--- Log opened Sat Mar 30 00:00:42 2013 00:11 < jonathanc> it occurs to me that you have an interesting view of what open hardware means 00:11 <@kanzure> why's that? 00:12 < jonathanc> i.e. you want an open library of microcontroller firmware, presumably because you will have a piece of desk equipment which can do anything you want if you just download the right firmware to it 00:12 < jonathanc> one day it makes coffee, the next day it makes yogurt 00:12 < jonathanc> just download the firmware and it reconfigures itself so to speak 00:12 <@kanzure> haha i am not willing to write that much software 00:12 < jonathanc> is that right? 00:12 <@kanzure> no, i'm okay with installing single-purpose software 00:13 <@kanzure> but i do believe in code-reuse wherever possible 00:13 <@kanzure> hmm i should have been more clear 00:13 <@kanzure> i am okay with single-purpose controllers 00:13 < jonathanc> if so then you have to accept that the line between hardware and software at the embedded level gets fuzzy 00:14 < jonathanc> so there is no such thing as "general purpose firmware" which can be downloaded to arbitrary hardware 00:14 <@kanzure> it certainly does get fuzzy in the very constrained environments, but to me that just means "only libraries that are targeting this architecture should be used" 00:14 < jonathanc> if you have a coffee maker then it can only make coffee, it can't make espresso 00:15 < jonathanc> it seems there is a technology cycle continually looping. 00:15 < jonathanc> in the 80s maybe it was "general purpose computer device which can be programmed to do antyhing" 00:15 <@kanzure> there were a lot of pics back then too, i thought? 00:16 < jonathanc> in the 90s it certainly was "independent, specific devices which do a certain things well" like gps, digital camera, pda note taker, flip phone 00:16 < jonathanc> in the 80s, no, there were no PICs 00:16 < jonathanc> most common was motorola 6805 or intel 8051 00:17 <@kanzure> we jumped straight into the 80xx series? hmm. 00:17 < jonathanc> in the 00s it looped back to "general purpose [smart phone device] which can be programmed to do any app" 00:18 < jonathanc> right now maybe the loop is cycling again 00:18 < jonathanc> right now the semiconductor co's are pushing "internet of things" meme 00:19 <@kanzure> "great, you're going to give me a free ethernet soc?" 00:19 <@kanzure> "haha no" 00:19 < jonathanc> which basically equates to "specific devices which do certain things well" like sense this, or mesh connect that, or control this, etc 00:20 < jonathanc> "internet of things" is being pushed because moore's law has reached a point where 32-bit microcontrollers are in the few-dollar range, so networking can soon be ubiquitous 00:20 < jonathanc> 802.15.xx 00:21 < jonathanc> semiconductor co's can sell billions of chips if they are used in everything (ex. lightbulbs) 00:22 < jonathanc> this means firmware will become more specific again, not more general-purpose-app type 00:22 <@kanzure> developers will be given more general purpose platforms to work on, though 00:22 < jonathanc> in the 80s there really were just a few very popular architectures like I mentioned (6805, 8051) 00:22 <@kanzure> there's no way that people are going to voluntarily develop on stackless architectures 00:22 < jonathanc> in the 90s there was more of a diversification 00:23 < jonathanc> in the 00s there was a mini-implosion 00:23 < jonathanc> ha 00:23 < jonathanc> "internet of things" is pushed by the arm cortex crowd. 32 bit, rtos capable 00:24 < jonathanc> the tiniest embedded chips, like used in computer mouse, is the stackless kind 00:24 < jonathanc> maybe only 16 bytes RAM or so 00:24 <@kanzure> if i was mass producing mice then that seems useful.. but i am not doing that. 00:25 < jonathanc> well what are you doing then 00:25 <@kanzure> in lab equipment? 00:25 < jonathanc> everyone has a thermometer (nowadays digital) in their bathroom medicine cabinet 00:26 < jonathanc> everyone should have a thermocycler as well 00:26 < jonathanc> that is mass production 00:27 < jonathanc> how are you gonna detect if there's horsemeat in your meatballs w/o a thermocycler? 00:27 <@kanzure> for a moment, let's imagine there is no demand for mass production 00:27 < jonathanc> then define mass 00:27 <@kanzure> even in that scenario, i'm still interested in continuing to build my lab equipment 00:27 < jonathanc> how many labs are there in the u.s. 00:27 <@kanzure> n=1 "just for me" 00:27 <@kanzure> mine mine mine 00:28 < jonathanc> well that's useless, only the dod does that silliness 00:28 <@kanzure> how is that useless. if it actually works for me? 00:28 < jonathanc> "let's spend a trillion dollars on this [mainframe or whatever] and only build 1 ever, for our use only" 00:28 <@kanzure> a trillion dollars to build a thermocycler or mass spec? come on. 00:28 <@kanzure> for the military, sure. for me? 00:28 < jonathanc> why did hackers at mit originally break into the mainframe labs and subsequently invent unix and gnu gpl 00:29 <@kanzure> unix was because they wanted to play snake or some shit 00:29 < jonathanc> because they wanted access to a special piece of equipment they couldn't use otherwise, because it was controlled 00:29 < jonathanc> unix to overtake multics 00:29 <@kanzure> i only know multics by reputation. i haven't actually been on a multics system yet. 00:30 < jonathanc> if it's useful enough to build 1, then it's useful enough to build 100. if 100 people find it useful then it can scale up from there. 00:31 < jonathanc> how is it open if there's only 1 ever built? now you're making zero sense. 00:31 <@kanzure> that's not the definition of open source. 00:31 <@kanzure> there could be one or zero built for all OSI cares.. 00:32 <@kanzure> for me though, i would like at least one, heh 00:32 < jonathanc> well that's an interesting perspective i guess 00:32 < jonathanc> I figure, why bother to write it or create instructions if there is no plan to reuse it 00:32 <@kanzure> so, are you interested in mass production because you're Just So Kind? or because you think there's a profitable business in there somewhere? some other reason i'm overlooking? 00:32 < jonathanc> the entire point is reuse 00:33 <@kanzure> sure it's reuse. i think general purpose computers are reusable. 00:33 < jonathanc> how is anything innovated if there's only 1 ? 00:33 <@kanzure> innovated? a thermocycler is hardly that.. 00:33 <@kanzure> blah i need to stop talking about thermocyclers anyway. those things are the lamest shit in the lab anyway. 