| --- Day changed Thu Oct 29 2009 | ||
| -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-51-133.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] | 00:46 | |
| Phreedom | kanzure, ybit: pong | 00:47 |
|---|---|---|
| Phreedom | I tend to think that there must be a separate knowledge db/ apt-get like project, released under gpl-like license | 00:48 |
| Phreedom | the project would consist of heavily parametrized blueprints of stuff and a piece of software to calculate the parameters eg pick suitable materials | 00:49 |
| Phreedom | among these parameters would be price and time | 00:50 |
| Phreedom | also you can expect some packages to be(temporarily) closed-source, like electronic parts | 00:50 |
| Phreedom | this means that your software engine will sometimes decide that buying some part is the only way or the preferred way to build something | 00:51 |
| Phreedom | and here the commercial stuff gets its way until we build a molecular assembler | 00:51 |
| Phreedom | as a consequence some companies will offer their repositories of closed parts and cost/time estimation code for your hw apt-get to use | 00:53 |
| Phreedom | all this really follows deb's model: multiple repositories, package priorities, different licences... | 00:54 |
| Phreedom | this implies that there will be multiple commercial hw companies | 00:55 |
| Phreedom | if you offer skdb or anything under non-free license, nobody will care. if you do and place artifical limits, its are forked as soon as its useful | 00:55 |
| Phreedom | -are | 00:56 |
| Phreedom | I was under impression that skdb was in early pre-alpha stage at best, so only the name of the database project is up to discussion | 00:56 |
| Phreedom | and I thought that giving your project a nice name like omnifab is so much better than dfhk, or skdb or whatever :P | 00:58 |
| Phreedom | really I wasn't prepared to discuss anything commercial | 00:58 |
| Phreedom | the reasons are: skdb still doesn't exist so there's nothing to commercialize; there will be multiple and independent commercial manufacturers/part suppliers | 01:01 |
| Phreedom | when tiem comes and skbd gets closer to being useful, you can start such a company and do it before anyone else does, right | 01:01 |
| Phreedom | but I don't think you are discussing something like this now? | 01:02 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-47-152.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 01:33 | |
| fenn | Phreedom: that is 100% exactly what skdb was always about (all this commercialization bullshit is new) | 01:38 |
| genehacker | whoa | 01:39 |
| genehacker | I missed what phreedom said | 01:39 |
| ybit | genehacker: ? | 01:39 |
| fenn | Phreedom: i have no idea why it's being discussed now, before we even have a useful system | 01:39 |
| ybit | i PMd you | 01:40 |
| ybit | genehacker ^ | 01:40 |
| ybit | i'm just getting a name to work with on the site, that's why | 01:40 |
| genehacker | ok got it | 01:40 |
| fenn | can't we just call it kitapalooza or some crap | 01:40 |
| fenn | then shut up and get back to work | 01:40 |
| fenn | wasn't this the reason to get a marketing guy in the first place | 01:42 |
| genehacker | fuck this marketing stuff | 01:42 |
| genehacker | just get something that works | 01:43 |
| fenn | thank you | 01:43 |
| fenn | "If you’re 90 percent non-bogus and ten percent bogus, and you work with someone else who’s 90 percent non-bogus, you end up with a team that’s 81 percent non-bogus." | 01:43 |
| genehacker | also I really wish I had more time to make .yaml's | 01:44 |
| Phreedom | fenn: my point was that I thought I had come up with a nice name for the db and I didn't mind it being using for this. No contracts need to be signed, no strings attached since it's an open and free project | 01:44 |
| fenn | ok | 01:45 |
| ybit | 01:40 < fenn> can't we just call it kitapalooza or some crap | 01:45 |
| ybit | works for me | 01:45 |
| genehacker | also how useful a process would cylindrical upsetting be? | 01:45 |
| ybit | oh and the part of 01:40 < fenn> then shut up and get back to work | 01:45 |
| genehacker | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Upset_forging#Upset_forging | 01:46 |
| genehacker | IE taking a cylinder and smashing it into a less tall and wider cylinder | 01:46 |
| genehacker | or doing the same to part of a cylinder | 01:47 |
| fenn | cold heading is used for 99% of screws and bolts | 01:47 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: I see you like very DIY-friendly technologies;) | 01:47 |
| genehacker | ok then | 01:47 |
| genehacker | sure I do | 01:48 |
| genehacker | but I'm starting to think some things are impossible to diy | 01:49 |
| genehacker | reasonably | 01:49 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: *ATM ;) | 01:50 |
| genehacker | not just at the moment | 01:50 |
| Phreedom | and no you don't have to DIY everything. using nvidia proprietary drivers on linux is so much better than running M$ crap | 01:50 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: you don't believe in the molecular assembly dairy tale? | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | *fairy | 01:51 |
| genehacker | are you going to have a 5000 ton press in your backyard | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | grr | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | you better believe in it. you can then start a religion and get a tax-free status | 01:51 |
| genehacker | well, I took a look at it | 01:51 |
| genehacker | it looks like it could work | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | it will work someday | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | and 5000 ton press isn't that huge | 01:51 |
| Phreedom | also you foget about community ownership options | 01:52 |
| Phreedom | even if you need such a press you don't need it everyday | 01:52 |
| genehacker | anyway currently only the process for making diamond has been worked out | 01:52 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: africans have been making diamonds for ages | 01:53 |
| Phreedom | with hammers and axes :) | 01:53 |
| genehacker | I'm doubtful if some of those cool nanobearings are buildable | 01:53 |
| Phreedom | I\'m even doubtful they are needed | 01:53 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: the largest obstacle to DIY things is electronics | 01:53 |
| genehacker | but my problem is with bootstrapping the damn thing | 01:53 |
| genehacker | electronics? | 01:54 |
| Phreedom | ICs | 01:54 |
| genehacker | pah chips are cheap | 01:54 |
| Phreedom | and closed | 01:54 |
| genehacker | plus how'd you make them? | 01:54 |
| genehacker | I guess we could use E-beam litho | 01:54 |
| Phreedom | single-electron transistors made from graphene. you know what you use to assemble this :) | 01:55 |
| genehacker | but then again stuff like that is crazy high vacuum where you worry about helium leaking i | 01:55 |
| fenn | i hope nanoscale self-assembled circuits work goodenough in 10 years | 01:55 |
| genehacker | hmmm... | 01:55 |
| genehacker | well there's also this: | 01:55 |
| genehacker | http://nextbigfuture.com/ | 01:55 |
| fenn | you'll probably be bitching about where to get gold nanodots then | 01:55 |
| genehacker | yeast coated in glass | 01:56 |
| genehacker | made at room temperature | 01:56 |
| Phreedom | either way this is wankery | 01:56 |
| Phreedom | lets do something that's useful and can be done right now | 01:56 |
| fenn | genehacker: that is so not impressive | 01:56 |
| genehacker | why not use copper reducing proteins to make electronics | 01:56 |
| genehacker | it's yeast covered in glass! | 01:56 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: don't ask me. I don't know what you are talking ;) | 01:56 |
| genehacker | yeah it is | 01:57 |
| genehacker | ok | 01:57 |
| Phreedom | *talking about | 01:57 |
| genehacker | you know there may not even be a need for 5000 ton presses and whatnot if you have different materials | 01:57 |
| Phreedom | most of the time you can work around these complex industrial processes | 01:58 |
| Phreedom | it might be slower, more expensive but who cares? | 01:59 |
| Phreedom | you can save on lawyers and secretaries to compensate for this | 01:59 |
| Phreedom | industry often has 10 specialized processes instead of 1 generic because it's cheaper at their scales. it doesn't mean we have to mirror them | 02:00 |
| genehacker | there are certain processes that are the only reasonable what to make things | 02:01 |
| Phreedom | while it's absolutely ok to do e-beam litho using your STM, it's totally unacceptable to the industry | 02:01 |
| Phreedom | not that many and really is it a big deal if commercial enterprises will still manufacture 5% of what you consume? ;) | 02:01 |
| genehacker | for example in order to make light sheet metal car parts you have to use metal that has been strain hardened | 02:02 |
| Phreedom | or you can instead build your car with different materials like carbon fiber coposite | 02:03 |
| fenn | sheet metal car parts | 02:03 |
| fenn | are you joking? | 02:03 |
| genehacker | yes fenn sheet metal | 02:03 |
| fenn | it's 2009 | 02:03 |
| Phreedom | or yeah just make it out of shit metal instead. it will be weaker, but you can repair it at home :) | 02:04 |
| genehacker | metal sheet forming makes complex parts | 02:04 |
| genehacker | for cheap | 02:04 |
