--- Log opened Sun Dec 18 00:00:48 2022
01:01 < lsneff> heading back home!
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05:42 < kanzure> lsneff: home is where the raptors are
05:48 < muurkha> ♪ no matter how the raptors live♪
06:29 < kanzure> .wik tree injection
06:29 < saxo> "Tree injection—also known as trunk injection or stem injection,—is a method of targeting a precise application of pesticides, plant resistance activators, or fertilizers into the xylem vascular tissue of a tree with the purpose of protecting the tree from pests, or to [...]" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_injection
06:31 < kanzure> also ".. stem injection of grapevines is investigated in viticulture for control of pathogens with difficult biologies which infect and destroy woody tissues and that cannot be controlled efficiently by canopy spray applications of fungicides"
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07:14 < kanzure> huh, i didn't know randall o'reilly was running a Focused Research Organization on human brain inspired models: https://astera.org/obelisk/
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10:43 < lsneff> kanzure: in a couple months, maybe it will be :)
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16:24 < kanzure> "About 20 percent of all kindergarten through 12th grade schools in the United States engage or have engaged with Repl.it in code jams, hackathons, and other activities"
16:24 < kanzure> that's cool.
16:32 < nsh> open source lives
16:33 < nsh> the future will be created by minds far less encumbered than ours 
16:33 < nsh> this is a blessing
16:33 < nsh> learning to embrace that blessing is a thing one might elect to do
16:34 < muurkha> the future will be created by Palantir, Starlink, and SpaceX
16:37 < kanzure> they use wormholes for interstellar trade in orion's arm :( https://www.orionsarm.com/eg-topic/45b3bbdc13805 https://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/485a95009288f https://www.orionsarm.com/eg-article/56758a236b14f
16:39 < nsh> it's possible to imagine futures that aren't expansionist
16:40 < nsh> it's even possible to begin to recognise that expansionism might perhaps be a symptom of a less-than-ideal psychic state of affairs
16:40 < muurkha> sure, if you kill everyone
16:41 < nsh> it's entirely possible to flourish in ones niche
16:41 < nsh> as a culture in balance with its environment
16:41 < muurkha> but if you have ten billion non-expansionist people and one expansionist person, the expansionist person is going to expand to occupy the niche of the rest of the universe
16:41 < nsh> such short memories
16:42 < muurkha> unless they can't figure out how
16:42 < kanzure> interstellar trade doesn't seem practical; the timespans are too large.
16:42 < kanzure> it seems more likely that everyone is going to be fairly isolated in the galaxy
16:42 < nsh> can't think outside of a thousand years
16:42 < nsh> when there has been culture for far longer
16:42 < nsh> a *few thousand years
16:42 < kanzure> and maybe once in a while you get a shipment of physical goods that you forgot asking for, or some inscrutable information delivery
16:43 < muurkha> culture has been, as far as we can tell, dominated by its expansionist factions for quite a bit longer than a thousand years
16:43 < kanzure> maintaining social structures over thousands of years would be valuable in this context but it just seems unlikely
16:43 < nsh> between which ice ages?
16:44 < muurkha> it's been a lot more than a thousand years since the last ice age
16:44 < nsh> symbiotic coexistence of cultures was the norm for a lot longer a time period the current one characterised by domination
16:45 < nsh> we are living in a period of aberration, not the norm
16:45 < pasky> ...wait what? what symbiotic coexistence of cultures?
16:45 < pasky> war exists since forever
16:45 < nsh> and that aberration itself is in the process of its own dissolution
16:45 < nsh> lol pasky 
16:46  * kanzure turns down the inscrutability knob on nsh
16:48 < nsh> are these artefacts of conflict and disorder? https://sand-boarding.com/new-geoglyphs-discovered-nazca-desert/
16:49 < fenn> does anyone happen to have a copy of orionsarm already?
16:49 < nsh> it's a question of scale
16:49 < kanzure> yes..
16:49 < kanzure> no. just the mailing list apparently.
16:51 < kanzure> they have a by-letter view https://www.orionsarm.com/xcms.php?r=oaeg-alpha&letter=A
16:52 < fenn> Muaddib: is orion's arm in your database?
16:52 < Muaddib> fenn: I don't know, but I'm sure I have an arm-y of questions about it.
16:52 < fenn> Muaddib: a transapient archailect and a relativistic spore trader walk into a bar...
16:52 < Muaddib> fenn: The bartender says, "What can I get you? A stiff drink or a stiffer one?"
16:53 < fenn> terrible
16:55 < muurkha> the earlier joke was better
16:56 < muurkha> Muaddib: what do the stiffnesses of drinks have to do with the transapient archailect and relativistic spore trader?  I don't understand the joke
16:56 < Muaddib> muurkha: The bartender was asking if they wanted a fast or a faster drink.
16:56 < muurkha> Muaddib: why?
16:56 < Muaddib> muurkha: Because if you want to catch the archailect, you'd better get something fast, and if you want to trade spores with the relativistic trader, you'll need something even faster.
16:57 < kanzure> at least this has an index https://orionsarm.com/im_store/
17:00 < kanzure> and https://orionsarm.com/images/
17:02 < fenn> the !san are still around, but maybe for not much longer. but we can say that about the rest of humanity as well
17:02 < fenn> !kung san
17:04 < muurkha> the Moriori are more numerous now than before the Maori genocided them
17:05 < muurkha> it's true that most of human life is harmonious and cooperative and not expansionist\
17:06 < muurkha> it's just that in the long run expansionism runs over everything else repeatedly
17:35 < fenn> "Currently there are around 700 people who identify as Moriori, most of whom no longer live on the Chatham Islands." not much of a bounce back
17:35 < fenn> .wik Musket Wars
17:35 < saxo> "The Musket Wars were a series of as many as 3,000 battles and raids fought throughout New Zealand (including the Chatham Islands) among Māori between 1807 and 1837, after Māori first obtained muskets and then engaged in an intertribal arms race in order to gain territory [...]" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Musket_Wars
17:42 < fenn> "The Moriori population peaked at around 2,000 divided among nine tribes."
17:45 < fenn> "Despite knowing Māori were not pacifist, Moriori ultimately decided to stay pacifist against the invaders, describing Nunuku's Law as "a moral imperative". Although the council decided in favour of peace, the invading Māori inferred that the decision was a prelude to war." makes perfect sense
17:47 < fenn> "In 1870, a Native Land Court was established to adjudicate competing land claims; by this time most Māori had returned to Taranaki. The court ruled in favour of the Māori, awarding them 97% of the land. The judge ruled that since the Moriori had been conquered by Māori they did not have ownership rights of the land."
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19:08 < kanzure> https://orionsarm.com/fm_store/MoveAPlanet.pdf
19:22 < kanzure> https://web.archive.org/web/20080906001759/http://github.com/
19:22 < kanzure> https://web.archive.org/web/20081103115556/http://heroku.com/
19:39 < kanzure> these links don't work for me- seems to be faster than normal linkrot? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=16506825
19:46 < fenn> they're not 404, they have been booted out of the replit cache(?)
19:48 < fenn> uh, nevermind, it's the same page if you change the url after the first "/" character
19:48 < fenn> for a second it was giving me a "this repl is very popular!" page
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--- Log closed Mon Dec 19 00:00:49 2022