--- Log opened Fri Jan 30 00:00:39 2015 00:15 -!- xrr [~xrr@gprs-inet-183-27.elisa.ee] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:31 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:40 < cntrational> recently i've been starting to get more inclined to the idea that capitalism may be efficient, but it decreases overall human happiness 00:44 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@109.179.2.4.tmi.telenormobil.no] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:45 -!- TheBlight [~TheBlight@gatekeeper.bbp.ch] has joined ##hplusroadmap 00:47 -!- phm4242 [~o@boole.london.hackspace.org.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:52 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.vic.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 00:52 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@109.179.2.4.tmi.telenormobil.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 00:58 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 00:59 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has joined ##hplusroadmap 01:05 -!- 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connection] 03:03 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:10 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:13 -!- TheBlight [~TheBlight@gatekeeper.bbp.ch] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 03:19 -!- QuadIngi [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:19 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 03:24 -!- xrr [~xrr@gprs-inet-183-27.elisa.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 03:38 -!- TheBlight [~TheBlight@gatekeeper.bbp.ch] has joined ##hplusroadmap 03:45 -!- QuadIngi [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 03:49 < nsh> it certainly decreases the happiness of overalls 03:50 < nsh> the industrial revolution was not good for overall quality of life 03:50 < nsh> oil, rips, tears, chemical spills 03:50 < nsh> nasty, brutish and machine-washed 04:00 -!- xrr [~xrr@gprs-inet-183-27.elisa.ee] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:11 < maaku> kanzure: sorry was afk at that point 04:12 < maaku> cntrational: congratulations. recognizing that efficient is not necessarily the same as utility maximizing is the first step 04:13 < maaku> (towards insanity as you realize just how fucked up and self-destroying the world is) 04:30 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-115-47.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:39 -!- TheBlight [~TheBlight@gatekeeper.bbp.ch] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com] 04:41 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has quit [Quit: bedtime] 04:55 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:58 -!- superkuh [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 04:58 -!- superkuh_ [~superkuh@c-174-53-145-10.hsd1.wi.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 04:58 -!- superkuh_ [~superkuh@c-174-53-145-10.hsd1.wi.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host] 04:58 -!- superkuh_ [~superkuh@unaffiliated/superkuh] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:02 -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:02 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 05:04 -!- superkuh_ is now known as superkuh 05:07 < archels> nsh, sounds very Luddite 05:10 < maaku> only if you're the kind of person that gives up in the face of adversary 05:11 -!- QuadIngi [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:14 -!- FourFire [~FourFire@185.7.192.138] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 05:42 -!- justanot1eruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:43 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 05:44 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 05:46 -!- justanot1eruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Client Quit] 05:57 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 06:14 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:16 -!- mariusz1 [~mariusz@wsip-174-78-132-9.ri.ri.cox.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:16 -!- mariusz1 is now known as weles 06:31 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:31 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has quit [Client Quit] 06:39 -!- Zinglon [~Zinglon@ip565f6f48.direct-adsl.nl] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:51 -!