| genehacker | on carbon fiber | 02:04 |
| fenn | i could think of about 90 other processes that have a superior end product and are 100x more DIY-friendly | 02:04 |
| genehacker | for making certain carbon fiber things you have to press em' really hard with a heated press | 02:05 |
| genehacker | as I learned yesterday | 02:05 |
| fenn | why is that? | 02:05 |
| Phreedom | we really should concentrate on doing the most with the least effort. not doing everything. and then try harder things | 02:05 |
| fenn | yeah 80/20 principle | 02:05 |
| genehacker | but then again I guess you could use prepreg or something | 02:05 |
| Phreedom | you can expect that a DIY movement that can do 50% of stuff at home to greatly influence manufacturing ;) | 02:06 |
| genehacker | you know a reprap capable of integrating fibers into parts would sorta moot the whole press issue or something | 02:06 |
| Phreedom | not reprap but yeah, why not weave the fiber in place, coating it with epoxy on the go? | 02:06 |
| genehacker | yeah | 02:07 |
| genehacker | that is what I'm saying | 02:07 |
| genehacker | dammit, why does carbon fiber have to be so expensive | 02:07 |
| fenn | maybe you should switch to e-glass | 02:07 |
| genehacker | what's that? | 02:07 |
| fenn | or s-glass or whatever | 02:07 |
| fenn | or even basalt fiber | 02:08 |
| genehacker | how about we modify that one glass sponge | 02:08 |
| fenn | carbon fiber is for weenie engineering students who don't do any independent research | 02:08 |
| genehacker | did you do any? | 02:08 |
| fenn | ffs just google 'basalt fiber' | 02:09 |
| Phreedom | glass fibers are nice too and cheap | 02:09 |
| genehacker | I know what basalt fiber is, and it's certainly an option | 02:09 |
| fenn | the only reason carbon is expensive is the unpredictable nature of the military market | 02:09 |
| Phreedom | although most of the cost of fiber composites comes from manual work and low volumes | 02:09 |
| genehacker | durr everyone knows that | 02:09 |
| fenn | so why bother if you don't need that last 2% of optimization | 02:10 |
| fenn | (hint: you don't) | 02:10 |
| genehacker | anyway the problem with glass fiber is when you want to make your own | 02:10 |
| genehacker | basalt fiber might be okay though | 02:10 |
| fenn | why is that a problem? | 02:10 |
| genehacker | how cheap is cheap for glass fiber? | 02:11 |
| fenn | the process goes like this: you make a block of silicone, burn the shit out of it, melt it, then drop it in a heated column | 02:11 |
| genehacker | silicone? | 02:11 |
| fenn | yup | 02:11 |
| genehacker | source? | 02:11 |
| fenn | guh. fuck you | 02:12 |
| fenn | i'm finishing my book now | 02:12 |
| genehacker | I've never heard of that process | 02:13 |
| genehacker | I think I should stop talking | 02:13 |
| Phreedom | genehacker: glass fiber is cheap enough to be used for heat insulation | 02:15 |
| Phreedom | not in space mind you | 02:15 |
| Phreedom | or it was used sometime ago | 02:16 |
| Phreedom | probably less used now | 02:16 |
| Phreedom | at least in buildings | 02:16 |
| Phreedom | when you are dealing with higher temps, I believe it's still useful | 02:16 |
| genehacker | okay | 02:16 |
| genehacker | that's pretty cheap | 02:16 |
| fenn | s-glass isn't that cheap | 02:17 |
| fenn | it's mostly for airplanes | 02:17 |
| fenn | uffda.. basalt fiber was first produced in 1923 | 02:56 |
| fenn | i wonder how much work goes into something like this | 03:01 |
| fenn | http://nextbigfuture.com/2009/10/augmented-reality-helps-marine.html | 03:01 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-47-152.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 03:35 | |
| -!- marainein [n=marainei@220-253-55-191.VIC.netspace.net.au] has joined #hplusroadmap | 04:04 | |
| katsmeow-afk | you could prolly take over Somalia without a lot of opposition, if you could do so fast enough | 07:16 |
| katsmeow-afk | that would give you land and uneducated workforce and ocean access | 07:16 |
| marainein | and all the malaria you could eat | 07:17 |
| katsmeow-afk | in my wildest dreams, i say let the robots do it | 07:17 |
| katsmeow-afk | yeas, and yellow fever, dengue, and annoying flying bullets | 07:18 |
| katsmeow-afk | they have solar power and cooling water and cheap land no one else wants, let the robots convert it to one huge sealed space, it's already useless for modern humans, so little loss there | 07:19 |
| katsmeow-afk | small enclaves for existinghumans, naturally | 07:19 |
| katsmeow-afk | sq mile parks, reserves, jungles, made better with technology and side effects of the robots' properity | 07:20 |
| katsmeow-afk | clean drinking water fromthe ocean cooling water, micro-managed farms, etc | 07:21 |
| katsmeow-afk | just that keeping the humans alive wouldn't be the robots' primary attention, no more than it is the humans now | 07:22 |
| katsmeow-afk | but condenced steam from cooling tower <shrug> free desalinated water | 07:22 |
| katsmeow-afk | industries based on dirty tech, like lead, lithium, zinc, etc need a place to be that can be written off by the world, and they've already written off Somalia | 07:24 |
| marainein | that's great. now you just have to sell the idea to the locals | 07:24 |
| katsmeow-afk | the locals use less than 1% of the land, i imagine | 07:24 |
| katsmeow-afk | and they are literally dying for improvements, like food and water and bullet filters | 07:25 |
| katsmeow-afk | just a place to get out of the sun, like a bush that someone else isn't breaking down for firewood (not even able to *chop* it down) | 07:26 |
| katsmeow-afk | uncontaminated water somewhere in a day's walking distance | 07:27 |
| marainein | actually, if the locals raise cattle, i'd imagine they use a lot of the land | 07:27 |
| marainein | why not pick a place with better neighbours? | 07:27 |
| katsmeow-afk | the land is unproductive for cattle, that's a cultural thing | 07:27 |
| katsmeow-afk | marainein, the point isn't neighbors, it's more like "neighbors? whatever!" | 07:28 |
| Phreedom | lol | 07:28 |
| katsmeow-afk | raising cattle is a means to an end: money and food | 07:28 |
| katsmeow-afk | so provide other means | 07:28 |
| katsmeow-afk | most African countries int hat area are world-wide aid drains, bottomless money holes | 07:29 |
| katsmeow-afk | and atm, Somalia is said to not have a governemnt, it's effectively a land mass with no state status | 07:30 |
| katsmeow-afk | you cold prolly a) buy it for 10cents acre all at once, or b) buyit for 10 cents an acre as long as the humans living on that acre will leave it for that price | 07:31 |
| katsmeow-afk | eithe way, it's your's by imminent domain, and if you improve the locals with aux fallout of the technology, they won't complain | 07:32 |
| katsmeow-afk | they'll come running and say "take over my land too, please!" | 07:33 |
| katsmeow-afk | please and more pleas | 07:33 |
| katsmeow-afk | "look! omnifab is making a new place a mile away, lets move there to enjoy the free water for our home and animals and garden!" | 07:34 |
| katsmeow-afk | and free 100watt/hr of lites/nite, and maybe other perks, depending on howmuch you feel owning the country without human revolt is worth | 07:35 |
| Phreedom | :) | 07:37 |
| Phreedom | katsmeow-afk: I like your neoimperialism | 07:37 |
| katsmeow-afk | Rechargeable zinc-air batteries can store three times the energy of a lithium-ion battery. Wednesday, October 28, 2009 :::::::::: i been trying to get my paws on these for years, even n non-rechargeable forms | 07:37 |
| katsmeow-afk | Phreedom, i didn't really say anything about governing the humans, did i? | 07:38 |
| Phreedom | how about reliability, toxicity, charge cycles | 07:38 |
| Phreedom | katsmeow-afk: if you control their land, food, water... | 07:38 |
| -!- marainein [n=marainei@220-253-55-191.VIC.netspace.net.au] has quit [Read error: 54 (Connection reset by peer)] | 07:38 | |
| katsmeow-afk | well, atm, most are squattrs with no food or water | 07:38 |
| katsmeow-afk | there's no gov, so no land titles. If the side effects of the land use is providing food and water as cheap byproducts or side effects, why not? | 07:39 |
| katsmeow-afk | if the humans rejoice, allow, don't complain, and crime drops, why not? | 07:40 |
| Phreedom | it will work for some time | 07:40 |
| Phreedom | then people will demand more | 07:40 |
| katsmeow-afk | naturally, there will be a short pacification interval | 07:40 |
| Phreedom | and more and more | 07:40 |
| Phreedom | it's not like they build the infrastructure themselves | 07:40 |
| Phreedom | aaand why do you need so much land? | 07:41 |
| Phreedom | you could buy some cheapass land in the us too | 07:41 |
| katsmeow-afk | the land is cheap, the land is sand and rocks, build a wall like the isralies do, park ED209s or autotargetting Samsung miniguns on them, let peace happen inside | 07:41 |
| Phreedom | yeah it would be much more expensive than africa, but only nominally | 07:41 |
| katsmeow-afk | wher is land with unlimited water access cheap in the usa? | 07:42 |
| Phreedom | since it'd be cheaper than anything you might build there | 07:42 |
| Phreedom | some desert :) | 07:42 |
| katsmeow-afk | unlimited water access | 07:42 |
| Phreedom | why do you need unlimited water? | 07:42 |
| katsmeow-afk | cooling, alt energy cycles, pacifying the natives who need water | 07:42 |
