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03:34 < FourFire> Invited someone who is working on Brain Computer interface to this channel.
03:35 < ebowden> vonstraus?
03:36 < ebowden> Oh, derp, likely wouldn't be him. Was it though?
03:38 < FourFire> "Josh Penn-Pierson -"
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03:40 < newbie> greetings
03:41 < newbie> this channel was just refered on a discord mind-uploading server
03:41 < newbie> I am happy to see it has lots of users
03:41 < newbie> and george church's sentence on the topic makes me happy
03:42 < newbie> can anyone provide context or if possibly, the video?
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03:52 < FourFire> superkuh, nice illustration: there's something fundamentally wrong with human brains... until we enhance them.
03:52 < FourFire> newbie, check out the logs.
03:52 < newbie> ~thanks
03:53 < newbie> oh noes, no search... and too many logs
03:53 < newbie> anyway, I googled george saying that and only got a few irc chans' topics
03:53 < newbie> not the video or whatever
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04:44 < fenn> newbie: "ray kurzweil is a pessimist" george church quote https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q_zzFRjeGRI&t=2m10s
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04:52 < newbie> thanks fenn
04:53 < newbie> you're awesome :)
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05:18 < kanzure> newbie: greets
05:19 < newbie> hey kanzure
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05:23 < kanzure> newbie: here is a brain scanning thing http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/Rosetta%20brains:%20A%20strategy%20for%20molecularly-annotated%20connectomics%20-%20Marblestone%20-%20Church%20-%20Boyden%20-%202014.pdf
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05:52 < newbie> anyone interested in bioviva?
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06:08 < kanzure> search logs
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06:30 < newbie> kanzure, can you search accross .txts?
06:31 < kanzure> newbie: you can also download http://gnusha.org/logs/archives/
06:32 < newbie> thanks kanzure
06:33 < newbie> hmmm, I think they are linux only
06:34 < kanzure> you.. what
06:35 < newbie> tar.gz is a linux compression format, right?
06:35 < kanzure> you have an extremely huge misunderstanding about how computers work
06:35 < newbie> it could be worse
06:36 < kanzure> file formats do not depend on operating system type
06:36 < newbie> I was indoctrinated to think rar and zip were for windows and tar for linux, my bad
06:36  * newbie autoflogs
06:37 < kanzure> death2teachers
06:58 < newbie> kanzure, there's no grep on windows, can you teach me how to search across all these htmls, please?
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07:24 < kanzure> install linux in a vm
07:24 < kanzure> (virtual machine)
07:24 < kanzure> or cygwin; then you can use grep.
07:26 < kanzure> i also think there are builds of grep that target windows
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08:09 < kanzure> what on earth is a unicorn colony laser https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZKzjmqO_LUY
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08:23 < JayDugger> http://gundam.wikia.com/wiki/Colony_Laser
08:26 < kanzure> sounds a lot like a "galaxy gun" http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Galaxy_Gun
08:28 < kanzure> hrm, no, wrong superweapon.
08:49 < JayDugger> Cf. Niven's Wunderland Treatymaker and Ringworld Meteor Defense System and the laser pushers for lightsails that ended then first Man-Kzin War.
08:50 < JayDugger> There's also no doubt a bunch of starkly astounding crap in E. E. Smith's Lensmen books, but I grew up after the transistor and can't suspend disbelief that much.
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08:53 < JayDugger> Artificially induced solar flares as weapons have been used elsewhere in SF, probably first by Stapledon in Star Maker (1937), and pocket universes as projectiles by Walter Jon Williams in Implied Spaces (2008).
08:55 < JayDugger> But Hall's Weather Machine has the best units for measuring destructive potential: Hiroshimas per second.
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12:03 < nmz787_> head the name 3scan dropped at the microscopy symposium, I think in reference to what microscope they recently bought or something
12:04 < nmz787_> newbie: just install the GIT windows installer, and set the tools to be on your PATH (some radio button or checkbox during the install). then you'll have grep on cmdline (also I recommend conEmu for command line terminal on windows)
12:04 < nmz787_> s/head/heard/
12:05 < newbie> thanks nmz787_
12:06 < nmz787_> newbie: seems FourFire said you're working on brain computer interface, are you an analog EE type person?
12:06 < nmz787_> or a biochemist?
12:07 < newbie> no, I only have higshcool
12:07 < nmz787_> experimenting with electronics or just starting to investigate this stuff?
