--- Log opened Sat Feb 25 00:00:01 2017
--- Day changed Sat Feb 25 2017
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03:48  * adlai has still not seen a good argument that aging is bad... let's put it this way - aging accelerates the arrival of grey goo by removing less-colorless biomass that competes over resources with grey goo's future creators
04:13 < fenn> apologies for potentially off topic, but how can i ignore the supervillain-like name "Dr. Spectre"? https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/big-data-cambridge-analytica-brexit-trump
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04:24 < fenn> are there warez copies of these huge databases sold by companies like nielsen and acxiom? tools like palantir are only useful if you have the data to work with in the first place
04:36 < adlai> might someday be a viable business model alternative for ransomware devs
04:37 < fenn> they wouldn't be stealing the database from the database company, but rather from their customers
04:39 < fenn> in which case it's no sweat off the customer's back
04:52 < adlai> fwiw i wouldn't call the article OT although i wish it linked to more of Kosinski's research rather than just anecdotally cherrypicking results
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05:34 < kanzure> adlai: aging is literally damage
05:35 < adlai> biological garbage collection
05:35 < adlai> realtime to boot - no global delays
05:36 < chris_99> how's it garbage collection?
05:48  * adlai used the term very liberally, roughly as "the genotypes that survive over time are those that remain fit through environmental changes, those who's fitness has decreased (whether through decay of the organism due, or inability to replicate in the changed environment) are eventually pruned"
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05:52 < chris_99> ah i think i misunderstood what you meant
05:54 < chris_99> i see what you mean now
05:56 < kanzure> adlai: if you are arguing that death is good, that's one thing. but you can still kill/murder people even if they are young, so i don't see your point.
05:58 < adlai> 'aging' suggests something caused by the organism/species/phenotyptome's environment integrated over time, rather than action taken by individuals based on judgement
05:58 < streety> Why should be lay down and die to speed the arrival of grey goo? I've no fondness or allegiance wih grey goo.
05:58 < streety> Also, genotypes are pruned by extinction, not by aging and death
05:58 < adlai> no, you should work to accelerate it. otherwise it will simulate you burning in hell (computronium is conscious, duh)
05:59 < streety> even accepting that, seems separate from aging/death
06:00 < kanzure> i am very confused
06:01 < kanzure> adlai: are you arguing that aged bodies are more functional/healthy?
06:01  * adlai is also confused (most likely stemming from ignorance) about the difference between extinction and death sufficiently pluralized
06:02 < adlai> kanzure: no? i think those are orthogonal with age. i guess my point boils down to anti-aging being nice for us as individuals, but not ~necessarily~ an evolutionarily wise approach
06:03 < adlai> this is getting rather political though so let's go back to discussing how to hack politics using data
06:03 < kanzure> there ain't no evolutionary guarantees anyway, you lookin' in the wrong place
06:05 < streety> I suppose if you take it out to the extreme extinction is just the death of all members of a species. Not clear how the death of all humans would eccelerate any technological advances though
06:07 < streety> .title http://www.cell.com/cell/fulltext/S0092-8674(17)30130-7
06:07 < yoleaux> streety: Sorry, that doesn't appear to be an HTML page.
06:08 < adlai> Fasting-Mimicking Diet Promotes Ngn3-Driven beta-Cell Regeneration to Reverse Diabetes
06:08 < streety> potential regeneration of cells thought to be hard to induce proliferation in using a cycling fasting diet
06:08 < streety> thanks adlai
06:08 < streety> not sure why yoleaux had trouble with that
06:08 < adlai> probably the redirect thru elsevier
06:09 < streety> on principle?
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08:51 < fenn> i never knew the story behind this painting https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christina's_World
08:52 < fenn> "The woman in the painting is likely to have suffered from Charcot-Marie-Tooth disease, a genetic polyneuropathy. Wyeth was inspired to create the painting when he saw her crawling across a field"
08:56 < fenn> "The challenge to me was to do justice to her extraordinary conquest of a life which most people would consider hopeless," he wrote. "If in some small way I have been able in paint to make the viewer sense that her world may be limited physically but by no means spiritually, then I have achieved what I set out to do."
09:23 < C0MPAQ_> fenn: pathetic
09:23 < fenn> really, that's what you have to say?
