| --- Day changed Mon May 19 2008 | ||
| Vedestin | their routing software | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| kanzure | fenn: http://www.engr.utexas.edu/che/students/undergrad/documents/06-08SAC_000.pdf | 00:04 |
| kanzure | it's not too bad in the end | 00:04 |
| kanzure | that's the chemical engineering curriculum | 00:04 |
| kanzure | classes that might be worth it: | 00:04 |
| kanzure | lab instrumentation, electronics machinery, chem engr process & materials, reactor analysis & design, process control/design, and then the technical area electives. | 00:04 |
| kanzure | maybe the separation class, that's always important | 00:05 |
| kanzure | of course, I'm not against anything on that list per-se, just that I'd like some flexibility :) | 00:05 |
| kanzure | like, I don't know, not taking the core corriculum (american govt, literature (I can always read Wikipedia to hear what I'm going to hear in there), soc-sci, hist., | 00:06 |
| kanzure | hrm | 00:06 |
| kanzure | don't know. | 00:06 |
| kanzure | http://science.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/05/18/1253258 | 00:22 |
| kanzure | Shit. | 00:22 |
| kanzure | Missed that one. | 00:22 |
| fenn | i think you will be underwhelmed | 00:23 |
| fenn | just think about what you've learned in the last 4 years and compare with that curriculum | 00:25 |
| fenn | wow two courses in american history | 00:26 |
| fenn | and two american government wtf | 00:26 |
| kanzure | http://science.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=556554&cid=23458618 My post on Slashdot re: brain hacking, sandboxing, etc. | 00:43 |
| kanzure | Hm. I'm not going to get karma for that one. | 00:46 |
| Vedestin | kanzure, ever met chemical engineers? | 00:49 |
| kanzure | Nope. | 00:49 |
| kanzure | yes, actually | 00:49 |
| kanzure | my calculus/physics teacher is a chemical engineer | 00:49 |
| Vedestin | really? | 00:49 |
| Vedestin | isn't he a teacher? | 00:49 |
| kanzure | yep | 00:49 |
| kanzure | yes he is | 00:49 |
| Vedestin | he works part time in chem eng? | 00:49 |
| Vedestin | or he's just trained in it | 00:50 |
| kanzure | no, he has a degree in it | 00:50 |
| kanzure | 'trained' is a different story (=no) | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | well, in my experience | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | chemical engineers are either intensely dull | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | intensely arrogant | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | or a horrible mix of both | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | which would normally be ok | 00:50 |
| Vedestin | except that chemical engineers tend to teach chemical engineering courses | 00:51 |
| kanzure | it's definitely something I'm interested in though - this is where you get into manufacturing automation, plus chemistry is an intense analytical science on its own | 00:51 |
| Vedestin | they're different | 00:51 |
| Vedestin | chemical engineering should really be called process engineering | 00:51 |
| Vedestin | what are they researching at austin that you'd want to be involved with kanzure | 00:57 |
| kanzure | Vedestin: http://ellingtonlab.org/ - automated engineering for the acceleration of natural evolution | 00:58 |
| Vedestin | ahh ok, sounds interesting | 00:59 |
| Vedestin | i'm going to go battle bureaucracy for a while | 01:02 |
| Vedestin | bye | 01:02 |
| kanzure | k | 01:02 |
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| kanzure | fenn: just if you haven't seen Ed yet, http://edboyden.org/ | 01:08 |
| fenn | hm interesting this was just mentioned on some mailing list or other since i was just reading about it from marshallbrain.com http://www.aber.ac.uk/compsci/Research/bio/robotsci/ | 01:09 |
| kanzure | that was on my mailing list | 01:10 |
| kanzure | heh | 01:10 |
| fenn | omg too much stuff | 01:10 |
| kanzure | hm? | 01:10 |
| kanzure | Ed Boyden? | 01:10 |
| kanzure | yeah, he's kind of like me | 01:10 |
| kanzure | it's interesting though | 01:10 |
| kanzure | he also knows Superkuh | 01:10 |
| fenn | oh he's the "everything i learned at MIT" guy | 01:11 |
| kanzure | I talked to him on the phone before. | 01:11 |
| fenn | totally useless but that's what i remembered | 01:11 |
| kanzure | remember him more as the "guy who is using lasers to control neurons" | 01:12 |
| kanzure | and the guy who is associated with http://www.innerspacefoundation.org/ | 01:12 |
