--- Log opened Thu Dec 31 00:00:03 2020
00:00 < fenn> yes
00:00 < fenn> i couldn't remember the name of it either
00:00 < fenn> actually it's pretty bad
00:00 < apotheon> Is it?
00:01 < apotheon> I haven't tried it.
00:01 < fenn> they can't even agree on whether to pass along terminal control codes
00:01 < apotheon> I know someone thnks Gemini is pretty cool.
00:01 < apotheon> s/thnks/who thinks/
00:01 < apotheon> criminy
00:01 < apotheon> I accidentally a and a.
00:02 < apotheon> (That line wasn't as clever as I'd hoped.)
00:03 < fenn> huh. gemini quadrupled in size in november 2020
00:03 < apotheon> So . . . in other news, it seems that metformin can both increase intelligence and offer protective value for people with COVID-19.  Too bad long-term usage seems to interfere with cellular regeneration.
00:03 < apotheon> fenn: Did the number of users increase from 5 to 20?
00:04 < fenn> either way it's impressive :P
00:04 < fenn> i heard metformin makes you feel awful
00:04 < fenn> also it's prescription only
00:05 < apotheon> Its most common side effects, as far as I'm aware, involve gastrointestinal stuff.
00:05 < apotheon> Abdominal pain, diarrhea, and nausea are three things I recall off the top of my head.
00:05 < fenn> gemini doesn't solve the trust in TLS certificate roots problem at lal
00:05 < fenn> all*
00:06 < fenn> the whole project seems pretty amateur
00:06 < fenn> i wish someone competent were interested
00:06 < apotheon> Are you competent?
00:06 < fenn> no
00:06 < apotheon> sad
00:06 < apotheon> I'm probably not competent in that realm, either.
00:06 < apotheon> If one of us was, and got interested, that could solve the problem.
00:07 < fenn> were*
00:07 < fenn> i only know how to complain and criticize
00:07 < apotheon> No, "one" of us.
00:07 < apotheon> if we were, if one (of us) was
00:07 < fenn> were is the subjunctive tense in english
00:07 < apotheon> If one was two, they would be were.
00:08 < fenn> english is sub-par in this respect, as "were" is ambiguous, and many subjunctive tenses simply don't exist in english
00:08 < fenn> not sure why they call it a "mood"
00:08 < fenn> it's a verb conjugation
00:12 < apotheon> hmph
00:12 < apotheon> I forget the subjunctive exists.
00:12 < apotheon> It always feels like hypercorrection.
00:13 < fenn> trying to start over when the web exists is probably going to fail
00:14 < fenn> instead, i'd try to scrape all the things, and have user contributed scraping data from a browser plugin
00:14 < fenn> and then share the scraped data in a standardized format that can be displayed via a user configurable template/markup language
00:15 < fenn> the particulars are not important, but the shared data would not contain all the BS garbage that surrounds the actual content
00:15 < apotheon> For that to work would require it being on the darknet, at this point, because of copyright laws.
00:15 < fenn> and said "sharing" would count as copyright infringement so it will have to be a robust system with trust metrics to prevent data poisoning
00:15 < apotheon> "great minds", et cetera
00:16 < fenn> unlike gopher, which just worked because nobody gave a shit
00:16 < fenn> back in the good old days when helping people was looked upon kindly
00:16 < apotheon> yep
00:17 < fenn> i find it amusing that surfraw was written by julian assange
00:17 < apotheon> Now, people judge you by how mean you are to people of the most-hated out-group.
00:18 < apotheon> Why's that amusing?
00:18 < fenn> "Surfraw provides a fast unix command line interface to a variety of popular WWW search engines and other artifacts of power. It reclaims google, altavista, dejanews, freshmeat, research index, slashdot and many others from the false-prophet, pox-infested heathen lands of html-forms, placing these wonders where they belong, deep in unix heartland, as god loving extensions to the shell."
00:20 < fenn> because assange is usually seen as some global political figure like george bush, not a guy who writes shell scripts for easier web browsing
00:20 < fenn> if george bush maintained debian packages that'd also be amusing
00:21 < fenn> i'm just used to "them" having absolutely no connection to things on the ground
00:22 < fenn> engineers are to exploited, not heard
00:23 < fenn> now get back in the kitchen and sudo make me a browser
00:24 < fenn> another funny one is noam chomsky (linguistics)
00:24 < apotheon> He was in the original cypherpunk mailing list community.
00:26 < apotheon> Noam Chomsky is one of those people who got really good at a particular field, introduced some revolutionary ideas, thought of those ideas as being relevant to a lot more than is reasonable, and ultimately came to the conclusion they know enough about basically every field there is to be an expert.