12:07 < newbie> I'm always the less intelligent people anywhere, you should not ask me difficult questions
12:08 < newbie> I'm just a transhumanist enthusiast because I want to live forever on this paradise full of asian sex
12:08 < newbie> it's as simple as that
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14:41 < andytoshi> we are looking for a mailing list for grin https://github.com/ignopeverell/grin/issues/13
14:41 < andytoshi> what is a good tor-accessible one?
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15:55 < Solvaring> Greetings
16:01 < fenn> newbie: well there's thailand, for the near term future
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16:07 < kanzure> Solvaring: greets
16:08 < Solvaring> :D
16:08 < Solvaring> I'm about to go back to school to continue my computer science education. I've been looking into nootropics and after hearing a report on NPR the other day i've decided to experiment.
16:09 < Solvaring> did it just cut out the first part of my post?
16:09 < Solvaring> I'm about to go back to school to continue*
16:10 < Solvaring> I've got some PEA, Phenibut, and Adrafinil coming but i've read these are things to be taken sparingly. I currently take lemon balm and was wondering what else i could supplement as an 'every day' substance
16:11 < fenn> what benefit do you expect to gain from PEA?
16:12 < Solvaring> Well i go to the gym once or twice a week, and I read that it's working its way from the body building community into the nootropics community, it's reported to give mental clarity and energy and the first 20-30 minutes after taking it people report mild euphoria
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16:12 < fenn> yes if you take shit tons
16:13 < Solvaring> I'm a high-strung person, moderate anxiety/social anxiety, find it hard to focus, and have moderate Anhedonia from years of opiate abuse, i'm currently on Suboxone maintenance.
16:13 < fenn> i recommend taking a tablespoon of magnesium citrate solution morning and night, available at your local drugstore and maybe grocery store
16:13 < Solvaring> Whenever i get back into school i trick myself into the same old things thinking my old substances will make me do better but i'm not going to make that same mistake this time, still I feel like i need some help.
16:13 < Solvaring> a boost
16:14 < fenn> if you have a history of abusing euphoriants then i doubly recommend against PEA
16:15 < fenn> it can be terribly addictive with certain drug interactions and this is not widely known
16:15 < Solvaring> really? i figured it was the least dangerous of the 3 things i ordered. I read that the workout community has used it for years.
16:16 < Solvaring> so will PEA not be effective for mental clarity unless i take large doses? which then makes it dangerous because of the addictive side effects.
16:16 < fenn> afaik it won't do anything unless you take large doses because it won't cross the blood brain barrier
16:16 < Solvaring> ahh
16:16 < Solvaring> hmm
16:17 < Solvaring> What about the fat burning qualities?
16:17 < Solvaring> I read to take it 30 minutes before my workout.
16:17 < fenn> bodybuilding is not my area of expertise
16:18 < Solvaring> yeah
16:18 < Solvaring> okay ill look that up
16:18 < fenn> you may want to try phenylalanine
16:19 < Solvaring> okay, what does the magnesium citrate help with?
16:19 < fenn> anxiety and muscle tension
16:19 < fenn> it dampens the adrenaline response
16:19 < fenn> also it's generally a good thing to have; most americans are deficient in magnesium
16:20 < Solvaring> ah okay
16:20 < Solvaring> oh it looks to be a stool softener
16:20 < fenn> not really
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16:20 < Solvaring> hmm okay
16:20 < fenn> if you take more than you can absorb it holds onto water
16:20 < fenn> and then you get diarrhea
16:21 < Solvaring> ahh ok
16:21 < Solvaring> I just saw someone recommends Magnesium Glycinate ofter the citrate
16:21 < fenn> sure
16:21 < Solvaring> does it matter?
16:21 < Solvaring> ok
16:22 < Solvaring> Whatever it's bound to just effects how it gets absorbed i assume?
16:22 < Solvaring> Citrate, Glycinate, Malatate
16:22 < fenn> glycinate is more bioavailable so you can overdose on it and get hypermagnesemia instead of just diarrhea :D
16:22 < Solvaring> oo
16:22 < Solvaring> >.<
16:23 < Solvaring> What about L-Theanine? I've read lots of good stuff about using that one every day, some studies suggest it's one of the things in green tea that helps Japanese Monks meditate for hours and hours
16:23 < fenn> so if you're really deficient in magnesium then glycinate is the way to go, but you'll get there eventually with just citrate
16:23 < Solvaring> Okay cool
16:23  * Solvaring is writing these things down
16:23 < superkuh> Does small milli/micro scale cavitation in venturi-like micro-fluidic setups also have the sterilizing effect that large scale hydrodynamic cavitation does?
