--- Day changed Thu Mar 19 2009
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00:41 < gene> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/03/090318094642.htm
00:41 < gene> bacteria in the stratosphere
00:43 < gene> what are bacteria  doing in the stratosphere?
00:45 < gene> heck if there's bacteria in the stratosphere, why doesn't something feed off of them
00:45 < fenn> i wish they would do isotope analysis on them
00:46 < fenn> the premise is that the bacteria come from interstellar space and drift down to earth
00:47 < gene> whoa that'd be weird
00:47 < gene> you'd expect panspermia to be a rare event
00:47 < fenn> not at all
00:47 < gene> I doubt they're from intersteller space though
00:48 < fenn> science is just a series of events showing how earth isn't the center of the universe
00:48 < gene> they've got some similarity with life on earth
00:48 < fenn> hey dumbass, paradigm shift
00:48 < willPow3r> what are you doing in the stratosphere bacteria? you don't belong there, you can't even breathe there bacteria
00:48 < fenn> if there's bacteria in outer space, life didn't originate on earth
00:48 < gene> heh
00:48 < fenn> that means life on earth was seeded by these bacteria drifting in
00:49 < gene> well fenn, they found a genus of janibacter
00:49 < fenn> so that's why they are genetically similar
00:49 < gene> you want me to do a genetic comparison of janibacter genome to the human genome?
00:49 < gene> do you?
00:49 < fenn> not really
00:50 < gene> but I don't get it what the heck are bacteria doing up there?
00:50 < gene> carrying out photosynthesis
00:51 < fenn> there aren't any air currents in the stratosphere so they couldnt be blown there by winds
00:51 < gene> I wonder if they live there or just got carried there by say jet liners
00:51 < fenn> the only way to get there is by volcano or from outer space
00:51 < gene> I wonder if they came from enceladus
00:51 < fenn> and they are careful not to do sampling after a volcano eruption
00:52 < fenn> did you know that the surface of comets are darker than photo copier toner?
00:52 < gene> well you never know 
00:52 < gene> really?
00:52 < gene> well then, I think we found a new source of toner
00:53 < gene> damn I wonder if there is life on enceladus or europa
00:54 < gene> and if there isn't if we can solve that
00:54 < gene> by shooting a bunch of bacteria into it
00:57 < gene> I wonder if there are any clouds at 40 km
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01:15 < kanzure> meh, I had that paper on my server btw
01:16 < kanzure> I don't know if he knows how to do genome analysis
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01:19 < fenn> dunno if i ever ranted about the red rain phenomenon: http://www.earthfiles.com/news.php?ID=1526&category=Science
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01:34 < kanzure> nope
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10:33 < kanzure> http://blog.makezine.com/archive/2009/03/help_get_a_hacker_space_running_in.html?CMP=OTC-0D6B48984890
10:33 < kanzure> don't know if we'll want to eventually make a similar announcement or not
10:44 < kanzure> http://www.ist.caltech.edu/mpp/ molecular programming project (winfree/rothemund)
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11:33 < kanzure> huh
11:33 < kanzure> contact electrochemical replication
11:36 < kanzure> Contact Electrochemical Replication of Hydrophilic−Hydrophobic Monolayer Patterns http://is.gd/o2Kq
11:49 < kanzure> crap. CyberKinetics (the MEA folks) are going out of business.
11:50 < kanzure> http://www.neurometrix.com/
11:56 < kanzure> fuck, it made wired? http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/2009/03/open-source-har.html
11:56 < kanzure> (the osh "bank" bullshit)
11:56 < kanzure> "Huynh and Stack are managing the process through a Excel spreadsheet.
11:56 < kanzure> "
11:56 < kanzure> argh
11:56 < kanzure> wtf is wrong with this world
12:09 < kanzure> you make an excel spreadsheet and get in the news
12:09 < kanzure> blah. I need to go punch a baby.
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12:35 < UtopiahGHML> regarding http://www.ist.caltech.edu/mpp http://www.jcheminf.com/ started recently AFAIK
12:40 < kanzure> http://www.tamasoft.co.jp/pepakura-en/download/viewer.html 
12:40 < kanzure> http://www.tamasoft.co.jp/pepakura-en/
12:40 < kanzure> have we gone over this 'pepakura design software' before?
