--- Log opened Tue Jan 23 00:00:37 2024
00:03 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has quit [Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
00:03 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has joined #hplusroadmap
01:02 -!- Lando-HoloNet [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has joined #hplusroadmap
01:05 -!- Lando-SpacePimp [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
01:23 -!- Llamamoe [~Llamamoe@188.146.97.217] has joined #hplusroadmap
01:32 < hprmbridge> kanzure> already listed https://diyhpl.us/wiki/genetic-modifications/
01:32 < hprmbridge> kanzure> your punishment shall be to memorize that page
01:57 -!- L29Ah [~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
02:19 -!- L29Ah [~L29Ah@wikipedia/L29Ah] has joined #hplusroadmap
02:19 < hprmbridge> Eli> I didn't realize this existed. Out of curiosity, why not use some open source thing to host the info, like GitHub wiki or something?
02:23 < hprmbridge> kanzure> github is not open source. this wiki used ikiwiki.
02:24 < hprmbridge> kanzure> https://github.com/kanzure/diyhpluswiki is a copy
04:18 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
04:21 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
05:12 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:13 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
05:26 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
05:54 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has quit [Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
05:54 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has joined #hplusroadmap
06:29 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> Great resource. Looking at the various groups listed around the world, who would you say are the top 3-5 most productive and interesting to you?
06:34 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
06:35 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> The DIY section on growing human cells/tissues could list some quite doable at home experiments. For example, everyone can harvest epithelial cells from their saliva and you send them to a company that turns them into iPSC. But it’s true that then maintaining them would come at a rather large cost. I am arguing for a while now that we need community spaces equipped for human tissue manipulation.
06:41 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> The cheaper version to iPSC would be to grow them as organoids and one can do all kinds of fun stuff with them.
06:47 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> Yet another source of human stem cells is when you get your wisdom tooth extracted. Just ask the dentist to drop the tooth and some of the blood into a media container with antibiotics
07:27 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
07:30 < hprmbridge> kanzure> church group tends to be interesting
07:51 -!- faceface [~faceface@user/faceface] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:01 -!- darius__ [~darius@2605:a601:aad3:ed00:8fa:7703:5ba:e4fb] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:02 < fenn> is handling your own tissue culture dangerous? you'd have the same vulnerabilities to any viruses as the tissue culture. while most viruses are easily defeated by the immune system at low concentrations, a large initial dose can be fatal even for a clinically insignificant virus
08:02 -!- test_ [flooded@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/flood/x-43489060] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:02 -!- SDr4 [~SDr@li1189-192.members.linode.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:06 -!- stipa_ [~stipa@user/stipa] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:08 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
08:08 -!- stipa [~stipa@user/stipa] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
08:08 -!- SDr [~SDr@user/sdr] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
08:08 -!- abecedarius [~darius@136.49.149.137] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
08:08 -!- flooded [flooded@gateway/vpn/protonvpn/flood/x-43489060] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
08:09 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:28 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:36 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
08:48 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
08:52 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Write error: Broken pipe]
08:52 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:06 -!- Lando-HoloNet [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has quit [Quit: Invest in physical media; buy LaserDisc!]
09:06 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
09:07 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:08 -!- Lando-SpacePimp [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:08 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> By default you would have to follow best cell culture handling practices and have equipment that allows you to do that. Laminar hoods, incubators, autoclaves etc. That being said, if the donor is not infected then the culture should bot be infected. We prescreen every donor material. We also work with a variety of pathogens and follow standard operating procedures as prescribed- either BSL2 or
09:08 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> level 3.