16:24 < fenn> personally i don't like theanine, it just makes me feel on edge
16:24 < fenn> but some people use it *shrug*
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16:26 < fenn> superkuh i dunno about cavitation but large pressure swings can lyse bacterial cells
16:26 < Solvaring> oh Theanine makes some people feel on edge?
16:26 < Solvaring> that is definitely not what I want >.<
16:27 < fenn> try it and find out
16:27 < fenn> the problem with nootropics and supplements is there's so many
16:28 < Solvaring> yeah
16:28 < fenn> if you take 50 new things at once, you don't know what caused an improvement or side effect
16:28 < Solvaring> and a lot of the research isn't super clear cut like it is for normal pharmaceuticals.
16:28 < Solvaring> yeah i'll try things one at a time to start
16:29 < Solvaring> right now i've been taking lemon balm for almost a week, not sure if I notice anything.
16:34 < fenn> so you've got a bunch of GABA analogues in your stack, you might want to look at NMDA antagonists instead
16:35 < fenn> phenylalanine is an NMDA antagonist and dopamine precursor
16:36 < Solvaring> yep i just read that, it's an essential amino acid that your body can make use of to create all kinds of good stuff.
16:37 < fenn> nutrition is important but we are bio-hacking
16:37 < fenn> eat lots of salmon and spinach, yadda yadda
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16:37 < Solvaring> I also just read that phenibut is an antagonist to PEA, apparently it will reverse the effects of PEA?
16:38 < fenn> no i wouldn't say they're opposites
16:39 < fenn> PEA is a stimulant and phenibut is a sedative, but that doesn't mean nothing happens when you take both
16:40 < Solvaring> you said my stack was full of GABA analogues, i know that Phenibut is GABA with a phenyl ring, but Adrafinil to my knowledge doesn't do anything with GABA.
16:40 < Solvaring> Does PEA do something to GABA as well?
16:40 < fenn> lemon balm increases GABA
16:41 < Solvaring> Yep, was just about to get to that one.
16:41 < Solvaring> okay
16:41 < Solvaring> NMDA i'll look that up right now
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16:44 < Solvaring> ahhh
16:45 < Solvaring> related to ketamine
16:45 < fenn> yes
16:46 < fenn> try just magnesium and phenylalanine first though
16:46 < fenn> most NMDA antagonists are hard to get a hold of, for stupid legal reasons
16:47 < Solvaring> yeahh
16:47 < Solvaring> they look a bit heavy
16:47 < Solvaring> good for relaxing but stronger ones impair working memory?
16:47 < fenn> yep they definitely do
16:48 < fenn> compare to being drunk
16:48 < fenn> similar to*
16:49 < fenn> anyway the dose makes the poison
16:49 < Solvaring> hmm
16:49 < Solvaring> yeah, i just read a small dose of dxm at night before bed helps if one is using racetams
16:50 < fenn> as far as actual nootropics, rather than ... anxiolytics. i've had good experience combining caffeine and piracetam and vinpocetine
16:50 < fenn> i should probably play around with mod/adrafinil
16:50 < Solvaring> those can be taken on a daily basis?
16:50 < Solvaring> yeah, modafinil apparently is prescription only
16:51 < fenn> yes, but cycle vinpocetine every couple weeks
16:51 < Solvaring> Adrafinil though im excited to try out
16:51 < fenn> adrafinil is just a slightly less safe prodrug of modafinil
16:51 < Solvaring> yep
16:51 < Solvaring> slightly less safe?
16:51 < fenn> higher risk of severe rash
16:51 < Solvaring> ahh
16:51 < Solvaring> hmm
16:52 < Solvaring> okay
16:52 < Solvaring> i'll keep that in mind
16:52 < fenn> er, whoops liver toxicity
16:52 < Solvaring> ohhh
16:52 < Solvaring> I just had my Hepatitis C cured, i dont need to worry about that anymore :D
16:52 < Solvaring> not like i used to anyway
16:52 < Solvaring> i only had it for a few years, it didnt have time to do any damage
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16:53 < fenn> good thing you live in the future
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16:53 < Solvaring> There are so many cognition enhancing things out there, it's hard to figure out what exactly to take, what do i need, what am i deficient in.
16:53 < Solvaring> haha yes, im very grateful i got the treatment.
