| --- Day changed Sat Aug 08 2009 | ||
| nchaimov | dfdfdf | 00:34 |
|---|---|---|
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| kanzure | fenn: http://heybryan.org/~bbishop/docs/pong.txt | 00:39 |
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| kanzure | added some papers: http://heybryan.org/books/Biology/neuro/ | 00:48 |
| kanzure | hrm things seem to be all messed up .. | 00:51 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/books/Biology/neuro/neuro/ | 00:51 |
| kanzure | guess I'll fix that eventually | 00:51 |
| genehacker | MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA | 01:01 |
| genehacker | microfluidics is awesome | 01:01 |
| genehacker | you can put a whole bunch of reactors on the same chip | 01:03 |
| genehacker | page 207 of that book contains something that could be used for a dna synth | 01:05 |
| genehacker | valveless valving for taking samples from different reactors so the composition can be analyzed | 01:13 |
| genehacker | kanzure are you present at the moment? | 01:18 |
| genehacker | nvm | 01:20 |
| genehacker | probably won't work for DNA synthesis | 02:46 |
| genehacker | re needs to be higher for those things to work | 02:46 |
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| kanzure | what? http://www.google.com/search?q=%22Full+text+access+provided+to+Googlebot+Access+by+Web+Services.%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.debian:en-US:unofficial&client=iceweasel-a | 08:41 |
| kanzure | "Full text access provided to Googlebot Access by Web Services" | 08:42 |
| kanzure | heh | 09:04 |
| kanzure | "Finite-elements model of the developing cerebral hemisphere" | 09:04 |
| kanzure | (from a model for the development of cortical convolutions) | 09:05 |
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| kanzure | heh tensegrity models of gyrification and cortical folding due to mechanical tension | 09:11 |
| kanzure | "The increased predictability observed under surface-based registration suggests that the location of V1 is more accurately predicted by the cortical folds than by the shape of the brain embedded in the volume of the skull." | 09:30 |
| kanzure | (from Accurate prediction of V1 location from cortical folds in a surface coordinate system | 09:30 |
| kanzure | so is the inferior precentral sulcrus (IFJ) the same thing as the prefrontal orbitolateral regions? | 09:34 |
| kanzure | er I guess I meant to say "dorsolateral prefrontal cortex" | 09:38 |
| kanzure | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychological_refractory_period | 09:48 |
| kanzure | http://brainmap.org/scribe/index.html "Scribe is the BrainMap application that is used to extract coordinates and meta-data from a published functional neuroimaging study and enter it in our database." | 09:52 |
| kanzure | hm. sleuth might be useful (maybe) | 09:53 |
| kanzure | takes a while to download search results | 10:00 |
| * ybit wants to see an example of scribe | 10:00 | |
| ybit | 01:03 < genehacker> page 207 of that book contains something that could be used for a dna synth | 10:01 |
| ybit | what book was genehacker referring to? | 10:01 |
| ybit | it was some microfluidics books he mentioned allowing others to torrent?... | 10:08 |
| ybit | http://filebin.ca/ayxuh | 10:08 |
| ybit | i think | 10:08 |
| ybit | wtf kind of file is that | 10:09 |
| ybit | http://filebin.ca/ordqrh is the first part i believe | 10:09 |
| ybit | zip | 10:09 |
| ybit | -_- .zip would be nice | 10:09 |
| ybit | oh | 10:11 |
| * ybit is jealous some people can scan two pages at once | 10:12 | |
| ybit | 11:48 < fenn> like CRC handbook, but for manufacturing | 10:13 |
| ybit | Chemical Rubber Company handbook of chemistry and physics | 10:13 |
| ybit | that's the only book which comes up | 10:13 |
| ybit | is that what you were referencing? | 10:14 |
| drazak | lol | 10:16 |
| ybit | Pussy Beer: "Pussy Beer is an alcoholic beverage created from using Candida yeast from a vaginal yeast infection to create fermentation in a custom mash consisting of vaginal lubrication, menses, and rice. " | 10:17 |
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| ybit | http://wiki.xkcd.com/irc/Pussy_Beer | 10:17 |
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| drazak | lol | 10:18 |
| ybit | someone's rofling about crc book and i don't know why | 10:20 |
| drazak | it's fucking impossible to find shit in the crc handbook of physics and chemistry | 10:22 |
| drazak | motherfucking impossible | 10:22 |
| ybit | :) | 10:22 |
| drazak | you need to take a class on using it | 10:22 |
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| ybit | df -h | 11:50 |
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| kanzure | ybit: yes, CRC is a classic | 11:52 |
| kanzure | there are various copies of it floating around the web | 11:54 |
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| * kanzure really wants to find a gene silencing + beta-catenin + cerebral cortex paper. | 12:18 | |
| kanzure | "A recent study suggests that the regulation of cortical size might involve phospholipids, by showing that their addition to cultured embryonic mouse cortices increases cortical size and induces folds resembling gyri." | 12:18 |
