--- Log opened Mon Mar 05 00:00:38 2012
00:48 < strangewarp> If I wanted to guesstimate a year where it would be viable to live moderately well without any housing or traditional source of income, what year would that be?
00:48 < foucist> strangewarp: you don't know what you want to guesstimate it at?
00:49 < foucist> or are you asking us to guesstimate it for you :p
00:49 < strangewarp> I am asking for a second opinion, yes :p
00:50 < foucist> gonna go with 2040
01:01 < strangewarp> Hmmm
01:04 < foucist> a mere 28 years in the future hmm
01:04 < foucist> maybe not good enough
01:04 < foucist> perhaps it could be projected somewhat
01:04 < foucist> well, is cost of food going down?
01:04 < foucist> cost of housing?
01:04 < foucist> probably not
01:04 < foucist> cost of electricity/energy sure is going down though
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01:05 < foucist> can super cheap energy be used to compensate for the food/housing problem?
01:07 < strangewarp> Vat-meat is on the way, so.. partially, I'd assume
01:08 < strangewarp> And the descendents of 3D printers would be convenient for making insta-houses, so.. probably, if laws didn't interfere
01:11 < Steel> strangewarp, 3d printed houses are already being done
01:11 < Steel> I'd have to find the paper though
01:13 < strangewarp> Ah, I'd heard about that, but isn't it still in the concept stage, where it's been done but not scaled up?
01:14 < Steel> not sure
01:14 < Steel> I'd have to find the paper again
01:15 < Steel> do you care enough for me to look?
01:17 < strangewarp> Nah, it's fine\
01:20 < strangewarp> Was just fishing for people's opinions on the projected date of universal food-housing-wellbeing welfare, at the behest of a friend... might ask again in the daytime :p
01:22 < Steel> hah
01:22 < Steel> honestly?
01:22 < Steel> depends on locale.
01:22 < Steel> and surplus mass/energy
01:22 < strangewarp> indeed, and.. indeed
01:26 < Steel> http://jme.bmj.com/content/31/5/273.full have y'all read this?
01:28 < strangewarp> ...! I've actually read that!
01:28 < Steel> hah
01:28 < Steel> I have a list of 54 articles, actually
01:34 < strangewarp> Hm, for specific purposes?
01:34 < Steel> depends
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03:24 < Vicarious> 'morning
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06:40 < JayDugger> Hello, everyone.
06:40 < Mariu> hey JayDugger
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12:00 < Mokbortolan_> https://share.sandia.gov/news/resources/news_releases/prosthetics/
12:00 < Mokbortolan_> Sandia developing nerve interface
12:00 < kanzure> what type
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12:01 < Mokbortolan_> biocompatible polymers
12:02 < Mokbortolan_> scaffolds, wires
12:04 < kanzure> so electrodes?
12:05 < Mokbortolan_> yep
12:06 < Mokbortolan_> I've read that wires tend to get coated with a protein that degrades its ability to talk to nerves
12:06 < Mokbortolan_> is there a name for that substance/process?
12:08 < kanzure> Mokbortolan_: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/implants/Response%20of%20brain%20tissue%20to%20chronically%20implanted%20neural%20electrodes.pdf
12:08 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/implants/Magnetic%20resonance%20compatibility%20of%20neural%20implants%20-%202006%20-%20whowouldhavethought.pdf
12:09 < Mokbortolan_> thanks!
12:14 < Mokbortolan_> wow
12:14 < kanzure> liking what you see?
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12:15 < Mokbortolan_> When CNS damage severs blood vessels, microglia are indistinguishable from the blood borne, monocyte-derived macrophages
12:15 < Mokbortolan_> that are recruited by the degranulation of platelets and the cellular release of cytokines.
12:15 < Mokbortolan_> the brain keeps a ready stock of defenders
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12:48 < fenn> mmm http://www.flickr.com/photos/sandialabs/sets/
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12:57 < delinquentme> http://stark-fire-6273.herokuapp.com/  << front end of the  OSCAR-4 chemo parser ( note: the "parse" option doesn't work as I'm not currently running the backend EC2 server )
12:57 < delinquentme> but you can take a look at the existing parses w the "browse" button
12:58 < kanzure> delinquentme: can you get xserver-xorg-video-dummy running on heroku?
