| --- Day changed Mon Apr 20 2009 | ||
| kanzure- | fenn: so one method that people have used is a silicon cantilever with a resistor built into it | 00:09 |
|---|---|---|
| kanzure- | as the cantilever bends, the resistivity changes | 00:09 |
| kanzure- | uh, resistance | 00:09 |
| kanzure- | did I just say resistivity? :( | 00:09 |
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| genehacker | goto ifpi.org right now | 00:15 |
| genehacker | ERROR CONVERSATION LAPSE | 00:15 |
| fenn | actually i think 'resistivity' is correct, in this case | 00:19 |
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| genehacker | http://www.wired.com/science/planetearth/magazine/16-06/mf_monkeybusiness | 00:31 |
| genehacker | you can get in trouble for Biopiracy in Brazil | 00:31 |
| genehacker | heh | 00:32 |
| genehacker | I wonder what they'd do about a researcher going into a forest there, sequencing everything in sight and dumping all the data to the internet | 00:33 |
| kanzure- | what do you think prostitutes are doing? | 00:33 |
| kanzure- | "genetic sleuthing" or something. | 00:34 |
| genehacker | it's not piracy | 00:39 |
| genehacker | though | 00:39 |
| genehacker | it's making copies | 00:39 |
| kanzure- | with a sufficiently long and sufficiently narrow nanochannel (picochannel?), would a fluidic scanning microscope device work? | 00:41 |
| kanzure- | I don't think it would because of the force required to push liquid up such a small channel | 00:41 |
| kanzure- | but if it did you could just use light to detect whether or not the liquid is up to that particular point | 00:41 |
| kanzure- | which would tell you how far the liquid has been pushed | 00:41 |
| fenn | prostitutes provide a service which interferes with the marriage racket.. it's more like online college degrees than piracy | 00:42 |
| kanzure- | ok ok, I'll just start stalking people and recovering DNA from their dirty dishes or something | 00:43 |
| kanzure- | wait, why am I doing this? | 00:43 |
| fenn | was that a barack obama reference? | 00:43 |
| kanzure- | not to my knowledge | 00:43 |
| fenn | wow sounds like someone was really out to get that biologist | 01:00 |
| fenn | sending assassins after him even | 01:00 |
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| genehacker | kanzure just mail them some junkmail | 01:27 |
| genehacker | they pick it up | 01:27 |
| genehacker | breath on it accidently | 01:27 |
| genehacker | and throw it away | 01:27 |
| genehacker | then extract the DNA from the paper | 01:28 |
| genehacker | PCR is that sensitive | 01:28 |
| genehacker | and unfortunately the dude who wrote the anthrax letters knew about it | 01:28 |
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| faceface | apparently someone said somethgin to me in the last 3 days... anyone got a history? | 03:11 |
| faceface | I have it here somewhere... | 03:11 |
| fenn | 12:32 #hplusroadmap: < kanzure> faceface: that's neat. why would it result in a publication though? | 03:27 |
| fenn | in response to: " each buddy would result in a pub." | 03:27 |
| fenn | starting a new novel; which of these is best? left hand of darkness, the mote in god's eye, a fire upon the deep | 03:28 |
| * fenn wonders how much a gold-plated, machined chunk of silver costs | 03:39 | |
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| faceface | cheers fenn | 07:47 |
| faceface | kanzure-: getting a bioinf person to solve a bio problem, and a bio person to use some bioinf, should be a (small) publication I guess... depending on the quality of the work. | 07:48 |
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| kanzure | http://www.opencircuits.com/Atomic_microscope | 10:58 |
| kanzure | gwyddion. hrm. | 10:58 |
| kanzure | http://www.nanosurf.com/ hrm. handheld AFM. "request a quote" blah | 11:06 |
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| kanzure | is my fluid-AFM idea any good? would you be able to move a dyed fluid in response to pico-levels of forces? | 11:19 |
| kanzure | or atto-levels, even? I don't think so. :-/ as you restrict the diameter of the channel, you increase the amount of force required to push liquid through, right? | 11:19 |
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| kanzure- | that sandstone bacteria (bacillus pasteurii) sounds pretty neat | 13:14 |
| kanzure- | "I researched different types of construction methods involving pile systems and realised that injection piles could probably be used to get the bacteria down into the sand – a procedure that would be analogous to using an oversized 3D printer, solidifying parts of the dune as needed." | 13:14 |
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| kanzure- | heh heh | 13:35 |
| kanzure- | 3D selective laser sintering .. from orbit. | 13:36 |
| kanzure- | or er you don't need to be in orbit | 13:40 |
| kanzure- | just on a really tall mountain | 13:40 |
| kanzure- | you could print a city I think | 13:40 |
| kanzure- | am I going insane? | 13:40 |
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| kanzure- | Hey Eric | 13:45 |
| kanzure- | erm, junglistric | 13:45 |
| junglistric | hello | 13:45 |
| kanzure- | did you see my diybio post on 3D printing of deserts (SLS) from orbit? | 13:45 |
| junglistric | no, i haven't, let me check the email digest | 13:46 |
| kanzure- | http://is.gd/tvV7 | 13:47 |
| junglistric | hm, pretty amazing | 13:50 |
| kanzure- | aren't there some serpinski triangle regulatory networks that we have engineered for bacteria? | 13:51 |
| kanzure- | I mean, that make serpenski triangles on a plate of agar? | 13:51 |
| kanzure- | I know we've done it with DNA (see Winfree/Rothemund, etc.), but I don't know about GRNs and multiple cells | 13:51 |
| junglistric | i had to look serpinski up. what do you mean by GRN? | 13:53 |
| kanzure- | genetic regulatory network | 13:54 |
| kanzure- | there are ways to control the expression of genes that would be involved in shape or growth and so on | 13:54 |
| kanzure- | this is what is used in amorphous computation projects, for instance | 13:54 |
| kanzure | http://bytesizebio.net/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/iching-thealieness.jpg huh? | 13:58 |
| junglistric | a regulatory network that creates that type of structure, i'm not so sure. | 13:58 |
| kanzure | isn't that how gene expression re: HOX works? | 13:59 |
| kanzure | for shape determination | 13:59 |
| kanzure | and destiny cells in embryo development | 14:00 |
| junglistric | sure, but the would have to be some collective regulation since we're talking about the shape of a colony | 14:02 |
| junglistric | might be an undertaking for a bio-artist | 14:06 |
| junglistric | some outside stimulus i.e. light | 14:06 |
| kanzure- | here at UT there was an igem project for that- bacterial patterning with a camera photograph | 14:08 |