| kanzure | huh ncravens hangs out in #openkollab | 12:32 |
| genehacker | ??? | 13:07 |
| genehacker | wow | 13:07 |
| genehacker | the potential between the cell wall and surroundings can get to 130 volts | 13:07 |
| genehacker | cytoplasm an surroundings | 13:08 |
| fenn | no way | 13:08 |
| kanzure | maybe you mean mV | 13:10 |
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| kanzure | hey tropology | 13:13 |
| kanzure | fenn: http://88proof.com/synthetic_biology/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/protolexer1.png | 13:13 |
| tropology | hi | 13:13 |
| kanzure | what's up? | 13:13 |
| tropology | was in #openkollab, thought I'd explore | 13:14 |
| -!- kanzure changed the topic of #hplusroadmap to: skdb - "apt-get but for hardware" http://adl.serveftp.org/skdb/ http://adl.serveftp.org/skdb.git/ | 13:14 | |
| kanzure | tropology: yeah I was surprised that nathan was on irc | 13:14 |
| kanzure | he doesn't seem to understand what skdb is | 13:14 |
| kanzure | and I don't seem to understand why he needs to make "openkollab" | 13:15 |
| tropology | cool stuff | 13:15 |
| tropology | any work there with wifi, etc? | 13:15 |
| tropology | a few years back was trying to get community wireless more active in openhardware concept | 13:15 |
| tropology | why dont you think it would be nec. or useful? | 13:18 |
| kanzure | what's wrong with openmanufacturing? | 13:19 |
| kanzure | why not just use that | 13:19 |
| tropology | I need to get up to speed on what is/was happening there .. | 13:20 |
| tropology | lots of folk startring from very different places but after something similar | 13:20 |
| kanzure | well if you want it condensed, the first four links on this page are probably helpful: | 13:20 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/om.html | 13:20 |
| tropology | thanks, gave quick glance will read more soon .. and will joni th e google grop | 13:21 |
| tropology | I've been coming at this from several contexts myself .. arrived at a number of the same or related realizations .. | 13:22 |
| tropology | my contexts included community organizing, local npo/community oorganizations , coalitions of same, community networking, community tech, and community wireless amomg other things | 13:22 |
| tropology | everything just began bleeding together | 13:23 |
| tropology | wow, still on the first of 4 == great stuff | 13:24 |
| tropology | thanks for the orientation | 13:27 |
| kanzure | no problem | 13:27 |
| kanzure | but most of the work was Eric Hunting | 13:28 |
| * tropology begins memory game with daughter | 13:30 | |
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| tropology | :) | 13:44 |
| kanzure | hey tav | 13:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: will you fix the isinstance()/complement error? | 13:50 |
| kanzure | er nevermind | 13:50 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r 9c2f747a39ec / (core/interface.py pymates/pymates.py): fix complement compatibility check in core/interfaces.py | 13:52 |
| kanzure | should mate_parts() fuse objects together? | 13:55 |
| kanzure | or should it return all objects, or what? it currently modifies the shapes of the inputs | 13:55 |
| kanzure | but this was apparently not expected functionality? or something? | 13:55 |
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| genehacker | nope fenn | 14:01 |
| genehacker | volts | 14:01 |
| genehacker | or whatever a nernst potential is | 14:02 |
| fenn | mate_parts should return the transformation, and then something else should display the transformation applied to that part | 14:15 |
| fenn | re: interface complement; isinstance(other, self.complement) really makes more sense because it encompasses subclassed interfaces | 14:19 |
| fenn | even though lego is broken atm | 14:19 |
| kanzure | a nernst potential is in mV | 14:20 |
| fenn | that's what i figured | 14:21 |
| kanzure | fenn: can you add some more legos with step files to data.yaml for motivational purposes? | 14:27 |
| fenn | hold yer horses | 14:28 |
| kanzure | why isn't cp -p the default? | 14:44 |
| kanzure | or scp -p? | 14:44 |
| fenn | because you haven't added to .bashrc | 14:45 |
| fenn | </snark> | 14:45 |
| genehacker | ok | 14:46 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 4787abd600e1 /packages/lego/ (grammar.yaml interfaces.py): finish translating grammar to dict format | 14:48 |
| fenn | er, the code to use that doesnt exist yet | 14:48 |
| kanzure | er why are the URLs at the top not in a urls: attribute list? :p | 14:49 |
| kanzure | also, line 15 you have a stray apostrophe | 14:49 |
| kanzure | which messes up my vim highlighting- not sure if yaml will complain | 14:49 |
| kanzure | huh yaml doesn't complain | 14:49 |
| kanzure | the vim yaml syntax highlighter might suck | 14:49 |
| kanzure | ah there was a bug report for it | 14:50 |
| kanzure | didn't fix it | 14:52 |
| * kanzure blames Clark Evans | 14:53 | |
| kanzure | git://github.com/trans/yaml_vim.git | 14:55 |
| fenn | do you really want metadata in every file? | 14:58 |
| fenn | those are just notes for my reference later | 14:59 |