- phm4242 [~o@boole.london.hackspace.org.uk] has joined ##hplusroadmap 06:53 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fzwvveraltkexkks] has joined ##hplusroadmap 07:13 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has joined ##hplusroadmap 07:15 < JayDugger> Good morning, everyone. 07:38 < Zinglon> Hi! 07:40 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 07:52 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 07:59 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.2-dev] 08:04 -!- ebowden_ [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 08:14 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:16 -!- strangewarp_ [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 08:16 -!- strangewarp_ [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:24 * nsh smiles 08:42 -!- Merovoth [~Merovoth@gateway/tor-sasl/merovoth] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 08:58 -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-cextyeigvmmjpmud] has joined ##hplusroadmap 08:59 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@r167-57-115-47.dialup.adsl.anteldata.net.uy] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 09:01 -!- nmz787_i1 [~nmccorkx@192.55.55.37] has joined ##hplusroadmap 09:03 -!- nmz787_i [nmccorkx@nat/intel/x-cextyeigvmmjpmud] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 09:20 -!- thundara [~thundara@104.236.109.149] has quit [Quit: leaving] 09:21 -!- QuadIngi 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11:32 -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds] 11:45 -!- Vutral [~ss@mirbsd/special/Vutral] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:00 < delinquentme> kanzzzzzzzzooooo 12:00 < delinquentme> I MISSH You 12:01 < kanzure> feed me music or die 12:02 < delinquentme> heavy or soft ? 12:03 < kanzure> heaviest 12:05 < delinquentme> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HraunoXufD0 12:14 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fzwvveraltkexkks] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 12:16 -!- ButaTine [~FourFire@host-37-191-195-228.lynet.no] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 12:19 < nmz787_i1> when I hear about pac-bio's SMRT I can only think of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcGQpjCztgA 12:19 < nmz787_i1> .title 12:19 < yoleaux> The Simpsons- S-M-R-T - YouTube 12:25 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 12:41 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:42 -!- Zinglon [~Zinglon@ip565f6f48.direct-adsl.nl] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:50 -!- nmz787_i1 [~nmccorkx@192.55.55.37] has quit [Quit: Leaving.] 12:50 < archels> kanzure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raAblA0curk 12:51 < kanzure> .title 12:51 < yoleaux> Chemical Brothers - Exit Planet Dust - [HQ - Full Album] - YouTube 12:53 -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@192.55.55.37] has joined ##hplusroadmap 12:54 < kanzure> hm 12:59 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gptgxvjwszidmvfp] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:04 -!- weles [~mariusz@wsip-174-78-132-9.ri.ri.cox.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 13:05 < kanzure> .wik Van Eck phreaking 13:05 < yoleaux> "Van Eck phreaking is a form of eavesdropping in which special equipment is used to pick up side-band electronic-magnetic emissions from electronics devices that correlate to hidden signals or data for the purpose of recreating these signals or data in order to spy on the electronic device. Side-band electromagnetic radiation emissions are …" — http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Van_Eck_phreaking 13:11 < chris_99> marcus kuhn has got some v. cool papers 13:11 < chris_99> on that 13:12 < chris_99> *markus 13:38 -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-198-176-86.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:39 -!- yoleaux [~yoleaux@xn--ht-1ia18f.nonceword.org] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 13:39 -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-80-87-190.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 13:40 -!- skyraider [uid41097@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dsynkymgndbmmwaz] has joined ##hplusroadmap 14:46 < kanzure> "Astrobotic and CMU are the only Google Lunar XPRIZE team to secure all three milestone prizes." 15:04 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gptgxvjwszidmvfp] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 15:11 < delinquentme> kanzure, thoughts on 50 microsecond logging of float64 with python / numpy 15:11 < delinquentme> specifically the persistence part... redis? 