| --- Day changed Tue Aug 11 2009 | ||
| ybit | let's see.. | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| ybit | adventureland, sunshine cleaning, the midnight meat train, slumdog millionaire, rpm, deathbed, | 00:01 |
| ybit | and yes, they are mostly talking about what time to meetup to go see these movies at a theater | 00:02 |
| ybit | that's from the log, only 2% into it | 00:02 |
| ybit | bah, time for bed | 00:02 |
| * ybit doesn't care for complaining anymore | 00:02 | |
| genehacker | oh dear | 00:04 |
| genehacker | that's not a maker's club | 00:04 |
| genehacker | dang that's not even sci-fi | 00:05 |
| genehacker | those conversations can not be redirected toward something productive | 00:06 |
| strages | ybit: seriously? | 00:06 |
| ybit | strages: cereal as cereal can be | 00:07 |
| strages | you haven't been to our shop | 00:07 |
| ybit | http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cereal | 00:07 |
| strages | judging us over irc banter is pretty lame | 00:07 |
| ybit | "no guy, i'm totally cereal right now" -al gore, family guy ep.? | 00:08 |
| strages | did it ever occur to you that the people in there conversing aren't the ones out in the real world doing? | 00:08 |
| ybit | s/guy/guys | 00:08 |
| ybit | meh | 00:09 |
| genehacker | recommended course of action: remove local movie theater | 00:09 |
| genehacker | recommended course of action is possibly illegal | 00:09 |
| strages | or remove those in the channel giving us a bad name, sheesh | 00:09 |
| ybit | it's difficult to find locals that are interested in linux interested in anything interesting | 00:09 |
| genehacker | do they have to be interested in linux? | 00:10 |
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| strages | ybit: I'm interested in robotics, augmented reality, open manufacturing, origami, geocaching | 00:11 |
| ybit | let's see, found a guy who runs ubuntu and admins a few linux machines whatever distro they run, i mention creating a hackspace and he mentions wanting to have music there... one guy i introduced linux to turned to a mac eventually, another guy who has arch linux, uses awesome wm is majoring in political science.. | 00:11 |
| genehacker | make an origami augmented reality setup that is automatically assembled by robots that assists in geocaching | 00:11 |
| ybit | so yeah, i'm sure most of the guys in #makerslocal are idiots too | 00:11 |
| genehacker | people in IRC are | 00:12 |
| strages | ybit: sheesh, you're judging us based on completely different people from us? | 00:12 |
| ybit | strages: follow the diyh+ mailing list, you'll like it | 00:12 |
| strages | got a link to it? | 00:12 |
| ybit | http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fgroup%2Fdiytranshumanist&ei=l_2ASqmvHeGTtgf_2fjRCg&usg=AFQjCNEE3GAPlv1hT0Tj-wj_4k0uzgd0pQ&sig2=1PedtkhZugwb7uWwhAW7wQ | 00:13 |
| ybit | groups.google.com/group/diytranshumanist | 00:13 |
| strages | ybit: have you been to our shop or seen our wiki? | 00:13 |
| ybit | strages: eh? | 00:13 |
| ybit | oh, you're from #makerslocal :P | 00:14 |
| strages | yes | 00:14 |
| ybit | wow | 00:14 |
| ybit | now there are 3 people in here from alabama | 00:14 |
| strages | and read all the bad things you said about us | 00:14 |
| ybit | i don't care, it's true and ya know it | 00:14 |
| strages | who's the third? | 00:14 |
| ybit | katsmeow-afk: | 00:14 |
| strages | ybit: it is not, how do you know? | 00:14 |
| ybit | i have logs to prove this | 00:15 |
| strages | irc doesn't prove shit | 00:15 |
| ybit | umm.. these are logs.. to prove that the channel mostly talks about bs | 00:15 |
| ybit | let's see.. when did you join this channel... | 00:15 |
| strages | check the frequency of chatter per user | 00:16 |
| ybit | what about it? | 00:16 |
| strages | your logs will show that there are a few loud and lazy people in there | 00:16 |
| ybit | hmm.. sometime after june | 00:17 |
| strages | the rest are out working on things and see each other in person daily at our hackerspace | 00:17 |
| ybit | grr, /me doesn't want to cat logs | 00:17 |
| strages | then don't, trust me instead | 00:17 |
| ybit | well then, strages nice to meet you on irc | 00:17 |
| strages | I suggest coming to our hackerspace sometime and checking out our wiki https://256.makerslocal.org/wiki/index.php | 00:18 |
| strages | lots of bright folks there working on projects | 00:19 |
| ybit | july 11 is the date i have you as joining.. | 00:19 |
| strages | hit up nykodemus, crashcart, or ratmandu in a private conversation sometime | 00:19 |
| ybit | how'd you find out about this channel? | 00:19 |
| strages | kanzure was in #makerslocal I got to talking to him about things and how he found our channel and he led me hear and to the open manufacturing mailing list | 00:20 |
| strages | *here | 00:20 |
| ybit | heh, nice. kanzure, what were you doing there? :P | 00:21 |
| strages | apparently you mentioned our channel in here before and he followed | 00:21 |
| ybit | afk for a sec | 00:22 |
| strages | I also started #hackerspaces as a central point for talking to various hackerspaces listed on hackerspaces.org | 00:22 |
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| ybit | and i'm back | 00:28 |
| ybit | strages: i'm highly relieved to be proven wrong that not the entire channel is full of idiots and that there are some sane people nearby | 00:30 |
| ybit | strages, katsmeow is also any83313030 | 00:31 |
| strages | there are lots, we're just too busy to irc all that much lol | 00:31 |
| strages | ah ok, good to know | 00:31 |
| ybit | busy doing what exactly... | 00:32 |
| strages | I'm organizing a hackerspaces meetup next month, sept 18-20. hackerspaces from all over are coming to visit for the weekend and try and organize a hackerspaces con for the following year | 00:32 |
| strages | hopefully here in huntsville | 00:32 |
| strages | two makerbots are being brought by other spaces to the event | 00:33 |
| strages | and a mcwire cartesian table | 00:33 |
| ybit | let's see, you'll need to be in touch with the atl group if you haven't already, they'll be interested | 00:33 |
| strages | I have been in touch with them and the nashville space | 00:33 |
| strages | there's a space from quebec driving down | 00:34 |
| ybit | nashville? | 00:34 |
| strages | two from florida, one from kansas, one from washington dc, and other from texas | 00:34 |
| ybit | link to nashville group please | 00:34 |
| strages | hackerconsortium is in nashville | 00:34 |
| strages | http://hackerconsortium.com/ | 00:35 |
| strages | I've been working on augmented reality badges for the meetup and trying to finish my multitouch table and automated blimp | 00:36 |
| strages | who knows what all I'll get done in time | 00:36 |
| ybit | hrm | 00:36 |
| strages | at the space we have arduino folks, a guy who knows just the chipset the arduino uses, and we have a boat load of stepper motors | 00:37 |
| strages | I want to make a large area 3 axis table that I can change out the head one | 00:38 |
| ybit | so how exactly do you plan on creating ar badges, the attendees will need the equipment to view this stuff | 00:38 |
| strages | all the attendees will need is the webcam built into their laptop or to use one of the stations we'll have setup | 00:38 |
| strages | we're using FLARtoolkit on a website to handle the AR stuff | 00:39 |
| ybit | an ar badge is just a blank space with some color encompassing the edges | 00:39 |
| ybit | so, paper with something like a colored strip of paper on top | 00:40 |
| * ybit really isn't this crule in person, it's the irc that does it to me | 00:40 | |
| ybit | the black void which is the cli | 00:41 |
| strages | well it'll have a glyph one it | 00:41 |
| strages | black bordered box with a symbol int he center recognized by the software and then replaced with something of our choosing on the computer screen | 00:42 |
| strages | some call them markers | 00:42 |
| genehacker | ar badges? | 00:43 |
| ybit | augmented reality | 00:43 |
| genehacker | got cardstock and a printer handy? | 00:43 |
| ybit | you know... covention badges.. | 00:43 |
| genehacker | that's all you need | 00:43 |
| strages | ybit: I am curious as to this colored stripe AR stuff you're referring to | 00:43 |
| genehacker | yeah | 00:43 |
| genehacker | I know | 00:43 |
| genehacker | ARtoolkit | 00:43 |
| genehacker | use it | 00:43 |
| genehacker | hope it works well | 00:43 |
