--- Log opened Mon Mar 09 00:00:17 2020
00:03 -!- shawwwn [uid6132@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fxnawqelvlxkhkea] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
01:51 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::3] has joined ##hplusroadmap
02:24 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
02:50 -!- orange_ [~textual@92.223.89.134] has joined ##hplusroadmap
02:57 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
03:01 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181086.dynamic-4-waw-k-4-1-0.vectranet.pl] has joined ##hplusroadmap
03:14 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::3] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
04:38 < nmz787> .title https://imgur.com/a/YZzwI2w
04:38 < saxo> vacuum deposition system controller - Album on Imgur
04:38 < nmz787> ^ what I've been working on this weekend
04:43 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181086.dynamic-4-waw-k-4-1-0.vectranet.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
04:52 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181086.dynamic-4-waw-k-4-1-0.vectranet.pl] has joined ##hplusroadmap
05:03 -!- adamsky [~adamsky3@178235181086.dynamic-4-waw-k-4-1-0.vectranet.pl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:11 -!- spaceangel [~spaceange@ip-89-177-23-46.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined ##hplusroadmap
05:19 -!- CryptoDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-faijmqjlzghdizog] has joined ##hplusroadmap
06:00 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has joined ##hplusroadmap
06:05 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
06:34 -!- agile_prg2 [~nyb@96.70.252.186] has left ##hplusroadmap ["Leaving"]
06:40 -!- agile_prg [~nyb@96.70.252.186] has joined ##hplusroadmap
06:41 < juri_> partay.
06:43 < agile_prg> I won 2nd place in the carona virus online hackathon this weekend with this: https://plnkr.co/edit/TNuAIB1mFn01O1tG6KtM?preview
06:43 < agile_prg> know this
06:53 -!- darsie [~kvirc@84-114-73-160.cable.dynamic.surfer.at] has joined ##hplusroadmap
07:06 -!- juul [~juul@juul.io] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
07:08 -!- juul [~juul@juul.io] has joined ##hplusroadmap
07:43 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@unaffiliated/justanotheruser] has joined ##hplusroadmap
07:58 < lsneff> Looks like we're about to hit a recession.
07:58 < kanzure> yawn
07:58 < kanzure> let's talk about death rays
08:01 < lsneff> Well, we might need a few.
08:06 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffffff@172.58.19.145] has joined ##hplusroadmap
08:24 -!- dongcarl [~dongcarl@unaffiliated/dongcarl] has joined ##hplusroadmap
08:42 -!- orange_ [~textual@92.223.89.134] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
08:50 < superkuh> My favorite has always been Bill Beaty's idea to give mirrors to thousands of school children, train then to reflect at objects together, and let them loose.
09:00 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has joined ##hplusroadmap
09:05 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
09:11 < kanzure> threshold shamir secret sharing.. stuff.. https://zengo.com/refresh-when-you-wake-up-proactive-threshold-wallets-with-offline-devices/
09:11 < kanzure> https://eprint.iacr.org/2019/1328.pdf
09:31 < agile_prg> https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/09/coronavirus-scientists-play-legos-with-proteins-to-build-next-gen-vaccine/?utm_source=STAT+Newsletters&utm_campaign=a9ecfe4869-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2020_03_08_11_04&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_8cab1d7961-a9ecfe4869-150526461
09:31 < agile_prg> my approach has been validated
09:59 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::3] has joined ##hplusroadmap
10:19 -!- preview [~quassel@2407:7000:8423:b00::3] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
10:21 < fltrz> do any of the human protein sequences utilize PHE(nylalanine)? According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essential_amino_acid#Recommended_daily_intake it is an essential amino acid for humans, but the RDI is PHE+TYR=25-33mg/kg/day which implies 25-33mg/kg/day of TYR would suffice, but clearly if PHE is essential and at least one human protein uses it, it would result in a shortage of PHE
10:28 < yashgaroth> ...yes, at least one human protein contains phenylalanine
10:43 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=8d247b00 Michael Folkson: Add Poelstra transcript on Miniscript >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/london-bitcoin-devs/2020-02-04-andrew-poelstra-miniscript/
10:43 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=333187f8 Bryan Bishop: Merge pull request #80 from michaelfolkson/add-poelstra-miniscript >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/
10:45 < gnusha> https://secure.diyhpl.us/cgit/diyhpluswiki/commit/?id=05d21c79 Bryan Bishop: add tweeter link >> http://diyhpl.us/diyhpluswiki/transcripts/london-bitcoin-devs/2020-02-04-andrew-poelstra-miniscript/
11:25 < fltrz> yashgaroth, isn't the RDI oof (PHE+TYR)=~24mg/kg/day wrong then? it seems like it should state a minimum of PHE instead of allowing the diet to contain no PHE and "sufficient" TYR to make up for it?