15:12 < kanzure> syslog 15:18 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has joined ##hplusroadmap 15:22 < delinquentme> how should I specify a r/w buffer size? 15:22 < delinquentme> some fraction of the machines available ram? 15:24 < kanzure> what are you doing? 15:25 < delinquentme> sampling a voltage reading off of an arduino 15:26 < delinquentme> reading it into python via serial and then I want to write to disk 15:30 < nmz787_i> delinquentme: you shouldn't worry about the time outside the arduino, I think... just add an RTC and put the time in the reading then 15:30 < nmz787_i> I saw this t-shirt at lunch and now I think I have to custom order one, since they don't seem to sell them anywhere http://www.stopbuyingcrap.com/pics/sbc/intelsimpsons2.jpg 15:31 < nmz787_i> I also really like this one http://thlog.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/homer-internet-t-shirt.jpg 15:31 < nmz787_i> 'the internet, that old thing still around?' 15:33 -!- eudoxia [~eudoxia@179.26.156.191] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 15:33 < nmz787_i> delinquentme: I don't think you can depend on a constant delay between arduino readings and when the get to your OS-level application, due to network contention on the USB level 15:35 < delinquentme> nmz787_i, smart. 15:38 < kanzure> http://blog.uber.com/eta-expectations 15:55 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 15:59 -!- skyraider [uid41097@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-dsynkymgndbmmwaz] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 16:00 -!- yoleaux [~yoleaux@xn--ht-1ia18f.nonceword.org] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:02 -!- Viper168 [~Viper@unaffiliated/viper168] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:04 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat] 16:04 < delinquentme> kanzure, advantages of syslog ? 16:04 < delinquentme> that its just already there + is a aggregation of all system events? 16:08 < kanzure> eh, this particular scenario does not seem like one that syslog is a great answer for 16:20 -!- Zinglon [~Zinglon@ip565f6f48.direct-adsl.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds] 16:39 -!- gnusha [~gnusha@unaffiliated/kanzure/bot/gnusha] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:39 -!- Topic for ##hplusroadmap: biohacking, nootropics, transhumanism, open hardware | sponsored by george church and the NRA, banned by the Federal Death Administration (4 times) | this channel is LOGGED: http://gnusha.org/logs | http://diyhpl.us/wiki 16:39 -!- Topic set by kanzure [~kanzure@unaffiliated/kanzure] [Sat Dec 27 16:56:22 2014] 16:39 [Users ##hplusroadmap] 16:39 [ abetusk ] [ cuba ] [ faceface ] [ juul ] [ Proteus1 ] [ ThomasEgi ] 16:39 [ andytoshi] [ cursive ] [ fenn ] [ kanzure ] [ Qfwfq ] [ thundara ] 16:39 [ archels ] [ Daeken ] [ glutton ] [ kenju254 ] [ saurik ] [ TMA ] 16:39 [ augur ] [ delinquentme ] [ gnusha ] [ lichen ] [ sheena ] [ Urchin ] 16:39 [ balrog ] [ docl_ ] [ gwillen ] [ maaku ] [ sid6_7 ] [ Viper168 ] 16:39 [ bbrittain] [ Douhet ] [ heath ] [ Merovoth ] [ sivoais ] [ voidfire ] 16:39 [ bkero ] [ dpk ] [ helleshin ] [ nickjohnson] [ smeaaagle ] [ Vutral ] 16:39 [ blueskin ] [ drazak ] [ HEx1 ] [ night ] [ souljack ] [ xrr ] 16:39 [ BobaMa_ ] [ drewbot ] [ ivan` ] [ nmz787 ] [ soylentbomb ] [ yashgaroth] 16:39 [ Boscop_ ] [ DumpsterD1ver] [ JayDugger ] [ nmz787_i ] [ strages ] [ yoleaux ] 16:39 [ Burninate] [ dvorkbjel ] [ JonTitor ] [ nsh ] [ strangewarp_ ] [ yorick ] 16:39 [ catern ] [ ebowden ] [ jrayhawk ] [ ParahSailin] [ streety ] 16:39 [ comma8 ] [ EnabrinTain ] [ juri_ ] [ pasky ] [ superkuh ] 16:39 [ crescend1] [ erasei ] [ justanotheruser] [ poohbear ] [ the8thbit|work] 16:39 -!- Irssi: ##hplusroadmap: Total of 81 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 81 normal] 16:39 -!- Channel ##hplusroadmap created Thu Feb 25 23:40:30 2010 16:39 -!- Irssi: Join to ##hplusroadmap was synced in 11 secs 16:39 -!- gwillen is now known as Guest68711 16:52 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving...] 16:53 -!- strangewarp [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 16:55 -!- strangewarp_ [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 17:02 -!- Guest68711 [~gwillen@li450-236.members.linode.com] has quit [Changing host] 17:02 -!- Guest68711 [~gwillen@unaffiliated/gwillen] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:02 -!