--- Day changed Fri May 28 2010
00:00 < fenn> btw i'd like to point out that you _could_ have a t-rex if you finished the mechmate
00:00 < splicer> (an at-st maybe)
00:01 < splicer> 3d is nice... so there is something to be said for goggles with motion sensors, they shouldn't be that far off... and there just has to be a market for them.
00:02 < fenn> you can already buy them
00:02 < fenn> vr920's aren't goggles exactly but it's the right idea
00:03 < splicer> nice
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01:25 < fenn> hmm.. http://www.masturbate-a-thon.com/home.html
01:26 < fenn> SF is funny
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01:29 < fenn> "Not Sure you want to be part of the live event?
01:29 < fenn> You can join us by masturbating from home! Click here to find out how."
01:29 < fenn> how do i shot web :\
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01:54 < fenn> learn something new every day
01:54 < fenn> " Dermestid beetles can be obtained from biological supply houses, local natural history museums or university zoology departments. Once a colony is set up in a warm place, they require minimal maintenance and are capable of stripping entire skulls in a day or two."
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04:15 < splicer> ...but how do I get rid of the bones?
04:19  * splicer just remembered that bryan logs everything
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06:29 < JayDugger> Good morning, everyone.
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09:12 < kanzure> bad infection: http://www.dol.govt.nz/News/Media/2008/adu-bobie-report.asp
09:26 < kanzure> A Long-Term Follow-Up of Autologous Mesenchymal Stem Cell Transplantation in Patients with Ischemic Stroke http://bit.ly/cdyKn7
09:53 < kanzure> does anyone know of a good source of "animal cams"? for instance, a collection of "where the hell my cat goes"
09:53 < kanzure> or "where my front yard toads go during the day"
10:02 < kanzure> Utopiah: do you have a script that will download an rss feed on a periodic schedule?
10:05 < Utopiah> yes
10:05 < Utopiah> well no actually I download my OPML file describing what RSS feeds I follow daily
10:06 < Utopiah> but anyway an RSS feed you can just use wget for that
10:06 < Utopiah> crontab -e then add your wget line with its option (for renaming mainly)
10:07 < Utopiah> (the daily OMPL allows me to diff)
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10:20 < TCrown> hola!
10:20 < TCrown> so who was it I chatted with about diybio over the weekend at MF?
10:21 < TCrown> this is Eric from Chicago
12:08 < Utopiah> http://fora.tv/2010/05/23/BioCurious_The_Bay_Area_Biology_Collaborative_Lab_Space
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13:41 < fenn> quantified kitty
13:43 < fenn> mostly german stuff but the cat doesn't speak english anyway http://www.mr-lee-catcam.de/pe_cc_u.htm
13:44 < fenn> i'm sure we can do better wrt the hardware
13:54 < fenn> http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn18967-eat-bacteria-to-boost-brain-power.html
13:57 < fenn> next we will be discussing the miraculous properties of snake oil
13:59 < genehacker> Well snake venom derivatives have had some use in developing anticoagulants for heart attacks and what not
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14:49 < jrayhawk> Kanzure: Usually rss2email is the best approach, assuming you have a multiple-folder email client.
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15:15 < kanzure> mission accomplished
15:15 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_puma500.jpg
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15:15 < kanzure> genehacker: just picked this up: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_puma500.jpg
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15:22 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_154006_puma500.jpg
15:24 < dustbin> what are the plans for htat
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15:29 < kanzure> world domination
15:29 < kanzure> nothing yet
15:30 < dustbin> heh ok
15:30 < dustbin> does it have replaceable hand attachments?
15:30 < dustbin> like could we stick a mill end on it and use it as a 4 axis cnc or something?
15:32 < kanzure> i don't have any extra end effectors yet
15:32 < kanzure> but yeah it's replaceable
15:32 < kanzure> it's 6DOF btw
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15:41 < genehacker> nifty
15:41 < genehacker> we could make a mr.stabby like NYC resistor did
15:42 < genehacker> or we could do something more useful with it
15:42 < genehacker> where'd you get it?
15:42 < genehacker> and will you be there on sunday?