| kanzure- | a mask of the PI was used and the bacteria then displayed that photo :) | 14:08 |
| kanzure- | it involved substantial genetic engineering of some signaling pathways apparently | 14:08 |
| junglistric | yeah perhaps to tune the bacteria to the desired stimulus | 14:10 |
| junglistric | easier than it sounds | 14:11 |
| junglistric | *harder | 14:11 |
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| bkero | bkero@fir ~ $ uptime 20:06:38 up 916 days, 2:33, 33 users, load average: 1.70, 1.50, 1.70 | 15:10 |
| kanzure | http://www.acceleratingfuture.com/michael/blog/2009/04/interview-with-singularity-institute-president-michael-vassar/ <-- huh, Steve Rayhawk is now an employee of SIAI? good for him. | 15:11 |
| kanzure | bkero: we all hate you :) | 15:12 |
| kanzure | why can't *I* have an uptime of 916 days | 15:13 |
| bkero | kanzure: That's my 5-9's service. | 15:13 |
| kanzure | ? | 15:13 |
| bkero | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_availability | 15:13 |
| bkero | Availability is measured in 9's. | 15:13 |
| bkero | 2 9's is 99%. 5 9's is 99.999% | 15:14 |
| kanzure- | right. | 15:14 |
| bkero | 5 9's is < 5 minutes of downtime/year. | 15:14 |
| kanzure- | oh. | 15:14 |
| kanzure- | So you're cheating. | 15:14 |
| bkero | ? | 15:14 |
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| bkero | No, it's been up the entire time | 15:14 |
| bkero | I'm saying it's provided at LEAST five nines | 15:14 |
| kanzure- | hrm. | 15:15 |
| kanzure | who introduced me to the concept of singing sand dunes in here? | 15:55 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singing_sand | 15:56 |
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| kanzure | I wonder if we could geoengineer sand dunes to produce ultrasonic booms | 16:12 |
| kanzure | http://www.singingbridges.net/about/ | 16:14 |
| kanzure | "sonic sculpture" | 16:14 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_sculpture | 16:22 |
| kanzure | what neat sound devices have been built before? amplifiers, I guess | 16:24 |
| kanzure | pneumatic sand circuits? | 16:37 |
| fenn | shape determination from hox etc is based on folding and other type of sheet deformation | 16:48 |
| fenn | you couldn't do that if locked in a matrix of sand particles | 16:49 |
| fenn | and besides, bacteria don't grow in sheets | 16:49 |
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| kanzure | see what you miss when you sleep? | 17:12 |
| kanzure | not that anything has actually happened | 17:13 |
| kanzure | you know what. nevermind. | 17:13 |
| kanzure | heh, thomas paviot adopted fernhout's quoting method (ok ok, maybe he just knows enough python) | 17:16 |
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| kanzure | http://hypography.com/forums/engineering-and-applied-science/18854-solar-desalinator-making-one-diy-serious.html | 17:19 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/books/papers/solar%20still%20-%20diagram3%20-%20solar%20desalinator.jpg | 17:39 |
| xp_prg | wow brian cool idea! | 17:57 |
| xp_prg | brian what about getting the salt too? | 17:57 |
| kanzure | what about it? | 18:04 |
| kanzure | hurt what? | 18:25 |
| kanzure | oh | 18:25 |
| fenn | http://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2008/04/algae-fuel-biof.html | 18:31 |
| kanzure- | the first cantilever was hand-crafted 800 micrometer strip of gold foil glued to a diamond tip | 18:44 |
| kanzure- | for AFM. | 18:44 |
| xp_prg | kanzure harvest the salt from your desalinization | 18:59 |
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| fenn | cost of sneakernet vs internet for large data transfers http://www.codinghorror.com/blog/archives/000783.html | 19:03 |
| fenn | linked from http://www.lowtechmagazine.com/2009/02/sneakernet-beats-internet.html | 19:03 |
| fenn | envelope full of microSD cards seems like a reasonable solution | 19:04 |
| fenn | especially with a lot of ISP's going with monthly bandwidth caps | 19:04 |
| fenn | i think time warner was going to do a 5GB/mo cap (which frankly, is ridiculously small) | 19:05 |
| fenn | makes you wonder about space colonization; maybe data will be the most valuable transport cargo | 19:07 |
| kanzure- | glad somebody else is worrying about algae efficiency and of the processes | 19:10 |
| kanzure- | the problem is that we're not funded to examine efficiencies, we're funded to do something that might be impossible | 19:11 |
| kanzure- | so it's in our interest to not do those studies, or something | 19:11 |
| kanzure- | I don't know how this works. | 19:11 |
| kanzure- | but it's also because I don't entirely understand how to do the math I guess | 19:13 |
| kanzure- | for instance, killowatt hours have never ever made sense to me | 19:13 |
| fenn | it's simple | 19:15 |
| fenn | kilowatt is 1000 watts | 19:16 |
| kanzure- | even if I did the analysis, that doesn't mean it's fixed though- because the results will probably show us how much it sucks | 19:16 |
| kanzure- | yes, I know how much a kilo is :) | 19:16 |
| fenn | 1000 watts for 1 hour is 1 kilowatt*hour | 19:16 |
| kanzure- | right, but they always relate this in some weird way to joules | 19:16 |
| kanzure- | that doesn't dimensionally make sense or something | 19:16 |
| kanzure- | but they use it for selling electricity | 19:16 |
| fenn | joule is a watt*second | 19:16 |
| fenn | so a kilowatt hour is 3,600,000 joules | 19:17 |
| kanzure- | right | 19:17 |
| kanzure- | maybe there's something else that was supposedly confusing | 19:17 |
| fenn | i think they should get rid of the "joule" unit and just call it W*s, "wuss" :P | 19:17 |
| kanzure- | or the fact that no device really tells you how many watts it takes to operate when it's operating in such and such mode? | 19:18 |
| fenn | manufacturers are getting better about that | 19:18 |
| kanzure- | I'm tempted to get Andrew Hessel to hire me on to an open source synthetic biology microalgae biofuel project | 19:18 |
| kanzure- | screw this closed/proprietary crap | 19:18 |
| fenn | but specmanship will never die, so there's still a need for independent testing | 19:18 |
| fenn | good luck finding one | 19:19 |
| kanzure- | finding what? | 19:19 |
| fenn | open source synthetic biology project with money | 19:19 |
| kanzure- | he has a source of funding for one. | 19:19 |
| fenn | one that's not iGEM | 19:19 |
| kanzure- | right | 19:19 |
| kanzure- | that's him :) | 19:19 |
| fenn | the point of the article was that there are much more things going into algae biofuel production than just the algae | 19:22 |
| kanzure- | right | 19:22 |
| fenn | so even if the algae is 'proprietary' it doesn't matter | 19:22 |
| kanzure- | no, I'm talking about the harvesting and lysis machinery | 19:22 |
| kanzure- | that's really the bottleneck | 19:22 |
| kanzure- | algae naturally grows- growth optimization only matters to some extent- it's *made* to grow | 19:23 |