00:34 <@kanzure> part of the reason why i want to use libraries and package managers is because it means that you get to re-use the work from many different people even if they didn't have quite the same intentions in mind 00:35 <@kanzure> btw it occurs to me that i wanted to bring something up to you regarding Robotics::Tecan... i think there's a yaml code execution vulnerability in there somewhere. i'm still working out the details. 00:36 < jonathanc> it's possible 00:36 < jonathanc> I think the compiled instructions are eval'ed in the end 00:36 < jonathanc> that is the least of the worries 00:36 <@kanzure> heh. i know it probably doesn't see high use, but it's better safe than sorry, etc.. 00:36 < jonathanc> bigger concern is someone controlling the arm accidentally and running it into something which damages it, or damages people 00:37 <@kanzure> yes. 00:37 <@kanzure> i would also worry about people downloading yaml config files from the internetz and just running them without reviewing. 00:37 < jonathanc> what to do when I integrate a centrifuge part and the lid fails to lock or the user sets the speed too high or etc. it's bad news 00:37 <@kanzure> i know it probably doesn't happen at all at the moment, but again... 00:38 < jonathanc> so max brought in some spectrophotometers 00:38 <@kanzure> in fact, maybe there should be key signing or something. "warning, this config file has not been reviewed by anyone, go fuck yourself". 00:38 < jonathanc> i'll probably integrate them next 00:38 <@kanzure> good 00:38 <@kanzure> nmz787 has been wanting something like that 00:39 <@kanzure> we started on a python library to read from random spectrophotometers 00:39 <@kanzure> https://github.com/kanzure/python-spectrometers 00:39 <@kanzure> doesn't do anything interesting 00:39 <@kanzure> if you have the chops to dump ROM found onboard, that would be awesome too. i really want to do more teardowns of these expensive devices. 00:39 < jonathanc> I'd like to rewrite my entire perl codebase in python one of these days 00:40 < jonathanc> there was a guy who started emailing me roms from the various Tecan controller boards 00:40 <@kanzure> awesome, can i have a look? 00:40 < jonathanc> however, these are all old CPU's no longer worth bothering with 00:40 < jonathanc> I think Z80 or so 00:40 <@kanzure> i've been doing shitloads of z80 reverse engineering dude 00:41 <@kanzure> i presented this last night http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/irc/pokered/crystal/aha-pokemon-crystal.odp 00:41 <@kanzure> https://github.com/kanzure/pokecrystal 00:41 < jonathanc> there's no point, either use it as is with the exisitng command set, or toss it and replace with a new controller wired to the motors. 00:41 <@kanzure> it's a compiling version of pokemon crystal source code 00:41 <@kanzure> i also wrote a z80 disassembler in that git repo 00:42 <@kanzure> ah well i'm also just curious about laughing at their mistakes 00:42 <@kanzure> i am a very unforgiving critic 00:43 < jonathanc> dude what's with that call graph, yikes 00:43 < jonathanc> spaghetti code or what 00:43 <@kanzure> code is fucking awful 00:43 <@kanzure> interns, man. 00:44 <@kanzure> this is why the games were so buggy. 00:45 < jonathanc> regardless it is better to replace the biorobotics boards if desired 00:45 <@kanzure> oh sure 00:45 <@kanzure> yeah i am surprised anyone trusts the default software on these things 00:45 < jonathanc> even a PIC24 is killer replacement for Z80 00:46 < jonathanc> the important parts to disassemble if any, would be the motor calibration routines 00:46 < jonathanc> since there is probably a lot of design optimization there from emperical testing 00:46 <@kanzure> the clusters in that call graph are different parser engines. for example the text on screen is blitted from a tileset with different commands/bytes, so all the branching is just lots of switch/if handling. 00:49 <@kanzure> anyway, the ROMs would be cool to poke at, just saying.. 00:49 <@kanzure> i also would be happy to help you with porting to python 00:49 <@kanzure> and i would also be interested in helping with any of the spectrometer formats 00:50 < jonathanc> there's multiple ports on one of the units. "i/o port" which is old ibm/pc keyboard type connector, centronics port maybe for line printer, serial port, and "expansion port" which is proprietary 12 pin connector or so. will have to see what comes out of the serial port. 00:51 <@kanzure> in some cases you can torrent the windows software first or use hyperterminal or w/e to see what it's transmitting 00:51 < jonathanc> alternatively it is not unheard of to wire into the display panel and steal the display information and wire into the membrane keypad to fake user inputs. 00:51 < jonathanc> oh good idea 00:52 < jonathanc> or, just remove the circuit board completely, replace with new board with bluetooth which controls the mechanical stuff 00:52 < jonathanc> it's amazing how big this equipment is, when most of the case is empty space inside 00:52 <@kanzure> can you hear your own echo 00:53 < jonathanc> maybe you should present at SLAS conference in SD in 2014 00:53 <@kanzure> what should i present? 00:54 < jonathanc> lots of topics covered there. 3d printing or new types of liquid handling is always a big topic. 00:55 < jonathanc> 3d printing in the sense of not printing, but using the device as sample pick/place 00:56 < jonathanc> it is an industry conference so is more focused than the academics 00:56 < jonathanc> interesting app note: wireless temperature sensing, uses under 100 instructions http://ww1.microchip.com/downloads/en/AppNotes/00850a.pdf 01:04 -!- klafka_ [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 01:05 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 01:19 -!- jonathanc [~jonathanc@wsip-98-174-141-194.sd.sd.cox.net] has quit [] 01:22 -!- klafka_ [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 01:23 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 01:27 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:30 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has joined ##hplusroadmap 01:55 < archels> kanzure: do you know anything about NURBS in CAD? Any ubiquitous standards? 