| fenn | lugnet has nothing to do with the grammar besides hosting pretty pictures of the examples (method which i'll be writing shortly) | 14:59 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r 357220943669 /packages/bearing/metadata.yaml: bearing/metadata.yaml changed to match metadata for the threads package | 15:12 |
| kanzure | genehacker: did you post in /r9k once about me? | 15:38 |
| drazak | wtf is r9k? | 15:48 |
| genehacker | did I? | 15:53 |
| genehacker | why? | 15:53 |
| genehacker | no | 15:53 |
| genehacker | what happened? | 15:54 |
| kanzure | drazak: on 4chan | 15:54 |
| kanzure | oh well. someone sent an email to openmanufacturing and said that he found out about me on /r9k because someone posted a link to my homepage | 15:55 |
| genehacker | and? | 15:55 |
| genehacker | does he want to join us? | 15:56 |
| genehacker | or do we have a troll problem? | 15:56 |
| kanzure | no it's fine | 15:57 |
| kanzure | I replied to him: http://groups.google.com/group/openmanufacturing/msg/7ee9a44355752417 | 15:58 |
| genehacker | oh the tech tree person | 15:59 |
| genehacker | I think that was me | 15:59 |
| genehacker | they might be useful to us | 15:59 |
| kanzure | who is they? | 15:59 |
| genehacker | no the tech tree guy | 16:00 |
| fenn | post_init_hook never gets called; how have packages been getting their path? | 16:19 |
| fenn | since package.unix_name never gets set | 16:19 |
| fenn | (fwiw i think unix_name is a stupid idea; the package name should always be unix compatible) | 16:20 |
| kanzure | ybit: the system I have in mind lets you view a web page only once, construct a scraper in it via the the GUI of your usual web browsing experience, extract data into yaml, then consequently do some cron-scheduled task on the data that is burped back, do some stuff on /dev etc. | 16:20 |
| kanzure | erl | 16:20 |
| kanzure | hm | 16:20 |
| kanzure | fenn: skdb.py Package.path() | 16:21 |
| fenn | i remember gene posting about skdb in some sort of 'time traveler from the future chats with 4chan for the lulz' thread | 16:21 |
| kanzure | it checks if there is a unix name and if not, sets it as the name for the moment | 16:21 |
| kanzure | however I agree that all names should be unix compatible | 16:21 |
| kanzure | so I'm fine with you doing away with that | 16:21 |
| kanzure | and replacing it with just the regular name | 16:21 |
| fenn | right now it just checks assert hasattr(self, "unix_name") | 16:21 |
| kanzure | well you can delete that then :) | 16:21 |
| fenn | anyway.. fixing | 16:21 |
| fenn | bah isalpha doesn't even do what you say | 16:24 |
| kanzure | proof? | 16:25 |
| fenn | 'fo_o'.isalpha() | 16:25 |
| fenn | False | 16:25 |
| kanzure | wasn't I using isalnum() ? | 16:27 |
| kanzure | huh that doesn't work to | 16:27 |
| kanzure | *too | 16:27 |
| fenn | ^[a-zA-Z0-9_]*$ | 16:29 |
| fenn | something like that | 16:29 |
| kanzure | how about dashes? | 16:29 |
| kanzure | and periods? | 16:30 |
| fenn | keep em comin | 16:30 |
| kanzure | + | 16:31 |
| kanzure | and possibly \ but that's questionable | 16:31 |
| fenn | no | 16:31 |
| fenn | why +? | 16:31 |
| kanzure | wouldn't want it anyway | 16:31 |
| kanzure | I was thinking of my recent sudo apt-get install libgtk+ call | 16:32 |
| fenn | superpackage++ | 16:32 |
| fenn | i think it's lame | 16:32 |
| kanzure | I don't think anyone will miss it | 16:32 |
| fenn | packaging nazis ftw | 16:32 |
| kanzure | "rawr you may *NOT* have those symbols in your package name!" | 16:32 |
| fenn | somebody's gotta do it | 16:33 |
| genehacker | shoot | 16:37 |
| genehacker | I accidently sewed through tubing | 16:38 |
| drazak | do you guys want to make me some primers? | 16:39 |
| kanzure | what happened to your script? | 16:41 |
| drazak | well, I only need one primer, atm, and my script is still in the works, but i wanted to see if someone else could make me this primer because i'm not sure how to find a UTR of a gene | 16:41 |
| drazak | if i know have to find the untranslated region i'd do it | 16:42 |
| drazak | :P | 16:42 |
| kanzure | and it's not on genebank? | 16:42 |
| drazak | i need a primer for 100-150 basepairs of one of the UTR of smooth muscle actin alpha | 16:43 |
| kanzure | what's a UTR exactly? | 16:44 |
| kanzure | don't give me bio crap, just say what you want | 16:44 |
| drazak | it's the untranslated reigon | 16:45 |
| kanzure | there's no reason for dna to be translated | 16:45 |
| drazak | it's part of a gene that's turned into mRNA but not into a polypeptide | 16:45 |
| kanzure | isn't there some codon that says whether or not that should happen? | 16:46 |
| drazak | AUG is the start codon of a translated sequence | 16:47 |
| kanzure | and the stop codon? | 16:47 |
| * kanzure tries to remember | 16:48 | |
| -!- ecd [n=ecd@adsl-226-143-118.int.bellsouth.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 16:48 | |
| drazak | AAUAAA | 16:48 |
| kanzure | hey ecd | 16:48 |
| ecd | hi! | 16:48 |
| fenn | what about packages of all digits (no letters) | 16:48 |
| kanzure | nice to see you show up | 16:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: up to you. I see no reason to allow it. | 16:48 |
| ecd | nice to be greeted immediately :) | 16:48 |
| fenn | well, it'd be easier to allow it | 16:48 |