12:41 < kanzure> also, 3d pokemon papercraft: http://paperpokes.blogspot.com/
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15:00 < kanzure> fenn: the osh bank stuff made it to wired.com :(
15:46 < kanzure> UTCS Distinguished Lecture Series: Richard Stallman/Free Software Foundation (gnu.org): "Copyright vs. Community in the Age of Computer Networks" WEL 1.308, Friday, April 24, 2009 2:15 p.m.
15:46 < kanzure> oh snap
15:46 < bkero> kanzure: do it
15:46 < bkero> Have a beard-off with RMS
15:46 < bkero> You always lose, but it's always fun
15:48 < kanzure> gah, but I shaved :(
15:52 < bkero> :(
15:52 < bkero> Glue it back on?
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16:55 < kanzure> could a burning a CD be used as a way to make a mask for photolithography? :/
17:17 < fenn> ffs this secrecy crap pisses me off
17:17 < fenn> "Bre Pettis demonstrated the prototype device during SxSW Festival"
17:19 < kanzure> one of the daves I know was there and chatted with bre for a while (not the one you know)
17:19 < fenn> ya treadwell
17:19 < kanzure> oh crap
17:19 < kanzure> yes
17:19 < kanzure> oh, I forwarded his message to om
17:19 < kanzure> that's right.
17:20 < kanzure> I sent a massive email to BRLCAD about their GSoC involvement. I offered to put graphsynth under the hood for the constraints satisfaction engine
17:20 < fenn> and now i find out the book i'm reading (title Themepunks) is going to be re-titled "Makers" - dammit!
17:20 < kanzure> sucks how much things suck, eh?
17:20 < fenn> graphsynth isn't a constraints engine
17:20 < fenn> what are you thinking?
17:20 < kanzure> ho ho ho, but it can solve the same problems
17:20 < fenn> not quantitatively
17:21 < kanzure> that's not entirely true
17:21 < fenn> educate me
17:21 < fenn> also, graphsynth is c#
17:21 < fenn> i doubt brl-cad would go for that
17:21 < kanzure> right, that's definitely an issue
17:21 < kanzure> um, so, the same way that the gears are generated quantitatively :)
17:22 < fenn> iirc the gears were all spinning the wrong speeds
17:22 < kanzure> that had nothing to do with graphsynth
17:22 < fenn> it was just random numbers right?
17:22 < kanzure> yep, everything to do with glxgears
17:23 < kanzure> there's probably something better than graphsynth for a real constraints engine that is already implemented somewhere of course
17:23 < kanzure> but their previous constraints attempt was the boost graph library
17:23 < kanzure> and if they want to do graphs, let's do graphs :p
17:39 < kanzure> todo: write up an article on how to convert a CD drive into an optical data link (I guess just a PCB with the right interconnects)
17:44 < fenn> first you gotta figure out how to do that
17:44 < fenn> not like i see the point though
17:45 < kanzure> there's not much of one, I just ran into a random paper while I was searching for references to this other paper thingy about CDs apparently having spiral microchannels
17:45 < kanzure> (but now that I look at it, it's apparent that they fabricated that pattern on to the CDs via PDMS)
17:48 < fenn> they use laser engraved glass i think
17:49 < fenn> reprap is on-par with commercial RP machines now: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Cii6PZ78wNc/ScD8n-LvOhI/AAAAAAAAAFE/6-o4ezLUsuI/s1600-h/WineG_ABS.jpg
17:50 < fenn> assuming someone can duplicate this person's methods
17:50 < fenn> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Cii6PZ78wNc/ScD9RMyB_xI/AAAAAAAAAFU/TMP-8zS8yRQ/s1600-h/WineG_ABS10.jpg
18:08 < kanzure> scotch tape can transfer layers of sharpie circuits to the polycarbonate surface of a CD (where there are microchannels) and thus creating wells, where fluid can flow over into the next microchannel/groove, but not going to the sides (where sharpie markings would be located, supposedly)
19:22 < gene> sweet
19:22 < gene> kanzurer
19:23 < gene> I'm working on a fluidic amplifier right now
19:23 < gene> fenn, more info on that
19:23 < gene> is that nophead?