01:59 <@kanzure> i know many things about nurbs in cad 01:59 <@kanzure> i also know that i am not very good at implementing nurbs intersection algorithms 01:59 < archels> well that does sound like a pain 02:00 < archels> I am going to argue for a neuron morphology standard in terms of NURBS (or an extensions thereof) 02:00 <@kanzure> take a look at opennurbs 02:00 <@kanzure> the intersection portions of the opennurbs library are proprietary but the other parts are open source 02:01 < archels> bastards. 02:01 <@kanzure> opencascade has some custom brep things with open source intersection stuff, but the downside is that it's opencascade and therefore the source code is unreadable and unmaintainable. however, it works. 02:01 < archels> well, the problem with NURBS is that you can't really join together separate NURBS 02:01 <@kanzure> another option is sisl 02:02 < archels> oh ya, I've been in touch with the SINTEF guys 02:02 <@kanzure> sure you can. lots of people use a "wings" data structure for stitching nurbs surfaces together. 02:03 <@kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/cad/ 02:03 < archels> yes, but that requires lofting both NURBS to have the same number of knots. So if you want to join two dozen surfaces, all with different knot vectors, you'll end up with a zillion knots/control points 02:05 < archels> Thomas Hughes, there's another bastard right there. Has an apparently great framework/library for locally refinable NURBS (which avoid this problem ^), but he commercialised instead of open sourced it. 02:07 <@kanzure> on an unrelated note, have you looked at https://github.com/kanzure/netmorph 02:07 < archels> oh, that's Randall's abandoned project isn't it 02:08 <@kanzure> well i'm sure there's other projects he's abandoned if that would make you feel better heh 02:09 < archels> I should probably mention it in my talk. thanks 02:09 <@kanzure> there are some youtube videos too 02:10 < archels> Unlike 02:10 < archels> previous work which considers primarily the problem of fitting a 02:10 < archels> single B-spline patch, our goal is to directly reconstruct a surface of 02:10 < archels> arbitrary topological type. We must therefore define the surface as 02:10 < archels> a network of B-spline patches. 02:10 < archels> this is the problem with NURBS: stiching them together 02:11 <@kanzure> stephen larson probably has more actionable recommendations for you 02:15 < archels> I don't suppose he visits here much? 02:15 <@kanzure> he is sometimes in #openworm-office 02:16 <@kanzure> he seems responsive by email 02:19 < archels> oh damn, he's even in my /lastlog there 02:22 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 02:25 < archels> kanzure: your repository is missing a classic, The NURBS Book by Piegl and Tiller ;) 02:25 < archels> ftp://ftp.turingbirds.com/math/Springer%20-%20The%20NURBS%20Book%202ed.djvu 02:27 <@kanzure> your server is slow 02:27 < archels> yes, anonymous logins are capped to 100 kB/s summed over up to 5 users 02:28 < archels> I don't want my ISP to come knocking at my door telling me to take it all down 02:30 <@kanzure> ok got it 02:32 < archels> alright time to move a chair 02:32 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has quit [Quit: jmil] 02:32 -!- cpopell [~cpopell@pool-96-231-37-73.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 02:47 -!- qu-bit_ [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has joined ##hplusroadmap 02:50 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 03:13 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:54 -!- makoLime [~mako@103-9-42-31.flip.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 03:58 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:14 -!- qu-bit_ [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:15 -!- plur [~nonentity@121-73-87-49.cable.telstraclear.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 04:40 -!- mutagen [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 04:42 -!- ArmilusDajjal [~safitan@75-105-12-23.cust.wildblue.net] has 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joined ##hplusroadmap 08:49 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:55 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:00 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 10:04 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:05 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Client Quit] 10:46 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:00 <@kanzure> hah ph-detours 11:01 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 11:04 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:04 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:04 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Client Quit] 11:07 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:10 -!- Cat4D [433456da@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.52.86.218] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:10 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 11:45 -!- Guest96256 is now known as yeastwest 11:48 -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 11:58 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:07 <@kanzure> http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/we-are-the-explorers-a-movie-trailer-for-our-space-program 12:17 -!- Cat4D [433456da@gateway/web/freenode/ip.67.52.86.218] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 12:33 -!- Guest17500 [~quassel@192.210.211.75] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 12:35 -!- _0bitcount [~ulises11@82.159.59.4.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 12:35 -!- underscor [~quassel@192.210.211.75] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:35 -!- underscor is now known as Guest29838 12:57 -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:37 -!- strages_home [~strages@98.67.174.4] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 13:47 <@kanzure> "TMS320C6x COFF Linker Unix v6.0.7 Copyright (c) 1996-2006 Texas Instruments Incorporated" 13:52 -!- cpopell [~cpopell@pool-96-231-37-73.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:13 <@kanzure> hayes commands for ardrone's protocol https://github.com/felixge/node-ar-drone/issues/40 14:17 < jmil> kanzure: do you have this file: MrKim_Sarik_Printable_Transistors_part1-v1.3.pdf 14:18 < jmil> kanzure: Smidge204 in #reprap is looking for it. i'd like a copy too if you have 14:18 < jmil> also kanzure: i accepted an assistant professorship at Rice University in Houston 14:18 < jmil> will start in july 14:18 < jmil> 3d printing sugar full time research lab 14:18 <@kanzure> congratulations 14:18 <@kanzure> now for the arduous road to funding.. 