| kanzure | ecd: we're wired in to the channel or something | 16:48 |
| kanzure | fenn: maybe we can just "strongly discourage it" | 16:48 |
| kanzure | or "strongly make fun of the practice" | 16:49 |
| fenn | hm | 16:49 |
| fenn | can we hire a professional heckler? | 16:49 |
| drazak | lol | 16:49 |
| ecd | ("Fantastic, I will eat your brain" - I have a friend who said something like that, who also seems "wired into the channel") | 16:49 |
| kanzure | you mean a mother? | 16:49 |
| drazak | kanzure said that, ecd | 16:50 |
| kanzure | ecd: brains don't taste as good as you might think | 16:50 |
| ecd | aye draz | 16:50 |
| ecd | thanks for the tip, kanzure! | 16:50 |
| kanzure | speaking of which, ecd, this was a recent find: http://adl.serveftp.org/papers/Regulation%20of%20cerebral%20cortical%20size%20by%20control%20of%20cell%20cycle%20exit%20in%20neural%20precursors.pdf.png | 16:50 |
| kanzure | the brain on the right is a transgenic brain | 16:51 |
| ecd | I had just looked at that in the "papers archive" | 16:51 |
| ecd | how are you spying on me? | 16:51 |
| ecd | real-time log monitoring? | 16:51 |
| kanzure | yes, bot it's usually just bots | 16:52 |
| ecd | so who has volunteered for brain enlargement treatment? | 16:53 |
| kanzure | most of us | 16:53 |
| kanzure | actually brain size isn't necessarily the real trick | 16:53 |
| ecd | pardon my sluggishness, i'm relatively new to all this. what IS the real trick? quantity and fidelity of connections? | 16:54 |
| kanzure | the real trick is not assuming you know the real trick :p | 16:55 |
| ecd | far be it from me! | 16:56 |
| kanzure | more tools would be helpful | 16:56 |
| ecd | for investigating brains? or are you talking about collaboration stuff? | 16:56 |
| kanzure | brains | 16:56 |
| ecd | are you talking new tools/techniques, or actually having some of your own? | 16:57 |
| kanzure | what is the difference? | 16:57 |
| ecd | (tools, taht is) | 16:57 |
| kanzure | as a sysadmin of my brain, I really have only these big bulky hands with which to do work with- so I need to acquire more tools and maybe build more. | 16:57 |
| ecd | what do you have in mind? | 16:58 |
| genehacker | direct interface to a computer for more control perhaps? | 16:58 |
| ecd | Any progress anywhere in that regard? | 16:58 |
| kanzure | in vivo dna synthesizer on a chip and virus bioreactor on a chip, implantable microelectrode arrays, sandboxing of neural stem cell cultures, "weather monitoring" such as by MRI reporter genes, | 16:59 |
| kanzure | or fluorescent protein reporters of membrane potentials, gene silencing capabilities, | 16:59 |
| ecd | haha, where do you want to start? or where have you already? | 17:00 |
| kanzure | rTMS/tDCS, do-it-yourself fMRI/MRI/CT/PET scanners, etc. | 17:00 |
| kanzure | ecd: well this is kind of why I'm doing skdb too | 17:00 |
| ecd | anyone building? or still not enough info out there? | 17:00 |
| kanzure | yes there are people building some of these devices | 17:00 |
| kanzure | a few people I know have rTMS setups | 17:00 |
| ecd | using them? getting results as advertised? | 17:01 |
| kanzure | another fellow has herself a tDCS setup that she's been meaning to get back into the habit of working on | 17:01 |
| kanzure | what results? | 17:01 |
| nsh | stimulation of the transcraminums | 17:01 |
| nsh | i would imagine | 17:02 |
| kanzure | hi nsh :) | 17:02 |
| nsh | yo | 17:02 |
| kanzure | one fellow reported tingling sensations | 17:02 |
| ecd | no memory/ability enhancements? | 17:02 |
| ecd | (and no negative side effects yet?) | 17:02 |
| kanzure | be very careful when asking that question | 17:02 |
| kanzure | it's not entirely obvious what an "enhancement" might be | 17:03 |
| kanzure | at this point I'm more interested in augmentations that might lead to enhancements | 17:03 |
| ecd | such as? | 17:03 |
| kanzure | a brain-computer interface is an augmentation in my book | 17:03 |
| kanzure | but not necessarily an "enhancement" (whatever that means) | 17:03 |
| kanzure | it might be an enhancement, but you shouldn't bet on it | 17:03 |
| kanzure | what I'm trying to say is that intelligence/enhancement are just fuzzy words and nobody has a clear definition | 17:04 |
| kanzure | so let's avoid them :) and carry on instead | 17:04 |
| ecd | is memory a fuzzy word too? | 17:04 |
| kanzure | dunno, I have read a lot of papers where memory is tested- and there are some simple ways to "test" different forms of memory | 17:05 |
| ecd | (not being sassy) do i recall correctly: tms had some effect on memory? | 17:05 |
| kanzure | like the "repeat a list of words" test | 17:05 |
| kanzure | or the recent rapamycin tests regarding mice that had a ridiculously high percentile improvement in long-term visual memory | 17:06 |
| kanzure | there are many TMS articles out there so I'm not sure which one you're talking about | 17:06 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/books/papers/open-rtms/ <-- here's some rTMS papers | 17:06 |
| ecd | all i've heard is through pop sci-type articles and a friend who works in a lab | 17:06 |
| kanzure | ouch. | 17:06 |
| kanzure | don't you wish you had more tools to play with to see for yourself? | 17:07 |
| genehacker | popsci as in the magazine? | 17:07 |