| Phreedom | there are no natives in arizona :) | 07:43 |
| katsmeow-afk | hell, most of the aquifers under the midwest are dry or pollluted now, but the land price is stillastronomically high, and there's the usa gov to deal with | 07:43 |
| katsmeow-afk | for nearly any industrial process, you need water | 07:44 |
| Phreedom | if you are prepared to defend yourself with guns and are ok with never leaving your premises, africa is indeed the land of freee | 07:44 |
| katsmeow-afk | especially for food, bioenergy, liquid fuel making, etc, and then there's cheapness of international shipping | 07:44 |
| katsmeow-afk | i imagine there's a lot of people in Africa who cannot afford guns, don't want guns, are tired of guns, and if you treat them nice will not shoot you, and will let you defend them from shooters | 07:46 |
| katsmeow-afk | besides, the premise being robots to run things, what's a bullet or two? | 07:46 |
| katsmeow-afk | Somalia demands food aid, and medical aid from diseased water, they need the side effects of tech, and have the land to exchange for it | 07:47 |
| katsmeow-afk | government-less land, let the robots build it, let the robots run it, let the humans drink the cooling water after it cools more ovrnite | 07:48 |
| katsmeow-afk | you haveto defend anything you do with lawyers here, there you do it with Samsung miniguns at a distance,,, so what if the majority of the poeple will be your friends between those points? | 07:49 |
| Phreedom | you have to defend anything of substance with lawyers | 07:50 |
| Phreedom | you can keep your laptop | 07:50 |
| katsmeow-afk | there's no courts in Somalia | 07:50 |
| Phreedom | while over there anything you happen to have is a treasure | 07:50 |
| Phreedom | I was talking to the us | 07:50 |
| Phreedom | *about | 07:51 |
| katsmeow-afk | i was talking about Somalia | 07:51 |
| Phreedom | in somalia a typical us bum is a walking treasure | 07:51 |
| Phreedom | oh and a gun that you carry to defend you is a treasure too;) | 07:51 |
| katsmeow-afk | yep, so any industrial side effect you give away, is buying allegances | 07:52 |
| Phreedom | there's a certain percentage of population that holds no allegiance | 07:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | hell, even the shade from your factory walls can be a treasure there | 07:52 |
| Phreedom | they take something if they can. even if it's detrimental to the society | 07:52 |
| kanzure | hi | 07:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | if they don't need it, praps they won't take it | 07:52 |
| katsmeow-afk | and if yoou bring bolts, it's less portable | 07:53 |
| katsmeow-afk | hi kanzure | 07:53 |
| Phreedom | katsmeow-afk: but what you describe might make some sense for large-scale effort | 07:53 |
| Phreedom | katsmeow-afk: you're yet to tell what huge thing you plan to manufacture | 07:53 |
| katsmeow-afk | yeas, i did mean a *COUNTRY* | 07:53 |
| Phreedom | perhaps a space elevator? ;) | 07:53 |
| Phreedom | otherwise, really why bother owning a country? | 07:54 |
| katsmeow-afk | i didn't go that far, no one will let me decide that anyhow | 07:54 |
| kanzure | Phreedom: why haven't you contributed to skdb ever? | 07:56 |
| kanzure | just wondering | 07:56 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: time | 07:56 |
| Phreedom | I'm tyring to break away from nepomuk | 07:56 |
| Phreedom | in a constructive way I mean | 07:56 |
| kanzure | despite what fenn might think we're really doing ok ("not bad") | 07:57 |
| Phreedom | just to finish things that depend on me or things I can do so much better than anyone else | 07:57 |
| kanzure | so when ybit gave us a domain name that happened to have strings attached to you, | 07:57 |
| kanzure | you can imagine how upset i was :( | 07:57 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: there are no "strings" | 07:57 |
| Phreedom | but we need to agree on what's going to happen | 07:57 |
| Phreedom | if you want a better name for skdb | 07:58 |
| kanzure | no, that's not what's happening | 07:58 |
| Phreedom | if skdb is released under a fossy license | 07:58 |
| kanzure | sigh | 07:58 |
| * katsmeow-afk is more into data : frankly, i no longer know what Tiggr does or doesn't know, but i just counted bytes in one dir of *answered* how-when-why questions: 9.5gigabytes; even at 1000:1 noise factor, that's 9.5 megabytes of howto-when-why; and there's other dirs; bigger dirs; domain specific dirs | 07:58 | |
| Phreedom | then you can have the name | 07:58 |
| kanzure | Phreedom: i feel like you don't actually follow us | 07:58 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: quite possibly. I don't read the channel 100% of the time | 07:58 |
| kanzure | ybit wants to rename skdb, that's true | 07:58 |
| kanzure | but what's actually going on here is, as fenn said, is "commercial bullshit" | 07:58 |
| katsmeow-afk | rename? or one name own the other? | 07:59 |
| kanzure | no | 07:59 |
| Phreedom | commercial bullshit without contracts, shares etc sounds strange ;) | 07:59 |
| kanzure | that's why i'm asking you guys to not step on my toes until i get things worked out | 07:59 |
| * katsmeow-afk steps lightly | 07:59 | |
| kanzure | katsmeow-afk: women excluded of course | 08:00 |
| katsmeow-afk | poo | 08:00 |
| katsmeow-afk | i can put on boots too | 08:00 |
| kanzure | no thanks | 08:00 |
| katsmeow-afk | k :-) | 08:00 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: really I saw my name being mentioned along with omnifab so I decided to chime in and explain how I see this whole thing | 08:01 |
| kanzure | right but it sounded like you didn't know the current position either | 08:01 |
| katsmeow-afk | bend at ...... | 08:01 |
| kanzure | anyway, don't mind me, i'm just a "misanthrope" (i learned this yesterday) | 08:01 |
| * kanzure goes back to sleep | 08:02 | |
| katsmeow-afk | erg, people seriously mixing up "semantic" "Symantec" and "semitic"? | 08:03 |
| katsmeow-afk | the web has become Alabama | 08:04 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: if wikipedia's definition of misantropy is correct, then we all are misantropes :) | 08:04 |
| katsmeow-afk | this is why i count on 1000:1 noise factor on all web content: | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | <meta meta name="description" content="Auto Mechanics"> | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | <meta name="keywords" content="auto, mechanincs, wrench, sex, penis, tits, clit, boobs"> | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | You see how it was abused. Any more advanced semantic tools will be similarly abused. | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | plus the overhead of thetags all over everything | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | and misspellings | 08:05 |
| katsmeow-afk | ybit you are about to get weatherly pounded | 08:22 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 09:06 | |
| -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 09:16 | |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 09:32 | |
| -!- genehacker2 [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 09:43 | |
| katsmeow-afk | Birmingham Alabama mayor guilty on 64 counts of bribery and corruption, possible 800+ yrs in jail, awaiting sentencing | 10:27 |
| -!- superkuh [n=hukrepus@unaffiliated/superkuh] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 10:31 | |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 10:51 | |
| -!- superkuh [n=hukrepus@unaffiliated/superkuh] has joined #hplusroadmap | 10:52 | |
| -!- ybit2 [i=449f8e42@unaffiliated/ybit] has joined #hplusroadmap | 12:15 | |
| -!- ve [n=a@94-193-95-252.zone7.bethere.co.uk] has quit [Connection timed out] | 12:24 | |
| -!- ybit2 [i=449f8e42@gateway/web/freenode/x-jduzeftgwpslynsn] has quit ["Page closed"] | 12:25 | |
| * kanzure adds "fabbage engine" to the list | 12:42 | |
| kanzure | http://adl.serveftp.org/~bryan/domain_ideas.txt | 12:43 |
| fenn | fabroidal sounds like a n uncomfortable medical condition | 12:49 |
| genehacker | it's not a condition | 12:51 |
| fenn | shouldnt it be "stallman's russia" instead of "stalin's fablab"? | 12:51 |
| genehacker | it could describe a condition | 12:51 |
| fenn | kanzure: i have more crap to add, where is that wiki page dammit | 12:52 |
| fenn | oh no we've been spammed | 12:52 |
| fenn | see spammers have no problem coming up with domain names | 12:53 |
| fenn | wrqqizetbrgo.com | 12:53 |
| genehacker | we have a wiki? | 12:55 |
| fenn | http://adl.serveftp.org/dokuwiki/ | 12:56 |
| kanzure | fenn: http://adl.serveftp.org:8080 | 12:59 |
| kanzure | oh | 12:59 |
| kanzure | hey why don't we have recaptcha installed on dokuwiki yet? | 12:59 |
| kanzure | also why did i just set up hatta-wiki? | 12:59 |
| genehacker | forgot about that | 12:59 |
| genehacker | I thought you didn't like captchas? | 12:59 |
| kanzure | i sometimes feel like the dokuwiki is more for the lab | 12:59 |
| kanzure | genehacker: well, i don't, but it stops people like me from spamming websites | 13:00 |
| kanzure | err | 13:00 |
| kanzure | this is self-defeating in some sick way, i'm sure | 13:00 |
| fenn | dokuwiki was only spammed once in 6 months.. that's not enough to bother with captchas | 13:01 |
| fenn | ah dammit now there's two versions | 13:02 |
| kanzure | http://adl.serveftp.org:8080/name%20ideas | 13:02 |
