--- Log opened Fri Apr 26 00:00:08 2013 00:04 <@kanzure> paperbot: http://arxiv.org/abs/1304.6780v1 00:04 <@kanzure> .title 00:04 < yoleaux> [1304.6780v1] Practices in source code sharing in astrophysics 00:04 < paperbot> http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/Practices%20in%20source%20code%20sharing%20in%20astrophysics.pdf 00:04 -!- strages_home [~strages@adsl-98-67-105-54.hsv.bellsouth.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:04 <@kanzure> oh right 00:06 -!- strages_1ome [~strages@98.67.161.107] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 00:22 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:23 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-24-6-18-31.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:28 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-24-6-18-31.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 00:35 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:36 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 01:20 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 01:44 < superkuh> paperbot: http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs11207-013-0286-8 01:44 < paperbot> error: HTTP 500 http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/441897c27f230ab55b0c48bc94fb1ab.txt 01:45 <@kanzure> why oh why is paperbot failing more often. 01:49 < ThomasEgi> paywalls getting higher? 01:52 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 02:02 < nmz787> i have access to that paper 02:03 < archels`> paperbot: http://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007%2Fs11207-013-0286-8.pdf 02:03 < paperbot> no translator available, raw dump: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/a53e1a93963beb41463895c6561ac517.txt 02:04 < nmz787> http://diyhpl.us/~nmz787/Chromospheric%20Sunspot%20Oscillations%20in%20H%ce%b1%20and%20Ca%20II%208542%20%c3%85.pdf 02:04 < nmz787> 2 - 3 min delay because this isn't automated/assisted in some way 02:04 < superkuh> Thank you. 02:05 < nmz787> kanzure: i'm just ssh-ing these over 02:05 < nmz787> kanzure: is there a way to do that via js? 02:06 < nmz787> or can you help me run an upload server and the accompanying bookmarklet to upload with? 02:06 <@kanzure> you can do an XHR HTTP PUT from javascript 02:07 <@kanzure> if you have a specific upload server in mind then i'll take a look at it to see if it's safe to run, sure.. 02:08 < nmz787> well like i said, currently i'm just scp-ing these paperbot failures to the same server paperbot is on 02:09 <@kanzure> simplest way would be to add some wsgi python application to your user account via .htaccess or something 02:09 < nmz787> so that's the target in this case 02:09 <@kanzure> and then tack on user authentication with a password or something 02:09 < nmz787> flask based? 02:09 <@kanzure> sure why not 02:10 < nmz787> or what is wsgi in your case? 02:10 <@kanzure> the vserver is serving up web pages with apache so it would involve mod_wsgi 02:11 <@kanzure> i am currently sleeping but i am sure that joey would love to be bugged to do apache things at 4am 02:11 < nmz787> 4am 02:11 < nmz787> psh 02:11 < nmz787> 2:11 02:12 < nmz787> if you lived here you'd have more time to program tonight 02:12 <@kanzure> nope i spend all of my midnight hours complaining about phantomjs 02:12 <@kanzure> it is a very strict schedule 02:12 <@kanzure> 12-1 is scheduled for complaining about callbacks 02:13 <@kanzure> 1-3am complaining about commonjs/require/assholes overriding require 02:13 <@kanzure> 4am is spent resolving existential crises brought about by javascrpt 02:13 <@kanzure> +i 02:14 < nmz787> well i actually did some physicalwork earlier so i am tired too, guess i have no reason to stay awake 02:15 < nmz787> oOps 02:15 < nmz787> can you apt-get install python-flask? 02:15 < nmz787> on gnusha 02:28 < nmz787> kanzure: beat ya by downloading the libs myself http://diyhpl.us:5000/ 03:03 -!- Viper168_ [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:04 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:05 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 03:30 -!- makoLime [~mako@103-9-42-48.flip.co.nz] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 03:51 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 03:56 -!- Zarakii [~devillll@ppp-46-244-176-131.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:58 -!- Suwap [~devillll@ppp-46-244-176-131.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 04:00 -!- strages_home [~strages@adsl-98-67-105-54.hsv.bellsouth.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 04:02 -!- strages_home [~strages@adsl-98-67-105-54.hsv.bellsouth.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:38 -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-27.wireless.umd.edu] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:20 -!