--- Log opened Wed Apr 03 00:00:46 2013
00:10 < nmz787> paperbot: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0143816611003617
00:10 < paperbot> no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/High%20resolution%2C%20low%20cost%20laser%20lithography%20using%20a%20Blu-ray%20optical%20head%20assembly.pdf
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02:22 < archels> where are my genetic drugs, ##hplusroadmap. I demand to know
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08:54 < chris_99> does anyone have the link to that webpage on c. elegans regarding a simulation
08:54 < chris_99> got it :)
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09:33 < eleitl> messagebot: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1472-8206.2009.00692.x/pdf
09:33 < eleitl> paperbot: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1472-8206.2009.00692.x/pdf
09:33 < paperbot> no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/203bcb3403d6c4a911e781f1e54cdf24.txt
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09:36 < eleitl> paperbot: http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1472-8206.2009.00692.x/full
09:37 < paperbot> no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/7780a42bb48e5fc233274a50b8d7e821.txt
09:43 < eleitl> Can anyone here access http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1472-8206.2009.00692.x/full ?
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09:48 < eudoxia> kanzure, with skdb, did you intend to keep all package data exclusively as YAML files
09:48 < eudoxia> or did you consider having skdb load that information into an SQL database to speed up resolving dependencies (while at the same time keeping the original files)?
09:49 < eudoxia> (and updating the db when packages are changed/added, et cetera.)
09:49 < eudoxia> it just seems so slow to iterate over a list of file paths, open them, yaml.load() them, search them...
09:53 < sivoais> eleitl: yes, do you want it?
09:54 < sivoais> eleitl: <http://ge.tt/2ve4zxc/v/0>
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10:46 <@kanzure> eudoxia: are you seriously concerned about performance on something that doesn't even work?
10:47 < eudoxia> thinking ahead and stuff
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10:49 <@kanzure> eudoxia: how about you think about writing some code or something instead.
10:53 < eudoxia> fine i was just wondering if you had thought about it
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10:54 < eudoxia> i guess premature optimization really is that bad
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11:03 <@kanzure> "Disney Shuts Down LucasArts" wtf
11:04 < eudoxia> wait a second... it's not the 1st of april anymore...
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11:08 < klafka> ?
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11:14 < klafka> lol i love when ipython debugger shows you comments like
11:14 < klafka>     500         # XXX -- this is a Vile HACK!
11:19 <@kanzure> i like it when you press enter on a blank line in ipython but what it actualy does is some random command in your history
11:19 <@kanzure> when i say "like" what i really mean is "hate"
11:22 <@ParahSailin> ipython is the python repl or something else
11:23 <@kanzure> ipython is a python repl
11:23 <@kanzure> it is not the default python repl
11:23 < klafka> and i'm actually using ipython noteboo
11:23 < klafka> k
11:23 < klafka> which is really awesome
11:24 < klafka> it needs like maybe 1-2% more polish and it'll be amazing
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11:42 <@kanzure> i'm still not convinced about a web notebook. why not just use a repl?
11:46 < klafka> code is much more replicable
11:47 < klafka> right now i'm making a little comparison of various python performance enhancements and i can just distribute the notebook when i'm done
11:47 <@kanzure> "Starting salaries are around $35k. If you are working for a non-profit foundation (ie: cancer research), expect to earn $25k."
11:47 <@kanzure> haha science sucks
11:48 <@kanzure> klafka: can't you just save the ipython session (from the repl) and distribute that too? i don't see how that is unique.
11:48 < klafka> wow
11:48 < klafka> you can also convert it to pdf or latex
11:48 <@kanzure> dubious value :P
11:48 < klafka> ugh god more babies
11:54 <@kanzure> huh, we'll be losing iain banks?
11:54 <@kanzure> "As a result, I've withdrawn from all planned public engagements and I've asked my partner Adele if she will do me the honour of becoming my widow (sorry - but we find ghoulish humour helps)."
11:54 <@kanzure> http://www.littlebrown.co.uk/a-personal-statment-iain-banks.page
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11:58 < klafka> i saw that
11:58 < klafka> that sucks :(
11:58 < klafka> his books were a bit poppy but I enjoyed them a lot
12:02 < chris_99> the Wasp Factory was really good i thought, i haven't read his sci-fi stuff yet
12:03 < klafka> i don't remember too much of the wasp factory though i think i have it
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12:03 < chris_99> it's very dark
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12:24 < chris_99> anyone made a vacuum chamber out of interest
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12:49 <@kanzure> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWenQ3haUVY
12:50 <@kanzure> .title
12:50 < yoleaux> Error 502 (Server Error)!!1
12:50 <@kanzure> "Jesse Dylan Discusses DIY Science with DIYBio Co-Founder Mackenzie Cowell"
12:50 <@kanzure> "At Los Angeles's Biohackathon 2013"
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14:00 < Burninate> kanzure: is paperbot doing anything (turned on) in #lesswrong?