14:21 < ParahSail1n> wow 14:21 < ParahSail1n> what department? 14:22 <@kanzure> jmil: closest thing to that file that you're gonna be able to find is http://openmaterials.org/2010/12/14/diy-printed-transistors-botacom/ 14:22 <@kanzure> "What has happened to the mrkimrobotics website? It seems everything related to this research has been taken down everywhere." was posted 1 year ago. 14:23 < ParahSail1n> jmil, call me next time you're in town, i can guide you around the rice steam tunnels 14:23 < ParahSail1n> 847-641-1285 14:25 < jmil> ParahSail1n: sweeeet 14:26 < jmil> kanzure: I will put the fun in funding lol 14:26 < jmil> Bioengineering ParahSail1n 14:26 < ParahSail1n> so are you in the tower across the street? 14:26 < ParahSail1n> the brc? 14:26 < jmil> yes 14:26 < jmil> will be 14:26 < ParahSail1n> thats pretty awesome 14:26 < jmil> ParahSail1n: you work in med center? 14:26 < jmil> thanks! i'm super excited 14:26 < ParahSail1n> fucking parking there is a ripoff 14:26 < jmil> lol 14:27 < jmil> you should try parking at MIT 14:27 < ParahSail1n> im a grad school dropout from rice 14:27 < jmil> ah, what dept? 14:27 < jmil> you go to valhalla much? 14:27 < ParahSail1n> i was in civil engineering, but i did a lot of stuff with chbe 14:27 < jmil> gotcha 14:27 < ParahSail1n> yeah, i was there for four years, so hard to avoid it 14:28 < ParahSail1n> should have mentioned it in here when you visited rice 14:28 < jmil> what are you doin now? 14:28 < ParahSail1n> im in bioinformatics now, a place called eureka genomics 14:28 <@kanzure> ParahSail1n is busy crying that he doesn't have a printer as cool as yours 14:28 < jmil> my schedule was packed. literally 14 hours a day of meetings had to request bathroom breaks 14:29 < ParahSail1n> they're trying to launch 23andme for dogs 14:29 < jmil> ah 14:29 <@kanzure> jmil: i know one person who might have this pdf 14:29 < ParahSail1n> i dont know that many professors in the brc 14:29 -!- makoLime [~mako@103-9-42-31.flip.co.nz] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:30 < ParahSail1n> i bummed occasional cultures off people in there, cell lines, viral vectors, etc 14:30 < jmil> coolio 14:31 < jmil> well i hope to see you at the maker popup in houston in august. we are starting to organize 14:31 < ParahSail1n> whats that? 14:32 < jmil> it will be a makerspace that will exist for one month only. to stimulate interest and focus projects and project completion 14:33 < jmil> we are still framing the idea 14:33 < ParahSail1n> where you gonna be staying? 14:34 <@kanzure> jmil: neat idea, but getting all the equipment in one place for a month seems hard to pull off? 14:34 < jmil> we won't have too much equipment 14:34 < ParahSail1n> i imagine tx/rx could lend the space 14:34 <@kanzure> without equipment what's the point :p 14:34 < jmil> will be more of a coworking space and engage the locals 14:34 <@kanzure> oh. 14:34 < jmil> and focus presentation and workshops 14:35 <@kanzure> sounds like a normal meeting then? 14:35 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:35 < jmil> but hopefully i will have a couple reprap builds going there 14:35 < jmil> and reprap build class 14:35 < jmil> things like that 14:39 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 14:40 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:41 < ParahSail1n> jmil, so same research direction, the sugar printing? 14:41 < jmil> yes 14:42 < jmil> but going BIGGER 14:42 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:42 < ParahSail1n> bigger? 14:42 < chris_99> sugar printing == printing with sugar? 14:48 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 14:50 < brownies> sounds like a sweet job 14:51 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:53 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:56 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:57 < eudoxia> kanzure, is skdb under the GPL because of that wrapper around GNU units that fenn wrote? 14:58 <@kanzure> no 14:58 <@kanzure> it's under gpl because we decided we wanted it under gpl 14:58 < eudoxia> actually nevermind, i see you have your own unit conversion thing 14:58 < ParahSail1n> package system for "real stuff" 14:58 < ParahSail1n> first i think you'd need a ld for real stuff 14:59 <@kanzure> gotta start somewhere 14:59 < eudoxia> not that i have anything against the GPL, just curious if using another program from the command line is subject to similar restrictions as linking 14:59 <@kanzure> nope 15:00 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has quit [Quit: jmil] 15:00 < ParahSail1n> def frange(start, stop, step): #this ought to come with python :( -- xrange? 15:01 < ParahSail1n> oh, you need with float 15:02 <@kanzure> also this was back when python 2.6 15:12 -!- Mariu [Jimmy98@89.41.57.33] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:16 -!- Mariu [Jimmy98@89.41.57.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:17 < ParahSail1n> fucking loud-ass goats 15:21 <@kanzure> http://defcad.org/ "Welcome to DEFCAD, operated by Defense Distributed. This site is a makeshift response to Makerbot Industries' decision to censor files uploaded in good faith at Thingiverse, specifically firearms-related files. We are hosting as many of the pulled files as we can find." 15:22 < chris_99> are they still trying to make an all-plastic gun 15:22 < yashgaroth> they never were 15:22 < chris_99> they said they where 15:22 < chris_99> a one shot thing 15:22 <@kanzure> i didn't realize how colorful they were trying to make their models.. wtf. 15:23 < eudoxia> 10bux he gets killed by the ATF 15:23 <@kanzure> the animated gifs saying "NEW" are extremely annoying http://defcad.org/browse/ 15:23 <@kanzure> i think these guys are either amateurs or idiots 15:24 <@kanzure> and by amateurs i don't mean the good kind 15:24 <@kanzure> and their "megapack" ad is clearly using an icon registered by some windows software company http://defcad.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/12/mp.png 15:24 < eudoxia> the browse page should look more like the main page 15:25 < eudoxia> with each item being a little square with an image and the name in it 15:25 <@kanzure> i'm a little disappointed 15:26 <@kanzure> i think there's room for someone to write a grant proposal to NRA to do a legit version of this (there's no way NRA would dump money on this as it is, because of their questionable beginning) 15:26 -!