--- Log opened Fri Sep 23 00:00:02 2016
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01:54 < fenn> wow first time i've actually looked at the hplusroadmap html logs. will have to fix some things
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02:17 < archels_> to circumvent scientific publisher copyrights when reproducing images... if I use automated image processing methods to extract data from plots in papers (old/pixel only and new/can maybe read PS source), then re-plot them and cite the method and the original paper... would that work
02:26 < fenn> ok fixed word wrapping in the html logs with really long links (i think)
02:28 < fenn> archels_: it hinges around whether it's a derivative work or not. in this case it seems like one could make the case that it is, but the fair use clause seems like it might apply? ask mindspillage
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03:07 < TMA> archels_: you would probably be safer when the data extraction step would be performed by a different person, If I understand it correctly data cannot be under copyright (because the data are not a creative work but a result of measurement) on the othere hand their arangement is a copyrightable work. the second person would get the (unencumbered) data and produce an image.
03:09 < TMA> archels_: in the same vein as "clean room engineering" one person performs the analysis (reverse engineering) another produces syntesis (forward engineering from the specification by the first person)
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03:29 < fenn> but corporations are people right, so you can just get your company #1 to do analysis and company #2 to do reverse engineering?
03:29 < fenn> er, data plotting
03:35 < TMA> fenn: it depends on the exact wording of the law -- in certain jurisdictions the author is the natural person (the corporation merely holds the rights in trust (of which the corporation is the beneficiary, except for some types of rights of which the beneficiary is the natural person author)
03:35 < TMA> )
03:38 < TMA> fenn: which incidentally makes funny results: if you (a natural person) work for hire, you do not retain rights to your creation, they will be tranferred to the other party; whereas when a corporation works for hire, it retains the rights and merely licenses them as they see fit
03:41 < TMA> fenn: generally it is advisable to have several corporations at your disposal so that you can switch personhoods as you see fit; it might not work as expected though, because they might be grouped together and treated as an indivisible unit (conglomerate/concern/holding structure/...)
03:42 < TMA> and that's why lawyers can ask exuberant sums for their services
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05:49 < kanzure> fenn: would be better to fix irclog2html instead
05:53 < fenn> the irclog.css needed work-break: break-word;
05:53 < fenn> word-break: break-word;
05:54 < fenn> i replaced the distro versions so it should stay fixed
05:54 < kanzure> https://github.com/mgedmin/irclog2html/pull/15
05:54 < fenn> yeah i guess i could do a pull request but i'm lazy
05:55 < kanzure> consider it part of the workload
05:56 < kanzure> what's the least insane way to do per-message html log generation?
05:56 < fenn> to update html logs in realtime?
05:56 < kanzure> i only need somewhat realtime
05:57 < fenn> uh, a process? it reads from a fifo and modifies a html file appropriately?
05:58 < kanzure> i mean "which irssi configuration setting do i want"
05:58 < fenn> not sure what irssi has to do with it
05:58 < kanzure> that's how the current logs are rendered
05:59 < kanzure> (text logs)
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06:00 < fenn> so you want irssi to log as html
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06:01 < kanzure> i want irssi to call irclog2html
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06:01 < fenn> why?
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06:02 < kanzure> fenn: because it's currently not...? the html logs are not rendered after each message.
06:02 < kanzure> fenn: easiest to make new anchorlinks of recent messages compared to ancient messages. so you go look for something in the recent logs, make a link, problem solved. unfortunately this is broken because the html logs aren't available for today's log.
06:03 < fenn> *mumble* file alteration monitor *mumble*
06:03 < kanzure> noo i don't want a watcher. what would i be watching anyway? the source file changes.
06:04 < kanzure> *the location of the source file changes
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06:05 < fenn> "everything in this directory"
06:05 < kanzure> i don't want to regenerate the whole set each message :P
06:05 < fenn> it wont do that, that's the point
06:05 < fenn> oh but maybe it would regenerate the whole day for each message
06:06 < kanzure> that's fine.
06:07 < fenn> if a file is changed, run irclog2html on it
06:07 < fenn> optionally sleep 5 seconds to keep server load down
06:08 < kanzure> i've been looking for a not-terrible voip/sip implementation
06:08 < kanzure> so far the most succinct implementation i've found is https://github.com/Eyepea/aiosip
06:08 < kanzure> unfortunately this does not have tests
06:09 < kanzure> and this one https://www.gnu.org/software/sipwitch/ seems to redirect to "cherokees of idaho" or something...
06:10 < kanzure> https://github.com/theintencity/p2p-sip/blob/master/src/app/voip.py
06:10 < kanzure> https://github.com/AGProjects/python-sipsimple/blob/master/sipsimple/session.py
06:10 < kanzure> ugh.