09:17 < fenn> counter culture has problems with unwashed beer bottles in the recycling attracting flies, which then go in and out of the hoods, contaminating petri dishes etc
09:17 < fenn> so, this is the current state of community labs
09:17 < fenn> the bottles are usually left over after an event held in the same space
09:19 < fenn> tissue culture flasks have nice screw on lids, but asking for BSL2 or 3 seems premature
09:20 < fenn> "do not recap needles" seems like a totally insane regulation
09:21 < fenn> how about, press the needle into one of the slots on your standardized hands-free cap holder array
09:23 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> I have doubts how meaningful biohacking in the context of transhumanism can be without the basic cell equipment and SOPs
09:25 < fenn> there are other private research labs that are not community spaces
09:25 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> indeed there are
09:33 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> it is unfortunate though that if someone doesn’t like how academia/gov works and on the other hand is not interested in scientific work that has a commercial angle, there aren’t that many options of doing fundamental science
09:34 -!- boxy [~box@128.127.113.207] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:37 < fenn> i agree. please propose alternative societal constructs
09:38 < fenn> i wonder if i can get a bot to go through the logs and harvest all the ideas and put them in the wiki in the appropriate place with citations back to the log timestamp
09:39 < fenn> i'd probably need some kind of idea ontology or tagging, which i don't trust an LLM to do properly
09:45 < Lando-SpacePimp> fenn
09:49 < fenn> yes, Lando-SpacePimp?
09:50 < Lando-SpacePimp> Hi!
09:50 < fenn> ah, you still exist. wonderful.
09:53 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> I have not thought that one through but spent some time contemplating alternatives. One would be stakeholder led/supported initiatives organized as a DAO for efficiency (or not). Example for far into the future: Parkinson’s patients or individuals with vested interests form a not-for-profit community and raise funds to support research they want to see and not the one the government pushes and big
09:53 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> name labs that stall progress. The community hires a global scientific advisory board and puts out calls for applications reviewed by external reviewers, SAB and community representatives. Selected projects get space and funding to set up shop in a community funded lab space. The DAO and project leaders hold rights over the discoveries and get potential drugs tested/manufactured by black-label
09:53 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> certified drug companies that have to release the product at an acceptable price. Oh the gaps in this vision…
09:54 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> Something like this is already taking shape in the longevity space (of course)
09:55 < fenn> this sounds an awful lot like commercial research
09:55 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
09:56 < fenn> i'm allergic to "DAO" stuff unfortunately
09:56 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> True that but it’s an extreme example - the topic could be anything where enough people share an interest - wasp inspired robotics
09:56 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> Forget the DAO - I share the sentiment
09:57 < fenn> i'm not sure what the real causes of DIYBIO ineptitude are
09:57 < fenn> surely there's some kind of brain drain evaporative cooling
09:57 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> Any foundation could do it - the point is to circumvent gov/academia and monetary incentives from industry
09:58 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
09:58 < fenn> but also it seems like anyone seriously pursuing a field as their life purpose, inevitably has a sort of disdain for hangers-on who aren't in it 100%, so they're unwilling to participate
09:58 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> the problem is where to do the science if not in either one
09:59 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> in what context?
09:59 < fenn> pretty much anything
09:59 < fenn> biohacking, law, programming, art, sports, acting, music
10:01 < fenn> it's exceedingly rare to have sean connery show up at the local coffee house open mic night
10:02 < fenn> you're never going to get a considered legal opinion from a lawyer on a law forum
10:03 < fenn> we never see a higher level of talent going into a grassroots scene
10:03 < fenn> the grassroots always has to lift itself up gradually. unfortunately the usual pattern is that the best and brightest get recognized and receive offers to leave the scene
10:04 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> i see what you mean
10:04 < Lando-SpacePimp> HEY GUYS
10:07 < fenn> "'Bionic woman' is first to have robotic limb merged with bone - and controlled with her mind" https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/002/741/789/854.jpeg 
10:09 < Lando-SpacePimp> :O)
10:09 < fenn> i wonder how they solved the skin penetration site infection problem
10:10 < fenn> this was implanted 3 years ago?
10:14 < fenn> x-ray of osseointegrated leg implants https://www.prostek.com.au/images/osseo.png
10:16 < Lando-SpacePimp> fenn, radiograph
10:22 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:22 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
10:23 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:25 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:26 < fenn> i wasn't able to find anything about infections at the osseointegration implant percutaneous site, or solutions
10:26 < fenn> there was some talk about using antler tissue as a feedthrough
10:26 < fenn> a long time ago, in the channel
10:27 < fenn> .t https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2100310/
10:27 < saxo> Nature's answer to breaching the skin barrier: an innovative development for amputees - PMC
10:27 < EmmyNoether> Nature's answer to breaching the skin barrier: an innovative development for amputees - PMC
10:28 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
10:30 < fenn> Lando-SpacePimp: why don't we see animals with osseointegrated implants?