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09:24 < C0MPAQ_> its a simple painting, depicting a diseased woman crawling up a hill
09:26 < fenn> wyeth spent about 20 years obsessing over this woman and depicting her life
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09:33 < Alsike> i see the appeal though
09:33 < Alsike> compared to more mundane subject matter
09:34 < Alsike> most paintings are simple
09:34 < Alsike> its up to the interpretation of it for anyone to make it hold value
09:39 < kanzure> what's with the pro-aging anti-nanotech anti-dna influx of users
09:40 < fenn> i don't think anyone's pro-aging
09:41 < fenn> i think adlai was saying he prefers nanotech to immortal boring people
09:42 < Alsike> anyone familiar in decellularization here
09:43 < kanzure> delinquentme was selling some sort of extracellular matrix product
09:43 < fenn> do you mean CLARITY or ghost heart stuff
09:43 < Alsike> ghost heart stuff
09:44 < Alsike> i've been decelling lots of tissue and stuff with surfactants
09:44 < fenn> i saw one they had made at counter culture but i don't know the protocol myself
09:44 < Alsike> next step is to try and get stem cells to latch on and grow, but i have no clue how i even start with that
09:45 < fenn> shove a chicken through a needle and you're set :P
09:45 < kanzure> the 3d printing tissue culture people seem to think that as long as you make enough grooves the cells will just get stuck in there
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09:45 < kanzure> greetings casper_87
09:45 < Alsike> hm
09:46 < fenn> ok so it's more like, do a trypsin digestion and incubate in phosphate buffered saline
09:46 < fenn> ugh tissue culture is hard
09:47 < fenn> vascularized tissue is another level of hard on top of that
09:47 < kanzure> organoids seem to do it
09:48 < C0MPAQ_> are anti-pidgeon bioweapons within reach of homebrew DNA sequencing?
09:48 < C0MPAQ_> I might want to contribute to make that happen
09:48 < kanzure> you mean dna synthesis, not sequencing
09:48 < C0MPAQ_> yes
09:49 < kanzure> you are never going to make viable bioweaponry if you get the fucking details wrong
09:50 < kanzure> anyway, pick an appropriate avian virus genome and manufacture it https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/genomes/GenomesGroup.cgi?taxid=10239
09:52 < fenn> i thought the point of organoids was that they were not vascularized
09:52  * kanzure chex https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organoid
09:52 < fenn> they're small enough to be ok with just diffusion
09:53 < fenn> less than the size of a sesame seed
09:53 < C0MPAQ_> those are all too dangerous, maybe a virus that just causes excessive vomiting would be appropriate
09:54 < fenn> "Lacking a blood supply, cerebral organoids reach about 4 mm across"
09:54 < kanzure> ah.
09:55 < kanzure> hm.
09:55 < kanzure> maybe there's a cancer somewhere that causes excessive vascularization and we should just steal those mutations
09:55 < kanzure> lots of tumors end up vascularized, right?
09:56 < C0MPAQ_> good point
09:56 < fenn> a better anti-pigeon bioweapon is the peregrine falcon
09:56 < fenn> "In urban areas, the main component of the peregrine's diet is the rock or feral pigeon, which comprise 80% or more of the dietary intake for peregrines in some cities."
09:58 < casper_87> he llo sirs cheers
09:59 < fenn> ok this is a use of the word "hack" i hadn't heard of: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hack_(falconry)
10:02 < kanzure> "Non-interactive zero knowledge proofs of discrete log equivalence" https://moderncrypto.org/mail-archive/curves/2017/000850.html
10:04 < casper_87> this is cool https://www.technologyreview.com/s/603492/10-breakthrough-technologies-2017-reversing-paralysis/?utm_medium=native_social&utm_source=facebook&utm_campaign=10bt_traffic&utm_content=paralysis_story
10:05 < casper_87> some one have a paper or stuff about how control brain of animals ?
10:06 < casper_87> Anyone can give to me a reference ?
10:06 < kanzure> casper_87: http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/implants/
10:06 < kanzure> casper_87: or the optogenetics papers in http://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/neuro/
10:08 < fenn> .title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p2TcAA7VqmM&t=1474s
10:08 < yoleaux> The future of genetic codes and BRAIN codes - YouTube
10:08 < fenn> hmm
10:09 < fenn> george church strikes again
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10:10 < kanzure> like a ninja
10:11 < kanzure> did you see the 2016-05-10 transcripts?