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06:24 < fenn> heh whoops
06:24 < fenn> dont make new files in the directory you're monitoring for new files :P
06:27 < kanzure> ?
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06:33 < kanzure> also the css file should probably be updated to extend the bottom of the page so that the bottom anchors are viewable (probably just padding-bottom:1200px or something)
06:34 < fenn> there are bottom anchors?
06:34 < fenn> last thing i see is 'Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!'
06:36 < fenn> i have something that mostly works now, using fileschanged (part of file alteration monitor)
06:37 < kanzure> if you click one of the last timestamps, the browser cannot auto-scroll to that location without increasing the total size of the page (which can be accomplished through css)
06:38 < fenn> if you're interested see /home/fenn/test_fam/call_irclog2html.sh
06:41 < fenn> fixed padding issue
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06:42 < kanzure> "Tesla is accumulating ~1 million miles of data every 10 hours fleet-wide"
06:42 < fenn> ... and doing nothing with it
06:43 < fenn> is there an open database for street view type stuff yet?
06:43 < fenn> also no reason to limit it to street view, could be anywhere really
06:44 < fenn> the ability to scroll around in time would be very useful, and sadly is lacking from google street view
06:48 < fenn> test
06:49 < fenn> apparently i dont understand something about gnusha. does it batch the log files into days once a day?
06:53 < fenn> disregard
06:59 < fenn> hrm
07:01 < fenn> stupid
07:01 < fenn> i always think "o" in chmod is for owner
07:01 < fenn> but it means exactly the opposite
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07:05 < kanzure> fenn: there is an openstreetview thing now, from the openstreetmap people
07:07 < fenn> test
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07:08 < fenn> seems to be working http://gnusha.org/logs/realtime_html_test/2016-09-23.html#t07:07
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07:12 < fenn> this would have been a lot easier if fam had an option to output only the filename
07:12 < fenn> s/fam/fileschanged/
07:16 < fenn> test
07:17 < kanzure> you aren't using my patch?
07:17 < kanzure> messages sent in the same minute don't work on your page
07:18 < kanzure> also it doesn't seem to be appending lines.
07:18 < kanzure> (or updating at all)
07:19 < fenn> it was stopped just now
07:19 < kanzure> your page doesn't distinguish between http://gnusha.org/logs/realtime_html_test/2016-09-23.html#t07:17 and http://gnusha.org/logs/realtime_html_test/2016-09-23.html#t07:17 and this makes me sad :(
07:20 < fenn> not sure how that's my fault? that was the anchor format irclog2html made
07:20 < fenn> anyway i like it better than having a longer anchor tag
07:20 < kanzure> right, it's a branch i made. i submitted it as a pull request to upstream.
07:21 < kanzure> well, you could remove the timestamps i suppose... my commit shows all the places to edit.
07:21 < gradstudentbot> The paper got rejected.
07:21 < fenn> i didnt actually look at the commit, or i didnt understand what it was
07:21 < kanzure> these links are the reason why i've neglected gnusha.org/logs/html/ for so long
07:22 < kanzure> https://github.com/mgedmin/irclog2html/pull/15/commits/c6855e398da65591b381af448e112256efe131ee
07:22 < fenn> where's the version of irclog2html i should be calling?
07:23 < kanzure> i'll install it..
07:23 < fenn> plz install it in gnusha so i'm not calling /home/bryan/whatever
07:24 < kanzure> done
07:26 < fenn> http://gnusha.org/logs/realtime_html_test/2016-09-23.html#t07:24-161
07:26 < fenn> i dont know why it didn't use its own irclog.css
07:27 < kanzure> there. now i will make a billion bookmarks for a billion trivial hplusroadmap things.
07:27 < kanzure> also you can use html/ if you want
07:28 < fenn> ok i will overwrite html now
07:31 < fenn> bloop
07:34 < kanzure> weird, my opennurbs rewrite thingy was in 2010? http://gnusha.org/logs/html/2010-08-11.log#t00:01-1
07:36 < fenn> now you know people are going to want to do live webchat using the html logs
07:36 < fenn> and this is where we must draw the line
07:37 < fenn> in defense of all that is sacred
07:39 < kanzure> live from 2010
07:40 < kanzure> fenn: 2016-09-23.html does not match the same filename as the other logs
07:41 < kanzure> others are .log.html
07:49 < fenn> uh. that thing you just linked was .log
07:49 < fenn> now i'm confused
07:50 < fenn> how does it know to send it as html mime type?
07:52 < gradstudentbot> Don't phage me, bro.
07:58 < kanzure> i think the web server does some introspection, and browsers of course will tend to do their own wacky html parsing
07:58 < kanzure> "the thing you just linked was .log" yes that's because the web server does not have a strict requirement for the .html extension for incoming url requests.