| kanzure | woah, John Cumbers just offered hplusroadmap some moonrocks :) | 01:12 |
| fenn | eh.. real moon rocks? | 01:12 |
| kanzure | not real moon rocks, but stuff that is chemically essentially the same stuff | 01:13 |
| kanzure | 'recommended production of two root simulants corresponding | 01:13 |
| kanzure | to a low-Ti mare basalt and a high-Ca highland | 01:13 |
| kanzure | *anorthosite. *These roots represent compositional | 01:13 |
| kanzure | end-members of mare and highland materials, and can | 01:13 |
| kanzure | in principle be physically mixed to target the range of | 01:13 |
| kanzure | soil compositions in the Apollo inventory. Lunar mare | 01:13 |
| kanzure | basalt simulant *JSC-1A *approximates Apollo 14 basalts | 01:13 |
| kanzure | with relatively low-Ti content, and was obtaiggd | 01:13 |
| kanzure | by milling and sieving a glassy volcanic ash from Merriam | 01:13 |
| kanzure | Crater in Arizona (*JSC-1AF = finer grade)* | 01:13 |
| fenn | okies.. i'll keep it in mind if i ever need some lunar regolith simulant :) | 01:14 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/Moontank is the obvious application | 01:14 |
| kanzure | fenn: if I go back and make those edits to the [[2008-05-18]] page, what new things should I add to it? | 01:15 |
| kanzure | it's supposed to be showing up in a magazine for transhumanists among others | 01:15 |
| kanzure | so I'm trying to show that they can actually contribute / get people onboard etc. | 01:16 |
| fenn | one sec, lemme transfer to laptop/bedroom | 01:16 |
| kanzure | I'm going brb | 01:16 |
| fenn | /away | 01:28 |
| fenn | heh | 01:28 |
| fenn | I HAVE ARRIVED | 01:28 |
| kanzure | hm? | 01:28 |
| fenn | i wonder what would happen if the cat walked on the keyboard when i have multiple screen sessions open | 01:29 |
| fenn | 2005-08-18 is what exactly? | 01:30 |
| kanzure | 2008-05-18 | 01:31 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/2008-05-18 | 01:31 |
| kanzure | it's supposed to become an essay for the Sirius H+ magazine | 01:31 |
| kanzure | meant to be a dense, but accessible, introduction to SKDB | 01:31 |
| fenn | do you know what eric is talking about with Taylor-* stuff? | 01:32 |
| kanzure | hm | 01:33 |
| kanzure | well, wikipedia calls it 'scientific management' | 01:33 |
| kanzure | I think this just means 'thoughtful management' | 01:33 |
| kanzure | uh, shit | 01:34 |
| kanzure | I need some sleep, fenn | 01:34 |
| fenn | g'nites | 01:34 |
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| fenn | He distinguishes "Process", the course of material that is transformed into product, from "Operation" which are the actions performed on the material by workers and machines. | 01:47 |
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| Vedestin | synergism is a pretty interesting concept | 06:30 |
| Vedestin | in biological systems | 06:30 |
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| Biopunk | hi kanzure | 17:49 |
| kanzure | Hey Biopunk. | 17:50 |
| kanzure | http://www.acscinf.org/ | 18:03 |
| Biopunk | American Chemical Society | 18:10 |
| Biopunk | sounds like something chemical brothers could be members of | 18:11 |
| * Biopunk softly sings "hey boy, hey girl..." | 18:12 | |
| fenn | http://smari.yaxic.org/blag/2008/05/19/building-a-post-scarcity-society-in-a-patent-and-copyright-encumbered-intellectual-climate/ | 19:13 |
| Biopunk | it's not so easy to find a good solution for the patent problem | 19:37 |
| Biopunk | everyone agrees there has to be a change I think, except disney... well they too.. only they want progressively longer patents | 19:39 |
| fenn | grr tapr.org is making all the same stupid mistakes that we're finally rooting out in the free software world, "because hardware is different! wah!" | 19:47 |
| kanzure | "No! No different! Only different in your mind." | 19:51 |
| kanzure | ooh, it was you | 19:51 |
| fenn | yeah i just wanted to nudge smari in the right direction | 19:52 |
| fenn | i guess it worked | 19:52 |
| kanzure | good job | 19:52 |
| kanzure | we'll have to do a followup with him later | 19:52 |
| kanzure | fenn: do you have a mental bootup "time" / routine? | 19:53 |
| kanzure | I just spent 40 minutes in the kitchen, a significant time of which was on the floor looking in cupboards | 19:53 |
| kanzure | I am not sure why, though. | 19:53 |
| fenn | yeah i often do dishes generated by my roomates during that time | 19:53 |