- FooQuuxman [~arik@c-98-215-254-55.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:42 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 05:56 -!- lupfantomo [~lupfantom@24-159-24-229.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 06:01 -!- nsh [~nsh@obquire.infologie.co] has quit [Changing host] 06:01 -!- nsh [~nsh@wikipedia/nsh] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:08 -!- lupfantomo [~lupfantom@24-159-24-229.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:45 -!- ielo [~ielo@134.219.227.25] has joined ##hplusroadmap 07:27 < ParahSail1n> i wonder how much http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/761650376/Nanodrop_Spectrophotometer_wavelength_range_230nm_260nm.html is 07:39 -!- yorick [~yorick@oftn/member/yorick] has joined ##hplusroadmap 07:44 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@adsl-64-169-36-85.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:11 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:17 -!- kajetan [122@d30-138.icpnet.pl] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:43 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:43 -!- strages_home [~strages@adsl-98-67-105-54.hsv.bellsouth.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 09:01 -!- Gu_______ [~textual@pool-108-4-11-75.rcmdva.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:23 -!- ianmathwiz7 [~chatzilla@nat-portal-160-94-47-16.uofm.wireless.umn.edu] has joined ##hplusroadmap 10:01 < ParahSailin> wow, iontorrent did not give root on the proton one server 10:14 <@kanzure> those bastards 10:16 -!- ielo [~ielo@134.219.227.25] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds] 10:28 -!- cpopell [~cpopell@pool-96-231-37-73.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 10:35 <@kanzure> nmz787: lots of people do random port scanning of that server, so that needs to be really secure. 10:35 -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+o fenn] by kanzure 10:35 -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+o ParahSailin] by kanzure 10:36 -!- mode/##hplusroadmap [+o bkero] by kanzure 11:04 -!- 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##hplusroadmap 11:34 -!- FooQuuxman [~arik@c-98-215-254-55.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 11:35 -!- ianmathwiz7 [~chatzilla@nat-portal-160-94-47-16.uofm.wireless.umn.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:39 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@185.5.8.81] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:39 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@185.5.8.81] has quit [Changing host] 11:39 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has joined ##hplusroadmap 11:39 -!- bkero [~Ben@osuosl/staff/bkero] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 11:54 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:15 -!- makoLime [~mako@103-9-42-48.flip.co.nz] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:18 -!- marciogm [~textual@unaffiliated/marciogm] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:18 <@kanzure> extropy-chat mailing list archives going back to pre-2000 http://extropians.weidai.com/ 12:20 <@kanzure> hahah 12:20 <@kanzure> "10% of the book figuring out Tamara was a simulacra built out of Danlo's memories? I thought that guy proved theorems and shit? Holy shit, really, why couldn't Hanuman li Tosh be in this one too? He was the ONLY likeable character in the series! At least Nikolos Daru Ede doesn't put a pause in every sentence he says. Honestly, all that comes out of Danlo's mouth is "But, truly... To live, life itself... The shimmering interconn...ectedness. ... 12:20 <@kanzure> ... Yes?". Christ, is the cerebral callus getting in the way of the aneurysm again?" 12:20 <@kanzure> "I seriously hope Hanuman shows the fuck up in the last book or I'm back to Greg Egan." 12:24 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r190-134-13-90.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:24 < eudoxia> i'm glad you like my comedy kanzure 12:24 <@kanzure> anyway yes he shows up in the last book 12:25 < eudoxia> i know, i read it month ago :P 12:25 < eudoxia> i should update that part 12:25 <@kanzure> i was just remembering how much i hate most fiction and how disappointing it all is 12:26 <@kanzure> neverness has ftl which is inexcusable. 12:26 <@kanzure> and charlie stross is just trying to show off how many words he knows (or something) 12:27 <@kanzure> and somehow i ended up on your page. 12:29 <@fenn> pretty sure i read through all of neverness, but i barely remember any of it 12:30 <@kanzure> http://heybryan.org/docs/Zindell,%20David%20-%20Neverness%20(v1.0).txt 12:30 <@fenn> dunno if that says something about me or the book 12:31 <@kanzure> 6 or 7 years ago i realized that if i was going to get any reasonably good hard scifi in my lifetime that i would have to be the one to write it 12:31 <@kanzure> so i started squirreling away tiny fragments once in a while into an archive 12:32 < eudoxia> ohhh i'd like to read that 12:32 < eudoxia> was it version controlled? 