| ybit | usually geeks have them hanging around their neck or something at conventions :) | 00:43 |
| strages | ah | 00:44 |
| strages | I see what you did there | 00:44 |
| ybit | ? | 00:44 |
| strages | genehacker: yeah we'll be using the flash implementation of artoolkit, which is based off nyartoolkit, a java based one | 00:45 |
| ybit | so what kind of projects at makerslocal | 00:46 |
| ybit | strages^ | 00:47 |
| strages | we made a portable full sized photobooth that folds up | 00:47 |
| ybit | interesting | 00:48 |
| ybit | anything else? | 00:48 |
| ybit | a list of them on the wiki perhaps? | 00:48 |
| strages | linux based, and we plan to opensource the design and software | 00:48 |
| strages | ybit they are on our wiki | 00:48 |
| ybit | linux based, kind of a no brainer :P | 00:48 |
| ybit | strages: link? | 00:48 |
| strages | https://256.makerslocal.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page | 00:49 |
| strages | also http://256.makerslocal.org is our blog | 00:49 |
| ybit | so essentially what you just mentioned, ar, multitouch screen, photobooth | 00:50 |
| ybit | and other little hacks | 00:50 |
| strages | yes mostly | 00:50 |
| strages | BEAMbots | 00:50 |
| strages | our usb authenticated door system, which is currently down | 00:51 |
| strages | laptop running the authentication went south on us | 00:51 |
| genehacker | USB AUTHENTICATED DOOR SYSTEM? | 00:51 |
| genehacker | documentation? | 00:52 |
| ybit | none | 00:52 |
| ybit | atm i'm assuming | 00:52 |
| genehacker | we could use one of those here | 00:52 |
| genehacker | oh shoot | 00:52 |
| ybit | details though would be nice | 00:52 |
| strages | genehacker: https://256.makerslocal.org/wiki/index.php/USB_Auth | 00:52 |
| strages | ybit: seriously stop jumping the gun on being so pessemistic about us | 00:53 |
| strages | genehacker: we're working on a standalone version of it without the need for the pc to authenticate | 00:53 |
| ybit | it's the cli strages, it happens to the best of us | 00:54 |
| genehacker | ok cool | 00:54 |
| genehacker | let us know when you are finished | 00:54 |
| genehacker | perhaps we could set up the same system over all other hackerspaces | 00:55 |
| strages | in a nutshell, every usb key has a unique id stored on a chip in it. we use that to identify a person, a pc tells a microcontroller to turn a servo attached to the deadbolt on the door | 00:55 |
| strages | I'm not going to say it's a fool proof means of access, but it works pretty well | 00:56 |
| genehacker | it need not be fool proof | 00:56 |
| strages | someone looses their "key" we erase the id from the db and reauthenticate a new one | 00:56 |
| genehacker | any people capable of hacking in might be of interest to you | 00:57 |
| genehacker | just let us know how it works out | 00:57 |
| strages | we have figured out how to completely clone someone's thumbdrive, but it's not easy and requires some specific hardware | 00:57 |
| strages | we've been using it for about a year now, it works pretty well | 00:57 |
| genehacker | therefore people with that hardware might be useful to you | 00:57 |
| genehacker | ok then | 00:58 |
| strages | correct | 00:58 |
| genehacker | documentation please? | 00:58 |
| strages | it's on the wiki link I posted | 00:58 |
| genehacker | ok | 00:58 |
| genehacker | kanzure | 00:58 |
| strages | even the code both for the arduino and for the pc | 00:58 |
| strages | we made hackaday with it last october | 00:59 |
| genehacker | your link to that diy taq thing is broken | 00:59 |
| genehacker | then I presume it is fairly well documented | 00:59 |
| strages | accept the certificate | 00:59 |
| genehacker | cool | 00:59 |
| ybit | strages: a friend of mine who is now in chicago was working on the same thing ~3 years ago... i should email him to see how far that came along | 00:59 |
| strages | firefox hates cacerts for some reason | 00:59 |
| ybit | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JKTXRlaXLDQ | 01:00 |
| strages | ybit: please do, I'd be interested in hearing about his work | 01:00 |
| ybit | is my alsa config fucked or is there really just no audio | 01:00 |
| strages | your alsa config is fucked up | 01:00 |
| * ybit guesses the alsa-config due to mocp mucking around | 01:00 | |
| ybit | nope, just mplayer thinking it would be cute to mute pcm | 01:01 |
| strages | shit it's 1am, I need to go to bed | 01:01 |
| strages | work and all in the morning | 01:01 |
| strages | we'll talk more, and I'll happily answer any questions | 01:02 |
| ybit | that reminds me, ncp needs to be configured properly on this machine :) | 01:04 |
| ybit | any question? | 01:05 |
| ybit | so when's the rfid version of this coming out? | 01:05 |
| -!- any83313030 is now known as katsmeow-afk | 01:06 | |
| strages | there won't be one, but the idea has been brought up in the past and I have a full rfid kit at the space for people to experiment with | 01:06 |
| strages | including an implantable one | 01:06 |
| ybit | nice | 01:07 |
| ybit | alright, time for bed | 01:07 |
| bkero | Did you guys see that stross conversation that got /.ed? | 03:10 |
| genehacker | ??? | 03:18 |
| katsmeow-afk | 1 machine, 4 weeks now enough to sequence human genome | 03:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | Researchers have used a new machine that sequences millions of small DNA fragments in parallel to cover 90 percent of one individual's genome in only four weeks. | 03:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | By John Timmer | Last updated August 10, 2009 2:15 PM CT | 03:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2009/08/human-genome-completed-using-one-machine-for-four-weeks.ars | 03:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | scientists from the Universities of Nottingham and Southampton demonstrate a technique that allows the electrodeposition of 3nm copper lines : Last updated August 10, 2009 4:05 PM CT : http://arstechnica.com/science/news/2009/08/researches-create-3-nm-wiring-with-supercritical-fluids.ars | 03:27 |
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| drazak | ok | 06:13 |
| drazak | so what is the link between diybio and synthetic biology | 06:13 |
| drazak | it seems counterintuitive | 06:13 |
| drazak | synbio requires a very high level of knowledge about biology, it requires expensive reagents, complicated protocals, potentially BSL2 | 06:14 |
| kanzure | exactly | 06:53 |
| kanzure | genehacker, the diy taq thing is copied in the email | 06:59 |
| kanzure | here's that robot inventory system using small little turtles: http://www.kivasystems.com/demo/index.html | 07:01 |
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| strages | kanzure: looks kind of like what zappos.com uses in their warehouse | 09:02 |
| drazak | kanzure: like my last two diybio posts? | 09:03 |
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| drazak | kanzure: :D | 09:50 |
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| kanzure | chimpanzees spend on average six hours a day chewing | 10:05 |
| kanzure | fenn: my mom will be bringing by some boxes of legos soon | 10:07 |
| -!- drazak is now known as draz|lab | 10:07 | |
| draz|lab | kanzure: so, you totally understood me properly | 10:08 |
| kanzure | apparently she didn't throw them away | 10:08 |
| draz|lab | kanzure: I think the diybio community doesn't know shit for shinola about how to actually do biology | 10:08 |
| draz|lab | you don't just one day say: LETS MAKE SYNTHETIC CELLS | 10:08 |
| * kanzure was looking for an ontology of biology protocols to append to fenn's taxonomy of manufacturing techniques | 10:11 | |
| kanzure | but unfortunately nobody seems to have one | 10:11 |
| kanzure | there was one from protocol-online.org, but it's hiddeously (un)organized | 10:11 |
| draz|lab | I have a western blotting protocal that I can give you | 10:12 |
| draz|lab | WITH PICTURES | 10:12 |
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| ybit | draz|lab: link? | 10:32 |
| CIA-38 | brain: kanzure master * r3b0a312 / genes.yaml : sequence identification of 2,375 human brain genes - yay venter - http://bit.ly/164vTm | 10:35 |
| draz|lab | ybit: I'll email it to ya'll | 10:42 |
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| * ybit can't figure out why escitalopram | antomoxetine would prevent one from sleeping normally | 11:12 | |
| ybit | http://ybit.ath.cx/docs/papers/Antidepressants%20and%20their%20effect%20on%20sleep.pdf | 11:14 |
