--- Day changed Mon Jul 27 2009 00:25 -!- Netsplit holmes.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: strages, xp_prg 00:30 -!- Netsplit over, joins: strages 00:30 -!- Netsplit over, joins: xp_prg 00:35 < ybit> 13:25 < kanzure> mike mentioned that he would like to package the neural tissue scanner into skdb 00:35 < ybit> mike? 00:36 < ybit> 13:25 < kanzure> he doesn't even know if it's a university-only project, or if todd has the reigns on it or what 00:36 < ybit> todd? 00:36 < ybit> must be utexas people 00:42 < ybit> 7:53 < timschmidt> excitingly, my wrench-buildable machine got two fully working axes, including motor mounts, lead screws, everything last night. Still only a wrench and a hacksaw were used. 00:42 * ybit is impressed 00:43 < timschmidt> :) 00:43 < QuantumG> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cjWTWrma9Q 00:43 < timschmidt> I _didn't_ do most of the work 00:44 < timschmidt> I'll have pictures up as soon as I get some from the other members in attendance. 00:46 < ybit> timschmidt: how much do you guess the wrench-buildable machine will cost in total? 00:49 < timschmidt> depends heavily on what price you can get the square perforated tube for. I estimate $75 in parts other than the tube, motors, and electronics. I paid $22 / 6ft for the tube, and used perhaps 20ft of it. 00:50 < timschmidt> meh. more like 30ft of it 00:51 < ybit> this make me very happy and greedy 00:51 < timschmidt> the next highest cost items are the drawer rails, for which I paid $14 / pair 00:51 < timschmidt> and used 3 pair 00:51 < timschmidt> everything else is pocket change 00:52 < ybit> just plan on me bothering you for awhile after i save up some money :) 00:53 < timschmidt> each pillow block bearing (of which there are 6) costs about $0.50 to build. Lead screws are inexpensive allthread. Couplers (for motors + lead screws) are two $0.60 shaft collars (which I also use to restrict the lead screws) JB-welded together. 00:53 < timschmidt> And that's about all of it 00:54 < timschmidt> nuts, bolts, washers, a spacer or two, and some pipe hangers to couple the stages to the drive nuts. 00:56 < timschmidt> I think the square perf tube is both the most expensive and hardest to find component. Any help finding a cheap source of it is welcome. 00:56 < timschmidt> I bought mine at Menards 00:57 < genehacker_light> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UJDxp2gv3o 00:57 < genehacker_light> quantumg, who's rocket is that? 00:58 < genehacker_light> you posted that death of a camera thing so I figure you might know 00:58 < QuantumG> Paul Breed's 00:58 < QuantumG> Unreasonable Rocket 00:58 < QuantumG> http://unreasonablerocket.blogspot.com/ 00:58 < genehacker_light> oh 00:59 < QuantumG> see also http://www.youtube.com/user/bbrockert 00:59 < QuantumG> Masten Space Systems 01:00 < QuantumG> those two will be battling for the second prize of the first stage of the Lunar Lander Challenge this year.. John Carmack's team won the first prize of the first level last year. 01:00 < QuantumG> and they intend to win the first prize of the second level this year :) 01:02 < katsmeow-afk> cheap bearing holders: http://designerthinking.com/idlers.html 01:02 < genehacker_light> oh yeah 01:02 < katsmeow-afk> i don't sell them, but i made some, that's a howto 01:03 < katsmeow-afk> standard bearings, stock steel tubing, make as long or short as you like, no real tools needed 01:04 < ybit> kanzure, so skdb has been renamed to tangible bit?... 01:04 < katsmeow-afk> the tubing is heavy enough to weld or braze into othe bits of steel or wood 01:04 * ybit likes skdb 01:04 < ybit> much shorter 01:04 < ybit> ..and precise.. as i've stated before 01:05 -!- any10284809 [n=someone@75-120-41-131.dyn.centurytel.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 01:06 < ybit> nice katsmeow-afk 01:06 < any10284809> erg 01:06 < timschmidt> katsmeow-afk: awesome! 01:06 < ybit> this week i'm heading to the junkyard to teach myself welding. yay 01:06 < any10284809> thanks 01:06 < any10284809> timschmidt, url? 01:06 -!- katsmeow-afk [n=someone@75-120-36-233.dyn.centurytel.net] has quit [Nick collision from services.] 01:06 -!- any10284809 is now known as katsmeow 01:06 < timschmidt> http://builders.reprap.org/2009/04/first-example-of-wrench-build-machine.html 01:06 < timschmidt> it looks much more complete now, however. 01:06 < timschmidt> will get pictures ASAP 01:09 < katsmeow> re skate bearings, englich bearing of near-same size, but true english (1/4 inch bore) measures are a lil cheaper than real skate bearings 01:13 < ybit> first time i saw this: http://openfarmtech.org/index.php?title=Open_Source_Lathe 01:14 * ybit is off to bed 01:14 < ybit> gn timschmidt, katsmeow, QuantumG, genehacker_light 01:14 < timschmidt> night 01:14 < katsmeow> gnite ybit 01:28 < genehacker_light> good night 01:29 < genehacker_light> I will not sleep tonight 01:34 < katsmeow> ybit, just a note, remember this: re: http://openfarmtech.org/index.php?title=File:Clamps.jpg that style clamp is terribly inaccurate for the ID, in fact you can place one side ont he rod, and *rock it* side to side, as in over .010 play on each side; those things are not bored properly 01:34 < katsmeow> however, with a drill press, you can make more accurate ones 01:35 < katsmeow> they get real pricey in stainless and larger sizes, but you can get them in any shaft size 02:00 -!- flazmot [n=roy@ip68-108-88-202.lv.lv.cox.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 02:01 < flazmot> /w/ 02:01 < flazmot> w/ 02:01 < flazmot> w 02:02 < flazmot> hi 02:05 -!- katsmeow is now known as katsmeow-afk 02:36 < genehacker_light> wall? 03:09 -!- genehacker_light [n=chatzill@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 03:11 < splicer> is there some other channel keeping bot than chanServ on freenode? 03:29 -!- Smari [n=smari@88.149.89.58] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:00 -!- rnkv2 [n=rnkv2@aeni119.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:00 -!- rnkv2 [n=rnkv2@aeni119.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl] has left #hplusroadmap [] 04:28 < kanzure> Smari: I merged for you. 04:28 < kanzure> ybit: it's just a merge at this point. 04:36 -!- Smari [n=smari@88.149.89.58] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 04:40 -!- Smari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:44 < kanzure> hey Smari 04:45 < Smari> y0 04:45 < kanzure> I merged. 04:45 < Smari> any luck yesterday? 04:45 < kanzure> pull? 04:46 < Smari> from which? 