16:53 < fenn> "Relative to adrafinil, modafinil possesses greater specificity in its action, lacking or having a reduced incidence of many of the common side effects of the former (including stomach pain, skin irritation, anxiety, and elevated liver enzymes with prolonged use)"
16:54 < Solvaring> I found a test created by neuroscientist out on the web that is supposed to give a subjective view on what neurotransmitters and such one is efficient and deficient in
16:54 < fenn> lol i just saw that
16:54 < fenn> braverman?
16:54 < Solvaring> not sure what it's worth but i'll try it
16:54 < Solvaring> Yes
16:55 < Solvaring> I used to consider myself well versed in taking chemicals but looking into nootropics i feel like i know nothing
16:55 < Solvaring> need to take a biology course or something lol
16:56 < fenn> hum maybe i should print this braverman questionnaire out and give it to people
16:57 < kanzure> ok fine we'll use an extension block
16:57 < kanzure> er, sidechain ish
16:58 < fenn> i see some cognitive subprocess has returned
16:58 < fenn> also you can totally transfer digital ownership rights for fine art nyaa
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16:59 < kanzure> no i'm just about to board
16:59 < kanzure> an airplane
16:59 < kanzure> it's not much of a return.
16:59 < kanzure> (i was pestering andytoshi in pm)
16:59 < Solvaring> yep i printed out the test yesterday
16:59 < Solvaring> going to take it
17:04 < fenn> snort that shit
17:10 < Solvaring> snort what shit?
17:14 < fenn> (the test)
17:17 < Solvaring> haha
17:18 < Solvaring> next time i get paid i'll make sure to pick up magnesium and look into the racetams and phenylanine
17:24 < fenn> magnesium is pretty cheap, a $2 bottle will last you a couple weeks
17:24 < Solvaring> ah okay maybe ill go get some tomorrow then
17:25 < fenn> well, a week
17:25 < fenn> $1/1.5 week is my final offer
17:26 < Solvaring> hahaha
17:26 < Solvaring> xD
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17:27 < Solvaring> wow the more i keep reading
17:27 < Solvaring> the more im getting distracted from writing my code
17:27 < Solvaring> i think biohacking will become my new addiction
17:27 < Solvaring> making my brain STRONGER!
17:27 < fenn> biochemistry is definitely a rabbit hole
17:27 < Solvaring> FASTER
17:27 < Solvaring> BETTER
17:27 < Solvaring> Writing more code, more 1's more 0's!
17:27 < fenn> 10x more
17:27 < Solvaring> More CPU register diagrams! More architecture knowledge!
17:27 < Solvaring> xD
17:28 < fenn> what sort of code are you writing?
17:28 < Solvaring> Hopefully this turns out better than my last few chemical obsessions. Needless to say they ended very poorly.
17:28 < fenn> or not writing
17:28 < Solvaring> I managed to pull myself out of it though :P
17:28 < Solvaring> Python mainly
17:28 < Solvaring> took a Python course last year
17:28 < fenn> python is a long way from register diagrams
17:28 < Solvaring> currently experimenting with writing a debugger
17:28 < Solvaring> ahh
17:28 < Solvaring> you would think so
17:28 < Solvaring> but it's not
17:29 < Solvaring> I'm going through the AMD64 cpu manual
17:29 < Solvaring> learning about the debug registers of my CPU
17:29 < Solvaring> because i need to do a lot of bitwise operations, shifting bits into appropriate registers for handling breakpoints
17:30 < Solvaring> and i'm using a lot of code provided by the C types library
17:30 < Solvaring> so that got me down the path of having a rudimentary understanding of C and C++, which was the first code i ever wrote back when i was like 15
17:30 < Solvaring> wrote a 'choose your own adventure' console game
17:30 < Solvaring> text based
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17:31 < Solvaring> and then the wikipedia rabbit hole of the C language taught me a little history about it's initial development along with ALGOL
17:32 < Solvaring> and how it's basically one step removed from assembly language, or it was at the time, is how it was described.
17:32 < Solvaring> My Aunt writes assembly for NASA, writes code for satellites, can't wait to ask her some questions this Christmas.
17:32 < Solvaring> I'm 25 now, it took me a long time to get my shit together, but i'm finally doing it.
17:33 < Solvaring> And i'll finally conquer MATH!
17:33 < Solvaring> I've made a commitment to myself to take lots of Math and learn it well.