12:58 < delinquentme> what is that?
12:58 < delinquentme> it sounds like a video codex for ubuntu?
12:58 < delinquentme> do you mean EC2?
13:01 < kanzure> no i do not mean ec2
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13:41 < delinquentme> kanzure, im about to do another interview ... i can catch up w what you're working on in like an hour
13:41 < delinquentme> cooool?
13:42 < kanzure> i might be sleeping in an hour
13:56 < delinquentme> kk
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14:36 < jrayhawk> huh, clinicaltrials.gov is a pretty cool site
14:40 < kanzure> i mentioned it in the backlog recently if you want to see some myostatin-related trials
14:40 < kanzure> yashgaroth delivered some links for various studies
14:42 < jrayhawk> Eh, steroids and growth hormones seem effective and safe enough for me.
14:42 < jrayhawk> if I were to give a shit about muscle growth, that is.
14:42 < Steel> muscle growth = I can eat more
14:42 < kanzure> i'm still confused about why there's such a large amount of steroid misinformation
14:43 < jrayhawk> Only in the U.S.
14:43 < jrayhawk> Most everywhere else, anabolics are legal
14:43 < kanzure> the internet is less cluttered elsewhere?
14:43 < kanzure> or "because you live in the US you are probably exposed to anti-steroid propaganda"
14:44 < kanzure> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anabolic_steroids
14:44 < jrayhawk> I don't know if propaganda is even needed at this point; there's massive selection bias.
14:44 < jrayhawk> Basically the only time we hear about steroids is when some jackass overdoses.
14:44 < kanzure> i guess this is a result of wikipedia's "all views are equally valid"
14:45 < kanzure> "A 2005 review determined that some, but not all, randomized controlled studies have found that anabolic steroid use correlates with hypomania and increased aggressiveness, but pointed out that attempts to determine whether AAS use triggers violent behaviour have failed, primarily because of high rates of non-participation."
14:45 < kanzure> non-participation o.o
14:45 < Mokbortolan_> some kid's dad went apeshit and some politicians took the reins to further their campaigns
14:46 < kanzure> is there some sort of secondary effect where- if you ban the drug itself- misinformation is generated about it?
14:46 < kanzure> why is that in the form of a question
14:47 < zacharycohn> jrayhawk: This site would be a lot more awesome if I could find any studies with results posted...
14:47 < kanzure> zacharycohn: mostly the results show up on pubmed... eventually
14:47 < Mokbortolan_> kanzure: the misinformation is part of the initial campaign
14:47 < jrayhawk> http://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT00385671?term=portland&rank=26 i found one!
14:47 < Mokbortolan_> and afterwards social rules take over and not only propagate it, but punish misinformation deniers
14:47 < jrayhawk> but i don't expect there's a lot of motivation to post results here; this seems like a recruitment platform.
14:48 < Mokbortolan_> the monkeys make sure that nobody climbs the ladder
14:51 < zacharycohn> kanzure: I keep finding 3-4 year old studies with "no results posted" messages
14:52 < kanzure> oh yeah has anyone figured out if you can participate in overseas clinical trials while in the states?
14:52 < kanzure> 'transatlantic clinical trials' sounds pretty cool
14:53 < jrayhawk> It would depend on the experiment design, but I assume some of them would be okay.
14:53 < kanzure> eh i mean legal stuff
14:53 < jrayhawk> That would also depend on the experiment design.
14:54 < jrayhawk> I imagine importing drugs would be a no-no, but diet and behavioral studies don't really need that
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14:55 < jrayhawk> Does the U.S. have laws on medical tourism yet?