19:23 < gene> if so, then reprap is not on par
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19:39 < fenn> no it's tony fletcher
19:39 < fenn> see builders.reprap.org
19:39 < gene> never heard of him
19:39 < fenn> me either
19:40 < gene> is that with a reprap?
19:41 < fenn> i guess he is associated with bfb somehow
19:42 < gene> that is with a reprap?
19:42 < gene> if it is, holy shit
19:42 < fenn> well, RapMan but close enough
19:44 < gene> oh that guy
19:44 < gene> the guy who's also building some sort of fusion reactor I believe
19:46 < gene> that is a reprap
19:46 < gene> rapman=reprap kit
19:47 < gene> wow
19:47 < gene> original website
19:50 < fenn> you're thinking of famulus == http://prometheusfusionperfection.wordpress.com/
19:51 < gene> yeah I am
19:51 < gene> now why the heck is my caliper flashin?
19:54 < fenn> heh the old dodacahedral hamiltonian path problem
19:54 < fenn> here's one solution http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~sequin/SCULPTS/CHS_miniSculpts/HamiltonianPaths/DodHpFDiagD.JPG
19:54 < gene> never heard of it
19:55 < fenn> he has to wrap a wire around each loop exactly once (preferably)
19:56 < gene> oh cool
19:56 < gene> do you mind sending me the link to the original webpage for that
19:56 < fenn>  
19:56 < fenn> hm
19:56 < fenn> http://www.eecs.berkeley.edu/~sequin/SCULPTS/sequin.html
19:57 < fenn> yuck http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~sequin/SCULPTS/CHS_miniSculpts/HamiltonianPaths/DodHamPathB.JPG
19:57 < fenn> bathsheba kicks this guy's ass
19:58 < gene> damn that famulus guy made some progress
19:59 < gene> artists are begining to think 3d printed art is noobish
19:59 < fenn> that's good
19:59 < fenn> maybe we'll see some real art now
19:59 < fenn> i mean, more than just "look ma, VR!"
20:00 < gene> well one of the art groups I met with on campus recently wants to do 3d printer art too
20:00 < gene> but I have other ideas
20:00 < gene> expect something interesting....
20:00 < fenn> i'd like to see FDM where the grain follows the actual shape, like isolines on those mathematical surfaces
20:01 < fenn> instead of just raster scan
20:01 < gene> oh damn
20:01 < fenn> what art group? actlab?
20:01 < gene> someone else
20:01 < gene> art and science group
20:04 < gene> open to everyone if you want in
20:07 < fenn> link?
20:10 < gene> let me see if they have a site yet
20:10 < fenn> do you know anywhere i can go that has HDMI monitors that i can hook a beagleboard to?
20:11 < gene> what's a beagleboard?
20:11 < fenn> a toy
20:11 < gene> try fry's they won't mind
20:12 < fenn> i wonder how to fake out a computer into thinking my AVR is a keyboard
20:13 < gene> http://artscienceaustin.blogspot.com/
20:13 < gene> oh yes they got a site now
20:14 < fenn> hm is this some kind of steampunk club :)
20:14 < gene> no
20:14 < gene> art group
20:15 < gene> you know the "BEWARE OF ZOMBIES" sign hack? well someone 'knows the person who did it' if you know what I mean
20:15 < fenn> Potentially new resources for group
20:15 < fenn> 3-D printer in Engineering
20:15 < fenn> 3-D printer in Architecture
20:15 < fenn> Laser cutter in Architecture 
20:15 < gene> 3-D printer in geology
20:15 < fenn> is that like "REJECT CHRIST RECEIVE BACON"?
20:16 < gene> hahahahahah
20:18 < gene> argh, how the heck do I use Qcad
20:19 < fenn> with lots of clicking
20:19 < fenn> are you drawing a gear? :)
20:19 < gene> no
20:20 < gene> trying to draw a template for a cover plate for a fluidic amplifier
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20:21 < gene> so I can electroetch it
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21:38 < fenn> omg <3 eric hunting
21:45 < kanzure> we all do :)
21:46 < kanzure> but, out of curiosity, what did he do this time?
21:54 < fenn> put a troll in his place
21:54 < fenn> http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/luf-team/message/10575
21:55 < kanzure> was this the "cult" thread?