| ecd | your site is a goldmine, thanks for hosting all that by the way | 17:07 |
| ecd | hell yes | 17:07 |
| ecd | hence my "tech tree" project | 17:07 |
| genehacker | or or journals that advertise a lot? | 17:07 |
| kanzure | I really think you might be working on the same thing as us, ecd | 17:07 |
| ecd | general journals, gene | 17:07 |
| kanzure | we just don't call it a tree because it's sometimes more of a graph | 17:07 |
| ecd | more like "wanting to work" | 17:07 |
| ecd | yeah | 17:07 |
| kanzure | heh wanting to work | 17:07 |
| ecd | exactly. i've been looking for decent graph databases | 17:07 |
| kanzure | there are a few libraries that manipulate graphs | 17:08 |
| ecd | (hard to invest the time it seems to require given my limited abilities and the demands of citizenship (money, etc.)) | 17:08 |
| kanzure | but none that do dependency resolution algorithms really except smartpm | 17:08 |
| kanzure | so I added some code to skdb for dependency resolution in the dep/ folder | 17:08 |
| genehacker | oh good so you do read journals | 17:08 |
| kanzure | it's not quite functional yet but it should give an idea as to what we have in mind for resolving multiple dependencies of different types on different tech/hardware | 17:08 |
| ecd | where i can. i've been wanting to camp the local college library for access to some tech journals | 17:09 |
| genehacker | which is good for figuring out how to make self-replicating automata | 17:09 |
| genehacker | go for it | 17:09 |
| genehacker | COLLEGE LIBRARIES ROCK | 17:09 |
| ecd | are you all in school/professionals? | 17:09 |
| kanzure | no | 17:09 |
| genehacker | I am in school | 17:09 |
| genehacker | but we're hardly professionals | 17:10 |
| ecd | hah | 17:10 |
| ecd | spoken proudly? :P | 17:10 |
| genehacker | kanzure you're doing lego at the moment correct? | 17:11 |
| kanzure | one idea I was toying around with a few years ago was this idea of using neural stem cell cultures to sandbox possible alterations to my brain that I might want to make | 17:11 |
| kanzure | genehacker: fenn is, I'm in here acting like I'm social though | 17:11 |
| ecd | (kanzure, on my account? or are there other brains in here you want to consume?) | 17:13 |
| kanzure | what? | 17:13 |
| ecd | "Acting like i'm social" | 17:13 |
| genehacker | another idea I'm toying around with is a gene synthesizer to make the components necessary to do stuff like neural stem cell cultures | 17:13 |
| kanzure | ecd: yes I should probably be acting like I'm working instead of acting like I'm being social | 17:13 |
| ecd | then by all means! | 17:14 |
| kanzure | secretly I'm this angry old man trapped in this old kid's body or something (not sure if I got my story straight this time) | 17:14 |
| fenn | hum. what is Package.load supposed to do? | 17:14 |
| kanzure | but anyway, no, I'm happy to be talking | 17:14 |
| fenn | kanzure you're too naive to be an old man trapped in a kid's body | 17:14 |
| kanzure | am I angry enough? | 17:15 |
| fenn | not really, but why do old people have to be angry? | 17:15 |
| kanzure | dementia? | 17:15 |
| ecd | most old guys i know/knew are/were pretty chill | 17:15 |
| kanzure | ok ok | 17:15 |
| kanzure | fenn: I think it was supposed to be for loading stuff from data.yaml | 17:15 |
| fenn | right, but, what is all the k,v stuff about? | 17:15 |
| genehacker | you could cultivate insanity kanzure | 17:16 |
| genehacker | it gets you evil genius points | 17:16 |
| kanzure | genehacker: bah | 17:16 |
| kanzure | fenn: the idea was that in data.yaml there might be multiple parts listed | 17:17 |
| kanzure | so one of the parts might be "bob: !screw" | 17:17 |
| kanzure | so this would set the screw's name attribute to "bob" | 17:17 |
| fenn | oh, right | 17:17 |
| fenn | what are only_classes? | 17:17 |
| kanzure | data.yaml might have multiple objects listed | 17:17 |
| kanzure | so if you want only the screw tags, then just say "screw" or something | 17:18 |
| kanzure | er pass the screw class (screw_package.Screw) as only_classes | 17:18 |
| fenn | hm | 17:18 |
| kanzure | and then you'll get back only the screws | 17:18 |
| fenn | i think that should be done with isinstance | 17:18 |
| kanzure | this method is kind of stupidly structured | 17:18 |
| fenn | and load should just load the file | 17:18 |
| kanzure | it should be def load_data() | 17:18 |
| kanzure | not def load(content) | 17:18 |
| kanzure | no reason to make the user pass some content.. | 17:18 |
| kanzure | it should know where the package_path is and where data.yaml can be found | 17:18 |
| fenn | ok; is "source data:" always the right tag for data.yaml | 17:19 |
| fenn | er, mapping key | 17:19 |
| kanzure | if you're happy with the name "source data" in metadata.yaml yeah | 17:19 |
| fenn | i'm not entirely happy with the idea of one data file | 17:19 |
| kanzure | how about an attribute in metadata.yaml called "catalog" | 17:19 |
| fenn | oh it's a list | 17:19 |
| kanzure | ok nevermind | 17:20 |
| kanzure | should be fine | 17:20 |
| kanzure | for Package.load_data how do you specify which file to load, then? | 17:20 |
| kanzure | I was hoping for Package.load_data() to just work automagically | 17:20 |