04:46 < Smari> tb? 04:46 < kanzure> http://adl.serveftp.org/skdb.git/ 04:46 < kanzure> http://adl.serveftp.org/skdb.git 04:46 < Smari> ah k 04:46 < Smari> I pulled on tb this morning and was disappointed ;) 04:47 < Smari> cloning on Hilbert, yay. 04:47 < kanzure> is hilbert your dog? 04:47 -!- genehacker2 [n=noko@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 04:48 < Smari> kanzure, it's my new computer. 04:49 < Smari> My computing devices are named after mathematicians - my cellphone is Shannon, the work laptop Cauchy, my old desktop is Julia, my old laptop was Carroll... I've also had Hausdorff, Euler, Mandelbrot and a couple of others. 04:50 < Smari> The chronology of the archive is very strange. 04:50 < kanzure> your commits should be in the logs 04:50 < Smari> they are 04:51 < Smari> but they're in the wrong order. I'm not complaining though, it looks cool. 04:51 < kanzure> wrong order? how did that happen? 04:51 < kanzure> isn't it by date? 04:51 < Smari> Nope 04:52 < kanzure> what should it be by? 04:52 < Smari> Some things from 2009-07-26 come before 2009-07-18 in the chronology.. 04:52 < Smari> It's ordered by in which order the changes were made to the archive.. 04:52 < Smari> so you probably merged folders in some order.. 04:53 < kanzure> I think you might be using a special option to "git log" 04:53 < Smari> which didn't agree with how they came into existence (and how could it?) 04:53 < Smari> I'm using gitk 04:53 < kanzure> aha 04:53 < Smari> but hey, it seems to work 04:54 < Smari> Hm. 04:55 < Smari> Something's missing. 04:55 < kanzure> 'media' 04:55 < kanzure> I was hesitant to import binary data. 04:55 < Smari> sources is also missing 04:55 < kanzure> check out inventory/ 04:56 < Smari> Ah 04:56 < Smari> I see no real reason not to import binary data, as long as it's static stuff. 04:57 < Smari> media isn't just binary either 04:57 < Smari> a lot of it is javascript code 04:57 < kanzure> there was a few css files and javascript files in there, yeah 04:57 < kanzure> but it would have confused the fuck out of you 04:57 < kanzure> if I had just imported the CSS and js 04:57 < kanzure> and not the images 04:57 < Smari> yeah 04:57 < Smari> It's four images 04:57 < kanzure> no, there were many more 04:57 < Smari> Hmm? 04:58 * kanzure digs around 04:58 < Smari> Ah no... 04:58 < Smari> admin/ is a symbolic link 04:58 < kanzure> tangiblebit/tangiblebit.com/media/admin/img/admin 04:58 < kanzure> oh? 04:58 < kanzure> hey, you're right 04:58 < Smari> Its contents shouldn't be imported 04:58 < Smari> Because it's linking to the Django distribution 04:59 < kanzure> ok so four images aren't as terrible as "many" :) 04:59 < Smari> yes. 04:59 < Smari> Should I re-add them or will you merge them in? 05:00 < Smari> Oh, btw.. I don't have 05:00 < Smari> write permissions 05:00 < Smari> on skdb.git 05:00 < kanzure> please go ahead and fix 05:00 < Smari> (do I?) 05:00 < Smari> sure 05:00 < Smari> Actually, there's a bunch of history behind the javascript files... 05:00 < Smari> so could you merge instead? 05:00 < kanzure> yes 05:00 < Smari> thx 05:02 < kanzure> er there's a lot of images in media/javascript/components/slider/img/new/Image101.gif 05:02 < kanzure> er there's a lot of images in media/javascript/components/slider/img/ 05:02 < genehacker2> still awake or up early? 05:03 < kanzure> neither 05:03 < kanzure> this is the sleep-walking subsystem of kanzure 05:03 < genehacker2> zombie-mode? 05:04 < kanzure> not quite 05:04 < kanzure> Smari: anything to look for in the logs to see if I was successful? 05:05 < Smari> not... really.. 05:05 < kanzure> "Restructuring javascript interface" ? 05:06 < Smari> kanzure, that would be a good one 05:06 < Smari> yeah 05:06 < kanzure> okay, it worked then. 05:06 < kanzure> now, where should media/ go? 05:06 < kanzure> in inventory/ ? 05:08 < Smari> kanzure, that works, but it has bad side-effects.. 05:08 < Smari> No, actually, I can work around them 05:09 < Smari> It's mostly that Django runs slow if normal files are being passed through it before download. 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * re138d0cdafc7 /inventory/media/javascript/latlonselector.js: Converging, some bugs in the sitedetails.json template though, ignore for now. 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * r9c209521bf59 /inventory/media/javascript/maptools.js: ... 05:09 < Smari> But I can bypass it. 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * r3459f7f262aa /inventory/media/javascript/site.js: Restructuring JavaScript interface... 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * re41a57262728 /inventory/media/javascript/site.js: Pushing around some javascript functions, cleaning up site management interface. 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * r3e03562c6890 /inventory/media/javascript/site.js: More XMLRPC and Javascript glue. 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: spm * rbf45cb500af8 /inventory/media/javascript/ (latlonselector.js map.js site.js): Map and LatLon selector development. Why the hell doesn't OpenLayers have a DragMarker class?! 05:09 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r8f55c88a63d7 /inventory/media/ (175 files in 22 dirs): Merge commit 'git-import-folder-merge/master' 05:11 * Smari is impressed 05:11 < kanzure> does this turn you on? 05:11 < kanzure> muahah 05:12 < kanzure> actually don't answer that 05:12 < Smari> Noooooooooooooo.... how could you?! You evil evil man! 05:12 < Smari> You've converted tabs into spaces 05:13 < Smari> Why don't you just kill me now and have it over with? 05:13 < kanzure> because I enjoy watching developers suffer, or something sadistic like that 05:14 < Smari> Gah, I'm verging on a nervous breakdown here... spaces... spaces for indentation... why oh why... what have I done to deserve this? 05:14 < Smari> :P 05:18 < Smari> I suppose I either have to get over my tab-addiction (which has been with me since 1996) or I convince you that tabs are the right way to go... 05:18 < Smari> and I'm honestly not sure which would be easier ;) 05:18 < kanzure> er right now I'm falling back asleep 05:18 < kanzure> zombie mode over 05:18 < kanzure> er, sleep-walking mode over I mean 05:18 * kanzure looks around with shifty eyes 05:19 < Smari> heheh 05:23 < kanzure> Smari: btw, skdb.git is at: /var/www/skdb.git/ on adl 05:23 < Smari> ~/.ssh/authorized_keys isn't working on adl :( 05:23 < kanzure> any suggestions on how to get it working? 05:23 < Smari> no... 05:23 < Smari> sorry 05:24 < Smari> my fault! 