10:31 < Lando-SpacePimp> fenn, https://www.livescience.com/cat-titanium-prosthetic-paws.html#:~:text=3D%2Dprinted%20titanium%20limbs%20helped,get%20back%20on%20her%20feet.&text=A%20female%20cat%20in%20Russia,printed%20prosthetics%20made%20from%20titanium.
10:32 < fenn> i see far more three legged dogs hopping around than one legged humans hopping around
10:32 < fenn> maybe it's my ignorance speaking, but screwing a titanium pin into a bone doesn't seem that hard? medical stuff is only expensive because humans are so litigious
10:34 < Lando-SpacePimp> fenn, just like most medical devices, implants have a governmental review
10:34 < Lando-SpacePimp> unless you get a medical device development thingy
10:34 -!- test_ is now known as _flood
10:35 -!- cthlolo [~lorogue@77.33.24.3.dhcp.fibianet.dk] has joined #hplusroadmap
10:35 < fenn> even for animals it's a billion dollar clinical trial every time you make a change?
10:36 < Lando-SpacePimp> LOL NO
10:38 < fenn> http://www.sentientdevelopments.com/2009/11/dog-gets-osseointegrated-prosthetic.html
10:57 < fenn> https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/antlers-are-miraculous-face-organs-could-benefit-human-health-180963635/
11:02 < fenn> "the same thing happens if you transplant those cells onto the deer’s leg" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/corecgi/tileshop/tileshop.fcgi?p=PMC3&id=487169&s=11&r=1&c=1
11:04 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
11:04 < fenn> "Nude mouse skin was not capable of participating in antler tissue formation. However, grafted deer skin together with antlerogenic periosteum may have successfully rescued this failure after wounding, which highlights the necessity of the specificity of the overlying skin for antler tissue generation."
11:05 < fenn> finally, jackalopes are a legitimate object of scientific study
11:06 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
11:07 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
11:08 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
11:44 -!- cthlolo [~lorogue@77.33.24.3.dhcp.fibianet.dk] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:46 -!- cthlolo [~lorogue@77.33.24.3.dhcp.fibianet.dk] has joined #hplusroadmap
11:47 -!- cthlolo [~lorogue@77.33.24.3.dhcp.fibianet.dk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:02 < hprmbridge> nmz787> https://www.nonasoftware.org/software
12:03 < hprmbridge> nmz787> """Nona supports over 40 applications in the synthetic biology community and plenty on our Github. Search through Nona’s curated software repository to see if someone else has already solved your problems for you"""
12:08 -!- SDr4 is now known as SDr
12:08 -!- SDr [~SDr@user/sdr] has changed host
12:12 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
12:40 < L29Ah> 18:56:12]<fenn> i'm allergic to "DAO" stuff unfortunately
12:40 < L29Ah> do you have a better proposition for structuring foundations?
12:50 < hprmbridge> Eli> What in the world? I was always taught food or drink in the lab was a crime.
12:51 < fenn> technically it's not *in* the lab, just next door in an open space without a wall separating them
12:53 < fenn> L29Ah: i don't really understand the problem that the DAO idea is solving, so i can't comment constructively. i feel ethereum is mostly bullshit and has a constant influx of scam-culture from the more-bullshit crypto space
12:54 < fenn> i do think public key signatures for access tokens is a good idea
12:54 < fenn> do we need a blockchain for that? probably not
12:57 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> It‘s a general phenomena that newer technologies get first exploited by hype that reduced trust and their utility, followed by slow and delayed adoption by folks who see the realistic benefits of their use and implementation. Same goes for biotech as it does for crypto
12:57 < fenn> why do i need "gas" instead of just paying e.g. vast.ai to run my computations
12:58 < fenn> it's "cloud" woo all over again
12:59 < fenn> turing complete smart contracts are a bad idea
13:00 < docl> yeah the "gas" thing is really tripping my bs alarm
13:00 < fenn> people more in the know than me have explained how proof of stake is a bad idea
13:00 < fenn> what's left besides that cool trapezohedron logo?