| fenn | then why bring synthetic biology into it? | 19:23 |
| kanzure- | "ask it nicely to release its lipids" | 19:23 |
| fenn | 'reusable' algae? | 19:23 |
| kanzure- | and less effort involved with lysing it or killing it or whatever | 19:23 |
| fenn | btw i linked to something about using diatomaceous earth for that, dunno if you ever saw that | 19:23 |
| kanzure- | no? | 19:24 |
| fenn | well i have no idea where it went | 19:24 |
| kanzure- | linkhunters | 19:24 |
| fenn | maybe it was on diybio? | 19:24 |
| kanzure- | what I want to do is come up with some theoretical curves and then some actual curves for testing different hardware for lysis and harvesting | 19:25 |
| kanzure- | for some reason we're now moving on to foam fractionation (or something similar to it) | 19:25 |
| kanzure- | with this giant machine with little to no specs | 19:25 |
| kanzure | also, adding in some natural flocculation protein would be neat | 19:27 |
| kanzure | there's also some co-species methods where a bacteria or other plant thingy produces flocculants that will make the algae clump together | 19:28 |
| kanzure | which makes harvesting as easy as running a big giant stick through the pond. | 19:28 |
| kanzure | thesis on automated gear train design - (I guess that means I'm done with the visualizer??) | 19:40 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/books/papers/Automated%20Synthesis%20and%20Optimization%20of%20Gear%20Train%20Topologies%20-%20Albert%20Swantner%20-%202009.pdf | 19:40 |
| kanzure | http://code.google.com/p/sfepy/ simple finite elements for python | 20:04 |
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| kanzure | hey RandIter. | 20:04 |
| RandIter | hello | 20:05 |
| RandIter | just came to see what you guys are up to | 20:05 |
| kanzure | today? | 20:11 |
| kanzure | DIY atom-scale resolution microscopy, algae farms, and I just learned about AHA! - the Austin Hackers Association | 20:12 |
| fenn | how do i get cp or tar to preserve everything? it always messes up the permissions and creation time (yes i've tried cp -a) | 20:32 |
| fenn | grr now it works of course, after i ask | 20:32 |
| fenn | gremlins | 20:32 |
| kanzure | zip has always preserved creation times for me, fwiw | 20:35 |
| fenn | oh i see.. cp -a changes the permissions back to original when it's done copying | 20:44 |
| kanzure | hrm. octave versus sympy for doing some mathematical modeling? | 20:44 |
| fenn | what kind of modeling? | 20:45 |
| kanzure | meh, just a basic multivariable model of how much algae you'd have to grow to get how much energy if some volume of algae has such and such growth phase curves and blah blah blah | 20:46 |
| fenn | ah | 20:46 |
| kanzure | plus maybe weather consideration stuff. | 20:46 |
| fenn | i was just thinking about how to do differential equations the other day | 20:46 |
| fenn | i guess maxima or some mathematica clone would be the standard solution | 20:46 |
| kanzure | sympy is a symbolic package, but I don't think I need to do symbolic stuff | 20:46 |
| kanzure | so octave would be it then. hm. | 20:46 |
| fenn | have you used octave/matlab before? | 20:47 |
| kanzure | I've used octave a bit | 20:49 |
| fenn | hm i thought it was a requirement that theses had pretty latex equations | 20:54 |
| kanzure | he sent it to me in docx format | 20:57 |
| kanzure | which is Microsoft's latest way of raping the internet | 20:57 |
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| kanzure | Hey genehacker. | 21:01 |
| genehacker | yes I know | 21:01 |
| genehacker | AHA | 21:01 |
| genehacker | do they do software primarily or the other type? | 21:02 |
| kanzure | seems like "the other type" | 21:04 |
| fenn | "security professionals" | 21:06 |
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| genehacker | security | 21:06 |
| kanzure | hey DrTread | 21:07 |
| DrTread | hey, bryan | 21:07 |
| fenn | DrTread: i was supposed to ask you something but i forget what it was.. | 21:08 |
| fenn | something about fab lab | 21:09 |
| fenn | perhaps you should just send an email to lfilip@mac.com instead of me acting as proxy messenger | 21:09 |
| DrTread | ooops... i didn't use your secret code name! | 21:09 |
| DrTread | :-x | 21:09 |
| DrTread | anything to do with airspeed velocity of swallows? | 21:09 |
| DrTread | ah. | 21:09 |
| DrTread | ok. | 21:09 |
| fenn | i hate not having a wiki or mailing list.. this is stupid | 21:10 |
| DrTread | regarding fab stuff... one of my tweeple posted a link to a journal of interesting shapes... | 21:10 |
| RandIter | kanzure: considered numpy as an alternative to octave? | 21:10 |
| DrTread | http://www.isama.org/hyperseeing/ | 21:10 |
| DrTread | mmmmm.... numpy | 21:11 |
| DrTread | and scipy | 21:11 |
| kanzure | fenn: should we have a mailing list? | 21:11 |
| fenn | guess i'm burned out on all that 'ooo math surfaces' stuff | 21:11 |
| kanzure | fenn: this is getting kind of ridiculous, with all of these mailing lists | 21:11 |
| fenn | yes there should be a mailing list | 21:12 |
| kanzure | for what now? | 21:12 |
| kanzure | should I attempt to revive the old hplusroadmap mailing list? | 21:12 |
| kanzure | even though it had no real purpose? | 21:12 |
| DrTread | as i'll be the proud owner of a MakerBot by the end of this week, i'm getting a new interest in math surfaces | 21:12 |
| fenn | not for philisophy or whatever, just for basic announcements and so i'm not shuttling emails around between people | 21:12 |
| kanzure | maybe we need a Bryan Bishop mailing list | 21:12 |
| fenn | er, announcements is wrong | 21:12 |
| fenn | i mean low level discussion that shouldn't be plastered all over the net | 21:12 |
| DrTread | kanzure make it so. you're good at facilitating these things, right? | 21:13 |
| fenn | like 'what next?' or 'come help screw together some scaffolding tuesday at 6pm' | 21:13 |
| kanzure | ah | 21:13 |
| kanzure | for the fablab | 21:13 |
| genehacker | DR TREAD DON'T BUY A MAKERBOT | 21:14 |
| DrTread | 2 late | 21:14 |
| genehacker | it's overpriced | 21:14 |
| genehacker | you can get a CNC mill that can cut metal for about the same price | 21:14 |
| genehacker | besides SKYNET designed some parts for makerbot | 21:14 |
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| genehacker | I don't trust skynet | 21:15 |
| DrTread | hmmm... i have been lazy about building anything myself. buying a makerbot was a chance to jumpstart my own making things | 21:15 |
| DrTread | ah. | 21:16 |
| kanzure | hrm, I might be able to get hessel in here | 21:16 |
| genehacker | well have fun | 21:16 |
| DrTread | interesting discussion over coffee/adult beverage | 21:16 |
| DrTread | ok, genehacker, laser cutter: build one myself or buy an epilog or other unit? | 21:16 |
| DrTread | (with fab lab peeps help, of course) | 21:17 |
| kanzure | did anyone else besides fenn see the SLS-3D-printing-of-the-desert-from-orbit thingy I posted? | 21:17 |