- Mariu [Jimmy98@89.41.57.33] has quit [Quit: leaving] 15:27 <@kanzure> ah they are in #defcad 15:27 < chris_99> i don't personally see the point of plastic weapons 15:27 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:27 < chris_99> is it just a way to make a gun without a license or something 15:28 < chris_99> since they're focussing on the reciever thing 15:28 < yashgaroth> we freedom-loving americans are allowed to manufacture firearms for personal use, as long as they meet legal restrictions 15:29 < chris_99> wow, didn't know that 15:29 <@kanzure> oops i forgot that nmz787 showed us that exact quote like a month ago 15:29 < yashgaroth> once you have a lower receiver, you can buy everything else off of amazon, minus magazines and ammunition 15:30 < ParahSail1n> " goats are unproblematic" 15:30 < chris_99> isn't having the receiver made out of plastic dangerous though, like what happens if it fails 15:30 <@kanzure> ParahSail1n: an understatement 15:30 < yashgaroth> chris_99 the gun just breaks in half, pretty much 15:31 < yashgaroth> it won't start shooting bullets back at you 15:31 < chris_99> aha 15:31 < ParahSail1n> in theory they are cellulose to protein conversion machines-- in practice, in a grass filled backyard, they will starve to death until i go out and set up a platform so they can reach the wisteria vines 15:32 <@kanzure> wait.. did you go and get a goat since the last time we were talking about it? 15:32 < ParahSail1n> i dunno, i bought them the first week of february 15:33 < ParahSail1n> https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/108592484668460515128/albums/5838517469299267185?q=album&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS520US520&aq=f&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&authkey=CITGk5Cfu5DdrQE 15:33 < ParahSail1n> its not hard to get a "90%" lower half of the receiver 15:33 < chris_99> theres a documentary on it http://www.vice.com/motherboard/click-print-gun-the-inside-story-of-the-3d-printed-gun-movement 15:33 -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-34.wireless.umd.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:33 < ParahSail1n> the printing thing is more of a proof of principle than anything 15:34 < ParahSail1n> 90% receiver = machined roughly in the shape, but not finished enough to be considered an ffl product, but you can drill a couple holes and its a gun 15:36 < ParahSail1n> im not familiar with ar, but im pretty sure the upper receiver is the one that holds the bolt, the lower is mostly a magazine well 15:36 < yashgaroth> magazine, trigger group, and the buffer 15:37 < ParahSail1n> 3d printed high cap magazines might be the killer app 15:37 < yashgaroth> they have those, but you need to buy springs because apparently plastic makes shitty springs 15:37 < ParahSail1n> yeah i imagine 15:38 < chris_99> yashgaroth, so _anyone_ could buy the parts other than the lower reciever without a licence?! 15:38 < ParahSail1n> springs are pretty universal 15:38 < yashgaroth> haha license 15:38 < ParahSail1n> yes, they call them ar-15 parts kits 15:38 < ParahSail1n> you can get parts kits for ak model rifles as well 15:39 < yashgaroth> need a pretty heavy-duty press to assemble an AK though 15:39 < ParahSail1n> press the barrel into the receiver? 15:39 < yashgaroth> mhm 15:39 < ParahSail1n> yeah i can imagine 15:40 < chris_99> that's insanely scary that anyone could buy that stuff 15:40 < chris_99> to me 15:41 < ParahSail1n> lol, find a friend to take you out shooting 15:41 < yashgaroth> he's gonna have to travel pretty far to do that 15:42 <@kanzure> you guys don't have shooting ranges? 15:42 -!- Mariu [Jimmy98@89.41.57.33] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:42 < ParahSail1n> eu? 15:42 <@kanzure> yeah 15:42 < chris_99> we have clay pigeon shooting 15:42 <@kanzure> what's that? 15:42 < yashgaroth> shotguns 15:42 < ParahSail1n> shotgun skeet 15:42 < chris_99> using shotguns to shoot spinning discs 15:42 < ParahSail1n> a proper aristocratic shooting sport 15:42 < chris_99> heh 15:43 <@kanzure> sounds lovely 15:45 < ParahSail1n> i could live without guns 15:45 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:46 < ParahSail1n> but im not gonna unilaterally disarm 15:47 < eudoxia> 15:30 < chris_99> isn't having the receiver made out of plastic dangerous though, like what happens if it fails 15:47 <@kanzure> you can pry my gene gun from my cold dead .. 15:47 < eudoxia> lol their latest fired 600 bullets without harm 15:47 <@kanzure> something something something 15:47 < eudoxia> without failing* 15:47 < eudoxia> i reiterate, they're gonna get killed by the ATF 15:47 < chris_99> ATF? 15:48 < jrayhawk> why would the ATF give a shit 15:48 < ParahSail1n> how many days does it take to squirt out what looks like at least 100 grams of plastic from a 3d printer 15:48 < eudoxia> the Bureau of Fun Things 15:48 < eudoxia> (alcohol, tobacco, firearms and explosives) 15:48 < ParahSail1n> i think they got a ff license from them 15:49 < eudoxia> they did 15:49 < eudoxia> i was surprised 15:49 < ParahSail1n> so i dont think the atf is gonna kill them 15:50 < jrayhawk> not that there's much point; nobody's going to pay extra for a crappier product 15:50 < ParahSail1n> probably the atf doesnt care about such a low throughput manufacturing method as plastic extrusion though a 1 mm apertude 15:50 < ParahSail1n> when there are people with cnc mills 15:51 < eudoxia> i don't know much but aren't these sort of files implementation-agnostic? 15:51 < eudoxia> i mean sure you could print them in thermoplastic 15:52 < jrayhawk> printing a mold for it would be fairly useful 15:55 -!- qu-bit [~shroedngr@unaffiliated/barriers] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:59 -!- willywompa [6bd9a086@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.217.160.134] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:00 < eudoxia> but you could also print them in metal, with a laser sintering machine 16:00 * eudoxia 's sister needed to use the computer making me afk for a while 16:02 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node111.19.251.72.1dial.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:02 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node111.19.251.72.1dial.com] has quit [Changing host] 16:02 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:06 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:07 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:09 -!