| fenn | what is this hatta wiki supposed to be for/ | 13:02 |
| kanzure | i thought you wanted me to set up a wiki? | 13:02 |
| fenn | http://adl.serveftp.org/dokuwiki/skdb_names | 13:02 |
| fenn | i thought you werent doing anything so i made a new page | 13:02 |
| fenn | and fixed the spammage | 13:02 |
| kanzure | ok. /me uses dokuwiki | 13:02 |
| fenn | why does it need a new port anyway? that's whack | 13:03 |
| kanzure | it's running using cherrypy's custom server at the moment | 13:03 |
| kanzure | it would take me a minute more to reconfigure apache | 13:03 |
| kanzure | i figured it wouldn't be worth it | 13:03 |
| fenn | also it doesnt really seem to be a wiki | 13:03 |
| kanzure | why's that | 13:04 |
| fenn | oh it just changed behavior | 13:04 |
| fenn | something about mime types i guess | 13:04 |
| fenn | yeah the pages are plain text type | 13:04 |
| fenn | even edit page | 13:05 |
| fenn | well, some of them at least | 13:05 |
| kanzure | i have to admit, hatta wiki is pretty close to being perfect for me | 13:05 |
| kanzure | not quite there yet- for instance, the url scheme seems a little off | 13:06 |
| kanzure | and it's not immediately obvious how someone else can clone the repository without asking me | 13:06 |
| fenn | what you want page/edit instead of edit/page? | 13:06 |
| kanzure | yes please | 13:06 |
| fenn | does hatta work with git? | 13:06 |
| kanzure | should be easy enough for me to fix, since i'm doing that for skdb/web/web.py anyway | 13:06 |
| kanzure | hatta works with hg | 13:06 |
| fenn | but does it work with git? | 13:06 |
| kanzure | no, it imports mercurial | 13:06 |
| kanzure | mercurial has a git plugin (on the command line) but it doesn't convert skdb.git | 13:07 |
| fenn | what does 'git plugin' mean? | 13:07 |
| fenn | it can import repos to hg format? or it can actually use a .git repo? | 13:07 |
| * fenn hates this crap | 13:07 | |
| kanzure | you drop some files in a ~/.hg/plugin/ and you can call hg clone git:// or hg clone skdb.git | 13:07 |
| kanzure | it does both | 13:07 |
| kanzure | well, not really, hold on a sec | 13:07 |
| kanzure | it can import a .git into a .hg | 13:08 |
| kanzure | but it can also allow a .hg to push to a .git | 13:08 |
| fenn | hmm | 13:08 |
| fenn | does it screw everything up is what i'm asking :) | 13:08 |
| kanzure | i thought it sounded awesome until it totally failed on skdb.git because of some funky shit we were doing with git | 13:08 |
| kanzure | like moving files around or something | 13:08 |
| kanzure | it errored on skdb/doc/todo/TODO (which doesn't exist) | 13:08 |
| fenn | hmm | 13:08 |
| fenn | try iporting a clean git clone | 13:09 |
| fenn | the repo on adl has a lot of dangling commits from all that --force stuff you did | 13:09 |
| kanzure | my hdd has been slow to respond to "ls" and other commands today, any thoughts | 13:09 |
| kanzure | btw i was trying it on my local working directory | 13:09 |
| * kanzure tries | 13:09 | |
| fenn | use ps -ef and see if anything unusual is running | 13:10 |
| fenn | or top | 13:10 |
| kanzure | why is firefox using half a gigabyte of RAM? it's only showing dokuwiki | 13:10 |
| * fenn guesses something is accessing disk and erasing the disk cache | 13:10 | |
| kanzure | 29367 kanzure 20 0 478m 260m 34m R 12 8.8 325:06.37 firefox-bin | 13:11 |
| kanzure | the order is virtual, res, shared | 13:11 |
| katsmeow-afk | it does that, i just crash it and restart it, have it reload the urls/files | 13:11 |
| kanzure | sigh | 13:11 |
| kanzure | why do i use firefox | 13:11 |
| katsmeow-afk | i find myself using IE8 more and more <sigh> | 13:12 |
| kanzure | why isn't there a cli browser that has javascript support? that's all i really need | 13:12 |
| kanzure | katsmeow-afk: you are banned for the next 20 minutes | 13:12 |
| kanzure | please just use wget | 13:12 |
| katsmeow-afk | i use that too, when both browser fail :-) | 13:12 |
| katsmeow-afk | or i copy/paste links to wget | 13:12 |
| genehacker | I use firefox and opera for double redundancy | 13:13 |
| kanzure | how's opera working out for you? | 13:13 |
| katsmeow-afk | i ROT13 everything twice too | 13:13 |
| fenn | i tunnel everything through DNS | 13:13 |
| kanzure | hm how do i make a bare repository again? | 13:14 |
| fenn | init? | 13:14 |
| kanzure | git init -b or something? | 13:14 |
| kanzure | git init --bare | 13:14 |
| fenn | (you shouldn't have to do that) | 13:14 |
| kanzure | just a backup plan for when hg gclone inevitably fails again | 13:14 |
| katsmeow-afk | i wanna know why there's $ stuck into the keybds in http://craphound.com/images/makerslaunch.jpg | 13:14 |
| kanzure | creating bookmarks failed, do you have bookmarks enabled? | 13:14 |
| kanzure | abort: Not a directory: /home/kanzure/sandbox/hg-testing/skdb-hg/doc/todo/TODO | 13:14 |
| kanzure | i wonder why google hasn't released their own mail client yet | 13:15 |
| fenn | *cough*gmail*cough* | 13:16 |
| fenn | katsmeow-afk: there's gold in them thar junk hills | 13:17 |
| fenn | (is the main theme, sorta) | 13:17 |
| katsmeow-afk | o | 13:19 |
| * katsmeow-afk offers fenn 200 cabletvboxes | 13:20 | |
| * fenn offers kata cakitty treat | 13:20 | |
| katsmeow-afk | in case you are counting, that's 1200 70ns 128k/256k drams, 200+ flash chips, 200+ 40watt switcher psu, 800 7seg led, etc | 13:21 |
| kanzure | ah, adding [extensions]\nhgext.convert= to ~/.hgrc makes "hg convert skdb" work. | 13:21 |
| katsmeow-afk | and none of it worth a damn | 13:21 |
| kanzure | but this is a one-way conversion | 13:21 |
| fenn | katsmeow-afk: maybe you can convince some kids in the philippines to take it off your hands | 13:22 |
| katsmeow-afk | or India, or China | 13:23 |
| katsmeow-afk | thing is, there's a few useful chips in these if someone needed them, like very lowpower 20mhz a/d convertors | 13:23 |
| fenn | if only we had a comprehensive database of physical things and how they are made | 13:24 |
| kanzure | ah i had to run "hg update" to get all of the files to show up | 13:24 |
| katsmeow-afk | you missed what i said earlier? | 13:24 |
| kanzure | ok. now what? | 13:24 |
| kanzure | why did i do that | 13:24 |
| fenn | why did you? | 13:24 |
| kanzure | you asked if hatta works with git, and then i commented about the hg git conversion not working, and i decided to go try it out again | 13:25 |
| fenn | is there any reason it can't work with git directly? | 13:25 |
| kanzure | so yeah. | 13:25 |
| kanzure | no, it's just not implemented | 13:25 |
| fenn | i mean if we're going to have some arbitrary choice of dvcs we might as well make it a choice | 13:26 |
| * fenn realizes that was confusing | 13:26 | |
| fenn | hatta ought to be able to use git, is what i'm saying | 13:26 |
| * fenn reads more about hatta | 13:27 | |
| katsmeow-afk | "Monitoring Pressure in Milking Systems" .... duh,, is the cow getting bigger? | 13:27 |
| fenn | so they don't bruise the tender nipples? | 13:28 |
| kanzure | there's probably a drop off in milk pressure when your cows start going dry | 13:28 |
| kanzure | fenn: i have a copy of hatta in adl:~/public_html/ (hatta.py) if you're interested | 13:29 |
| kanzure | er, adl:~/public_html/wiki/hatta.py | 13:29 |
| fenn | kanzure: what does hatta have to do with cherrypy? | 13:29 |
| katsmeow-afk | turns out the article is about heat exchanger pressures and temperatures vs protiens plating out of the milk onto the exchanger surfaces | 13:29 |
| kanzure | fenn: hatta uses cherrypy | 13:29 |
| kanzure | er, actually, that's not entirely true | 13:30 |
| katsmeow-afk | protiens covering up the sensors makes the thing runaway | 13:30 |
| kanzure | it uses cherrypy's server, but it mostly uses werkzeug | 13:30 |
| fenn | seems like every time WSGI comes up i get confused | 13:31 |
| katsmeow-afk | - Storage. 75 file cabinets and 27 tons of reports from 1965 were not needed. | 13:34 |
| katsmeow-afk | i guess they kept the 75 file cabinets and 27 tons of reports from 1966 | 13:36 |
| kanzure | hatta wiki should use cherrypy and anyvc under the hood, instead of werkzeug and mercurial. (actually i dunno about werkzeug) | 13:37 |
| * kanzure secretly wants optfunc to work with cherrypy :) | 13:38 | |
| fenn | it doesnt/ | 13:38 |
| kanzure | it does, but only on the CLI side of things | 13:39 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: I can't keep up with you guys. you are too spammy :( | 13:39 |
| kanzure | what are we spamming about? | 13:40 |
| Phreedom | kanzure: but if you decide something about the name let me know | 13:40 |
| Phreedom | just about anything :) | 13:40 |
| katsmeow-afk | the thing about spam is.......... | 13:40 |
| kanzure | all i asked is for you to not step on any toes until i get things worked out | 13:40 |
| kanzure | i don't know how that's spam | 13:40 |
| fenn | he just means channel activity | 13:41 |
| Phreedom | catching up is almost impossible. I go pee and have several pages to read after I come back | 13:42 |
| fenn | does anyvc have some sort of .. documentation, webpage, anything but a web interface to the source code/ | 13:42 |
| kanzure | no | 13:42 |
| kanzure | there's documentation in the source, apparently, and a makefile, but i haven't run it yet | 13:43 |
| kanzure | i was looking at the unit tests. they weren't helpful. | 13:43 |
| kanzure | maybe one day there will be a bridge between all of the dcvses, but for now that doesn't look likely | 13:48 |