10:11 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/hgp-write/2016-05-10/
10:11 < kanzure> http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/hgp-write/2016-05-10/from-recoli-to-1-million-genomes/
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10:19 < kanzure> just bought airfare yesterday to go to the may 2017 version of that conference
10:19 < kanzure> will be out of town may 7 through june 1st
10:23 < kanzure> .title http://bamos.github.io/2016/08/09/deep-completion/
10:23 < yoleaux> Image Completion with Deep Learning in TensorFlow
10:25 < kanzure> "Also, you can perform vector arithmetic on the z input space. The following is on a network trained to produce faces."
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10:49 < fenn> how are you supposed to make 3 billion edits in a single organism?
10:49 < fenn> (from that transcript q&a)
10:50 < kanzure> whole genome synthesis
10:50 < kanzure> that's what the new human genome project is about
10:50 < kanzure> (hgp-write)
10:50 < fenn> but that would have the same genome for every cell
10:50 < fenn> he's talking about 3 billion cells each with a different genotype (different by 1 mutation)
10:51 < kanzure> his MAGE technique is one way; but yeah he wants really really high throughput write capability :).
10:51 < kanzure> you could do microfluidics and inject a custom genotype into each cell
10:51 < fenn> into a mouse? what?
10:51 < kanzure> maybe i should look at context
10:52 < fenn> maybe my brain isn't working right or maybe there isn't enough information there to make sense of what he's saying
10:52 < kanzure> oh the haplo-insufficiency question?
10:52 < kanzure> oh oh okay,
10:52 < fenn> the first question
10:52 < kanzure> so he's talking about doing a billion different genotypes and testing each embryo
10:52 < kanzure> and then checking the outcomes
10:52 < fenn> does that mean 3 billion mice?
10:53 < kanzure> no, these are just cell blobs
10:53 < kanzure> small cell blobs at most
10:54 < kanzure> perhaps the video is more clear
10:54 < fenn> i am watching this part of the video for the fourth time
10:54 < kanzure> link is wrong in the file, it's 39m 50s
10:54 < kanzure> (the start is 39m 50s)
10:55 < fenn> maybe the key phrase here is "in principle"
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10:55 < kanzure> "To some extent the cis-regulatory element, if they are subtle, they are independent... they are not necessarily influencing heterzygous state in gene B, so you could change them simultaneously and then read them out in parallel in every cell of the body."
10:55 < kanzure> that's probably: every cell *type* of the body
10:56 < kanzure> oh, no, it's george church so he might really mean eveyr cell in parallel heh
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11:05 < fenn> they gotta be kidding if they expect "oh no we're just doing this in somatic cells, not germline" to quell the inevitable shitstorm
11:06 < kanzure> it's DRM basically and i hate them for it
11:06 < fenn> as if it's all that different a protocol
11:06 < kanzure> it doesn't prevent me from using genome synthesis tech to make that chromosome
11:06 < fenn> it's the exact same protocol
11:06 < kanzure> yes, it's completely insulting
11:08 < fenn> backing up, if there is in fact a way to speed up genome analysis by 3 billion times, that seems pretty important
11:09 < kanzure> i think a lot of it is just "do combinatorial things" and there hasn't been any engineering put into that setup yet (or funding?)
11:09 < fenn> so MAGE does directed evolution by causing mutation systematically
11:09 < fenn> but this would only work for analyzing single cell organism genomes
11:09 < fenn> i guess he's saying it doesn't matter that cells interact?
