--- Log opened Fri Jan 31 00:00:24 2020
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01:02 < kanzure> hmph
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01:58 < nsh> what's hmphin' kanzure?
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05:10 < maaku> .title https://openai.com/blog/emergent-tool-use/
05:10 < EmmyNoether> Emergent Tool Use from Multi-Agent Interaction
05:35 < nsh> neat
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06:38 < nmz787> lsneff: that's called multiple personality disorder...
06:38 < nmz787> .title https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-14319-8
06:38 < EmmyNoether> Probing the physical limits of reliable DNA data retrieval | Nature Communications
06:38 < nmz787> .title https://bioengineeringcommunity.nature.com/users/341121-lee-organick/posts/58963-probing-the-physical-limits-of-reliable-dna-data-retrieval
06:38 < EmmyNoether> Probing the Physical Limits of Reliable DNA Data Retrieval | Nature Research Bioengineering Community
06:38 < lsneff> nmz: yes exactly haha
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10:59 < kanzure> nsh: i forgot san francisco is blah
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11:22 < nsh> ah yeah, it'll do that
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19:37 < delinquentme> yashgaroth,  re:  immunological reactions in cells
19:37 < delinquentme> The most important hallmark of MSCs, regardless of their tissue sources of origin, is that the MSCs do not express major histocompatibility complex class II antigens (human leukocyte antigen, DR receptors), thereby not provoking the host’s T-cell response on implantation.
19:39 < delinquentme> Anyways I got a message from bill andrews saying " weve already tried this and it doesnt work"
19:39 < delinquentme> I dont believe this to actually be the case but still some examining to do.
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20:11 < delinquentme> "MSC therapies have not been FDA-approved for treatment yet, but they have been approved for treatment in the European Union, Canada, and Australia"
20:11 < delinquentme> https://www.americordblood.com/uses-trials-treatments/
20:22 < jrayhawk> https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.01.30.927871v1.full.pdf wuhan coronavirus has magical horizontal gene transfers from *multiple* HIV variants to increase human host specificity
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20:27 < jrayhawk> gene hackers get to look forward to renewed interest from the FBI
20:38 < jrayhawk> this might be china's chernobyl
20:53 < fenn> are you implying that the mutation was intentionally engineered by humans?
20:54 < jrayhawk> ayup
20:55 < fenn> why then would they use a novel virus to start with?
20:58 < jrayhawk> The only angle I can figure, there, is that they wanted differential effects based on nationality and/or geography.
20:59 < fenn> can you elaborate on that explanation
20:59 < fenn> the way i see it, a novel virus is highly unpredictable, and thus would make a bad candidate for a vector
21:01 < jrayhawk> they wanted something with SARS-level effectiveness, but SARS was way too effective on the Chinese, so they were exploring around in the same family.
21:01 < jrayhawk> But I don't know.
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21:03 < jrayhawk> China *is* on the forefront of CCR5 modification, at least. :P
21:04 < fenn> heh. the vaccine deployment did not go as planned
21:15 < fenn> this would have been a very sophisticated modification
21:16 < fenn> it's one thing to just add a protein from HIV, but to modify the binding site of an existing protein, that requires expertise in structure prediction, and then you have to verify that it actually works as intended
21:17 < fenn> forget chernobyl, this might be biotech's stuxnet
21:18 < fenn> or worse
21:19 < jrayhawk> Has anyone confirmed He's location in prison in the past six months?
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21:21 < MarkOtaris> It's already been pointed out that the inserts aren't specific to HIV
21:22 < MarkOtaris> And that the same have evolved independently in many other viruses, including coronaviruses
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21:57 < fenn> i can't even get blast to return any results
21:58 < fenn> it's annoying that they didn't include the DNA sequences
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22:06 < yashgaroth> delinquentme, even if the MSCs don't express any HLA antigens (which I doubt, since cells that don't present immune recognition peptides are targeted and destroyed) then their descendant differentiated cells will anyway
22:10 < yashgaroth> I find it funny that people are saying "those sequences also show up in a bat coronavirus, therefore it must have been a natural mutation" when the bat coronavirus genome sequence in question was uploaded by a Wuhan team two days ago (& 'collected' 6 years ago)
22:11 < MarkOtaris> That'd be a good point if it didn't show up in other viruses too :/
22:11 < MarkOtaris> Anyway you can search for the motif alignments in table 1
22:12 < yashgaroth> the first fragment only showed up in 'hypothetical protein [uncultured marine virus]'
22:13 < yashgaroth> saying that a short sequence would show up by chance like they're claiming doesn't hold weight, since any short sequence will get hits across a number of genomes
22:13 < yashgaroth> fragments 3 and 4 are stretches though
22:14 < yashgaroth> ah "expected random hits" was the term being used
22:14 < MarkOtaris> It only needs to be similar.
22:16 < yashgaroth> I don't think they were engineering it in wuhan, though I'll have to check where the supposed fragments lie in gp120's 3d structure, since 1-3 are so nicely colocalized in the coronavirus structure
22:17 < yashgaroth> ...tomorrow
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22:18 < MarkOtaris> There's still no particular reason to look at gp120 if they show up in many other places already.
22:20 < fenn> if i'm reading fig. S2 right, only insertions 1 and 4 are unique to 2019-nCoV, and 2 and 3 are present in the bat virus
22:23 < MarkOtaris> "very unique"? ha
22:23 < MarkOtaris> But none of them is unique.
22:23 < fenn> that's not what i meant
22:24 < fenn> of the four insertions they have called out, two of them are present in the bat virus (as stated in the paper itself)
22:24 < MarkOtaris> Yeah, see what you mean, but it's not what *they* meant.
22:25 < fenn> ok
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--- Log closed Sat Feb 01 00:00:26 2020