15:42 < genehacker> I might be able to visit on sunday
15:44 < genehacker> and the most important question of all, can we control it?
15:56 < fenn> everything's bigger in texas, even the boat anchors
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16:08 < genehacker> well there are no real lakes in texas so we have to use a special type of anchor...
16:08 < kanzure> genehacker: i can pick you up on sunday if necessary
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16:08 < genehacker> that may not be necessary
16:08 < genehacker> I might have a car by then
16:08 < kanzure> hey, at the very least i just got myself a fucking awesome lamp
16:08 < genehacker> so can you control it?
16:08 < kanzure> nah not yet
16:09 < kanzure> it has individual pinouts for each servo
16:09 < genehacker> and it has encoders on the joints?
16:09 < kanzure> didn't check
16:10 < genehacker> the robotics trailer has a HUGE 4 axis stepper/servo driver that will drive servos however you want them if you can hook up encoders too
16:11 < genehacker> also it's possible to control the stepper driver directly from parallel port
16:11 < genehacker> got any specs on the servos it uses?
16:11 < genehacker> from parallel port with EMC2
16:11 < kanzure> not yet.. the model is Unimate PUMA500 Robot Arm JR3 67M25A-U560
16:11 < kanzure> yeah i was planning on forcing fenn to fennticate his knowledge of emc2 (or, i guess i'll just read the emc2 manual)
16:12 < genehacker> http://www.listown.com/sporting/ast/200911/121198.htm
16:12 < genehacker> SPORTING GOODS?
16:12 < genehacker> WTF
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16:12 < kanzure> what sporting goods?
16:12 < genehacker> who in the right mind puts a robot in SPORTING GOODS
16:13 < genehacker> I found your robot it's been for sale
16:13 < kanzure> yep
16:13 < kanzure> it's been all over ebay and craigslist
16:13 < kanzure> http://cgi.ebay.com/Unimate-PUMA500-Robot-Arm-JR3-67M25A-U560-hand-/290373583741?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item439b9d437d
16:13 < genehacker> it was classified in sporting goods
16:13 < genehacker> I wonder if it was used to test out golf clubs...
16:14 < kanzure> heh repeatedly bashing golf clubs against a car?
16:14 < kanzure> "yep"
16:15 < kanzure> reminds me of: http://www.joeydevilla.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/pug_factory.jpg
16:15 < genehacker> heh
16:15 < genehacker> you don't have the arm trainer do you?
16:15 < kanzure> trainer? what?
16:16 < kanzure> so anyway, the guys i bought this from have a ridiculously large inventory of biotech equipment
16:16 < kanzure> one of them used to be a molecular biology student at utexas.edu
16:16 < genehacker> a trainer is a little handheld keypad thing you use to "program" the arm
16:17 < kanzure> sounds stupid
16:18 < genehacker> this is a primitive robot, it performs repetitive tasks with no feedback
16:18 < genehacker> or very little at the least
16:18 < kanzure> it's not really a "robot"
16:19 < genehacker> http://www.retrothing.com/2008/10/unimate-puma-50.html
16:19 < kanzure> these are the guys i bought it from: http://www.assetrenew.com/
16:19 < kanzure> all of their prices are negotiable
16:19 < genehacker> will they buy stuff?
16:20 < kanzure> expensive shaker: http://www.assetrenew.com/comments.php?y=10&m=05&entry=entry100528-171030
16:20 < kanzure> dunno.. they seem to just hang out at liquidation auctions
16:20 < kanzure> local delivery available ha ha
16:20 < kanzure> so i was thinking i'd just have them forward thermocyclers that they get
16:20 < kanzure> and i'd throw on an arduino or some avr
16:21 < genehacker> http://www.prsrobots.com/puma500.html
16:21 < genehacker> WOOO SPEC SHEETS!