| kanzure | (and spit out the objects/data) | 17:20 |
| fenn | loads all in source data | 17:21 |
| kanzure | ok | 17:21 |
| kanzure | how about a particular source data file, then? | 17:21 |
| kanzure | named parameter that is set to None, if None then load_all ? | 17:21 |
| fenn | just do package.load(package_file(whatever)) | 17:21 |
| kanzure | what? | 17:21 |
| fenn | or skdb.load | 17:21 |
| kanzure | why | 17:21 |
| fenn | package_file hasnt been committed yet | 17:21 |
| kanzure | package.load_data() #returns all source data | 17:22 |
| fenn | i needed a way to load grammar.yaml inside of the lego package | 17:22 |
| fenn | but i didnt know the local path | 17:22 |
| kanzure | package.load_data("data.yaml") #returns source data only from data.yaml in the package | 17:22 |
| fenn | so package_file finds the path of a file in a package | 17:22 |
| kanzure | where is package_file defined | 17:22 |
| fenn | skdb.py global namespace | 17:23 |
| kanzure | then what are yuo passing it? | 17:23 |
| fenn | package_file('lego', 'grammar.yaml') | 17:23 |
| kanzure | meh | 17:23 |
| kanzure | if you commit I'll make it slightly more pythonic | 17:23 |
| fenn | how so, please elaborate | 17:23 |
| fenn | i should just shut up and commit | 17:24 |
| kanzure | Package.path() could take a parameter (filename) and spit out the path | 17:24 |
| fenn | no | 17:24 |
| fenn | won't work | 17:24 |
| kanzure | why not | 17:24 |
| kanzure | if there's no parameter given, then just do the default behavior (package path) | 17:24 |
| fenn | you're in the middle of constructing the package | 17:24 |
| fenn | just hang tight and look at the code when i'm done | 17:24 |
| fenn | the real problem is i'm getting None for package name somewhere in this process | 17:25 |
| fenn | even though it's defined in metadata.yaml | 17:25 |
| kanzure | what's worng with os.path.dirname(os.path.abspath(__file__)) in where-ever you're trying to load grammar.yaml? | 17:26 |
| fenn | it's gross | 17:26 |
| kanzure | :p you're gross | 17:26 |
| fenn | and doesn't do any checks or anything | 17:26 |
| kanzure | ecd: so anyway, I'm guessing you checked out the repository? | 17:27 |
| ecd | browsing now | 17:27 |
| fenn | when a !package gets loaded from yaml its name is empty, so when it gets initialized unix_name fails (it doesnt have the right data anyway) | 17:35 |
| fenn | how do i call check_unix_name after the data gets stuffed? | 17:35 |
| kanzure | post_init_call? | 17:37 |
| fenn | right, it works now for some reason | 17:38 |
| fenn | _-_ | 17:38 |
| kanzure | hahaha "Manipulating gene expressions by electroporation in the developing brain of mammalian embryos." | 17:44 |
| kanzure | "We have also performed EP in developing fetuses in utero guided by ultrasound image" | 17:44 |
| kanzure | hm there has to be a use for transient gene expression during cerebrogenesis (or whatever you call it) | 17:45 |
| ecd | is this a paper you've uploaded? | 17:46 |
| kanzure | localized accelerated regions of growth of neurons I guess | 17:46 |
| kanzure | ecd: one moment and I'll put it up | 17:46 |
| ecd | ty | 17:46 |
| ecd | (though i've near-zero bio knowledge, still sounds interesting...) | 17:46 |
| kanzure | ttp://adl.serveftp.org/papers/Manipulating%20gene%20expressions%20by%20electroporation%20in%20the%20developing%20brain%20of%20mammalian%20embryos.pdf | 17:47 |
| kanzure | er | 17:47 |
| kanzure | http://adl.serveftp.org/papers/Manipulating%20gene%20expressions%20by%20electroporation%20in%20the%20developing%20brain%20of%20mammalian%20embryos.pdf | 17:47 |
| kanzure | so I wonder if anyone has built as stereotactic frame for human fetuses | 17:48 |
| kanzure | "Mussen devised the first stereotactic frame intended for human use in 1918." | 17:48 |
| ecd | for fetuses... how much jostling can fetuses tolerate without ill-effect? | 17:49 |
| kanzure | they squeeze through a fucking vagina | 17:49 |
| ecd | and how many women would let you build a frame in their womb? | 17:49 |
| kanzure | who said anything about using a woman's womb? ectogenetic tanks, man :p | 17:50 |
| kanzure | (only half kidding) | 17:50 |
| ecd | hah. ...how far away? | 17:50 |
| kanzure | kuwabara was doing that in the late 90s in japan but died and nobody continued his wokr | 17:50 |
| kanzure | *work | 17:50 |
| kanzure | however it was only for rats IIRC or goats(?) | 17:50 |
| ecd | wow *internets* | 17:50 |
| kanzure | search also for "artificial womb" and "artificial uterus" | 17:51 |
| ecd | aye | 17:51 |
| kanzure | aha, here we go: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_uterus | 17:51 |
| kanzure | "Another form of artificial uterus is one in which tanks are filled with amniotic fluid which is maintained at body temperature, and the embryonic umbilical cords are attached to external pumps which regulate nutrient intake and waste outflow. " | 17:52 |
| kanzure | hrm surely someone has done fetal neurosurgery before | 17:53 |
| kanzure | how have they done it without a stereotactic frame? | 17:53 |
| ecd | i can search, yeah, but do you know offhand how "complete" the knowledge is of embryo development & such? | 17:53 |
| kanzure | there's a large body of knowledge about embryogenesis if that's what you're asking | 17:54 |