17:34 < Solvaring> because in Math, there is always a right answer, and I enjoy being right :P
17:34 < fenn> there's still a lot of new C code being written, but you have to really know it well, including all the weird idioms
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17:35 < fenn> i'm a fan of cython
17:36 < fenn> math is overrated
17:36 < Solvaring> hmm cython that's one i've only heard about
17:37 < fenn> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_letters_used_in_mathematics,_science,_and_engineering#Concepts_represented_by_a_Greek_letter
17:37 < Solvaring> not quite sure what makes cython since Python is implemented in C and python has libraries like C types and CFFI
17:38 < fenn> also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mathematical_symbols
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17:40 < fenn> you can compile cython
17:41 < Solvaring> ahh yes
17:41 < Solvaring> there is that part
17:42 < fenn> huh cool "The Sage notebook allows transparently editing and compiling Cython code simply by typing %cython at the top of a cell and evaluate it"
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17:50 < Solvaring> going afk for a bit
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19:57 < fenn> this braverman subjective neurotransmitter test is a bunch of crap
19:58 < fenn> it's impossible to honestly answer most of the questions because they're so morally loaded and depend heavily on what sort of people you interact with
19:59 < fenn> it's definitely skewed to the "yep you're deficient in X" bias
19:59 < fenn> but the basis vectors just dont seem to make any sense
19:59 < fenn> like everything was 50% true 50% false for me
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20:04 < fenn> "I am now doing pretty much the opposite of what the Braverman assessment recommended and I'm doing better than ever"
20:07 < Solvaring> LOL
20:07 < Solvaring> i have a 15 month old so
20:07 < Solvaring> i go through periods of being very busy
20:07 < Solvaring> lol
20:07 < Solvaring> have to run to store now
20:07 < Solvaring> sooo i think
20:07 < Solvaring> besides what you reccomended
20:07 < Solvaring> gonna give
20:07 < Solvaring> noopept+choline a try
20:07 < fenn> ok can't hurt
20:08 < Solvaring> at first was gonna go the racetam+choline route
20:08 < fenn> noopept is a racetam
20:08 < Solvaring> actually
20:08 < Solvaring> from what i read
20:08 < Solvaring> technically it is not
20:08 < Solvaring> but they said it works the same way
20:08 < Solvaring> and it is more bioavailable
20:09 < Solvaring> i would love it if i could remember even a full 25% of every programming thing I read and write down every day
20:09 < Solvaring> since i haven't been in school im a big fan of online tutorials and downloading books in PDF format and then reading them and hammering out the exercises and studying the code
20:09 < fenn> try graduated interval recall (automatic flash card apps)
20:09 < Solvaring> ooh
20:10 < Solvaring> okay :D
20:10 < fenn> works best if "knowledge" is easily divided into "facts"
20:10 < Solvaring> yeah i got so many notebooks full of programming notes
20:10 < Solvaring> i write down everything to help reinforce it into my memory
20:10 < fenn> take a look at anki
20:11 < Solvaring> alright i will
20:11 < Solvaring> once i get back
20:11 < Solvaring> gotta throw a fluffy suit onto my daughter
20:11 < Solvaring> and run to the grocery store forrrrr
20:11 < Solvaring> coffee creamer, and milk
20:11 < fenn> TMI
20:12 < Solvaring> AWAY!!!
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20:54 < fenn> Solvaring: phenibut has been described as "horribly addictive" in multiple places, so, probably not a good idea
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21:46 < Solvaring> ah yrs
21:46 < Solvaring> yes*
21:46 < Solvaring> I saw that
21:48 < Solvaring> im very curious about it though, in all honesty im craving something that will give me a clear and relaxed buzz, i've had a poor mood coupled with anxiety and a general 'blah' that i can't shake
21:48 < Solvaring> i probably shouldn't
21:49 < Solvaring> I get drug tested regularly as part of my suboxone maintenance program to keep me away from the hard stuff and i've failed at trying to use those responsibly so many times coupled with the fact that it severely hampers my mental faculties, i know i can't try it again
21:51 < Solvaring> when i first started with the normal gamut of mind altering substances i excelled in school for a short time, and then it became not maintainable as the doses needed to increase it increasingly destroyed my memory and ability to function
21:54 < Solvaring> there must be some magical combination out there that can give me what im seeking without destroying me in the process
21:56 < Solvaring> oh wow just realized how much time has elapsed, fenn
21:56 < Solvaring> there we go
21:57 < Solvaring> a mention should get your attention :P
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23:03 < kanzure> okay back
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--- Log closed Mon Nov 07 00:00:43 2016