| genehacker | DrTread, are you on the campus? | 21:17 |
| DrTread | nope. | 21:17 |
| genehacker | oh yeah | 21:17 |
| genehacker | damn | 21:17 |
| genehacker | well guess you can't use the laser cutter here then | 21:17 |
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| -!- I}ruid_ is now known as I}ruid | 21:17 | |
| DrTread | true enough. | 21:17 |
| kanzure | Hey I}ruid. | 21:18 |
| fenn | a haq'r! | 21:18 |
| genehacker | saw that SLS from space | 21:18 |
| I}ruid | oh noes! where??? | 21:18 |
| * I}ruid looks aroudn | 21:18 | |
| kanzure | to your left | 21:18 |
| kanzure | he's a hacker-ninja | 21:18 |
| * fenn points at the wall behind I}ruid | 21:18 | |
| DrTread | I}ruid, the hacker-ninja! | 21:18 |
| genehacker | it's already too late if you see the ninja | 21:18 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: we were just talking about SLS 3D printing of the deserts from orbit. | 21:18 |
| DrTread | yes, i've googlestalked him since receiving email | 21:18 |
| genehacker | how does the from orbit part work? | 21:19 |
| kanzure | we all have :) | 21:19 |
| I}ruid | 3D printing, as in object fabrication with those new-fangled printers? | 21:19 |
| kanzure | genehacker: laser | 21:19 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: nope, there is a bacteria that turns sand into sandstone | 21:19 |
| I}ruid | ahhh | 21:19 |
| I}ruid | neat. | 21:19 |
| kanzure | so if you gate that metabolic reaction with a laser-sensitive protein | 21:19 |
| kanzure | and then laser-activate the bacteria .. | 21:19 |
| genehacker | fusion powered laser? | 21:19 |
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| kanzure | why would it be fusion powered? | 21:19 |
| kanzure | hey ahessel. | 21:19 |
| fenn | <insert technobabble step here> | 21:19 |
| ahessel | jey | 21:19 |
| ahessel | hey | 21:19 |
| I}ruid | so the laser comes from orbit | 21:19 |
| kanzure | ahessel: we're currently talking about 3D printing of deserts from orbit. | 21:19 |
| I}ruid | and you sandstone up some dope logos in the desert | 21:19 |
| DrTread | fusion? i thought it was a Tc-99m gamma ray lazor? | 21:20 |
| genehacker | you might be able to take advantage of barchans to spread your bacteria | 21:20 |
| kanzure | well, you could also use a very tall tower | 21:20 |
| fenn | DrTread: it's a neutron pumped lazor | 21:20 |
| genehacker | sigh, if only we could get some Tc-99 | 21:20 |
| DrTread | ah. | 21:20 |
| kanzure | so you don't have to be in orbit necessarily | 21:20 |
| I}ruid | how would you spread the bacteria well enough to make that work? | 21:20 |
| kanzure | although it helps if you want to pattern a large area | 21:20 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: shhh! | 21:20 |
| genehacker | too bad hafnium doesn't work | 21:20 |
| kanzure | the wind? | 21:20 |
| I}ruid | crop duster? (: | 21:20 |
| DrTread | yes, i've been looking for Tc-99 for some time now. damned NRC! | 21:20 |
| DrTread | for purely safe, scientific purposes, of course. | 21:21 |
| genehacker | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barchan | 21:21 |
| genehacker | barchans can self replicate | 21:21 |
| kanzure | " | 21:21 |
| kanzure | A barchan dune is an arc-shaped sand ridge, comprising well-sorted sand. This type of dune possesses two "horns" that face downwind, with the slip face (the downwind slope) at the angle of repose, or approximately 32 degrees. The upwind side is packed by the wind, and stands at about 15 degrees. Simple barchan dunes may stretch from meters to a hundred meters or so between the tips of the horns." | 21:21 |
| fenn | fire can also 'replicate' | 21:22 |
| kanzure | so can fairies | 21:22 |
| fenn | and ewoks | 21:22 |
| kanzure | nah, they're just little infertile kids | 21:22 |
| fenn | oh | 21:22 |
| I}ruid | in teddy bear suits | 21:22 |
| I}ruid | it's a furry convention up on Endor, y0. | 21:22 |
| genehacker | PURGE PURGE | 21:23 |
| I}ruid | hahah | 21:23 |
| DrTread | **shivers @ thought of Ewok sexxin** | 21:23 |
| genehacker | PURGE | 21:23 |
| I}ruid | good thing I didn't follow that up suggesting that you contemplate the name of the planet in that context. | 21:23 |
| I}ruid | whoops. | 21:23 |
| DrTread | let me run over to /b/ for a minute to get my sanity back. | 21:24 |
| I}ruid | (: | 21:24 |
| * I}ruid behaves now | 21:24 | |
| genehacker | I don't think /b/ is going to give it back | 21:24 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: yesterday I was going over some do-it-yourself atomic force microscopy stuff. | 21:24 |
| kanzure | hope you like what I forwarded to the list. | 21:24 |
| DrTread | ok, so we know solitons self-replicate. where are you headed with this, kanzure? | 21:25 |
| kanzure | solitons? what? | 21:25 |
| genehacker | we want to make a megastructure | 21:25 |
| kanzure | genehacker was the one who said these "sand thingies" could self-replicate | 21:25 |
| DrTread | solitary waves, of which barchans are an example | 21:25 |
| kanzure | fenn and I disagree | 21:25 |
| DrTread | oh. yes. sorry. :( | 21:25 |
| I}ruid | looks interesting, I'll have to read it when I have more time and am not distracted by tha chatz | 21:25 |
| fenn | it doesn't really matter if it 'replicates' since it's not useful for anything | 21:25 |
| genehacker | guess so | 21:26 |
| DrTread | megastructure, so we can take over the world? | 21:26 |
| kanzure | well. no. not really. but we could fabricate a really really huge dog whistle I guess. | 21:26 |
| fenn | i dont get how they are supposed to remove all the unbonded sand | 21:26 |
| DrTread | and control all the dogs & use them to take over the world? ok... sanity has returned. | 21:26 |
| I}ruid | if you're creating sandstone from orbit by "painting" the desert, you could easily create building components, although sandstone is notoriously weak as a building material | 21:27 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: yes. that's where this started. | 21:27 |
| I}ruid | gotcha... | 21:27 |
| DrTread | sandstone is as weak as its binder | 21:27 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: http://is.gd/tvV7 | 21:27 |
| * I}ruid missed the beginning of the conversation (: | 21:27 | |
| kanzure | I}ruid: that link will fill you in | 21:27 |
| fenn | I}ruid: the original idea was to infuse sand with 'sandstone bacteria' by stabbing pipes into the sand and infusing the volume underground with bactera/nutrient solution | 21:27 |
| genehacker | perhaps we should make a giant wind powered machine that slowly goes across the desert squirting bacteria into the sand | 21:28 |
| kanzure | or just the surface for starters | 21:28 |
| kanzure | genehacker: how would you make sure it covers a certain area | 21:28 |
| fenn | i mean if you have huge machinery available to move sand around, why not just build walls out of cement or something? | 21:28 |