13:01 < fenn> hobknobbing with digital central bank currency globalists? no thanks
13:01 < L29Ah> fenn: the problem is organizing flows of financial capital in the form of cryptoassets; has nothing to do with Ethereum, see it more like a joint-stock company form where you have algorithms instead of cops to enforce some of your contracts
13:02 < L29Ah> i agree with you on the bullshit-richness point
13:02 < hprmbridge> Eli> Investing in non-dollar assets just means you’re long on politician mismanagement of the nations wealth. We will see what pans out
13:04 < L29Ah> what's "non-dollar assets"?
13:04 < fenn> there are a lot of non-dollar assets, you'll have to convince me why this one is special
13:05 < docl> is a credit score an asset? it has value, but hmm, nobody pays taxes on their FICO score going up
13:05 < fenn> milling machines, gold, FPGAs, ammunition, baseball cards, whey protein, luxury watches, real estate, stocks...
13:05 < hprmbridge> Eli> Anything that’s not the US dollar. Other currencies, crypto, art and other intangibles, metals, etc …
13:05 < L29Ah> then i don't understand your point
13:06 < fenn> ah yes, "Art" another money laundering bullshit scam market
13:06 < L29Ah> "investing" in US dollars is stupid
13:06 < hprmbridge> Eli> Most of the world does it.
13:06 < fenn> it's not investment, it's diversifying your holdings to be resistant to unexpected shifts in (relative) value
13:06 < L29Ah> it does not
13:07 < L29Ah> still, has nothing to do with DAOs
13:07 < fenn> right
13:09 < hprmbridge> Eli> That’s the question. They use crypto in Venezuela even though it’s illegal. It’s possible that crypto could have value during a US sovereign debt crisis. People would need to move their wealth to something stable.
13:09 < docl> ok but I argue the credit score is a little more disanalogous to cash dollars than concrete assets you can buy or sell. it has nominal value 0 because if you borrow you have to repay, but it does change how much you can borrow / at what interest which has an effect on your raw power. however it's more like currency because it's pure ledger backed fiction
13:10 < fenn> maybe i misunderstood "gas" - it seems to be isomorphic to bitcoin transaction fees, according to wikipedia
13:11 < fenn> early on they were talking about running arbitrary computations on gas
13:11 < fenn> i guess that meant turing complete smart contracts
13:13 < L29Ah> in real business most of your contracts aren't blockchain-enforceable well, you still have to have nominal owners of stuff
13:13 < L29Ah> smart contracts won't ever be a silver bullet regardless of their features
13:14 < fenn> credit score is a reputation currency, that's all
13:22 -!- Gooberpatrol66 [~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
13:48 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
14:02 -!- Llamamoe [~Llamamoe@188.146.97.217] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
14:05 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
14:06 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
14:12 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
14:14 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
14:29 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
14:29 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
14:40 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
14:41 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
15:18 -!- Lando-HoloNet [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has joined #hplusroadmap
15:21 -!- Lando-SpacePimp [~Lando-Spa@user/lando-spacepimp] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
15:44 < jrayhawk> proof of stake isn't strictly bullshit, it's just limited to being a security multiplier on some other consensus mechanism. otherwise it runs into the "nothing at stake" problem. the bullshit is when it's claimed to be the *sole* consensus mechanism, which only serves to obscure the real consensus mechanism.
15:47 < jrayhawk> bitcoin, for instance, deployed UASF *on top of* proof-of-work, and did not bullshit about it
15:49 < Ashstar> how about, proof of steak for all those carnivores?