16:21 < kanzure> 5lbs max load btw
16:22 < genehacker> disregard that, these spec sheets suck
16:23 < kanzure> "For a hard copy of this page, click the print button on your web browser"
16:25 < genehacker> oh found a better spec sheet
16:25 < genehacker> apparently you don't have the controller
16:25 < genehacker> but that's probably OK
16:25 < genehacker> this robot is really old
16:25 < genehacker> 1980s ish
16:26 < genehacker> www.antenen.com/htdocs/downloads/files/download.php?id=6
16:27 < genehacker> so by using a better ADC you might be able to make it more accurate than it's supposed to be
16:28 < kanzure> hm overhead mounting
16:29 < genehacker> yeah
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16:29 < genehacker> as in we could make it into a robotic gantry crane
16:31 < genehacker> http://www.computer.org/portal/web/csdl/doi/10.1109/MMVIP.1997.625229
16:32 < genehacker> http://www.springerlink.com/content/d16j47613110g73j/
16:32 < genehacker> much more recent
16:32 < genehacker> we don't need a 1980s controller to control it
16:36 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/papers/Implementation%20of%20a%20new%20PC%20based%20controller%20for%20a%20PUMA%20robot.pdf
16:36 < genehacker> excellent
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16:37 < genehacker> 100% complete protection from ebola using RNAi: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127226355
16:37 < genehacker> in n=4 samples
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16:47 < kanzure> maybe i should make the arm high-five me
16:48 < fenn> i would suggest not getting anywhere near the thing while turned on
16:48 < kanzure> right
16:48 < kanzure> yeah i think standard procedure is to have a perimeter outlined on the ground
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16:49 < genehacker> I'd suggest a robot cage
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16:49 < fenn> wtf, "unimate jr3" only gets results for this particular arm in austin
16:50 < genehacker> that's a serial number I think
16:51 < kanzure> i bet a lot of this equipment is pre-internet to the point that the original manufacturers went out of business and never put stuff up online
16:53 < genehacker> http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~deadslug/puma.html
16:53 < fenn> yeah supposedly there are manuals online that people have scanned in, it's all bitrotted links though
16:53 < fenn> oh there you go
16:54 < genehacker> "This page contains useful information (manuals, diagrams, and other links) for people interested in retrofitting Unimation PUMA robots or writing low-level software."
16:54 < genehacker> odd there's no word of what happened to unimation, the first industrial robot manufacturing company
16:54 < fenn> so now "all you have to do" is reverse engineer all that stuff
16:55 < fenn> SMOEDBP
16:55 < kanzure> oh boy oh boy
16:55 < fenn> simple matter of engineering designing building and programming
16:55 < kanzure> so in other words.. just starting from scratch
16:55 < genehacker> well not really from scratch
16:55 < kanzure> sometimes it's better to throw away shit that other people fucked up
16:56 < fenn> what is tha actual model number? is it a 560?
16:56 < kanzure> 500
16:57 < fenn> you sure about that? not "500 series"?
16:57 < kanzure> i'm not presently near it to double check of course
16:57 < fenn> pics or it didnt happen'
16:57 < kanzure> ebay auction says 560
16:57 < kanzure> http://cgi.ebay.com/Unimate-PUMA500-Robot-Arm-JR3-67M25A-U560-hand-/290373583741?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item439b9d437d
16:57 < fenn> never trust ebay
16:57 < kanzure> pics: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_puma500.jpg
16:57 < kanzure> http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_154006_puma500.jpg
16:57 < genehacker> I'd say it's a simple matter of figuring out which connectors on it go to which motors and how to drive em
16:57 < genehacker> oh and the pots too
16:58 < kanzure> here's the craigslist posting
16:58 < kanzure> http://austin.craigslist.org/sys/1737794799.html
16:58 < kanzure> it says both U560 and PUMA500
16:58 < genehacker> ok then there's a retrofit guide available
16:58 < fenn> jr3 is the gripper model number
16:59 < kanzure> aren't the end effectors supposed to be interchangeable?
16:59 < fenn> i doubt you'll find the right wiring connectors , will have to chop them off and wire to terminal blocks probably
16:59 < kanzure> on the ebay auction page there's a close-up of the connector
16:59 < fenn> yeah
16:59 < kanzure> it looks a raw pin-out to the servos
16:59 < fenn> connectors usually cost more than what you pay for the machine
17:00 < kanzure> so, we've confirmed 2.5DOF so far
17:00 < kanzure> but i can't get the first arm link to move at all
17:01 < kanzure> or for the base to rotate
17:01 < genehacker> by forcing it to turn?