| genehacker | what do you mean? | 21:28 |
| kanzure | genehacker: your machine would be subject to the direction of the wind | 21:28 |
| kanzure | so you would only get some weird pattern of bacterially-active sand | 21:29 |
| genehacker | turbine powered | 21:29 |
| kanzure | which isn't very useful for laser patterning | 21:29 |
| kanzure | turbine powered? | 21:29 |
| genehacker | wind turbine powered | 21:29 |
| genehacker | kite powered | 21:29 |
| fenn | i'm picturing something like a strandbeest | 21:29 |
| kanzure | ooh. | 21:30 |
| genehacker | yeah sorta like that | 21:30 |
| genehacker | kites are better | 21:30 |
| genehacker | get more wind | 21:30 |
| fenn | of course | 21:30 |
| ybit | <random_tweet_of_the_day> http://www.q-linkproducts.com/h_our_technology.shtml :: when i have my open eeg setup, i may test this </random_tweet_of_the_day> | 21:31 |
| genehacker | more POWER | 21:31 |
| fenn | so, you're saying 'move all that sand with wind powered shovels' basically, right? | 21:31 |
| kanzure | ybit: am I following you? http://twitter.com/kanzure | 21:31 |
| ybit | kanzure, i dunno | 21:32 |
| ybit | http://twitter.com/heathmatlock | 21:32 |
| fenn | ybit: qlink, although it sounds good, is a total scam. the circuit isn't actually even a circuit | 21:32 |
| ybit | i don't tweet much, just on this channel ;) | 21:32 |
| fenn | it's a resistor with pads that go nowhere, and a coil that goes nowhere | 21:32 |
| kanzure | ok. now I am. | 21:32 |
| fenn | see http://www.badscience.net/wp-content/qlink.JPG | 21:32 |
| ybit | thanks fenn, i was looking for specs | 21:33 |
| genehacker | http://www.darkroastedblend.com/2006/11/even-bigger-machines-dig-bigger-holes.html | 21:33 |
| genehacker | i'm thinking something like this | 21:33 |
| fenn | for $100 or so they could at least try to do what they claim | 21:33 |
| kanzure | do we have sand submarines yet? | 21:33 |
| genehacker | no | 21:33 |
| ybit | oh, guess i'm still looking for specs :) | 21:33 |
| kanzure | why haven't you made one yet? get on with it. | 21:33 |
| fenn | i mean it wouldn't be hard to make an active damping antenna | 21:33 |
| I}ruid | reference for qlink? what is this device intended to do? | 21:34 |
| kanzure | I}ruid: it's the one that ybit linked to | 21:34 |
| I}ruid | oh, there it is (: | 21:35 |
| I}ruid | the faux HTML threw me off (: | 21:35 |
| genehacker | HAHHAHAHHAHAA | 21:35 |
| genehacker | qlink | 21:35 |
| genehacker | "My intuition and logic suggest that Clarus type products will be an important part of humanity’s future." | 21:36 |
| genehacker | O'RLY? | 21:36 |
| DrTread | **incredulous glare** | 21:36 |
| kanzure | fenn: this might have backfired on me. this is becoming wrongplanet. | 21:36 |
| DrTread | i do know a yoga instructor who wears a qlink. she's not dead yet. | 21:37 |
| I}ruid | well, as long as there's intuition and logic involved... | 21:37 |
| kanzure | why not just build one of the openEEG systems? | 21:37 |
| kanzure | or better yet, the open-rTMS system? | 21:37 |
| genehacker | the heavily regulated underground rogue chemistry sets of the 21st century will instead synthesize new terrestrial compounds, counter-earths and other illegal geosimulants, rare earth anti-elements that might then catalyze a wholesale resurfacing of the world through radical landscape architecture. | 21:38 |
| genehacker | huh? | 21:38 |
| DrTread | intuition & logic alone produced Aristotle, & science suffered for 2000 years. :( | 21:38 |
| kanzure | DrTread: there's actually a mechanism in the brain responsible for intuition and insight, and I was intent on harvesting it | 21:39 |
| genehacker | DAMN YOU ARISTOTLE! | 21:39 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/thinking.html are my notes on it | 21:39 |
| DrTread | just don't use Protomatter! | 21:39 |
| kanzure | d-cycloserine is an interesting chemical for those purposes. | 21:39 |
| fenn | philosophy suffered for 2000 years because there was 1500 years of dark ages in between | 21:39 |
| I}ruid | this site is way too new-agey... where's the science? where's the whitepaper? (: | 21:39 |
| I}ruid | peer review anyone? | 21:39 |
| fenn | I}ruid: please don't waste your time on q-link | 21:39 |
| genehacker | ok well I have to go study for a test AFK | 21:39 |
| fenn | thanks for nothing genehacker | 21:39 |
| genehacker | thanks for feedback | 21:40 |
| fenn | what people don't realize is that there was only like 200 years of philosophy before all development ceased | 21:40 |
| fenn | then it started back up again in the 18th century | 21:40 |
| I}ruid | once it becomes no longer amusing then I'm wasting my time (: | 21:40 |
| I}ruid | at least right now it's providing the lols | 21:40 |
| fenn | well, western philosophy at least | 21:42 |
| I}ruid | fenn: you talking western philosophy? cuz I'm pretty sure eastern dominates in longevity | 21:42 |
| I}ruid | hah, beat me to my own comment | 21:42 |
| I}ruid | gg | 21:42 |
| kanzure | holy shit. somebody who uses "gg" still. | 21:42 |
| fenn | is that some kind of usenet thing? | 21:42 |
| kanzure | I heard of it in subnet, so no. | 21:42 |
| kanzure | subspace, I mean | 21:42 |
| I}ruid | no, it's a gamer thing. | 21:43 |
| ybit | good game* | 21:43 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SubSpace_(computer_game) | 21:43 |
| ybit | yeah, it's used often | 21:43 |
| I}ruid | it's used almost unconciously by FPS players | 21:43 |
| DrTread | wow. kanzure, for a youngun, you've got quite a memory | 21:44 |
| ybit | :P | 21:44 |
| kanzure | DrTread: I was playing Continuum, the free version of Subspace | 21:44 |
| I}ruid | as soon as a match ends there's an obligitory flood of "gg"'s in the in-game-chat | 21:44 |
| kanzure | yep. | 21:44 |
| I}ruid | I blame little-league baseball coaches. | 21:44 |
| DrTread | kanzure, you're responsible for my returning to IRC for the first time in 12 years. thx. | 21:45 |
| kanzure | DrTread: sorry :( | 21:45 |
| kanzure | DrTread: but we're sufficiently worthwhile I think | 21:45 |
| kanzure | unless you need me to throw harder problems at you? | 21:45 |
| DrTread | yes, you are, and i'll eventually recover my self-esteem. | 21:45 |
| DrTread | ;) | 21:45 |
| kanzure | nope, all of the self-esteem is for me me me | 21:45 |
| ybit | I}ruid: if it's baseball coacheswh to blame, i ask: where's the "potb"? (pat on the butt) | 21:46 |
| * fenn mumbles something about self-esteem punks | 21:46 | |
| kanzure | ? | 21:46 |
| DrTread | it's my dinner time... bbl | 21:46 |
| kanzure | hm. me too. | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | I still think you should all move to SILC | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | it's far superior to IRC> | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | s/>/./ | 21:47 |
