--- Log opened Wed Apr 11 00:00:30 2012
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00:07 < diginet> is protein size generally inversely proportional to rate of expression?
00:08 < yashgaroth> generally, yes
00:14 < kanzure> why am i awake?
00:14 < kanzure> and what is this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YwnM3eMh3Q8#t=1910
00:14 < kanzure> the whole fist of the north star?
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00:31 < diginet> I'm worried that the expression of my protein will be too low to be usable
00:32 < yashgaroth> there are ways around that...titin gets expressed all the time
00:32 < diginet> lol, titin
00:33 < diginet> doesn't titin have an absurdly low half-life, like 2 hours or something?
00:33 < diginet> what are the ways around that? just using a strong promoter? or are there others?
00:33 < yashgaroth> most of your problems are due to the size of the mRNA
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00:34 < yashgaroth> more likely to get cleaved somewhere, slower to export from the nucleus
00:35 < diginet> how does one rectify that?
00:35 < yashgaroth> you can optimize a number of sequence features on the mRNA, though it's likely the spider has already evolved that
00:36 < yashgaroth> also that 2 hour figure for titin is how long it takes to translate, not its half-life
00:36 < diginet> ohhh
00:37 < diginet> wow, that's looooong
00:37 < diginet> I wish there was more research in the way of in vitro expression
00:38 < yashgaroth> there's plenty, but in vitro expression sucks unless you've got some super-toxic protein
00:38 < yashgaroth> also, the glycosylation and chaperone proteins don't usually work as well in vitro, if at all
00:39 < diginet> true
00:40 < yashgaroth> your main problem will be isolating a stable cell line with high expression
00:40 < diginet> if you had to guess, for a 300 kDa protein, what kind of yields could I expect per liter, for a batch reactor?
00:40 < yashgaroth> oh man there's way too many variables
00:41 < diginet> I figured :(
00:41 < diginet> what are the most important one?
00:41 < diginet> *ones
00:41 < yashgaroth> if you had all the money of big biotech, and if the protein doesn't interfere with the cells during/after its synthesis...
00:41 < diginet> (generally speaking)
00:41 < diginet> go on. . .
00:42 < yashgaroth> stability of the protein after secretion is a major one
00:42 < yashgaroth> if it immediately gets eaten by the cells then you're screwed
00:42 < yashgaroth> so silk might fare well in that regard
00:42 < diginet> it should
00:43 < yashgaroth> that's part of why antibodies are so easy to grow - cells have FcRn receptor that spits them back out when they get ingested
00:43 < yashgaroth> so you get baller yields
00:43 < diginet> one thing that's bothered me is that I can't find any realiable information on the solubility of the dope
00:43 < diginet> that's good
00:43 < yashgaroth> I do wonder how the silk proteins are stored in the glands
00:44 < yashgaroth> but generally the interior of a gland is a lot easier to modify (for an organism) than an entire flask of cell culture media
00:44 < diginet> what do you mean?
00:45 < yashgaroth> if they need to be kept at high pH or something, that's fine for cells that have a side that's kept exposed to normal blood
00:45 < yashgaroth> the interior of the gland can have all sorts of weird conditions to store silk monomers in
00:45 < yashgaroth> but at least part of the cell needs access to normal blood/media to keep it alive
00:45 < yashgaroth> when your entire flask resembles the interior of said gland, the cells might not like it
00:46 < yashgaroth> but I have yet to research what conditions the 'dope' is kept in, after being excreted
00:47 < diginet> oh yeah, good point
00:48 < diginet> how hard is it to sort proteins by size? I mean the silk proteins I gather would be significantly larger than most any others
00:49 < yashgaroth> sort, in what sense
00:49 < yashgaroth> the typical method of protein analysis is to run them through a gel by electricity, whereby the heavier proteins will migrate slower
00:50 < diginet> err, seperate I guess
00:50 < yashgaroth> if you don't go with affinity purification, size exclusion could indeed be the easiest way
00:50 < diginet> can size different be used as a means to efficiently purify a protein?
00:50 < diginet> ah
00:50 < diginet> so affinity would be easier?
00:51 < yashgaroth> not necessarily
00:51 < diginet> constructing the collumn seems like it would be a pain
00:51 < yashgaroth> nah
00:51 < diginet> oh it isn't?
00:51 < diginet> hmmm
00:51 < yashgaroth> if you can get the specialized resin and a tube
00:51 < diginet> sounds expensive
00:52 < yashgaroth> yeeeeeah
00:52 < diginet> well how do you get the protein out of the matrix?
00:52 < yashgaroth> they come out eventually
00:52 < yashgaroth> size exclusion works with a non-interacting resin that has nanometer size pores all over it
00:52 < diginet> sounds expensive as well
00:52 < diginet> :(
00:52 < yashgaroth> the smaller proteins tend to get caught in said pores more easily, so they run slower
00:53 < diginet> what about ammoniun sulphate precipitation?
00:53 < diginet> *ammonium
00:53 < yashgaroth> you can certainly try, hard to say how the silk would react
00:53 < diginet> I read reports of it working
00:53 < diginet> would that be easier, or more importantly, cheaper?
00:53 < yashgaroth> it's a solid method, sure
00:54 < diginet> (specifically with spider silk that is)
00:54 < yashgaroth> oh way cheaper, if it works
00:54 < diginet> ahhh
00:54 < yashgaroth> silk proteins strike me as not having the highest solubility, which works both for and against you
00:55 < diginet> In one paper, which produced the proteins in E. Coli, the cells were lysed and "acid precipitated"
00:55 < diginet> any idea what that means? they claimed that the silk proteins were the only ones solluble in the acid
00:56 < yashgaroth> it means they acidified it until everything but the silk proteins dropped out, yeah
00:56 < diginet> the process I've seen that seemed to be the most promising was to heat up the mixture to 90 C, which denatures most of the proteins (but not the silk) and then precipitate it via ammonium sulphate
00:56 < diginet> hmm, that sounds like a possible option
00:57 < yashgaroth> you should really try collecting a bunch of webs and seeing what conditions you can use to purify
00:57 < diginet> oooohhhh, good idea
00:57 < diginet> I could dissolve the proteins, mix them with some other stuff, and try to get them back out
00:57 < yashgaroth> pretty sure that enormous communal spider web was found in texas
00:57 < diginet> haha
00:58 < diginet> I feel pretty confident about being able to transform the yeast cells, what I'm nervous about, as previously mentioned, is the purification process, and the yield rates
00:59 < yashgaroth> at least you can optimize the purification with some collected silk
00:59 < diginet> true
00:59 < yashgaroth> optimizing yield tends to involve plating out thousands of single cells and testing the colonies til you get one with respectable levels of expression
00:59 < diginet> ahhh I see
01:00 < diginet> that sound difficult\
01:00 < yashgaroth> usually under selection conditions as well
01:00 < yashgaroth> yeah it is
01:00 < diginet> I don't have a microscope
01:00 < diginet> so
01:00 < yashgaroth> everyone needs a microscope
01:01 < diginet> hah, yes, I wish I had one
01:01 < yashgaroth> surely some hacker space has one, if nothing else
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01:02 < diginet> true true
01:03 < diginet> I'm wondering, if I were to estimate my yields at say, 250mg/L, if I bought a 200 liter drum, that would be around 50g per batch
01:03 < diginet> I wonder how far that goes
01:03 < diginet> (in terms of the fiber)
01:05 < diginet> I remember seeing a video on those guys trying to use goats to make the protein, they had a tiny vile of the purified protein that they said would produce a meter of fiber.  I believe a single silkworm cocoon will generally yield around 600 m of silk, and it takes around, IIRC, 5000 cocoons to make a silk kimono
01:06 < diginet> meaning you need 3 million meters of silk to make one kimono. Also meaning I'd need one million batches to make an equivalent garment out of spider silk
01:06 < diginet> (given this process)
01:06 < diginet> err
01:06 < diginet> wat
01:06 < diginet> bad math
01:07 < diginet> I wonder how much silk was in that vile
01:11 < diginet> I'd guess it was maybe around half a gram
01:12 < diginet> meaning, each batch would yield 100 meters.  thus putting my necessary batches at 30k
01:12 < yashgaroth> better put on yer spider ranchin' hat, pardner
01:14 < JayDugger> Good luck with that. Ever notice all animals raised on a ranch don't belong to the Predators' Union?
01:15 < yashgaroth> naw man, we'll just, like...keep them super blazed on the chronic all the time, and they'll all get along dude
01:15 < diginet> spiders have the endearing habbit of eating each other, so unfortunately I don't know if that's possible
01:15 < JayDugger> Hmmm....
01:15 < yashgaroth> communal spiders seem to do ok
01:16 < diginet> haha, communal spider rancher?
01:16 < JayDugger> Yeah, you might find a particular breed or species that would serve.
01:16 < JayDugger> The idea of intoxicated spiders might have more use than you'd think.
01:16 < JayDugger> I remember years ago seeing photographs of spiders under the influence of hallucinogens.
01:16 < yashgaroth> peep dis shit http://texasento.net/Social_Spider.htm
01:16 < yashgaroth> yeah I think that was faked, at least the video version Jay
01:17 < diginet> http://youtu.be/sHzdsFiBbFc
01:17 < diginet> that comes to mind :P
01:17 < JayDugger> That's quite possible. I don't remember where I read it, and I don't have a reference.
01:18 < yashgaroth> but when you have a faux-tree structure, filled with a swarm of fruit flies...stick a colony of those spiders in and see what happens
01:18 < yashgaroth> or a few really big flies, whatever makes the spiders decide to band together
01:19 < diginet> yeah, then dissolve the webs, and reconstitute them as a single fiber
01:19 < yashgaroth> bam
01:22 < diginet> lol, spider farms
01:29 < diginet> I think we can thus conclude that the only reasonable way of producing the silk in any appreciable amount is either farming or perhaps transgenic plants
01:31 < yashgaroth> look we're either calling it ranching or rustling
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01:32 < diginet> oohhh, look at this: apparently, if you insert the gene into the genome of the chloroplast, you get ridiculously high yields, like up to 30% total soluble protein
01:33 < yashgaroth> plant cells are a bitch to lyse
01:33 < diginet> sure but it would be worth it
01:34 < yashgaroth> might be a way to selectively ultracentrifuge out the chloroplasts, but I don't work with plant cells
01:35 < diginet> what do you work with generally?
01:36 < yashgaroth> mammalian cells and e.coli
01:36 < yashgaroth> plus pseudomonas or insect cells, depending on where my next job's at
01:37 < diginet> what are the largest proteins one can produce from e.coli?
01:37 < yashgaroth> I've never tried, but probably not much larger than whatever their largest naturally occurring protein is
01:39 < diginet> I'm thinking plants are the most attractive option right now
01:41 < yashgaroth> regardless,
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05:21 < archels> http://trueskinfilm.com/
05:21 < archels> must... see... :O
05:22 < phryk> swf?
05:22 < phryk> sfw*
05:22 < archels> yes
05:23 < phryk> ah nice visuals
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05:30 < archels> totally epic
05:30 < archels> I can't wait to see it. :)
05:36 < phryk> I'll have to watch the trailer later on. too lazy to plug in my headphones into another machine :P
05:39 < archels> not much added value there, it's mostly the visuals.
05:39 < phryk> the visuals are very interesting, I'll have to give it that much^^
05:40 < phryk> doesn't look like a full fledged professional production, but it very interesting.