11:11 < kanzure> maybe he's hoping a lot of the gene products are steady-state regardless of interaction
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11:24 < nmz787_> http://sam.zeloof.xyz/
11:24 < nmz787_> .title
11:24 < yoleaux> Sam Zeloof - DIY Electronics Projects
11:24 < nmz787_> @home semiconductor fab
11:26 < fenn> swapping codons for virus resistance is a neat idea
11:26 < fenn> not sure i'd want my children to require a DNA synthesizer to breed though
11:27 < nmz787_> that's the best way to breed
11:27 < fenn> .wik ooloi
11:27 < yoleaux> "Lilith's Brood is a collection of three works by Octavia Butler. The three volumes of this science fiction series (Dawn, Adulthood Rites, and Imago) were previously collected in the now out of print volume, Xenogenesis. The collection was first published under the current title of Lilith's Brood in 2000." -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ooloi
11:27 < nmz787_> I mean the most trendy
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12:11 < kanzure> yep
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12:39 < kanzure> fenn: they are still accepting project proposals for hgp-write
12:40 < fenn> i don't really know what that means
12:40 < kanzure> it's grant money basically
12:40 < kanzure> http://engineeringbiologycenter.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Pilot-Project-Proposal-Form.pdf
12:40 < fenn> that's just a blank piece of paper
12:41 < kanzure> for example, the "make essential fatty acid synthesis part of the human genome" was one of the submitted proposals and i think they are funding that now
12:41 < kanzure> ( http://diyhpl.us/wiki/transcripts/hgp-write/2016-05-10/synthesizing-a-prototrophic-human-genome/ )
12:41 < fenn> oh i thought they wanted like, "super awesome scheme for assembling light directed oligos"
12:42 < kanzure> i hope they do stuff like that too
12:42 < fenn> don't we have a zillion potential genome edits already?
12:42 < fenn> the obvious one is to fix vitamin C synthesis
12:42 < kanzure> small edits yes, although i think they are looking for more justifications for large-scale synthesis and big edits not just small changes
12:43 < kanzure> yes i think vitamin c is missing on that page
12:44 < fenn> so obvious it's apparently not on that last link :D
12:44 < kanzure> it's on http://diyhpl.us/wiki/genetic-modifications/ at least
12:48 < fenn> nutritional stuff seems easier to implement with a custom microbiome
12:50 < fenn> eh but then you have to figure out how to keep the good bugs alive
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12:50 < fenn> i think i need to sleep
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12:50 < fenn> in any case i'm not going to come up with a grant proposal right now
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12:59 < yashgaroth> prototrophic humans are great and all, but surely it's a lot easier to engineer a plant to produce all sufficient nutrients...unless you're in some edge case where a person has to survive on glucose for a year
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13:01 < yashgaroth> or at least get gut bacteria to do it, I mean it's kind of a pain in the ass to engineer humans vs. any other organism
13:03 < kanzure> well they mentioned space travel,
13:03 < kanzure> but sure go ahead and propose your super potato
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13:03 < yashgaroth> or super radiation-eating fungus; that'll be my third proposal if I don't burn out writing them
13:04 < kanzure> it is not clear to me hwat quality they are expecting
13:05 < kanzure> maybe just "here's a few paragraphs, if you think this has legs then i'll write up something better"
13:05 < kanzure> because it seems rather informal to me at the moment
13:05 < yashgaroth> two page limit is very kind of them
13:08 < kanzure> https://www.reddit.com/r/DrugNerds/comments/5w01qx/the_neurotoxic_mechanisms_of_amphetamine_step_by/
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13:27 < kanzure> greetings WizJin
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13:42 < kanzure> electroporator has been shipped https://cibolo.us/pipermail/open_electroporator/2017-February/000411.html
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14:12 < kanzure> md5 collision demo http://www.mscs.dal.ca/~selinger/md5collision/
14:14 < kanzure> webkit svn still broken today https://arstechnica.com/security/2017/02/watershed-sha1-collision-just-broke-the-webkit-repository-others-may-follow/
14:19 < JayDugger> Fenn, do yourself a favor and don't read Butler's Xenogenesis trilogy. It's a very thinly veiled polemic.
14:21 < JayDugger> In the author's defense, she can write. So unlike other such attacks (cough! Atwood, The Handmaid's Tale, cough) the books aren't boring screeds.
14:21 < archels> "A private connection to cibolo.us can't be established because your computer's date and time (Saturday, February 25, 2017 at 11:20:10 PM) are incorrect."
14:22 < kanzure> archels: you're in the future
14:22 < JayDugger> If you're going to read Butler, stick to Mind of Mind and Patternmaster, which have the merit of being straightforward junk SF.
14:22 < JayDugger> Alright, today's good deed done.
14:23 < fenn> too late
14:23 < JayDugger> Shit.
14:23 < JayDugger> I tried.