| kanzure | *dvcses | 13:52 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-104-251.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] | 13:58 | |
| kanzure | fenn: maybe it would be better if you replied to sam's email instead of paul's | 14:20 |
| kanzure | seeing as how sam asked about ISO standards for screws in skdb :) | 14:20 |
| fenn | i'm slow, i was writing that email before sam's arrived | 14:21 |
| fenn | do you have gnumeric installed? kspread looks kinda funky and im wondering what it's supposed to look like | 14:21 |
| kanzure | i have openoffice.org installed | 14:21 |
| fenn | from what i can tell it doesn't have any actual data like what pitch goes with what diameter | 14:21 |
| fenn | just formulas | 14:21 |
| kanzure | you want to come look? | 14:22 |
| kanzure | fenn: btw loading the screw package fails due to something being wrong in the threads package (in threads.py) | 15:08 |
| fenn | er, what exactly | 15:10 |
| fenn | i'm looking at threads.py right now and i seem to have stopped halfway through rewriting it :) | 15:10 |
| fenn | for example this is totally wrong assert self.form=="UN" and Unit(self.pitch).compatible('mm/rev') | 15:11 |
| fenn | why did you do this? (in screw.py) thread = Thread(diameter='1mm',pitch='1rev/in') | 15:13 |
| fenn | just leave it as None | 15:13 |
| fenn | or raise a warning or something, don't just make up shit | 15:13 |
| fenn | 'fail early and often' | 15:14 |
| fenn | man everything takes so long | 15:16 |
| * fenn cries | 15:16 | |
| kanzure | the imports? | 15:17 |
| CIA-23 | skdb: fenn * r c34fe3d /packages/screw/screw.py: remove bogus instantiation | 15:21 |
| fenn | well it took me an hour to respond to two emails | 15:22 |
| kanzure | that might be a new record | 15:23 |
| kanzure | usually you do 1/day | 15:23 |
| kanzure | hm eugen asks if there's a way to do "atomically specified parts" in skdb. i sent him a follow-up asking if he means something like SMILES (etc.) | 15:25 |
| kanzure | i don't know of any representations for nano-anything, to be honest, other than the chem stuff | 15:25 |
| kanzure | er i guess nano isn't atom specific, sorry | 15:26 |
| kanzure | ato :) | 15:27 |
| fenn | there are a few nano-CAD programs | 15:27 |
| kanzure | there was one that drexler did, right? you were playing around with it once.. how was it? | 15:27 |
| kanzure | nanoCADengineer or something | 15:28 |
| fenn | i spent a couple days trying to get nanoengineer-1 to compile, but ran out of time or something | 15:28 |
| kanzure | fooey | 15:28 |
| fenn | it's really complex | 15:28 |
| fenn | like 15 external libraries | 15:28 |
| fenn | their instructions are pretty good though | 15:28 |
| CIA-23 | skdb: fenn * r 5a9f69a /packages/screw/screw.py: check_compatibility function | 15:30 |
| kanzure | what happened to regular old compatibility? | 15:30 |
| fenn | i just turned it into a function | 15:30 |
| fenn | i think it needs to be moved anyway | 15:30 |
| kanzure | i thought Part.compatibility | 15:30 |
| kanzure | oh wait, no, it was Interface.compatible | 15:30 |
| fenn | i'm confused about how to separate screw and thread | 15:30 |
| kanzure | sorry, don't mind me | 15:30 |
| fenn | maybe check_compatibility is a bad name | 15:30 |
| fenn | i was also thinking of calling it makes_sense | 15:31 |
| kanzure | i was originally going to use makes_sense for checking if a newly instantiated <whatever> "makes sense" | 15:31 |
| fenn | yeah that's the same idea | 15:31 |
| kanzure | is this the same or different? (i don't care if you use it, but i just want to know) | 15:31 |
| kanzure | ok cool | 15:31 |
| fenn | i think i meant curve fitting, not symbolic regression | 15:40 |
| fenn | there are a lot of standards that follow something like a linear function, sampled at regular intervals, then rounded to the nearest whatever | 15:41 |
| fenn | sometimes they even tell you how they did it | 15:41 |
| kanzure | does list.index() use the __eq__ of its members? | 15:42 |
| fenn | try and see | 15:43 |
| fenn | i don't know | 15:43 |
| kanzure | yep | 15:43 |
| kanzure | cool | 15:43 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-159-127.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 15:51 | |
| -!- corvinius [n=anonymou@202.20.3.32] has joined #hplusroadmap | 15:55 | |
| kanzure | hello corvinius | 15:55 |
| corvinius | hi kanzure | 15:55 |
| * kanzure is hacking at cherrypy | 15:56 | |
| corvinius | cherrypy? what is that? | 15:56 |
| kanzure | highly pythonic web framework, basically | 15:57 |
| corvinius | nice | 15:57 |
| corvinius | i'm working on rails, on this project management software (redmine) for my job | 15:58 |
| corvinius | i'm customizing it for our need | 15:58 |
| corvinius | z | 15:58 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-159-127.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 16:21 | |
| ybit | link to nanoCAD mailing list archive? | 16:32 |
| ybit | http://sourceforge.net/projects/fungimol/ | 16:48 |
| ybit | "Fungimol is a free nanocad, that is, a free system for doingcomputer aided design of molecular-scale machines." | 16:48 |
| ybit | http://www.fungible.com/fungimol/ | 16:48 |
| ybit | Fungimol is an extensible system for designing atomic-scale objects. The intent is to eventually extend it to be a useful system for doing molecular nanotechnology design work. At the moment it's a PDB file viewer and Buckminsterfullerine editor. | 16:48 |
| ybit | probably old, haven't looked | 16:49 |
| -!- Netsplit leguin.freenode.net <-> irc.freenode.net quits: katsmeow-afk, kardan_, drazak, splicer, mage2, boogles, CIA-23, corvinius, Utopiah, Overand, (+4 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them) | 17:02 | |
| -!- Netsplit over, joins: splicer, corvinius, flamoot, Overand, mage2 | 17:03 | |
| -!- Netsplit over, joins: kardan_, drazak, Utopiah, zvader, nchaimov, katsmeow-afk, CIA-23, chizu, boogles | 17:04 | |
| ybit | shocking study of japanese wives (2005) http://www.boingboing.net/2005/12/15/how_soon_after_marri.html | 17:08 |
| ybit | nanoCAD mailing list archive is non-existant, not even on the creator's homepage | 17:10 |
| kanzure | yay for david cary | 17:34 |
| kanzure | nice to see he's not dead | 17:34 |
| kanzure | superkuh: have you been able to figure out who david cary is yet? | 17:34 |
| kanzure | this guy: http://www.rdrop.com/~cary/html/idea_space.html | 17:35 |
| superkuh | I don't remember reading the name previous to this date. | 17:39 |
| -!- tyson_ [n=tyson@68-114-130-93.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has joined #hplusroadmap | 17:44 | |
| kanzure | hello tyson_ | 17:44 |
| tyson_ | Ah, hello | 17:44 |
| tyson_ | Ill be honest i cant stay long | 17:44 |
| tyson_ | i have to pack and get drive into nashville for my flight | 17:44 |
| tyson_ | hello everyone | 17:44 |
| kanzure | i saw a flock of green parrots outside | 17:45 |
| tyson_ | where are you? | 17:45 |
| kanzure | austin, texas | 17:46 |
| tyson_ | Huh, not exactly parrot country | 17:46 |
| tyson_ | but i suppose it will serve | 17:46 |
| tyson_ | just dont ex them | 17:46 |
| kanzure | that's what's so confusing | 17:46 |
| kanzure | why would it happen right after we were talking about exing parrots? | 17:47 |
| tyson_ | synchronicity | 17:47 |
| tyson_ | ok | 17:50 |
| tyson_ | well i need to stop by the grocery store | 17:50 |
| tyson_ | i need more cat food | 17:50 |
| tyson_ | if Rufus isn't going to devour the house he will need a larger dish | 17:50 |
| tyson_ | so | 17:50 |
| tyson_ | ttyl | 17:50 |
| ybit | tyson_: where are you? | 17:58 |
| ybit | somewhere in tn it looks like | 17:58 |
| fenn | lion kimbro is associated with david cary? | 18:00 |
| fenn | based on my reading of http://www.communitywiki.org/en/TerseWriting | 18:01 |
| fenn | actually a lot of those names on the right look familiar | 18:02 |
| kanzure | PatrickAnderson haha | 18:05 |
| kanzure | SamRose.. hm. yeah | 18:05 |
| kanzure | somehow i don't think this is the one we know: http://www.usemod.com/cgi-bin/mb.pl?PatrickAnderson | 18:05 |
| kanzure | wait, no | 18:05 |
| fenn | shrug | 18:16 |
| fenn | also thomas kalka and bayle shanks | 18:16 |
| kanzure | is thomas kalka the emc thomas that i should know by now? | 18:18 |
| fenn | maybe? | 18:18 |
| ybit | fenn: you'll have to rent a car if we are to get from lax to irvine | 18:31 |
| ybit | i'm not 25 yet | 18:31 |
| ybit | and neither is bryan, even though the beard may fool others | 18:32 |
| ybit | which means you'll need your credit/debit card and other stuff that i will have to call and ask about | 18:32 |
| fenn | hum | 18:32 |
| fenn | i guess i would need a license and car insurance too | 18:32 |
| kanzure | why do we need to rent a car? | 18:35 |
| kanzure | anyone in LA? | 18:35 |
| ybit | kanzure: that was suggested to me | 18:35 |
| ybit | talking to lax rent-a-car right now | 18:35 |
| ybit | enterpise rent-a-car | 18:36 |
| kanzure | i'm sure they'd recommend themselves even if you had to walk one block | 18:36 |
| ybit | three days with full protection and tax: $274.14, $27.97 for full insurance, and we pay for gas | 18:37 |
| ybit | more than the flight there | 18:37 |
| ybit | that's for renting it friday through monday | 18:37 |
| kanzure | no thanks | 18:38 |
| * ybit wonders if hunter would be willing to drive us there and back for about $60 | 18:39 | |
