--- Log opened Tue Feb 25 00:00:04 2020
00:20 < juri_> nmz787: there's something i can do about the size problem with STLs (implicitcad does no triangle joining, because i found a bug in thata code, and disabled it)...
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02:18 < Yotam> !search heath
02:18 < Yotam> @find heath
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03:26 < nmz787> juri_: hmm, the viewer I generally use is meshlab, and it asks me if I want to "Unify duplicated vertices"... idk if thats the same thing as what you're saying
03:27 < nmz787> juri_: oh, after running for just over 12 hours, using -r 1, and the multicore option you gave... I got this error "extopenscad: internal error: Unable to commit 1048576 bytes of memory"
03:28 < nmz787> "Please report this as a GHC bug:  http://www.haskell.org/ghc/reportabug"
03:28 < nmz787> Killed
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04:07 < fenn> could work well with the reel to reel contact lithography method of 3d printing
04:07 < fenn> whoops
04:07 < fenn> lsneff ^
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05:52 < juri_> nmz787: you ran out of ram. :)
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06:07 < kanzure> .title https://www.bionews.org.uk/page_148138
06:07 < saxo> UK Government adviser resigns over eugenics remarks - BioNews
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06:35 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=0c18eafc Michael Folkson: Add Christian on c-lightning API >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/chaincode-labs/2018-10-22-christian-decker-c-lightning-api/
06:35 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=d4d8a373 Bryan Bishop: Merge pull request #78 from michaelfolkson/add-christian-chaincode >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/
07:16 < kanzure> "Organizing genome engineering for the gigabase scale" https://arxiv.org/abs/1909.01468
07:18 < kanzure> "Cellular and molecular probing of intact human organs" https://www.cell.com/cell/pdf/S0092-8674%2820%2930111-2.pdf
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07:19 < kanzure> "Optical tissue transparency permits scalable cellular and molecular investigation of complex tissues in 3D. Adult human organs are particularly challenging to render transparent because of the accumulation of dense and sturdy molecules in decades-aged tissues. To overcome these challenges, we developed SHANEL, a method based on a new tissue permeabilization approach to clear and label stiff ...
07:19 < kanzure> ...human organs. We used SHANEL to render the intact adult human brain and kidney transparent and perform 3D histology with antibodies and dyes in centimeters-depth. Thereby, we revealed structural details of the intact human eye, human thyroid, human kidney, and transgenic pig pancreas at the cellular resolution. Furthermore, we developed a deep learning pipeline to analyze millions of cells in ...
07:19 < kanzure> ...cleared human brain tissues within hours with standard lab computers. Overall, SHANEL is a robust and unbiased technology to chart the cellular and molecular architecture of large intact mammalian organs."
07:22 < lsneff> fenn: I wasn't able to find anything about that method. Could you point me towards some resources?
07:23 < kanzure> "In vivo multi-dimensional information-keeping in Halobacterium salinarum" https://www.biorxiv.org/content/biorxiv/early/2020/02/15/2020.02.14.949925.full.pdf
07:25 < fenn> lsneff: me either. maybe it was called something different. mostly it was used for making surface mount electronic components
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07:27 < lsneff> kanzure: Have you got anything about "reel to reel contact lithography" in your notes?
07:27 < fenn> there were large wheels with an array of stamps mounted on them, one stamp for each layer in the printed part, and they printed with multiple inorganic inks
07:27 < fenn> then the parts were fired to sinter the ceramic and metal particles
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07:27 < lsneff> Oh, interesting.
07:28 < lsneff> That seems designed for mass manufacturing though. Creating new parts would mean creating new reels.
07:28 < fenn> the wheels continuously printed on a reel of film
07:28 < kanzure> lsneff: https://diyhpl.us/~bryan/papers2/find-lithography.txt
07:28 < fenn> yes it was more for mass manufacturing tiny components
07:29 < lsneff> Thanks kanzure
07:29 < fenn> i doubt it's in there
07:30 < kanzure> updated file
07:31 < archels_> 'misfits with odd skills' and 'super-talented weirdos'
07:31 < archels_> heh
07:32 < fenn> it did get me to look in my own paper collection and i think i found it
07:33 < fenn> lsneff: http://fennetic.net/irc/eoplex_whitepaper_hvpf_high_volume_print_forming.pdf
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07:42 < archels_> kanzure: geez, they really character assassinated this guy because of hypotheticals he submitted on a discussion thread. good reminder never to go into politics
07:45 < fenn> "Although it was theoretically ‘on the record unless stated otherwise’, I could tell that many scientists were not thinking about this and so I have left out some things that I think they would not want attributed. Given they were not experienced politicians being interviewed but scientists at a scientific conference, I’m erring on the side of caution, particularly given the subjects
07:45 < fenn> discussed."
07:47 < fenn> although embarrassingly lesswrongy i'm finding dominic cummings' blog rather interesting
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07:49 < fenn> "Some had the attitude that ‘nature already does bio-terrorism’ so we should relax. I did not find this comforting and I’m sure I am in the majority so for anybody influential reading this I would strongly advise you not to use this argument in public advocacy or it is likely to accelerate calls for your labs to be shut down."
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07:55 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=aef3aeea Bryan Bishop: add many tweeter links >> 
07:59 < fenn> "It has been discovered that mutations in the human population can improve bone strength by 8 standard deviations. ... scientists in Africa who noticed that people in a local tribe who got hit by cars did not suffer broken bones, so they sequenced the locals’ genomes."