05:24 < Smari> That was VERY awkward 05:24 < kanzure> well I'm certainly not interested in using passwords forever 05:24 < kanzure> so getting keys working would be hot 05:24 < Smari> it works 05:24 < kanzure> yay 05:24 * kanzure sleeps 05:24 < Smari> just generate your key and put the public key in ~/.ssh/authorized_keys 05:25 < Smari> but make a point of not putting the private key there ;) 05:27 -!- Netsplit holmes.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: strages, xp_prg 05:27 -!- Netsplit over, joins: strages 05:28 -!- Netsplit over, joins: xp_prg 05:28 < flazmot> smari 05:28 < Smari> yes? 05:28 < flazmot> try authorized_keys2 05:28 < flazmot> sounds like you got it 05:28 < Smari> it works 05:28 < flazmot> word 05:28 < flazmot> it's not hard 05:28 < Smari> I know 05:28 < flazmot> so much bteter than typing your password another thousand times too 05:28 < Smari> I just made a stupid mistake 05:28 < flazmot> heh 05:28 < flazmot> seen 05:28 < Smari> I uploaded the private key by accident ;) 05:28 < flazmot> ;O 05:28 < Smari> very much thinking about regenerating 05:29 < flazmot> hehh 05:29 < flazmot> i ran out of POT 05:29 < flazmot> but i am going to sleep today so i can call a podcast tonight ,_, 05:30 < Smari> gnite 05:30 < Smari> or.. 05:30 < flazmot> it just stinks that's what i use to engineer my day/night cycle and my mood 05:30 < Smari> gday 05:30 < flazmot> yz 05:30 * flazmot waves 05:30 < Smari> either way, have fun 05:30 < Smari> peace 05:31 < flazmot> *because that's 05:31 < flazmot> it doesnt stink that i use pot for that, it's good for those things 05:31 < flazmot> ought to be in the supermarket 05:49 -!- nsh [i=sbp@wikipedia/nsh] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 05:49 -!- nsh_ [n=nsh@dsl-jklbrasgw1-fec7df00-254.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #hplusroadmap 05:49 -!- nsh [i=sbp@59.176.232.72.static.reverse.ltdomains.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 06:04 < genehacker2> http://www.umpcportal.com/2009/07/awesome-wearable-computer-setup-is-powered-by-sony-vaio-ux-umpc 06:22 -!- smari_ [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has joined #hplusroadmap 06:24 -!- Smari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 06:26 -!- smari_ [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 07:46 < kanzure> sounds like the fan on leibniz's power supply is dying 08:04 -!- nsh_ [n=nsh@dsl-jklbrasgw1-fec7df00-254.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Remote closed the connection] 08:12 -!- genehacker2 [n=noko@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 11:08 -!- Phreedom [n=freedom@195.216.211.175] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:31 -!- bzsmari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:41 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@c-76-21-115-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 11:52 -!- Inri [i=Sahin@18.140.1.150] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:53 -!- Inri is now known as Infornographer 11:54 -!- Infornographer is now known as help 11:54 < ybit> hi Infornographer 11:54 < help> ayo 11:54 < ybit> how'd you hear about this channel? 11:54 -!- help is now known as inri 11:54 < inri> Mr worldpeace brought me here 11:54 < inri> sec, brb 11:55 -!- inri [i=Sahin@18.140.1.150] has left #hplusroadmap [] 11:55 -!- Inri [i=Sahin@18.140.1.150] has joined #hplusroadmap 11:55 < Inri> There we go! 11:56 < Inri> Got my nick set up all straight. 11:56 < ybit> :p 11:57 < Inri> I hear you guys are into all sorts of neat stuff. :) 11:57 < ybit> you might have heard correctly :) 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r3691c4651d6e /doc/BOMs/perfusion-equipment.yaml: minor typo fix in perfusion equipment bill of materials 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * rb431ac9bc31c /pymates/pymates.py: fix pymates error 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r61212e16e8d0 /doc/todo/presentation.txt: notes for the upcoming presentation 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r2bd71788bac1 /doc/ (TODO todo/TODO): moved TODO to doc/todo/TODO 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r519072f7ca5e /packages/screw/screw.py: fixed an indent error in screw.py 11:57 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * rd66e52789cf3 / (3 files in 2 dirs): pymates todo and some modifications to the yaml data 11:58 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * rd54022333449 /doc/todo/pymates-todo: more monday meeting notes for pymates 11:58 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r4ebd3a33fec5 /doc/todo/presentation.txt: more presentation notes to be turned into slides 11:58 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * rea3bfe6473dd /doc/todo/process-constraints-notes.txt: took some notes on process constraints from the meeting 11:58 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * ref64a69fd4de /doc/todo/process-constraints-notes.txt: more process constraints notes 11:59 < kanzure> sorry for the commit spam 12:00 * ybit doesn't mind 12:00 < ybit> at least there's progress being made 12:01 < ybit> or so i suspect 12:06 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@99.2.31.217] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:09 -!- genehacker2 [n=noko@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 12:12 < kanzure> fenn: http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.39.9111&rep=rep1&type=pdf 12:12 < kanzure> see page 8 12:21 < kanzure> compatibility-knowledge-base method (pg.13 of "Automated Manufacturability Analysis - a survey") 12:21 < kanzure> " El-Gizawy et al. EGHB90] presented a system which considers the suitability of di erent man- 12:21 < kanzure> ufacturing processes for a given part based on a process capability database. 12:21 < kanzure> " 12:22 * ybit is spamming the diy h+er facebook group members about the mailing list 12:23 < kanzure> "A strategy for integrating product and process design of aerospace components". Manufacturing Review 3 (3): 178 186, 1990. 12:24 < kanzure> "Simplified generation of all mechanical assembly sequences" <-- bwahah 12:26 < genehacker2> interesting 12:26 < genehacker2> you know I've heard that NASA is partially managed by software 12:28 < Inri> What do you mean "managed"? 12:29 < Inri> Obviously they have quite a few algorithms working out logistic matters. :) 12:32 < kanzure> " A compatibility rating between the product profile requirements and the 12:32 < kanzure> alternatives stored in the database for each decision criteria is generated using possibility theory. The vector 12:32 < kanzure> of compatibility ratings are aggregated into a single rating of that alternative’s compatibility. A ranked set of 12:32 < kanzure> compatible material and manufacturing process alternatives is output by the system. 