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05:46 < phryk> s/it//
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06:16 -!- Topic for ##hplusroadmap: biohacking, nootropics, transhumanism, open hardware http://gnusha.org/logs/ http://bit.ly/diybionews2 http://gadaprize.org/ http://groups.google.com/group/diybio
06:16 -!- Topic set by kanzure [~kanzure@131.252.130.248] [Mon Feb 13 12:33:19 2012]
06:16 [Users ##hplusroadmap]
06:16 [ _Sketch_        ] [ epitron        ] [ nathaniel    ] [ strangewarp] 
06:16 [ _sol_           ] [ F7-AFK         ] [ nchaimov     ] [ superkuh   ] 
06:16 [ AlonzoTG        ] [ ferrouswheel   ] [ nuba         ] [ sylph_mako ] 
06:16 [ anelma          ] [ gedankenstuecke] [ ParahSailin__] [ Thorbinator] 
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06:16 -!- Channel ##hplusroadmap created Thu Feb 25 23:40:30 2010
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06:55 < phryk> sylph_mako: you mean not actually projected into the physical world but some kind of AR layer?
06:56 < sylph_mako> phryk, yeah.
06:56 < sylph_mako> It just makes so much more sense.
06:56 < phryk> Yup.
06:56 < phryk> The formulation you just used… It's basically what I want to realize :D
06:56 < sylph_mako> It offends me that the public still havn't caught on that that's how it's going to go. By the time we do get true holograms they'll seem /inconvenient/.
06:57 < Vicarious> hi
06:57 < phryk> I want to code a little service for AR devices that associates images (vector graphics if possible) with gps coordinates (including altitude) and orientation…
06:58 < phryk> So you can go somewhere and the service will tell your device 'Hey over there, there's graphic X so load and display it'
06:58 < phryk> One thing I haven't figured out is how I could make them disappear behind buildings
06:59 < phryk> but that will prolly end up being the AR devices job, else I'd have to have a 3d map of the whole world and shitloads of calculations to do for every query…
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07:00 < phryk> so the client on the ar device will prolly have some device to detect distances and calculate if the coordinate of the graphic is in front or behind the next object
07:00 < sylph_mako> On the other hand, who wouldn't want to be able to see through buildings?
07:01 < kanzure> sounds like a shared image cache
07:01 < phryk> sylph_mako: you could have a noclip mode in your client of course :P
07:02 < phryk> kanzure: cache sounds more volatile, but yes, something like that.
07:02 < phryk> but my vision of it is that you can paint around and for instance mark special spots in your city.
07:03 < phryk> you could have 'protected' tracks that only you and your friends can access for instance to mark good parkour routes.
07:04 < kanzure> A. K. Barbey et al., An integrative architecture for general intelligence and executive function revealed by lesion mapping, Brain: A Journal of Neurology, 2012
07:04 < kanzure> http://dx.doi.org/10.1093/brain/aws021
07:04 < kanzure> http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/content/early/2012/03/05/brain.aws021
07:05 < kanzure> "Impaired performance on these measures was associated with damage to a distributed network of left lateralized brain areas, including regions of frontal and parietal cortex and white matter association tracts, which bind these areas into a coordinated system."
07:05 < kanzure> "supporting their reliance upon a shared fronto-parietal network for the integration and control of cognitive representations"
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07:06 < phryk> this is actually a further development of an earlier idea i had about geolocated content.
07:07 < kanzure> why would i want my content inaccessible to me from other geolocations
07:08 < phryk> Not like that. More like a pointer to some content.
07:08 < phryk> The content would be accessible from everywhere. But you could place a pointer to a specific content of interest at a coordinate.
07:09 < phryk> For instance you stand in front of a special building and in front of it is a pointer to the corresponding wikipedia article.
07:09 < phryk> Or you're in front of a restaurant and you get a link to their menu and current specials
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07:11 < kanzure> restaurant menus are never that high tech
07:11 < kanzure> the only way to penetrate restaurants is through their point of sales system, sadly
07:12 < kanzure> notice how yelp doesn't even have menus
07:12 < phryk> kanzure: well not necessarily restaurants, but local pizza and other delivery services use services like pizza.de so they could just post a link to that ;)
07:13 < kanzure> post a link to yelp? why
07:13 < phryk> not yelp, to stuff like pizza.de
07:13 < phryk> and pizza.de has the menus, since you can order from there ;)
07:14 < kanzure> so, generally any programmer who has ever thought about AR has had your idea
07:15 < kanzure> in addition to this, any programmer who has seen any AR demonstration video, has had your idea
07:15 < kanzure> so how can you prepare for the influx of 10,000 programmers doing this exact project?
07:15 < kanzure> openstreetmap prepared for this sorta
07:15 < phryk> mhh
07:15 < phryk> true. but i don't really care if it get's used much, it's nice playing around.
07:16 < phryk> maybe i'll be motivated enough to invest a lot of time so that my implementation will be the 'best' one.
07:18 < kanzure> well. there are already a few implementations out there.
07:18 < kanzure> i was playing around with some.
07:18 < phryk> can you point me to them?
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07:18 < kanzure> https://github.com/haseman/Android-AR-Kit
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07:19 < kanzure> http://github.com/zac/iphonearkit
07:19 < kanzure> http://www.meetup.com/augmentedreality/
07:19 < kanzure> i don't know. that stuff.
07:19 < kanzure> http://arq.freebaseapps.com/
07:19 < kanzure> http://www.androidkit.com/developing-augmented-reality-applications-for-android
07:19 < phryk> that seems more like clients. I want to provide the service for those.
07:20 < kanzure> just look at them
07:20 < phryk> arquery seems more like what I want
07:20 < kanzure> it wont hurt you
07:20 < phryk> of course not, it's nice looking at different approaches to a topic :)
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07:36 < delinquentme> ok serious question
07:37 < delinquentme> anyone know how to stop google from putting up pics that a person has sent you
07:37 < delinquentme> basically im reading emails and getting dirty pics when I shouldnt be seeing them
07:42 < kanzure> in gmail? there's a setting to not display images from emails
07:43 < delinquentme> i mean in the side bar
07:43 < delinquentme> theres a fucking slide show in the side bar under the persons "google circles"
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07:48 < kanzure> "As an aside, this is one of IBM's secret tricks - hardware accelerated money datatype. No other major vendor has this."
07:48 < kanzure> http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/data/library/techarticle/dm-0801chainani/
07:48 < kanzure> wut
07:49 < delinquentme> so signing out of google circles works for the time being =/
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07:53 < delinquentme> kanzure, sooo
07:54 < delinquentme> i was thinking
07:54 < delinquentme> the academic journals stuff would totally be something that google ventures could get behind
07:56 < kanzure> ?
07:57 < F71> I wonder if diginet knows the golden orb weaving spider is like, ubiquitous in this area.
07:57 < F71> They used to scare the crap out of me with their bright colors and communal webs
08:00 < F71> Before the days of ubiquitous cameras I found a web with a finch caught in it. The big supporting silk was really strong.
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08:11 < kanzure> ParahSailin__: hi
08:11 < ParahSailin__> hey
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08:15 < Steel2> kanzure
08:15 < kanzure> what
08:16 < Steel2> I have a friend who's a (non bio-) chemist and is a little curious about what research in that field is specifically relevant to h+ stuff
08:16 < Steel2> they were looking at maybe doing polymers, but can you think of anything in specific?
08:16 < kanzure> organic or inorganic guy
08:17 < Steel2> junior year, starting to look at grad schools
08:17 < Steel2> so either/or
08:17 < Steel2> more interest in inorganic
08:17 < kanzure> organic chemistry: anything related to dna
08:17 < kanzure> inorganic: anything related to diamondoid synthesis http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/nanotech/
08:17 < kanzure> just make sure he's not scared away by the "NANO NANO!!!" stuff
08:18 < Steel2> ...she >_>
08:18 < kanzure> there's actually some good science going on there..
08:18 < Steel2> it's my ex
08:18 < Steel2> also, isn't that more matsci than chem?
08:18 < kanzure> wait. diamonds are organic
08:18 < kanzure> nope, nvm
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08:19 < Steel2> diamonds aren't organic
08:19 < Steel2> they're carbon based but don't meet any of the other requirements
08:20 < kanzure> huh? fertilizers are inorganic?
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08:21 < kanzure> well i guess so
08:22 < kanzure> so yeah, those are the two areas that come to mind.
08:22 < kanzure> drazak: maybe you have better suggestions
08:22 < delinquentme> kanzure, you're a linear string pot
08:23 < delinquentme> Steel2, recruit em!
08:23 < kanzure> i'm really just a bot http://heybryan.org/mac.html
08:25 < Steel2> delinquentme: Working on it
08:25 < Steel2> oh shit
08:25 < Steel2> I recognize a name in this irc channel
08:25 < Steel2> I think
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08:35 < phryk> kanzure: heh, and did you meet him?^^
08:35 < kanzure> mac? yeah he's at nearly any conference i go to
08:36 < phryk> Aah, okay :)
08:36 < phryk> But you've never been to any of the CCC events in germany, have you?
08:37 < kanzure> nope
08:37 < joshcryer> how do we know mac isn't a bot too
08:37 < phryk> kanzure: any particular reason for it?
08:37 < kanzure> the twist is that everyone but me is a bot
08:38 < kanzure> phryk: for not going to CCC? nope. i just haven't done it yet.
08:38 < phryk> kanzure: If you do so, tell me :P
08:38 < kanzure> in general i have stopped going to conferences where i am not speaking. but CCC, defcon, hope, might be interesting exceptions
08:38 < Steel2> kanzure: I'm at the same school as azonenberg, just released.
08:38 < phryk> Seeing that you at least in some way associate with nick farr, you'd have a pretty easy way of getting there too, i think.
08:39 < Steel2> And we have a number of intersecting friends
08:39 < Steel2> released = realized
08:39 < kanzure> Steel2: you should totally go be drinking buddies
08:39 < Steel2> talk about microstereolithography while drinking microbrews
08:39 < Steel2> :V
08:39 < kanzure> phryk: yeah, i know nick a little
08:39 < phryk> kanzure: I think he organizes a group-trip every year.
08:41 < gedankenstuecke> phryk: are you going to ccc's sigint next month?
08:41 < phryk> gedankenstuecke: i don't know, but hi there.
08:41 < phryk> gedankenstuecke: what'll it cost / where is it?
08:41 < phryk> the flyer is somewhere at home, only used for handling weed ^^;
08:42 < gedankenstuecke> phryk: it's in cologne, dunno about the costs, but ticket sale will start today at 2200 UTC+2
08:42 < phryk> gedankenstuecke: this month i couldn't pay for the ticket…
08:42 < phryk> my last money went into the ticket for the mayday…
08:42 < gedankenstuecke> ic
08:42 < phryk> I might get it organized though…
08:43 < gedankenstuecke> my guess is that they will have tickets left (at least this is how it was in 2010 iirc)
08:43 < phryk> cologne wouldn't be too far, either and I suspect that some other guys of the zone are going, too.
08:44 < phryk> I think I could sleep at a friends place, too.
08:45 < gedankenstuecke> uh, your at the warpzone right?
08:45 < phryk> yes, i believe we have met one or two times.
08:45 < gedankenstuecke> haha, i'm to bad with nicknames but somehow your's felt familiar :D
08:46 < phryk> You're 'Bastian Greshake', right?
08:46 < gedankenstuecke> yup
08:46 < phryk> I don't know when you've been here the last time, but I'm colloqually know as 'the guy with the magnet' :P
08:47 < gedankenstuecke> it's been a while since i moved to frankfurt for my master studies, but i think plaetzchen told me about "the guy with the magnet" a couple of times. and i'm still lacking mine, as finding a date with the piercer was harder than expected
08:47 < phryk> But you have a date for it now?
