--- Log opened Wed Nov 08 00:00:19 2023
00:33 < nsh> it isn't a learned cultural behaviour. they obviously practice is. 
00:33 < nsh> *it
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01:08 < nsh> analyze [journal] paper custom-GPT: https://chat.openai.com/g/g-WIlexDAW5-analyzepaper
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07:33 < hprmbridge> kanzure> https://www.synbiobeta.com/read/is-dna-data-storage-ready-for-data-centers
07:35 < hprmbridge> kanzure> https://www.gov.uk/government/news/building-better-with-biology-new-500000-themed-competition
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08:16 < L29Ah> i remember there was a short story posted here, maybe a month ago, about a jewel that gets implanted into one's skull to replace the brain after it starts deteriorating; what was it called?
08:27 < hprmbridge> kanzure> greg egan
08:28 < hprmbridge> kanzure> 'learning to be you'
08:28 < hprmbridge> kanzure> half-synthetic yeast announced today https://twitter.com/CellPressNews/status/1722282848923844935
08:29 < L29Ah> seems so according to wikipedia, but somehow can't find it in my browsing history (i recall reading it from a web page)
08:30 < hprmbridge> kanzure> we need better log search, with content embedded from links. and all links and images should be archived for posterity.
08:59 < L29Ah> found it
08:59 < L29Ah> for u in $(grep -r http ~/.tkabber/logs/2023/**/*hplus* | sed -ne 's#.*\(http[s:][^} ]*\).*#\1#p' | tac); do echo $u; curl -sL "$u" | grep --color=always -i jewel; done
09:06 < hprmbridge> alonzoc> This man regexes
09:19 < L29Ah> you may also like: https://github.com/l29ah/w3crapcli/blob/355e0221629b37c5a0b818dddc2168c02ed2809b/savefrom.net/savefrom
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11:48 < hprmbridge> kanzure> https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLH78wfbGI1x1Xxv-RAhra4Cm8iKxgXB0h&si=lHCkxtERuLG16J31
11:59 < docl> nice!
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12:00 < Urchin[emacs]> hi
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17:10 < kanzure> "Human-AI symbiosis, for those who want it, is the optimal outcome" https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1722418770046558428
17:10 < kanzure> curious why to limit to symbiosis as a possible path forward; why not let anyone escape down any escape hatch they want?
17:16 < L29Ah> what would be the proper channel for scientific philosophy/methodology questions?
17:16 < L29Ah> or otherwise a decent community
17:21 < hprmbridge> kanzure> https://bionomicon.substack.com/p/space-genetics?sd=pf
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17:54 < hprmbridge> boxious> test
17:54 < hprmbridge> boxious> ahoy Hplus! following kanzure and this group for some time
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17:55 < hprmbridge> boxious> Question: I really want to sequence my genome. But: 1) How risky is using a service re. genetic privacy 2) any recommended services where I can get my entire sequenced genome data?
17:56 < hprmbridge> kanzure> I've been thinking about setting up a privacy-focused sequencing company. The demand is hard to judge.
17:56 < hprmbridge> kanzure> like what if we actually delete your data after? It's a wild concept.
17:57 < jrayhawk> that is a big concern for about 25% of the people I talk to about it
17:57 < hprmbridge> boxious> kind of pointless to do since it can't be proven
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17:57 < hprmbridge> kanzure> yes many of these kinds of businesses are trust based.
17:58 < hprmbridge> boxious> have you guys sequenced your genome? seems super useful but not possible unless you trust a sequencing company
17:58 < jrayhawk> and the CCPA can be used to provide state oversight
17:58 < hprmbridge> kanzure> utility is high especially if you have a genetic disease.
17:59 < muurkha> "state oversight" is likely to mean "ensuring the state gets a copy before you delete it"
17:59 < muurkha> plausibly people concerned about their genome leaking will at some point give up because too many of their relatives have already gotten sequenced
17:59 < muurkha> so they're paying the cost of not getting sequenced (do I have BRCA1 or not?) without getting the benefit
18:00 < muurkha> not a pleasant prediction but a likely one, I think
18:00 < hprmbridge> boxious> hm actually a private sequencing company could potentially work as long as the customers could remain anonymous somehow
18:00 < jrayhawk> muurkha: how do you propose the CCPA would aid in state accumulation of genetic data
18:00 < superkuh> Pretty much everyone I've ever talked to about getting my 23andMe results objected to it on privacy grounds.
18:00 < fenn> i did 23andme, a decade later they got acquired by ancestry.com and everyone with active subscription had all their SNP data slurped up by ancestry.com (this was probably illegal)
18:00 < hprmbridge> kanzure> no reason customers need to be identified.
18:00 < muurkha> jrayhawk: how is it enforced?
18:01 < hprmbridge> kanzure> fenn do you mean promethease
18:01 < jrayhawk> a combination of civil and criminal punishments, depending on the nature of violations
18:01 < muurkha> jrayhawk: how are the violations discovered?
18:01 < fenn> um, yes i meant promethease. there was some other silly hack with 23andme
18:01 < hprmbridge> boxious> well practically it would be a challenge to actually maintain customer anonymity, if its a swab kit where is it sent to (address), etc
18:02 < hprmbridge> kanzure> the swab kits can be bought at the store... 23andme kits are stocked at convenience stores already.
18:02 < jrayhawk> muurkha: court-driven legal discovery, presumably
18:02 < muurkha> jrayhawk: perhaps when you know more about the particulars we can have the conversation
18:02 < superkuh> I don't know if they did but I requested 23andMe delete my data and destroy the sample in 2014.
18:03 < hprmbridge> kanzure> they aren't exactly a high privacy brand
18:03 < fenn> don't they all use spit vials because it requires some degree of consent
18:03 < superkuh> I keep waiting for full exome somewhere to go below ~$300.
18:03 < superkuh> Then I'll do it again, anywhere, privacy or not.
18:04 < jrayhawk> muurkha: i mean, no where in the CCPA is there an incentive to give the state the data in the first place, and privacy statements can be made such that having data to give to the state in discovery is a violation in and of itself
18:05 < jrayhawk> so, your basic premise seems nonsensical to me
18:05 < hprmbridge> kanzure> what if you just literally don't have it.
18:05 < hprmbridge> boxious> maybe you can use current sequencing companies under a fake identity?
18:06 < hprmbridge> kanzure> that doesn't mean they will delete your data
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18:10 < fenn> if you have several relatives with sequence data in the same database it will be very easy to remove the fake identity
18:11 < jrayhawk> kanzure: one funny idea is to do anonymous submission + low coverage short-reads with a bunch of different services and then giving customers the power to aggregate it to higher confidence themselves
18:11 < jrayhawk> and because it has low confidence it doesn't pass any legal thresholds for identifiability
18:12 < jrayhawk> e.g. can't be used in fishing expeditions by the FBI
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18:14 < jrayhawk> i woner if phones are good enough to do assembly these days
18:15 < fenn> phones, the modern bastion of security~
18:15 < jrayhawk> if they're good enough for bitcoin, they're good enough for just about anything
18:19 < jrayhawk> although a CCPA-regulated business with a strong data-deletion policy is a lot cheaper and more consumer-legible as a concept
18:20 < jrayhawk> promethease-in-an-app proably isn't too hard, either
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18:22 < jrayhawk> or even HIPAA for that matter
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--- Log closed Thu Nov 09 00:00:20 2023