- Guest68711 is now known as gwillen 17:03 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:04 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rwhfvxufafcixoad] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:10 -!- chris_99 [~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 17:22 < jrayhawk> q/window 63 17:22 < jrayhawk> whoops 17:32 -!- strangewarp [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: austerity chic brand destruction] 17:33 -!- strangewarp [~strangewa@c-76-25-206-3.hsd1.co.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 17:34 -!- nmz787_i [~nmccorkx@192.55.55.37] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 17:56 < kanzure> 17:56 < kevtris> I salvaged so many chips from boards using a blowtorch 18:03 -!- AmbulatoryCortex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:24 -!- augur [~augur@216-164-48-148.c3-0.slvr-ubr1.lnh-slvr.md.cable.rcn.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:58 -!- drewbot_ [~cinch@ec2-54-226-96-126.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 18:58 -!- drewbot [~cinch@ec2-54-80-87-190.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:06 < fenn> the heat and beat method 19:06 < fenn> not everyone has a vat of molten lead handy 19:08 < kanzure> why did we not fcus on electronics? 19:13 < kanzure> focus 19:16 -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 19:23 -!- HEx1 [~HEx@hexwab.plus.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 19:44 < bbrittain> when did linux distros start renaming wheel to sudo? :( 19:46 < kanzure> python wheel? 19:47 < bbrittain> the sudoers group used to be called wheel 19:47 < bbrittain> it was confusing as fuck to new people, but it was actually an homage to Robert Jordan 19:49 < kanzure> why are we calling this new thing a cheese wheel then 19:49 < fenn> bbrittain: since ubuntu 19:50 < bbrittain> fenn: damn ubuntu 19:50 < bbrittain> I think I'm gonna change my group back. hmpfh 19:50 < bbrittain> I feel like an old grumpy linux user 19:50 < bbrittain> next you know, I'll be complaining about systemd 19:51 < bbrittain> (which I do, frequently) 19:58 < fenn> "cat -v considered harmful" 19:58 < kanzure> frankly i find his complaints helpful 19:59 < kanzure> but really: what was the reason that skdb stuff was not electronics-specific? 19:59 -!- Burninate [~Burn@pool-71-241-254-181.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 19:59 < kanzure> i seem to recall some vague reasoning like "that makes too much sense" or "there's already a large electronics bias, even if datasheets suck" 19:59 -!- Burninate [~Burn@pool-71-241-254-181.washdc.fios.verizon.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:00 < fenn> because electronics is too easy 20:01 < kanzure> is that a good reason? 20:01 < fenn> because there are already tools that do BOM stuff for electronics 20:01 < fenn> so people would be like "why are you making yet another EDA tool" 20:02 < kanzure> from the perspective of a goal like "don't make me read millions of pages of documentation", microelectronic vlsi is pretty high on the list (and bom tools are a part of using this but not the whole story) 20:02 < fenn> it is at least a set of standards that exist that one could point to and say "hey why does your industry suck so much, be like these guys" 20:02 < kanzure> s/read/read or write 20:03 < kanzure> sorry, but i lost track about who you are pointing to what for which reason 20:04 < fenn> electronics industries follow good practices much of the time, is all i'm saying 20:05 < kanzure> true, but still not nearly apt-get-land 20:05 < fenn> lately they've been skimpy with documentation and NDA bullshit though 20:05 < kanzure> (well, more nearly, i suppose) 20:08 < fenn> also because electronics don't really help you build more electronics in easily specified ways, with the exception of circuit board prototyping 20:08 < fenn> (computers help with CAD but that process is hard to describe) 20:10 < fenn> i've been watching steve play minecraft FTB and a lot of the things in it remind me of what i was going for with SKDB and automation 20:11 < fenn> like there is a box that stores items and you can search through it for the item you want by typing a regex, and it will pipe the item to another box that assembles it based on a schematic 20:11 < kanzure> yes it's true that there's a lot of things missing if you choose only electronics... but you still get a lot out of it. 20:11 < fenn> then why hasn't anyone else done it 20:12 < kanzure> a reasonable