| ybit | http://ybit.ath.cx/docs/papers/The%20effect%20of%20escitalopram%20on%20sleep%20problems%20in%20depressed%20patients.pdf | 11:14 |
| ybit | also.. | 11:14 |
| ybit | http://adl.serveftp.org/papers/unsorted/The%20effect%20of%20escitalopram%20on%20sleep%20problems%20in%20depressed%20patients.pdf | 11:15 |
| ybit | http://adl.serveftp.org/papers/unsorted/Antidepressants%20and%20their%20effect%20on%20sleep.pdf | 11:15 |
| * ybit was thinking last night it would be nice to have a network of rsync mirrors for papers of interest | 11:16 | |
| ybit | papers, books, and possibly other | 11:17 |
| fenn | sounds like it's making you even more depressed than usual (based on reading last night's logs) | 11:19 |
| ybit | more of an asshole than usual would be the description | 11:24 |
| strages | I'll say :p | 11:25 |
| ybit | :P | 11:25 |
| kanzure | um, what should I be doing right now? | 11:34 |
| fenn | draz|lab: the link is iGEM | 11:34 |
| fenn | the idea here being "biobricks are so easy anyone can do it" | 11:35 |
| fenn | and besides, what else are you going to do with a bio lab? make petri dish paintings? | 11:35 |
| kanzure | iGEM isn't about biolabs | 11:35 |
| kanzure | so that's the wrong question, fenn | 11:36 |
| * ybit thought it was assumed that you have a decent knowledge of bio before participating or developing for diybio | 11:36 | |
| kanzure | we need a competition that glorifies lab setups | 11:36 |
| ybit | ^re:diybio isn't synbio | 11:37 |
| kanzure | where big bulky proprietary equipment is -- | 11:37 |
| kanzure | now I demand you tell me what I should be doing | 11:37 |
| fenn | http://www.saatchi-gallery.co.uk/images/thumbnail1.php/bcb9b685.jpg | 11:37 |
| fenn | photosynthetic bacteria | 11:38 |
| kanzure | that's what I should be doing? | 11:38 |
| fenn | kanzure: why don't you just save some time and energy and hot rod your truck | 11:38 |
| kanzure | my what? | 11:38 |
| fenn | lots of chrome and flames | 11:38 |
| kanzure | huh? | 11:38 |
| fenn | sigh.. nevermind | 11:39 |
| kanzure | why do you think it matters what a lab looks like? | 11:39 |
| fenn | 'we need a competitino that glorifies big bulky proprietary equipment' | 11:39 |
| kanzure | did I say that? | 11:39 |
| ybit | third time's a charm? | 11:40 |
| fenn | well, didn't you? | 11:40 |
| ybit | no | 11:40 |
| ybit | "where big bulky proprietary equipment is --" | 11:40 |
| kanzure | this is not hard to understand | 11:40 |
| ybit | i'm guessing -- == mising | 11:40 |
| ybit | missing* | 11:40 |
| ybit | devoid | 11:40 |
| fenn | define "--" | 11:40 |
| kanzure | fenn: learn your operators. | 11:40 |
| kanzure | out of context I guess it wouldn't make sense | 11:41 |
| ybit | like ++ but opposite me guesses | 11:41 |
| fenn | some people use -- as a separator | 11:41 |
| kanzure | that's true | 11:41 |
| kanzure | okay | 11:41 |
| ybit | and it's a comment in haskell | 11:41 |
| kanzure | now tell me what I'm supposed to be doing | 11:41 |
| kanzure | honestly I'm completely clueless | 11:41 |
| ybit | create a todo.org so you won't be clueless like this again | 11:42 |
| kanzure | I looked at my todo lists, but they suck | 11:42 |
| * fenn looks at the todo list | 11:42 | |
| fenn | update skdb/TODO to reflect what has been done | 11:42 |
| fenn | hah | 11:43 |
| kanzure | you mean skdb/doc/todo/TODO ? | 11:43 |
| fenn | yeah | 11:43 |
| fenn | also, install pythonOCC on leibniz | 11:45 |
| kanzure | pythonOCC isn't installed on leibniz? wtf | 11:46 |
| kanzure | how .. er.. um. | 11:46 |
| fenn | it runs in place but you can't import it | 11:46 |
| kanzure | huh, okay | 11:46 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r 3e86655a8d9f /doc/todo/TODO: metatodo is confusing. cleaned up todo. | 11:55 |
| fenn | aww. no completed items? how will i ever get a sense of true accomplishment without little ascii art checkboxes? | 11:58 |
| kanzure | do you want little ascii art checkboxes? | 11:59 |
| fenn | i don't know | 11:59 |
| fenn | maybe they should be moved to a 'features' page or something | 11:59 |
| kanzure | orgs mode is probably the closest thing to a shareable todo file format | 11:59 |
| kanzure | hnb has this todo file format, but it's XML, hnb hasn't been maintained in half a decade, and it sucks | 12:00 |
| kanzure | my old format sucked, and this new yamlification of it also sucks | 12:00 |
| fenn | i dont care much about the format as long as it's not XML | 12:01 |
| fenn | basically i was just complaining about the 'accomplishments' just disappearing | 12:01 |
| * fenn makes a new file 'doc/features' | 12:02 | |
| fenn | hm | 12:02 |
| fenn | or should it go in readme? | 12:02 |
| kanzure | changelog? | 12:03 |
| fenn | changelogs suck | 12:03 |
| fenn | they always end up being git log > changelog | 12:03 |
| draz|lab | fenn: all I was saying in my email is that if synbip is the way the diybio is going to go, then it's not going to be easy | 12:07 |
| draz|lab | that's kinda what I was trying to get out, I think | 12:07 |
| fenn | well, i hope you're wrong | 12:07 |
| fenn | omg i'm reading campbell/kurtoglu's "taxonomy" and apparently electrical/mechanical energy is an "object" and wire/gear is a "medium"? | 12:10 |
| kanzure | what? "If it weren't for Ben Goertzel, Second Life would be a red herring. The Cosmic Engineers need to take a page from Bryan Bishop's playbook." | 12:13 |
| kanzure | wrldpc2: huh? | 12:13 |
| wrldpc2 | You're actually doing shit. | 12:14 |
| fenn | what are the licensing stipulations for mechmate? (is it even legal to repackage the design files?) | 12:18 |
| kanzure | not sure | 12:21 |
| kanzure | john cumbers got married? apparently his "best man" was mackenzie | 12:34 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 8d05e9468235 /doc/todo/TODO: inevitable TODO list bloat.. i tried to add verbs :( | 12:36 |
| fenn | dammit i didnt mean to add stuff to that | 12:37 |
| draz|lab | kanzure: who the fuck is taking shit from your playbook? | 12:40 |
| draz|lab | and what playbook is this | 12:41 |
| draz|lab | and where can I find it | 12:41 |
| fenn | s/playbook/hnb/ | 12:42 |
| fenn | seriously though, this channel is basically formed around the idea of a giant todo list | 12:42 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: kanzure * r 493a3e563292 /doc/todo/TODO: some more fixes, various links that were requested | 12:45 |
| wrldpc2 | lolwtf | 12:46 |
| kanzure | well that was a completely useless exercise | 12:46 |
| kanzure | fenn: did you fix your mating code yet? | 12:47 |
| fenn | no, i need leibniz to do that | 12:49 |
| kanzure | ok done | 12:50 |
| kanzure | hm nevermind | 12:50 |
| fenn | "screenshot gallery generator" is what the djangit/views/3d stuff was about | 12:50 |
| kanzure | sort of | 12:50 |
| fenn | no? | 12:50 |
| kanzure | there was also the other app I made that generated screenshots from a file directory | 12:51 |
| kanzure | but it wouldn't be able to run on djangit unless the server had an X session going | 12:51 |
| fenn | oh. damn | 12:51 |
| fenn | we gotta find a way around that | 12:51 |
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| kanzure | hm the build is failing on leibniz | 12:56 |
| kanzure | might as well start from scratch | 12:56 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r c456a5256ce1 /readme: kind of a short feature list | 12:56 |
| kanzure | maybe we should be spending this time trying to come up with a fucking clue for how to do unit tests for interface mating | 12:58 |
| fenn | reminds me of that's what i'm doing | 12:58 |
| fenn | heh | 12:58 |
| kanzure | did you complete the whole "let a part have multiple transforms at once" deal so that we don't continue to overwrite Part.shapes[0] ? | 12:58 |
| fenn | sorta | 12:59 |
| kanzure | how does it (not) work? | 12:59 |
| fenn | i just stick the gp_Trsf in part.transform | 12:59 |
| kanzure | meh | 12:59 |
| kanzure | I guess there needs to be a way to ask for the interface point but also the interface point given the transform, etc. | 12:59 |
| fenn | then display BRepblahblah(part.shapes, part.transform).Shape() | 13:00 |
| fenn | the absolute location of the interface will change depending where the part is | 13:00 |
| kanzure | that's not entirely evident at the moment | 13:00 |
| kanzure | evident from the attribute names and so on, I mean | 13:00 |
| fenn | the attribute names kinda suck anyway | 13:01 |