08:48 < phryk> I don't know about frankfurt, but there are piercers in mannheim, berlin and cologne doing it.
08:48 < gedankenstuecke> nope, as i'm currently in tübingen for a job at the max planck institute there, but i'll get a date as soon as i'm back
08:49 < gedankenstuecke> i already visited the guy in mannheim to get it implanted, but the american seller of his magnets had some shipping problems, so he hadn't have a single magnet left at the time i arrived :D
08:49 < phryk> Ah sucks. You're talking about Marucs, right?
08:49 < phryk> He seemed very able, even though I got mine done by Haworth.
08:49 < gedankenstuecke> yeah :)
08:50 < phryk> If they take pictures of it, let them give you them on the spot though.
08:50 < phryk> Haworth told them not to give me my pictures -_-
08:50 < gedankenstuecke> why's that?
08:51 < phryk> No clue, I guess because of the anaesthetics…
08:51 < gedankenstuecke> mh k
08:51 < phryk> Also you might want to get in contact with rin, she'll like to get a few more experience reports :)
08:52 < gedankenstuecke> i already follow her on twitter :)
08:52 < phryk> Good ^_^
08:52 < Steel2> rin who?
08:54 < phryk> rinpaku
08:54 < phryk> on the twitters
08:54 < phryk> I'll be on my way to the warpzone now ;)
08:54 < kanzure> gedankenstuecke: which max planck institute are you working at?
08:54 < gedankenstuecke> phryk: hf and greetings to the other guys :)
08:55 < phryk> Will relay. ttyl
08:55 < gedankenstuecke> kanzure: i'm in this group right now: http://webdav.tuebingen.mpg.de/u/karsten/group/index.html?page=news
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08:58 < kanzure> hrm.. alright "Graph-based Functional Classification of Proteins using Kernel Methods"
08:58 < delinquentme> http://evolutionarypsychiatry.blogspot.com/2011/02/lithium-and-longevity.html
08:58 < kanzure> "Representative Subgraph Sampling using Monte Carlo Markov Chain Methods"
08:58 < delinquentme> anti-aging nootropic?
08:58 < kanzure> gedankenstuecke: i spent a bunch of time in a graph theory lab, heh..
08:59 < kanzure> ooh ooh "ShapePheno: Unsupervised extraction of shape phenotypes from biological image collections"
08:59 < gedankenstuecke> kanzure: i have no clue about graph theory, kernel methods etc. i'm just here to program a web-application :P
09:00 < kanzure> gedankenstuecke: meh. just use networkx and you have 80% of the knowledge you need.
09:00 < delinquentme> gedankenstuecke, howdeh.
09:00 < kanzure> gedankenstuecke: what's the web app you're building?
09:01 < gedankenstuecke> kanzure: basically an upgrade on what we've done with opensnp
09:01 < kanzure> snpedia?
09:01 < gedankenstuecke> enabling scientists to upload their genotype/phenotype-data no matter what species and enable gwas-computation in the cloud using the algorithms which have been developed here
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09:02 < kanzure> crossbow?
09:02 < gedankenstuecke> i think their algorithms are unpublished and i haven't seen them so far tbh
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09:12 < delinquentme> OMG
09:12 < delinquentme> someone BRING ME CAKE.
09:12 < delinquentme> kanzure, whos the intern today?
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09:26 < Urchin> do any of you confuse irc commands and unix commands
09:26 < Urchin> ?
09:27 < delinquentme> Urchin, nah sorry
09:27 < delinquentme> I confuse tacos and taquitos often though
09:35 < delinquentme> kanzure, I dont need to scrape elsevier do I
09:35 < delinquentme> nm ill get their indexes bc I think we're working w slightly diff stuff
09:36 < kanzure> well at least their site has bibtex export of an issue's citations/index, so take advantage of that
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10:14 < kanzure> delinquentme: don't forget about http://diyhpl.us/cgit/pyscholar/tree/zotero-import
10:16 < delinquentme> those are publishers right?
10:18 < kanzure> these are zotero plugins for scraping pages and turning metadata into bibtex. also for grabbing pdfs from the pages.
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10:43 < kanzure> hello malaimo
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10:45 < F71> here
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11:15 < audy> http://i.imgur.com/0eQcO.png
11:15 < audy> source: groupon for kidz advert
11:16 < audy> e-m@le the footless transhumanist
11:20 < F71> what the
11:27 < nmz787> fenn kanzure: ping
11:27 < kanzure> nmz787: pong
11:27 < nmz787> how fast do we need to cut again?
11:27 < kanzure> fenn is probably away until friday night
11:27 < nmz787> ahh
11:27 < nmz787> ok
11:27 < kanzure> nmz787: i'd like to keep it under 30 minutes per chip :P
11:27 < kanzure> 10-12 minutes would be pretty great
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11:30 < delinquentme> kanzure, http://www.elsevier.com/wps/product/cws_home/717248
11:30 < delinquentme> where bibtex
11:31 < nmz787> kanzure: so i calculate 1,000,000 drops, * 1.25 for overhead * 25 to get 31,250,000 microns, or 31,250 mm
11:31 < nmz787> kanzure: so 2000 mm/min is 15 mins
11:33 < nmz787> kanzure: 20:53 <@fenn> at 20kHz, maximum speed would be 3969 microns/s @ 16 microstep
11:33 < nmz787> which is 238.14mm/min
11:34 < nmz787> kanzure: thats 131 minutes
11:36 < nmz787> kanzure: that's with linuxcnc though
11:38 < kanzure> delinquentme: access that through sciencedirect and use the "export citation" tool like in the phantomjs javascript i showed you
11:38 < kanzure> nmz787: yeah, that does sound sorta slow
11:39 < kanzure> how much space is that for a million drops?
11:39 < kanzure> also the time it takes to pump out a million drops is probably astronomical?
11:40 < nmz787> depends on pump speed i guess
11:40 < nmz787> :/
11:40 < nmz787> parallelize?
11:40 < kanzure> we should really do the math on the pressure requirements
11:43 < F71> What about digital light solutions?
11:43 < F71> I think that's common in microfluidics. It's certainly highly paralell
11:43 < kanzure> F71: then you have to wait for it to polymerize
11:43 < F71> depends on the polymerization speed
11:44 < F71> also, it's probably easier to make bricks of clever routing, as opposed to stacking layers with vias
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11:45 < kanzure> F71: i bet we can get per chip fabrication time down to 10-20 minutes per chip with a laser
11:45 < kanzure> with polymerization i'm not really sure this would work
11:47 < kanzure> "The dominant rate limiting step is curing, and high temperature cures used to speed the curing process have adverse effects on the shape of the parts produced"
11:47 < kanzure> "This thesis examines the PDMS cure process and presents a methodology to intelligently design faster cure processes without compromising the quality of parts produced. The first part of this thesis applies statistical mechanics to relate the time evolution of cure with the modulus of elasticity."
11:47 < kanzure> http://dspace.mit.edu/handle/1721.1/61615
11:50 < kanzure> "Room temperatures very accurately replicated the dimensions of the master tooling, but required that PDMS sit undisturbed for two days while it solidified [19]."
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11:53 < kanzure> "The recommended cure time for Dow Corning Sylgard 184 is 2 hours at 65C. Increasing the process temperature increases the cure rate, so this time can be reduced to 1 hr at 75C or 30min at 85C. Similarly, decreasing the process temperature to room temperature increases the cure time to two days."
11:54 < nmz787> yeah its easier to have pre cured PDMS blanks
11:54 < nmz787> simon replied to me
11:54 < kanzure> i didn't get the email
11:54 < nmz787> forming a response onw
11:54 < nmz787> now
11:55 < nmz787> i noticed
11:55 < kanzure> nmz787: precured pdms? i thought you cure it with the pattern projected over it
11:56 < kanzure> oh you probably mean "it's easier to not do masked curing"
11:59 < kanzure> i wonder if running the laser cutter with an fpga would be a better idea or not
11:59 < kanzure> oh right. impossibly proprietary fpga tools.
12:01 < nmz787> no propeller would be fine
12:01 < nmz787> fenn didn't like the idea of writing an XYZ interpreter
12:02 < nmz787> doesn't seem like a terrible idea to me
12:02 < nmz787> i dont know about g-code, but it seems like XYZ positions for each step in a file on an 8gb SD card would be enough to do anything
12:03 < nmz787> XYZ, laser on/off
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12:14 < kanzure> nmz787: i don't think it should be an sdcard
12:14 < kanzure> take a look at some gcode from the web.. see what sorta things it should handle
12:18 < delinquentme> http://www.elsevier.com/wps/find/bibliographicdatabasedescription.cws_home/422597/description#description
12:21 < delinquentme> when companies have internal structure exposed to the internet
12:21 < delinquentme> you can begin to get an idea of how ill structure their schema is
12:22 < delinquentme> I really want to tweet this at one of the elsevier accounts
12:22 < delinquentme> :D
12:23 < kanzure> don't..
12:23 < kanzure> jesus man. don't do it.
12:24 < kanzure> nmz787: thx for writing out that email
12:28 < delinquentme> lol
12:29 < delinquentme> but its so true
12:30 < delinquentme> kanzure, is there any way to get traffic analytics for a website that I dont own?
12:30 < delinquentme> like would I be able to tell when peak hours are for a website which I dont run?
12:34 < kanzure> no. alexa is a scam.
12:35 < delinquentme> haha realluuuuu
12:36 < delinquentme> also http://pastie.org/3770073
12:36 < delinquentme> can I run a grep replace on that ^^
12:36 < kanzure> grep replace on what?
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12:38 < kanzure> do you mean .gsub or sed?
12:41 < delinquentme> ermm yeah
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12:42 < delinquentme> oh wait its grep and awk that people use right?
12:42 < kanzure> curl http://pastie.org/pastes/3770073/download | sed -i 's/puts/print'
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12:52 < delinquentme> kanzure, whut is dis black majik
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13:05 < F71> My interpreter borked. What is that?
13:05 < kanzure> ruby
13:05 < kanzure> delinquentme: bash
13:05 < F71> I know that
13:06 < kanzure> F71: related to http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/irc/ezproxy.py
13:09 < diginet> you know what drives me nuts? GMO fearmongers.  Granted there are a few legitimate concerns, like unforseen consequences for the environment. However, most people I hear complaning about them think we're all going to be poisoned by them or something idiotic like that.
13:09 < delinquentme> diginet,  me too!
13:11 < Steel_> diginet, did you see Amanda Stoel's post on facebook?
13:11 < diginet> no, I didn't? Who's that?
13:11 < Steel_> one of the sing network people
13:11 < Steel_> she's posted some un-backed up gmo stuff in the past, which I hit with actual articles and she took down
13:11 < diginet> hahaha
13:11 < Steel_> like anyone who says shit about monsanto and bees
13:11 < Steel_> ....
13:12 < Steel_> monsanto doesn't even produce the type of insecticide that has been linked with CCD
13:12 < Steel_> that's all Bayer's stuff
13:12 < diginet> Like I said, there is some genuine cause to be concerned, with things like non-seed-bearing plants cross-polinating, but that is NOT what people these tools are usually whining about
13:13 < Steel_> and honestly, even that's not a huge worry
13:13 < Steel_> terminator genes breed themselves out of existence
13:13 < kanzure> diginet: you should eat some GMO food on DNA day this year
13:13 < Steel_> not to mention monsanto I believe pulled them from shelves (I don't know for sure) due to backlash
13:13 < kanzure> diginet: https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!topic/diybio/FdpzU6-T6KE
13:15 < diginet> here's the thing: transgenic pesticides, or DDT? Yeah, I'll take the former
13:15 < Steel_> Also, I'm trying to make a connection with Alex Knapp, Forbes' head tech writer, who is about to start writing on the singularity
13:15 < diginet> Honestly, do anti-GMO people WANT thousands of people to starve? Because that's what would happen if they were banned
13:15 < Steel_> he said he might take my advice and point out in one of his articles the difference between singularity and transhumanism
13:16 < Steel_> he's the one who wrote the article pointing out kurzweil's inaccuracies
13:16 < diginet> oh good
13:17 < diginet> then I like him :)
13:17 < diginet> kurzweil is an arrogant douche, but that's just me
13:17 < kanzure> no that's everyone's opinion of ray
13:17 < kanzure> that's the general consensus, i mean.