21:56 < kanzure> ah, no, the funeral thread
21:56 < fenn> same thing really
21:58 < kanzure> I wonder how terrible it would be to be in an eric hunting cult
22:00 < fenn> probably not too bad
22:00 < kanzure> multi-volume manifestos every Tuesday and Thursday
22:00 < fenn> required zen classes
22:00 < kanzure> the zen-kinda meaning of "required" ? heh
22:02 < fenn> scroll down to "Tjan opened the door": http://dir.salon.com/story/tech/feature/2005/10/10/themepunks_5/index2.html
22:02 < fenn> that's how i want the lab to work
22:03 < kanzure> there's an ad
22:03 < kanzure> good god what is this crap
22:03 < kanzure> ah, the link was offset from the "close this ad" text
22:06 < kanzure> hm
22:08 < kanzure> I guess it's better than what we currently have
22:08 < fenn> currently = what?
22:09 < kanzure> it doesn't raelly fix the problems of organization
22:09 < kanzure> http://heybryan.org/folders.html
22:09 < kanzure> so your stuff goes into random folders now, big deal?
22:10 < fenn> sure we still need an ontology for "browsing" and the tub labeling/sorting would reflect this
22:10 < fenn> but a search engine sidesteps the problems of ontologies and miscategorization
22:11 < fenn> and RFID fixes the inventory "is it there?" problem
22:11 < fenn> which i was going to try to do with digital weight scales
22:11 < kanzure> "is the right amount of mass there" ?
22:11 < fenn> yeah
22:12 < fenn> i think we'll still have to do something like that for qty items like hardware or consumables
22:12 < fenn> but really an accurate mass is a pretty good identifier
22:13 < kanzure> if we're going to bother to implement all of the typical hard drive file system tools and standards, we might as well just be serious about it and implement it in terms of FUSE or something
22:14 < kanzure> the light-up-the-box model is basically like running `which` or `locate`
22:14 < kanzure> (locate runs off of a cache, `find` is the one that is a snail)
22:14 < fenn> i'm not going to fall into the filesystem trap
22:14 < kanzure> but that's what this is, no?
22:14 < fenn> unix tools are nice
22:14 < fenn> but it's a database, not a filesystem
22:14 < kanzure> oh look, 
22:15 < kanzure> http://www.tagsistant.net/
22:15 < kanzure> "a semantic filesystem for Linux and BSD kernels"
22:15  * kanzure rolls his eyes
22:16 < fenn> sure, filesystems are convenient
22:16 < fenn> but that's only because unix has totally perverted the meaning of "file"
22:16 < fenn> something like /proc would be useful
22:17 < fenn> i proposed this for emc2's HAL
22:17 < kanzure> isn't /proc just some extra information about /dev ?
22:17 < kanzure> i.e., i've retried processor temperatures from /proc 
22:17 < fenn>  /proc is a view into the kernel's status
22:18 < fenn> see man proc
22:18 < fenn> run proc run
22:19 < kanzure> I wish objects weren't so dead.
22:21 < kanzure> ok, anyway, yeah, it's an ok idea
22:21 < kanzure> I should only complain about objects if I have the solution these days :) and I don't.
22:21 < fenn> i was just surprised at how close doctorow was to my thinking
22:22 < kanzure> I do like the feature of being able to put anything anywhere
22:22 < kanzure> in the sense that it's "just out of the way"
22:22 < fenn> yeah, optimal close packing of "stuff"
22:22 < kanzure> Unified Theory of Stuff
22:22 < kanzure> "stuff flows to fill all available niches"
22:22 < fenn> you do need some sort of backup organization scheme though in case your computers all die
22:22 < kanzure> "stuff takes shape in the eye of the coder"
22:23 < kanzure> fenn: weekly print-outs from the server's cache?
22:23 < fenn> "stuff expands to fill available capacity"
22:23 < fenn> kanzure: i'm thinking disaster readiness
22:23 < fenn> not backup
22:24 < kanzure> keep small backpacks of disaster prepardness kits?
22:24 < fenn> insufficient functionality
22:24 < fenn> you dont go to a fablab in a disaster for a backpack
22:25 < kanzure> I've failed to think.
22:25 < kanzure> what are we talking about?
22:25 < fenn> inventory systems
22:25 < kanzure> minimal things that you need in case you are about to die?