| kanzure | At one point I realized that I was being inattentive and unable to do big/long thoughts, so I took the medication | 19:53 |
| fenn | "the medication"? | 19:53 |
| kanzure | well, I take Adderall | 19:54 |
| fenn | oh, why? | 19:54 |
| kanzure | so earlier today I didn't take it | 19:54 |
| kanzure | it's med for ADHD apparently :) | 19:54 |
| kanzure | the H stands for hyperactive, but more usefully perhaps H+ ;-) | 19:54 |
| fenn | heh | 19:54 |
| fenn | hilarious++ | 19:54 |
| kanzure | but I soon realized the error in that, "oh shit, that's why I'm not doing anything" | 19:54 |
| kanzure | so I went back and took some of the smaller dosages that I used to take in the afternoons | 19:55 |
| kanzure | (recently I switched to doing the full morning dose in the afternoon as well, you can probably tell)O | 19:55 |
| kanzure | *tell) | 19:55 |
| kanzure | the switch was sometime in March or April; I don't know if I remembered to document it | 19:55 |
| fenn | survival of the sexiest - is hyperactivity sexy? | 19:55 |
| kanzure | dunno | 19:55 |
| kanzure | it's pretty neat to me, especially paired iwth hyperfocusing | 19:55 |
| kanzure | *with | 19:55 |
| fenn | <- drug hater | 19:56 |
| kanzure | I don't know, fenn, the difference is rather staggering in me | 19:56 |
| fenn | you have to make sure you're "aimed" in the right direction before you take it, or else you might go off on a week-long obsession about pokemon | 19:57 |
| fenn | or at least that's my baseless speculation | 19:58 |
| kanzure | to some extent that might be true | 19:59 |
| kanzure | I was actually trying to think about the typical thoughts that I do think about | 19:59 |
| Biopunk | from my days in that world I remember that it was good to have someone close by who was not on drugs who could point one in the right direction | 20:00 |
| kanzure | for example, earlier today I was jotting out some massive handwritten notes to add to [[brainstate augmentation setup]] eventually | 20:00 |
| kanzure | and I was trying to go through the same thoughts again, | 20:00 |
| kanzure | but I couldn't actually do it, it all seemed rather depressing | 20:00 |
| kanzure | I mean, ultimately I know it is *not* depressing, it's incredibly awesome | 20:00 |
| kanzure | Biopunk: It's prescribed. It's not like that. | 20:00 |
| fenn | the fact that you can't remember your thoughts is awesome? | 20:00 |
| Biopunk | yeah i know | 20:00 |
| kanzure | no, I refer to the concepts | 20:01 |
| kanzure | it's the synthesis/picture/world-view that I am developing | 20:01 |
| kanzure | (perhaps exhibited by [[roadmap]]) | 20:01 |
| fenn | oh, you're sick of yourself | 20:01 |
| kanzure | hm? | 20:01 |
| fenn | take a vacation :) | 20:01 |
| kanzure | no, I'm fine, really | 20:01 |
| kanzure | I was going to come up stairs to do something | 20:02 |
| kanzure | but now I've ended up doing meta-talk with you | 20:02 |
| kanzure | hm | 20:02 |
| kanzure | ah, maybe I was going to work on http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/UT | 20:02 |
| kanzure | for some reason my server crapped out on me, so I dumped some content on your wiki on [[ohshit]], fenn ... it was a spur of the moment thing, I was pressed for time | 20:02 |
| kanzure | the server's been doing this recently, I need to fix it, but I can't quite track down the source of the problem | 20:02 |
| fenn | heh that's fine | 20:03 |
| kanzure | I'm pretty sure it's not internal, since the server always responds when I am within the network | 20:03 |
| kanzure | fenn: did I tell you that I have come across some good money for a new computer setup? | 20:03 |
| fenn | gratz | 20:04 |
| fenn | did you steer your grandma in the right direction? | 20:04 |
| kanzure | $2k. I'm planning on a 4 GB DDR2 RAM ($60) + at least one or two 500 GB SATA hdd internal ($90 ea), a RAID card, and a multimonitor card | 20:04 |
| kanzure | I'll then go dumpster diving for a few monitors, I want to get up to five or six soon | 20:04 |
| kanzure | no, I actually haven't talked to her about her textbook gift | 20:05 |
| fenn | get a head-up display and chording keyboard | 20:05 |
| kanzure | it'll depend on what I can do for the first year of classes | 20:05 |
| kanzure | fenn: chording keyboards look awesome | 20:05 |
| fenn | eh i guess | 20:05 |
| fenn | better than nothing | 20:05 |
| kanzure | the last woman I was close to had one | 20:05 |
| fenn | O.o | 20:05 |
| fenn | not a tranny? | 20:05 |
| kanzure | nope | 20:05 |
| kanzure | just blind :) | 20:05 |
| fenn | aha | 20:06 |