| kanzure | you fail at regular expressions | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | hahah yea, I do. | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | s/\>/\./ | 21:47 |
| I}ruid | which is funny, since that's all I did for nearly 2 years at TippingPoint | 21:48 |
| I}ruid | well, when I wasn't doing VoIP security research... that was the busywork. | 21:48 |
| fenn | the first one was fine? | 21:48 |
| I}ruid | . is a special character, should be escaped | 21:49 |
| fenn | not in sed | 21:49 |
| fenn | at least not in the second half of substitution | 21:49 |
| I}ruid | ahh true | 21:49 |
| I}ruid | time to make something to eat, bbl | 21:51 |
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| * kanzure goes back to modeling an algae growth biofuel thingy | 21:57 | |
| I}ruid | I saw a biofuel article today | 22:00 |
| I}ruid | was pairing modified yeast with something, one sec | 22:00 |
| DrTread | back. | 22:00 |
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| I}ruid | http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16989-yeast-and-bacterium-turned-into-gasoline-factory.html | 22:01 |
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| DrTread | beware of anything that says "cheaper than oil" | 22:10 |
| DrTread | oil is pretty darned cheap (right now, anyway) | 22:11 |
| kanzure | yep, saw it | 22:12 |
| fenn | vegetable oil is cheaper than gasoline | 22:25 |
| fenn | at least when you buy soybean oil at the asian market in 5 gallon jugs | 22:25 |
| fenn | also the street price of gasoline in USA is way lower than it ought to be due to subsidies | 22:27 |
| fenn | look at prices in any other country for more realistic cost | 22:27 |
| DrTread | subsidies, or lack of taxes = lack of internalization of external costs | 22:28 |
| DrTread | if you want subsidies, buy vegetable oil. | 22:29 |
| DrTread | any decisions on the heater material choice? gallium, aluminum, glycerol, etc? | 22:31 |
| fenn | heater? the PCR block? | 22:35 |
| fenn | kanzure: could you snag me some microcentrifuge tubes some time? like 30 of each size (should be two sizes, small and regular) | 22:37 |
| fenn | 4mm and 8mm diameter i think | 22:37 |
| kanzure- | okay. | 22:37 |
| kanzure- | does anyone have some suggestions for interesting things to look at under an AFM scope? | 22:37 |
| DrTread | i have a thousand ideas for an AFM | 22:38 |
| fenn | graphene, liquid zeolite, umm.. yeah just about anything | 22:38 |
| DrTread | in situ tribology | 22:39 |
| kanzure- | I've been looking for some good papers of interesting images | 22:39 |
| kanzure- | but it's not like anybody publishes anything interesting | 22:39 |
| DrTread | pffft | 22:39 |
| kanzure- | because it costs to print even black and white photos | 22:39 |
| DrTread | define interesting | 22:39 |
| kanzure- | not a grid of atoms | 22:39 |
| fenn | i bet a lot of biological materials would be very interesting | 22:41 |
| DrTread | electrically conductivity of DNA strands | 22:41 |
| DrTread | wait... that would require STM | 22:42 |
| kanzure- | well, not necessarily | 22:42 |
| kanzure- | I have a bibliography of papers of AFM DNA sequencing | 22:42 |
| kanzure- | want? | 22:42 |
| kanzure- | or a photo gallery of bacteria would be nice. | 22:44 |
| kanzure- | I was trying to search for bacteriophage morphological diversity the other day | 22:44 |
| kanzure- | but there's only like five shapes that viruses follow | 22:44 |
| fenn | you can do afm over larger areas than usual right? so you could use it in place of a regular light microscope for some things | 22:44 |
| kanzure- | even though there's something like 1E30 viruses on the planet. shouldn't there be more shapes than just a bunch of spheres and rods? damn. | 22:45 |
| fenn | self assembly lends itself to simple shapes | 22:45 |
| kanzure- | tell that to Paul Rothemund. | 22:45 |
| kanzure- | because he's been breaking that particular law. | 22:45 |
| fenn | well, there's no particular reason for evolution to favor more complex shapes | 22:45 |
| fenn | they have to do basically one thing: protect the DNA | 22:46 |
| kanzure- | true, but when using search terms regarding novelty, morphotypes, diversity, etc. etc., something should pop up | 22:46 |
| kanzure- | even just an oddball that somebody found somewhere | 22:46 |
| fenn | i doubt there have even been a large number of viruses and phages studies | 22:46 |
| fenn | studied* | 22:46 |
| kanzure- | thought virology was a huge field? | 22:46 |
| fenn | they only study the interesting ones | 22:47 |
| fenn | i forget the numbers but there's like a gazillion viruses per ml of antarctic sea water | 22:48 |
| fenn | where they come from, nobody knows | 22:48 |
| DrTread | a gazzilion is like a lot, right? | 22:48 |
| fenn | it's less than a quintrillion | 22:48 |
| fenn | but more than a jillion | 22:48 |
| kanzure- | I saw that paper, actually | 22:49 |
| kanzure- | wikipedia references it | 22:49 |
| fenn | on the panspermia page? | 22:49 |
| kanzure- | no | 22:49 |
| kanzure- | the paper on viruses per volume of sea water | 22:49 |
| ybit | what is superkuh's blog url? | 22:50 |
| fenn | there should be a requirement to include scientific mysteries in educational curricula | 22:50 |
| kanzure- | ybit: http://superkuh.ath.cx/ | 22:50 |
| fenn | right now it's like nobody even knows what the big problems are in science | 22:50 |
| fenn | unless you are a specialist in the field | 22:51 |
| kanzure- | that's because everybody has been bullshitted by strings and multiple dimensions | 22:51 |
| fenn | those are just explanations | 22:52 |
| DrTread | in texas, the important mystery is how creation happened so fast, and why there are fossils. | 22:52 |
| kanzure- | well, they are obsessed with it. | 22:52 |
| fenn | given any set of observations, there are a number of ways to explain it | 22:53 |
| DrTread | and why Forrest Mimms III is such an avid creationist. | 22:53 |
| fenn | eh, i forget where i was going with this | 22:53 |
| fenn | DrTread: you'd never know from looking at his webpage | 22:53 |
| DrTread | he doesn't advertise | 22:53 |
| fenn | then he isn't 'avid' | 22:54 |
| DrTread | and he's not a "young earther" | 22:54 |
| DrTread | touche | 22:54 |
| fenn | ah well, if he's not a 'young earther' then it's just semantics | 22:54 |
| fenn | 'did god create the universe? or was it a mysterious point source of near-infinite energy?' | 22:54 |
| fenn | personally i don't care, since it doesn't influence the results | 22:55 |
| kanzure- | gasp, you're ranting just to rant? | 22:55 |
| DrTread | The wingnut echo chamber has recently gone insane over the idea that Eric Pianka, an distinguished and much-loved ecologist at UT, advocates mass genocide by ebola in order to bring down world population. The allegation was leveled by disgruntled creationist Forrest Mims, and rapidly spread to the blogosphere via places like Dembski’s blog (three posts!) and Telic Thoughts, and then went to... | 22:55 |