22:25 < kanzure> optimal functionality when nothing is working?
22:25 < fenn> no, just maximizing functionality in a variety of circumstances
22:26 < fenn> not any sort of single mindedness
22:26 < kanzure> "gee, if only during spring cleaning I truly did an N^N categorization of everything" ?
22:26 < fenn> no single point of failure, basically
22:27 < fenn> categorization doesn't have to be perfect because you have a search engine
22:27 < fenn> search engine doesn't have to be 100% reliable because you have an ontology
22:28 < fenn> we won't have all the possible tags/keywords people will think of, for example AC/DC adapter, wall-wart, power supply, little black box, etc
22:28 < kanzure> I don't see how a search engine solves that
22:28 < fenn> but they could probably find it in "electrical->power supplies"
22:28 < kanzure> eh
22:28 < kanzure> if they knew it
22:28 < fenn> it doesn't, that's the point
22:28 < fenn> bah, you dont have to know an ontology if it's well thought out
22:29 < fenn> can do multiple categories too, so computer->peripherals->scanner->scanner power supply
22:30 < fenn> that's a lot of work though, and should be distributed run-time fixing
22:30 < fenn> like "it wasnt there, would you like to add it?"
22:34 < kanzure> so, RFID v. take a picture of the ISBN-equiavalent barcode ?
22:38 < fenn> tools dont have barcodes
22:38 < fenn> or at least mine dont
22:38 < fenn> maybe the ones at the store do, but the packages are all long gone
22:39 < fenn> or are you talking about a cheaper method of GUID than RFID?
22:40 < fenn> (my experience with grocery stores is that barcodes are a pain in the ass)
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23:02 < fenn> so RFID tags are approx. $1-2 and readers are $25-100
23:03 < fenn> i think that rules out putting a reader in every tub, at least for the near future
23:03 < gene> fablab for making autoturrets for fending off hordes of undead?
23:04 < gene> dataglyphs might work
23:04 < fenn> dataglyph requires line of sight, which doesn't work in a tub packed full of crap
23:04 < gene> then have a bunch of tubs full of individual things
23:05 < fenn> one tub per thing? that's ridiculous
23:05 < gene> one tub per bunch of things
23:06 < fenn> what's a bunch of things
23:06 < kanzure> fenn: amy is asking me for an itunes app store for hardware
23:06 < kanzure> blah.
23:06 < fenn> wtf
23:06 < kanzure> I'm asking if she has design files..
23:06 < gene> so are we setting up a super auto inventory system for the fablab?
23:07 < fenn> i started but only got like 20 things done, it takes a lot of work
23:07 < gene> maybe something like a kiva robot
23:07 < fenn> right
23:08 < gene> bins of unsorted stuff that the human can select
23:09 < fenn> ok what should i work on today
23:09 < gene> well you only have one hour until the day ends so....
23:09 < fenn> i'm on mars time
23:10 < gene> oh ok
23:10 < gene> hmmmm... take pictures of lab, draw out floor plan?
23:10 < kanzure> we already have a floor plan
23:11 < gene> link/
23:11 < kanzure> no link
23:11 < fenn> it's not public for some reason
23:11 < gene> ok, that's fine
23:11 < fenn> i think les is stuck in "business" mindset
23:12 < gene> hey if we sell food we could make a profit maybe
23:12 < fenn> if you sell anything you should be making a profit
23:13 < fenn> me, i'd rather not sell food if i can help it
23:13  * fenn tries compiling pythonocc again
23:14 < gene> materials
23:15 < gene> oh, you know what we need to do if we ever get a stratasys?
23:16 < gene> if we ever get a stratasys we need to figure out how to hack the cartridges
23:17 < fenn> i dont want a stratasys
23:18 < gene> maybe an SLS machine?