- strangewarp [~C@c-67-176-51-26.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:10 -!- strangewarp [~C@c-67-176-51-26.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:10 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Client Quit] 16:12 < Zuben> lol 16:17 < Zuben> 3d printing ar15s is really a worry? lol 16:19 < chris_99> http://defcad.org/22-single-shot-firearm/ 16:19 < Zuben> you can make a rifle fire automatically with a shoestring 16:19 < Zuben> dear god we should all be wearing flip flops 16:19 < Zuben> for the chiddrens 16:20 < jrayhawk> I wonder how the ATF distinguishes between a shoestring and a trigger crank. 16:20 <@kanzure> Zuben: who are you 16:21 < Zuben> you'd think that a group of people supposably embracing technology wouldn't be so ready to fear its worst uses but imagine the best ways to utilize it 16:22 < Zuben> I am me 16:22 <@kanzure> who are you. 16:22 < Zuben> does one need a title to be here? 16:22 <@kanzure> i think i know who you are and i'm about to ban you 16:23 < Zuben> oh lol, wow, that's rich 16:23 < Zuben> ban the antagonist 16:23 <@kanzure> i didn't say you are an antagonist 16:23 < Zuben> that's the problem today with this system of self seggregation 16:24 < Zuben> any ideas differing from mainstream group thought is bad, and scary 16:24 <@kanzure> what the fuck dude? 16:24 < Zuben> you clearly don't know anything 16:25 <@kanzure> i'm just interested in knowing who you are. there is someone who has a similar username who i ban regularly. 16:25 < Zuben> there's another zuben? 16:25 < Zuben> jesus christ, fucking internet is full 16:26 < ThomasEgi> +1 Zuben . i want the days back when someone had to be able to read a modem manual to get online. would keep so many idiots out of the net 16:26 < Zuben> everywhere I go there's "someone like you" 16:27 < Zuben> wish it were true 16:27 <@kanzure> why are you here? 16:27 < Zuben> I keep missing the unlucky bastard 16:27 < chris_99> ThomasEgi, i'd be interested in knowing what you think of this http://www.amazing1.com/electromagnetic-emp-pulse-gun-gen-ii-assembled-or-instructions/ 16:27 < Zuben> a search for transhumanist irc leads to two locations that still exist, this ones higher on the list 16:28 <@kanzure> are you zimmeri? 16:28 < Zuben> never heard of him 16:30 < Zuben> irc paranoia is so strange, has anyone ever studied it? it seems so based in the autonomic systems 16:31 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:31 < ThomasEgi> chris_99, i have no experiences with building or operating marx generators. but it should be quite possible to knock out pretty much every consumer-grade electronic device with the right marx generator + antenna 16:32 < chris_99> heh intriguing, so you're saying it could actually damage the silicon somehow 16:32 < Zuben> pre-consicous feeling about people we can't agree or disagree on if we've ever met before 16:32 < Zuben> you know how ludicrous that would be in society if you went up to random strangers and told them you feel like they're an asshole and slapped them 16:33 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:33 < ThomasEgi> chris_99, the silicon relies on very small ammounts of dotation and a monocristaline structure. there are also tons of tiny aluminum traces in a chip. both can suffer significant damage from overvoltage, permamently damaging pn-transitions or unslations of gates. 16:34 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:34 < ThomasEgi> chris_99, many modern chips are so sensitive that you can't even touch them without potentially breaking them with a ESD discarge. 16:34 < chris_99> wow didn't realise it could do that, it says it can output 2 Gigawatts, which sounds a lot to me, but wouldn't know what to compare that too 16:34 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:34 < ThomasEgi> well it's only a short burst. but it's certainly enough to damage the delicate silicone structures 16:35 < ThomasEgi> they are made to operate on voltages as low as 0.7 something volt. 16:35 < ThomasEgi> and such a burst can easily catch on traces on the pcb or inside the chip, inducing hunrdets of volts 16:36 < ThomasEgi> you may want to read about EMI in general. 16:36 < ThomasEgi> i've seen computers beeing knocked out by smaller things. like having a big electromagnet switched off by a relais , about 1m next to it. 16:36 < ParahSail1n> those wood screws were not worth crap, stripped the last four of them 16:37 < ParahSail1n> is there a secret to getting wood screws that arent garbage? 16:37 < ThomasEgi> the sudden stop in current caused an electromagnetic burst, shutting down the computer. 16:37 < ThomasEgi> and that was just a cheap magnet 16:37 < ThomasEgi> ParahSail1n, wood screws? 16:37 < ThomasEgi> like in screws and nuts made from wood? 16:37 < ParahSail1n> for fastening wood 16:38 < ThomasEgi> spax 16:39 < ThomasEgi> nothing beats those 16:39 < ParahSail1n> off to shoplift 16:40 < ParahSail1n> get my money back for the garbage ones 16:40 <@fenn> deck screws with torx or square drive are an order of magnitude easier to use 16:41 <@fenn> they invented the cordless impact driver because phillips drive is designed to cam out under constant torque 16:41 < ThomasEgi> phillips screws suck. they are ok to screw together some plastic parts 16:42 <@fenn> it dates to the 1920's when factories didn't have good torque clutch on their assembly guns 16:42 < ThomasEgi> for serious business go with torx or hexnut 16:43 <@kanzure> ughhh "I'm currently at the PaleoFX Conference, and had the pleasure to listen to a biohacking roundtable with some of the world's top biohackers (pictured above, left to right, Dan Pardi, Josh Whiton, Jolly, Abel James Bascom, and Darryl Edwards)." 16:43 <@kanzure> what is this crap 16:43 < yashgaroth> heh 16:43 < ParahSail1n> josh whiton is goatee-joss whedon 16:44 <@kanzure> yashgaroth: you wanna be the world's top biohacker? 16:44 < rigel> "biohacking"? 16:44 < yashgaroth> biohacking now means, like, nutrition or some shit 16:44 <@kanzure> "i looked at nutrition labels and won a gold medal" 16:44 < rigel> AMERICA'S NEXT TOP BIOHACKER 16:44 < ParahSail1n> welcome to brand dilution 16:44 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:44 <@fenn> i blame dave asprey 16:45 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 16:45 <@kanzure> maybe i should start shamelessly marketing stuff like this 16:45 <@kanzure> because at least it would be me marketing it and possibly doing something useful with the attention 16:45 <@kanzure> but then i would hate myself because i would be busy marketing things 16:45 < yashgaroth> I blame the same people who decided 'hacker' now means 'person who does a thing pretty well' 16:46 < rigel> that was always its original meaning 16:46 < yashgaroth> not even 'finds new ways of using or modifying something'? 