| kanzure | however there are not many people working on artificial wombs or verifying formulae for wombs | 17:55 |
| drazak | kanzure: I'll ask my uncle, he was trained as a developmental biologist, they do fetal surgery and all that | 17:55 |
| kanzure | ok thanks | 17:55 |
| kanzure | the reason why I'm looking for a frame is so that I can figure out whether or not this is feasible or just speculation | 17:56 |
| kanzure | ah they use ventriculosubgaleal shunts (VSG shunts) | 17:59 |
| ecd | man, no shortage of motiviation to work on skdb and such... | 18:00 |
| kanzure | http://www.scielo.br/img/revistas/acb/v22n3/03f1.jpg | 18:00 |
| kanzure | what species is that? | 18:01 |
| ecd | it's not in the paper? | 18:04 |
| kanzure | the image | 18:04 |
| ecd | quoting from the paper: "Twelve mixed breed Hampshire sheep were obtained from an external breeder." | 18:05 |
| ecd | whoops, obviously "Twelve _pregnant_..." | 18:05 |
| kanzure | the image I just linked to :p was saying that "they use VSG shunts" where they=neurosurgeons, not the paper's authors, sorry for the confusion | 18:06 |
| ecd | Still confused, sorry... what species were you asking about? | 18:08 |
| kanzure | the one in the image from the scielo.br link | 18:09 |
| kanzure | nevermind | 18:09 |
| ecd | You were making a joke that the paper's authors were pregnant sheep? :P | 18:10 |
| ecd | Also, how do you read all these papers? Can you just read really fast (practice, or (+) natural ability), or do you have some techniques? | 18:11 |
| kanzure | well the trick is to ignore the bullshit | 18:12 |
| kanzure | but usually I read only the techniques and methods or more if I'm looking for more details | 18:12 |
| kanzure | usually it's more about reading for feasibility information .. "ouch, that looks like a tool I won't be able to make or get my hands on, screw that" | 18:13 |
| kanzure | this narrows down the possibility space quite a bit as you can imagine | 18:13 |
| ecd | heh, hence the anger | 18:13 |
| kanzure | sure | 18:13 |
| ecd | have you built any of the Gingery stuff? (In addition to all the books, I have a pile of clay I dug out of the yard, and an old vacuum cleaner motor, and that's my progress on the furnace.) | 18:14 |
| kanzure | fenn: you want to take that one? | 18:15 |
| ecd | I take it fenn's more mechanically inclined? | 18:15 |
| kanzure | what? | 18:16 |
| kanzure | he built the gingery lathe and something else that I'm forgetting | 18:16 |
| kanzure | but I thikn he'd like to talk about it himself | 18:16 |
| fenn | eh | 18:16 |
| ecd | not exciting? | 18:17 |
| fenn | http://fennetic.net/machines/lathe_modifications | 18:17 |
| fenn | why dont we have tab completion for http location bar yet? :P | 18:18 |
| fenn | query the server for a list of possible urls | 18:19 |
| kanzure | or even just over your history | 18:19 |
| fenn | naw that just gets you a bunch of porn | 18:19 |
| kanzure | you have porn that will match for "lathe"? | 18:20 |
| kanzure | what the fuck man | 18:20 |
| ecd | that's what the ladies call me | 18:20 |
| * fenn hides | 18:20 | |
| ecd | take that how you will | 18:20 |
| ecd | also, what do you folks use to organize your bookmarks? | 18:20 |
| ecd | just firefox/whatever's built-in search stuff? | 18:20 |
| fenn | bookmarks really ought to be tagged rather than sorted | 18:21 |
| kanzure | http://heybryan.org/bookmarking.html <- an old rant on bookmarking | 18:21 |
| fenn | konqueror doesn't do tags so i'm sort of screwed there | 18:21 |
| kanzure | kbookmarkeditor and firefox and konqueror all crash with my bookmarks these days | 18:21 |
| kanzure | opera is able to load them up with sufficient RAM on a machine, but that's not ideal | 18:21 |
| kanzure | I was thinking of moving to flatfile bookmarks a while back | 18:21 |
| kanzure | should probably get around to doing that I guess :) | 18:22 |
| fenn | ecd: if you're interested in gingery you might enjoy looking around fennetic.net/machines/ | 18:22 |
| fenn | i havent done much with it in a couple years; eventually skdb will import that info | 18:23 |
| ecd | excellent, thanks | 18:23 |
| kanzure | fenn: push yet? | 18:23 |
| fenn | wah | 18:23 |
| fenn | ConstructorError: could not determine a constructor for the tag '!lego_feature' | 18:24 |
| fenn | wtf | 18:24 |
| kanzure | once things get more stable we won't have to push all the time | 18:24 |
| kanzure | weren't you loading a lego_feature object the other day? | 18:24 |
| fenn | it's in metadata.yaml | 18:24 |
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| fenn | i mean data.yaml. why is it loading data.yaml? gah | 18:25 |
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| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r f4444609eb6c /packages/lego/grammar.yaml: now its a dict of lego.Feature objects | 19:03 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r b6b0fe10999f /core/interface.py: Interface should be FennObject | 19:03 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 8822456e1611 /core/yamlcrap.py: new overlay function for merging objects | 19:03 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 5f834520c0bd /core/skdb.py: new functions package_file and load_data; clean up a lot of old file handling code | 19:03 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r f2c40961610f /packages/lego/ (data.yaml grammar.yaml interfaces.py lego.py metadata.yaml): lego feature grammar works now | 19:03 |