question, i don't have any answers at the moment 20:13 < fenn> probably because it's easier to just order from digikey than to write a program that orders from digikey 20:13 < kanzure> because the alternative ("run your own cmos fab") is "lots of hard ridiculous work that i thought cost a billion bucks anyway" 20:14 < fenn> oh 20:14 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has joined ##hplusroadmap 20:14 < fenn> yeah that's not feasible 20:14 < kanzure> you don't need a billion dollar fab 20:14 < kanzure> but you also can't get anything done if you are paying $10k per wafer 20:15 < fenn> so you're forced to use commodity components, big deal 20:15 < fenn> FPGA or CPLD works fine for most applications, bitcoin is just ridiculous about efficiency 20:16 < kanzure> oh, then i could come u pwith reasons like "nobody wants to build and support a product with lots of commodity parts" and things like form factor, whereas if you are specifically building stuff on a budget that isn't mass produced, you're more okay with such things 20:16 < fenn> "nobody wants to build and support a product with lots of custom parts" 20:16 < fenn> there i fixed it 20:16 < kanzure> there are far more things to do with (micro)electronics than just fpgas (lots of real world interface stuff) 20:17 < fenn> you dont need a billion dollar fab to make custom sensor devices 20:17 < kanzure> right, but i was trying to explain why nobody made an skdb-for-electronics-specifically thing 20:17 < kanzure> and "i thought it cost a billion bucks" is a good explanation 20:18 < cntrational> https://www.edx.org/course/artificial-intelligence-uc-berkeleyx-cs188-1x-0 hmm, should i sign up for this 20:18 < kanzure> and i guess sensor stuff is more like "nobody needs that much equipment"? i dunno why nobody has bothered really 20:19 < fenn> there aren't that many different semiconductor lab devices 20:20 < kanzure> heh i bet some whippersnapper could put all of the conventional molecular biology lab electronics into a single device, and just stuff it into different machines 20:20 < fenn> bulk deposition, doping, ovens, etching, masking, wire bonding and packaging... 20:20 < fenn> yeah it's called an arduino and some mosfets 20:20 < kanzure> yeah but i mean someone actually doing it :p 20:20 < fenn> touche 20:21 < kanzure> as far as i know everyone selling lab equipment is doing custom electronics for everything 20:21 < fenn> they are stupid and bad 20:22 < cntrational> pfff, didn't notice the prereqs 20:22 < kanzure> i can already tell by the url that it will be a waste of everyone's time 20:22 < fenn> cntrational: just read the norvig+russell book 20:22 < cntrational> fenn: hmm, okay 20:22 < kanzure> i don't really buy "they are stupid and bad" as an explanation for the other question ("why has nobody bothered") 20:23 < kanzure> i mean life is easy if you are happy with "they are stupid", but you're also often wrong 20:23 < fenn> i didn't say that 20:23 < kanzure> i know i know 20:23 < fenn> i don't know why nobody has made a package manager for electronics 20:23 < kanzure> but i was going to say that earlier 20:23 < kanzure> and i didn't 20:23 < kanzure> even in the surface mount domain 20:24 < kanzure> surface mount machine manufacturers probably don't get software that well, so maybe they don't bother- but a packager would really sell their machine methinks 20:24 < fenn> you mean pick and place machines? 20:24 < kanzure> (not that there aren't other reasons to bother) 20:24 < kanzure> oh sorry, yes 20:24 < fenn> hm. maybe ask ladyada and philip torrone how their adventures with pick and place are going 20:25 < fenn> "Advanced hacking! 20:25 < fenn> DIY tray - Make your own tray holder!" 20:26 < kanzure> not encouraging 20:26 < fenn> so l33t 20:26 < fenn> maybe anything physical at all counts as "advanced" for electronics people 20:26 < kanzure> certainly for software people 20:27 < fenn> possibly an industrial pick and place machine is too expensive to let sit idle (in opportunity cost) and so you have to employ people to keep it running 24/7 20:28 < kanzure> nah there's lots of cheapo shenzhen desktop pick and place machines these days 20:28 < fenn> it would be better if you just farmed the demand out to the internet with a sensible package manager though 20:28 < kanzure> snoop in #szdiy sometime 20:28 -!- delinquentme [~delinquen@162-245-22-166.v250d.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds] 20:29 < fenn> $8k is a fair amount of capital to be gathering dust under your workbench 20:29 < fenn> could be worse tho 20:29 < kanzure> a few runs of "stuff" could cover that, right? 