12:32 <@kanzure> i dunno why zindell did all that stuff about ftl.. there's a lot of room for story with relativistic travel.. 12:33 <@kanzure> no, it's just a place i dump text files into. i haven't actually looked at the collection. 12:33 <@kanzure> or edited anything ever 12:34 <@fenn> the problem with relativistic space travel is all the trips are one-way 12:34 <@kanzure> huh? 12:34 <@fenn> (the problem with non-relativistic space travel is it's equivalent to time travel) 12:35 <@kanzure> how are they one-way? you send your software there, then you can send it back. what's the big fucking deal. 12:35 <@fenn> consider you blast off to a star 1000 light years away at 99% of the speed of light; it takes you 10 perceived years to get there, and 10 years to get back, but 2000 years have passed in the meanwhile 12:35 <@kanzure> yep. 12:36 <@fenn> so much has changed in the time since you left that what you come back to is as different as the destination was compared to where you started 12:36 <@kanzure> how is that a problem? 12:36 <@fenn> nobody knows how to think that way 12:36 <@kanzure> i think authors are just lazy 12:37 < eudoxia> yeah fenn if everyone you know and love died or moved away you should just lump it 12:37 <@kanzure> what? 12:37 <@fenn> "lump it"? 12:37 < ThomasEgi> fenn, and your spacecraft woud have 9 times the mass compared to when it is not moving 12:37 < eudoxia> >To endure, accept, put up with a situation one does not like. 12:38 <@fenn> and your front would be longer than your side, but who cares 12:38 <@fenn> or was it the other way around 12:39 <@kanzure> also the authors could tie in longevity to get around the "no familiar characters" problem. 12:40 <@kanzure> or cryonics. 12:41 <@kanzure> or clones, ancestors, emulated copies, and all manner of other tricks. again, authors are lazy. 12:41 -!- eudoxia_ [~eudoxia@r186-55-195-35.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:41 <@fenn> but a world in which people are still recognizable after 2000 years wouldn't be that interesting 12:42 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r190-134-13-90.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 12:42 <@fenn> everyone would be sitting around frozen in tanks of liquid nitrogen, or side-effect free S expressions or whatever 12:42 < eudoxia_> haha 12:43 <@kanzure> "wouldn't be that interesting" isn't true.. there are many ways to tie in those elements in clever ways i think. 12:44 <@kanzure> to be fair there are many uninteresting things in current stories, i think they could be done better heh 12:47 <@fenn> i guess arthur clarke wrote about relativistic space travel 12:48 <@kanzure> i don't often see stories that use relativistic space travel plus brain emulation, or forked copies of individuals, or longevity, or cryonics. i mean, there's a lot of fodder for scifi that has gone unused. 12:49 <@fenn> hm. cryonics for space travel is so common it's cliche 12:49 <@fenn> space travel + brain emulation is rare though, i'll grant you that 12:49 <@kanzure> but isn't space travel plus emulation obvious? 12:49 < eudoxia_> not hard sci fi cryonics 12:50 <@kanzure> eudoxia_: ? 12:50 <@fenn> it's not obvious, it just may be the only thing that would work though 12:51 <@kanzure> saurik: do you have a rom dump of google glass yet? and if so can i have a look? 12:52 <@kanzure> http://cache.saurik.com/tinyimg/glassbroke.jpg 12:53 <@kanzure> fenn: i've also been disappointed in "biopunk". none of these authors seem to be molecular biologists. their "hard scifi biology" is pretty bonkers. 12:54 <@kanzure> greg's white knight concept was fun i think 12:54 <@fenn> yeah egan is the only one who gets it right on both counts 12:54 <@kanzure> "Google Glass runs Android 4.0.4, which is subject to the adb restore race condition; com.google.glass.logging fits the needed configuration." 12:54 <@kanzure> oh i see. 12:55 <@kanzure> well it's nice that it's android, but i was expecting it to be more challening to break. 12:55 <@kanzure> *challenging 12:57 <@fenn> oh look "science fiction stories with good astronomy and physics" http://astrosociety.org/edu/resources/scifi06.html 12:57 < eudoxia_> kanzure: cryonics with a bunch of technical details/discussion of difficulties 12:58 <@kanzure> eudoxia_: i haven't seen that in fiction yet 12:58 < eudoxia_> neither have i 12:58 <@kanzure> nobody seems to read fahy or ben best or whatever. that would seem to be a necessary first step to writing good cryonics fiction. 