| * fenn typed "interface1" enough times yesterday | 13:02 | |
| kanzure | so how exactly do unit tests for this sort of thing work anyway? | 13:05 |
| kanzure | do we check whether or not the cross products are correct? | 13:05 |
| kanzure | how do we check whether or not the result of the two rotations and one translation is "correct" ? | 13:07 |
| kanzure | and then we can throw in all sorts of edge cases to play around with that check | 13:07 |
| kanzure | mostly I've been doing visual confirmation but that's only because I have run out of ideas | 13:07 |
| kanzure | ping pong | 13:13 |
| kanzure | I guess we could check whether or not two interface points end up being in the correct locations after applying a transform, or something | 13:14 |
| kanzure | and then test it for all six sides of a cube, or something | 13:14 |
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| genehacker | posted that on diybio | 13:33 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 8e810d7d933e /packages/lego/grammar.yaml: now they are !lego_interface objects again | 13:35 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 997a34b8d8a4 /__init__.py: allow skdb to run without OCC | 13:35 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 1f4a28a9a48e /packages/lego/ (interfaces.py lego.py test_legos.py): clean up some bit rot | 13:35 |
| CIA-38 | skdb: fenn * r 6e7d4833769f / (doc/todo/TODO readme): Merge branch 'master' of ssh://adl.serveftp.org/var/www/skdb | 13:35 |
| fenn | yes, but testing six sides of a cube isn't much of an edge case | 13:36 |
| kanzure | there are many other possible edge cases | 13:36 |
| kanzure | involving weird geometries | 13:36 |
| kanzure | but that comes later | 13:36 |
| fenn | you need to do stuff like rotating 360 degrees and all three rotations | 13:36 |
| kanzure | checked against what? | 13:36 |
| fenn | common sense | 13:36 |
| kanzure | .. | 13:36 |
| kanzure | import common sense | 13:37 |
| fenn | i know, it's awful | 13:37 |
| kanzure | import unittest | 13:37 |
| kanzure | unittest.TestCase | 13:37 |
| kanzure | what now? | 13:37 |
| fenn | but if we had common_sense.py we wouldnt have to do anything right? | 13:37 |
| ybit | http://aperiodic.net/screen/multiuser | 14:22 |
| ybit | "screen can allow multiple users to access the same session. This can be useful for all sorts of information sharing, from helpdesk applications to extreme programming." | 14:22 |
| * ybit has always used gobby for collaborative editing | 14:22 | |
| ybit | but i like this idea of multiuser :) | 14:22 |
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| strages | I need an app that I can input information, tag it, and then it draws relationships between tagged items. Anyone got any clue what could do this? | 15:04 |
| draz|lab | sql databse | 15:04 |
| fenn | what do you mean tagged? | 15:04 |
| draz|lab | microsoft access (puke) | 15:04 |
| fenn | ugh, sql is terrible for interactive use | 15:04 |
| draz|lab | the open office version of access | 15:04 |
| kanzure | draz|lab: stfu | 15:04 |
| fenn | hey i was going to say that | 15:05 |
| strages | visually | 15:05 |
| * kanzure takes off his mind-reading cap | 15:05 | |
| strages | and I need realtime input | 15:05 |
| draz|lab | strages: lololol | 15:05 |
| draz|lab | strages: pen and paper man | 15:05 |
| kanzure | draz|lab: what part of stfu do you not understand | 15:05 |
| fenn | like flickr? | 15:05 |
| draz|lab | all of it | 15:05 |
| kanzure | strages: what do you mean "draws relationships"? | 15:05 |
| kanzure | draz|lab: it means shut the fuck up | 15:05 |
| strages | yes | 15:05 |
| strages | I want to be able to file in information, tag it at that time, and then forget about it until I come back to research something and follow the relationships | 15:06 |
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| fenn | ybit: i think multiple users trying to run the same vim session would get really confusing | 15:06 |
| kanzure | in vim, you do not have multiple cursors | 15:07 |
| kanzure | strages: ok so do you not need the graphing part of it or not? | 15:07 |
| strages | kanzure: I would like the graphing part, but following links to other notes would suffice | 15:07 |
| kanzure | ok | 15:08 |
| kanzure | sounds like a wiki to me | 15:08 |
| strages | but wikis don't work that way :/ | 15:08 |
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| kanzure | strages: what do they not do? | 15:09 |
| strages | they're hard to edit for simple note taking | 15:10 |
| kanzure | have you considered just using a flatfile wiki? | 15:10 |
| kanzure | you can edit the files with your favorite text editor | 15:10 |
| fenn | huh whatever happened to html image maps | 15:12 |
| fenn | that was the shizizzle in 1999 | 15:12 |
| kanzure | you mean the cgi clickable things? | 15:13 |
| fenn | http://www.dokuwiki.org/plugin:image_map | 15:13 |
| strages | note taking with a tag cloud or note taking with a mindmap type visualization | 15:15 |
| strages | mindmapping software sucks because it's all outlining rather than drawing relationships for you based on tags | 15:15 |
| strages | I don't think that linearly | 15:16 |
| fenn | if you dont need to circle a specific object in a photograph, i'd say just use a wiki | 15:18 |
| strages | a network diagram showing relationships between thoughts | 15:18 |
| fenn | dokuwiki supports tags with a plugin, but most can do categories out of the box | 15:18 |
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| fenn | i think you'll find that computer generated 'diagrams showing relationships' are generally awful | 15:19 |
| fenn | in my experience with graphviz at least | 15:19 |
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| fenn | huh. single molecule DNA sequencing is so simple | 15:33 |
| timschmidt__ | ybit: you there? | 15:33 |
| fenn | "a gene that has sometimes been associated with increased disagreeability" | 15:34 |
| fenn | i cant begin to imagine the legal fallout of that | 15:35 |
| fenn | asshole's-rights movement | 15:35 |
| katsmeow-afk | that's already existing, afaik : ADHD is a disability that's illegal to discriminate against (i am not agreeing, i am simply stating) | 15:49 |
| kanzure | hey I'd like to see information about that | 15:54 |
| kanzure | maybe I can sue someone | 15:54 |
| katsmeow-afk | school districts have been sued for not allowing ADHD students to attend, i am sure there's other cases | 15:55 |
| * strages points to #hackerspaces because of this | 15:57 | |
| strages | [15:42:45] <@strages> http://www.opennasa.com/2009/08/11/hackerspaces-and-nasa/ | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:44:26] <@tkrabec> Cool | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:46:36] <housetier> hackerspace on the moon... | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:49:49] <@strages> :o | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:52:49] <housetier> well we have hackerspaces on earth, we have communities trying to shoot a probe on the moon (openmoon.info) so why not shoot a reprap on the moon that will build the first hackerspace on moon | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:52:56] <housetier> a tiny one, but still | 15:57 |
| strages | [15:53:58] <@tkrabec> a reprap and some solar cells with a battery | 15:57 |
| kanzure | strages: see the google lunar x prize team, Team FREDNET | 15:57 |
| kanzure | and interplanetary ventures | 15:57 |
| kanzure | they've been thinking along those lines as well | 15:57 |
| * fenn is highly skeptical | 16:04 | |
| kanzure | as you should be | 16:06 |
| genehacker | Repraps are theoretically capable of operating in zero g | 16:07 |
| strages | http://www.opennasa.com/2009/08/11/hackerspaces-and-nasa/ | 16:08 |
| strages | oops, already posted the link | 16:08 |
| genehacker | but what good would a reprap on the moon do? | 16:09 |
| fenn | about the same as a reprap on earth | 16:09 |
| genehacker | a pave bot would be far more useful | 16:09 |
| * fenn attempts to not make any cynical comments | 16:09 | |
| kanzure | keep trying, fenn | 16:10 |
| strages | ok, so maybe not a reprap, but something along the same concept | 16:13 |
| strages | sits up there making modules out of raw material | 16:13 |
| genehacker | make what? | 16:14 |
| strages | next mission a rover with an arm(s) begins assembly and sealing | 16:14 |
| * fenn feels obligated to post link to http://www.islandone.org/MMSG/aasm/ for the lurkers | 16:14 | |