20:29 < fenn> http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/desktop-pick-and-place-machine-led_60012381969/showimage.html 20:29 < kanzure> how price competitive is the part-filled pcb market these days 20:30 < fenn> very 20:30 < kanzure> hmm. 20:30 < fenn> latency is expensive though 20:30 < fenn> low latency i mean 20:30 < kanzure> does not bode well for "pay for it with one or two runs of some bullshit from american bullshitters" 20:31 < fenn> the problem is you won't get a full run from american bullshitters because anyone making 1000 boards will do research on prices first 20:31 < fenn> it really makes sense to have a standard set of components that are loaded in the machine at all times, and anything else costs extra 20:32 < kanzure> wait why did i start talking about price 20:32 < fenn> i did 20:32 < kanzure> btw there was a pick and place standardization thing that upverter and octopart were involved in, and some other startup that had a long 20-foot pick and place production line thingy 20:32 < kanzure> trying to find link 20:33 < fenn> i have seen quotes in the $500k-1M range for advanced pick and place machines, i thought the entire industry was like that 20:33 < gwillen> 20:18:18 < cntrational> https://www.edx.org/course/artificial-intelligence-uc-berkeleyx-cs188-1x-0 hmm, should i sign up for this 20:33 < kanzure> no 20:33 < gwillen> cntrational: it's not exactly hardcore, but I enjoyed it 20:34 < gwillen> cntrational: as I recall it's mostly about game-playing agents, game-tree search, A*, that kind of thing 20:34 < gwillen> so not quite what I expected from the title 20:35 < gwillen> although 'classifying handwritten digits and photographs' sounds quite different from what I remember, so maybe they've added stuff to the course 20:35 < kanzure> fenn: i'm sure there's lots of high end stuff, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S8qkaTsr2_o&t=70s 20:37 < kanzure> "feed/reel exchange during production" haha 20:38 < cntrational> gwillen: hmm, okay 20:39 < fenn> why the fuck are they still using cartesian axis machines 20:39 < fenn> that is a job for a deltabot 20:39 < kanzure> hahaha: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SRu02F6AOmg&t=40s 20:41 < fenn> yeah the fuji rotary placement head is pretty cool 20:45 < kanzure> prolly a few million bucks 20:50 -!- AmbulatoryCortex [~Ambulator@173-31-9-188.client.mchsi.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20:51 -!- delinquentme [~delinquen@162-245-22-166.v250d.PUBLIC.monkeybrains.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap 21:06 < kanzure> http://hackaday.io/project/963-300-pick-and-place-3d-printer 21:06 < kanzure> "Our BOM will eventually be in our custom FireBOM system" 21:06 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has quit [Quit: WeeChat 1.2-dev] 21:06 < kanzure> https://github.com/firepick-delta/firepick-delta/wiki 21:07 < kanzure> their link is broken http://165.225.149.255:8080/firebom/rest/build?url=https://github.com/firepick1/FirePick/wiki/AFPD0001&x=33&y=8 21:08 < kanzure> they are using google docs to store their xml bom :( 21:08 < kanzure> http://firepick1.github.io/ 21:10 < kanzure> seems to be made by java people :/ http://delta.firepick.org/developers/ 22:14 -!- CheckDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rwhfvxufafcixoad] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 22:16 < JayDugger> Good evening. 22:18 -!- cntrational [~sid@49.205.77.125] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:26 -!- Boscop__ [me@178.73.223.92] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:27 -!- dvorkbjel [~viskestel@li607-220.members.linode.com] has quit [Excess Flood] 22:28 -!- dvorkbjel [~viskestel@li607-220.members.linode.com] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:29 -!- Boscop_ [me@178.73.223.92] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 22:59 -!- justanot1eruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap 22:59 -!- justanotheruser [~Justan@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Quit: Reconnecting] 23:00 -!- lichen [~lichen@c-50-139-11-6.hsd1.or.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal] 23:18 -!- justanot1eruser is now known as justanotheruser 23:39 -!- ebowden [~ebowden@CPE-144-131-35-125.lns4.dav.bigpond.net.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] --- Log closed Sat Jan 31 00:00:40 2015