23:18 < fenn> ok
23:19 < gene> those accept ground up plastic bits
23:19 < gene> invented here
23:19 < gene> crazy rez
23:19 < kanzure> amy's telling me a diesel engine should only have to be represented by STL
23:19 < kanzure> sigh
23:20 < gene> ugh
23:20 < gene> I learned to hate those things
23:20 < gene> no dimensions
23:20 < gene> I wish there was some sort of SVG for cad files
23:21 < fenn> a diesel engine in STL? what about different materials, tolerances, processes
23:21 < kanzure> right
23:22 < fenn> at least STEP contains useful info (even if its a closed standard)
23:22 < fenn> AP203 and 209 are just geometry though, like stl
23:23 < fenn> i dont know of any widely accepted formats that include material info
23:24 < fenn> at the very least you will need a separate file describing the materials and process to manufacture the geometry
23:24 < gene> solidworks
23:24 < fenn> and dont tell me you're going to SLS a diesel engine
23:26 < kanzure> wtf, she wrote a mechanical VHDL to STL compiler
23:26 < gene> hahahaha, they already did
23:26 < gene> except it doesn't work
23:26 < kanzure> fenn: you know what,
23:26 < kanzure> fenn: it occurs to me that people that run fablabs might not actually know what the fuck CAD is all about
23:26 < gene> and it's made of plastic
23:27 < kanzure> this is scaring me
23:27 < gene> who's amy again?
23:27 < fenn> kanzure: you're just now realizing this?
23:27 < kanzure> she runs the afghanistan fab lab
23:27 < gene> whoa
23:27 < gene> WHOA
23:27 < kanzure> fenn: I assumed they knew what they were doing, yes :(
23:28 < fenn> well, it's not all doom and gloom
23:28 < fenn> they know quite a lot about engineering
23:28 < kanzure> like, this is to the point of
23:28 < kanzure> "I don't care about CAD, just give me a PNG of the design and our laser cutter will do it"
23:28 < fenn> yes
23:28  * kanzure twitches
23:28 < fenn> there are a lot of those sort of files in the git repo's
23:28 < fenn> it's all craft crap though so go figure
23:28 < kanzure> right
23:29 < kanzure> "yay I made the 5 billionth star with a laser cutter"
23:29 < kanzure> (ok, I knew that a long time ago, but still)
23:29 < gene> hahhaha
23:30 < kanzure> hm. facebook plugin.
23:30 < fenn> cut faces on your laser cutter?
23:30  * kanzure twitches again, but in the opposite direction
23:31 < gene> hey did you see that company that is using SLS prints to make lithopanes?
23:31 < kanzure> why doesn't ponoko have a facebook plugin
23:31 < gene> huh?
23:32 < fenn> "That's where AP224 comes in. Officially the Mechanical Product Definition for Process Planning Using Machining Features, this AP is `owned' by Team SCRA (as its lead developer and international advocate). It provides not only the geometry of a part, but also the part features, dimensions and tolerances, material requirements, and notational information. In other words, everything a manufacturer needs to know in order to efficiently p
23:32 < kanzure> huh
23:32 < kanzure> fenn: is that behind a paywall?
23:32 < kanzure> and if so, do you want me to grab it?
23:32 < fenn> http://www.isg-scra.org/products_steptrans.cfm
23:32 < fenn> you dont have access to ISO documents, dont even bother
23:32 < kanzure> actually
23:33 < kanzure> http://www.lib.utexas.edu/engin/standards/usstds.html
23:33 < fenn> unless you do, in which case i will shit a uranium brick
23:33 < fenn> International Standards (ISO, IEC, ITU, DIN, etc.) are not collected or purchased by the University of Texas Libraries.  For purchase information go to the individual standards organization web site or Global Engineering Documents  to purchase copies of standards from all national or international organizations and many companies.
23:33 < kanzure> gimme an ISO standard to look up
23:33 < kanzure> blah
23:33 < kanzure> fuck this
23:34 < gene> look up the ISO standard on milling machine punched tape
23:35 < fenn> you mean IEC-RS274D?
23:35 < gene> really?
23:35 < fenn> (not ISO)
23:36 < gene> all be
23:36 < fenn> sorry, EIA
23:36 < fenn> same thing
23:36 < kanzure> bwaha, memorizing international standard codes
23:37 < gene> that's photoplotter code
23:37 < fenn> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerber_File
23:38 < kanzure> how much does an iphone cost per month?