13:17 < kanzure> i don't know why you think otherwise?
13:17 < diginet> I see
13:17 < diginet> well there seems to be a lot of people who take him seriously
13:17 < kanzure> who?
13:18 < Steel_> people who aren't already in the culture, or who are lured by scientism instead of science
13:18 < nmz787> I would love to find some more on this kind of stuff:
13:18 < nmz787> http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/1104/1104.3113v1.pdf
13:18 < nmz787> http://www.homeopathy.org/files/LucMontaigner2009.pdf
13:18 < delinquentme> nmz787, what about it
13:19 < delinquentme> what makes it desireable? bc isnt that a google search away?
13:19 < kanzure> nmz787: "muck lower frequencies" ?
13:19 < nmz787> if thats true, it'd be cool to set up some bacterial oscillators between culture flasks
13:19 < nmz787> delinquentme: its hard to find anything about bacteria and radio waves
13:19 < diginet> are we taking homeopathy seriously here? tell me no
13:19 < F71> Oh, diginet
13:19 < diginet> F71: hmm?
13:20 < nmz787> diginet: it was published in Interdiscip Sci Comput Life Sci
13:20 < delinquentme> nmz787,  "bacteria" AND "radio"
13:20 < delinquentme> ?
13:20 < F71> You know Golden Orb Weaving Spiders are indigenous to our area, right?
13:20 < nmz787> delinquentme: yes, i know how to search google
13:20 < F71> Like, I used to run into their communal webs when I was little and scare the crap out of myself
13:20 < diginet> F71: yes, but I decided to go with L. hesperus (black widow) because the genes are already sequenced
13:20 < delinquentme> ...
13:21 < F71> How does black widow silk compare to GOWS?
13:21 < diginet> nmz787, doesn't really matter who publishes it, anyone who actually thinks that water has "memory" is a crank
13:21 < diginet> about the same
13:21 < diginet> it might be slightly stronger
13:21 < kanzure> diginet: there doesn't seem to be anything about memory-water in that arxiv paper
13:22 < kanzure> dunno what you're talking about
13:22 < F71> how conductive is it?
13:22 < diginet> probably not very much, why? I've heard of people implanting gold in silk to make it conductive
13:23 < nmz787> diginet: its specifically talking about DNA in the water
13:23 < diginet> just to be clear, you guys ARE saying homeopathy plasubily exists, and isn't just naturopathy woo, or placebo?
13:23 < diginet> *plausibly
13:23 < nmz787> diginet: nothing of the sort, I'm interested in the claim that plasmids can resonate EM radiation
13:24 < F71> no, thermally conductive
13:24 < F71> GOW spider dragline silk is more conductive than copper
13:24 < diginet> oh oh, actually I don't know. That's a very good question
13:24 < F71> thermally, I mean
13:24 < diginet> Where do you find that data?
13:24 < diginet> *did
13:24 < F71> I'll grab some papers
13:24 < diginet> thanks
13:25 < diginet> nmz787, oh good! hahah
13:25 < diginet> sorry for the misunderstanding
13:25 < diginet> I was worried there for a moment
13:25 < nmz787> :D nononono
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13:26 < F71> http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/adma.201104668/full
13:27 < F71> need the paper still, ffff
13:27 < F71> but it gets 20% more conductive when stretched to 20%
13:27 < F71> it scales conductivity very linearly
13:27 < F71> one could use it to make adjustible thermal conductivity
13:28 < nmz787> F71: so what about modifying spiders, i.e. just removing their legs surgically/genomically
13:28 < F71> and fabric made from it would conduct heat better than copper
13:28 < F71> that'd be a good idea
13:28 < diginet> F71: I'm in a bit of a quandry as to how I'm going to actually make the protein.  I figured that even with optimistic yields, it would take on the order of 20k batchs in a 55-gallon drum to make one pound of silk
13:28 < kanzure> nmz787: that sounds harder than protein purification ;)
13:28 < Moksparagus> nmz787: why not grow the silk glands ex-vitro/
13:28 < F71> yeah, it's the glands I'm wondering about
13:28 < diginet> Moksparagus, I have a feeling that's a lot harder than it sounds
13:29 < nmz787> Moksparagus: that sounds alright if you can get glands to grow on their own easily from the egg
13:29 < F71> I havent seen any papers on taking the raw monomers and 'spinning' them
13:29 < nmz787> F71: so you don't know if you can produce in liquid or not?
13:29 < diginet> and actualyl in vitro means outside of the organism, so ex vitro means the opposite of what you think
13:29 < diginet> F71, really? I have
13:29 < nmz787> in vitro means in glass
13:29 < Moksparagus> really?
13:29 < diginet> I have about five or so
13:29  * Moksparagus just makes up words without understanding them.
13:29 < F71> cool, I'd like to see those
13:30 < diginet> nmz787, oh right, of course, as in vitreous
13:30 < diginet> hold on
13:30 < diginet> I'll look for them in a minute
13:30 < diginet> but anyhow, the best option I could think of was plants'
13:31 < diginet> by inserting the gene into chloroplasts, you can reliably yield at least 10% total protein content
13:31 < F71> just gluing a spiders in arrays, ass-up, and letting a machine slowly draw thread sounds elegant
13:31 < kanzure> delinquentme: curl http://pastie.org/pastes/3770073/download | sed -i 's/puts/print'
13:31 < Steel_> wait, so who's genetically modifying spiders here? O_o
13:31 < diginet> F71: feeding them?
13:31 < kanzure> Steel_: the twist is that we're all spiders
13:31 < kanzure> Steel_: diginet is our resident spiderman
13:31 < F71> crickets
13:31 < delinquentme> kanzure, theres just lots going on here
13:31 < diginet> I would feel really guilty about doing that though :(
13:31 < delinquentme> but anyways
13:31 < F71> they're crickets
13:31 < kanzure> delinquentme: yeah, but i think people can help possibly better than i can :)
13:31 < diginet> F71, sure but how would they wrap the crickets up
13:32 < diginet> no, the spiders
13:32 < kanzure> bash piping is pretty simple
13:32 < delinquentme> 's/puts/print'    puts needs to be a big ass long strinf
13:32 < F71> they get a free lunch
13:32 < delinquentme> string** or that curl input
13:32 < F71> It's not much different than a dairy cow
13:32 < kanzure> delinquentme: like what
13:32 < F71> except less neurons
13:32 < diginet> I hate milk though, bleh
13:32 < delinquentme> like the contents of that pastie
13:32 < diginet> hah
13:32 < nmz787> seems like you could knock out some neurons too
13:32 < kanzure> delinquentme: you want to replace the entire contents?
13:32 < diginet> but where do I get the spiders from?
13:33 < nmz787> if all you want them for is their sex organs, silk organs, and digestive system (mouth to anus)
13:33 < delinquentme> I need to replace that big ass string with another big ass string
13:33 < Moksparagus> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1409362/pdf/immunology00401-0045.pdf
13:33 < F71> there's a lot of parks in the area, and it's almost summer
13:33 < Moksparagus> in vitro salivary glands
13:33 < F71> try not to walk into a communal web
13:33 < delinquentme> i want to search for http://pastie.org/3770073 and replace it with an almost as large string
13:33 < delinquentme> i mean search for the contents of that pastie
13:34 < kanzure> whaat i don't understand
13:34 < Moksparagus> n/m, not what I was thinking
13:34 < kanzure> do you have this verify_data in places?
13:34 < kanzure> and you want to replace the code?
13:34 < Moksparagus> they just cultured cells and analyzed the medium afterwards
13:34 < F71> I've got some gloveboxes if they freak you out
13:34 < kanzure> delinquentme: a few options.. first.. just delete all the others, and import a single file
13:34 < kanzure> delinquentme: or redefine the function in ruby
13:34 < kanzure> so that you don't have to rewrite the other ones. i don't understand why you have more than 1 copy of that function?
13:34 < diginet> well I was thinking of trying to implant the gene into the duckweed, they double their mass every 24hrs, and have up to 45% protein by dry weight
13:35 < delinquentme> kanzure, ok how about i just search for that string and delete it
13:35 < F71> crap that's awesome
13:35 < delinquentme> that should be easier
13:35 < diginet> indeed
13:35 < diginet> I believe their plastome has been sequenced as well
13:35 < kanzure> delinquentme: like this? sed -i 's/verify_data/old_verify_data/g' *.rb
13:35 < diginet> they also grow on water, so they're hella easy to grow hydroponically
13:36 < F71> suddenly, buffalo bayou is covered in indestructible duckweed
13:36 < delinquentme> kanzure, sure where verify_data = that entire ~30 lines of code
13:36 < Steel_> diginet, which gene is this?
13:36 < diginet> MaSpI and MaSpII Major Ampullate Spidroins 1 and 2
13:37 < diginet> the nice part is that the spidroins are stable up to like 200 F, so you can just heat a stew of the particalized leaves to near boiling and denature most of the other protein
13:37 < Steel_> hmmm
13:37 < Steel_> but it wouldn't be in strand form no?
13:37 < diginet> no, you need to make a spinneret for that
13:37 < diginet> (which is a different struggle altogether)
13:38 < kanzure> delinquentme: possibly this.... sed -i 's/^  def verify_data\(.*\)^  end//p' my_file.rb
13:38 < Steel_> is there a benefit to having the spidroins not in strand form?
13:38 < diginet> that's how they come naturally
13:38 < diginet> their secreted by the gland into a dope and spun out by the spider
13:38 < diginet> *they'[re
13:38 < F71> put all your spider science papers and artificial spinneret stuff somewhere
13:38 < kanzure> delinquentme: you should probably not use -i for now, without -i sed will show you what the modifications will look like (without editing the file)
13:38 < diginet> okaym that'll take awhile
13:38 < F71> or on a flash drive or soemthing, this project is badass
13:39 < Steel_> right, diginet, but I mean is there a manufacturing use for them in that form
13:39 < diginet> F71, thanks :)
13:39 < kanzure> diginet: yeah if you put your files on dropbox i'll upload to the http paper server
13:39 < diginet> okay, got it
13:39 < delinquentme> check
13:39 < diginet> Steel_ sure, you can make them into films or anything you want
13:39 < Steel_> hmm
13:39 < diginet> I need to read up on transgenic plants
13:40 < delinquentme> kanzure, what do the carats do?
13:40 < delinquentme> ^
13:40 < diginet> all I know right now is that putting the genes into the chloroplasts gives like 100-fold better yields
13:41 < diginet> however, most of the research is on doing so in the tobacco plant
13:41 < F71> yeah but can you express these specific genes in a chloroplast?
13:41 < F71> Like I doubt it's a one-step
13:41 < F71> Is it even a single protein?
13:41 < diginet> there's not too much PTM
13:41 < diginet> there's two proteins
13:41 < F71> or does it agglomerate later?
13:41 < F71> okay
13:41 < diginet> yeah
13:42 < F71> Do you have a paper on how it's made?