16:46 <@fenn> college grad with vc funding? 16:47 < rigel> what the fuck is wrong with people that there is a goddamn paleo diet conference 16:47 < jrayhawk> There's PaleoFX and the Ancestral Health Symposium. 16:47 < rigel> that is the thing that needs to be rooted out, burnt to the ground, and the earth salted after it 16:47 <@fenn> that's a very agrarian metaphor you chose 16:48 < yashgaroth> very gluten-centric 16:48 < eudoxia> hahaha 16:48 < rigel> i feel like buying a domain name 16:48 <@kanzure> blackhatbio.com 16:48 < rigel> tyrannyofgluten.com 16:48 <@kanzure> mine is cooler. 16:48 < rigel> incorrect 16:49 <@kanzure> i will compromise with glutenocalypse.com 16:49 <@kanzure> or grainocalypse i guess 16:50 < rigel> it could be pretty great to put together a parody paleo/gluten-free website 16:50 < rigel> and honestly, i really feel for RDs 16:50 < rigel> because they are constnatly confused with quacks 16:51 <@fenn> RD means what? 16:51 < rigel> though of course plenty of them are themselves quacks 16:51 < yashgaroth> registered dieticians? 16:51 < rigel> i believe so 16:51 <@kanzure> > A frend suggested I read Biopunk and I just got done with the chapter that 16:51 <@kanzure> > mentions you! I have been doubting whether I really should go to grad 16:51 < rigel> they are nutritionists 16:51 <@kanzure> > school all year long 16:51 <@kanzure> ha ha ha this guy is coming to me for grad school advice 16:51 <@kanzure> it's like asking a magic eight ball that always answers "HELL NO" 16:52 < rigel> the consequences of dropping out of grad school are different than the consequences of not going to grad school in the first place 16:53 <@kanzure> what does dropping out have to do with it? 16:53 <@kanzure> i never went to grad school, so i didn't drop out. 16:53 <@kanzure> can't drop out of what you didn't start! 16:57 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 16:59 -!- jmil [~jmil@hive76/member/jmil] has quit [Quit: jmil] 17:02 -!- EnLilaSko- [EnLilaSko@host-85-30-145-65.sydskane.nu] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:04 <@kanzure> http://bioblender.eu/ 17:04 < brownies> yes, going and then dropping out is more prestigious 17:05 <@kanzure> "BioBlender is a software package built on the open-source 3D modeling software Blender." 17:05 <@kanzure> "Biology works at nanoscale, with objects invisible to the human eye. With BioBlender it is possible to show some of the characters that populate our cells, based on scientific data and the highest standard of 3D manipulation. Scientists all over the world study proteins at atomic level and deposit information in the public repository Protein Data Bank, where each molecule is described as the list of its atoms and their 3D coordinates." 17:05 <@kanzure> hmm well if the output is the same (pdb files) then i figure this is probably better than bothering with nanoengineer (except for all the features bioblender seems to be missing) 17:06 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:06 <@kanzure> blender definitely has more 3d modeling tools compared to nanoengineer, although nanoengineer is much more focused on cad modeling rather than 3d modeling 17:06 <@kanzure> "Molecular Dynamics Simulation (Elaborate and optimize protein motion)" 17:06 <@kanzure> "Complex protein surface property visualizations (e.g. MLP and EP surface properties)" 17:06 <@kanzure> "BioBlender uses a few other free third-party softwares (PyMLP, APBS, etc), these softwares and their licences are included in the BioBlender package. For full functionality, BioBlender requires the installation of Python 2.6, and PyMol (Free or Licensed). " 17:06 <@kanzure> ... python2.6? 17:06 <@kanzure> paperbot: http://arxiv.org/abs/1009.4801 17:07 < paperbot> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/BioBlender%3A%20Fast%20and%20Efficient%20All%20Atom%20Morphing%20of%20Proteins%20Using%20Blender%20Game%20Engine.pdf 17:07 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:07 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r186-54-244-132.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:09 <@fenn> this visualization of (van der waals?) interaction is kinda neat http://bioblender.eu/wp-content/uploads/interact_near1.png 17:10 -!- EnLilaSko- [EnLilaSko@host-85-30-145-65.sydskane.nu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:41 < ParahSail1n> fenn, thats fastenating how square drive was invented first, then phillips drive came out later to cope with inferior driver equipment 17:46 < Lemminkainen> ParahSail1n torquing out doesn't necessarily denote inferior 17:48 < ParahSail1n> torque limiting drivers seems a better solution to overtightening 17:49 < Lemminkainen> aye, but lock washers are just as lovely 17:50 < ParahSail1n> it seems at this point there is no conceivable need for the phillips bit 17:52 < ParahSail1n> "Robertson had licensed the screw design to a maker in England, but the party that he was dealing with intentionally drove the company into bankruptcy and purchased the rights from the trustee, thus circumventing Robertson.[citation needed] He spent a small fortune buying back the rights. Subsequently, he refused to allow anyone to make the screws under license. When Henry Ford tried out the Robertson screws he found they saved conside 17:52 < ParahSail1n> rable time in Model T production, but when Robertson refused to license the screws to Ford, Ford realized that the supply of screws would not be guaranteed and chose to limit their use in production to Ford's Canadian division.[22][23][24] Robertson's refusal to license his screws prevented their widespread adoption in the United States, where the more widely licensed Phillips head has gained acceptance. The restriction of licensing of 17:52 < ParahSail1n> Robertson's internal-wrenching square may have sped the development of the internal-wrenching hexagon, although documentation of this is limited." 