11:25 < fltrz> yashgaroth, is there a more recent RDI listing than the 2002 one? its been 18 years
11:27 < yashgaroth> phenylalanine deficiency is so absurdly rare that it's not really an issue
11:29 < kanzure> "The deadline to apply for YC Summer 2020 is Monday, March 16 at 8pm."
11:30 < fltrz> yashgaroth, does this mean it is a very infrequently used amino acid?
11:31 < fltrz> or is it because there is a lot of aspartame in current diets, that nobody cares about it?
11:31 < yashgaroth> no, but any large protein in any organism has plenty of phenylalanine so it's never the limiting amino acid for any diet
11:34 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has joined ##hplusroadmap
11:39 < fltrz> yashgaroth, I found this https://www.nal.usda.gov/sites/default/files/fnic_uploads/energy_full_report.pdf (warning 4+ MB, 1000+ pages)
11:40 < fltrz> yashgaroth, it states infants during the first 6 months are typically fed with human breast milk exclusively, and it states the mg/g of protein in milk for the essential amino acids and also Cysteine and Tyrosine
11:41 < fltrz> yashgaroth, it lists Phenylanaline 44 mg/g and Tyrosine 47 mg/g .. so I guess I can just divide the 24-33 mg / kg / day to have the same proportions?
11:43 < fltrz> yashgaroth, I need to enter *some* value for my algorithm not to face unknown numbers...
11:45 < fltrz> hmm if I use a similar ratio determination for Methionine / Cysteine, I get a different ratio than the WHO recommendation
11:49 < fltrz> yashgaroth, is it technically possible that isoleuceine and or phenylalanine are not in fact essential amino acids, but can be synthesized by an as of yet unknown mechanism?
11:55 < kanzure> now that i am maintaining https://github.com/petertodd/python-bitcoinlib i'm wondering about what i should take from this fork https://github.com/Simplexum/python-bitcointx
11:55 < kanzure> https://gist.github.com/dgpv/6607c7d0eff66c387d8a5eaeb378e787#file-on-release-of-python-bitcointx-v1-0-1-md
11:55 < kanzure> apparently requires python >=3.6 because of "custom class dispatching code"
11:57 < kanzure> and https://github.com/Simplexum/python-elementstx for that matter
12:25 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
12:29 < fltrz> kanzure, can you ELI5 for me why cryptocurrencies would fall in value with the corona crisis? im probably simplistic here, but if all markets worldwide will end up in recession, with central banks going to print money, i.e. devaluation, there is nowhere to flee (ignoring crypto coins). it would seem like crypto's should rise in value in these conditions? or is it because crypto's are mostly used for international trade, and physical trade may be
12:29 < fltrz> impeded? or is it because many crypto holders are not that wealthy and want to convert to cash for immediate future? or is it because philanthropists holding large amounts of crypto want to put their money to good societal use?
12:30 < kanzure> there's extensive unregulated leveraged trading by retail investors (that is, the general public) in cryptocurrency markets
12:30 < kanzure> and they are subject to fear and other market concerns like everyone else
12:30 < fltrz> or is it governments feeling forced to sell their semi-secret stash of crypto for immediate use?
12:31 < kanzure> it's retail traders that are panic selling
12:31 < kanzure> and significant FUD around the halvening or stock-to-flow price predictions
12:31 < fltrz> kanzure, like literally people who don't realize crypto's are probably safest form of investment right now? or am I being simplistic again?
12:32 < kanzure> it's not clear to me what proportion of the general public, invested in cryptocurrency, actually understands cryptocurrency
12:32 < kanzure> to be fair, it's fairly complex....
12:32 < fltrz> yeah, thats why I originally didn't invest in BTC, back when it started, because I could not envision convincing people of cryptocurrency merits, despite seeing them myself
12:34 < kanzure> one of the weirdest things i witnessed years ago when introducing people to bitcoin was next day i'd find them day trading on an unregulated BTC-USD exchange
12:35 < kanzure> and they previously had zero inclination to do day trading....
12:35 < fltrz> kanzure, I would love to invest in a cryptocurrency where one is only allowed to invest (or the value of balance is not burned) as long as one regularly proves they understand the math, crypto, proofs, and incentive structures of the crypto
12:35 < fltrz> kanzure, but not sure how to implement such a thing in a provably secure way, proctoring
12:36 < fltrz> it would prevent blind bubbles like the current one collapsing (i.e. your interpretation of current people chickening out because they don't truly understand crypto)
12:37 < fltrz> I'd rather keep things real and grow frugal but steady
12:38 < fltrz> on the other hand it might recover quite quickly once there is nobody left to sell out but an unknown fraction of hard core holders
12:39 < fltrz> while classic fiat inflates
12:40 < fltrz> I was also thinking about 1) relative wealth of crypto holder compared with non-cryptoholders and 2) relative age and health; how many wallets will be lost due to people dying taking their keys to the grave?