00:26 < apotheon> Richard Dawkins is another.
00:27 < apotheon> They're cults of personality now.
00:27 < fenn> but evolutionary-* is totally a thing
00:27 < fenn> evolutionary psychology being the big one
00:27 < apotheon> Yes, it is a real thing.
00:27 < fenn> unfortunately a lot of the time it's not falsifiable
00:28 < apotheon> Is this supposed to be a defense of Richard Dawkins?
00:28 < fenn> the alternative is just being aristotle and saying stuff for no good reason
00:29 < fenn> dawkins is an asshole, but maybe he's right about a lot of things in fields unrelated to his expertise, simply because evolution was/is important in so many fields
00:30 < apotheon> Most of what I've seen him bloviate about in the last ten or fifteen years seems to be self-aggrandizing nonsense, teaching minions to declare others wrong without demonstrating any knowledge of what's right.
00:30 < apotheon> It's frustrating.
00:31 < apotheon> I mean, the guy is more important to the formal concent of memetics than Vernor Vinge is to the idea of the technological singularity, but he forsook that in pursuit of the blind faith of simplistic atheists who make other atheists look bad.
00:32 < apotheon> It's disappointing, at least.
00:32 < apotheon> Anyway, it's past bedtime.  I should go.
00:32 < apotheon> ta
00:32 < fenn> nn
01:28 < L29Ah> 11:18:53]<fenn> "Surfraw provides a fast unix command line interface to a variety of popular WWW search engines and other artifacts of power. It reclaims google, altavista, dejanews, freshmeat, research index, slashdot and many others from the false-prophet, pox-infested heathen lands of html-forms, placing these wonders where they belong, deep in unix heartland, as god loving extensions to the shell.
01:28 < L29Ah> "
01:28 < L29Ah> too bad this is a lie, as surfraw is just a fancy way to call a browser with the search engine URL typed in
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11:31 < lsneff> https://preview.redd.it/wmowlyhync861.png?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=9ec68f5ea7210ccfb10a0bc6c7cbd8f89364f363
11:32 < lsneff> "R.U. a Cyberpunk?" (2000)
11:37 < apotheon> Oh, that thing.
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11:39 < apotheon> Crap.  I am, or have been, at least very similar to all but two of those definitions.
11:43 < apotheon> I think that guy's wearing a fake-bullet-bandolier guitar strap around his waist.
12:11 < kanzure> "closed source means someone only shares source code with criminals and hackers"
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13:06 < lsneff> speaking of close source, a startup is trying to sponsor me to dual-license one of my projects
13:08 < apotheon> kanzure: nice one
13:09 < apotheon> kanzure: Did you quote that from somewhere?
13:09 < apotheon> lsneff: Dual-license how?
13:10 < lsneff> So free/non-commercial is open-source, but commercial users have to pay the startup.
13:28 < apotheon> What's the current license?
13:29 < apotheon> I mean . . . is this an MIT License project that they want you to change to GPL/Commercial?
13:29 < apotheon> . . . 'cause that'd be sketchy as fuck.
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14:07 < nmz787> m
14:08 < nmz787> my wife and I cracked the PC software for oour FIB last night!
14:08 < nmz787> successfully skipping a stupid time wasting function call in a button click handler
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14:57 < jrayhawk> are you still stuck on an old pentium for that
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15:28 < kanzure> nmz787: post the disassembly for the rest of us
15:29 < kanzure> often you can just delete serial number check functions or write other programs that call into the program's "real" main function
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16:03 < Malvolio> Happy New Year!
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16:24 < lsneff> apotheon: yes, that's basically the idea
16:27 < apotheon> Offer to keep it MIT License and offer a commercial license to them anyway.
16:27 < apotheon> (I guess.)
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22:10 < nmz787> jrayhawk: yeah, same PC as before... I did have to upgrade it from WinXP sp2 to sp3 to get the debugger to run. Luckily that hasn't obviously impeded normal functionality of the software
22:11 < nmz787> kanzure: hmm, I have a filedump of some symbols that a disassembler/decompiler produced, which we used to informa Ghidra plugin
22:11 < nmz787> s/informa/inform a/
22:22 < nmz787> http://gnusha.org/~nmz787/pdf/smi3200/disasm/
22:43 < nmz787> kanzure: any links for "other programs that call into the programs", like so I think I know at least a memory address of a function that would be good to call from some sort of "my program" (maybe Python???)
22:44 < nmz787> I was thinking like, load a Python DLL into the program, then have it call Python on some script... just steal a button somewhere that I don't use, there's probably a bunch of them
--- Log closed Fri Jan 01 00:00:02 2021