14:23 < archels> oh, I missed the title in copy & paste. Chrome actually says "Your clock is ahead"
14:23 < fenn> i thought the writing was bad but the ideas were solid
14:23  * archels is halfway through Altered Carbon
14:23 < kanzure> archels: just saying that this stuff is now shipping physical units to some peeps https://github.com/kanzure/culture_shock
14:24 < archels> kanzure: my interest in it is the high-voltage power supply and related switching/sequencing
14:24 < JayDugger> Which ones?  "cancer as a trade good" was pretty neat.
14:25 < kanzure> archels: jcline had a lot of complaints about the power supply that i don't remember any more.  also you could pester nmz787_ if you want some details about this one.
14:25 < archels> incidentally, it's annoying when you commit electronics schematics as a .sch for some random CAD software but without a PDF dump
14:26 < kanzure> yea i guess we should pester john to fix this
14:26 < fenn> JayDugger: just the general structure of the 3 sexes was novel
14:27 < fenn> 3rd sex as mediator/recombinase organelle
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14:27 < JayDugger> Geez...I'd forgotten how old these books were.
14:28 < fenn> the aliens were always right though, it's not like she's shouting some obvious message like "slavery is bad mmkay"
14:29 < fenn> the problem was the humans were all worthless shits
14:30 < JayDugger> Somewhere, I think, IIRC, there's a literary analysis comparing Lovecraft's "A Shadow Over Innsmouth" to Butler's Xenogenesis. Let me know if that's of interest, and I'll see if I can dig up the details.
14:30 < kanzure> sure, we could use some more lovecraft up in this joint
14:31 < fenn> there's the generalized fear of tentacles
14:31 < fenn> or lust for tentacles
14:31 < fenn> or something
14:31 < JayDugger> I read them a few years after when they were first published, and I don't think they've held up well.
14:32 < JayDugger> http://search.informit.com.au/documentSummary;dn=374890677138870;res=IELAPA
14:32 < JayDugger> "Unlikely Utopians: Ecotopian Dreaming in H.P. Lovecraft's 'The Shadow over Innsmouth' and Octavia Butler's Lilith's Brood"
14:33 < JayDugger> Yes, that's a "real" paper.
14:33 < fenn> i don't understand, was xenogenesis supposed to be a dystopia?
14:33 < JayDugger> Ah? Post atomic war alien invasion?
14:33 < fenn> i mean it turned out pretty well all things considered
14:33 < JayDugger> Oh, and they really are to fuck you and steal your kids?
14:34 < JayDugger> Sorry, "are here to"
14:34 < fenn> still not seeing any problems
14:34 < fenn> near immortality, cure all disease, economic abundance, peace on earth, etc etc
14:35 < JayDugger> Did you miss the part about the human survivors being sterilzed?
14:35 < fenn> but mah freedoms
14:35 < fenn> they took er jahbs
14:36 < JayDugger> Yeah...the aliens' abilities could've handled that a lot better, but then the author wouldn't have had a story.
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16:08 < CheckDavid> When will we have human level AI?
16:08 < kanzure> what level of confidence do you need
16:09 < kanzure> you can put in your numbers here http://theuncertainfuture.com/
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16:20 < CheckDavid> 50% kanzure
16:21 < kanzure> yea use the applets
16:23 < CheckDavid> I'm on mobile. Will try it tomorrow
16:24 < CheckDavid> It's not loading here
16:24 < kanzure> probably wont work on mobile
16:28 < kanzure> "Moving towards user activated soft fork activation" https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/pipermail/bitcoin-dev/2017-February/013643.html
16:36 < kanzure> "Since miners already have the protocol level right to select whatever transaction they prefer (and not mine those they don't), it would be better if a miner could chose to not participate in triggering activation of something they won't use, but, without being a veto to the process (and all the ire they may have to experience as a consequence)."
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17:02 < kanzure> https://www.benzinga.com/pressreleases/17/02/p9080499/kernel-acquires-krs-to-build-next-generation-neural-interfaces
17:02 < kanzure> "Company adds Adam Marblestone as Chief Strategy Officer and Ed Boyden as Senior Scientific Advisor"
17:02 < kanzure> well there's your answer...