14:58 < kanzure> hi paolao
15:00 < paolao> hi
15:02 < jrayhawk> and, ironically, not all of these seem to be clincal trials
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16:45 < kanzure> bkero: one of the emokit maintainers is going to be speaking tomorrow at something
16:45 < kanzure> http://www.openyou.org/
16:45 < kanzure> http://www.meetup.com/Data-Mining/events/50787192/
16:46 < bkero> kanzure: orly
16:52 < kanzure> blah more people trying to recruit me to different transhumanism forums
16:53 < kanzure> if only people would work on projects, rather than putting so much time into recruiting pre-existing transhumanists
16:54 < Steel> what forum?
16:54 < kanzure> an onion network thing
16:54 < Steel> hahaha.
16:55 < Steel> goddamn, I'm worried about obscurity as is and they're usiong TOR?
16:55 < kanzure> who cares?
16:55 < Steel> not you
16:55 < kanzure> do you need help using tor Steel
16:55 < Steel> nope! I can use it.
16:56 < Steel> however, it raises barrier to entry
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16:56 < eudoxia> Steel you should have made an onion network/tor thing
16:56 < eudoxia> put us in some badass watchlists
16:57 < Steel> I'm pretty sure anyone w ho works for the government is put on a different agency's watchlist by default
16:57 < kanzure> the quality of work achieved does not depend on th quantity of clickthrough traffic...
16:57 < Steel> yes, but when people who are interested in the subject don't even fucking know about the concept/field in general, you don't want to raise your publicity barriers
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16:58 < kanzure> you're assuming everyon wants publicity :(
16:58 < kanzure> *everyone
16:59 < kanzure> if publicity happens just let it happen.. don't sweat it if it doesn't
16:59 < Steel> they don't, but the movement/philosophy (call it whatever you want, I don't care) needs it.
16:59 < kanzure> the what?
16:59 < kanzure> ok ok not this argument again
16:59 < Steel> when most biomeds I've talked to are interested after hearing about it, but never knew such a concept/group of people existed, there's an issue
17:00 < kanzure> medicine is very much already about health and improving bodies, what you smoking?
17:00 < Steel> 'is it like that crazy kurzweil stuff?'
17:00 < kanzure> kurzweil doesn't matter in the scheme of things
17:01 < Steel> you keep being awesome and trucking, dude. I'll keep telling people that these ideas exist.
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17:16 < Urchin> kurzweil sometimes makes predictions on principles that support opposite conclusions
17:16 < Urchin> like his idea of voice operated computers
17:16 < Urchin> I find keyboards hard to replace
17:16 < eudoxia> Kurzweil sometimes makes predictions on principles that benefit his companies
17:16 < Urchin> particularly as I use the terminal a lot
17:17 < eudoxia> "oh goodness I make text-speech software keyboards will go eat shit in the future"
17:18 < Steel> ugh
17:18 < Steel> fuuuuck.
17:18 < foucist> i think you need more than just voice operated, probably also need eyeball tracking
17:19 < foucist> to help the computer know wtf you want
17:19 < eudoxia> you can always use the mouse to specify context
17:20 < kanzure> the mouse sucks
17:20 < eudoxia> he didn't say anything about having to click with your voice
17:20 < kanzure> and i don't want to have to look at things to make things happen
17:20 < Steel> we're going to see swype operated glasses by the end of the year imo
17:20 < kanzure> if i had to look at all the things i've done with a keyboard, i'd be doomed
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17:21 < foucist> eudoxia: a window/pointer based system is probably doomed anyways, for voice operation
17:22 < eudoxia> unless the thing is so meta you can say "mod + r" and "alt + F4" and shit
17:22 < foucist> uh..
17:22 < foucist> that defeats the purpose
17:23 < kanzure> i am sometimes able to do keystrokes on the order of 10-50ms
17:23 < kanzure> depending on which keys we are talking about
17:23 < kanzure> plus or minus 8 fingers
17:24 < kanzure> i don't think you can get that throughput with eyeball
17:24 < kanzure> *eyeballs
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17:25 < foucist> kanzure: yeah probably not
17:28 < kanzure> !! unless!