12:59 <@fenn> usually they just assume "it's just like bears hibernating" and leave it at that 12:59 <@fenn> could a human hibernate 1000 years? 12:59 -!- ParahSailin [~Rob@50-194-178-148-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 13:01 <@fenn> seeds can be dormant for that long, no problem 13:02 -!- ParahSailin [~Rob@50-194-178-148-static.hfc.comcastbusiness.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:03 -!- wizrobe [~userdi@c-76-23-254-105.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has left ##hplusroadmap [] 13:05 -!- FooQuuxman [~arik@c-98-215-254-55.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:10 <@fenn> "Vitrification in cryonics is different than vitrification in mainstream cryobiology because vitrification in cryonics is not reversible with current technology." does that mean that "mainstream" vitrification is reversible? 13:15 < saurik> kanzure: yeah, its just Android with a custom launcher/home thingee 13:16 < saurik> http://test.saurik.com/kanzure/IMG_0144.JPG 13:18 <@kanzure> fenn: i'm pretty sure you still move around during hibernation. 13:18 <@kanzure> fenn: having never hibernated, i am not entirely sure. 13:19 <@kanzure> saurik: so there's a specific google glass apk that i could possibly poke at? 13:20 -!- marciogm [~textual@unaffiliated/marciogm] has quit [Quit: Computer has gone to sleep.] 13:20 <@kanzure> saurik: btw there should be a way to get a screenshot off of /dev somewhere.. i used to use "adb -d pull /dev/graphics/fb0 fb0" all the time. 13:20 <@kanzure> erm.. -d because i was using an emulator in that case. 13:20 <@kanzure> then you have to reformat the file: ffmpeg -vframes 1 -vcodec rawvideo -f rawvideo -pix_fmt rgb32 -s 480x800 -i fb0 -f image2 -vcodec png $outputpng 13:20 <@kanzure> or whatever the resolution is (480x800 is probably wrong) 13:21 <@fenn> Why this effect works is a matter of dispute, but it is known that static electric fields enhance ice nucleation  so perhaps oscillating electric fields have the opposite effect. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cells_Alive_System 13:22 < ParahSailin> when they vitrify cell lines or sperm, its reversible 13:22 <@fenn> i always figured "stasis field" was just pure poppycock technobabble 13:23 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:25 <@fenn> something like the "cells alive system" would make cryo preservation super cheap; no need for a team of surgeons to drill holes in your skull 13:26 <@fenn> and not needing high concentrations of chemicals should reduce the challenge of reanimation 13:26 < eudoxia_> but you'd need to keep it powered constantly 13:26 <@fenn> no, once you're frozen you're frozen 13:26 < eudoxia_> i think 13:26 < eudoxia_> right, right, past T_g 13:27 -!- eudoxia_ [~eudoxia@r186-55-195-35.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: leaving] 13:31 <@fenn> "ABI’s “Cells Alive System” (CAS) vibrates water with magnetic fields, preventing freezing, even at supercool temperatures of -10 degrees Celsius (According to the Patent.) When the field is turned off, the water in the food instantly freezes." 13:37 -!- bkero [~Ben@osuosl/staff/bkero] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:39 <@fenn> i'd think something similar could be done with immense hydrostatic pressure; the phase diagram for water is pretty complicated http://www.lsbu.ac.uk/water/phase.html#intr2 13:40 <@fenn> raise pressure to 200MPa, lower temperature to -20C, lower pressure to 0 13:41 <@fenn> 200MPa is quite achievable 13:45 -!- randallagordon [~randall@75-164-208-103.ptld.qwest.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:46 <@fenn> ah i guess i'm not the first person to have thought of this http://www.benbest.com/cryonics/pressure.html 13:46 <@kanzure> ahem i explicitly said something about reading ben best things heh 13:48 <@fenn> come on who wants to read about phase diagrams, where's the space aliens and lazers 13:53 <@fenn> it's surprising that additions to the phase diagram have been made as recently as 2002, i thought all that stuff was figured out in the 50's 14:00 < jrayhawk> a 200MPa swing seems a bit unhealthy for tissues 14:01 < jrayhawk> though i suppose density is probably a good idea anyway since the expansion from Ih ice would also be bad for tissues 14:02 < jrayhawk> s/density/pressure 14:04 < jrayhawk> i suppose humans at least can survive pressurization just fine, it's depressurization that causes problems, so just compress further into III and V to get the rapid freezing effect 14:05 <@fenn> high pressures drive organic condensation reactions equilibrium toward polymerization 14:07 <@fenn> i guess i'd be worried about cracking bones because of the relative expansion difference 14:09 <@fenn> how come nasa isn't doing this stuff 14:10 < jrayhawk> 1044 feet: world record for deepest scuba dive 14:10 <@fenn> i read 548 meters (50bar) but not very impressive 14:10 < jrayhawk> jeepers 14:10 <@fenn> so i guess the liquid air stuff in abyss isn't really used 14:11 <@fenn> oxygenated perfluorocarbons 14:15 -!