| DrTread | ...the Drudge Report and caused a national media firestorm appearing in my local paper by Monday morning. I smelled a rat from the beginning, and now I have been proved right. KXAN News36 in Austin, TX, has just debunked the whole thing, and for good measure has posted a 20-minute unedited interview with Pianka which everyone must watch to realize the full depravity of what the wingnuts have... | 22:55 |
| kanzure- | isn't that violating some sort of law | 22:55 |
| DrTread | ...done here. Pianka says several times that Mims is a “crazy kook” that “distorted and changed everything I said.” The death threats that have flooded Pianka and the Texas Academy of Sciences are also a nice touch. | 22:55 |
| DrTread | nope. doesn't influence the results. | 22:55 |
| fenn | 'disgrunted creationist' is just poor reporting | 22:56 |
| fenn | given all the possible descriptions of forrest mims | 22:56 |
| DrTread | yep. | 22:56 |
| DrTread | sorry i brought it up. :( | 22:56 |
| fenn | well i have yet to see any first-hand info on his supposed creationist stance | 22:56 |
| DrTread | fwiw, i still LIKE Mr. Mimms, and he does good science. | 22:57 |
| kanzure- | hm | 22:57 |
| kanzure- | "Self-repair Of Bacterial Cell Wall Against Multiple Puncturings By An AFM Tip" | 22:57 |
| kanzure- | "We report, for the first time, that bacteria survive multiple stabbings by an atomic force microscopy (AFM) tip under physiological conditions" | 22:58 |
| kanzure- | "This experiment, which generated a characteristic puncture curve, was repeated more than 50 times at different locations on the same bacterium." | 22:58 |
| kanzure- | hahah | 22:58 |
| kanzure- | god I love science | 22:58 |
| kanzure- | "MatLab® code was written to analyze the puncture curves, which carry an abundance of information on such characteristics of the bacterium as the surface elasticity, the critical pressure needed to puncture the bacterial cell wall, the interaction of the AFM tip with the interior of the bacterium and the precise width of the bacterium in the physiological environment." | 22:59 |
| DrTread | yes. pitty you can't puncture monkeys like they used to. :( | 22:59 |
| DrTread | bacteria don't have a fan club yet. | 22:59 |
| fenn | i'm a big fan of bacteria | 22:59 |
| fenn | thing is, a monkey isnt much different from a human | 22:59 |
| fenn | so it makes sense to feel sorry for a monkey being stabbed | 23:00 |
| kanzure- | uh? | 23:00 |
| kanzure- | are we trying to rationalize? | 23:00 |
| fenn | rationalize what? | 23:00 |
| kanzure- | feeling sorry for certain things rather than other things? | 23:00 |
| fenn | yes | 23:00 |
| kanzure- | what, wouldn't you uplift all of the bacteria if you could? | 23:00 |
| fenn | there's a logic to it | 23:00 |
| DrTread | yes, yes we are. we are only a few decades post-Tuskegee experiment. | 23:01 |
| fenn | bacteria are already so far above us it would be poor form to try to improve them | 23:01 |
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| fenn | i don't mean individual cells, i mean the network | 23:03 |
| kanzure- | "regardless of tip geometry and puncturing density varying between 20 and 40 puncturing events per square micrometer. " | 23:04 |
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| DrTread | oh snap! kitty on keyboard | 23:05 |
| DrTread | lost thread. | 23:05 |
| kanzure- | DrTread: we're puncturing bacteria with AFM tips with 20 to 40 puncturing events per square micrometer | 23:05 |
| DrTread | ok. | 23:05 |
| kanzure- | heh | 23:06 |
| DrTread | shall we make our own AFM? | 23:06 |
| DrTread | i've always wanted to. | 23:06 |
| kanzure- | yes. | 23:06 |
| kanzure- | I was surprised the other day with how simple they are | 23:06 |
| DrTread | indeed. | 23:06 |
| kanzure- | fenn suggested using capacitance to detect the bend/deflection in the cantilever tip instead of a laser+photodiode method | 23:06 |
| kanzure- | and I have an old collection of papers on diy-ways to make sharp cantilever probe tip thingies | 23:07 |
| kanzure- | and then the $100 STM guy's "cut a piezo tweet into four sections and wire them up separately" method (just using a pocket knife + solder + wires) | 23:07 |
| kanzure- | and "z-xis approach mechanism consisting entirely of a screw" method. | 23:08 |
| fenn | capacitance makes sense for a lot of reasons: it's cheap, easy to build, doesn't require any added weight to the cantilever, and gives you an analog value (instead of digital like a photodiode strip would) | 23:08 |
| DrTread | ok. | 23:08 |
| kanzure- | the problem is that I'm rusty with my electronics. | 23:08 |
| fenn | you never learned electronics | 23:08 |
| DrTread | but capacitance requires AC to measure, doesn't it? | 23:08 |
| kanzure- | not true | 23:08 |
| DrTread | Pffft | 23:08 |
| kanzure- | well, I took classes, but I didn't learn much from them | 23:09 |
| DrTread | read Forrest Mimms' books. :) | 23:09 |
| DrTread | they're great! | 23:09 |
| fenn | DrTread: you set up a resonant circuit, (LCR circuit) | 23:09 |
| kanzure- | I used to be an electronics kid, but.. | 23:09 |
| * kanzure- still hasn't got through "The Art of Electronics" entirely | 23:09 | |
| fenn | then measure the frequency somehow | 23:09 |
| fenn | the 'somehow' is where there are a lot of options | 23:09 |
| DrTread | right. so you have to pick a frequency that will make the tip resonate at a useful frequency | 23:09 |
| fenn | no | 23:09 |
| fenn | it doesn't move the tip | 23:09 |
| DrTread | or not at all? | 23:10 |
| fenn | electrical resonance not mechanical | 23:10 |
| -!- PeerInfinity [n=someone@216.36.180.162] has quit [] | 23:10 | |
| kanzure- | the tip is stationary | 23:10 |
| kanzure- | the sample is attached to a piezo | 23:10 |
| DrTread | and just how does a capacitor plate (the tip) not experience a mechanical force from the electrostatic charge? | 23:10 |
| kanzure- | the piezo moves the sample. | 23:10 |
| DrTread | yes, that's correct, but so does every other force field. | 23:11 |
| fenn | DrTread: it's a tiny amount charge | 23:11 |
| DrTread | and a tiny tip :) | 23:11 |
| DrTread | most AFMs are run in an oscillatory mode, anyway | 23:11 |
| DrTread | unless you are measuring a very hard surface (array of atoms = boring) | 23:11 |
| DrTread | the z-axis moves in and out of contact with the surface | 23:12 |
| kanzure- | AFM bacteria puncturing diagram: http://heybryan.org/books/papers/puncturing_bacteria_AFM_probe.gif | 23:12 |
| DrTread | as the x- and y- are scanned | 23:12 |
| kanzure- | RAPE | 23:12 |
| fenn | i thought they used PID to keep the 'altitude' constant | 23:12 |
| fenn | so PID would keep it from oscillating | 23:12 |
| DrTread | there are a number of ways of doing it, but constant altitude is difficult for soft objects | 23:13 |
| DrTread | bacteria squish | 23:13 |