12:32 < kanzure> " 12:32 < kanzure> the preceeding was from 'a decision support system for material and manufacturing process selection' 12:35 < kanzure> "manufacturing process capabilities" doesn't really help you to figure out what breaks and hwen 12:36 < kanzure> *when 12:36 < genehacker2> shit, you mean everything I just learned in my materials class can now be accomplished by a piece of software? 12:36 < kanzure> "The manufacturing process selection module identifies feasible manufacturing processes and rank them 12:36 < kanzure> according to the compatibility of their capabilities with the product profile requirements. 12:36 < kanzure> " 12:36 < fenn> genehacker2: not even close 12:37 < kanzure> "Figure 6 Possibility of wall thickness under a manufacturing process capability" 12:37 < kanzure> meh that requires the wall to be tagged as such though 12:37 < fenn> CUTDATA provides Cutting Speed and Feedrate recommendations that will result in acceptable tool life, cutting a given material in a specific hardness range or heat treatment condition 12:37 < genehacker2> ok dang 12:37 < fenn> i wonder how much CUTDATA costs 12:38 < genehacker2> I wouldn't be surprised though 12:38 < kanzure> "and a compatibility rating vector for each manufacturing process alternative." 12:40 < genehacker2> there are some formulas for determining the probability of survival for a ceramic material in terms of size and applied stress and defect density 12:41 < kanzure> genehacker2: what we need is a way to say "here are the main ways you fuck up a milling machine" 12:41 < genehacker2> 1. 12:42 < genehacker2> stress applied on anypart exceeds yield point 12:42 < genehacker2> 2. part 12:42 < genehacker2> is subject to creep and could fail within a certain time period 12:43 < kanzure> Fig. 7. Partial EXPRESS-G diagram of manufacturing resource model for cutting tool data (Jurrens et al., 1996). 12:44 < genehacker2> 3. stress applied to part exceeds fatigue limit and part will fail within a short time 12:44 < ybit> oh alright, guess i'm gone to scan some books 12:45 < genehacker2> 4.part happens to be made of brittle material and any bump in the wrong direction could break it 12:45 < kanzure> "2~The use of process specification language for cutting processes" 12:45 < genehacker2> fatigue would be hard though because fatigue is hard to measure 12:46 < genehacker2> but those are the generall causes of part failure 12:46 < genehacker2> oh and corrosion 12:46 < genehacker2> that too 12:47 < genehacker2> 5. creep 12:48 < genehacker2> part slowly deforms until it's useless or breaks 12:48 < genehacker2> as is happening for the the PTFE barrels on repraps 12:49 < kanzure> "capability profile" 12:49 < fenn> the most often cause of failure is mechanical resonance induced by the endmill cutting forces 12:49 < fenn> that, and crashing... and chip clogging 12:50 < genehacker2> but if you can figure out stress applied, what sort of vibrations would be produced, and the temperature it operates in you should be good 12:50 < kanzure> SK Gupta keeps on showig up 12:50 < genehacker2> mechanical res can be figured out 12:50 < fenn> easy for you to say 12:50 < genehacker2> from computers models 12:50 < fenn> what computer models 12:50 < genehacker2> that take a really long time 12:50 < fenn> modal analysis? good luck 12:50 < genehacker2> FEA duh 12:51 < fenn> how do you model an oil film cushion with FEA? 12:51 < fenn> assuming i can even get the parameters describing a machine tool in the first place 12:53 < genehacker2> parameters describing machine tool might be taken as a function of the head being used, material, being cut, and speed operated at. 12:53 < kanzure> most research seems to have stopped at kerf angles and curvatures and thickness, not considering any other sort of geometrical issues 12:53 < CIA-43> skdb: * rbbd6086e2c7e /taxonomy.yaml: thread rolling 12:53 < genehacker2> I'm sure you could figure out some model of vibrations 12:54 < genehacker2> mechanical resonance causes fatigue related damage? 12:54 < fenn> genehacker2: no i'm talking about the dynamic damping of the machine frame 12:55 < genehacker2> there are models of it 12:55 < fenn> BRING THEM TO ME! 12:55 < fenn> ahem. sorry 12:55 < genehacker2> I can't 12:55 < genehacker2> I've got a test to study for 12:55 < fenn> where can i get some decent minions these days? 12:56 < genehacker2> just look up dynamic damping 12:56 < genehacker2> I'll give you the fatigue formula later 12:56 < fenn> whatever. that's not important right now 12:57 * fenn files it under "simulation" 12:57 < genehacker2> it's related to the damage caused by resonance 12:57 < fenn> yes i know 12:57 < genehacker2> basically you need the max and min stress applied 12:57 < genehacker2> I can see why it'd be hard though 12:58 < kanzure> what does "process compatibility" even mean? 12:58 < fenn> it doesn't 12:58 < fenn> it's bullshit 12:58 < genehacker2> and it might get messy and really complicated very fast 12:59 < genehacker2> because of real parts varying from virtual parts 13:01 < kanzure> think of it more as trying to figure out possible shapes and impossible shapes or possible shapes that can break the system 13:01 < genehacker2> like hollow spheres inside cubes? 13:03 < kanzure> maybe? 13:04 < CIA-43> skdb: * rf6076333933f /doc/todo/presentation.txt: more 13:05 < kanzure> fenn: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6VJD-40JG14K-5&_user=108429&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=967438330&_rerunOrigin=scholar.google&_acct=C000059713&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=108429&md5=990ce03f7786b0caa0678dd3a6360c49 13:05 < kanzure> "trajectory spacing" 13:07 < kanzure> it doesn't really talk about failure modes though 13:11 < kanzure> basically it's like "tool wear via trajectory" 13:11 < fenn> that paper sucks 13:12 < kanzure> didn't expect them to be not account for wear and failure modes 13:12 < fenn> i have a much better paper if you'd like; but it's 10MB 13:12 < fenn> on tub 13:12 < kanzure> on what? 13:12 < fenn> the computer 13:12 < fenn> martin held 1991 voronoi pocketing and other path planning for 2.5d pockets 13:14 < kanzure> "Estimation of tool wear in orthogonal cutting using finite element analysis" 13:20 -!- genehacker2 [n=noko@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 13:21 < kanzure> "wear maps"? 13:21 < kanzure> "The maps have demonstrated that tool wear rates vary with cutting speeds and feed rates used. " 13:21 < kanzure> they don't vary with workpiece geometry/shape? 