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14:07 <@ParahSailin> i thought you hated that place kanzure
14:07 < Burninate> he lubs to hate it
14:10 < Burninate> what's this channel been up to lately?
14:12 <@kanzure> Burninate: yes paperbot is active in that channel
14:12 <@kanzure> Burninate: this channel has been busy trying to convince people to actually do work
14:12 <@kanzure> today we are shaming eudoxia into writing some software.
14:13 < Burninate> messed up papermachine autocomplete earlier, but no big deal if it's there for a purpose
14:14  * Burninate , shamed at interrupting a four-day streak of Actually Doing Work, gets back to it
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14:19 <@kanzure> "Copy-on-write DOM. In Servo, the DOM is a versioned data structure that is shared between the content (JavaScript) task and the layout task, allowing layout to run even while scripts are reading and writing DOM nodes."
14:19 <@ParahSailin> servo is heroku something?
14:21 <@ParahSailin> nm i was thinking of some other similar sounding thing
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14:27 <@kanzure> servo is https://github.com/mozilla/servo
14:27 <@kanzure> https://github.com/mozilla/servo/wiki/Design
14:27 <@kanzure> "Servo is a research project to develop a new Web browser engine. Our goal is to create an architecture that takes advantage of parallelism at many levels while eliminating common sources of bugs and security vulnerabilities associated with incorrect memory management and data races."
14:28 <@kanzure> "Tiled rendering. We divide the screen into a grid of tiles and render each one in parallel. Tiling is needed for mobile performance regardless of its benefits for parallelism. Partially implemented."
14:29 <@kanzure> "Servo's DOM is a tree with versioned nodes that may be shared between a single writer and many readers. The DOM uses a copy-on-write strategy to allow the writer to modify the DOM in parallel with readers. The writer is always the content task and the readers are always layout tasks or subtasks thereof."
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15:18 < Burninate> http://scitechdaily.com/single-antibody-is-broadly-effective-against-a-variety-of-human-cancer-tumors/
15:20 <@ParahSailin> lemme guess, someone's gonna be granted a monopoly on it
15:31 <@kanzure> ah google is also making a new rendering engine
15:31 <@kanzure> https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/blink
15:32 <@kanzure> http://www.chromium.org/blink/developer-faq
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15:40 <@kanzure> haha rudiger just posted a set of slides proposing "inoculation of vagina from rectal bacteria"
15:40 <@kanzure> (to the diybio list)
15:41 <@ParahSailin> what
15:49 <@kanzure> something about conceptration
15:50 <@kanzure> oh it doesn't seem to be posted yet? weird, i guess his emails are manually reviewed by the mods.
15:52 <@kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/diybio/trojok-bacterial-contraception.pdf
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16:21 <@kanzure> ah he wants money from gates foundation to do that work (or continue it? it's not clear).
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16:33 < Lemminkainen> any ideas on where hardware development contract RFPs would be posted?
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17:33 <@kanzure> wtf "Projects like TinkerCell allow cellular biologists to design their own metabolic pathways and share them open-source with a community,"
17:33 <@kanzure> nobody has ever shown me something shared as a result of tinekrcell
17:33 <@kanzure> *tinkercell
17:33 <@kanzure> i think these guys are lying
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19:39 < ParahSail1n> anyone good with electronics who can explain why inverters for solar pv are so expensive?
19:42 <@fenn> if they're not true sine wave they aren't that expensive, unless you're talking about huge amounts of power, in which case most electronic things that deal with huge power flows are expensive
19:45 <@fenn> if true sine wave, they need a lot of filtering components because 60Hz is really slow and dumb
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19:45 < Lemminkainen> ParahSail1n build your own; replacing the inverters with some backwards mozzies and Schottky diodes works a charm
19:48 < ParahSail1n> fenn, and dealing with variable input voltage presumably adds difficulty?
19:50 <@fenn> not really, if it's only a factor of two or so
19:52 <@fenn> ideally the input voltage is slightly higher than the RMS AC voltage (so 140V or so i guess)
19:53 < ParahSail1n> yeah, seems like you use inductors to boost first
19:54 <@fenn> nah just make sure the panels are connected in series for the right voltage
19:54 < ParahSail1n> series is really bad for solar panels
19:54 < ParahSail1n> you lose quite a lot
19:54 <@fenn> huh?
19:55 <@fenn> voltage is easier to transmit than current, that's why power lines are high voltage
19:55 < ParahSail1n> lot of resistance, and if there's shade on one, itll really screw you
19:56 <@fenn> hm i'll admit i don't know what happens with partial shade
19:57 <@fenn> "Many modern panels, however, come equipped with devices called bypass diodes which minimise the effects of partial shading by essentially enabling electricity to ‘flow around’ the shaded cell or cells."