17:01 < genehacker> I wouldn't do that....
17:01 < kanzure> i think there's a locking mechanism that goes away when the pneumatic hookup is in place?
17:01 < genehacker> maybe
17:01 < genehacker> I doubt it
17:01 < genehacker> don't push the arm
17:02 < genehacker> you might mess up the gearing
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17:03 < fenn> usually the brake is electric
17:03 < genehacker> so it has a brake then?
17:04 < fenn> photos of puma brake: http://theatronics.com/Servo_Repair_Photos.php
17:04 < genehacker> so if it's a puma 560 there's a lot of documentation available
17:05 < fenn> don't wrap coils in teflon, use kapton
17:05 < fenn> teflon degrades to fluorine gas
17:05 < fenn> or HF gas or something
17:06 < genehacker> http://juve.ro/blog/puma
17:06 < genehacker> I don't think we have to worry about HF gas fenn
17:06 < genehacker> or do we?
17:07 < fenn> i know that guy.. he's on freenode as alex_joni
17:08 < kanzure> juve.ro?
17:08 < fenn> yeah
17:08 < genehacker> really?
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17:08 < genehacker> then it's time to ask him about our puma
17:09 < fenn> he does welding robot servicing and installation for his dad's company
17:09 < fenn> looks like he went to bed 4 hours ago
17:10 < kanzure> such is irc
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17:10 < kanzure> hi lepton_ 
17:10 < fenn> you could just start blabbering in emc and somebody will probably blabber back
17:11 < kanzure> lepton_: i bought myself a fancy lamp stand today: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/2010-05-28_puma500.jpg
17:17 < kanzure> other pics: http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/puma560/
17:17 < lepton_> ha! hello
17:18 < lepton_> fenn: Yeah, if you were to blabber about EMC that would probably incite a response from me
17:18 < lepton_> Plans for the arms?
17:18 < lepton_> nevermind, reading the logs now
17:19 < kanzure> heh someone in #startups thought i paid $200k for it
17:20 < genehacker> so if we mount it from the ceiling we might be able to make it into a waldo
17:20 < lepton_> Damn, I look away for 3 mineuts and the CNC finishing the toolpath I wanted to watch
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17:21 < lepton_> looks like it went well, at least
17:21 < lepton_> genehacker: Did you just reference Waldo, as in the old piece of fiction?
17:21 < genehacker> yeah sort of
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17:22 < lepton_> awesome
17:22 < genehacker> any robot you control with a strap in arm set up I consider a waldo
17:22 < lepton_> sure! I'm just not used to people being aware of that story/term
17:23 < genehacker> I might be able to obtain a waldo suit that can be used to control the robot if we get it working and mounted upside down
17:23 < genehacker> there was a robot arm knot tying competition here a while back and some one made one
17:24 < lepton_> Honestly, sounds like a pretty do-able project just with an Arduino and a CNC
17:24 < lepton_> or maybe a LeafLabs Maple, since I just got that and I'm excited to do Arduino things on an STM32
17:24 < fenn> i think eric hunting is the real life version of waldo
17:24 < kanzure> "where is eric hunting" just doesn't have the same ring to it
17:24 < kanzure> because the answer is always "in the fucking desert"
17:24 < fenn> just wait until the movie comes out
17:25 < genehacker> I wouldn't say just an arduino, we need some PWM controllers and ADCs
17:25 < lepton_> kanzure: any interest in talking me into coming down to Austin for the June conference?
17:25 < kanzure> sure!
17:25 < kanzure> uhh uhh
17:25 < kanzure> hm
17:25 < lepton_> ^I do PWM servo control on Arduinos
17:25 < kanzure> how about, i'm paying?
17:25 < lepton_> But yeah, better hardware is always good
17:25 < lepton_> ahhh
17:25 < lepton_> yeah?