| genehacker | in that case how about a microwave lunar powder sintering robot | 16:15 |
| fenn | just use a mirror | 16:15 |
| genehacker | that'll work too | 16:16 |
| genehacker | but it'd be hard to make big structures | 16:16 |
| fenn | genehacker: microwave wavelength is like 5-50mm | 16:16 |
| genehacker | instead of building structures on the moon it'd be far better to cap and pressurize a lave tube | 16:16 |
| fenn | or just put a balloon in the tube | 16:17 |
| fenn | or both | 16:17 |
| genehacker | just need to find em' first | 16:17 |
| fenn | anyway i agree surface structures don't make sense unless they're solar power stations or railroads | 16:17 |
| genehacker | lunar railroads? | 16:18 |
| genehacker | cool | 16:18 |
| fenn | well how else are you going to ship stuff around? catapult? | 16:18 |
| genehacker | catapult | 16:18 |
| genehacker | you don't have any air | 16:18 |
| genehacker | and low gravity | 16:19 |
| fenn | sound hard on the bones | 16:19 |
| timschmidt__ | minor detail | 16:19 |
| genehacker | too bad Nasa's funding for a lunar mass driver got cut a while back | 16:19 |
| fenn | 20G morning commute is no minor detail | 16:19 |
| genehacker | oh | 16:19 |
| timschmidt__ | :) | 16:19 |
| genehacker | for people | 16:19 |
| fenn | or other delicate robots | 16:20 |
| genehacker | how about a really long one so the acceleration is 1 G and you have time to exercise | 16:20 |
| timschmidt__ | we _are_ rather delicate robots, aren't we? | 16:20 |
| fenn | would a railroad be more efficient than a catapult? i have no gut feeling on this one | 16:20 |
| genehacker | we could do that liquid breathing thing like in evangelion | 16:20 |
| genehacker | oh I know | 16:20 |
| genehacker | maglev railroad | 16:21 |
| fenn | that's the worse of both | 16:21 |
| genehacker | with high temp superconductors | 16:21 |
| kanzure | someone from the Mars Society wanted to put a railroad on the moon | 16:21 |
| kanzure | or on mars | 16:21 |
| kanzure | don't listen to me | 16:21 |
| genehacker | no air so you can go really fast | 16:21 |
| genehacker | if it wasn't for that damn dust | 16:21 |
| fenn | kanzure: around deimos, going faster than escape velocity so you have gravity | 16:22 |
| fenn | i think it's pretty silly | 16:22 |
| timschmidt__ | genehacker: unfortunately, breathing highly oxygenated fluorocarbons (like 3M's Fluoronert) collapses the avioli in the lungs, leading to traumatic death after removal of the liquid. | 16:22 |
| kanzure | lung transplants are routine these days | 16:23 |
| timschmidt__ | Fluorinert rather | 16:23 |
| genehacker | yeah, which is why you just fill the lungs up with fluid and use a blood oxygenator instead | 16:23 |
| genehacker | like alexander bolonkin suggests for using in spacesuits | 16:23 |
| fenn | just use a wireless blood electrolyzer! :P | 16:24 |
| fenn | er, and nevermind about that co2 stuff | 16:24 |
| genehacker | oh I know, nanites! | 16:24 |
| fenn | ah good old nanites | 16:24 |
| genehacker | the ones that caputre CO2 and release oxygen, but don't exist yet and could be near impossible | 16:24 |
| fenn | i think the trick is getting electricity to them | 16:25 |
| fenn | if they're nanites, you can't use microwave to transmit power | 16:25 |
| fenn | also you'd probably overheat from all the recycling going on in your blood stream | 16:26 |
| fenn | so pull a bolonkin and pretend the nanites can store an infinite amount of energy as super-AB-matter | 16:26 |
| timschmidt__ | Screw electricity. Real nanites run on Brownian motion. | 16:27 |
| fenn | timschmidt__: i suggest reading about thermodynamic equilibrium and why enzymes go forwards and backwards unless there's energy input | 16:27 |
| timschmidt__ | :) | 16:27 |
| * fenn wonders if he can manage to eat some ice cream instead of writing geometry unit tests | 16:29 | |
| fenn | in retrospect, not going to work hasn't helped this situation | 16:29 |
| kanzure | wrong thing to wonder | 16:29 |
| fenn | oh well | 16:29 |
| kanzure | I'd write them if I knew what to write | 16:30 |
| fenn | me too | 16:31 |
| fenn | the general idea is something like: a cube with one interface at 1,1,1 pointing at 2,2,2 | 16:31 |
| kanzure | have you been able to get two arrows to point at the same spot? | 16:31 |
| fenn | now rotate the cube 180 around -1,1,1 | 16:31 |
| fenn | the interface should be pointing at -2,-2,-2 | 16:32 |
| kanzure | according to what | 16:32 |
| fenn | the legos told me so | 16:32 |
| fenn | hum. anyway it's more than that isn't it | 16:33 |
| fenn | assume you have two cubes | 16:33 |
| fenn | the second cube's interface should be located at 1,1,1, but pointing at 0,0,0 | 16:33 |
| fenn | and the body of the cube at 2,2,2 | 16:33 |
| fenn | also it'd be a good idea to show the interface arrows | 16:35 |
| fenn | -1,1,1 is the cross product of 1,1,1 (i think) | 16:35 |
| kanzure | a good start would be to get the interface arrows to show even on rotated cubes | 16:35 |
| kanzure | or rotated legos, I mean | 16:35 |
| genehacker | nanothermodynamics is weird | 16:35 |
| kanzure | at the moment in pymates the arrows for some reason do not show on any transformed part | 16:35 |
| kanzure | (probably because I didn't write code that does that) | 16:35 |
| fenn | boo hiss | 16:36 |
| kanzure | they just show on the first one loaded into the system | 16:36 |
| kanzure | the reason this happens is that the arrows are drawn based off of part.interfaces | 16:36 |
| kanzure | so if the interfaces aren't transformed, then there you go | 16:36 |
| kanzure | but it shouldn't be looking at interface.point values anyway.. so it's wrong. | 16:36 |
| fenn | the interfaces shouldnt be transformed unless you transform them | 16:36 |
| * fenn looks around for his tail | 16:37 | |
| fenn | i know it's around here somewhere, but every time i turn around it's gone! | 16:37 |
| kanzure | summersault! summersault! | 16:37 |
| * fenn does a backflip and breaks his neck | 16:37 | |
| kanzure | just so everyone knows, he really did just do a backflip | 16:38 |
| kanzure | and I'm sitting here informing you of this | 16:38 |
| kanzure | instead of helping him | 16:38 |
| fenn | i swear. i didn't even spill any ice cream | 16:38 |
| kanzure | but you broke your neck? | 16:38 |
| fenn | i'm talented | 16:38 |
| kanzure | you're retarded is more like it | 16:38 |
| fenn | does that mean i get disability income | 16:39 |
| kanzure | no, you're white | 16:39 |
| genehacker | hey if your spinal cord is broken you might be able to get a neural implant | 16:39 |
| fenn | what if i biohack my skin so it's green | 16:39 |
| genehacker | otherwise chug blue food coloring | 16:39 |
| fenn | with enough chlorophyll i wouldnt need to move anyway | 16:40 |
| kanzure | you forgot surface area | 16:40 |
| kanzure | it's an important ingredient | 16:40 |
| fenn | might get kinda boring without a neural implant tho | 16:40 |
| fenn | surface area is for wimps with no mirror arrays! | 16:40 |
| genehacker | then you're cooking | 16:41 |
| fenn | not underwater i'm not | 16:41 |
| kanzure | no it's because of the chlorophyll density maximums | 16:41 |
| genehacker | yup | 16:41 |
| kanzure | why are you underwater anyway? | 16:41 |
| kanzure | weren't you writing some unit tests? | 16:41 |
| fenn | because i'm emulating that guy in some book i read | 16:41 |
| fenn | michael valentine | 16:41 |
| genehacker | what book? | 16:42 |
| fenn | the Man from Mars | 16:42 |
| genehacker | ok | 16:42 |
| genehacker | well have fun unittesting | 16:42 |
| genehacker | time to design a cover for my printable stepper | 16:42 |
| * fenn suggests a flat plate | 16:43 | |
| genehacker | it can't be | 16:43 |
| genehacker | this part mus interface with WOBBLE GENERATOR and allow AIR to pass through to WOBBLE GENERATOR. part must interface with THRUST BEARING and ROD | 16:44 |
| fenn | NO WAY! | 16:45 |
| fenn | s/WAY/WAI/ | 16:45 |
| fenn | mustn't forget our manners | 16:45 |
| kanzure | there are many possible paths, but only one wai | 16:46 |
| fenn | the kawaii wai? | 16:46 |
| genehacker | is wai most optimal | 16:47 |
| fenn | http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t83/llammy/kawaii.jpg | 16:47 |
| genehacker | well at least the conversation hasn't devolved to anime | 16:49 |
| fenn | too late, mister evangelion | 16:49 |
| genehacker | is there a standard m8 washer size? | 16:51 |