- industromatic [~chatzilla@cpe-70-113-67-117.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Iceweasel 10.0.12/20130108232239]] 14:15 -!- ParahSail1n [~pwang@unaffiliated/parahsailin] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:16 -!- SDr [~ask@unaffiliated/sdr] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 14:16 -!- ParahSail1n [~pwang@unaffiliated/parahsailin] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:16 -!- SDr [~ask@unaffiliated/sdr] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:41 -!- randallagordon [~randall@75-164-208-103.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 14:42 -!- randallagordon [~randall@75-164-206-171.ptld.qwest.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:46 < ParahSailin> ok i got shell access to the iontorrent box 14:46 < ParahSailin> kanzure: you got any rootkit advice? 15:03 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:07 -!- TheEmpath [~12dCode@unaffiliated/theempath] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:09 -!- sdoowpilihp [~Adium@pool-96-251-88-55.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:19 <@kanzure> ParahSailin: uname -a 15:29 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:35 <@fenn> paperbot: https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/tjsrae/26/4/26_4_371/_pdf 15:35 < paperbot> error: HTTP 500 http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/paperbot/d342b279e3522a3ac91e3fa3820813f.txt 15:36 <@kanzure> heh japanese javascript 15:37 <@fenn> this paper is probably misleading anyway 15:37 <@kanzure>
15:37 <@fenn> "In this study, the effect of weak magnetic field (about 0.0005 T) on freezing process of several kinds of foods was investigated by using a specially designed freezer facilitated with magnetic field generator. " 15:37 <@fenn> but the patent says "fields of between 1 and 20000 G" which is like 2T 15:39 -!- augur [~augur@129-2-129-27.wireless.umd.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 15:46 -!- ielo [~ielo@cpc9-addl4-2-0-cust229.6-3.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 15:56 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 15:56 -!- klafka_ [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:00 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:00 -!- klafka_ [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:01 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 16:02 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:05 -!- klafka [~klafka@204-16-157-18-static.ipnetworksinc.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:12 < ParahSail1n> some crazy eastern european gave a talk at a sens conference once about using magnets in cryonics 16:21 -!- sdoowpilihp [~Adium@pool-96-251-88-55.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net] has left ##hplusroadmap [] 16:21 -!- EnLilaSko [EnLilaSko@unaffiliated/enlilasko] has quit [Quit: - nbs-irc 2.39 - www.nbs-irc.net -] 16:33 -!- cpopell [~cpopell@pool-96-231-37-73.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:35 -!- yorick [~yorick@oftn/member/yorick] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 16:35 -!- randallagordon [~randall@75-164-206-171.ptld.qwest.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 16:36 -!- randallagordon [~randall@75-175-54-32.ptld.qwest.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:36 < chris_99> what for ParahSail1n? 16:37 < ParahSail1n> cooling through a quantum physical chemistry effect 16:37 < chris_99> oh is it the magnetocaloric effect 16:38 < ParahSail1n> yeah 16:38 < chris_99> that sounds really interesting 16:38 < ParahSail1n> you need crazy teslas to do that 16:38 < ParahSail1n> 1 T per .1 C 16:38 < chris_99> heh, so not esp. practical 16:39 < chris_99> don't you need a rare-ish metal too 16:39 < ParahSail1n> you need a superconducting magnet of some sort 16:39 < chris_99> according to wiki they use a Gadolinium alloy in the field 16:40 < chris_99> whatever that is 16:40 < ParahSail1n> magnetocaloric effect is only really useful for going super cryogenic temperatures, like below he bp 16:40 < ParahSail1n> because .1 C is a lot bigger if you're at 4K 16:44 <@fenn> the idea is just to prevent ice crystals from forming while you supercool the sample 16:59 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 17:03 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 17:16 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-24-6-18-31.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:21 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-24-6-18-31.