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| fenn | sigh. | 19:30 |
| fenn | 'foo' in 'foobar' | 19:30 |
| fenn | True | 19:30 |
| fenn | so 'stud' is compatible with 'anti stud cup' because it contains the string 'stud' | 19:30 |
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| genehacker | ???/ | 20:18 |
| genehacker | stud? | 20:19 |
| genehacker | are you abstracting that high | 20:19 |
| genehacker | oh I get it | 20:29 |
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| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r a4ff523f295b /pymates/pymates.py: fix gp_Ax1 orientation parameters and fix list index error in random.randint in pymates | 20:54 |
| ybit | kanzure: i like it (your web browsing exp. idea) | 21:13 |
| fenn | web browsing exp? | 21:19 |
| kanzure | fenn: just an idea to make tabs go away until they are needed | 21:21 |
| fenn | who was ecd? | 21:21 |
| kanzure | the guy I replied to on om | 21:21 |
| ybit | s/exp/system *shrug* | 21:27 |
| * ybit doesn't like how beer makes him clumsy | 21:28 | |
| * ybit would prefer adderall | 21:28 | |
| ybit | damn my doc for thinking i need straterra right now -_- | 21:28 |
| ybit | for that sacha girl to be so on top of her email, she sure is taking a long time to respond to me | 21:29 |
| ybit | it's okay though, i'm guessing the scripts she writes about our some of the ones she maintains like remember.el or something like that | 21:32 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r 72a288d439bb / (3 files in 2 dirs): key bindings and cycling through different possible combinations of legos (need to implement options() next) | 21:45 |
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| genehacker | hmmm... now I wonder if there are plants that can make nitrous oxide | 21:49 |
| katsmeow | they'd have been popular in the 60's | 21:49 |
| kanzure | nitrogen cyclers? | 21:49 |
| genehacker | plants that make NOx | 21:50 |
| genehacker | and some sort of fuel | 21:50 |
| genehacker | then mix them and take off like a rocket | 21:51 |
| genehacker | or perhaps make some sort of cellulose based potato cannon | 21:54 |
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| ybit | genehacker: what's the name of this microfluidics book you keep talking about | 22:08 |
| genehacker | kanzure has it | 22:14 |
| genehacker | microfluidics history and applications or something | 22:14 |
| genehacker | let me check | 22:14 |
| genehacker | Microfluidics History, Theory, and Applications | 22:15 |
| kanzure | it's on the server | 22:19 |
| kanzure | er, on adl | 22:19 |
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| kanzure | huh ldraw uses a 3x3 matrix | 22:25 |
| fenn | boo | 22:30 |
| fenn | oh wait, nevermind | 22:30 |
| kanzure | sorta kinda have a ldr-to-python converter written | 22:51 |
| genehacker | 3x3 matrix of what? | 22:55 |
| genehacker | crystal structure? | 22:55 |
| genehacker | I mean lego crystal structure can be quite simple | 22:56 |
| fenn | probably position and two orientation vectors | 22:59 |
| genehacker | rotation? | 23:00 |
| fenn | right | 23:00 |
| fenn | orientation == rotation more or less | 23:00 |
| genehacker | euler angles not a quaternion? | 23:00 |
| fenn | yeah | 23:00 |
| fenn | i never figured out quaternions (bad explanations probably) | 23:01 |
| genehacker | BUT THOSE ARE SUSCEPTIBLE TO GIMBAL LOCK? | 23:01 |
| fenn | oh noes | 23:01 |
| genehacker | I haven't either fenn | 23:01 |
| genehacker | do you know the apollo spacecraft was too? | 23:01 |
| fenn | actually orientation vectors don't have gimbal lock | 23:01 |
| genehacker | they had to do special maneveuring to avoid those conditions | 23:01 |
| fenn | Two interpolate between two quaternions, you must interpolate linearly over the surface of the unit hypersphere in four dimensions. | 23:07 |
| fenn | i wonder if i'm supposed to get some sort of enlightenment from that | 23:07 |
| genehacker | the missile knows where it is because it knows where it isn't | 23:08 |
| fenn | there is no missile | 23:08 |
| genehacker | I saw a very funny presentation on missile guidance | 23:08 |
| genehacker | whose unstated purpose was to completely misinform people on missile guidance | 23:09 |
| fenn | e2 is great | 23:09 |
| genehacker | ??? | 23:09 |
| fenn | "quaternion" links to "Everything2 | 23:09 |
| fenn | erm | 23:09 |
| genehacker | awesome | 23:09 |
| fenn | "quaternion" links to "roll me over and fuck me again" | 23:09 |
| genehacker | rotation freaks me out | 23:12 |
| fenn | definitive article on the subject http://everything2.com/title/Teenage+genius+computer+hacker+myth | 23:15 |
| genehacker | how big is everything | 23:17 |
| genehacker | http://nostarch.com/mg_electricity.htm | 23:25 |
| genehacker | maybe there's a manga guide to matrix math | 23:25 |
| fenn | i remember when this was funny http://onastick.net/sitz/images/webphone.html | 23:25 |
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