--- Log opened Sat Dec 05 00:00:28 2015
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03:47 < indiebio> low-tech way to find new antibiotics: http://www.statnews.com/2015/12/03/antibiotics-bacteria-research/
03:52 < FourFire> kanzure, do we have any somewhat comprehensive list of resonant frequencies for structures inside mamillian cells?
03:53 < FourFire> >  where you're too distractible to get basic life things done, or occasionally even carry on a conversation
03:53 < FourFire> This is me.
03:54 < FourFire> but wow, forgetting the origin of a chain of thought happens to me quite often, but forgetting the Prior thought, wow I don't think someone could function independently like that.
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05:50 < xentrac> kanzure: so amphetamine nearly functions as an antipsychotic for you, which is interestingly paradoxical
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06:25 < kanzure> xentrac: is that what antipsychotics are supposed to do?
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06:26 < kanzure> "but forgetting the Prior thought, wow I don't think someone could function independently like that." well i suspect this is why i am somewhat better at remembering contexts or trying to trace things (because i just need those tools for basic stuff all the time)
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06:39 < xentrac> well, "trouble constructing coherent thoughts, or remembering conclusions to thoughts," is definitely one of the key aspects of psychosis
06:39 < xentrac> it's not the only one
06:40 < xentrac> maybe not even the most important one — delusions and hallucinations are kind of a bigger deal really
06:42 < kanzure> well, i suppose it's not fair for me to focus on coherency; they are coherent, although repetitive and not useful.
06:43 < xentrac> like a song you can only remember the chorus of?
06:44 < kanzure> eh that's closer.
06:44 < kanzure> another possibility is that, for the longest time i never actually knew what mental fatigue felt like
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10:17 < kanzure> i don't think selling snp data in this context makes sense https://github.com/joepickrell/genome-server-21
10:42 < justanotheruser> lol what
10:42 < justanotheruser> very strange
10:43 < justanotheruser> I'm not sure whether this is just an example demonstrating how you can use some of their APIs
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11:16 < docl> fenn: Any comments on the prospect of using phased arrays to etch useful electronics on distant objects in space?
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11:28 < docl> Ooh, Bryan Wowk is interested in phased array optics. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phased-array_optics
11:29 < docl> http://www.phased-array.com/1996-Book-Chapter.html
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11:35 < docl> Er, Brian Wowk.
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11:42 < docl> http://www.wired.com/2014/11/be-mean-online/ explains so much.
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11:50 < docl> Of course the same principle can be employed over the entire surface area of the building, encompassing hundreds of kilowatts of laser power. Our camouflage, decorative lighting system is now a long-range missile defense system, or directional transmitter of interstellar range. (With a beam divergence less than a millionth of a degree, a stable 100 meter wide array would appear 1% as bright as the sun
11:50 < docl> at any distance.
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12:42 < atomical> has anyone used RU for hair loss?
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14:41 < bjonnh> are there people familiar with rdf/owl, semantic web and so on?
14:42 < bjonnh> kanzure: what is kanzure/streak?
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15:25 < kanzure> bjonnh: kanzure/streak is just git commit lies
15:26 < kanzure> bjonnh: dpk is probably an ok person to ask about rdf stuff
15:26 < {dpk}> i think kanzure is trolling
15:27 < kanzure> swhackians, in general, can be assumed to have good knowledge of rdf, owl, tags, and anything that feels boring enough to be a w3 spec
15:27 < {dpk}> (no, i don't know very much about RDF. not sure where kanzure got the impression that i do. but i don't. sorry! my advice is to stay away from that sort of stuff)
15:27 < {dpk}> we have a good enough knowledge to satirize it, not necessarily to advise on its serious usage
15:28 < kanzure> i see, i see
15:32 < bjonnh> what do you base that upon?
15:33 < kanzure> well, dpk is probably basing that on his own knowledge
15:33 < bjonnh> Yes that's how I did interpret that
15:33 < bjonnh> But I'd get more details than "blue is a crappy color"
15:34 < {dpk}> color:blue quality:is quality:crappy .