17:26 < kanzure> it's possible
17:26 < genehacker> as in beefier PWM servo controllers
17:26 < genehacker> this thing's pretty big
17:26 < fenn> i dont think you should use an arduino to control this
17:26  * kanzure agrees
17:26 < fenn> plan on spending ~500 for control electronics
17:26 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
17:26 < fenn> get a mesa m5i20 and whatever amps they sell
17:26 < kanzure> dave (or davyn or whatever?) suggested a few thousand
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17:27 < fenn> oh right, six axis so at least $1k
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17:27  * kanzure tries to get davyn in here
17:27 -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:27 < kanzure> hey klafka 
17:28 < kanzure> see pm
17:28 < genehacker> lepton are you in austin
17:29 < lepton_> Boulder, Colorado
17:29 < genehacker> ok
17:29 < lepton_> Sounds like I might be in Austin in June, though
17:30 < genehacker> I'll be in a place called Thermofluid systems then
17:30 < lepton_> Looks like I'll have more time available that week than I had anticipated (though my girlfriend will not be pleased if I skip town that weekend)
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17:31 < kanzure> yay hi quantumkat 
17:31 < kanzure> but i was trying to get dave in here
17:31 < quantumkat> Heya
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17:33 < kanzure> right, so, adopt a lab rat needs a logo
17:33 < kanzure> hi elevenarms 
17:33 < elevenarms> hello all
17:33 < kanzure> fenn: did you and dave talk yet about hextatic stuff and parts
17:33 < genehacker> adopt a lab rat?
17:33 < kanzure> genehacker: yeah, they deserve our loving too
17:33 < fenn> kanzure no
17:33 < fenn> i forgot
17:33  * fenn adds to todo lol
17:34 < elevenarms> re: the puma 500
17:34 < elevenarms> https://docs.google.com/fileview?id=0B1ZODSrj5_bmN2YyNzVlMDgtYWIzOS00M2M4LWE3NWQtZDBhMjQ4MDlmMGYy&hl=en
17:34 < elevenarms> is an article of interest
17:34 < fenn> oh hi dave
17:34 < elevenarms> hi fenn
17:34 < genehacker> yeah found that earlier
17:35 < elevenarms> not the approach i would have taken... but a good starting point
17:35 < fenn> i'm always skeptical of academic papers explaining how to do some project
17:35 < genehacker> chinese paper go figure
17:36 < fenn> total cost $4k
17:36 < kanzure> Lab Rat Adoption Taskforce (LRAT)
17:36 < fenn> seriously just use a mesa card
17:36 < fenn> and emc
17:37 < kanzure> btw do you mean mesa like mesa gl?
17:37 < elevenarms> which mesa fenn?
17:37 < fenn> no
17:37 < elevenarms> is there an 8 channel one?
17:38 < fenn> 5i20 on here http://www.mesanet.com/fpgacardinfo.html
17:38 < fenn> 5i22 has slightly more io 
17:39 < fenn> both are supported with emc
17:39 < fenn> there are also plug-in amp boards
17:39 < elevenarms> the 3C20
17:39 < elevenarms> ?
17:40 < fenn> http://www.mesanet.com/motioncardinfo.html
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17:41 < fenn> not sure how big this robot is.. but 7i30 or 8i20 are probably what you want
17:41 < fenn> the 50 pin ribbon cable just plugs in
17:42 < fenn> anything on that page with a 50 pin IDC
17:43 < elevenarms> the puma spec sheet lists the power req @ 1500w total
17:43 < fenn> is the puma brushed or brushless?
17:43 < elevenarms> brushed
17:43 < fenn> ok good
17:44 < fenn> so one 7i30 and one 7i40 would probably do what you want
17:45 < fenn> HostMot is their emc driver
17:45 < elevenarms> noted
17:47 < fenn> should also get a 7i37 for misc crap like the gripper and fans and stuff
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17:47 < fenn> 7i37T
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17:50 < fenn> so what are we up to now... 5i20 - $199, 7i30-4 - $89, 7i40 - $150, 7i37T - $79 = $517 for control cards
17:50 < kanzure> that doesn't sound terrible
17:51 < elevenarms> nb indeed i guessed 1-2k
17:51 < fenn> add a big honkin PSU and lots of wires and buttons and connectors and a pc and a box
17:51 < fenn> i'd suggest a couple antec toroid transformers from ebay
17:51 < kanzure> elevenarms: what about the mechanical work that you guestimated?