| fenn | do i really have to use numpy to do 3d cross product? | 16:51 |
| fenn | (not including pythonOCC) | 16:51 |
| kanzure | don't write your own | 16:51 |
| fenn | it just seems like something that ought to be in "math" | 16:52 |
| genehacker | it's not fun writing one's own cross product function | 16:52 |
| fenn | math.cross((1,2,3), (4,5,6)) | 16:52 |
| fenn | i mean they have hypot() fer cheese sauce | 16:52 |
| fenn | you know the interface vectors should probably have some value of units associated | 16:54 |
| fenn | at least interface.point | 16:54 |
| kanzure | that's fine | 16:55 |
| kanzure | part of the problem with CAD kernels that I have *never* figured out is that all of their numbers are unitless | 16:55 |
| kanzure | so I have absolutely no idea how big an object is supposedly being modeled as | 16:55 |
| kanzure | and it's only at the last minute do you get to do dimensioning or something | 16:56 |
| fenn | not sure about that | 16:56 |
| kanzure | well consider OCC.gp.gp_Pnt | 16:56 |
| fenn | the lego step models are in mm | 16:56 |
| kanzure | you have absolutely no idea how distance two points are from one another | 16:56 |
| kanzure | how do you know? | 16:56 |
| genehacker | python math pack = numpy? | 16:56 |
| fenn | i think i saw it in the file somewhere | 16:56 |
| kanzure | genehacker: no, numpy is an extra mathematics package | 16:56 |
| kanzure | genehacker: python comes with its own math module | 16:56 |
| genehacker | that's what I meant | 16:56 |
| fenn | numpy is for matrix math (and statistics?) | 16:58 |
| fenn | Fast mathematical operations over arrays, Linear Algebra, Fourier Transforms, Random Number Generation | 16:59 |
| genehacker | understood | 16:59 |
| fenn | i think you can apply a python function to an array and it'll do some magic to make it super fast | 16:59 |
| fenn | hmmm | 17:01 |
| fenn | __init__(self, float_conv=<type 'float'>, int_conv=<type 'int'> | 17:01 |
| fenn | i wonder if that's generalizable | 17:01 |
| fenn | nope | 17:02 |
| ybit | timschmidt__: i am now | 17:09 |
| * ybit was away treading through the storm for food | 17:10 | |
| ybit | fenn, i've yet to run the code on this computer, but i read somewhere that emacs has a multiuser session mode. i imagine you all have your own buffer? | 17:11 |
| ybit | though, org-mode and git should suit collaborative efforts in text just fine most of the time | 17:11 |
| ybit | timschmidt__: you run? | 17:11 |
| ybit | rung* | 17:11 |
| kanzure | it's what aresnick uses | 17:11 |
| ybit | link to his repo? | 17:12 |
| kanzure | http://github.com/aresnick | 17:13 |
| fenn | ybit: not everybody uses emacs | 17:14 |
| fenn | ybit: i tried it once and suffered greatly | 17:15 |
| fenn | i spent about 2 weeks using it and never got comfortable | 17:15 |
| ybit | mentally or physically through emacs pinky? | 17:15 |
| fenn | mentally | 17:15 |
| fenn | it could have been the lisp i was imbibing at the same time | 17:16 |
| kanzure | nah, no way | 17:16 |
| * kanzure twitches | 17:16 | |
| fenn | it's powerfull stuff :{ | 17:16 |
| kanzure | is that a smileyface stuffing ice cream into his face? | 17:17 |
| fenn | ybit: what i really want is a way to lean over someone's shoulder and type on their screen without getting in the way | 17:17 |
| fenn | that's a guy with a mustache, he's not smiling. | 17:17 |
| fenn | bah apparently 'contig' can mean any of possible definitions | 17:23 |
| ybit | what are some ultimate goals of h+? | 17:25 |
| kanzure | the organization? | 17:25 |
| fenn | OBJECTION that might be classified as philosophy | 17:25 |
| kanzure | OBJECTION OVER-RULED | 17:25 |
| kanzure | I will not have your flibbery-babbery in my court room, Mr. Fenn. | 17:25 |
| fenn | h+ seeks to dominate and enslave legalist jurisprudence in any and all domains | 17:26 |
| ybit | well, i'm thinking, (er.. well trying to think with this throbbing headache) about how to best organize hackerspaces.. | 17:26 |
| genehacker | http://www.aeropause.com/wordpress/archives/images/2008/07/pw-objection.gif | 17:26 |
| kanzure | the trick is to let them organize themselves | 17:26 |
| ybit | flibbery-babbery :P | 17:26 |
| kanzure | but provide some really really kickass models for them to build off of | 17:26 |
| ybit | let's see... | 17:26 |
| genehacker | H+ seeks to transform humanity and culture by upgrading humanity | 17:27 |
| fenn | oh geez did you read that on the website or what? | 17:27 |
| fenn | the REAL purpose of H+ is... | 17:28 |
| ybit | so how to upgrade humanity, that's what i'm after... | 17:28 |
| kanzure | what the fuck | 17:28 |
| kanzure | ybit: no, let's not upgrade humanity | 17:28 |
| kanzure | if some random joe wants to "upgrade" himself, let him | 17:28 |
| genehacker | well I sorta grabed words out of my head | 17:28 |
| kanzure | they are bad words | 17:28 |
| fenn | genehacker: bad meme, bad! | 17:28 |
| kanzure | the actual purpose of transhumanism is to provide support to transhumans or transhuman-wannabes | 17:29 |
| fenn | you know, if you turn H+ on its side it looks like a mishmash of "old" and "engineering" in japanese | 17:29 |
| fenn | oops, "ground" not "old" | 17:33 |
| fenn | http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/工 http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/土 | 17:34 |
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| genehacker | your link isn't working | 17:37 |
| fenn | your irc client isn't working | 17:37 |
| genehacker | wtf? | 17:39 |
| genehacker | I can't copy that | 17:39 |
| genehacker | http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/土 | 17:41 |
| genehacker | now that's weird | 17:41 |
| QuantumG | works for me | 17:42 |
| ybit | http://airto.hosted.ats.ucla.edu/wiki/index.php/Main_Page | 17:42 |
| ybit | "This is the new home for the BrainMapping.org Wiki" | 17:43 |
| kanzure | fenn is there any trick to getting virtualhosts working on apache? | 17:43 |
| kanzure | it thinks my document root is / | 17:43 |
| fenn | look at adl | 17:43 |
| fenn | i think i did a fairly clean setup | 17:43 |
| genehacker | it says dirt not engineering | 17:44 |
| fenn | there are two links | 17:44 |
| kanzure | links? | 17:44 |
| fenn | (@ genehacker) | 17:44 |
| kanzure | blah | 17:44 |
| kanzure | well I've been running off of your fennetic.net example | 17:44 |
| kanzure | ok it works | 17:45 |
| kanzure | yay | 17:45 |
| fenn | did you have to turn on NameVirtualHost in the main config? | 17:45 |
| kanzure | no, I forgot to throw it into sites-enabled, and even once I did that, I forgot to restart apache (because I had just restarted it a second ago) | 17:46 |
| kanzure | anywho | 17:46 |
| kanzure | I've been working on something called "protocola" | 17:46 |
| kanzure | http://protocola.org/ | 17:46 |
| kanzure | it's a django app for collaborative unfucking of protocols | 17:46 |
| fenn | 'secret ingredients: bog water and chocolate syrup' | 17:46 |
| kanzure | haven't ported the django app yet | 17:47 |
| fenn | but you don't know the ratio! | 17:47 |
| kanzure | basically the idea is to show the user a protocol, | 17:47 |
| kanzure | and then text fields below each numbered step | 17:47 |
| kanzure | upon entering in information, the site will yell at you if you get the syntax wrong or something | 17:47 |
| kanzure | the idea is that over time the protocols will be completely converted and verified | 17:48 |
| fenn | i'm so going to pronounce that wrong every chance i get | 17:48 |
| kanzure | hm? | 17:48 |
| kanzure | how do you pronounce it? | 17:48 |
| fenn | "proto cola" | 17:48 |
| kanzure | that's not the same as protocola? | 17:48 |
| fenn | like cocoa cola | 17:48 |
| kanzure | just say it as if you're drunk | 17:49 |
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| ybit | git clone git://gitorious.org/todo-org/todo-org.git | 18:00 |
| ybit | so that's the todo.org that needs a lot of fixing | 18:00 |
| ybit | ultimate goals blank | 18:01 |
| kanzure | meta todo rot | 18:01 |
| ybit | meh | 18:01 |
| kanzure | bah, shave chest | 18:02 |
| kanzure | :( | 18:02 |
| ybit | lol! | 18:02 |
| ybit | no way haha | 18:02 |
| genehacker | NaOH should do the job quite well | 18:02 |
| ybit | :P | 18:02 |
| ybit | er, that was the personal todo.org -_- | 18:04 |
| fenn | neato: "pyjamas contains a stand-alone Python-to-Javascript compiler, an AJAX Framework and Widget set, and through use of these components, developers can write comprehensive applications, to run in all major web browsers, without writing a single line of javascript." | 18:07 |