| kanzure | proprietary lockin, hehe | 20:06 |
| fenn | why arent all blind people geniuses | 20:06 |
| kanzure | Haldeman? | 20:06 |
| kanzure | Holdeman? I didn't check the spelling | 20:06 |
| kanzure | She was bright, in a way. | 20:06 |
| Biopunk | but she couldn´t see it? | 20:06 |
| kanzure | but ultimately tainted by proprietary lock in, and not just in terms of software on the device, but also memes and religion etc. | 20:06 |
| kanzure | [how it ended might be a story for another time] | 20:06 |
| kanzure | Biopunk: do *you* need to see the keyboard when you type? | 20:07 |
| fenn | i do sometimes | 20:07 |
| kanzure | heh | 20:07 |
| fenn | only the weird keys though | 20:07 |
| * kanzure has keys with no letterings anymroe | 20:07 | |
| Biopunk | yes... t'was a joke.. 'bright' | 20:07 |
| Biopunk | cool | 20:07 |
| kanzure | anyway, it ended fairly terribly | 20:07 |
| kanzure | this was late 2006 | 20:08 |
| kanzure | 70,000 words over IM and 600 emails within 2.5 months | 20:08 |
| kanzure | [I didn't bother counting phone usage, or time otherwise spent] | 20:08 |
| fenn | cults are the next big obstacle once we get a post-scarcity economy | 20:08 |
| kanzure | how so? | 20:08 |
| kanzure | hrm, I can go into my cancerous spiell | 20:08 |
| kanzure | I have a few notes up in a log somewhere | 20:08 |
| fenn | well, governments will totally be useless when people have what they want | 20:08 |
| kanzure | okay, so cults | 20:09 |
| kanzure | the problem is that these cults are going to be somewhat damaging | 20:09 |
| kanzure | suppose we have a singularity society | 20:09 |
| kanzure | where you can fork your habitat and go off on your own | 20:09 |
| kanzure | the real problem is that the original forker might be ideologically constrained in some way or another | 20:09 |
| kanzure | so every derivative work might in fact be 'tainted' | 20:09 |
| kanzure | this is the same problem as cancer, as the combinatorial explosion, | 20:09 |
| Biopunk | people want people to tell them what to do... evolution has built that in | 20:09 |
| kanzure | as the reason why we need brainsynch [even though it won't entirely work ever [though I am optimistic]] | 20:09 |
| fenn | no, people can change, especially once they've been isolated from influences that shaped the original philosophy/culture | 20:10 |
| kanzure | Biopunk: uh? | 20:10 |
| kanzure | fenn: I hope so :) | 20:10 |
| fenn | i'm optimistic about that | 20:10 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/chats/2007-12-08%20-%20cancer.html | 20:10 |
| kanzure | Noah is a friend of David's (from CBA) | 20:10 |
| Biopunk | look out for no one.. that sort of thing... most pepole will always want people to tell them what to do I think | 20:10 |
| fenn | i like people telling me what to think sometimes | 20:11 |
| Biopunk | 'look out for number one'... defend and faciliate for the guy in charge | 20:11 |
| fenn | it's easy, comforting | 20:11 |
| fenn | i have a good bullshit detector though | 20:11 |
| Biopunk | yeah... that's exactly it | 20:11 |
| kanzure | ' | 20:12 |
| kanzure | But the rate of growth of the noise is going to always be much faster than the rate of growth of any sort of "signal factory" that we can make. And even if we *could* make a signal factory, who's to say that when our dx overpowers the dx of the billions of other noise engines, that our own systems will not also be noise, unable to be stopped? Ater all, we identify noise via looking into our own internal meanings and interpretation | 20:12 |
| kanzure | who's to say that when our dx overpowers the dx of the billions of other noise engines, that our own systems will not also be noise, unable to be stopped? Ater all, we identify noise via looking into our own internal meanings and interpretations, so is it truly to be our will to impose upon the rest of reality? Sounds cancerous, sickly, deadly.' | 20:12 |
| kanzure | don't know where the cutoff is | 20:13 |
| Biopunk | with religion.... it's like you never have to grow up... you can be 5 all your life... big daddy will always take care of things | 20:13 |
| fenn | always is a strong word | 20:13 |
| fenn | lasers overcome the noise problem | 20:13 |
| fenn | and they're just tubes of hot gas | 20:13 |
| kanzure | fenn: shine a laser in people's eyes and what happens? | 20:13 |
| kanzure | subtlety is needed | 20:13 |
| kanzure | much like your nudging that guy in the right direction | 20:13 |