15:50 < docl> UASF = User Activated Soft Fork
15:51 < docl> there's a fork/steak joke in there somewhere I'm sure
15:53 < hprmbridge> astatineknight> UASF more like USDA
15:54 -!- Gooberpatrol66 [~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66] has joined #hplusroadmap
15:56 < Ashstar> I was raised vegetarian, I remmber my first steak, I ate it with guilty abandon
15:57 < Ashstar> thought I would get sick from lack of protease
15:57 < Ashstar> s
15:57 < Ashstar> enough HCL
15:58 < Ashstar> it was truly delicious
15:59 < jrayhawk> concerns over stomach acid and bile production are legitimate, but fortunately, there is suppemental ox bile to help bootstrap that
16:00 < jrayhawk> hopefully you did okay regardless
16:04 -!- ike8 [e8f913dbdf@irc.cheogram.com] has joined #hplusroadmap
16:09 < Ashstar> it was not that bad
16:12 < Ashstar> I did it because I had a feeling I wasn't getting enough protein. I do feel that we are not able to digest a lot of red meat, the connective tissue makes it hard to digest adequately, also our digestive track, we are facultative omnivores, our guts are too long for a meat iet
16:12 < Ashstar> diet
16:13 < Ashstar> other meats, like fish, fowl are easier to break apart
16:13 < jrayhawk> hydrolyzing collagen down to smaller peptides is a function provided by boiling
16:13 < Ashstar> yes
16:13 < Ashstar> that helps
16:14 < Ashstar> it's the collagen that makes it hard to digest
16:15 < jrayhawk> humans' lack of prolase is more disastrous in plant foods, of course
16:15 < Ashstar> the aleuron layer of seeds, like beans makes it hard to access the protein
16:15 < Ashstar> why we fart
16:16 < Ashstar> so, really cooking it helps
16:18 < fenn> no, beans contain oligosaccharides which feed microbes and are not absorbed
16:19 < fenn> soaking the beans dissolves the oligosaccharides into the water. after a few water changes you get most of it out
16:20 < fenn> soybeans contain trypsin inhibitors, which causes a different kind of fart (the really bad H2S kind)
16:22 < fenn> .wik raffinose
16:22 < saxo> "Raffinose is a trisaccharide composed of galactose, glucose, and fructose. It can be found in beans, cabbage, brussels sprouts, broccoli, asparagus, other vegetables, and whole grains." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raffinose
16:22 < EmmyNoether> "Raffinose is a trisaccharide composed of galactose, glucose, and fructose. It can be found in beans, cabbage, brussels sprouts, broccoli, asparagus, other vegetables, and whole grains." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raffinose
16:22  * fenn yells "BOT FIGHT!!!"
16:22 < fenn> get 'em emmy, one two, one two
16:23 < jrayhawk> huh, i knew soaking helps with saponin/lectin/phytate problems, but i had never knew about raffinose
16:23 < Ashstar> fenn, that is part of it, the seed coating, which is a mechanism to keep the seed intact
16:23 < Ashstar> is called the Aleuron layer
16:23 < jrayhawk> .wik aleuron
16:23 < saxo> "Aleuron is a genus of moths in the family Sphingidae first described by Jean Baptiste Boisduval in 1870. /  Aleuron chloroptera (Perty 1833) Aleuron cymographum Rothschild & Jordan 1903" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleuron
16:23 < EmmyNoether> "Aleuron is a genus of moths in the family Sphingidae first described by Jean Baptiste Boisduval in 1870. /  Aleuron chloroptera (Perty 1833) Aleuron cymographum Rothschild & Jordan 1903" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleuron
16:23 < jrayhawk> .wik aleurone
16:23 < saxo> "Aleurone (from Greek aleuron, flour) is a protein found in protein granules of maturing seeds and tubers.[clarification needed]| The term also describes one of the two major cell types of the endosperm, the aleurone layer." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleurone
16:23 < Ashstar> it is the whole undigested portion of the beans that go through the gut
16:24 < EmmyNoether> "Aleurone (from Greek aleuron, flour) is a protein found in protein granules of maturing seeds and tubers.[clarification needed]| The term also describes one of the two major cell types of the endosperm, the aleurone layer." - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleurone
16:24 < Ashstar> let find right spelling
16:24 < jrayhawk> i ain't eatin' no moths *throws out bag of lentils*
16:28 < Ashstar> damn laptopp
16:28 < Ashstar> stuck
16:31 < Ashstar> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleurone
16:31 < Ashstar> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleurone
16:32 < Ashstar> anyway, it keeps a lot of the material that feeds the gut bacteria