12:41 < fltrz> perhaps intelligent people who understand crypto, have loved ones who they want to inherit the money, but to whom they fail to educate and train proper security protocols, domain knowledge etc regarding BTC...
12:42 < fltrz> transnational cybercrime might rise significantly, if local governments look the other way
12:43 < fltrz> especially when nations end up in conflict
13:14 -!- Urchin [~urchin@unaffiliated/urchin] has joined ##hplusroadmap
13:22 < kanzure> anyway, i still think bitcoin is a good idea, i wouldn't worry
13:46 -!- shmeebegek [62cf5a17@c-98-207-90-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap
13:48 -!- mauz555 [~mauz555@2a01:e0a:56d:9090:3092:7169:2a22:9e8d] has joined ##hplusroadmap
14:10 < shmeebegek> anybody have info or opinions on whether and why SARS-CoV-2 would slow/stop in May-June?
14:16 < maaku> shmeebegek: because other coronovirus have seasonal intensity
14:17 < kanzure> but also, the numbers are going to lag
14:17 < shmeebegek> what's the mechanism tho?
14:17 < maaku> heat
14:17 < shmeebegek> it's odd to me, since most people spend their time indoors, in air conditioning
14:18 < maaku> but may/june is a little early
14:18 < maaku> shmeebegek: most people spread germs while outdoors
14:18 < shmeebegek> supposedly SARS stopped in May, and some Chinese professor was saying June
14:18 < maaku> that Chinese professor has a source of numbes in his ass
14:19 < shmeebegek> haha
14:20 < Urchin> shmeebegek: you mean if it will survive summer heat?
14:20 < shmeebegek> well, yes, and what is the mechanism
14:21 < maaku> the same as the common cold--it survives in people and circulates until it becomes an epidemic the next season
14:21 < Urchin> well, seems to be alive in australia but not blooming
14:22 < maaku> also north/south hemispheres
14:22 < shmeebegek> right, but what I'm not getting is, in a culture like the US with ubiquitous central heating, and a car culture with almost no public transport usage, I don't see lower flu deaths per capita generally ?
14:22 < shmeebegek> I guess if it always saturates the whole population each year then it doesn't matter
14:23 < Urchin> it's really running wild in Italy
14:23 < yashgaroth> higher temperatures are less hospitable to virus fomites, more UV from the sun kills virus faster outside the body, more people are outside in their free time and not cramped in buildings
14:23 < shmeebegek> the cramped in buildings thing was always my suspicion for why there was more spread in winter
14:24 < shmeebegek> more recycled air
14:24 < shmeebegek> but in really hot areas, the summer is more cramped inside
14:24 < yashgaroth> well it shouldn't be spreading through the HVAC
14:24 < Urchin> afaik it's a droplet based infection like flu
14:25 < Urchin> which is about the nastiest thing to stop
14:25 < shmeebegek> like in Texas, I don't see it spiking in summer
14:25 < Urchin> death rate low enough that it doesn't kill all the hosts
14:25 < shmeebegek> HVAC has a filter, that's true
14:25 < Urchin> high infectivity
14:26 < yashgaroth> droplet infection isn't as bad as airborne, which is a separate classification; droplet definitely won't spread far in the air, while airborne might
14:27 < shmeebegek> I just don't really get how the extreme seasonal difference, which is so consistent between very different societies, is explained
14:27 < Urchin> well, pandemics tend to be droplet infections, so that's not much of a consolation
14:28 < shmeebegek> it feels like there's some explanatory mechanism missing
14:28 < yashgaroth> in places with deep, shitty winters, the low humidity and temperature can aggravate people's lungs, which probably contributes
14:30 < shmeebegek> but I guess we just know it empirically
14:31 < yashgaroth> it seems I've covered most of what's listed in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flu_season#Cause except...less vitamin D and schoolchildren being plague vectors
14:34 < agile_prg> if I wanted to design a protein that would bind to a receptor, what is the best way to do that?