| ybit | taxi is more expensive than rent-a-car | 18:39 |
| fenn | who is hunter? | 18:39 |
| ybit | my friend in malibue, we traveled playing baseball for several years | 18:39 |
| ybit | malibu | 18:39 |
| fenn | "It is also possible to take the Metro Rail train from LAX to LA Union Station in Los Angeles, and then transfer either to an Amtrak or Metrolink train which will get you down to Irvine." | 18:40 |
| ybit | he's uber christian, but, it's cheaper than having to rent a car | 18:40 |
| kanzure | there's also a bus | 18:40 |
| fenn | how far are we talkin about anyway? | 18:41 |
| kanzure | 40 miles | 18:41 |
| ybit | 50mins away | 18:41 |
| fenn | what's the hotel again? sheraton? | 18:41 |
| ybit | http://www.lawa.org/welcome_LAX.aspx?id=292 | 18:43 |
| ybit | i don't think it's sheraton | 18:43 |
| kanzure | ybit: google maps suggests something way cheaper | 18:43 |
| drazak | I might go to irvine | 18:43 |
| ybit | that bus ride could get us back to lax from irvine, not sure about from lax to irvine though | 18:43 |
| kanzure | ybit: why are you so intent on paying so much money to go 40 miles? | 18:44 |
| kanzure | $120? | 18:44 |
| * ybit isn't, it was just recommended to me from people i've talked to today who have been there | 18:44 | |
| kanzure | sorry, $120 is crazy | 18:44 |
| ybit | it being rent-a-car | 18:44 |
| ybit | yeah | 18:44 |
| ybit | i glanced @ $7 | 18:44 |
| kanzure | rent-a-car for $274 is also silly | 18:45 |
| kanzure | oh, $7? | 18:45 |
| ybit | wait, i was right, it's $7 | 18:45 |
| ybit | so that's the way to go on monday | 18:45 |
| ybit | drazak: if you are serious, we need details if you plan on rooming with us | 18:45 |
| ybit | s/details/confirmation | 18:45 |
| drazak | ybit: for school | 18:46 |
| drazak | UC irvine | 18:46 |
| ybit | :P | 18:46 |
| ybit | okay | 18:46 |
| fenn | google suggests 2 trains and 4 buses | 18:46 |
| fenn | (in series) | 18:46 |
| ybit | i considered that school, i considered a lot of places and stayed home, probably not the greatest decision on my part, anywho.. | 18:46 |
| ybit | http://www.primetimeshuttle.com/ | 18:47 |
| fenn | yeah i think one of the shuttles is best | 18:48 |
| bkero | Don't go to school in LA. | 18:48 |
| drazak | why not? | 18:50 |
| bkero | LA sucks, sometime around the early 2000's, the UC system reached critical mass, and stopped giving a shit. | 18:51 |
| ybit | it's $69 total for all of us from lax to irvine with the prime time shuttle, fenn, kanzure | 18:51 |
| bkero | To your professors you're just a number. It's almost impossible to get to know them. | 18:51 |
| drazak | bkero: eh | 18:51 |
| bkero | My school has around 11,000 students. I'm on a first name basis with almost all of professors in the computer science department. | 18:52 |
| ybit | drazak: if i had to do it over, i'd say pick a school where they allow you to pick your course curriculum, self-directed study.. there was a school where your last 1.5 years was your own project, which is neat | 18:52 |
| kanzure | what happened to the $7/ride shuttle | 18:52 |
| ybit | hampshire college, that's it | 18:52 |
| drazak | nah | 18:53 |
| ybit | kanzure: that's from irvine to lax | 18:53 |
| ybit | we need to get to irvine | 18:53 |
| kanzure | the bus doesn't go back? | 18:53 |
| fenn | one way ticket to HELL! | 18:53 |
| ybit | not from what i gathered, will look again | 18:53 |
| ybit | hampshire college, that's the name of the school, drazak | 18:53 |
| ybit | it's pretty neat | 18:53 |
| kanzure | conservation of buses, ybit | 18:53 |
| drazak | ybit: no thanks | 18:53 |
| ybit | drazak: and you are allowed to visit other schools, amherst and umass | 18:54 |
| ybit | s/visit/take classes at | 18:54 |
| ybit | *shrug* | 18:54 |
| ybit | the flyaway shuttle bus takes you to the union station | 18:56 |
| * ybit checks to see if union station can get you to irivine | 18:56 | |
| -!- kardan_ [n=kardan@p54BE547D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Connection reset by peer] | 18:58 | |
| fenn | totally stupid that the train doesn't go to the airport | 18:58 |
| ybit | $14 from lax to irv at amtrak | 18:58 |
| fenn | eh? | 18:58 |
| ybit | plus the $7 shuttle ride to union station | 18:58 |
| fenn | oh | 18:59 |
| ybit | so we're looking @ ~$25 to get to irvine | 18:59 |
| fenn | that sounds not too bad | 18:59 |
| ybit | and we may need to schedule ahead just to make sure we get the tickets | 18:59 |
| ybit | on monday, it's about ~$10 | 18:59 |
| kanzure | do we need to pay to reserve? | 19:00 |
| ybit | looking @ http://tickets.amtrak.com/itd/amtrak | 19:00 |
| ybit | no, it's like a plane tickets | 19:00 |
| kanzure | lame | 19:01 |
| ybit | s/a// | 19:01 |
| ybit | might be useful to have on the netbook/lappy: http://www.lawa.org/uploadedimages/lax/images/GT_mapF.gif | 19:02 |
| fenn | print it out | 19:02 |
| fenn | do it now! i command you | 19:02 |
| ybit | me? never! | 19:03 |
| * ybit reaches for strages kiddle | 19:04 | |
| ybit | er, kindle* | 19:04 |
| fenn | there is also a $25 "flyaway bus" straight from the airport | 19:05 |
| ybit | that's the shuttle i was talking about | 19:07 |
| ybit | it's $7 from what i recall looking at | 19:07 |
| fenn | no $25 to irvine | 19:07 |
| fenn | http://www.lawa.org/uploadedImages/LAX/Flyaway/IrvineFaresChartFINAL.JPG | 19:08 |
| ybit | that works, let's do that | 19:08 |
| ybit | to and from irvine, $25 each way, so $50 for transportation. you pay when you get one the bus | 19:11 |
| ybit | just called | 19:12 |
| ybit | now on to hattit | 19:12 |
| fenn | good old last mile problem | 19:12 |
| fenn | what's hattit? | 19:12 |
| ybit | are we going to use hattit? | 19:12 |
| ybit | the mercurial wiki | 19:12 |
| fenn | hatta | 19:12 |
| kanzure | hatta-wiki | 19:12 |
| ybit | yeah, that | 19:13 |
| kanzure | jason morrison likes to claim he "geeks out" but i don't trust him | 19:13 |
| ybit | i was looking at it during my break today @ work | 19:13 |
| ybit | it's setup on my comp here | 19:13 |
| kanzure | (referring to his latest thread and his lack of understanding that an xml-tweeting thermocycler is not news) | 19:13 |
| fenn | god i wish twitter would hurry up and die | 19:13 |
| ybit | mind if we just stick it into the stack for the time being so we have a wiki? | 19:13 |
| kanzure | what's wrong with dokuwiki? | 19:14 |
| kanzure | the installed dokuwiki i mean | 19:14 |
| fenn | nothing | 19:14 |
| ybit | can you git-clone yourdokuwiki? | 19:14 |
| fenn | no | 19:14 |
| ybit | oh | 19:14 |
| kanzure | nope | 19:14 |
| kanzure | "yeah let's get excited about lab instruments hosting their own RSS feeds!" | 19:14 |
| ybit | i thought we were going for a vc wiki, one where you edit a text-file as opposed to having to open a browser to edit a file | 19:14 |
| kanzure | "but jason, wouldn't you rather want to do something more geeky than RSS?" | 19:15 |
| kanzure | "no! rss is the ultimate!" | 19:15 |
| * ybit whips out his ant farm and waves it in the air for the rss feeds, w00t | 19:15 | |
| fenn | well rss would be good for non-critical sensor alarms | 19:15 |
| kanzure | no, it should push messages somewhere else | 19:15 |
| fenn | 'humidity is up in the greenhouse' | 19:15 |
| kanzure | i'd rather not have an rss feed hosted on a little chip somewhere | 19:15 |
| kanzure | why not just have it push messages every once in a while? | 19:15 |
| ybit | 19:14 < ybit> i thought we were going for a vc wiki, one where you edit a text-file as opposed to having to open a browser to edit a file | 19:16 |
| kanzure | that way, if it dies, you have the messages sitting elsewhere | 19:16 |
| kanzure | ybit: yes that's still the plan | 19:16 |
| fenn | hm ok i have no idea how rss works, nevermind | 19:16 |
| ybit | so why not use hatta? | 19:16 |
| kanzure | fenn just wanted to put domain_ideas.txt | 19:16 |
| kanzure | on a wiki | 19:16 |
| kanzure | because it's mercurial, mainly | 19:16 |
| kanzure | fenn: look at any rss feed. at the xml markup. | 19:16 |
| ybit | because it has troubles with skdb.py | 19:16 |
| kanzure | you query a web server, it spits out xml | 19:16 |
| fenn | ybit: you can edit dokuwiki pages from the back end, they're just text files | 19:16 |
| kanzure | fenn: but the dokuwiki revision control system is custom or somesuch | 19:17 |
| fenn | ok let's not confuse unrelated issues | 19:17 |
| kanzure | yeah but how would you commit if you edited their flatfiles | 19:18 |
| kanzure | just wondering | 19:18 |
| fenn | uh.. i think it just says 'edited from backend' or something | 19:19 |
| fenn | actually i think it obliterates the version history | 19:19 |
| kanzure | yikes | 19:19 |
| fenn | anyway.. at least it's not some awful xml sql database dump | 19:20 |
| ybit | where'd the lego .stp files come from? | 19:24 |
| kanzure | national design repositoryt | 19:24 |
| ybit | fart | 19:24 |
| kanzure | i refuse | 19:24 |
| ybit | :) | 19:24 |
| ybit | kanzure is more shy than japanese wives | 19:24 |
| kanzure | they are valuable | 19:25 |
| ybit | have we had discussions previously on auto-generation of cad files? | 19:26 |
| * kanzure nods | 19:26 | |
| fenn | i think it was sort of taken for granted | 19:26 |
| kanzure | you're only grumpy because occ doesn't want to draw your helices | 19:26 |
| kanzure | there's a parametric demo in pythonOCC somewhere | 19:27 |
| kanzure | using sympy to control the sizes | 19:27 |