17:53 < ParahSail1n> what, licensing? why need to license a square? oh yeah, patents, always ruining everything 17:55 < Lemminkainen> ParahSail1n what's the timeline on that? because while Ford was still at his Woodward Ave location they had an in-house machine shop manually turning all their fasteners 17:55 < ParahSail1n> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robertson_screwdriver#Robertson 17:57 < Lemminkainen> thank you for accommodating my fractured attentions pan 18:20 -!- yorick [~yorick@oftn/member/yorick] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:37 -!- willywompa [6bd9a086@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.217.160.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 18:56 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:02 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Quit: arma3] 20:06 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:11 -!- klafka [~klafka@204.101.190.178] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 20:46 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node138.18.251.72.1dial.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:46 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node138.18.251.72.1dial.com] has quit [Changing host] 20:46 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:03 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:11 -!- Thorbinator [~Thorbinat@66-237-51-34.starstream.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:22 -!- lichen_ [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:24 -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:26 -!- lichen_ is now known as lichen 21:39 -!- Lemminkainen [uid2346@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-blbypxkwmcnswccy] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 22:08 -!- willywompa [6bd9a086@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.217.160.134] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:20 -!- strages_home [~strages@98.67.162.97] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:36 -!- strages_home [~strages@98.67.162.97] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:38 -!- strages_home [~strages@98.67.163.188] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:52 -!- willywompa [6bd9a086@gateway/web/freenode/ip.107.217.160.134] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 23:05 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:06 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has joined ##hplusroadmap 23:17 <@kanzure> http://www.cs.ox.ac.uk/chaste 23:17 <@kanzure> https://chaste.cs.ox.ac.uk/trac/wiki/GettingStarted 23:17 <@kanzure> paperbot: http://www.ploscompbiol.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.pcbi.1002970 23:17 < paperbot> error: HTTP 500 http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Chaste%3A%20An%20Open%20Source%20C%2B%2B%20Library%20for%20Computational%20Physiology%20and%20Biology.pdf 23:17 <@kanzure> "Cancer, Heart And Soft Tissue Environment — is an open source C++ library for the computational simulation of mathematical models developed for physiology and biology. Code development has been driven by two initial applications: cardiac electrophysiology and cancer development. A large number of cardiac electrophysiology studies have been enabled and performed, including high-performance computational investigations of defibrillation on ... 23:17 <@kanzure> ... realistic human cardiac geometries. New models for the initiation and growth of tumours have been developed. In particular, cell-based simulations have provided novel insight into the role of stem cells in the colorectal crypt." 23:17 <@kanzure> "mesh — code for linear or quadratic tetrahedral meshes and vertex meshes; nodes, elements, boundary properties; mesh generation; mesh distribution using METIS/parMETIS [22]; readers and writers for Triangle/TetGen [23], [24], Meshalyzer, Cmgui (http://www.cmiss.org/cmgui) and VTK (Paraview) [25] formats." 23:18 <@kanzure> "pde — code for defining elliptic and parabolic second-order PDEs; parallel finite element solvers of generic coupled systems of PDEs (using mesh and linalg)." 23:18 <@kanzure> "continuum mechanics — code for solving compressible and incompressible general non-linear elasticity problems." 23:18 < brownies> fancy 23:18 <@kanzure> now you too can run colorectal simulations 23:24 < brownies> i'd like to see the underlying PDE models 23:24 < brownies> i bet they're reasonably elegant 23:24 <@kanzure> hmmm to take the bet or to not take the bet 23:25 <@kanzure> https://chaste.cs.ox.ac.uk/trac/browser/trunk/pde/src/problem/AbstractLinearParabolicPdeSystemForCoupledOdeSystem.hpp 23:25 <@kanzure> "d/dt (u_i) = div (D(x) grad (u_i)) + f_i (x, u_0, ..., u_{p-1}, v_0, ..., v_{q-1}), i=0,...,p-1." 23:25 <@kanzure> could be worse 23:26 <@kanzure> oh look they even have tests of their testing system https://chaste.cs.ox.ac.uk/trac/browser/trunk/pde/test 23:27 < brownies> academic code that's actually well-architected? 23:27 < brownies> miracle of miracles 23:35 <@kanzure> that's disturbing. 23:36 <@kanzure> if academics were actually capable of writing usable code then something terrible might happen 23:38 < brownies> heh 23:41 -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:46 <@kanzure> http://epmv.scripps.edu/ "We have developed an open-source plug-in, embedded Python Molecular Viewer (ePMV), that runs molecular modeling software directly inside of professional 3D animation applications (hosts) to provide simultaneous access the capabilities of all of the systems. Uniting host and scientific algorithms into a single interface allows users from varied backgrounds to assemble professional quality visuals and to perform ... 23:46 <@kanzure> ... computational experiments with relative ease." 23:47 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@209.237.22.146] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 23:49 <@kanzure> "ePMV is free and the ePMV plugin currently supports: Cinema4D 11.5 12, 13, 14™ , Blender 2.49, 2.58 & 2.60, Autodesk Maya 2011, 2012, 2013™, Autodesk 3ds Max 2013™ With the help of developers like you, this list can easily extend to include Houdini, RealFlow, SoftImage XSI (PySoftimage), Modo, and many others.." 23:49 <@kanzure> not as helpful if you have to pay $20,000/seat to see your proteins 23:49 < brownies> better be some damned fascinating proteins 23:57 <@kanzure> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qHtp4ehseA 23:57 <@kanzure> .title 23:57 < yoleaux> ePMV Intro: molecular modeling in C4D. (4 min. introduction to the embedded Python Molecular Viewer) - YouTube --- Log closed Sun Mar 31 00:00:21 2013