, a wearable
23:17 < fenn> MEMS
23:17 < fenn> <1mm
23:17 < fenn> i wonder how you're supposed to power it
23:27 < gene> thaw the beetles did I miss something?
23:28 < gene> cyborg insects?
23:28 < gene> why power it fenn?
23:28 < gene> when you could use RFID or leach energy from the motion
23:33 < fenn> gene: because rfid requires a big antenna usually
23:33 < gene> usually...
23:34 < fenn> well, i'm no RFID expert
23:34 < gene> they can make RFID chips the size of salt cubes
23:34 < fenn> but you have to squeeze the antenna onto the 1mm chip somehow
23:35 < gene> http://www.technovelgy.com/ct/Science-Fiction-News.asp?NewsNum=939
23:35 < gene> 0.05 mm RFID tags
23:35 < gene> of course you might not get much range from them
23:36 < gene> but if your gluing them to your hands and want to  use them with your laptop....
23:37 < fenn> with my not-laptop
23:38 < gene> close enough
23:38 < gene> big RFID antenna
23:48 < kanzure_-> ybit: Are you going to read the om archive like you did "hb"?
23:55 < gene> I think I just found an legal exploit in the patent system
23:56 < gene> in Iraq at least
23:56 < gene> for ICs
23:56 < gene> for the circuit
23:57 < gene> for circuits
23:57 < gene> they define design as the Three-dimensional array of the elements constituting the circuit
23:57 < gene> forming the integrated circuit or specifically prepared for manufacturing the
23:57 < gene> integrated circuit.
23:58 < gene> change the change the shape a bit change the 3d array