15:34 < {dpk}> based mainly the experiences of people who wasted so much time on the Semantic Web that it's now only this year become longer since they gave it up than the time they wasted on it
15:35 < bjonnh> well "some people"
15:35 < bjonnh> MeSH, ChEBI, are used everyday. Same for RDF inside webpages like GR or RDFa (facebook, google use that all the time)
15:36 < docl> http://www.physics.uci.edu/tajima/Ebisuzakietal2015.pdf long distance laser stuff. Could in principle be scaled up to higher distances.
15:36 < bjonnh> Semantic web is not the "world saver" its creators and thinkers may have believed in, but it is the same for any new technology
15:37 < {dpk}> but nor has it been the world changer on the scale of the World Wide Web itself as it was originally predicted to be. "RDFa" is just a data serialization, like JSON but a bit crappier still
15:38 < bjonnh> yeah I'm not looking for a world changer
15:38 < bjonnh> people that think that their ideas, concepts or philosophy will change the world are bullshiters
15:38 < {dpk}> then use JSON, the format which doesn't have people swarming around it still hoping it'll take off like HTML did
15:39 < bjonnh> well my objective is to link ressources that already exist as RDF stuff (and heavily used)
15:39 < bjonnh> with some data which is for now in SQL, but would IMHO greatly benefit from being in RDF format
15:39 < bjonnh> especially with the way I query it
15:39 < kanzure> docl: another use for space debris with reflective surfaces is to reposition them to act as optical elements for the construction of kilometer-wide orbital telescopes
15:40 < docl> good point
15:40 < bjonnh> I mean JSON is just a dict storage… nothing about meaning or anything
15:40 < kanzure> docl: this was known as "brainbow"... no wait. uh.. "orbital cortex rainbows".
15:40 < {dpk}> what is "meaning"?
15:41 < {dpk}> meaning is in the eye of the human, ultimately
15:41 < bjonnh> of course
15:41 < bjonnh> and I'm human
15:41 < bjonnh> and the users of all the systems I'm talking about too
15:41 < kanzure> you will have to decide between you paying the ontology maintenance costs or you forcing your users to pay those costs manually, good luck
15:42 < bjonnh> well most of the ontology maintenance is managed by external entities in that case
15:42 < {dpk}> (if you choose the former, you also choose the latter)
15:42 < bjonnh> I would only have to make a rather minimal one
15:43 < kanzure> docl: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/space/Orbiting%20rainbows%20-%20optical%20manipulation%20of%20aerosols%20and%20the%20beginnings%20of%20future%20space%20construction%20-%20NASA.pdf
15:45 < docl> If you have a laser that can deliver enough energy at a given distance to make a plasma, you should be able to narrow that same laser to a smaller area using a thinned phased array. So something that can steer objects around at 100km can probably print fine details at 100km if you have lots of copies of it distributed around on the ground.
15:45 < kanzure> light patterning is a thing that optics can do
15:46 < kanzure> uh.. i mean spatial light modulation.
15:46 < kanzure> "Image restoration from a sequence of random masks" http://www.researchgate.net/profile/Xiaopeng_Peng/publication/274713215_Image_Restoration_from_a_Sequence_of_Random_Masks/links/55275ff00cf2e486ae40fece.pdf
15:46 < kanzure> this seems to be someone's followup to the orbital rainbow paper
15:50 < docl> It would be cool if just releasing a few hundred kg of tiny fibers into L1 would enable you to refocus a beam on the Moon well enough to print fine detail.
15:52 < docl> Incidentally, what do we know about manufacturing glass fibers for laser-making purposes?
15:53 < kanzure> xentrac: that last pdf link
15:53 < xentrac> what about it?
15:54 < xentrac> it's interesting that they're doing it blind
16:01 < bjonnh> talking about construction/reconstruction for imaging, I liked this about time inversion: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7beEe9CMcU
16:01 < kanzure> you could probably deploy some weather balloons to get a good telescope-from-random-elements thingy...
16:02 < kanzure> .title
16:02 < yoleaux> Mathias Fink Hot Topics presentation: Multiwave Approach to Elasticity Imaging for Cancer Detection - YouTube
16:02 < bjonnh> {dpk}: to go back to the rdf thingy. Basically, I have ressources I want to link together with data I have in SQL, I want to link to ressources which are available as RDF. And the data is clearly defined so are the models and the relations between them.