17:51 < kanzure> i was meaning to sit down and write it all down
17:52 < elevenarms> i'm worried about the servo brake
17:52 < elevenarms> the rebuild walkthrough you posted should give us some idea of what's involved
17:53 < fenn> for psu something like this: http://cgi.ebay.com/35-35V-600VA-Toroidal-Transformer-CNC-Controller-HiFi-/370294124931?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item56373ff183
17:53 < fenn> except twice as big, maybe two in parallel or series would work
17:53 < fenn> and you will probably want a soft-start circuit so it doesnt blow the breaker every time you turn it on
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17:54 < kanzure> oh no
17:54 < fenn> servo brake is just 6 io lines
17:55 < elevenarms> i'm hoping the arm doesn't need a complete rebuild
17:55 < fenn> oh nice http://cgi.ebay.com/78V-600W-CNC-Mill-Router-Power-Supply-Servo-Motor-6N78F-/370388214549?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item563cdba315
17:55 < fenn> yeah this is assuming it works at all
17:55 < kanzure> fenn: btw, this is his bridgeport http://designfiles.org/~bryan/photos/puma560/2010-05-28%2015.57.43_Austin_Texas_US.jpg
17:55 < kanzure> sorry for the bad quality
17:55 < fenn> did you ever get your camera working?
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17:55 < kanzure> i like the random bike parts all over the place
17:55 < kanzure> no, this is a "smart" phone
17:56 < elevenarms> if were ordering all this mesa hardware... it might be time for me to do a retrofit on the bport
17:57 < fenn> i forget, is that steppers or servos?
17:57 < elevenarms> dc servos
17:57 < fenn> if samco is around in #emc, i think he did a puma retrofit with emc a couple years ago
17:58 < elevenarms> I got it working with the centroid control... but promptly crashed the z axis
17:59 < elevenarms> (bad encoders)
17:59 < fenn> 2008 "Ours is a puma mark II 500 series"
17:59 < fenn> oops
17:59 < fenn> hope you were running it at low voltage
18:00 < elevenarms> eh... full power
18:00 < fenn> bad wiring? 
18:00 < fenn> i hate the whole control box concept
18:01 < fenn> sending high speed fragile signals down a long wire near huge whirring magnetic fields is just a bad idea
18:01 < elevenarms> indeed
18:01 < fenn> should have a little chip sitting right on the encoder counting, then talk to it with a robust communications protocol
18:02 < fenn> checksums etc
18:02 < elevenarms> i forget who makes them... but that exists - "smartmotors" they call them
18:02 < fenn> you could even use ethernet.. etherCAT is sort of designed like that
18:02 < fenn> there's a lot of proprietary crap out there
18:02 < fenn> ethercat is just barely open enough that i'd consider using it
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18:02 < elevenarms> fyi - http://www.animatics.com/
18:03 < fenn> meh
18:03 < fenn> any fool can make a smart motor module, even i did it: http://fennetic.net/machines/iskewb
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18:04 < fenn> http://fennetic.net/machines/motherchip
18:04 < elevenarms> seen it... i think i have your boards for those
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18:04 < fenn> i didnt make any boards yet, i think just a partial schematic and components
18:05 < elevenarms> there are some diy-etch boards in the box not sure what they are
18:05 < fenn> kicad files: http://fennetic.net/irc/iskewb.tgz
18:06 < elevenarms> awesome.
18:07 < fenn> it's just the h-bridge i think
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18:10 < elevenarms> fenn: i gotta run... i'll catch up via email...
18:10 < fenn> were these the boards? http://fennetic.net/irc/usbspi_v1.1f.jpg
18:10 < fenn> those are avr programmers
18:10 < fenn> ciao
18:10 < elevenarms> adios
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18:11 < kanzure> cool
18:13 < kanzure> who is eric michaud?
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18:23 < fenn> president of pumping station one
18:28 < kanzure> on a long phone call with him
18:28 < kanzure> he wants to do an open source sub micron double sided pcb automation setup
18:29 < kanzure> and a $100k prize for this
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18:36 < kanzure> well that was an odd call
18:36 < kanzure> hm he worked at anl.gov
18:36 < genehacker> LANL?