19:59 <@fenn> to answer your original question, it seems things get complicated when you have a lot of panels. and then there's a markup since it's not really a "consumer" item
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20:34 <@kanzure> http://sourceforge.net/projects/jedioutcast/
20:34 <@kanzure> http://sourceforge.net/projects/jediacademy/
20:40 <@kanzure> pdf table extraction things http://source.mozillaopennews.org/en-US/articles/introducing-tabula/
20:41 <@kanzure> https://github.com/jazzido/tabula
20:42 <@kanzure> "Caveat: Tabula only works on text-based PDFs, not scanned documents." well, nevermind.
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20:51 < Juul> kanzure, you're looking for OCR programs that accept PDFs?
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20:52 <@kanzure> Juul: it would be nice to have CRC data in a usable format instead of in scanned images.
20:52 < Juul> aha
20:52 <@kanzure> without paying to break into their online database or w/e
20:54 < Juul> i've never tried any open source OCR program that didn't kinda suck
20:56 < Juul> do any of you know of any organizations / grants / fellowships that would/could support a biohacking space or biohacking projects?
20:56 < yashgaroth> if you find any, let me know
20:57 < Juul> the awesome foundation :)
20:58 < yashgaroth> jojack hasn't really been able to find any such groups to sponsor our local space, but then again he hates everyone, which may be a factor
20:59 < yashgaroth> I do wonder what the crowdfunding exhaustion level is for diybio, really hope the seattle group isn't taking all the available cash
21:00 < Juul> the seattle group has been crowdfunding?
21:00 < yashgaroth> https://www.microryza.com/projects/seattle-biohacker-space
21:00 < Juul> ah
21:01 < Juul> hehe, i doubt $5000 will make a difference anywhere
21:01 < yashgaroth> that's a whole month of operating costs before they go broke
21:01 < yashgaroth> or one entire piece of equipment
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21:09 <@kanzure> gates foundation likes to shovel out money
21:09 <@kanzure> in $100k increments
21:14 < Juul> hm
21:14 < Juul> $5000 a month seems a bit high for monthly operating costs for a newly formed diybio group
21:15 < Juul> hehe, getting gates foundation to fund open science would be fun
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21:21 < yashgaroth> oh, I mean for a somewhat-established lab, and was also being a little facetious
21:23 <@kanzure> Juul: i think they would be open to it.
21:23 < Juul> yashgaroth,
21:23 < Juul> kanzure, ok, i'll look into it
21:24 <@kanzure> i haven't seen any attempts to get gates money for open source lab equipment
21:24 < yashgaroth> just tell them you'll do malaria research, bam instant millions
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21:32 < ParahSail1n> might be easier to convince them your developing birth control
21:33 < yashgaroth> for you see, we can grow the condoms on trees
21:33 < ParahSail1n> i dont always type you're as your, but when i do, its because wife is pestering me
22:19 <@kanzure> yashgaroth: weird thing is, i don't know anyone that actually hates jojack
22:19 < brownies> from what i've gathered, it's non-trivial to get money from the gates foundation?
22:19 < brownies> has your experience been different?
22:19 <@kanzure> a few friends wrote up grants and received money with minimal hastle
22:20 <@kanzure> ... compared to all the other terrible grant processes.
22:21 < brownies> interesting
22:21 < brownies> i guess they do have a lot of money to shovel out
22:22 <@kanzure> i dunno what requirements they attach to the funding though
22:23 <@kanzure> they might require partial ownership of intellectual property ?
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22:32 < brownies> nope
22:33 < brownies> they do make you agree to something along the lines of "you agree you will price your stuff such that it lines up with our mission of helping poor people"
22:33 < brownies> or something. they probably have a dozen different missions.
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22:39 < kanzure> oh that's nice.
22:40 < kanzure> then yes they would probably be interested in open source hardware things. or possibly hackerspace things.
22:40 < kanzure> "We want to setup a biohackerspace in the middle of Pakistan. Please wire all funds directly."
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23:12 < brownies> heh. they seem to be interested in more grandiose things, but i'm sure they could be convinced that buying a 3d printer and a lifetime supply of Ramen for some nerds somehow lines up with saving the poor
23:13 < kanzure> i think an "equipment costs too much" argument would be pretty easy to make.
23:13 < kanzure> then you could come up with some hand-waving about a hackerspace-run project
23:14 < kanzure> and then something about "even 30 year old technology would be acceptable, because blah blah blah, 30 years old (1980s) is better than nothing at all, blah blah blah".
23:15 < kanzure> perhaps including "blah" in a grant proposal is not a good idea
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--- Log closed Thu Apr 04 00:00:47 2013