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds] 17:44 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:45 -!- aristarchus [~aristarch@unaffiliated/aristarchus] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:49 -!- Juul [~Juul@50-0-83-116.dsl.static.sonic.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:54 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffff@cpe-66-27-118-94.san.res.rr.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:59 -!- ThomasEgi [~thomas@panda3d/ThomasEgi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 18:09 -!- TheEmpath [~12dCode@unaffiliated/theempath] has left ##hplusroadmap [] 18:20 -!- Zarakii [~devillll@ppp-46-244-167-46.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:23 -!- Suwap [~devillll@ppp-46-244-167-46.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 18:58 < nmz787> ParahSail1n: I'd think the japanese nanodrop ripoff would be better than a chinese ripoff 19:05 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has joined ##hplusroadmap 19:06 -!- augur_ [~augur@208.58.5.87] has joined ##hplusroadmap 19:06 -!- augur [~augur@208.58.5.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:11 < ParahSail1n> nmz787, i dunno 19:12 < ParahSail1n> where's the jp one? 19:13 < nmz787> http://www.malcom.co.jp/eng/product/es-2.html 19:13 < nmz787> the jap one says it can do a full UV Vis spec 19:13 < nmz787> while that chinese one only specifies 260 280 and i think one other 19:13 < ParahSail1n> any idea on price? 19:14 < nmz787> though it says it uses a xenon flash 19:14 < nmz787> so i imagine the chinese one is simply using filters and photodiodes 19:14 < nmz787> rather than a grating and linear/2d array 19:15 < nmz787> no idea, i emailed them twice with no response 19:15 < nmz787> 10/2011 and 7/2012 with no response 19:19 < ParahSail1n> no good at all if you can't buy it 19:22 < nmz787> i've had some no reply alibaba inquiries too 19:22 < nmz787> i imagine they don't respond due to IP/licensing 19:23 < ParahSail1n> ill keep you posted on this guanzhou outfit 19:43 <@kanzure> http://brlcad.org/~starseeker/CAD_MODELS/OpenSourceEcology/ 19:45 < Juul> kanzure, what's that? 19:45 <@kanzure> opensourceecology's worst nightmare... technical documentation about their projects. in particular some cad files. 19:45 < Juul> wut! 19:46 < Juul> i'm part of a group who've been trying to build the CEB press 19:46 <@kanzure> YEP applying some of that "evil computer magic" 19:46 < Juul> who did this? 19:46 < Juul> i am familiar with the suck that is OSE documentation 19:46 <@kanzure> US STRATCOM did this or something 19:46 <@kanzure> starseeker is part of the US military.. dunno where he's stationed. 19:47 <@kanzure> yeah i just wish i could convince OSE to seriously invest in CAD, file formats, and not "endless pages of wiki text"... 19:47 < Juul> we've found several bugs in their documentation so far 19:47 < Juul> and apparently the entire crew ragequit 19:48 < nmz787> he's done some tanks it looks like 19:48 <@kanzure> did you see the conversation with matt maier the other week? 19:48 < Juul> kanzure, no 19:48 < nmz787> and has got the ISS there 19:48 <@kanzure> Juul: http://gnusha.org/logs/2013-03-26.log 19:49 <@kanzure> Juul: check out some of the text near "On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 11:50 PM, Matt Maier wrote" 19:49 <@kanzure> basically they admitted that they have no plans whatsoever and that they have no engineering process.. 19:50 < Juul> yeah, that's what we've gathered after reading through the mailing list trying to find a consistent set of documentation 19:51 <@kanzure> because fuck engineering, i guess 19:51 <@kanzure> or.. something.. 19:52 < nmz787> kanzure: what is this http://brlcad.org/~starseeker/opennurbs/ 19:53 < nmz787> hmm 19:53 < nmz787> http://brlcad.org/~starseeker/vol2/book/tutorial_series/ 19:53 < ParahSail1n> trying to build a CEB press eh? 19:54 < ParahSail1n> their documentation is really that bad? 19:55 <@kanzure> nmz787: opennurbs is a library from rhino. brlcad uses opennurbs in a number of places in their infrastructure. 19:55 <@kanzure> nmz787: opennurbs has two versions. one is open source and freely licensed, but it has a number of important functions and algorithms disabled. the other is a commercial license. 19:55 <@kanzure> s/disabled/missing 19:56 < Juul> it's scattered and there buggy, but the worst part is that there are several versions of the documentation and each version is only available in some formats, some of it is available as technical drawings but the newest version is only in an STL version, and it's never clear which version you're looking at or what is the newest "stable" version 19:57 <@kanzure> is there a development repository? 