13:42 < diginet> it turns into a fiber when the pH is lowered, and it is exposed to shearing
13:42 < diginet> i.e. squeezing it/extruding it causes it to self assemble
13:42 < diginet> it's actually rather easy to make
13:42 < F71> Like, there might me some utilities that a chloroplast doesn't have
13:42 < diginet> the hard part is extracting the protein
13:42 < kanzure> delinquentme: in regular expressions, ^ just means "match beginning of line" and $ means "match end of line
13:42 < kanzure> "
13:43 < diginet> no, the chloroplast doesn't make the protein, it works just like nuclear expression, the ribosomes assemble the peptide chain
13:43 < F71> also, chloroplasts don't have a golgi apparatus
13:43 < diginet> it's just like a plasmid
13:43 < F71> oh I see
13:43 < diginet> F71, no the gene goes to the same ribosomes that nuclear genes do
13:43 < F71> I was like WTF, I didn't know chloroplasts had good expression systems, haha
13:43 < diginet> hahaha yeah
13:44 < diginet> it's rather than there are tons of them in every plant cell, and the plant seems to naturally favour genes in the chloroplast, so you get lots of expression
13:44 < diginet> another nice thing is that the gene is confined to the plant, it cant spread via pollen
13:44 < diginet> (so this would be great for GMOs)
13:48 < diginet> okay, let's do the math here, approx. 2500 silk cocoons equals one pound of silk.  One coccoon yields almost a kilometer of silk.  so, 2500 kilometers.  What we need to know is how many meters, say, a mg of silk would yield
13:49 < diginet> oh, another note: I might've said this before, but I have name for the spider silk fiber: serylar how does that sound?
13:49 < kanzure> find the molecular weight of the protein
13:49 < kanzure> and the length
13:49 < diginet> 300 kDa
13:49 < diginet> no idea on length though
13:49 < kanzure> ok. how many angstroms or nm.
13:49 < F71> take the cross section of the silk and you can figure volumetrically
13:49 < kanzure> the size should be on ncbi somewhere
13:49 < diginet> okay, I'll look
13:49 < F71> also, another reason to grab local spiders
13:50 < F71> chemistry and othersuch experiments
13:50 < diginet> indeed
13:50 < F71> My best scale is a milligram, and I'm too tied up to build a microgram
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13:50 < diginet> there is, supposedly, one company already commercializing duckweed for the production of protein pharmaceuticals
13:51 < F71> interesting
13:52 < diginet> meaning it is at least possible
13:52 < diginet> I haven't been able to get any data on how much protein tobacco contains by dry weight, as that is apparently the easiest to modify
13:54 < diginet> oh good, there's some articles in the literature on transformation of duckweed
14:01 < delinquentme> diginet, you're coming up with ways to use modified tobacco so that you're both combining the social good of dis-incentivising tobacco growers to adict people but still giving them a reasonable way out by providing some use for their crop?
14:01 < delinquentme> bc that would b e a goo idea
14:02 < kanzure> no he just wants spider silk
14:02 < F71> he'll take credit for that though
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14:05 < diginet> well heh, there's a lot in the literature on that very subject
14:05 < delinquentme> f me in the a
14:05 < delinquentme> there is seriously no tool for multi-line search and replace
14:06 < diginet> one paper argues that by 2030, Tobacco could be more important as a means of producing pharmaceuticals than smoking tobacco
14:06 < diginet> the question of how to transform the duckweed chloroplasts does remain, however
14:09 < kanzure> delinquentme: i just showed you how to do it
14:09 < kanzure> regular expressions are 100% compatible with multi-line search and replace
14:09 < delinquentme> diginet, id hope so
14:10 < diginet> delinquentme, yeah me too
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14:25 < delinquentme> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/features/9193015/Healthy-competition-in-the-NHS-is-a-sick-joke.html
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14:25 < delinquentme> too many ideas damn
14:25 < delinquentme> also richard branson has awesome genes
14:27 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Quit: pulseaudio is crap.]
14:27 < kanzure> it's true, pulseaudio ain't fun
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14:43 < delinquentme> kanzure, you didnt happen to notice if there is a way to get rendered XML for the elsevier RSS feeeeeeds
14:43 < delinquentme> did u?
14:43 < delinquentme> NM!
14:43 < delinquentme> GOT IT
14:44 < kanzure> rss is xml..
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14:58 < delinquentme> kanzure, did you hit any max # of request / second on elsevier?
14:58 < delinquentme> i was thinking about threading it .. but the safe thing to do is let it be slow
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14:59 < nmz787> http://arxiv.org/abs/1204.1719
14:59 < kanzure> yes they throttle
14:59 < delinquentme> do you know what the max is?
15:01 < kanzure> no
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15:10 < diginet> ugh, elsevier
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15:44 < kanzure> delinquentme: ok we're moving to github
15:45 < delinquentme> too close for guns?
15:46 < kanzure> what
15:46 < kanzure> someone is setting up the private repo for us
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15:47 < delinquentme> cool
15:47 < delinquentme> but um
15:47 < delinquentme> ones ruby
15:47 < delinquentme> ones python
15:47 < kanzure> not a problem
15:47 < kanzure> it'll work
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15:55 < hmatlock> jrayhawk: the server is slow?..
15:55 < hmatlock> impossible to do anything on it
15:56 < hmatlock> might be my system, but i'm not going to close everything to find out right now
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16:02 < kanzure> hmatlock: seems fine?
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16:06 < hmatlock> i'll take your word, it's odd that everything else seems to be working fine here
16:06 < kanzure> what? http://ipython.org/ipython-doc/stable/parallel/parallel_multiengine.html
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16:13 < jrayhawk> not seeing any obvious problems
16:14 < jrayhawk> load average: 0.25, 0.91, 1.63 huh, never seen it that high before
16:14 < jrayhawk> feel free to text me if it misbehaves again; i would like to catch it in action
16:15 < ybit> it was yakuake
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16:17 < jrayhawk> oh, right, you don't actually have my number. +1 503.869.8658
16:17 < ybit> jrayhawk: i'm in 150 irc channels.. would that contribute much to that load average?
16:17 < ybit> 160+ something
16:18 < jrayhawk> Maaaaybe if you're logging and aggressively syncing the logs.
16:20 < kanzure> yeah i might be doing that too
16:20 < kanzure> :)
16:21 < kanzure> delinquentme: commit
16:22 < jrayhawk> My quick google searches make no mention of that being an issue, so irssi is probably letting the filesystem/block layers determine transaction grouping.
16:22 < jrayhawk> So yeah, you're probably fine.
16:24 < kanzure> if doc brown was to store a delorean then i think he'd store it in a u-haul storage shed
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16:52 < kanzure> delinquentme: dunno what you're doing
16:52 < kanzure> but if you were grabbing rss
16:52 < kanzure> apparently i did that in 2009 http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/sciencedirect/sciencedirect-rss-urls.txt
16:52 < kanzure> so have fun with that..
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16:53 < delinquentme> the list seems short no?
16:54 < kanzure> *shrug* this is why verification is important
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17:04 < diginet> oh my ****ing god! look at this: http://www.plantadvanced.com/friday.php
17:05 < delinquentme> diginet, those are nice looking plants
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17:05 < delinquentme> diginet, i see a penis
17:05 < diginet> no, read the page
17:06 < delinquentme> so they modify the plant to make
17:06 < delinquentme> syrums?
17:07 < diginet> no, they modify the plant to express proteins, except it is excreted into the sterile pitcher, basically all you have to do to "purify" it is empty the pitcher
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17:11 < delinquentme> well along with ensuring that theres no crazy particulates in the air
17:11 < delinquentme> and I guess they feed the plant simply by feeding other pitchers?
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17:15 < nmz787> kanzure: simon says to try using a blu-ray drive to etch PDMS, but he avoided talking about custom optics
17:17 < kanzure> meh blu-ray diode is fun but let's just use a laser
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17:20 < kanzure> pfft "scienceexchange is the airbnb of science"
17:22 < nmz787> kanzure: he mentioned blu-ray because its got a spot size of less than 1 micron already (405nm laser), and he said it /could/ be better quality spot than $1000s in custom optics (but stayed away from answering my questions about custom stuff, which should amount to about 3 lenses)
17:22 < kanzure> 405nm is the wavelength, not the spot size?
17:22 < nmz787> right
17:23 < kanzure> are you sure the bluray spots ize is <1 micron?
17:23 < nmz787> spot size is around 580nm, according to one paper cited by wikipedia bluray page
17:23 < kanzure> *spot size
17:23 < kanzure> hmm
17:32 < kanzure> win 4
17:32 < kanzure> fdaskfjsakldfa
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17:38 < kanzure> http://syntheticgenomics.com/media/press/020212.html
17:38 < kanzure> idt+sgi partnership
17:38 < kanzure> "Today, IDT synthesizes and ships an average of 36,000 custom oligos per day to more than 86,000 customers worldwide."
17:42 < delinquentme> so whats the subtraction process like kanzure nmz787
17:42 < delinquentme> are you burning plastic off?
17:42 < delinquentme> PDMS *
17:42 < nmz787> kanzure: i think someone in here was saying CO2 laser is cleaner signal anyway
17:42 < nmz787> and i think we can control it with analog
17:43 < nmz787> instead of PWM... which i think will result in smoother cuts
17:43 < nmz787> delinquentme: I imagine about 50 microns of PDMS and 50 microns of acrylic
17:43 < nmz787> the reason so the PDMS is definitely cut through all the way
17:44 < kanzure> it's sometimes melting, burning, or vaporizing
17:44 < delinquentme> nmz787, I dont follow
17:44 < delinquentme> well melting you're going to need to clean it
17:44 < delinquentme> I guess you could put it under some kind of heavy airflow
17:44 < nmz787> like spread peanut butter on a toast
17:44 < nmz787> say you want to remove lines of peanut butter
17:44 < delinquentme> adhoc analogies
17:45 < nmz787> instead of scraping the pb off the toast
17:45 < delinquentme> lol
17:45 < delinquentme> yeahh...
17:45 < nmz787> you take a little toast with you for good measure
17:45 < nmz787> sacrificial toast layer
17:45 < delinquentme> lol
17:45 < nmz787> mmmmmmm
17:45 < delinquentme> but that still doesnt tell me how the PB is coming off
17:45 < nmz787> ahh
17:45 < nmz787> burning
17:45 < delinquentme> so vaporizing it
17:45 < nmz787> prob turning into silanes and CO2 and CO
17:46 < nmz787> hopefully fully vaping
17:46 < delinquentme> heat distortion in the material?
17:46 < kanzure> "In vaporization cutting the focused beam heats the surface of the material to boiling point and generates a keyhole. The keyhole leads to a sudden increase in absorptivity quickly deepening the hole. As the hole deepens and the material boils, vapor generated erodes the molten walls blowing ejecta out and further enlarging the hole."
17:46 < delinquentme> periodic cooling?
17:46 < kanzure> "Non melting material such as wood, carbon and thermoset plastics are usually cut by this method."
17:46 < delinquentme> whelp
17:46 < nmz787> I don't think its vaporizing then, its plain burning
17:46 < delinquentme> this is not wewd
17:46 < nmz787> combusting
17:47 < nmz787> well he makes a good point, phase change is a thing
17:47 < nmz787> i'd say wood burns
17:47 < nmz787> vapor to me means soluble in gas
17:47 < nmz787> i.e. pahse change occurs
17:48 < kanzure> "The energy delivered by the laser changes the surface of the material under the focal point."