| kanzure | ybit: unless you mean something else? like deciding which shapes to use? | 19:27 |
| fenn | yeah but it's a lamesauce example | 19:28 |
| kanzure | was it just a prism or something? | 19:28 |
| fenn | and you have to have all that other crap installed so i never actually tried it | 19:29 |
| fenn | (also more or less useless outside of an interactive UI cad program) | 19:29 |
| kanzure | me either :) | 19:29 |
| fenn | wtf is up with this connection | 19:29 |
| kanzure | i seem to be ok | 19:29 |
| ybit | i am raping it, that's what | 19:29 |
| kanzure | thank you and welcome to "guess your rapist" | 19:30 |
| ybit | :P | 19:30 |
| kanzure | this week's rapist is short, self-described pipsqueak, and running on a 56k line out of alabama | 19:30 |
| fenn | obviously a product of his environment | 19:30 |
| ybit | short? | 19:32 |
| kanzure | yes, short | 19:32 |
| ybit | no no, i'm a tall mofo | 19:32 |
| kanzure | see? every mofo is from alabama | 19:32 |
| ybit | so i guess it isn't me.. odd, there's another server rapist in the area... | 19:32 |
| fenn | hide your servers! | 19:33 |
| kanzure | lock the firewalls! | 19:33 |
| ybit | take it like men dammit | 19:33 |
| ybit | linux cam software? | 19:35 |
| ybit | what were the plans for that. | 19:35 |
| kanzure | emc? | 19:36 |
| ybit | automatic g-code generation from cad files | 19:36 |
| ybit | oh, no. emc doesn't do that | 19:36 |
| ybit | andypugh from #emc thinks heekscnc might | 19:40 |
| fenn | yes | 19:41 |
| fenn | so pycam is not bad | 19:43 |
| fenn | that's what heekscnc uses | 19:43 |
| ybit | aha | 19:43 |
| fenn | it's sorta slow; i think it could be fixed by rewriting the dropcutter function in C | 19:44 |
| fenn | anders was going to do that but flaked out | 19:44 |
| kanzure | sandberg? | 19:44 |
| fenn | wallins | 19:44 |
| kanzure | aw. | 19:44 |
| -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE547D.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 19:44 | |
| fenn | i'd be surprised if sandberg were even thinking about anything so concrete | 19:44 |
| fenn | this is the kind of crap i grew up with http://www.macrovu.com/image/VLBkimg/vlbkwhtisvlpict.gif | 19:49 |
| fenn | that was probably done in macdraw and imported into hypercard | 19:51 |
| ybit | http://code.google.com/p/pycam/wiki/PythonComputerVision :: not the python i just downloaded from sf | 19:57 |
| ybit | s/python/pycam | 19:57 |
| fenn | that's dumb. why didn't they call it pycv? | 19:58 |
| -!- kardan_ [n=kardan@p54BE56FB.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #hplusroadmap | 19:58 | |
| ybit | pycam only imports stl | 19:58 |
| fenn | yes, it only works on triangles | 19:58 |
| ybit | -_- | 19:58 |
| fenn | it's more for continuous surfaces than highly process specific geometry | 19:58 |
| -!- kardan| [n=kardan@p54BE547D.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)] | 19:59 | |
| ybit | so what else is on the list? | 19:59 |
| ybit | aside from pycam | 19:59 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-35-235.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 19:59 | |
| fenn | do you really want a list? | 19:59 |
| ybit | that'd be nice | 19:59 |
| * fenn thinks once an author's books sell for $1 on amazon they ought to just release the damn thing for free | 20:00 | |
| ybit | fenn: do you have a list? | 20:00 |
| fenn | hang on, this connection takes forever to do anything | 20:00 |
| fenn | you can probably get there faster than me | 20:01 |
| ybit | okay | 20:01 |
| fenn | go to wiki.linuxcnc.org and the page named Cam | 20:01 |
| fenn | http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Cam | 20:01 |
| ybit | http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?Cam | 20:01 |
| ybit | grr, your connection is still faster than my 56k ;) | 20:01 |
| ybit | dxf, stl, stp... /me wonders how easy it is to convert between each | 20:02 |
| kanzure | it's not | 20:03 |
| kanzure | are you looking for something to do? | 20:03 |
| fenn | so of the stuff on that list, dxf2gcode, inkscape biarc, aptos, mesh2hmap/image-to-gcode | 20:04 |
| fenn | those are the most useful and reliable | 20:04 |
| fenn | (not counting heekscnc stuff) | 20:05 |
| fenn | VectorSection is a cool idea, dunno if it ever went anywhere | 20:06 |
| fenn | The goal is to be able to convert between and access most vector graphic file formats such as dxf, dwg, dgn, svg, pdf, ps, jpg, png, ogr, ifc. | 20:06 |
| fenn | i'm not sure jpg and png really belong in that list | 20:06 |
| ybit | 20:03 < kanzure> are you looking for something to do? | 20:07 |
| * ybit was afk just now. will be for another 20 mins in about 2 mins... but well, i'm working it out, a tutorial for the new skdb user. which will also help me in the process of what to work on after the site is templated | 20:09 | |
| ybit | 20:06 < fenn> i'm not sure jpg and png really belong in that list | 20:09 |
| ybit | me either | 20:09 |
| ybit | 2d representations of 3d models, that doesn't sound like fun | 20:10 |
| kanzure | there's a big juicy todo list in the skdb/doc/ folder | 20:10 |
| fenn | the neato inspiring documentation for rhizopod (formerly vectorsection) sees to have disappeared | 20:10 |
| fenn | nah dxf always was a 2D format | 20:10 |
| fenn | dwg too | 20:10 |
| fenn | then they hacked in 3d support some time in the 90's | 20:10 |
| fenn | "There are even more ways to help with VectorSection than with typical open-source projects. If you can write code, you can write a connector. It doesn't matter what language you know. " | 20:12 |
| fenn | "Q: There should be a C API." | 20:13 |
| fenn | "A: That's not a question." | 20:13 |
| drazak | haha | 20:14 |
| fenn | hey where did this come from http://openscad.org/ | 20:16 |
| ybit | wow, that's not bad, and a common license too | 20:19 |
| ybit | 20:10 < kanzure> there's a big juicy todo list in the skdb/doc/ folder | 20:19 |
| ybit | yeah, i've already went over it | 20:19 |
| ybit | it is juicy and helpful | 20:19 |
| kanzure | seems to only export STL | 20:20 |
| fenn | i think it is mostly just opencsg | 20:21 |
| fenn | with a goofy language tacked on | 20:21 |
| kanzure | what's with the goofy lang, yeah | 20:21 |
| fenn | maybe i should make python bindings to opencsg | 20:22 |
| kanzure | he mentions "structured terminal forms library" hrm | 20:23 |
| -!- tyson_ [n=tyson@68-114-130-93.dhcp.jcsn.tn.charter.com] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 20:24 | |
| kanzure | heh: http://www.clifford.at/fun/ | 20:24 |
| fenn | yes looks absolutely rambunctious~ | 20:27 |
| ybit | why was the GEOOM Salome package left out of the pythonocc install instructions on http://adl.serveftp.org/dokuwiki/pythonocc | 20:36 |
| kanzure | GEOM | 20:37 |
| kanzure | the -NO_GEOM is to make it work | 20:37 |
| kanzure | there's sgeom.sf.net floating around out there but i don't remember how to make that compatible | 20:37 |
| ybit | er, yeah, i meant geom, maybe if i switched over to a dvorak i would be more conscious of what i press | 20:39 |
| ybit | so why not geom? | 20:40 |
| ybit | too much hassle to get it working? | 20:40 |
| kanzure | joseph jackson might give us a ride from LA | 20:43 |
| ybit | that would be nice | 20:44 |
| * fenn finds this amusing http://www.almaden.ibm.com/cs/user/inddes/open.gif | 20:44 | |
| fenn | ybit: i never needed anything from salome and thus never installed it and thus didnt feel right including instructions that i didnt actually test | 20:45 |
| fenn | i often wish opencascade were simpler, so addin even more crap seemed like a bad idea | 20:45 |
| kanzure | he heh has guido and ed | 20:46 |
| kanzure | but anyway, he thinks he can fit us in | 20:46 |
| kanzure | he's driving in from sf | 20:47 |
| fenn | o rly | 20:47 |
| fenn | i might go to bay area; hijacking joseph's caravan sounds attractive | 20:48 |
| kanzure | there are some folks there that would like to house you | 20:48 |
| ybit | i call rooftop, fenn, bryan you will have to fight over who gets the rope tied to the trunk | 20:48 |
| kanzure | or at least put up with you for a few days at minimum | 20:48 |
| kanzure | i'll weld a chair to the front hood | 20:49 |
| fenn | i was going to hang out with my brother for a while, but others might be interesting too | 20:49 |
| kanzure | oh right, a brother | 20:49 |
| kanzure | i want you to meet steve, just because he's in the area | 20:49 |
| fenn | er, i still havent asked my brother or anything | 20:49 |
| kanzure | but there are others, like michael anissimov | 20:49 |
| ybit | dammit, python's api ref page froze fsckfox | 20:50 |
| fenn | fsckfox froze itself | 20:50 |
| ybit | something like that | 20:50 |
| kanzure | i don't know why anyone puts up with firefox | 20:50 |
| fenn | http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?DupTective | 20:50 |
| fenn | http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?CategoryDuplicationFindingTool | 20:52 |
| -!- corvinius [n=anonymou@202.20.3.32] has quit [] | 20:57 | |
| * ybit wonders why paul doesn't use salome | 21:03 | |
| ybit | kanzure: who's ed? | 21:18 |
| ybit | and is that Guido D. Nez-Mujica? | 21:18 |
| ybit | nez-mujica seems like an interesting character | 21:18 |
| fenn | ed probably is embraceunity.com | 21:20 |
| kanzure | ed miller | 21:20 |
| kanzure | yep | 21:20 |
| ybit | fenn: you're part of the hardware liberation front as well, aye? :P | 21:20 |