13:21 < bzsmari> wow, that's insightful! :P 13:22 < bzsmari> I don't think the tool cares what the workpiece is shaped like 13:24 < kanzure> say you mill perpendicular to a surface/plane, 13:24 < kanzure> that will bust your drillbit 13:26 < fenn> breakage != wear 13:26 < bzsmari> you can make certain assumptions about geometry when testing wear rates... 13:32 < kanzure> you don't have to assume.. you have the geometry right in front of you 13:32 < kanzure> bzsmari: maybe fenn should explain 13:33 * fenn is trying to actually do something 13:34 < bzsmari> hehe 13:34 < bzsmari> don't worry about it 13:35 < kanzure> fenn: push? 13:40 < kanzure> bzsmari: do you have STEP documentation for Part 522 or Part 224? 13:40 < fenn> i wonder if this is the class i want: Geom2dInt_ExactIntersectionPointOfTheIntPCurvePCurveOfGInter 13:42 < kanzure> yay Thomas Kramer wrote some documentation for ISO 10303/224 13:42 < bzsmari> kanzure, which is? 13:43 < kanzure> how to do "tagging" of features in STEP files 13:43 < fenn> thomas kramer is my hero 13:43 < fenn> well, sort of 13:44 < fenn> he participated in the mess-making that was EMC1 13:44 < fenn> Geom2dGcc_Circ2dTan is what i want 13:45 < bzsmari> meh 13:45 < kanzure> "Len Slovensky" is the "owner" of STEP AP 224? 13:45 < fenn> there are step AP's for just about anything imaginable, and they all cost a fortune 13:45 < kanzure> hm it's more about particular things like boss, chamfer, circular_pattern, rather than generic tags 13:46 < fenn> i dont think it's realistic to expect to be able to use any of them 13:46 < kanzure> so if this is not a "feature" then what is it? 13:46 < fenn> says 'machining features' 13:47 < kanzure> then what should I be looking for? 13:47 < fenn> ISO Standard 10303-224 "Application Protocol: Mechanical Product Definition for Process Planning Using Machining Features." 13:47 < kanzure> "how to use random strings that represent features" ? 13:47 < fenn> instead of step files? well, keep in mind we dont have any files with feature information in them in the first place 13:47 < kanzure> no no no 13:48 < kanzure> my task is to figure out how to add a line to a STEP file to "label" something 13:48 < kanzure> without breaking the OCC loader 13:48 < fenn> i dont think you can do that 13:48 < kanzure> and something that OCC will load up correctly in some weird class I don't know about 13:48 < kanzure> why the hell not? 13:48 < kanzure> a label is a very simple concept 13:48 -!- bzsmari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 13:48 * fenn looks for label classes in OCC 13:48 < kanzure> here we go: 13:48 < kanzure> http://www.opencascade.org/org/forum/thread_9885/ 13:49 < kanzure> "But this is not true with the STEP format, when I load the STEP files I have, surfaces get no labels." 13:49 < kanzure> great no responses 13:49 -!- bzsmari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:49 < kanzure> something to do with XDE 13:50 < fenn> Other kinds of data such as colors, validation properties, layers, names and the structure of assemblies can be read or written with the help of separate tools - STEPCAFControl_Reader and STEPCAFControl_Writer. 13:50 < kanzure> ah: http://www.opencascade.org/org/forum/thread_14829/ 13:50 < fenn> that's from http://adl.serveftp.org/lab/opencascade/doc/Overview/whnjs.htm 13:53 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap 13:53 < fenn> so you could just give the relevant entities a name "INTERFACE(n)" where n is some integer 13:54 < fenn> d'oh: The doc from re-read IGES file does contain names, from STEP - does not. 13:55 < kanzure> http://www.steptools.com/support/stdev_docs/roselib/roselib-5.html 14:01 < kanzure> blah 14:02 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has quit [] 14:15 < kanzure> this is ridiculous 14:16 < kanzure> in solidworks, you can add an annotation to a point or a polygon 14:16 < kanzure> but it doesn't warn you that this information is not going to be preserved in the STEP file 14:24 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap 14:27 < kanzure> http://dcom.arch.gatech.edu/cs6754/STEP Files/P204.pdf 14:27 < kanzure> http://dcom.arch.gatech.edu/cs6754/STEP Files/P205.pdf 14:27 < kanzure> http://dcom.arch.gatech.edu/cs6754/STEP Files/AIM238.pdf 14:33 < kanzure> #5020 = PROPERTY_DEFINITION('mass property', $, #290); 14:33 < kanzure> #5030 = PROPERTY_DEFINITION_REPRESENTATION(#5020, #5040); 14:33 < kanzure> #5040 = REPRESENTATION('property value', (#5060), #5050); 14:33 < kanzure> #5050 = REPRESENTATION_CONTEXT('', ''); 14:33 < kanzure> #5060 = MEASURE_REPRESENTATION_ITEM('mass', MASS_MEASURE(3000), #5070); 14:33 < kanzure> #5070 =(NAMED_UNIT(*) MASS_UNIT() SI_UNIT($,.GRAM.)); 14:41 < kanzure> um, what? http://adl.serveftp.org/lab/opencascade/doc/ReferenceDocumentation/DataExchange/html/classRWStepAP214__RWAutoDesignDateAndPersonAssignment.html 14:42 < kanzure> look at all this crap 14:42 < kanzure> http://adl.serveftp.org/lab/opencascade/doc/ReferenceDocumentation/DataExchange/html/classStepBasic__Person.html 14:42 < kanzure> why is OCC representing people :p 14:48 < kanzure> see #5040 aboe- there's this "string" in each STEP file line that is the first parameter to all of the functions (well, they aren't really functions I guess) 14:48 < kanzure> anyway, somehow, somewhere, OCC is reading in these strings.. right? 14:48 < kanzure> solidworks just places "None" for all of those values for some reason 14:48 < kanzure> even though I specifically annotated an object 14:53 -!- wrldpc2 [n=benny@pool-173-48-253-182.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 14:59 -!- ybit-scanning [i=4894195a@gateway/web/freenode/x-027cc653c7a5d0c6] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:01 < kanzure> is this really so hard? saving an annotation in STEP? 15:04 < kanzure> what a piece of crap, AutoCAD can't import STEP 15:04 < kanzure> and Pro/E can't do any annotations 15:10 < fenn> hey i just spent an hour trying to add a key binding 15:10 < fenn> no beans 15:10 < fenn> i think you might be wasting your time with the annotation idea 15:19 < kanzure> no thanks to campbell 15:35 -!- ybit-scanning [i=4894195a@gateway/web/freenode/x-027cc653c7a5d0c6] has quit [SendQ exceeded] 15:37 -!- ybit-scanning [i=4894195a@gateway/web/freenode/x-3661afbd69c286c3] has joined #hplusroadmap 15:39 < kanzure> fenn: push? 15:42 < kanzure> file system structure for python projects: http://andreasjacobsen.com/2008/10/10/27/ 15:48 < kanzure> fenn: what about py.test? http://codespeak.net/py/dist/test/features.html#automatically-collects-and-executes-tests 15:48 < ybit-scanning> kanzure: who is http://github.com/epitron ? 