19:58 <@kanzure> also, jonathan cline just posted a good overview of tecan's security measures: 19:58 <@kanzure> "Tecan's software on Windows passes an authentication key to the robot hardware in order to allow 3rd party software to send the robot commands. Otherwise, only Tecan's own software can send the robot any commands. [*But see Note below] If the Windows box does not have the authentication key, then the Tecan software doesn't allow 3rd party software any method to send commands to the robot. Tecan does this to enforce royalties or ... 19:58 <@kanzure> ... licensing or other typical biz practices. The hardware isn't really "open" unless you buy the key [*But see Note below]." 19:58 <@kanzure> "Without the dongle, it was possible to run Tecan's own version of Gemini (PC software) to control the Genesis Robot. Other LIMS system software is 3rd party though, so might require the dongle. Maybe for the Freedom, Tecan tightened up the controls." 19:58 <@kanzure> "Certainly with the newer USB robots (no longer serial bus controlled), the robot makers are keeping the communications under tighter control. I approached a couple companies as a 3rd party developer and they immediately requested signing NDA before any details of their robot would be provided. Part of the NDA restricted any open source release of info, too. They're trying to protect their turf more than in the past. (Cavro became ad ... 19:58 <@kanzure> ... hoc industry standard for a while, so details were much more was open, and also the devices were simpler/dumber, so command formats were also simple.)" 19:58 <@kanzure> "[*Note] - it is possible to send commands directly to some of Tecan's robots by using raw serial or CAN bus protocol. The commands are documented in my open source Bio Robotics software (free for the taking). This requires some low level computer knowledge. For example, a USB-to-serial or USB-to-CAN bus converter could drive the robot directly from any host, if the correct communications protocol is used (simple header for device ... 19:58 <@kanzure> ... address, etc, if I remember right)." 19:58 <@kanzure> "The cost of the key is something around $3000 +/- or at least that was the price when I saw a purchase order for one." 20:00 < nmz787> well the price of an FTDI cable is <$20 20:01 < nmz787> an can do USB to SPI, prob CAN too 20:01 < Juul> there seems to be no official repository for OSE, just a wiki with uploaded files 20:02 <@kanzure> i wish OSE took itself more seriously :| 20:03 <@kanzure> hey what was that biofab announcement the other day 20:06 -!- aristarchus [~aristarch@unaffiliated/aristarchus] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:06 < Juul> i don't know man, i haven't talked to drew for a while 20:06 < Juul> i think he's been redefining what biofab is 20:07 < ParahSail1n> the optimist would hope that maybe the ose people are just too busy building stuff to upload schematics 20:07 <@kanzure> according to http://gnusha.org/logs/2013-03-26.log they don't even believe in schematics 20:07 < Juul> from what i've heard there are no-one on-site building anything now 20:11 < ParahSail1n> nmz787, guangzhou lab outfit replied 20:12 <@kanzure> ParahSail1n: can you hook us up with cheap chinese lab equipment 20:12 < ParahSail1n> they said they cannot sell to the us, but i have family in guangzhou 20:12 <@kanzure> i haven't seen anyone talking about how cheap the chinese can go on their science trash 20:12 < ParahSail1n> in my response i said i was based in sg 20:13 < ParahSail1n> that shop has thermocyclers too 20:14 < ParahSail1n> theres absolutely no way i would do wetlab work without nanodrop 20:15 -!- Juul [~Juul@50-0-83-116.dsl.static.sonic.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 20:22 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@adsl-64-169-36-85.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20:22 < ParahSail1n> the nano is 6k 20:26 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Quit: the neuronal action potential is an electrical manipulation of reversible abrupt phase changes in the lipid bilayer] 20:28 -!- wizrobe [~userdi@c-76-23-254-105.hsd1.ct.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:29 -!- FooQuuxman [~arik@c-98-215-254-55.hsd1.il.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20:29 < ParahSail1n> not cheap, but significant discount from the fisher one 20:30 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:30 -!- klafka [~klafka@c-67-174-253-229.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:33 < ParahSail1n> gradient thermocyclers 1800 and 2500 20:43 < ParahSail1n> i bet it wouldnt be that hard to resell these nanodrops 21:15 <@kanzure> i think fisher nanodrop is 20k 21:20 < ParahSail1n> it seems like its 10k 21:20 < ParahSail1n> im just at least jmil will be needing one 21:20 < ParahSail1n> s/just/sure 21:21 <@kanzure> yeah isn't now about the time when jmil is drafting his nih career grant thing for buying up lab equipment? 