| kanzure | instead of an all out burst like I have been doing | 20:13 |
| kanzure | like at OWW and ISDC2008 | 20:13 |
| kanzure | which only has a partially good reaction mostly because it's smart people on the other end | 20:14 |
| kanzure | :) | 20:14 |
| kanzure | but it could be better | 20:14 |
| fenn | hm.. the problem with your emails is they aren't focused, they're all over the place and you dont bring it together | 20:14 |
| kanzure | it's hard :( | 20:14 |
| fenn | yep | 20:14 |
| kanzure | but yes, I need to do that | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > The Vild in _Neverness_ is a region of the Milky Way galaxy where | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > stars are going supernova at an exponential rate. The heavens are | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > literally diseased, sickened, poisoned. The main character, Mallory | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > Ringess, pilot of the Order of the Mystical Mathematicians and Other | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > Seekers of the Ineffable Flame, must fall across the galaxy as a beam | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > of light in search of the source of the problem and to meet his | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > destiny. | 20:14 |
| kanzure | > And with that in mind, it is easy to call the internet poisoned. | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > Automated spam bots flood the internet with linkfarms and other | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > traps. The blognets are heavy with useless noise. Incorrect | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > information floods not only hard drives but minds of users. Botnets | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > storm the connections, denial of service attacks, etc. If an | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > individual could transcend the bio in/out info limitations it would | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > be possible to dive into both the noise and the signals all across | 20:15 |
| kanzure | > the internet (indeed, all of reality) without worries. | 20:15 |
| kanzure | even though it's quoted, that's actually me | 20:15 |
| fenn | another way of identifying noise is checking for consistency | 20:16 |
| kanzure | then the message is incomplete | 20:16 |
| kanzure | well, not the message | 20:16 |
| kanzure | the 'system on the other end' (the generator?) | 20:16 |
| kanzure | according to Godel, that is. | 20:16 |
| kanzure | Okay, enough philosophy. I was going to do something. | 20:19 |
| kanzure | hm. recurse through [[UT]], or recurse through my designs for [[brainstate augmentation setup]] | 20:19 |
| kanzure | or I can try to improve [[2008-05-18]], though I'm still questioning my ability to write well :) | 20:20 |
| Biopunk | you write well... but you might want to use the occams razor | 20:20 |
| kanzure | hm? | 20:21 |
| kanzure | how would you apply it in this situation | 20:21 |
| kanzure | v | 20:21 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/mediawiki/index.php/2008-05-18 | 20:21 |
| * fenn just wants to point out that kanzure didnt write anything past 'manufacturing ecology' | 20:22 | |
| kanzure | fenn: yep | 20:23 |
| kanzure | fenn: I should go place a link | 20:23 |
| kanzure | done | 20:23 |
| Biopunk | i think that's fine for it's intended audience | 20:24 |
| kanzure | many people would disagree completely | 20:24 |
| kanzure | it's not talking about how they can actually help out | 20:24 |
| kanzure | it's not talking about how this could mean something to them personally | 20:24 |
| kanzure | it's just a bunch of words in the end, no? | 20:24 |
| Biopunk | yeah... but you know my thoughts on the h+ community | 20:25 |
| * kanzure added a quote to http://heybryan.org/ at the top | 20:26 | |
| Biopunk | it's in the same style i think | 20:26 |
| kanzure | I need to change what Google shows up as my snippit when it turns up my website | 20:26 |
| kanzure | right now it's just me saying "Hey, my name is Bryan Bishop, and I'm blah blah blah" and nobody gives a flying fuck | 20:26 |
| fenn | bbl restauranting | 20:28 |
| Biopunk | time for me to sleep | 20:28 |
| Biopunk | cu | 20:29 |
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| kanzure | heh, | 21:49 |
| kanzure | call us the Singularity Acceleration Institute | 21:49 |
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