15:48 < kanzure> quickstart: http://codespeak.net/py/dist/test/quickstart.html 15:48 < kanzure> ybit-scanning: guy with a hole in his head 15:48 < ybit-scanning> :P 15:49 < kanzure> seriously, a giant cyst 15:49 < fenn> how does py.test know the answers? 15:49 < kanzure> fenn: it's a tool for unit tests 15:49 < kanzure> you still write the unit tests 15:49 < kanzure> you put them in your source directories (where ever they might be) 15:49 < kanzure> then you run "py.test" from the shell 15:49 < kanzure> and it finds them and is happy 15:49 < fenn> finds what? 15:50 < kanzure> unit tests via files that are named either "test_*.py" or "*_test.py" 15:50 < fenn> but the tests aren't in the files 15:50 < ybit-scanning> so what is the cyst guy into? 15:51 < kanzure> fenn: unit tests are in dot py files 15:51 < kanzure> ybit-scanning: he used to be in here 15:51 < kanzure> it runs dot py files 15:52 < kanzure> ybit-scanning: but he was kind of lame, in the end 15:53 * ybit-scanning is typing with one hand while holding the book to the scanner with the other. a frogpad, sub-vocal recognition software or some eeg setup would be nice to have right about now 15:53 * ybit-scanning doesn't recall an epitron 15:53 < kanzure> maybe he was before your time 15:53 < ybit-scanning> heh, could be 15:54 < ybit-scanning> think there were ~6-8 in here when i joined 15:56 -!- Irssi: #hplusroadmap: Total of 26 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 26 normal] 15:58 < genehacker2> interesting 15:59 < genehacker2> oops 15:59 < genehacker2> though DNA origami required oligos 20-50 long 15:59 < genehacker2> but it requires thousands of them 15:59 < genehacker2> http://cadnano.org/intro.html 16:02 < kanzure> yes, DNA origami is long shit 16:03 < genehacker2> so what other chemicals do we need to make photolabile phosphoramidite 16:03 < genehacker2> s 16:06 < CIA-43> skdb: * r26694b2e6b08 /paths.py: playing around with tangent circles; trying to make a valid path for bandsaw sweep. dont use 16:29 -!- Inri [i=Sahin@18.140.1.150] has quit [] 17:09 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 17:12 -!- ybit-scanning [i=4894195a@gateway/web/freenode/x-3661afbd69c286c3] has quit ["Page closed"] 17:23 -!- wrldpc2 [n=benny@pool-173-48-253-182.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 17:48 < kanzure> some old GPL'd pascal sources for reading ldraw *.dat files (which define lego parts) 17:48 < kanzure> http://web.telia.com/~u16122953/ldlistsrc.zip 18:06 < kanzure> stalk: "Max Peysakhov" 18:09 < fenn> kanzure: go to /etc/network/interfaces and copypaste the section for eth0 but change s/eth0/eth0:1/ 18:10 < fenn> and change the ip to 18:10 < fenn> too 18:11 < kanzure> http://web.archive.org/web/20050317000800/http://edge.mcs.drexel.edu/GICL/people/peysakhov/ 18:11 < kanzure> "# This is my new project in automatic design generation for LEGO robots. It's not a real web page, but a file repository." 18:11 < kanzure> http://web.archive.org/web/20040531083618/edge.mcs.drexel.edu/GICL/people/peysakhov/LEGO_GA/Code/ 18:32 < kanzure> someone should have asked me why I knew the name Max Peysakhov 18:33 < kanzure> see bryan@leibniz:~/manufacturing/national_design_repository/gicl.cs.drexel.edu/repository/data/repository/Lego/LEGO_GA/Docs 18:39 < fenn> lots more step files in /home/bryan/manufacturing/national_design_repository/gicl.cs.drexel.edu/repository/datasets/legos/ 18:42 < kanzure> see GECCO_LegoGA_Poster.pdf 18:42 < kanzure> er, in the folder that I last linked to 18:43 < fenn> the peysakhov simulation looks like crap 18:43 < kanzure> simulation? 18:46 < kanzure> fenn: what do I do once I update /etc/network/interfaces ? 18:47 < kanzure> ifconfig eth1:1 up 18:47 < kanzure> "SIOCSIFFLAGS: Cannot assign requested address" 18:47 < fenn> ifconfig eth1:1 up 192.168.1.123 18:47 < kanzure> same thing 18:48 < kanzure> oh, nevermind 18:48 < fenn> sudo? 18:49 < kanzure> nah, I got it 18:49 < kanzure> was trying 192.168.1.99 18:55 < fenn> these lego .stp files aren't anatomically accurate 18:57 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap 18:58 < kanzure> fenn: what's wrong with them? 18:59 < fenn> some of the gears have elements just floating in space 18:59 < fenn> and they use a subtracted cylinder primitive in places instead of making slots or a subtracted cube 19:00 < fenn> the gears look wrong but i'm not sure exactly why 19:01 < kanzure> ah so the edges are either snaps or inserts, apparently. but that doesn't tell you which snap or which insert mate to use.. 19:02 < fenn> eh? 19:02 < kanzure> house? 19:02 * fenn abandons futility 19:03 -!- smari_ [n=smari@88.149.89.58] has joined #hplusroadmap 19:05 < kanzure> hello smari 19:05 < fenn> what's iceland's unix TZ? 19:16 -!- bzsmari [n=smari@nmi-gw.eyjar.is] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)] 19:16 < smari_> fenn, UTC 19:16 < smari_> Not sure what that is in unix terms 19:16 -!- smari_ is now known as Smari 19:17 < wrldpc2> is there anyone else from Boston in here? 19:19 < Smari> Boston got destro... no wait, that was a novel. 19:22 < wrldpc2> It's your funeral, Smari. 19:22 -!- wrldpc2 [n=benny@pool-173-48-253-182.bstnma.fios.verizon.net] has quit [] 19:22 < Smari> Haha. 20:11 < kanzure> fenn: do you understand why the unittests don't run 20:11 < kanzure> they don't run because they are in unittests/ 20:11 < fenn> ffs just put test.py back in the main dir and include whatever fucking files you want 20:12 < kanzure> I think you don't understand file system structures for python modules.. 20:12 < fenn> skdb/test.py: import unittests; run_tests() 20:13 < kanzure> why is test.py in skdb/ ? 20:13 < kanzure> try this: http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/aix/library/au-pythontesting2/ 20:34 < Smari> I'm going to go nuts on the directory structure next time I have a moment to sit and focus. 20:35 < fenn> i think it's pretty good right now 20:35 < Smari> I've been actively thinking about the big picture of what we're doing all day. I drew diagrams. Managed to simplify a few things, draw logical connections, figure out a few structural points... most of it is the IIS/supply chain side of things.. 20:35 < Smari> IIS = Industrial Information System 20:36 < Smari> fenn, it's horrible right now. 20:36 < fenn> ok, so my crap is all over skdb/ 20:37 < Smari> fenn, there's no compartmentalization, no logical entry point, no obvious plan.. :) 20:37 < Smari> how do .yaml files, .py files and .dat files belong in the root? 20:37 < fenn> they don't 20:37 < Smari> exactly 20:38 < fenn> i don't like having a big "src" dir 20:38 < fenn> what's the point of that? 20:38 < kanzure> self.assertFalse(skdb.Unit('1') < skdb.Unit('-10')) 20:38 < kanzure> test_negative_cmp 20:39 < Smari> fenn, I'd at least like to separate data from code... and perhaps categorize code into different modules and apps. 20:40 < Smari> What parts are there exactly? 