14:35 < shmeebegek> "In nations where children do not go to school in the summer, there is a more pronounced beginning to flu season, coinciding with the start of public school. It is thought that the day care environment is perfect for the spread of illness"
14:35 < shmeebegek> that's really interesting, makes a lot of sense. summer vacation
14:36 < lsneff> .title https://hackaday.com/2020/03/09/dexter-robot-arm-embraces-new-manufacturing-with-first-micro-factory/
14:36 < saxo> Dexter Robot Arm Embraces New Manufacturing With First Micro-Factory | Hackaday
14:37 < kanzure> agile_prg: learn you a biology
14:37 < kanzure> agile_prg: read about ligand receptor design and experimental validation
14:49 < shmeebegek> I don't really like so many theories for one simple phenomenon, seems like no one is really sure
14:49 < shmeebegek> humidity is much less often controlled than temperature
14:51 < shmeebegek> seems like a good candidate
14:57 < shmeebegek> wow, it seems to have a really big effect
14:57 < shmeebegek> At humidity levels of 23 percent, 70 to 77 percent of the flu virus particles were still able to cause an infection an hour after the coughing simulation. But when humidity levels were raised to 43 percent, just 14 percent of the virus particles had the ability to infect. Most of the flu particles became inactive 15 minutes after they were released
14:57 < shmeebegek> into the humid air. "The virus just falls apart," at high humidity levels, said study researcher John Noti, of the CDC's National Institute for Occupational Safety and Health.
14:58 < shmeebegek> really counterintuitive to me
15:03 < shmeebegek> ahh, smaller droplet size at low humidity, so stays in the air longer  https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/full/10.1098/rsif.2018.0298
15:35 < lsneff> I've heard that turning up the temperature to around 30 degrees can greatly reduce the chance of infection.
15:38 < shmeebegek> also supported by the paper
15:38 < shmeebegek> denatures the virus faster
15:54 -!- aeiousomething [~aeiousome@unaffiliated/aeiousomething] has joined ##hplusroadmap
16:10 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has quit []
16:14 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@unaffiliated/malvolio] has joined ##hplusroadmap
16:14 -!- TC [~talinck@98.29.27.253] has joined ##hplusroadmap
16:15 -!- TC is now known as Guest76432
16:16 < kanzure> .tw https://twitter.com/LukeDashjr/status/1237145494092222465
16:16 < saxo> Anyone have a high-risk ("it could be a scam?") budget for a faster, regulation-ignoring, open source #coronavirus vaccine? // Sounds like they might only release "code" - anyone know what's needed to make it? // Disclaimer: I don't know the team behind this. // https://siasky.net/bACLKGmcmX4NCp47WwOOJf0lU666VLeT5HRWpWVtqZPjEA (@LukeDashjr)
16:18 -!- hehelleshin [~talinck@98.29.27.253] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
16:28 -!- orange_ [~textual@92.223.89.134] has joined ##hplusroadmap
17:04 -!- spaceangel [~spaceange@ip-89-177-23-46.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
17:05 -!- mauz555 [~mauz555@2a01:e0a:56d:9090:3092:7169:2a22:9e8d] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
17:19 -!- shawwwn [uid6132@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tmiovdylckzrmyjw] has joined ##hplusroadmap
18:44 -!- Urchin [~urchin@unaffiliated/urchin] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
18:58 -!- Urchin [~urchin@unaffiliated/urchin] has joined ##hplusroadmap
19:14 -!- shmeebegek [62cf5a17@c-98-207-90-23.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Ping timeout (120 seconds)]
19:25 -!- orange_ [~textual@92.223.89.134] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
19:53 < fenn> fltrz: you might look into the problems of people with phenylketonuria, as they are on a phenylalanine restricted diet, usually the bare minimum necessary
19:55 < fltrz> fenn, thanks, so it seems there is some amount of necessary phenylalanine
19:55 < fenn> the reason they're listed together is that they both are used as a substrate to make catecholamines
20:00 < fenn> light exposure and vitamin D levels play a large role in the seasonal flu variation
20:02 < fenn> you don't get much of a tan when bundled up
20:04 < fenn> people in warmer climates tend to have darker skin, which limits the availability of vitamin D. there's sort of a balance between skin cancer from DNA damage and getting enough vitamin D
20:08 < fenn> 3D printer farm eh
20:10 < fenn> i was not impressed with the markforged "engineering grade" 3d printer materials specs
20:11 < fenn> haddington dynamics should use their stupid robot arm to do carbon fiber prepreg layup
20:11 < fenn> you know, something you actually would need a robot for
20:56 -!- yashgaroth [~ffffffff@172.58.19.145] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
21:41 -!- superjen96 [~jenelizab@cpc155793-brmb11-2-0-cust474.1-3.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
21:45 -!- jenelizabeth [~jenelizab@cpc155793-brmb11-2-0-cust474.1-3.cable.virginm.net] has joined ##hplusroadmap
22:03 -!- darsie [~kvirc@84-114-73-160.cable.dynamic.surfer.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
22:59 -!- CryptoDavid [uid14990@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-faijmqjlzghdizog] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
23:19 -!- shawwwn [uid6132@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-tmiovdylckzrmyjw] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
--- Log closed Tue Mar 10 00:00:18 2020