17:48 < kanzure> "It may heat up the surface and subsequently vaporize the material, or perhaps the material may fracture (known as "glass" or "glass up") and flake off the surface. This is how material is removed from the surface to create an engraving."
17:48 < nmz787> I dont think PDMS will warp from heat
17:48 < nmz787> its basically glass with some carbon added for stickiness
17:48 < nmz787> hmm
17:49 < delinquentme> nmz787, then what about material running
17:49 < nmz787> running?
17:49 < delinquentme> as it heats is becomes less viscous
17:49 < nmz787> its crosslinked
17:49 < nmz787> no phase changing for it
17:49 < delinquentme> you're telling me that you're hitting it with sufficient energy to vaporize it
17:49 < nmz787> hmm
17:49 < delinquentme> but theres no phase change...
17:49 < delinquentme> channels being cut how far apart?
17:49 < nmz787> well combustion is a phase change, but its also a chemical change
17:50 < nmz787> it doesnt go back to PDMS on cooling
17:50 < delinquentme> true
17:50 < kanzure> delinquentme: channel separation distance is not decided yet. but it can't be too thin otherwise the channels will blow out..
17:50 < delinquentme> yeah thats what I was worried about
17:50 < kanzure> 10-25 microns should be good
17:50 < delinquentme> thats a testing thing
17:50 < nmz787> right
17:51 < nmz787> we'll have a lot of pieces that test simple devices and ideas
17:51 < delinquentme> i was gonna say stick it in a water bath but the water would diffract the beam
17:51 < nmz787> like channel wall variation
17:51 < kanzure> hah a channel wall test chip.. alright
17:51 < delinquentme> what if you cooled the shit out of it?
17:51 < kanzure> nmz787: it's probably a function of the swelling of the channel
17:51 < nmz787> might do something
17:51 < nmz787> i dunno
17:52 < nmz787> i think the microness of the CNC will help a lot
17:52 < delinquentme> you could also just periodically submerge it
17:52 < kanzure> why would we need to submerge it?
17:52 < delinquentme> cooling
17:52 < kanzure> why do we need to cool it
17:52 < delinquentme> you want fast prints no?
17:52 < nmz787> i cut channels before with a desktop laser cutter then viewed them with an interferometer
17:52 < delinquentme> minimize deformation
17:52 < nmz787> and they  looked pretty jagged
17:52 < nmz787> I don't think it will get that hot
17:53 < nmz787> we're ablating a very small amount of material
17:53 < delinquentme> another interesting thing would be if there are any advantages / smoothing effect from post cut heating the chip
17:53 < nmz787> i could be wrong
17:53 < delinquentme> it might smooth down the channels
17:53 < nmz787> but i think a peltier underneat should be good enough
17:53 < nmz787> I dont think rebaking will do anything
17:53 < nmz787> its a thermoset compound
17:54 < delinquentme> ohhh
17:54 < nmz787> i seem to remember them baking around 60 or 80 C
17:54 < delinquentme> so its manufactured as a chunk then fired to set?
17:54 < delinquentme> fucking materials science u so crazy
17:54 < delinquentme> plastic that thinks its ceramic
17:57 < nmz787> well it starts as a polymer of PDMS, then you add a crosslinking agent and set it... then you ablating the matrix
17:57 < delinquentme> oh
17:57 < delinquentme> i learned about ablation from MassEffec 2
17:57 < nmz787> PDMS without the crosslinking agent is a silicone oil
17:57 < delinquentme> #TrueStory
17:57 < nmz787> that a movie or game?
17:58 < delinquentme> game
17:58 < nmz787> ahh
18:00 < d3nd3> what are your opinions on drug use as enhancing the human experience ?
18:00 < delinquentme> quickest way to clearn "\r\n\t\t            Showing 1-100 of 165\r\n\t\t        "
18:00 < delinquentme> PHOR IT
18:01 < delinquentme> I mean is your brain usable afterwards
18:01 -!- F71 [~Adium@50.15.211.25] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
18:01 < nmz787> everyone uses drugs
18:01 < d3nd3> so these drugs should be made legal ?
18:01 < nmz787> many drugs are legal
18:02 < d3nd3> the ones which seem to have effects on the minds experience seem to be heavily legalized
18:02 < d3nd3> this is a bad move by governments?? if its a change in experience which we seek ?
18:03 < kanzure> legalized means "it's legal"
18:04 < delinquentme> I like the part where I lost a chunk of skin but bc proper care
18:04 < delinquentme> I KEPT IT!
18:04 < delinquentme> and its growing back
18:04 < delinquentme> aweshum.
18:08 < d3nd3> so do you take drugs to have an enhanced experience in life? if so which ones do you recommend
18:09 < nmz787> the good ones
18:09 < d3nd3> i am seeking enhanced experience of life and consciousness, how my mind is working, drugs is one way to have a different, perhaps better experience , or more intense, how ever you want to say it... do you know any other alternatives to drugs for a similar effect ?
18:09 < nmz787> yoga
18:09 < nmz787> meditation
18:10 < nmz787> read DMT: the spirit molecule by dr rick strassman
18:10 < nmz787> says those states could very well be the same as those experienced when deep in meditation
18:11 < nmz787> cool idea, haven't heard much about this stuff recently
18:11 < d3nd3> where is dmt leagal do you know, i really do want to experience this wonderful thing, i would not have said i lived until i experienced it
18:11 < nmz787> not a lot goin on in this country re: fixing psychological or physical medical probs
18:11 < nmz787> south america
18:12 < nmz787> there are churches in the U.S. but I don't think you can join the religion
18:13 < nmz787> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15163593
18:13 < nmz787> that writer's been at this topic for years
18:14 < nmz787> but even some of this old-world stuff is exploited in modern pharmacopeia that doctors in hospitals prescribe
18:15 < delinquentme> d3nd3, do you excercise ?
18:15 < delinquentme> when was the last time you were gasping for breath outside of a sex encounter
18:16 < d3nd3> terrence mckenna he died of brain cancer, he also took much drugs during his life, which put chemicals in the brain and alter his perception of life? ... surely there is connection, surely this is an indication that its perhaps a dangerous route to take drugs on a regular basis it causes damage in the head ? of the cells ? cancerous ?
18:17 < delinquentme> i love the fact that logic is exposed in the URL
18:17 < delinquentme> HAX on the IEEE
18:17 < delinquentme> d3nd3, the issue with many drugs is they're not so thouroughly tested
18:18 < nmz787> kanzure: http://www.instructables.com/id/Burning-visible-images-onto-CD-Rs-with-data-beta/
18:19 < nmz787> good way to test if a blu-ray will etch PDMS?
18:19 < nmz787> it would be raster, not vector, but maybe a good test of laser power?
18:23 < d3nd3> Non drug-users die EVERY DAY! 
18:23 < d3nd3> this is someone's point ...
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18:25 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-57-20.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
18:27 < d3nd3> i am curious to ask what are you talking about above, a project of some sort? what are you trying to achieve with a blu ray ?
18:30 < d3nd3> Is anyone working on an exciting project? or are you mostly all learning through study/reading? ... The purpose of your existences so far is to gain as much knowledge in this century? to be on top of the board game ready to do the ground-breaking moves towards a changed reality ?
18:31 < d3nd3> what are your goals, what are you working towards
18:31 < d3nd3> :P
18:33 < kanzure> no, we're building projects
18:34 < kanzure> spiderman is breeding silk webs, yash is doing human muscle enhancement, nmz787 is building a laser cutter and dna synthesizer
18:34 < kanzure> delinquentme is stealing all known science
18:34 < kanzure> etc. etc.
18:36 < diginet> speaking of me: does anyone have information on suppressing competing proteins in recombitant expression systems?
18:36 < delinquentme> etc etc
18:37 < delinquentme> diginet, what is a recombitant * *
18:37 < kanzure> delinquentme: well there's like 60 people in here, i can't possibly summarize all the projects in one sentence
18:37 < delinquentme> kanzure, ohh you're talking w d3nd3
18:37 < kanzure> delinquentme: recombinant expression system is just how you get cells to grow proteins for you
18:37 < delinquentme> d3nd3, havnt you been in here before?
18:38 < delinquentme> so to answer diginet wouldn't he be looking for "promoters" ?
18:38 < delinquentme> basically add more introns
18:39 < diginet> no, I know about promoters of course, I'm saying would also suppressing other proteins which aren't essential help things
18:39 < d3nd3> i am always here
18:40 < d3nd3> but i know so little...
18:41 < delinquentme> diginet, It might be a good bet to leave it be if you're not sure
18:41 < delinquentme> like we're stupidly complex
18:41 < delinquentme> now there ARE existing metabolic charts which map out connections and influences
18:41 < delinquentme> but!
18:41 < delinquentme> futzing with more stuff means you're dealing with more variables
18:41 < delinquentme> BUT!
18:41 < delinquentme> that might also be untrue
18:41 < diginet> true
18:42 < diginet> I could stunt growth and obviate any gains I might've made in the first place
18:42 < delinquentme> I can tell you that lots of cellular processes depend on the concept of thresholds
18:42 < delinquentme> has anyone researched into getting tits to grow?
18:42 < delinquentme> bc seriously that would be a massive business
18:43 < delinquentme> ( if its not obv already  )
18:43 < d3nd3> hehe
18:43 < delinquentme> injection > surgery
18:43 < delinquentme> id be really curious to see what the market for implants does
18:44 < diginet> isn't "tits" metonymy? I thought a "tit" was a nipple, not the breast
18:44 < d3nd3> how would this be possible? the skin would to also get bigger aswell as the organ inside the breast ?
18:44 < diginet> I hate that word, it's so puerile and just immature
18:45 < kanzure> so apparently none of you know how a breast works
18:45 < d3nd3> =)
18:45 < d3nd3> it looks like an intestine, yes ?
18:45 < d3nd3> so its a tubular organ?
18:46 < d3nd3> size of an organ .. growth of an organ, thats the topic yes ?
18:46 < d3nd3> has it ever been possible ?
18:48  * delinquentme keeps the mysogny to himself
18:49 < delinquentme> umm if you're stimulating fat deposits over time
18:49 < delinquentme> the skin will grow to accommodate
18:53 < delinquentme> OH YOU SILLY ENGINEERS
18:53 < delinquentme> YOUR WEBSITE IS SO CONSISTENT
18:53 < delinquentme> SCRAPEABILITY SCORE OF 10+
19:01 < delinquentme> BRB!
19:01 < diginet> also, what about protease inhibitors where the genome isn't known? I.e. I can't just suppres the protease gene, are there transgenic anti-proteases?
19:02 < ParahSailin> if there is a specific protease you are trying to inhibit, you can do that
19:02 < diginet> ah okay
19:03 < diginet> I probably don't need to worry about it at this point
19:05 -!- delinquentme [~asdfasdf@c-24-3-85-154.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
19:07 < diginet> uh oh
19:07 < diginet> I exceeded the maximum download for my library account :(
19:08 < joshcryer> There is a confluence of nicknames that start with 'D' which is fascinating to observe but not engage.
19:09 < diginet> should I be flattered or insulted
19:13 -!- delinquentme [~asdfasdf@c-24-3-85-154.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap
19:20 < joshcryer> Both.
19:24 < delinquentme> Neither.
19:33 < delinquentme> im all fuck yehhh the shits verified!
19:35 < kanzure> nmz787: ping
19:35 < kanzure> http://code.google.com/p/lemoncurry/wiki/main
19:35 < kanzure> "Open Source UV Photopolymer DLP 3D Printer"
19:35 < kanzure> see #lemoncurry
19:36 < joshcryer> Nice.