23:38 < gene> I want milling machine code
23:38 < gene> kanzure go with a kindle
23:38 < gene> free internet
23:38 < kanzure> I don't care
23:38 < kanzure> gimme a number
23:38 < fenn> hmm i guess there is ISO 6983 but it's just a copy of DIN 66025
23:38 < fenn> one zillion dollars
23:38 < gene> is that punched tape standards
23:39 < fenn> it could be on punched tape, yes
23:40 < fenn> some people still use tape actually
23:40 < fenn> but in general the standard isn't really a "standard" because they're all different
23:41 < gene> heh I want to design a replicator with a fluidic control system that lives in the rings of saturn
23:41 < fenn> how about this http://www.srcf.ucam.org/~jsm28/ECMA-10/
23:41 < fenn> btw how are you going to find paper on saturn
23:42 < gene> I'm not
23:42 < gene> spun basalt tape perhaps?
23:43 < kanzure> (11:42:41 PM) Amy Sun: good god i can't remember my freshman year.
23:43 < kanzure> (11:42:49 PM) Amy Sun: something about the number of people that would bail before the end of it
23:43 < kanzure> (11:42:56 PM) Amy Sun: and the cold weather putting hair on your chest
23:43 < kanzure> those afghans.
23:44 < kanzure> why didn't fablab apply for gsoc?
23:44 < gene> gsoc?
23:44 < kanzure> google summer of code
23:45 < gene> oh
23:46 < gene> btw you gonna see the Stallman's talk?
23:46 < kanzure> hell yes?
23:46 < fenn> kanzure: tell amy to check out heekscad
23:46 < fenn> and heekscnc
23:47 < gene> can heekscad do 2d?
23:47 < gene> like dxf?
23:47 < fenn> yes, no splines yet though
23:47 < fenn> it can import splines but they are ugly line segments
23:47 < gene> I don't care about splines
23:47 < gene> circles?
23:47 < fenn> well i do
23:47 < fenn> yep
23:47 < gene> in .dxf?
23:47 < fenn> right now you have to split a sketch and then extrude the different closed contours separately ( havent figured out why yet)
23:48 < fenn> gene: i just added circle import to dxf last week
23:48 < gene> is it easy to use?
23:48 < fenn> sure, it's easy to use when it's not crashing
23:48 < fenn> the snapping ("digitizing") doesn't really work right all the time
23:48 < fenn> and there's no feature tree so you're stuck with what you did
23:49 < fenn> but all these will change
23:49 < gene> I'll just stick with qcad for now
23:49 < fenn> ok
23:49 < fenn> qcad is good for 2d
23:50 < fenn> i dont think heekscad should try to duplicate its functionality
23:51 < fenn> one of the perils of working as an employee: you get awful oldies radio songs stuck in your head
23:51 < gene> well I have the crappy version of qcad
23:51 < fenn> what's the crappy version?
23:51 < fenn> "community edition"?
23:51 < gene> only works for 10 minutes and 100 hrs
23:51 < fenn> i've never used the for-pay version so i cant comment
23:51 < gene> yeah
23:51 < fenn> dont do that
23:51 < fenn> go to qcadbin-win.sf.net
23:52 < kanzure> was gene not running the compiled version?
23:53 -!- wrldpc [n=worldpea@pool-173-48-214-204.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
23:53 < gene> let's see if this works
23:54 < gene> right now qcad is crashing on me when I try to save
23:54 < kanzure>  that would bail before the end of it
23:54 < gene> damn my computer is running hot
23:54 < kanzure> (11:54:38 PM) Amy Sun: i was hoping that vista wasn't so broken that we could use it for the lab machiens...
23:55 < kanzure> kldfjlk;ad;kfadjl;fajskd
23:55 < gene> and loud
23:55 < gene> I'm running boinc
23:55 < fenn> what is she thinking?
23:55 < gene> kanzure you should run boinc
23:55 < kanzure> this *hurts*
23:55 < fenn> do they actually use any programs that require windows?
23:55 < kanzure> nope
23:56 < kanzure> she's complaining about vista stability issues
23:56 < kanzure> because her keyboard is acting up
23:56 < gene> heh
23:56 < gene> I still need to install ubuntu
23:56 < fenn> probably the CIA keylogger is interfering with the microsoft keylogger
23:57 < kanzure> (11:57:12 PM) Amy Sun: a later arm of fabfolk is goign to be able to pay coders salaries to write and finish stuff for open source community
23:58 < fenn> just make sure they get the license right, none of this "no commercial or military stuff" license crap
23:58 < fenn> USE STANDARD LICENSES