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18:36 < kanzure> yeah
18:37 < genehacker> sub micro pic and place?
18:38 < genehacker> is that for electronics assembly or something more exotic?
18:38 < kanzure> pcb board stuff
18:39 < genehacker> why submicron?
18:39 < kanzure> for some reason i didn't take notes
18:39 < kanzure> usually i type out full transcripts of what the other person is saying
18:39 < kanzure> i guess i'm a little tired today
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19:10 < fenn> sub micron for what?
19:11 < fenn> that's 0.00004 inches
19:13 < fenn> typical pcb services are +-0.004
19:13 < fenn> sth like that
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19:18 < kanzure> < pfred1> well steppers are like motors made in the land of the backwards
19:22 < kanzure> fenn: so i think i have some liquidator suppliers now
19:22 < kanzure> here in austin.. they hoard random lab equipment and industrial equipment
19:22 < kanzure> so i was thinking of just giving them the fablab inventory list
19:23 < kanzure> they also seem to have a good supply of thermocyclers.. so maybe an avr+http server kit would be doable in tandem with them
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19:37 < fenn> sure, if you have a lot of a common thermocycler model
19:37 < fenn> one-off hacks dont scale well
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19:47 < kanzure> hi elevenarms 
19:48 < elevenarms> hola
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20:00 < kanzure> elevenarms: how goes the trail of lights app
20:01 < elevenarms> good... i'm say.io'ing at the moment
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21:33 < kanzure> http://www.robomo.com/member_pages/jerry/PUMA/
21:33 < kanzure> hah he has the same model
21:37 < kanzure> and got a better deal ($75)
21:41 -!- superkuh [hukrepus@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
21:44 < fenn> hay can you launch a cruise missile strike on UFCU for me? kthnx
21:44 < kanzure> is that a credit union?
21:44 < fenn> yeah, in austin
21:44 < kanzure> what's up?
21:45 < fenn> somehow i've racked up $500 of overdraft charges and they didnt find it important to mention anything to me or deny the charge
21:45 < kanzure> lovely
21:45 < fenn> so each caltrain ticket incurred a $40 fee
21:45 < fenn> no email, no phone notification, even though they had my info
21:47 < dustbin> wow fenn never had a problem with them like that
21:48 < dustbin> have you talked to a rep yet?
21:50 < kanzure> it kind of scares me that there's 64,000 rails apps running: http://heroku.com/
21:50 < kanzure> just on that site
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22:11 < flamt_> don't say cruise missile
22:11 < flamt_> remember keith henson. remember cryogenics
22:11 < flamt_> never forget
22:11 < genehacker> cruise missile
22:11 < genehacker> ?
22:11 < genehacker> oh
22:13 < flamt_> lol
22:23 < JayDugger> Good morning, everyone.
22:24 < flamt_> how are you
22:24 < JayDugger> Just now awake.
22:26 < JayDugger> Fenn, I am sorry to hear about your unpleasant surprise.
22:27 < JayDugger> Genehacker, did you go to ISDC?
22:29 < genehacker> isdc?
22:30 < genehacker> no but if I'm lucky I'll go to IGVC
22:34 < JayDugger> Participant or spectator?
22:34 < JayDugger> http://www.igvc.org/
22:35 < genehacker> participant
22:36 < genehacker> and spectator
22:36 < JayDugger> Good! Go, man, go!
22:36 < genehacker> I have class on the same day
22:37 < flamt_> jee
22:37 < genehacker> class which might entail a visit to a nuclear reactor
22:37 < JayDugger> Hereabouts? A research reactor, or a power plant?
22:38 < genehacker> research reactor
22:39 < JayDugger> TRIGA?
22:43 < genehacker> no
22:43 < genehacker> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mgNwtepP-6M
22:43 < genehacker> this one
22:43 < genehacker> err maybe
22:44 < JayDugger> Yeah, I think that's a TRIGA.
22:44 < JayDugger> Cherenkov radiation is well worth seeing live.
