--- Log opened Fri Jul 03 00:00:59 2015
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03:41 < justanotheruser> hi bot, did you have something to tell me?
03:41 < yoleaux> 2 Jul 2015 12:45Z <kanzure> justanotheruser: there is not an hplusroadmap mailing list at the moment
03:41 < justanotheruser> great
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05:51 < kanzure> greetings
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06:42 < kanzure> http://phenomena.nationalgeographic.com/2015/07/02/single-celled-creature-has-eye-made-of-domesticated-microbes/
06:48 < kanzure> elon musk has donated some money to ai stuff http://futureoflife.org/misc/2015awardees
06:48 < kanzure> nick bostrom got $1.5M and anna salamon got $111k
06:55 < kanzure> "liquify the brain without destroying any of the neurons or their structures, then flow all of these structures through a microfluidic system where each cell can be individually analyzed"
06:56 < kanzure> "So we engineer some of your amoebae, or some stem cells more likely, and inject them into the brain, through the skull, or however.  The injection leaves behind a multi-stranded optical fiber with a faceted end.  The more strands the better.   The injected cell sidles up to an existing brain cell, interacts with it long enough to exfiltrate it's stored memory, then triggers apoptosis of the original brain cell, and divides.  Rinse, ...
06:56 < kanzure> ... repeat.  You go on living, braining, as your brain is replaced a cell at a time by an engineered brain.  The engineered cells express fluorescent proteins and synchronize light flashes like fireflies, to bucket-brigade data to the optical fiber, which is multi-channel, so you can do some statistical analysis to increase the bandwidth.  The first cells to convert exfiltrate their data almost immediately, so that by the time all the ...
06:56 < kanzure> ... cells are converted, half the brain's already uploaded."
06:56 < kanzure> (eh liquification seems easier?)
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08:06 < archels> I thought we had done away with replacing one cell at a time as just a quaint Moravecian thought experiment
08:07 < archels> are all of those projects about "AI is dangerous"
08:07 < archels> also you can't "extract" memory from a cell just by looking at its action potentials
08:07 < archels> unless maybe you're looking at all the action potentials of all the cells
08:24 < kanzure> i don't think anyone in here believes that looking at action potentials is sufficient
08:24 < kanzure> the idea of single-cell analysis of all neurons is so that you can patch clamp into each cell and extract methylated dna plus all the other goodies
08:25 < kanzure> (i believe the fluorescent protein stuff was regarding in vivo dna sequencing and so on- but i'm not very convinced about that approach)
08:27 < archels> ah, that makes more sense
08:28 < kanzure> i think the claim was something like "well it's okay for multiple in vivo sequencing things to be happening at the same time because you can just separate the data later thanks to fiber optical data recording" but..... eh.
08:29 < archels> oh, I vaguely recall hearing an argument like that
08:29 < archels> almost fits the template of a BOFH excuse
08:30 < kanzure> does it?
08:39 < kanzure> hmm the microbial nootropics method should be applied to the problem of sleep to see what happens there
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09:51 < kanzure> "The researchers ultimately discovered that cortical thickness was the missing unifying factor. They found that the degree of folding was a function of the total cortical area multiplied by the square root of cortical thickness. Interestingly, this relationship also governs the folds formed when a piece of paper is crumpled: The larger the surface area, the more folds formed; the thicker the paper is, the harder it is to fold. The ...
09:51 < kanzure> ... researchers found that this relationship held up surprisingly well for cortices across all mammalian orders, even among lissencephalic species, which have a folding index of 1 and contain no folds."
09:51 < kanzure> .title http://www.sciencemag.org/content/349/6243/74.abstract
09:51 < yoleaux> Cortical folding scales universally with surface area and thickness, not number of neurons
09:51 < kanzure> cc fenn, who i think called it earlier
09:53 < kanzure> "The findings help explain lissencephaly, a disorder in which the brain fails to form folds. Mutations that prevent the migration of neural progenitor cells—which would reduce cortical surface area and potentially increase thickness—cause the disorder (see Hong et al., 2000). The surface area/thickness relationship also explains some striking differences among species. For example, the manatee brain is relatively smooth for its large ...
09:53 < kanzure> ... size. Herculano-Houzel speculated that this could be due to decreased lateral mobility of neural progenitor cells and/or robust production of neurons from a given progenitor cell."
09:53 < kanzure> "Lastly, while pieces of paper crumple into random shapes, brains form a consistent pattern of folds within each species. Where does this specificity come from? According to Herculano-Houzel, white-matter fibers, which form prior to gray-matter folds during development, dictate where the folds take place. White-matter tracts are conserved among different orders of mammals, so that rodents, for example, have similar cortical folding ...
09:53 < kanzure> ... pattern, as do primates."
10:04 < kanzure> sent email to anders; he correctly pointed out that it is not only the smart ai that should take up everyone's time. even profoundly stupid ai deserves some consideration.
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10:59 < kanzure> http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/stop-mosquito-bites-silence-your-skins-bacteria-180955772/?no-ist
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11:08 < delinquentme_> kanzure, should I blow 1700 on a new carbon x1 ?
11:08 < delinquentme_> i think i want to.
11:09 < kanzure> blow it on one of these http://www.dji.com/product/phantom-3
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13:18 < fenn> folding is not caused by white matter fibers, it's caused by a protein Trnp1 whose presence/absence is determined by a reaction diffusion system (that probably also affects the location of white matter fibers etc)
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15:56 < kanzure> "Vingean reflection: Reliable reasoning for self-improving agents" https://intelligence.org/files/VingeanReflection.pdf
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17:38 < ebowden> paperbot http://www.cell.com/cell/abstract/S0092-8674%2815%2900002-1?_returnURL=http%3A%2F%2Flinkinghub.elsevier.com%2Fretrieve%2Fpii%2FS0092867415000021%3Fshowall%3Dtrue
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17:48 < kanzure> .title
17:48 < yoleaux> kanzure: Sorry, that doesn't appear to be an HTML page.
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17:56 < ebowden> http://www.cell.com/cell/abstract/S0092-8674%2815%2900002-1
17:56 < ebowden> .title
17:56 < ebowden> paperbot http://www.cell.com/cell/abstract/S0092-8674%2815%2900002-1
17:56 < yoleaux> ebowden: Sorry, that doesn't appear to be an HTML page.
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20:49 < heath> http://www.michaeltolley.com/publications/TMech_2015_Onal.pdf
20:49 < heath> Origami-Inspired Printed Robots
20:50 < heath> related: http://www.popupcad.org/
20:50 < heath> person: Daniel Aukes
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--- Log closed Sat Jul 04 00:00:00 2015