| DrTread | I love the picture... there are visible molecules in the membrane, but the AFM tip is a perfectly smooth elipsoid | 23:14 |
| kanzure- | hah | 23:14 |
| DrTread | some time back, i bought a bag of 100 bare piezo discs from Goldmine for just this purpose. | 23:15 |
| DrTread | now where did i put them... | 23:15 |
| fenn | in a ziploc bag | 23:15 |
| DrTread | good. good. now, where's that bag? | 23:16 |
| fenn | i sense that .. the bag may be.. located in ... a cardboard box | 23:16 |
| kanzure- | your jedi powers are weak, old man | 23:16 |
| DrTread | ooooh, you're on to something! | 23:16 |
| kanzure- | heh. | 23:16 |
| kanzure- | DrTread: you don't have an inventory system? | 23:16 |
| DrTread | now all i have to do is look in every cardboard box | 23:16 |
| kanzure- | inventory. system. | 23:16 |
| DrTread | HAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH | 23:17 |
| DrTread | ha | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | :( | 23:17 |
| DrTread | ha | 23:17 |
| fenn | we can help | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | that's kinda what we're here for | 23:17 |
| DrTread | :D | 23:17 |
| DrTread | cool! | 23:17 |
| fenn | but first you need to realize that there's a problem | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | hah | 23:17 |
| DrTread | come on over! take my stuff!!! | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | really? | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | may I? | 23:17 |
| DrTread | i need to get rid of lots of it! | 23:17 |
| DrTread | yes | 23:17 |
| DrTread | please | 23:17 |
| fenn | ^-^ | 23:17 |
| kanzure- | I can have a guy at your door in 15 minutes. | 23:18 |
| DrTread | you're on :) | 23:18 |
| kanzure- | ppst, fenn.. | 23:18 |
| kanzure- | heh' | 23:18 |
| fenn | am i "the guy"? | 23:18 |
| kanzure- | pretty much. | 23:18 |
| fenn | well, all right i guess | 23:19 |
| DrTread | squeee | 23:19 |
| fenn | what i really meant was making an inventory system for him | 23:19 |
| DrTread | oh. | 23:19 |
| kanzure- | right right | 23:19 |
| DrTread | my garage, library, dining room & one bedroom are jammed with stuff. most of it was acquired with intentions of hacking | 23:20 |
| fenn | not consumer junk i hope | 23:20 |
| kanzure- | hm. you haven't met david yet have you, fenn? | 23:20 |
| DrTread | oh, no! University of Michigan property disposition junk! | 23:20 |
| fenn | no | 23:20 |
| fenn | kanzure-: some people *cough ahem hrm* save stuff like vacuum cleaners or inkjet printers with the intent of making something useful out of them | 23:22 |
| kanzure- | right. | 23:22 |
| DrTread | have those, too. :( | 23:23 |
| kanzure- | I'm still confused about how to get everything organized here in austin | 23:23 |
| kanzure- | hell, jonathan cline still hasn't even met with you yet. | 23:24 |
| kanzure- | and then I get into thinking about combinatorial meetups and such | 23:24 |
| kanzure- | and it's just hard to get everything happening | 23:24 |
| fenn | that's what this fab lab is suposed to be for right? | 23:24 |
| kanzure- | but then I don't want to bother with a new mailing list either really | 23:24 |
| kanzure- | hrm | 23:24 |
| kanzure- | but then it's just yet another new mailing list or something obscure | 23:24 |
| fenn | no, it's not a mailing list at all | 23:24 |
| DrTread | if it's a real fab lab, then it won't be obscure. | 23:25 |
| fenn | it's a physical space | 23:25 |
| kanzure- | i'm talking about a way to organize things | 23:25 |
| DrTread | just create a Twitter hashtag | 23:25 |
| DrTread | problem solved. | 23:25 |
| kanzure- | urhm. | 23:25 |
| fenn | ugh please not twitter | 23:25 |
| kanzure- | no. | 23:25 |
| DrTread | why not? it's good enough for Oprah | 23:25 |
| fenn | i'd learn how to use RSS if there was sufficient motive | 23:25 |
| kanzure- | I don't know if RSS is sufficient- don't we want more than announce capabilities? | 23:26 |
| kanzure- | maybe I just need to be better at keeping up with the austin peoples | 23:26 |
| kanzure- | going through the whole fablab spiell over and over again can get, painful | 23:26 |
| kanzure- | because I have to remember where each person is coming from | 23:26 |
| kanzure- | for instance, cline was actually somewhat clueless | 23:27 |
| kanzure- | since he's coming from a very "purely" diybio/synbio perspective | 23:27 |
| kanzure- | even though he more or less fits the bill.. | 23:27 |
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| kanzure- | and the austin geek website thingy hasn't been very helpful in organizing things either | 23:28 |
| kanzure- | jon lebkowsky must not be moving quickly enough, or something | 23:28 |
| kanzure- | or too focused on 'social media' crap | 23:28 |
| DrTread | i need to step away from the computer for a bit. i'll keep it open... | 23:31 |
| kanzure- | there is no away. only the silicon way. | 23:38 |
| kanzure- | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Electron_microscope_images | 23:39 |
| fenn | add "pressure cell" to your algae lysis method list | 23:53 |
| DrTread | back, but for how long? | 23:54 |
| fenn | you pump water at high pressure through a tiny hole, and the pressure change as they exit the hole causes cells to explode | 23:54 |
| DrTread | fenn, that's my favorite method. | 23:54 |
| fenn | it's so elegant :P | 23:54 |
| DrTread | yes, in a medieval torture chamber sort of elegance way | 23:54 |
| kanzure- | fenn: but I was the one who told you about that method | 23:55 |
| kanzure- | in the literature it's called fluid shear force lysis or something | 23:55 |
| kanzure- | (minus "lysis" in the name of the method) | 23:55 |
| kanzure- | we (by that I mean, not me) are also building an osmotic pressure chamber too. | 23:56 |
| DrTread | pouring salt on wounds? | 23:56 |
| kanzure- | (not the same thing though) | 23:56 |
| kanzure- | what? | 23:56 |
| DrTread | osmotic pressure | 23:56 |
| fenn | it's usually fresh water, if you want them to lyse | 23:57 |
| DrTread | true. | 23:57 |
| fenn | not that i know why they would call it a chamber | 23:57 |
| DrTread | you want them to blow up, not shrivel | 23:57 |
| fenn | the electromagnetic method is interesting | 23:58 |
| fenn | reminds me of doctor hulda clark quackery | 23:58 |
| DrTread | sorry kids, but this old man needs to go to bed now. he turns into a pumpkin in 45 seconds | 23:58 |
| kanzure- | fenn, did you not see the powerpoint presentation? | 23:58 |
| fenn | tell the fairy i miss her | 23:58 |
| kanzure- | presentation: http://heybryan.org/bioreactor/2008-10-21%20Algal%20biomass%20extraction%20presentation.ppt | 23:58 |
| DrTread | will do. **poof** | 23:59 |
| fenn | kanzure-: could you pdf-ify that? | 23:59 |
| * kanzure- grumbles something about having to move chairs because he doesn't remember how to force soffice to do that remotely | 23:59 | |
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