22:45 < JayDugger> YMMV. I'd probably go see the UTA reactor in your place.
22:46 < genehacker> exactly what I hope to see
22:46 < genehacker> and it's a major maybe at this point
22:47 < JayDugger> Spoiled for choice by two excellent options.
22:49 < JayDugger> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TRIGA
22:50 < JayDugger> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cherenkov_radiation
22:50 < genehacker> yup the blue glow
22:50 < JayDugger> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Cerenkov_Effect.jpg
22:51 < JayDugger> Good detail, crummy color, in that image, but I saw that very reactor when I lived in Portland.
22:52 < genehacker> oh wait, that's a yes
22:53 < JayDugger> Why would an undergraduate liberal arts school have a reactor? "'It's just a neat facility,' he [Reed PA Dept.] said."
22:53 < JayDugger> Best reason of all, IMO.
22:54 < genehacker> a liberal arts school with a nuclear reactor
22:54 < JayDugger> Yup.
22:54 < genehacker> nothing suspicious there
22:54 < JayDugger> Every so often, their administration would have a fit of engineering-school-envy.
22:55 < JayDugger> We have a good Arts & Sciences faculty, prestigious alumni (sort of), and why shouldn't we have an "X"?
22:56 < JayDugger> Their reputation in Portland was, odd...
22:56 < genehacker> now I wonder if Sokal said anything about nuclear reactors in his famous affair
22:56 < genehacker> oh oh I know there
22:56 < genehacker> 's plenty of postmodernistic reasons for them to have a nuclear reactor
22:57 < genehacker> oh they actually have an engineering program
22:58 < JayDugger> Really?
22:59 < JayDugger> That's changed in the last <NEVERMINDHOWLONG> years.
22:59 < JayDugger> Well, they've had it since 1968.
23:00 < JayDugger> Oh, those are joint programs with Caltech, Columbia, and Rensselaer.
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23:01 < JayDugger> I give $0.02 to the OT jar.
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23:15 < flamt_> i've visited a research reactor
23:15 < flamt_> well. infiltrated one
23:15 < flamt_> learning reactor. at a university
23:15 < flamt_> for study
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23:50 < fenn> how the heck do they remove all the control rods in under 50 ms?
23:51 < fenn> and what keeps the fuel rods from shattering from thermal shock
23:51 < JayDugger> I vaguely remember it's triggered by a mechanism called "SCRAM," which supposedly stands for Stand-by Control Rod Ax Man.
23:51 < JayDugger> Or that might be inserting them...
23:52 < JayDugger> Probably the water bath that contains the core.
23:52 < JayDugger> I probably have the manuals...somewhere...
23:52 < JayDugger> I think you could probably get them from the General Atomics website, though.
23:53 < fenn> let me just dig around in my old vault-tec catalogs for a minute
23:54 < JayDugger> Or whoever bought that division from GA. I think they just make UAVs now-a-days.
23:54 < fenn> general atomics no longer makes reactors? for shame!
23:54 < JayDugger> I don't know that--they just get more ink in the trade press about their UAVs.
23:55 < JayDugger> If they don't, I agree about the shamefulness of wasting such a great name.
23:55 < JayDugger> Of course--atom-powered aircraft have a alt-tech, dieselpunk appeal.
23:56 < fenn> you mean a fucking awesome in any context appeal?
23:56 < fenn> i'm so pissed at this weaksauce world
23:56 < JayDugger> Well, yes...but that's not a terribly popular opinion.
23:56 < fenn> where's my atomic jetpack
23:56 < fenn> i have an appointment on mars this weekend!
23:57 < JayDugger> On the Warehouse 23 shelf, next to your gadolinium energy cell GI tract replacement...you know, the one labeled " (cc) Freitas Bionics Ltd."
23:57 < JayDugger> ;)
23:57  * fenn pouts and stuffs more dumpstered cookies into his face
23:58 < fenn> (actually i'm eating brussel sprouts but don't tell anybody)
23:58 < JayDugger> Brussels sprouts have zero appeal.
23:58 < JayDugger> One of two vegetables I hate.
23:59 < fenn> that's because everybody cooks them wrong