19:36 < nmz787> kanzure: email again
19:36 -!- nathaniel [~nathaniel@reddit/operator/nathaniel] has joined ##hplusroadmap
19:37 < kanzure> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qKhit2nsoq4
19:37 < nmz787> ! oO
19:37 < kanzure> firmware: https://github.com/kliment/Sprinter
19:37 < kanzure> stepper driver: http://www.pololu.com/catalog/product/1183
19:38 < nmz787> we should talk to him
19:38 < nmz787> yeah thats the one fenn was talking abouth
19:39 < nmz787> well almost, thats the one i think we should get
19:39 < nmz787> its $7 more but has voltage regulation
19:40 < nmz787> i'm not sure what resolution this could give us though
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19:40 < nmz787> each pixel is already 4-40 microns
19:40 < nmz787> (not sure)
19:40 < nmz787> in this case it looks like he's enlarging the image too
19:40 < kanzure> i wonder why they are using dlp to do 3d printing
19:40 < joshcryer> diginet, I was just teasing btw.
19:40 -!- joshcryer [~g@unaffiliated/joshcryer] has quit [Quit: bbl]
19:41 < nmz787> instead of LCD?
19:42 < kanzure> well i guess they want small features
19:42 < delinquentme> http://www.jstor.org/action/showPublication?journalCode=blackcamera
19:42 < delinquentme> #trueStory
19:42 < delinquentme> #ThisIsWhyRacism
19:43 < kanzure> why the hell are you using twitter hashtags
19:43 < kanzure> this isn't twitter
19:43 < kanzure> blah
19:44 < nmz787> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HL3Wmg7N9V8
19:44 < nmz787> so we need to hack a bd-r
19:44 < kanzure> music is awesome
19:44 < nmz787> newegg $80-$100
19:44 < nmz787> says 450mW
19:45 < kanzure> electrical tape at 9 ft.. hahah
19:45 < nmz787> ya
19:45 < nmz787> if he can do that, maybe PDMS is no prob
19:45 < kanzure> looks like he's carving wood no problem
19:48 < kanzure> hmm
19:48 < kanzure> well that significantly cuts down on the price
19:49 < diginet> haha, is anyone here interested in gene guns/biolistics? because it looks like I'm going to have to be building one
19:50 < kanzure> i think you should use an electroporator instead
19:50 < kanzure> thomasegi was designing one with yashgaroth
19:50 < audy> kanzure for tissue?
19:50 < kanzure> iirc it was like a $30 circuit
19:50 < kanzure> oh right. well anyway, it's a very similar circuit either way
19:50 < audy> you can gene gun DNA into a plant or your little brother
19:51 < audy> very difficult to electroporate your little brother much less make him competent
19:51 < diginet> mentally, or biologically for that matter
19:51 < delinquentme> ZOMG GENE GUN
19:51 < delinquentme> BAZOOM
19:51 < delinquentme> Also.
19:51 < audy> I might be as simple as modifying a shotgun shell
19:51 < delinquentme> Kara No Kyoukai
19:51 < diginet> I dunno about that
19:51 < diginet> maybe though
19:52 < delinquentme> audy, you're qualified
19:52 < nmz787> http://www.rolanddga.com/products/milling/imodela/
19:52 < nmz787> Software resolution0.00039 inches/step (0.01 mm/step; RML-1),0.000039 inches/step (0.001 mm/step: NC code)Mechanical resolution0.00000732 inches/step (0.000186 mm/step: micro steps)
19:52 < kanzure> delinquentme: commit the scrapers
19:52 < diginet> lol, gene guns
19:52 < delinquentme> the barnacles are too hard kanzure
19:52 < audy> *BOOM* now you're expressing GFP in your butt
19:52 < kanzure> delinquentme: what
19:52 < diginet> YES
19:52 < kanzure> delinquentme: if you commit the files, i will do the search-and-replace thing
19:53 < delinquentme> lol i already did that
19:53 < diginet> electroporation is hard for plant cells, and not very useful for chloroplast transformation
19:53 < audy> eeek yeah how do you get DNA into the choloroplasts?
19:54 < kanzure> diginet: for plants you should just use agrobacterium
19:54 < diginet> basically, luck
19:54 < audy> culture them separately?
19:54 < diginet> kanzure, useless for chloroplasts
19:54 < kanzure> ParahSailin: do you have any agrobacterium experience
19:54 < audy> you do triparental mating
19:54 < ParahSailin> i have a friend in lubbock who is working with them and can get me bugs and plasmids
19:55 < diginet> audy, basically you use a cell type which has fewer chloroplasts, insert a marker, and select for it very aggressively until you get a homoplastid cell
19:56 < diginet> kanzure, ParahSailin, actually that may be useful, as I need two different strains of the target, one for each protein and was thinking of using GFP as a visual marker to differentiate each
19:56 < diginet> but that will be later on
19:56 < ParahSailin> this friend is actually the one who told me about this channel but i dont know what name he goes under here
19:57 < diginet> audy, if you're interested I can upload a few papers I have on plastid transformation
19:57 < audy> diginet I got google scholar thanks :)
19:57 < diginet> no problem
19:58 < kanzure> diginet: i'm still waiting on your paper dump :)
19:58 < diginet> kanzure, I know I know, I have so many folders to go through, it's gonna take awhile
19:58 < diginet> I have to take beaks every now and then
19:58 < diginet> *breaks
20:02 -!- ybit is now known as fussybabybitch
20:02  * diginet is confused
20:03 -!- fussybabybitch is now known as ybit
20:09 < ybit> diginet: on occassion i change my name to the word i'm unintentionally highlighted with, if that's what your confusion is about
20:10 -!- ybit [~ybit@131.252.130.248] has quit [Changing host]
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20:12 < diginet> haha
20:13 < delinquentme> LOLOL
20:26 < delinquentme> how long does google keep emails?
20:26 < kanzure> forever
20:27 < delinquentme> nah
20:27 < delinquentme> unless i cant search forever back
20:27 < delinquentme> PS why does gmail search suck balls?
20:27 < delinquentme> im looking for a password I saved and I specifically recall a portion of the term
20:28 < kanzure> gmail search takes 30-45sec each time for me
20:28 < delinquentme> but gmail search for some reason only searches whole words
20:28 < kanzure> granted, it has hundreds of thousands of emails to search
20:28 < delinquentme> archives are searched by default right?
20:28 < delinquentme> does it search reliably for you?
20:28 < delinquentme> bc mine is shitty
20:28 < nmz787> i periodically zombify and go through old emails, its boring but it doesn get rid of some clutter
20:28 < kanzure> nope it takes forever, so if i typo i have to wait another minute or two
20:32 < delinquentme> kanzure, u got a new email in ur inbox
20:32 < kanzure> hmm
20:32 < kanzure> loading
20:33 < kanzure> was this sent to you?
20:33 < kanzure> or did you send this
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20:36 < delinquentme> anyone know of a quick way to break into a dlink router without having to reset it?
20:36 < diginet> default password?
20:38 < delinquentme> yeah i changed it
20:45 < delinquentme> OK 1 more then break time
20:53 < delinquentme> ["Asian Journal of Mathematics", "http://www.intlpress.com/AJM/"]
20:53 < delinquentme> you know thats a good ass math journal
20:53 < _Sketch_> Heh.
20:53 < _Sketch_> ass-math.
20:53 < delinquentme> _Sketch_, dont be racist.
20:53 < _Sketch_> http://xkcd.com/37/
20:55 < ParahSailin> difficulty level asian
20:55 < delinquentme> <adjective>-ass <noun>  better?
21:00 < nmz787> kanzure: http://www.repairfaq.org/sam/laserhtr.htm#htrichl
21:01 < kanzure> sam's laser faq is the best
21:01 -!- _0bitcount [~ulises11@213.37.202.49.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap
21:03 < nmz787> kanzure: "CO2 lasers are generally used for cutting materials like stainless steel because they can, in general, be focused to smaller spots, which improves cut quality. You can focus a 1 kW CO2 laser to a 100 micron spot. A 1 kW YAG is generally used with fiber optics for beam delivery and can't be focused smaller than 400 microns or so."
21:03 < kanzure> hrm
21:06 < kanzure> yep! that's the solution, we'll cut our chips out of stainless steel. haha
21:06 < kanzure> and then arc weld the two layers together
21:08 < nmz787> too bad we can't do 3D channels with SLS or that yellow curry thing
21:08 < nmz787> but fill the last cut layer with like, wax or something
21:08 < nmz787> so we can just keep adding layers
21:08 < nmz787> then melt the wax out at the end
21:09 < nmz787> :/
21:09 < kanzure> you could probably boil the wax or acid etch it out
21:10 < nmz787> then it would be more automated, no probs bonding layers
21:12 < kanzure> we should probably just design for a bluray diode
21:12 < kanzure> but also design the structure to accomodate a giant laser
21:12 < kanzure> and a co2 tube
21:12 < kanzure> and those crazy additional optics
21:13  * delinquentme found a bug in ruby
21:14 < kanzure> commit yer code
21:16 < nmz787> what if bluray takes too long
21:16 < nmz787> hrmm
21:20 < delinquentme> i thought
21:20 < delinquentme> '/asdf/'.split('/').count == 2
21:20 < delinquentme> shouldn't it be 3?
21:21 -!- _0bitcount [~ulises11@213.37.202.49.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:23 -!- d3nd3 [~dende@cpc10-croy17-2-0-cust245.croy.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
21:26 < kanzure> delinquentme: no because there's no content after the last one
21:26 < Moksparagus> does anybody know why embedded device manufacturers obfuscate the kernel/drivers of their devices?
21:27 < delinquentme> kanzure, theres no content for the first one!
21:28  * delinquentme mindplodes
21:28 < kanzure> >> '/a/b/c/d/e'.split('/')
21:28 < kanzure> => ["", "a", "b", "c", "d", "e"]
21:28 < kanzure> try lsplit and rsplit
21:29 < kanzure> oh ruby doesn't have that
21:29 < kanzure> well. python does.
21:30 < kanzure> nmz787: check this out..
21:30 < kanzure> my grandma emailed me this a few months ago
21:30 < kanzure> "Steve Jurvetson, a director of Synthetic Genomics, is part of a group of very rich, very bright Singularity observers who end up somewhere in the middle on the philosophy’s merits — optimistic about the growing powers of technology but pessimistic about humankind’s ability to reach a point where those forces can actually be harnessed."
21:30 < kanzure> "Mr. Jurvetson, a venture capitalist and managing director of the firm Draper Fisher Jurvetson, says the advances of companies like Synthetic Genomics give him confidence that we will witness great progress in areas like biofuels and vaccines."
21:30 < kanzure> "Still, he fears that such technology could also be used maliciously — and he has a pantry filled with products like Spam and honey in case his family has to hunker down during a viral outbreak or attack."
21:30 < kanzure> '“Thank God we have a swimming pool,” he says, noting that it gives him a large store of potentially potable water.'
21:31 < kanzure> i think that's hilarious
21:31 < delinquentme> kanzure, '/asdf/'.split('/',-1)
21:31 < delinquentme> extensible and consistend
21:32 < delinquentme> unlike me spulling
21:32 < kanzure> "Also, in the interest of making sure the record is straight, I do believe that Steve is not the only person who originated the idea of adding artificial chromosome add-ons to the human genome.  I had the inklings of the idea in the mid-1990's [2]."
21:32 < kanzure> "I founded a company, Robiobotics, circa 2001 to pursue that objective but its life was cut short by the dot-com bust.  The idea was however presented to Steve Jurvetson at DFJ and I believe it subsequently led to the funding of Synthetic Genomics [3]."