16:03 < kanzure> this is not what i was expecting
16:03 < bjonnh> So either I build a home made relational system between them that would be rather static or really complex, or I just use RDF/OWL the way they did link these ressources
16:04 < kanzure> i was expecting ai-style semantic web handwaving
16:04 < bjonnh> no, I absolutely don't believe in that
16:04 < bjonnh> I agree with Cory Doctorow and his metacrap, people are lazy, people lie and people are stupid
16:05 < kanzure> pick a programming language, find an rdf sdk, load up your objects from sql into memory (use sqlalchemy or something), then convert into the in-language sdk object for rdf. then serialize and dump output.
16:05 < bjonnh> you can't make a global knowledge database that an hypothetic AI could use knowing that
16:05 < bjonnh> not without fuzzy logic and probabilistic rules that would still allow to infer something from huge piles of crap
16:05 < bjonnh> kanzure: yep that's my plan
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16:06 < kanzure> there might also be something like pyxb for rdf
16:06 < bjonnh> My app is currently a django/postgresql, and I have played with rdflib enough to convert my data to triples.
16:06 < bjonnh> the only thing I have left is making the RDF schema/model to make stuff more interesting
16:08 < docl> This is great. How fiber lasers work. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofEqFlqkiS0
16:10 < bjonnh> wow 10kW single mode
16:11 < bjonnh> CW
16:12 < kanzure> yeah i think everyone should prefer at least 1 kW laser cutters over those 30W over-hyped glorified light bulbs
16:13 < bjonnh> I play a lot with a 30W one
16:13 < bjonnh> it is already fun enough :p
16:13 < bjonnh> I would not be against having a 1kW to cut through metal though
16:14 < kanzure> like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAR7rgvI_wc
16:14 < bjonnh> yep
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16:15 < bjonnh> I could still benefit from something smaller
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16:37 < kanzure> .title https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10683431
16:37 < yoleaux> The patent on the Space Shuttle has expired | Hacker News
16:37 < docl> The CAN laser that they are talking about using for space debris is from this paper: http://www.nature.com/nphoton/journal/v7/n4/full/nphoton.2013.75.html
16:39 < docl> http://www.laserfocusworld.com/articles/2013/03/scientists-propose-coherent-amplified-fiber-laser-network-for-co.html
16:40 < kanzure> scalingbitcoin hong kong livestream is starting in a few minutes https://youtube.com/watch?v=qdghS32TeZU
16:42 < kanzure> also there is #bitcoin-workshops
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16:49 < kanzure> http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/04/science/crispr-cas9-human-genome-editing-moratorium.html
16:49 < kanzure> gah
16:50 < kanzure> .title http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v528/n7580_supp/full/528S7a.html
16:50 < yoleaux> Perspective: Encourage the innovators : Nature : Nature Publishing Group
16:51 < kanzure> "Finally, the concept of a ban on germline editing does not make sense. There is already a ban on using medical technologies in humans until they are proven safe and effective in appropriate animal trials. Then, following human trials, they can only be applied to the general population for those conditions for which their use has been demonstrated. Banning human-germline editing could put a damper on the best medical research and ...
16:51 < kanzure> ... instead drive the practice underground to black markets and uncontrolled medical tourism, which are fraught with much greater risk and misapplication. Instead, the generally high safety and efficacy standards of regulatory agencies should be encouraged rather than saddled with pessimistic assumptions about the trajectory of promising approaches."