17:28 < kanzure> you use compound eyes
17:28 < kanzure> individually addressible compound eyes
17:28 < kanzure> OK so first i am going to need to find some articulated compound eye genes
17:28 < kanzure> and 3 paperclips and some glue
17:29  * katsmeow-afk hides the duct tape
17:32 < Vicarious> ohai
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17:33 < katsmeow-afk> i ask this because i do  not know, what is the meaning of "strage"?
17:35 < Vicarious> could be a typo
17:35 < eudoxia> massacre?
17:35 < foucist> typo for strange
17:35 < eudoxia> according to define:strage
17:36 < foucist> otherwise it's an italian word
17:36 < katsmeow-afk> oh
17:36 < Vicarious> or a combination of stage and rage
17:38 < katsmeow-afk> http://dictionary.sensagent.com/strage/it-en/
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17:40 < Vicarious> or it could be just a nickname
17:40 < kanzure> stage+rage sounds right
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17:54 < kanzure> i need something where i ca 5
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17:59 < delinquentme> katsmeow-afk, arent you from #robotics?
18:01 < Steel> anyone in here from the NoVA region that needs a roommate?
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18:08 < ybit> i'm looking for a repository of images i can use for a kde booth...
18:09 < ybit> anyone here know of something like this/
18:09 < ybit> i'm not so great at ripping images from flickr it turns out
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18:11 < ybit> http://www.clearbits.net
18:11 < ybit> nice
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18:18 < katsmeow-afk> delinquentme, yeas, but i have been in here years before today
18:18 < delinquentme> nice!
18:18 < delinquentme> its a good place to be
18:19 < katsmeow-afk> when i came in, there were only 5 nicks here, if that
18:20 < kanzure> ad now we are one million strong!
18:20 < kanzure> *and
18:20 < katsmeow-afk> it was like ybit, me, kansure, bkero, and fenn
18:20 < katsmeow-afk> i contribute nothing, really, but i might learn something
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18:28 < Steel> sup yashg
18:28 < yashgaroth> yo
18:37 < ybit> "i was here before ##hplusroadmap became popular, that's when the real discussions took place!" :)
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18:51 < nsh_> katsmeow-afk is the evil twin. do not trust her lies
18:51 < yashgaroth> k
18:54 < katsmeow-afk> don't trust anyone's lies, silly
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20:45 < delinquentme> allllriiight
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20:45 < delinquentme> whats going on in heeereee
20:47 < Mokbortolan_> I dunno
20:47 < delinquentme> kanzure, you still hacking away?
20:47 < kanzure> cooode
20:51 < delinquentme> ^^ nice
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21:58 < katsmeow-afk> wow, i met fenn's rl nice twin at the grocery store tonite, looked just like fenn
22:01 < sylph_mako> Why are you people so proximal with each other.
22:01 < katsmeow-afk> we aren't, the real fenn is a 3 day drive away from me
22:02 < katsmeow-afk> that said, some in here are gypsies, moving from one convention to the next
22:02 < sylph_mako> I see.
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22:48 < bkero> ybit: ##hsplusroadmap is popular?
22:49 < bkero> o shit 53 nicks
22:49 < bkero> 26 of which must clearly be bots ;)
22:50  * katsmeow-afk agrres
22:51 < katsmeow-afk> so eating 50gms of protien for breakfast will suppress appetite all day long?
22:52 < bkero> I usually go for the emotionally distraught appetite suppressant
22:53 < foucist> ybit: too bad you didn't participate in the real discussions
22:53 < katsmeow-afk> i don't know that one
22:55 < rkos> whats there to live for if you don't have an appetite?
22:55 < katsmeow-afk> merely having less of one, saving some money
22:57 < katsmeow-afk> i am so short on energy, i discovered that eating more isn't the answer
23:01 < ybit> foucist: ahh :'(
23:01 < ybit> it's true
23:01 < ybit> s/ahh/aww
23:01 < ybit> i participated by getting in the way
23:01 < ybit> that counts, right?
23:18 < Utopiah_> I suppose most here know about https://6002x.mitx.mit.edu but just in case <-
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23:46 < foucist> ybit: :P
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--- Log closed Tue Mar 06 00:00:39 2012