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| fenn | The widget set library [5] that comes with Pyjamas is so similar to PyQt and PyGTK that a port of Pyjamas was made to run Pyjamas applications on the desktop, called Pyjamas-Desktop | 18:12 |
| kanzure | nice | 18:13 |
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| ybit | git clone git://gitorious.org/diyhplus/diyhplus_org.git | 18:23 |
| kanzure | MEAs aren't the end of the story, ybit | 18:24 |
| kanzure | also I'm having trouble figuring out what the organization is to that file | 18:24 |
| ybit | it needs some fixing definitely | 18:25 |
| ybit | and no it isn't the ultimate goal, that's still from the personal todo.org | 18:26 |
| ybit | i just wanted to put something out there, and edit as i get time | 18:26 |
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| ybit | related book, related papers, related links should go with the individual listing of hardware and software projects | 18:27 |
| ybit | isn't a transhuman some form of an upgraded human? | 18:32 |
| ybit | ""17:25 < kanzure> the actual purpose of transhumanism is to provide support to transhumans or transhuman-wannabes"" do you mean "the actual purpose of humanity plus and transhuman wannabes is to..." | 18:33 |
| kanzure | no | 18:38 |
| kanzure | a transhuman is an "upgraded" or "augmented" human, yes | 18:38 |
| timschmidt__ | ybit: hi | 19:14 |
| ybit | hi there | 19:15 |
| timschmidt__ | howdy | 19:16 |
| timschmidt__ | an update for you: http://builders.reprap.org/2009/08/wrench-built-machine-update.html | 19:16 |
| * ybit tips his hat to timschmidt__ | 19:17 | |
| timschmidt__ | We've made a lot of changes to the Z stage since then, I'll get photos asap (which might not be for another week or so) | 19:17 |
| timschmidt__ | but basically, we made the Z stage look and work a lot more like the X and Y stages. | 19:18 |
| timschmidt__ | keep in mind that every angle on the machine is three-way braced, and bolted tight, so it's all square relative to itself. | 19:20 |
| any04225226 | hmm, http://www2.sandbox.google.com/ has about the same results as http://www.google.com/ , but it's 3x faster | 19:24 |
| ybit | timschmidt__: thanks for the updates, keep them coming please | 19:24 |
| timschmidt__ | Will do. When 'done' we plan on taking pictures, dis-assembling, and documenting the build step-by-step. | 19:25 |
| ybit | nice :) | 19:25 |
| timschmidt__ | then it's up to you to build one | 19:25 |
| ybit | :) | 19:26 |
| timschmidt__ | We've still only used a wrench and a hacksaw. There was some debate about the use of JB Weld, but I classify that as 'material', not 'tool'. | 19:27 |
| timschmidt__ | Use of a file to clean the edges of the cut beams is optional, but recommended for safety. | 19:28 |
| kanzure | any04225226: how'd you find that? | 19:44 |
| ybit | wow, that is fast | 19:44 |
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| fenn | ybit: is that all proper org mode syntax? | 19:53 |
| fenn | i dont understand why there's TODO in some places and not in other, or why ***'s in some but foo: bar in other | 19:54 |
| fenn | and why not put your root goals at the root of the tree? | 19:54 |
| fenn | some day i'll write a program that takes nodes with dependencies and builds a tree from them | 19:56 |
| * fenn tosses that dream on the burn pile | 19:56 | |
| fenn | and you spelled toothebrush wrong | 19:59 |
| kanzure | alabamians have no teeth anyway | 20:00 |
| fenn | fwiw todo lists should have verbs in every entry | 20:00 |
| kanzure | yes | 20:00 |
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| fenn | hmm. should lego interface units be in N or N/m^2? | 20:03 |
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| fenn | i guess N | 20:04 |
| kanzure | we wrote that down somewhere | 20:05 |
| fenn | the problem is i'm trying to pretend "face" is a lego feture | 20:05 |
| fenn | but it's really not | 20:05 |
| genehacker | pascals | 20:05 |
| genehacker | I guess newtons | 20:06 |
| kanzure | huh I get 26,300 search results for 'kanzure' these days? | 20:11 |
| kanzure | how did that happen | 20:11 |
| fenn | gosh if only i had a measuring lab, i'd be able to figure out how much shear a lego stud can take | 20:13 |
| * fenn reflects on the fact that his internal representation of mass is in blocks of cheese | 20:17 | |
| kanzure | and the units of gravity is in terms of gravy spoonfuls? | 20:19 |
| fenn | gravitons | 20:20 |
| kanzure | crutons? | 20:21 |
| fenn | i suppose gravy is a mixture of anti-croutons and something else.. dark matter perhaps? | 20:23 |
| kanzure | dark cheese | 20:23 |
| * fenn punishes himself for making such terrible jokes | 20:23 | |
| kanzure | maybe more physicists should just wake up and smell the gravytons | 20:23 |
| kanzure | thinking about it in terms of food makes it much more easy to solve | 20:24 |
| fenn | i guess that would be the "edible stance" | 20:25 |
| kanzure | The Sauce of the Cosmos | 20:25 |
| fenn | cheese sauce crust | 20:25 |
| ybit | i'm running into problem organizing these projects, and that is how to show how individual topics relate to other topics of interest | 20:31 |
| fenn | yep | 20:31 |
| fenn | it's actually a directed graph, not a tree | 20:32 |
| fenn | you can sort-of get away with pointers in yaml | 20:32 |
| fenn | see trans-tech.yaml in skdb | 20:32 |
| kanzure | or human_brain.yaml in brain | 20:33 |
| fenn | it's all backwards/inside out (trans-tech) | 20:33 |
| fenn | should just redo that file | 20:34 |
| fenn | must.. procrastinate.. | 20:34 |
| fenn | i wish there were a better word for "unit" | 20:48 |
| fenn | "unit test" is taken, "unit vector" is taken, and i dont even know what to call the combined expression of number and unit (or is it the other way around?) | 20:49 |
| kanzure | unit magnitude? | 20:50 |
| fenn | what's the not-magnitude part | 20:50 |
| kanzure | maybe "parametric unit expression" | 20:50 |
| kanzure | the non magnitude part is the unit | 20:50 |
| fenn | what's the number and unit together? | 20:50 |
| kanzure | unit magnitude | 20:50 |
| fenn | no | 20:50 |
| kanzure | no? | 20:50 |
| fenn | the magnitude is the number | 20:50 |
| kanzure | okay? | 20:51 |
| fenn | think of it like a vector | 20:51 |
| kanzure | sure | 20:51 |
| fenn | each base unit is a dimension | 20:51 |
| fenn | ok crappy analogy | 20:51 |
| fenn | or is it... | 20:52 |
| fenn | 0.5V * 2A yields 1V*A | 20:52 |
| fenn | but it's not the same thing as 2V * 0.5A | 20:52 |
| kanzure | why not? | 20:52 |
| fenn | the voltage is different | 20:53 |
| kanzure | so are the amps | 20:53 |
| fenn | right | 20:53 |
| fenn | here's a little secret | 20:53 |
| kanzure | so what? you just say what you have | 20:53 |
| fenn | every time you convert units, you're losing information | 20:53 |
| kanzure | that's only because your conversion method sucks in units.py | 20:53 |
| fenn | no, this is theoretical | 20:54 |
| kanzure | you could keep the original unit expression | 20:54 |
| fenn | eventually all units equal 1 | 20:54 |
| kanzure | and pass it along and a chain or list accumulates | 20:54 |
| fenn | i do, but there's no way to make use of it atm | 20:54 |
| fenn | anyway you still can access the original variable that said how many volts your jigger was charged up at | 20:55 |
| kanzure | skdb-get install jigger | 20:56 |
| kanzure | error: no package 'jigger' found | 20:56 |
| kanzure | :p | 20:56 |
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| fenn | kanzure: do you have a working heekscad somewhere? | 21:09 |
| fenn | anyway i just want a 2x2x2 cube centered at 0,0,0 | 21:10 |
| kanzure | it's in /home/bryan/manufacturing/heekscad/ or something | 21:14 |
| fenn | doesn't want to compile.. nevermind i'll get along | 21:15 |
| fenn | without it* | 21:15 |
| ybit | sci-pirate tech: | 21:16 |
| ybit | ? | 21:16 |
| ybit | myostatin inhibitors: &myostatin-inhibitors | 21:16 |
| kanzure | ybit: &myostatin-inhibitors lets "*myostatin-inhibitors" work as a pointer elsewhere in the file | 21:17 |
| fenn | ybit: for stealing papers | 21:17 |
| ybit | that's what i was about to say until my aunt came in here and told me to get some rest | 21:17 |
| ybit | it's a tag | 21:18 |
| ybit | /fenn snarls | 21:18 |
| ybit | /kanzure kicks | 21:18 |
| fenn | /ybit barks like an insane loon | 21:19 |