16:54 < kanzure> better link- http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCql9h_eXmusjt-f3k8qLwPQ/live
16:55 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=f68d587f Bryan Bishop: just some links >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/intro/
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17:06 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=e78c0c45 Bryan Bishop: more intro stuff >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/intro/
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17:28 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=d6444765 Bryan Bishop: bip99 and uncontroversial hard-forks >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/bip99-and-uncontroversial-hard-forks/
17:39 < jrayhawk> this livestream is bad and it should feel bad
17:40 < jrayhawk> obs-studio makes live compositing, filtration, and normalizing fairly easy
17:53 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=24934006 Bryan Bishop: fungibility and scalability >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/fungibility-and-scalability/
17:54 < kanzure> tell them in #bitcoin-workshops
17:57 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=b1afe8ea Bryan Bishop: fungibility and scalability >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/fungibility-and-scalability/
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18:29 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=47fe563a Bryan Bishop: snarks stuff >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/zero-knowledge-proofs-for-bitcoin-scalability-and-beyond/
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18:37 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=4fffc7b2 Bryan Bishop: add link to previous fungibility/privacy talk >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/fungibility-and-scalability/
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19:08 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=4f218898 Bryan Bishop: security assumptions >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/security-assumptions/
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19:40 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=a71250ca Bryan Bishop: petertodd talk >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/in-adversarial-environments-blockchains-dont-scale/
19:58 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=e773f9c6 Bryan Bishop: why miners will not voluntarily individually produce smaller blocks >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/why-miners-will-not-voluntarily-individually-produce-smaller-blocks/
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20:43 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=31bba5a8 Bryan Bishop: iblt stuff with rusty and friends >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/invertible-bloom-lookup-tables-and-weak-block-propagation-performance/
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20:55 < fenn> "any attempt to create a gene-modified child would require approval by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration
20:56 < fenn> not sure i believe that falls under their jurisdiction
20:56 < fenn> it's not a food or drug or medical device or treatment for disease
21:02 < fenn> "International Harmonization - Gary Marchant, a law professor at Arizona State University, noted that uniform national regulations and requirements would assure more equal protections for citizens and discourage medical tourism."
21:02 < fenn> it's pretty clear they are aiming for an international ban on human gene editing
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21:15 < fenn> "although germline genome editing is often portrayed as permanent, there is nothing to stop us using the same technique to correct any mistakes."
21:26 < kanzure> bioethicists are just... awful.
21:26 < fenn> "Sharon Terry, CEO of a patient group called the Genetic Alliance was the only patient advocate invited to speak, and no practicing IVF doctors took the stage. That is an oversight, since it means the deliberations have mostly excluded the people who would actually use the technology."
21:27 < kanzure> doesn't george church have a large quantity of cash by now to flood that sort of conference with his goons?
21:28 < fenn> you don't need goons, just get people with inherited diseases to say they're "bioethicists"
21:29 < kanzure> has there ever been a moratorium that has actually benefited me
21:29 < fenn> hah for once i actually agree with marcy darnovsky
21:29 < fenn> Marcy Darnovsky, head of the eugenics watchdog group the Center for Genetics and Society, says there is no medical reason to ever use the technology, in part because people with genetic ailments don’t have to have children. “It should not be considered a medical technology at all. It’s not treating an existing person,” she says.  
21:29 < kanzure> a moratorium on moratoriums
21:30 < kanzure> yes i am a moratorium ethicist
21:30 < fenn> international summit of mad scientists calls for a moratorium on international summits
21:31 < fenn> "i'm just so busy terrorizing the southern hemisphere that i don't have time for all these meetings," said an exasperated Doktor Evil as he rushed out of the conference lair
21:32 < kanzure> "robots call for moratorium on roboresearch"
21:32 < fenn> but wouldn't that put them out of a job?
21:33 < kanzure> i am glad that china doesn't accept this brand of bullshit
21:33 < fenn> unemployed robots riot in roboberg, call for health insurance benefits
21:33 < kanzure> instead they just buy a fleet of 256 dna sequencers. i like them.
21:35 < kanzure> chinese miners at scalingbitcoin conference in response to a talk called "in adversarial environments, bitcoin doesn't scale" replied something like "we are just trying to help everyone, we are not adversaries, we are cooperative"
21:36 < fenn> well that is probably true, china needs bitcoin as much as everyone else
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21:37 < kanzure> yes but the point of the talk was that you have to design for worst-case performance, not best-case
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22:14 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=fa5cf410 Bryan Bishop: bip101 talk >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/scalingbitcoin/hong-kong/bip101-block-propagation-data-from-testnet/
22:35 < kanzure> hmm not sure whether i want to click https://static.adzerk.net/Advertisers/e49d9260f9344b74acc2c3e7145e488a.png
23:04 < kanzure> fenn: please check laser comments in backlog
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--- Log closed Sun Dec 06 00:00:29 2015