20:41 < kanzure> pymates, your fabmap thing, fablab job scheduling, toolpath swept volumes code, packages, 20:41 < fenn> inventory, simulation, dependency resolution 20:41 < kanzure> simulation? 20:41 < kanzure> fenn and I have different definitions of simulation 20:42 < kanzure> and neither of us are willing to budge :p 20:42 < kanzure> so we keep confusing each other 20:42 < fenn> hm. ok forget "simulation" 20:42 < kanzure> there's something that somewhat approximates SPICES in the repo 20:42 < fenn> whatever you call being able to predict information you don't have about an artifact based on data you do have 20:44 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r706c12208368 / (units.py unittests/tests.py): fix unit tests and fix units module 20:44 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r86bea97680c1 /paths.py: Merge branch 'master' of ssh://bryan@adl.serveftp.org/var/www/skdb 20:44 < Smari> hahaha 20:44 < Smari> I'm making a README file in the doc/ folder that will explain the directory structure 20:44 < Smari> Mind if I find shorthand to your names? 20:44 -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@w-central-232-88.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] 20:44 < kanzure> Smari: pull before you commit 20:44 < Smari> yes 20:44 < kanzure> don't be like me :( 20:45 < Smari> Like "fablab job scheduling" becomes "scheduling" 20:45 < kanzure> what? 20:45 < Smari> "toolpath swept volumes code" becomes "toolpaths" 20:45 < kanzure> Smari: I'm not sure you know the project entirely yet 20:45 < fenn> sounds fine to me 20:45 < kanzure> but you might, and I could be very wrong 20:45 < fenn> kanzure always makes excessively verbose names 20:45 < Smari> kanzure, I understand it to a fairly reasonable degree 20:45 < kanzure> okay 20:46 < kanzure> also there's 'pymates' :) 20:46 < Smari> I don't understand everything that's under the hood in your code... 20:46 < Smari> is it okay to call it 'mating' ? 20:46 < kanzure> no, the folder name is 'pymates' 20:46 < Smari> it sounds more kinky... 20:46 < kanzure> but you could just reference the actual folder 20:47 < Smari> I'm talking about moving things and renaming them so that it'll be easy to navigate through the swaths of code... 20:47 < Smari> that will be there :) 20:47 < kanzure> how about you just ask us what you should write? 20:47 < Smari> Uhm 20:47 < kanzure> :p 20:47 < fenn> i didnt realize we had gotten to the point where we need a readme already 20:47 < Smari> Because I'm going to write what I bloody well feel like writing :) 20:48 < kanzure> but you just admitted you don't know what's what 20:48 < fenn> if it's wrong i'll fix it 20:48 < kanzure> okay 20:48 < Smari> *sigh* 20:48 < fenn> keep up the good work smari 20:48 < Smari> fenn, is that a joke? 20:48 < kanzure> .. 20:48 < kanzure> now I'm not sure 20:49 < fenn> yes it was a joke. 20:49 < fenn> wait, now i'm not sure 20:49 < fenn> no offense intended 20:49 < kanzure> which does "no offense intended" evaluate to? joking or not joking? 20:49 < fenn> now i dont know how to resolve this at all 20:49 < kanzure> quick, to skdb/dep/ ! 20:51 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * re3c014c8e0f4 /dep/dependency.py: removed dependency.py, should write a unit test 20:51 -!- Smari [n=smari@88.149.89.58] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)] 20:52 -!- Smari [n=spm@88.149.89.58] has joined #hplusroadmap 20:53 < kanzure> someone kick me in the ass to write some unit tests for skdb/dep/ 20:53 < kanzure> oh there are some tests in there already 20:53 < kanzure> bah 20:59 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r748bbc014105 /dep/ (dep.py test_dep.py): dependency resolver unit tests moved about 21:01 < Smari> Annoying. Bah. Good night. 21:01 < kanzure> what? 21:01 < kanzure> aren't you going to push? 21:01 < Smari> nah 21:02 < kanzure> hm. I wonder why running "py.test" in skdb/dep doesn't produce any print statements.. 21:02 < kanzure> but running "python test_dep.py" does 21:03 < kanzure> what the devil is py.test --looponfail for? 21:03 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@99.2.31.217] has quit ["This computer has gone to sleep"] 21:03 < kanzure> ah, -s 21:04 < kanzure> py.test -v -s --debug 21:04 < fenn> what's -s? 21:04 < kanzure> apparently it automagically catches stdout and stderr "for your convenience" 21:04 < kanzure> -s makes it not do that 21:06 -!- Smari [n=spm@88.149.89.58] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] 21:08 < kanzure> phineas ghage 21:29 -!- genehacker2 [n=noko@cpe-67-9-157-136.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap 21:34 < ybit> argh, friends want me to hang out 21:35 < ybit> how do you do it guys? how do you balance social life and me-time/workingArseOff4fun 21:35 < kanzure> what is social life? 21:35 < ybit> ideally, my friends would want to work on the same projects, maybe weld something, make some metal, something fun 21:35 < kanzure> get some better friends 21:35 < ybit> instead it's always getting high or drunk :-\ 21:36 < ybit> yeah.. 21:36 < kanzure> if they don't come back with sunburns from arc welding, 21:36 < kanzure> drop them 21:39 < ybit> :) 21:40 < fenn> does that mean i should wear sunscreen next time? 21:40 < ybit> heh, would that actually work? 21:41 * ybit maintained his vampire tan even while in sun for 10+ hours the other day 21:41 < ybit> 100spf sunscreen was generously applied ever hour 21:43 < genehacker2> http://www.ballsemi.com/tech/index.html 21:43 < genehacker2> check it out 21:43 < genehacker2> silicon chips that are balls 21:43 < genehacker2> company is dead though 21:49 < genehacker2> might be useful if they could have found a way to put a tiny power source inside ball and made some claytronics 21:54 -!- strages [n=strages@c-68-62-216-5.hsd1.al.comcast.net] has quit [Connection reset by peer] 21:55 -!- strages [n=strages@c-68-62-216-5.hsd1.al.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 22:00 < kanzure> is there a standard way of expressing algebraic symbolic operator tree thingies? 22:00 < kanzure> er.. do these have a common name in programming? 22:01 < kanzure> symbolic expression trees? 22:01 < genehacker2> unicode? 