07:58 < fenn> also it has the full pathname now in the h1 header
07:59 < kanzure> but the bug i was reporting was that, on the file system, 2016-09-23.html does not follow the file naming conventions established for the previous files
07:59 < fenn> yes i changed it to do .log.html now
07:59 < kanzure> pathname seems to also be fixed
08:00 < kanzure> nope nevermind
08:00 < fenn> fixing pathname atm
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09:35 < ybit> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmAqdHJyPhE
09:35 < yoleaux> Christoph Gerber seminar on AFM technologies for non-invasive diagnostics - YouTube
09:38 < ybit> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n2RhhwkF4sU
09:38 < yoleaux> AFM in Basel - co-inventor Christoph Gerber describes the microscope's first development - YouTube
09:39 < ybit> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OznfvI-ZOgw&list=PLZvBi3FJSCFNBTwuROsyzOpaCPSbSMyEw&index=6
09:39 < yoleaux> AFM in Basel - Moritz Pfreundschuh uses AFM to measure protein interactions - YouTube
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12:09 < ybit> i ran into a smart kid today who's well studied in logics, category theory, and topology.. he has a b.sc in mechatronics and needs a job. anyone looking for his skill set or have some ideas on where he should look
12:11 < ybit> he just release a new version of his own language https://hackage.haskell.org/package/Delta-Lambda-0.2.0.0
12:12 < ybit> his nick is listofoptions on freenode
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14:43 < ybit> a university professor just mentioned these 10 things that he feels most software developers don't understand
14:43 < ybit> 1. what is a function   2. how do you reuse code   3. how do you build something with more than 5 files   4. how do you build something with more than 1 thread without spaghetti    5. what's a data structure and how is it different from a type   6. what is an AST   7. what is a message    8. synchronous vs asynchronous   9. CAP theorem   10. Alan Turing
14:56 < kanzure> "acoustic gravity wave"
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16:38 < maaku> ybit: send his resume my way
16:38 < maaku> if he gave you one :P
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16:47 < kanzure> saurik: any chance i could bug you about VOIP things?
16:55 < saurik> kanzure: it is probably possible to bug me. like, in general I'd probably enjoy talking about voip, but if you go out of your way to try you will probably succeed in annoying me enough to feel bugged (but why would you do that?)
16:57 < kanzure> saurik: okay thanks. sent you a few PMs.
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17:23 < kanzure> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/cgal-bindings
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19:01 < juul> BioHack The Planet Conference at Counter Culture Labs streaming in a few minutes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EM7ITgYCn6c
19:02 < kanzure> thanks.
19:02 < kanzure> will you field questions & heckling from irc?
19:03 < kanzure> http://biohacktheplanet.com/
19:04 < kanzure> http://biohacktheplanet.com/schedule/
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19:05 < kanzure> cory is still doing nitrogenase directed evolution...?
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21:14 < Proteus1> kanzure: do you know if this stream will be available somewhere once the talks are over?
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21:57 < fenn> "how do we safely exchange biological materials?" lol it's cheese
21:58 < fenn> i guess i should go to this
21:59 < juul> kanzure: sorry i was one-manning the whole operation today so didn't have my laptop but we'll do IRC questions all day tomorrow
21:59 < fenn> hm "sold out"
21:59 < juul> fenn: just show up
21:59 < fenn> juul: why is this the first i've heard of the event?
22:00 < juul> because the organizers did a bad job of it?
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22:00 < juul> if you need to, just say you're here for sudo room, head into sudo room and then come through the backstage entrace (up the stairs in sudo room)
22:01 < fenn> i'll make a VIP badge :P
22:01 < juul> any speaker who signs a release form we'll publish their talk as CC BY-SA 4.0
22:03 < juul> i should mention that the organizers didn't want to involve anyone else in decisionmaking and then expected last minute volunteers to do everythin
22:04 < kanzure> haha
22:05 < juul> i figured it was still worth it to record/stream the talks
22:05 < juul> lots of good people giving talks and showing up
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22:20 < Proteus1> juul: Thanks for the stream, it's much appreciated!
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22:35 < juul> Proteus1: :)
22:35 < kanzure> <-- defeated SIP, on to the next windmill
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23:01 < juul> was there any issues with the stream? (i know the audio dropped out for a few seconds at one point, but other than that)
23:01 < juul> i'm gonna try to force everyone to be on the stage with the spotlight on them tomorrow so they don't look all red and dark when standing in fron of the bright projected image
23:03 < juul> thank discordia for modern camera stabilization technology when Tomas just strated speaking on the floor of the room and I had to hand-hold the cam through his entire talk
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--- Log closed Sat Sep 24 00:00:03 2016