16:33 < Ashstar> it is the way seeds get through the gut
16:33 < Ashstar> undigested
16:34 < Ashstar> just have a cup of KOPI LUWAK
16:34 < Ashstar> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kopi_luwak
16:49 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
16:52 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
16:54 < L29Ah> i prefer https://buxtrade.de/de/nahrungsergaenzung/koffein-in-pulverform-100-rein-1-kg
17:00 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
17:02 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:07 -!- darius__ is now known as abecedarius
17:09 < muurkha> jrayhawk: moooths
17:14 -!- balrog [znc@user/balrog] has quit [Quit: Bye]
17:16 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has quit [Quit: https://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
17:16 -!- TMM_ [hp@amanda.tmm.cx] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:18 -!- balrog [znc@user/balrog] has joined #hplusroadmap
17:21 < Ashstar> moths have protein, also exoskeleton of chitin, a polysacharide, same as fungi
17:22 < Ashstar> insects are good sources of nutrition
18:09 < muurkha> moths that ate your lentils have, at most, the protein that was in the lentils they ate
18:10 < muurkha> animals in general don't convert other macronutrients into protein (because they don't fix nitrogen and can't metabolize other sources of nitrogen such as ammonia, urea, or uric acid)
18:11 < muurkha> they do, however, often have less non-protein macronutrients
18:13 -!- Malvolio [~Malvolio@idlerpg/player/Malvolio] has quit [Quit: 1BD4 ~~water you sinking about~~ 2024-01-24 02:13:53:024]
18:20 < fenn> also they can eat leaves which are not edible by humans
18:21 < fenn> there's some research on extracting tree leaf protein for famine / food supply emergencies
18:21 < muurkha> yes, but in this case we're talking about lentils, which are edible by humans
18:23  * fenn mumbles about mycelial protein fed with ammonia
19:23 < Lando-HoloNet> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57rIx0FwBaI
19:26 < hprmbridge> kanzure> they be selling decapped chips in case you lost your acid baths https://www.labsmore.com/store/p/pal-decapped
19:28 < hprmbridge> kanzure>  https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1064664282450628710/1199556234123161730/image0.png?ex=65c2f8cc&is=65b083cc&hm=9e94ce1860f684041f8a56a194d8a667399ede49135e7650cb620fbd45a58ee3&
19:30 < hprmbridge> kanzure> surfaces for liquid handling https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2024.01.17.575712v1
19:42 < muurkha> kanzure: I hear you can get epoxy off chips just by immersing them in boiling colophony for several hours?
19:43 < muurkha> not, obviously, as selectively as this
19:52 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20:40 -!- mxz [~mxz@user/mxz] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
21:40 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:19 -!- Hooloovoo [~Hooloovoo@hax0rbana.org] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
22:27 -!- Hooloovoo [~Hooloovoo@hax0rbana.org] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:28 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:31 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:33 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
22:36 -!- Ashstar [~Ashstar@mobile-166-170-41-40.mycingular.net] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:47 -!- mxz [~mxz@user/mxz] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:48 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:49 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:50 -!- Gooberpatrol66 [~Gooberpat@user/gooberpatrol66] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
22:50 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
22:51 < muurkha> nmz787: have you thought about plasma garbage incineration at low temperature?  I'm thinking of something like a plasma asher, where you put organic substances in a low-pressure air environment which you convert to a room-temperature plasma for several hours or days
22:51 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
22:52 < muurkha> In addition to water and carbon dioxide, this will generate a lot of ozone and nitrogen oxides, which you have to get rid of in some way, like maybe a catalytic converter or diesel exhaust fluid
23:12 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
23:25 -!- justanotheruser [~justanoth@gateway/tor-sasl/justanotheruser] has joined #hplusroadmap
--- Log closed Wed Jan 24 00:00:38 2024