21:33 < delinquentme> is it evil to threaten to hack girls FBs
21:33 < delinquentme> lololol
21:33 < kanzure> delinquentme: as long as you don't leave a baby on the profile
21:33 < delinquentme> LOL!
21:34 < kanzure> aww shit i have his email from 2007
21:34 < kanzure> Steve Jurvetson <steve@dfj.com>
21:35 < kanzure> also this guy: sj@dfj.com
21:35 < kanzure> Timothy Draper <tim@dfj.com>
21:35 < kanzure> Warren Packard <warren@dfj.com>
21:36 < kanzure> "Space Investment Summit 5... The Keynote Speaker will be Steve Jurvetson, Managing Director at Draper Fisher Jurvetson, and founding VC investor in Hotmail."
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21:38 < delinquentme> warren packard
21:38 < delinquentme> thats an astronaut name
21:38 < kanzure> http://www.dfj.com/team/teamdetail.php?10155
21:38 < kanzure> eww "Intellectual Ventures"
21:38 < delinquentme> so is shepard
21:39 < delinquentme> real time sports discovery
21:39 < delinquentme> oh
21:39 < delinquentme> wow
21:39 < delinquentme> yip
21:39 < delinquentme> ee
21:40 < kanzure> http://www.techstars.org/mentors/bbryant/ i think this guy is also from dfj
21:42 < nmz787> kanzure:
21:42 < nmz787> http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/lapl.200710123/abstract
21:42 < kanzure> neat
21:42 < nmz787> that says for soft tissue they used 1735 W/cm sq
21:43 < nmz787> i have calculated (which Simon didn't completely straightforward say was correct) 27 million W/cm sq
21:43 < nmz787> for 1W @ 6 micron spot
21:44 < nmz787> that sounds like a hell of a lot
21:44 < kanzure> sounds like we're going to explode our pdms :)
21:44 < delinquentme> http://www.iospress.nl/journal/ai-communications/
21:44 < delinquentme> Impact factor of ... 0.837
21:44 < delinquentme> do you even advertise that?
21:45 < kanzure> haha
21:45 < kanzure> "Impact factor of zero, yo"
21:45 < delinquentme> "were underground"
21:46 < kanzure> hipster impact factor
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21:56 < nmz787> kanzure: BH12LS38 
21:56 < nmz787> whoops
21:56 < nmz787> http://www.ebay.com/itm/LG-Internal-Blu-ray-Drive-BH12LS38-12x-BD-DVD-Rewriter-Super-Multi-Blue-/160782110321?pt=PCC_Drives_Storage_Internal&hash=item256f5c4e71#ht_500wt_1287
21:56 < Guest73883> lemon curry dlp?
21:56  * kanzure nods
21:57 < Guest73883> why use a blue ray drive instead of a regular dlp?
21:57 < kanzure> this is just for our laser cutter
21:58 < Guest73883> ohhhh
21:59 < Guest73883> will that be the actual laser diode for it?
22:00 < kanzure> probably, still deciding..
22:00 < kanzure> a co2 laser would give us more options
22:01 < kanzure> but a bluray diode would be super cheap
22:01 < Guest73883> how much power does bluray provide?
22:01 < nmz787> not just cheaper, but easier to make small
22:01 < nmz787> 700mW
22:01 < nmz787> supposedly focused to <1micron
22:02 < nmz787> i guess they spin the hell outta those discs to keep them from burning
22:03 < nmz787> ".or, knowing that the track length for CDs is 5,378m, the track length for DVDs is roughly:
22:03 < nmz787> 5,378 * CD Track Pitch / DVD Track Pitch = 5,378 * 1.60/0.74 metres
22:03 < nmz787> and the track length for BDs is:
22:03 < nmz787> 5,378 * CD Track Pitch / BD Track Pitch = 5,378 * 1.60/0.32 metres"
22:04 < nmz787> and we have 31 meters to cut
22:04 < nmz787> (bd has 26890 meters of writable track)
22:06 < nmz787> "The 12x BD burner that delivers a perfect 25GB disk in under
22:06 < nmz787> 12 minutes"
22:06 < nmz787> so i think with that ratio of their lengths, and since the power is constant... i think a bluray drive might actually work nicely
22:12 < delinquentme> kanzure, xpath search for a href value
22:13 < delinquentme> .search('/a[contains(@href,"http://")]')
22:13 < delinquentme> not  // bc thats the whole document and I'm pretty sure href is the right selector
22:14 < kanzure> eh
22:14 < kanzure> //a[@href!='']
22:14 < delinquentme> thats just not empty right
22:14 < kanzure> yes
22:14 < delinquentme> yeah I need to find the one with http :D
22:15 < kanzure> just look at all of them and check for http in ruby
22:15 < kanzure> mylink.include? "http"
22:16 < delinquentme> thatll do
22:20 < kanzure> http://www.gizmag.com/magnifi-iphone-adapter-microscope/22116/
22:20 < kanzure> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/637232010/magnifi-the-worlds-first-iphone-photoadapter-case
22:20 < kanzure> http://www.arcturuslabs.com/
22:20 < kanzure> iphone/microscope fixture. nothing to see here, carry on..
22:23 < delinquentme> that is pretty fucking sexy
22:23 < delinquentme> wah wah wee wah
22:24 < nmz787> pretty cool
22:27 < delinquentme> it doesnt show how the clasp works for different size lenses!
22:27 < delinquentme> LIESSSSSSSSSSSSSs
22:28 < kanzure> man, i was totally going to write some pokemon code tonight
22:28 < delinquentme> for integration w google maps NES?
22:28 < kanzure> delinquentme: nope. i've been writing source code to pokemon red
22:29 < kanzure> http://bitbucket.org/kanzure/pokered
22:29 < kanzure> http://bitbucket.org/kanzure/pokecrystal
22:31 < nmz787> you just need to buy me a big kit 'o lenses to play with
22:31 < nmz787> and some lasers too
22:31 < nmz787> gotta have lasers
22:31 < nmz787> more lasers
22:32 < nmz787> is teh pokemon kid still Ash?
22:32 < delinquentme> pew pew
22:32 < kanzure> nmz787: in the game?
22:32 < nmz787> ya
22:34 < delinquentme> I think i have a celeb crush on sarah underwood
22:36 < kanzure> nmz787: nope it's choose-your-own-name or something
22:41 < delinquentme> japan society of applied physics
22:41 < delinquentme> something was lost in translation
22:47 < kanzure> its real name is "japan society of applied giant robots"
22:48 < delinquentme> http://annex.jsap.or.jp/OSJ/opticalreview/
22:48 < delinquentme> OH man.
22:51 < kanzure> hey man don't hate on SCIENCE and 1995-style HTML
22:51 < kanzure> hah
22:55 < delinquentme> I think a phillipino girl is trying to get me to import her
22:55 < delinquentme> =/ shes like 45
22:55 < ybit> delinquentme: just one?
22:56 < ybit> come on, you can do better than this
22:57 < delinquentme> lol
22:57 < delinquentme> well at their standard of living i could prob import a whole family
22:57 < delinquentme> teach them to program u know
22:57 < delinquentme> DAMN
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23:10 < delinquentme> am i missing something here
23:10 < delinquentme> " Applied Phsyics Express (APEX)".include? " Applied Physics Express"
23:10 < delinquentme> FALSE?
23:10 < kanzure> it says Phsyics
23:10 < kanzure> not Physics
23:11 < delinquentme> damn.
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23:25 < delinquentme> http://i.imgur.com/ZH7qN.jpg
23:25 < delinquentme> im out
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23:31 < jrayhawk> why is the intake partially dismantled
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23:32 < jrayhawk> i guess tubes are just too boring or something
23:34 < katsmeow-afk> maybe they got the intercoolers, which are somewhere else
23:34 < katsmeow-afk> got = gotot
23:34 < katsmeow-afk> goto
23:34 < jrayhawk> I guess that makes sense
23:34 < jrayhawk> http://www.rx7.org/Robinette/images/hoses.gif tubes rule
23:35 < yashgaroth> I just realized I have no idea where the intake even is
23:35 < jrayhawk> it's INSIDE YOUR HOUSE
23:35 < yashgaroth> oh nooooo
23:35 < jrayhawk> RUN
23:35 < yashgaroth> it's...taken me in!
23:35 < diginet> LOUD NOISES
23:36 < katsmeow-afk> BRIGHT FLASHES AND LASER SOUNDS
23:36 < yashgaroth> don't worry guys I beat it away with the alternator or something
23:37 < jrayhawk> http://image.fourwheeler.com/f/9046046+w750+st0/129_0710_10_z+gm_4l60e_transmission_fixes+valve_body.jpg also fluidics rule
23:38 < jrayhawk> it's sorta like tubes, only even more terrifying
23:38 < katsmeow-afk> you'll find plates like that in most automatics
23:38 < yashgaroth> is that to keep the engine entertained on long drives?
23:39 < katsmeow-afk> speaking of fluidics, why wold a gear pump be labeled right hand or left hand?
23:39 < jrayhawk> maybe it's engineered to be more efficient in one direction
23:39 < katsmeow-afk> it should be symetric
23:40 < jrayhawk> I imagine you can do neat tricks with flow dynamics to that end, but I'm not much of an engineer.
23:43 < jrayhawk> man, that last image makes me actually miss the cleansing feel of ATF
23:43 < jrayhawk> i should rectify this by removing my power steering. fucking power steering.
23:45 < jrayhawk> ##carplusroadmap
23:46 < katsmeow-afk> nice thing about not having serpentine belts: when my ps pump sounded like a wood chipper, i dropped the belt and kept driving
23:46 < diginet>  you know, since it's going to take awhile to farm enough protein, I should resurect DIY diamonds in the interim
23:46 < diginet> the question is how to go about building the CVD reactor
23:47 < yashgaroth> why don't you ask the guys who made them oh wait they're in a shallow grave somewhere
23:47 < diginet> SERIOUSLY
23:47 < diginet> that's the one conspiracy I believe in, DeBeers is everywhere
23:47 < katsmeow-afk> that sounds severe
23:48 < yashgaroth> yeah well
23:48 < jrayhawk> the killings aren't really going on anymore
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23:48 < yashgaroth> then they had the intended effect
23:48 < katsmeow-afk> ran out of people?
23:49 < diginet> jrayhawk, how comforting :P
23:49 < yashgaroth> people willing to mess with an industry that supplies a product that hitmen like to be paid in
23:49 < jrayhawk> they soooortof delayed the first artificial diamond industry, though obviously the second world had them during that time
23:49 < katsmeow-afk> inherent downside
23:49 < jrayhawk> s/the first/the first world/
23:50 < yashgaroth> yeah they did alright until the mafia took over running the ussr
23:51 < diginet> the Soviets didn't take their shit, then when the USSR collapsed, they just bought up their cache
23:51 < jrayhawk> actually the USSR was selling diamonds to Oppenheimer the whole time; that's a big part of how they got foreign currency for their espionage efforts.
23:51 < katsmeow-afk> so basically, make the lab portable, and move around, sell infrequently, randomly, different laces, small qtys
23:52 < yashgaroth> hard to make it portable when it's a 20-ton hunk of metal
23:52 < diginet> not interested in selling
23:52 < diginet> I don't care about the money
23:52  * katsmeow-afk would look annoyed at her nose if she could,, it had a runny cold on the left last nite, and today the cold is on the right
23:53 < katsmeow-afk> 20 tons 1) floats 2) fits in a shipping container
23:55 < ParahSailin> rothschild runs de beers
23:55 < jrayhawk> what?
--- Log closed Thu Apr 12 00:00:32 2012