08:00 < kanzure> fenn: looks like i forgot about this page https://diyhpl.us/wiki/cadfaq
08:01 < fenn> the objection to blender on that page is not quite right, as most people use subdivision surfaces, where the "mesh" you interact with is actually a set of control points
08:01 < fenn> it's quite similar to bezier splines actually
08:02 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=fd74e4f9 Bryan Bishop: link to cadfaq >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/cad/representation/
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08:02 < kanzure> ugh how do i do backwards links
08:02 < fenn> i do agree that blender needs more "design specification" capture UI to really work well as a CAD tool
08:03 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=b2b0050a Bryan Bishop: just move cadfaq into cad/ anyway >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/cadfaq/
08:03 < fenn> good job
08:03 < kanzure> that's a lot of standard deviations
08:03 < kanzure> is that enough for surviving freefall?
08:04 < fenn> your brain will bounce around inside your skull
08:04 < fenn> aorta tears, etc
08:04 < kanzure> you never let me do anything fun
08:04 < fenn> upgrade all the things
08:08 < fenn> blender has face and vertex normals to define in/out, and manifold/watertightness check, so i don't see how it's any worse than "solid geometry"
08:09 < fenn> it's possible to get yourself into a pickle by checking watertightness at one level of subdivision and then rendering/printing at a different level
08:10 < fenn> all it needs is a CAM plugin
08:12 < kanzure> edit the page then
08:12 < fenn> bah
08:12 < kanzure> if you are truly lazy then just link to today's log and delete the previous thing
08:16 < fenn> i have my own outdated cadfaq to worry about http://fennetic.net/irc/cadwiki.mediawiki
08:27 < fenn> "delving into secrets of Promethean flammability"
08:53 < lsneff> That seems like an obviously beneficial mutation, wonder why it didn't become "mainstream".
08:54 < kanzure> stuff takes a while, and bone density might already be sufficient on average
08:54 < kanzure> "your bone density is deeply arousing"
08:55 < fenn> not dying is conducive to reproduction
08:55 < fenn> dense bones leave less room for other stuff like bone marrow, which produces immune and blood cells
08:55 < lsneff> I guess cars weren't particularly common in sub-saharan Africa
09:26 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=5f77327e Michael Folkson: Add Antoine slides >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/lightning-conference/2019/2019-10-20-antoine-riard-rust-lightning/
09:26 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=029eda46 Bryan Bishop: Merge pull request #79 from michaelfolkson/add-antoine-slides >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/
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10:21 < fenn> dominic cummings' "essay" is 237 pages :\
10:33 < kanzure> topic?
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10:40 < kanzure> maaku: any interest in moving forward? we can write up a plan document.
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10:51 < kanzure> let's email dominic
10:52 < fenn> Prime Minister's Chief Adviser - Dominic Cummings - 24 July 2019
10:53 < fenn> probably has enough on his plate already
10:54 < kanzure> he has yudkowsky on his blogroll so he must be the enemy
10:54 < fenn> lol
10:55 < kanzure> dmc2.cummings@gmail.com
10:55 < fenn> we're the People's Front of Judea, how dare you associate us with the Judean Peoples' Front!
10:55 < kanzure> "I have never been a member of a political party."
11:05 < Urchin> where's the popular front?
11:23 < juri_> I'm sure glad i'm not part of that mess, and that i joined the Front of the Judean People!
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18:12 < lsneff> kanzure: Are y'all moving forward with the vaccine?
18:16 < kanzure> that's up to maaku i think. or maybe i can be convinced.
18:17 < lsneff> Is maaku in a particularly risky situation, or just precautionary?
18:17 < kanzure> well we all travel a lot in this industry
18:18 < lsneff> Ah, that's true.
18:25 < lsneff> Worrying times.
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18:54 < kanzure> https://dominiccummings.com/2014/08/19/standin-by-the-window-where-the-light-is-strong-de-extinction-machine-intelligence-the-search-for-extra-solar-life-neural-networks-autonomous-drone-swarms-bombing-parliament-genetics-amp/
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19:09 < maaku> lsneff: I work for a Japanese company and am integrally involved with a workshop in Tokyo in May...
19:15 < lsneff> Ah, I see why you're worried.
19:27 < maaku> Also we all just spend a rediculous amount of time in airports generally.
19:28 < maaku> And perhaps the most noble reason is that we should be allowed to make and use our own vaccinations, damnit.
19:35 < fltrz> is there a law against using your own vaccine on yourself?
19:35 < fltrz> is our immune system illegal?
19:36 < fltrz> or is it just breathing in a random cold viral particle and becoming immune to it?
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19:51 < lsneff> I can't imagine there's a law against it.
19:51 < lsneff> Perhaps distributing it is illegal.
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23:22 < nmz787> juri_: well for a model as simple as this, with the quality of the STL output with -r 10... and -r 1 running out of RAM (the machine has 64GB).. this doesn't bode too well for my usage of the tool
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23:36 < nmz787> kanzure: maaku:  piGuy over in vacuumhackers (discord channel) said his day job is making low cost diagnostics for infectious diseases, and had quickly re-tooled one he made for HIV to work for COVID-19 testing
23:37 < fenn> what's wrong with plain old PCR
23:38 < nmz787> I think it might be isothermal amplification
23:39 < nmz787> but my guess is it's microfluidic and injection molded plastic or something... not too sure
23:39 < nmz787> low cost seems to indicate good for high volume manufacturing
23:52 < fenn> yes but then you have to actually manufacture it in high volume in order to get the low cost per unit
23:53 < nmz787> maybe, depends
--- Log closed Wed Feb 26 00:00:05 2020