17:03 < kanzure> re: http://kernel.co/ and marblestone employment
17:05 < kanzure> "Challenges for brain emulation: why so difficult?" http://synapticlink.org/Brain%20Emulation%20Challenges.pdf (2012)
17:07 < kanzure> author was a lifer (20+ years) at sun http://cattell.net/rick/index.html
17:23 < kanzure> http://lifeboat.com/blog/2017/02/interview-liz-parrish (warning: video)
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17:58 < yashgaroth> kanzure: ok I wrote those two proposals...they're not gonna, like, steal it and get patents right? first to file is a bitch
17:58 < yashgaroth> not that I know or think these are necessarily patent-worthy, but still
18:00 < kanzure> welll, we could make some crypto proofs
18:00 < kanzure> gimme the files by email and i can create some timestamps that would prove the existence of the text as of ~today
18:00 < yashgaroth> well yes there is that, but first to file tho
18:01 < yashgaroth> I was gonna bcc you on the email anyway so that would work nicely
18:01 < kanzure> slap on a patent pending statement? :P
18:01 < yashgaroth> pending in my head, not sure if that counts
18:01 < kanzure> IANAL
18:02 < yashgaroth> yeah ok fuck it, I swear on george church's great bushy beard that I will have my vengeance on them if they pull anything
18:03 < kanzure> shit this guy is serious
18:05 < kanzure> ok creating timestamps
18:05 < yashgaroth> ty
18:07 < kanzure> sent
18:08 < yashgaroth> I don't really know how they work, but I'll scatter them across all my drives
18:08 < kanzure> great diagram
18:10 < yashgaroth> they took up the vast majority of my time, but I read through the text and was like "jeez even I need a diagram to understand this"
18:10 < kanzure> yashgaroth: so what is your personal estimation regarding the feasibility of recA assembly vs forcing/optimizing yeast to figure out assembly from short fragments
18:12 < yashgaroth> well I know most of the parts will work in vitro, but at least it's relatively easy to try out - the exonuclease I'm not 100% about it working correctly, eg the actual homology scanning might expose the ends so they get degraded prematurely
18:12 < kanzure> using an enzymatic system is nice because less moving parts, but it also seems more magical
18:12 < yashgaroth> man if you don't think yeast are magic I don't even know
18:12 < kanzure> they are magic but it's a different kind of magic
18:13 < kanzure> hm
18:13 < yashgaroth> definitely be a lot of optimizing ratios of all the enzymes and other components involved, but nothing too crazy
18:14 < yashgaroth> but I use the core recombinase enzymes erryday and I can detect 40 copies of target DNA in 10 minutes, so they must be doing an okay job
18:16 < kanzure> yeah, okay.
18:18 < yashgaroth> not to say that yeast couldn't do it too, but they're several levels above '5 enzymes in a tube' wrt complexity; certainly you can do some directed evolution but you still need robots for that
18:19 < yashgaroth> and they are convenient in the sense you can grow them up easy, but all these proteins express so well you can get a million reactions from a liter of e.coli
18:19 < yashgaroth> of course, I am biased
18:20 < kanzure> no, no, better to prefer simple enzyme systems if possible, i agree
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22:28 < nmz787_> I mean the most trendy
22:28 < nmz787_> oops
22:29 < nmz787_> yashgaroth: that's kinda what i've been thinking re: first to file
22:30 < yashgaroth> yeah, especially after the crispr ruling fiasco
22:30 < nmz787_> or just keep shit a trade secret and get bought out
22:31 < nmz787_> writing papers sucks anyway
22:32 < yashgaroth> writing patents too, hell, reading patents is worse than writing papers
22:40 < nmz787_> nah
22:40 < nmz787_> reading isn't as bad as writing
22:40 < nmz787_> imo
22:44 < yashgaroth> after you read the 400th claim, I feel that patents about 5%, about 10%, about 15%, about 20% worse
22:45 < yashgaroth> in certain embodiments, anyway
22:48 < yashgaroth> sorry, bad patent jokes
22:50 < nmz787_> maybe I just read wayyy less patents
22:51 < yashgaroth> I hope so, for your sanity
22:52 < nmz787_> .tell chris_99 I am reading this now http://web.mit.edu/8.13/8.13d/manuals/keithly-602-electrometer.pdf  (got one of these today).. thinking of hooking that PIN photodiode up to it, to check for x-rays in the FIB
22:52 < yoleaux> nmz787_: I'll pass your message to chris_99.
22:52 < nmz787_> does .tell chris_99 work mid-sentence?
22:52 < nmz787_> nope
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--- Log closed Sun Feb 26 00:00:43 2017