| * kanzure kicks | 21:19 | |
| ybit | :P | 21:19 |
| * fenn snarls | 21:20 | |
| ybit | .org probably isn't the best file for sharing with a mass audience | 21:20 |
| ybit | file +format | 21:20 |
| ybit | but man it's so convenient | 21:21 |
| kanzure | was there a gundam where the pilots were standing up? | 21:21 |
| fenn | no | 21:21 |
| kanzure | then what am I thinking of? | 21:22 |
| fenn | obviously an airplane throttle is sufficient to control a multi-limbed flying robot | 21:22 |
| * ybit isn't finding specs on yaml pointers | 21:22 | |
| fenn | shirow's exoskeletons were <insert fancy word here that means when you move your arm/leg the robot moves its arm/leg> | 21:22 |
| ybit | http://yaml.org/spec/10dec2001.html#trans-ptr is missing | 21:23 |
| fenn | you said you never saw appleseed so that can't be it | 21:23 |
| kanzure | one day I will figure out which gundam I grew up with | 21:24 |
| kanzure | there's apparently no way to search for old tv guides | 21:24 |
| fenn | power rangers? | 21:24 |
| ybit | they sat down | 21:24 |
| kanzure | hahah | 21:24 |
| fenn | i wonder if their mecha had toilets built in | 21:25 |
| fenn | ffs if they're going to do CG anime at least draw the eyes by hand | 21:25 |
| kanzure | maybe it was gundam seed | 21:26 |
| genehacker | meteor shower tonight | 21:26 |
| kanzure | possibly g gundam | 21:26 |
| genehacker | heh | 21:26 |
| kanzure | ah yeah that was it | 21:27 |
| genehacker | I think there was | 21:27 |
| genehacker | oops | 21:27 |
| kanzure | that was the one that toonami played before they went lame | 21:27 |
| kanzure | and started playing SD gundam | 21:27 |
| kanzure | what the *fuck* _was_ that? | 21:27 |
| genehacker | I don't know | 21:27 |
| kanzure | seriously though | 21:27 |
| kanzure | http://www.freewebs.com/chaostheroyalknight/5d_021_sd_gundam.jpg | 21:27 |
| genehacker | http://www.space.com/spacewatch/090811-perseid-meteor-shower.html | 21:28 |
| fenn | compare and contrast: http://mayafreaksblog.files.wordpress.com/2008/02/appleseed-1.jpg http://www.razorfine.com/images/uploads/Appleseed_Caps.jpg | 21:28 |
| fenn | looks like a god damn doll | 21:29 |
| kanzure | that was the entire show | 21:29 |
| kanzure | luckily that was not my intro to gundam | 21:29 |
| fenn | (was talking about deunan but whatever, SD sucks too) | 21:29 |
| genehacker | fenn is it on wheels? | 21:29 |
| kanzure | here we go .. this is engrained in my memory: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DlhtVgB7QuY | 21:30 |
| genehacker | added airfoils would allowed a wheeled-bipedal mecha to go faster | 21:30 |
| genehacker | lasers around the earth? | 21:31 |
| ybit | guess ya want be able to make artificial heart/blood/power supply for body and parts if ya haven't mastered the sci of taking digitizing that brain of yours | 21:31 |
| ybit | won't* | 21:32 |
| ybit | -taking | 21:32 |
| genehacker | uh | 21:32 |
| genehacker | not really | 21:32 |
| genehacker | don't artificial hearts already exist? | 21:33 |
| * ybit wonders what type of power supply a digital brain might use | 21:33 | |
| ybit | genehacker: yeah.. i wasn't really referring to that though | 21:34 |
| genehacker | uninterruptable nuclear fusion power supply | 21:34 |
| ybit | brain parts... | 21:35 |
| genehacker | or mains power and 20 back up generators | 21:35 |
| timschmidt__ | or just backed-up non-volatile storage | 21:36 |
| timschmidt__ | version control for brains would be interesting, possibly scary | 21:36 |
| * ybit clones git://github.com/kanzure/brain.git | 21:36 | |
| timschmidt__ | ha! | 21:37 |
| ybit | it is a real repo just in case you didn't know :) | 21:38 |
| timschmidt__ | leave it to us sysadmins to figure out how to safely store everyone else's brains... sheesh | 21:38 |
| timschmidt__ | interesting thought... when brains are digital, psychologist / doctor == programmer? | 21:39 |
| fenn | as usual the conversation has progressed beyond gundam cockpits by the time i find the link | 21:40 |
| timschmidt__ | :) | 21:40 |
| genehacker | sentience is a process timschmidt | 21:41 |
| genehacker | that's why a chat bot isn't sentient | 21:41 |
| fenn | kanzure: http://fennetic.net/irc/guges/ | 21:41 |
| timschmidt__ | genehacker: and? | 21:41 |
| fenn | hmm i have higher res labeled version of those somewhere | 21:42 |
| genehacker | chatbots don't continously carry out a thinking process other than what words to choose next | 21:44 |
| timschmidt__ | genehacker: I never said they did | 21:44 |
| kanzure | hah. | 21:46 |
| kanzure | http://www.brickshelf.com/gallery/NickGreat/CustomFigs/frieza.jpg | 21:46 |
| genehacker | pausing simulation of a brain interrupt sentience | 21:46 |
| genehacker | oh wait | 21:46 |
| kanzure | timschmidt__: aren't you the sysadmin of your brain? | 21:47 |
| fenn | not at all | 21:47 |
| timschmidt__ | genehacker: yep, it would. And the experience might be quite jarring. | 21:47 |
| kanzure | fenn: ? | 21:47 |
| fenn | brain runs autonomously | 21:47 |
| kanzure | so? | 21:47 |
| kanzure | so does your box | 21:47 |
| fenn | if the box breaks, i fix it | 21:48 |
| fenn | if my brain breaks, what? | 21:48 |
| kanzure | if your brain breaks, you should fix it | 21:48 |
| fenn | how do i do that :( | 21:48 |
| kanzure | well it's not magic | 21:48 |
| timschmidt__ | especially with a broken brain | 21:48 |
| fenn | srsly | 21:48 |
| kanzure | timschmidt__: well that's where tools come in handy | 21:48 |
| timschmidt__ | a working brain comes in handy for, you know, fixing things. | 21:48 |
| genehacker | how about a second brain for fixing the other one if something goes wrong | 21:49 |
| kanzure | a sysadmin doesn't wait for the last minute to realize everything is fucked up | 21:49 |
| kanzure | (maybe that's because he already knows the system is fucked) | 21:49 |
| timschmidt__ | nah, just reboot and choose 'last known good configuration'. And if that doesn't work, Safe Mode. What could go wrong? | 21:50 |
| kanzure | I wonder if you're being serious | 21:50 |
| timschmidt__ | not at all | 21:50 |
| kanzure | okay | 21:50 |
| fenn | my brain doesn't run on Windows, thank you very much | 21:50 |
| kanzure | is it POSIX compatable with the T101? | 21:50 |
| fenn | actually the T101 runs plan 9 | 21:50 |
| genehacker | guys I once dreamed a windows 98 screensaver, what does that mean? | 21:52 |
| fenn | you had a virus | 21:52 |
| kanzure | that's not in freud's books :( | 21:52 |
| kanzure | it's listed as "SEE OTHER" | 21:52 |
| fenn | was it the pipes? | 21:53 |
| kanzure | oh no, not the pipes | 21:53 |
| kanzure | that's the worst sign of them all | 21:53 |
| genehacker | no | 21:53 |
| fenn | how could it not be the pipes?! | 21:53 |
| genehacker | it was that mouse one | 21:53 |
| fenn | link | 21:53 |
| genehacker | you don't remember mouse maze? | 21:53 |
| kanzure | how is it that 10 lines of code has been able to supercede the entire ADL by about three decades | 21:53 |
| genehacker | what? | 21:54 |
| fenn | genehacker: this? http://www.plentyofsoft.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/07/58724.gif | 21:54 |
| genehacker | something like that | 21:55 |
| genehacker | except with less quality and the maze inverted periodically | 21:55 |
| genehacker | it was made to look like an AWESOME GRAPHICS videogame at the time | 21:56 |
| genehacker | there were also weirder brick walls | 21:56 |
| ybit | hrm. 88.80.7.248 - - [11/Aug/2009:19:58:50 -0500] "GET http://spam-chaos.com/pp/set-cookie.php HTTP/1.1" 404 346 "-" "-" "-" | 22:08 |
| ybit | anyone had such a service come at your server? | 22:08 |
| * ybit remembers the maze | 22:12 | |
| ybit | ..screensaver | 22:12 |
| ybit | "give'm the pipes" seems like it should be a saying for a futurama parod of the clamps bot | 22:12 |
| ybit | parody | 22:13 |
| * ybit is grepping logs... for the sleep.yaml... | 22:13 | |
| * ybit is curious how much away-time from the computer you two roomies recieve | 22:13 | |
| ybit | er, that would be kanzure and fenn | 22:15 |
| ybit | since you are constantly committing | 22:15 |
| fenn | away time? what is that? | 22:17 |
| genehacker | I certainly could use a bender right now ybit | 22:18 |
| genehacker | or maybe a tubing coiler | 22:18 |
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| draz|lab | kanzure: I see there was no response to our messages on taht thread | 23:13 |
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