21:21 <@kanzure> maybe we should start suggesting toys for him 21:21 < ParahSail1n> i bet i could sell 10 of them at the brc, rice, baylor, and md anderson 21:22 <@kanzure> do you want to? 21:22 < ParahSail1n> its a prospect i will look into 21:23 < ParahSail1n> i think for what that sort of spec does, it would be hard to open source make that for much less than 6k 21:24 <@kanzure> open source doesn't have to be cheaper, unless you're trying to get people to buy it 21:24 < ParahSail1n> ill for sure do an order of the nanospec, thermocycler, shakers, and analytical balance 21:25 < ParahSail1n> less sure about resale 21:27 < ParahSail1n> the "lite" version that a&e sells might also be one that labs would buy 21:41 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffff@cpe-66-27-118-94.san.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 21:58 <@kanzure> "The key used with the older Tecan's are the typical old-school "parallel port security dongle" which has a serial number or something similar, which matches the hardware. In the simplest cases the dongle internally is just a set of jumpers which hardwires the parallel port IO's to a fixed value (tied to vcc or gnd). Or it could be an EPROM. A hacker here emailed me the dump and instructions for the Tecan dongle a while back and reportedly ... 21:58 <@kanzure> ... got a clone working. These parallel hardware-dongle keys used to be pretty common for different types of server software. Nowadays companies use USB dongles for software-license-control, these are a bit more involved crypto-wise yet still pretty simple and I'm sure there are cloners out there. (Cloners or crackers are not appropriate for a commercial installation though.)" 21:59 <@kanzure> "When the dongle is installed, Tecan windows software allows 3rd party software to pass commands through a windows shared pipe (filename \\.\\pipe or similar) -- this is in my source code. If the dongle is not installed, this windows pipe doesn't exist, so the user is stuck -- unless customized (but not difficult) hardware is used to pass the serial commands directly to the hardware, without Tecan in the middle. For example, the typical ... 21:59 <@kanzure> ... Bio guy writes MS Visual Basic (yuck!) which writes commands through Tecan's command pipe, to the robot." 21:59 <@kanzure> "So, the dongle is required if using Tecan software in an out-of-the-box configuration with 3rd party software like mine, where Tecan windows software requires being the "man in the middle" for all the robot commands." 21:59 <@kanzure> "The better method is to send the commands directly to the robot with a USB-to-serial device. For my Perl Robotics::Tecan software to work with such a setup, it would be a straightforward change to write to the correct device and prepend the comm byte header. (Or similar.) This isn't implemented right now though since I always used a PC with the dongle, and most labs do too." 22:10 -!- lichen [~lichen@c-24-21-206-64.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 22:19 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node164.19.251.72.1dial.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:19 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@node164.19.251.72.1dial.com] has quit [Changing host] 22:19 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:23 -!- OldCoder_ [~OldCoder_@c-67-188-115-249.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:49 < brownies> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ym2L1urOz8&feature=youtu.be&t=10s 23:12 <@kanzure> .title 23:12 < yoleaux> Simpsons - grad students - YouTube 23:21 < rigel> god dammit 23:21 < rigel> there are so many fucking books i need to read 23:21 < rigel> i need to figure out how to get paid for this shit 23:28 <@kanzure> you could always sell your soul and go work for drchrono 23:39 < rigel> who what 23:40 <@kanzure> random emr outfit 23:41 < rigel> oh. i actually know someone who works there 23:41 < rigel> i think 23:41 <@kanzure> there's a lot of them. but it seems a hard space because docs aren't always pro-computer anyway. 23:42 < rigel> yeah 23:42 < rigel> we are going to have 20 years of docs accustomed to Epic now, before we have any FOSS stuff in that space i think 23:42 < rigel> though maybe the VA's OSEHRA program will change that earlier 23:43 < rigel> Epic is a gigantic turd on a stick 23:43 < rigel> a lot of people are going to die because we decided we wanted to give a subsidy to the AMA and proprietary software for recordkeeping 23:43 <@kanzure> yep 23:44 < rigel> sacrifices to the gods of the Free Market --- Log closed Sat Apr 27 00:00:09 2013