22:01 < genehacker2> try the unicode tables 22:01 < fenn> kanzure: lisp 22:05 < kanzure> no 22:05 < kanzure> you're both wrong 22:05 < kanzure> go away and fetch me chocolate 22:10 < kanzure> parse trees? 22:11 < kanzure> http://effbot.org/zone/simple-top-down-parsing.htm 22:11 < kanzure> gah 22:11 * kanzure doesn't want to have to write a parser 22:11 < fenn> what was wrong with lisp? 22:11 < kanzure> I'm using python 22:11 < kanzure> go away 22:12 < kanzure> can anyone explain Gundam 00 to me? 22:12 < genehacker2> are you watching gundam and programming? 22:12 < kanzure> yes 22:13 < genehacker2> http://sciencelinks.jp/content/view/749/282/ 22:14 < genehacker2> in order to make a gundam, we'd have to invent some new really lightweight materials 22:14 < genehacker2> Issue 1: Mass is a major issue as Gundam is slim but would still weigh several hundreds tons if normally manufactured. Its legs are slender: Slender legs are preferable in ensuring control. However, they would result in a lot of pressure being applied to the soles of the feet. Roads and the ground could not withstand the pressure applied from that weight and the body would sink into the ground. 22:17 < genehacker2> I wonder if carbon nanotube microtrusses would do the trick... 22:20 < fenn> how about ... Gundanium alloy? 22:21 < fenn> and you could power it with a GM particle reactor 22:22 < genehacker2> a GM particle reactor? 22:22 < genehacker2> I thought they used minovsky physics or something like that 22:23 < fenn> GM is a special type of minovsky particle 22:23 < genehacker2> oh ok 22:23 < genehacker2> how about a plasmak? 22:23 < genehacker2> it's real 22:23 < fenn> O RLY 22:23 < genehacker2> it just hasn't been tested for fusion yet 22:24 < genehacker2> the plasma ball doesn't touch the walls of the containment vessel 22:25 < genehacker2> the plasma ball is also stable enough to last a couple seconds at room temperature pressure 22:25 < genehacker2> but in order to do fusion with it 22:25 < genehacker2> you have to put inside an ULTRA-CANNING machine 22:25 < genehacker2> IE a device that generates really really high pressure 22:27 < fenn> uh.. i dont think you know what you're talking about 22:34 < genehacker2> they use devices that generate really high pressures in the food industry 22:34 < genehacker2> forget it 22:35 < ybit> transformers any good? 22:35 < ybit> thinking of playing it in the background 22:36 * ybit wants some mindless sci-fi movie playing in the background 22:36 < ybit> star trek needs to get on dvd 22:36 < ybit> so i can torrent it.. 22:37 < genehacker2> transformers good? 22:38 < genehacker2> no they're horrible 22:38 < ybit> perfect 22:38 < genehacker2> they dissipate quite a bit of energy as heat 22:38 < genehacker2> my laptop power brick gets hot enough to almost burn me 22:39 < genehacker2> but if you were refering to the movie I heard it's pretty bad 22:39 < flazmot> i torrented a raelly good screener of star trek 22:39 < flazmot> only the sound was a little crunchy somteimes 22:39 < flazmot> but basically you couldnt tell 22:39 < flazmot> also you couldnt quite see the whole screen 22:40 < flazmot> too bad they don't still have intermission breaks for snacks or you'd know for sure it was a screener when the dancing concession stand snacks showed up 23:03 < kanzure> what is a screener? 23:05 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r1ef3ac63f63e /dep/test_dep.py: some ideas for tests for the dependency module 23:07 < ybit> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=screener 23:08 * ybit wonders what eric is doing now to start the international open space initiative 23:09 < kanzure> ybit: writing 23:09 < CIA-43> skdb: kanzure * r77027a30d718 /doc/todo/pymates-todo: further notes on what to do next with pymates 23:10 < kanzure> I wish there was some device that gave me an electric shock every time I make a commit 23:10 < kanzure> so that I would be tempted to not commit as frequently as I do 23:10 < ybit> :P 23:11 < ybit> geometry constraints language, ever find one? [kanzure]? 23:11 < kanzure> that's more fenn than for me at the moment 23:11 < kanzure> and the answer is no 23:11 < kanzure> ybit: check skdb/doc/todo/process-constraints.txt for some notes on that 23:12 < kanzure> er, sorry 23:12 < kanzure> skdb/doc/todo/process-constraints-notes.txt 23:16 < ybit> here's a preview of my projects todo 23:16 < ybit> * Projects 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO Massive Communication Matrix 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO Autoscholar 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO djangit/co.de/heath.im 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO skdb 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO djangit/toolbook/freefab.org & diysci/htmcie.org & openmanufacturing.org 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO AR 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO welder from microwave 23:16 < ybit> ** TODO microfluidics 23:17 < ybit> *** t-shirt press 23:17 < ybit> *** laser scanner 23:17 < ybit> plan on using djangit on my own servers 23:17 < ybit> as well 23:17 < kanzure> autoscholar has been renamed to pyscholar and now has some terrible new code 23:17 < kanzure> http://github.com/kanzure/pyscholar 23:17 < ybit> right right 23:17 < ybit> just haven't renamed it 23:18 < kanzure> Open-source (and open hardware) Arduino-based telemetry and instrumentation module for amateur rocketry 23:18 < kanzure> http://github.com/lukeweston/artemis/ 23:18 < ybit> nice 23:22 < kanzure> fenn: should the unit tests for skdb/dep/ attempt to act like they are supposed to work for the dependency information in skdb/packages/screw/metadata.yaml ? 23:23 < kanzure> at the moment I don't have anything that does anything interesting with the "or" and "and" structure of that dependency outline (although it would be nice if there was something, but I don't know what that something should be at the moment) 23:24 * kanzure sleeps 23:25 -!- xp_prg [n=xp_prg3@c-76-21-115-162.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #hplusroadmap 23:27 < kanzure> good code for reading: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=327710 23:28 < kanzure> huh wonder when this popped up http://pyblosxom.sourceforge.net/ 23:29 * kanzure linked over to the perl version (blosxom) the other day 23:30 < kanzure> python module of the week - http://www.doughellmann.com/PyMOTW/contents.html 23:55 < fenn> ybit: welder from microwave is harder than it sounds.. at least I could never get it to work 23:55 < fenn> considering you can now buy a crappy mig welder for $100 i'm not sure it makes sense to build one