| fenn | ybit: i'm the founding member apparently | 21:20 |
| ybit | that must be frustrating with bryan being part of the people's hardware liberation front | 21:21 |
| fenn | you mean the hardware liberation front of the people | 21:21 |
| drazak | haha | 21:21 |
| fenn | "Porn will be the vanguard" | 21:24 |
| ybit | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DJOTEDBA2c :: was that really the quake engine, because it looks to me like they put the mouse in a windows 95 maze screensaver, poor rodent | 21:26 |
| fenn | that's not a mouse, it's a trackball! | 21:29 |
| fenn | but seriously where do i get one | 21:30 |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-35-235.public.utexas.edu] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)] | 21:38 | |
| -!- genehacker [i=genehack@wireless-128-62-35-44.public.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 22:01 | |
| ybit | a simple lego brick isn't a good example | 22:11 |
| ybit | it needs to be multiple legos forming something | 22:11 |
| ybit | that way skdb is actually useful | 22:11 |
| ybit | otherwise the user might as well use any cad/cam coupling | 22:11 |
| fenn | yeah, we talked about assemblies being a series of manufacturing techniques, such as press-fit or adhesive bonding | 22:12 |
| ybit | then again it could still just be useful as a database via agx-cache search | 22:12 |
| ybit | or whatever method chosen | 22:12 |
| ybit | kanzure: i think you linked to some lego cars at some point... | 22:14 |
| ybit | 'the most basic lego car i could make' isn't so basic | 22:14 |
| ybit | http://www.mocpages.com/moc.php/133253 | 22:14 |
| ybit | maybe we could do a convertible | 22:17 |
| ybit | or for the tutorial, just two brick combined to make a tetris piece | 22:17 |
| ybit | http://www.slipperybrick.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/10/imaginative-lego-clever-advertisement.jpg | 22:19 |
| kanzure | fenn: thought you might like this. https://store.iso.org/isoweb//order/OrderDownload.html | 22:20 |
| kanzure | also, i hate java | 22:21 |
| ybit | kanzure: what do you open that that with? | 22:23 |
| ybit | Iceweasel doesn't know how to open this address, because the protocol (ognl) isn't associated with any program. | 22:23 |
| ybit | it's java according wikipedia | 22:23 |
| ybit | Object-Graph Navigation Language (OGNL), created by OGNL Technology, is an open-source Expression Language (EL) for Java, | 22:23 |
| kanzure | those are the backend template files | 22:26 |
| kanzure | if you read through it you'll see they are doing some embedded scripting | 22:26 |
| ybit | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asZJHIpwpQ4, that doesn't seem too difficult | 22:26 |
| kanzure | anyway, that's how to figure out how to download ISO documents for free | 22:26 |
| kanzure | it looks like they are using a hash at least once, but it might just be a hash of the file name, for instance | 22:26 |
| kanzure | anyway | 22:26 |
| kanzure | ybit: fenn and i were originally thinking a good first demo project would be "skdb make spacebase" | 22:26 |
| kanzure | but in legos | 22:27 |
| kanzure | people need to understand that while it would be great for skdb to be a one night stand, | 22:27 |
| kanzure | it really takes some time (like any project) | 22:27 |
| kanzure | so the spacebase tutorials or project would be broken up into installments | 22:27 |
| kanzure | the first one would be making a basic lego spacebase framework.. also known as "a giant board" | 22:27 |
| kanzure | the second one, maybe you get some people | 22:27 |
| kanzure | third time around, maybe there's something new to get for your spacebase | 22:27 |
| kanzure | but the problem is you might as well be making /actual/ stuff | 22:28 |
| ybit | there's no reading through this: http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-222150_1024x768_scrot.png | 22:28 |
| kanzure | ybit: the html source | 22:28 |
| kanzure | silly | 22:28 |
| kanzure | nobody reads the web like that | 22:28 |
| kanzure | hey who's raping this server? | 22:29 |
| fenn | quit showing pictures of your scrot | 22:31 |
| ybit | :) | 22:31 |
| ybit | the base might have different 'terrain' different colored legos maybe? | 22:31 |
| -!- kanzure_ [n=kanzure@cpe-72-177-121-106.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap | 22:31 | |
| ybit | or even varying altitude (read: stacking bricks) | 22:31 |
| kanzure_ | ybit: what did i last send | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:27 < kanzure> third time around, maybe there's something new to get for your spacebase | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:28 < ybit> there's no reading through this: http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-222150_1024x768_scrot.png | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:28 < fenn> quit showing pictures of your scrot | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:29 < ybit> :) | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:29 < ybit> the base might have different 'terrain' different colored legos maybe? | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:30 -!- kanzure_ [n=kanzure@cpe-72-177-121-106.austin.res.rr.com] has joined #hplusroadmap | 22:31 |
| ybit | 22:30 < ybit> or even varying altitude (read: stacking bricks) | 22:31 |
| fenn | heh racing stripes | 22:31 |
| kanzure_ | lajfdkafjadsl | 22:31 |
| -!- kanzure_ [n=kanzure@cpe-72-177-121-106.austin.res.rr.com] has quit [Client Quit] | 22:31 | |
| fenn | oogajaboogawa | 22:32 |
| ybit | watch out, there's a 56k rapists on the loose | 22:32 |
| ybit | +dialup | 22:32 |
| ybit | grr | 22:33 |
| ybit | fenn, kanzure: are you thinking the board needs to be many pieces connected? or just one large plastic part with stubs sticking in an orderly fashion? | 22:39 |
| ybit | +out | 22:39 |
| fenn | it should be a graph, not just a tree or chain | 22:41 |
| fenn | some kinematics would be nice too | 22:41 |
| fenn | but i havent written any code for that yet | 22:41 |
| fenn | also there's no way to rotate bricks 90 yet either | 22:42 |
| kanzure | for the spacebase? i dunno | 22:47 |
| kanzure | how would you integrate technics into a spacebase design anyway | 22:47 |
| kanzure | "look, a regolith!" | 22:47 |
| bkero | ll | 22:48 |
| bkero | llll | 22:49 |
| ybit | isn't this just a simple copy here, copy there type thing from pythonocc's api? | 22:49 |
| ybit | ..for rotation | 22:49 |
| ybit | hi bkero | 22:49 |
| ybit | did you get my PM earlier? | 22:49 |
| bkero | sorry | 22:49 |
| bkero | yea brb | 22:49 |
| ybit | no probs | 22:49 |
| ybit | alright | 22:49 |
| ybit | fenn ^ | 22:50 |
| ybit | ...or the misanthrope the hardware liberation front of the people | 22:51 |
| ybit | +of | 22:51 |
| ybit | grr, why am i completely missing words on a regular basis (rhetorical, please don't answer) | 22:51 |
| fenn | kanzure: the classic space base had these radar dome panel things that swiveled out | 22:52 |
| kanzure | ybit: pythonocc's api is just opencascade crammed down swig's throat | 22:55 |
| kanzure | opencascade doesn't do part mating | 22:56 |
| kanzure | so it doesn't know about revolute joints | 22:56 |
| kanzure | ODE does, so that's what i was supposed to be doing for the past month | 22:56 |
| kanzure | yet-another-dependency | 22:56 |
| kanzure | right now if you notice, paths.py just kinda builds a wall | 22:56 |
| kanzure | even though the legos should be able to be rotated.. well. now you know why | 22:56 |
| kanzure | haa | 23:00 |
| kanzure | how much should i pay for an ISO document that usually costs 92 chf? | 23:01 |
| kanzure | ping? anyone | 23:01 |
| ybit | oh noes, not this part | 23:02 |
| ybit | http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-225529_1024x768_scrot.png | 23:02 |
| * ybit prepares to see this for a long time: http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-225545_1024x768_scrot.png | 23:02 | |
| ybit | or just ctl-c and hope it picks another part | 23:03 |
| ybit | it, being paths.py | 23:03 |
| ybit | isn't someone in here from switzerland? | 23:04 |
| ybit | wouldn't someone be willing to share teh iso doc? | 23:04 |
| kanzure | iso docs cost money | 23:04 |
| kanzure | well, usually | 23:04 |
| kanzure | anyway, how about a tenth of a penny | 23:04 |
| ybit | so do some books which i get for free | 23:04 |
| ybit | you name your price? | 23:05 |
| kanzure | yeah but iso docs aren't running around the net really | 23:05 |
| kanzure | no, but they have stupid programmers working for them | 23:05 |
| kanzure | they put the price in HTML on their order page | 23:05 |
| kanzure | as a form value | 23:05 |
| ybit | hah. | 23:05 |
| kanzure | :) | 23:05 |
| kanzure | the ISP at my college dorm did the same thing | 23:05 |
| ybit | if it works out for you, i say go for it | 23:05 |
| ybit | did that work out as well? | 23:06 |
| kanzure | yes | 23:06 |
| ybit | haha, nice | 23:06 |
| kanzure | i paid $0.37 for my semester of 10 MB/sec connectivity on two machines | 23:06 |
| kanzure | i had to register two accounts actually | 23:06 |
| kanzure | they only allowed one mac address to be associated with a payment | 23:06 |
| ybit | wow, did they find out eventually? | 23:06 |
| kanzure | no | 23:06 |
| ybit | that's the best story i've heard this hour :) | 23:07 |
| kanzure | anyway, http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-225545_1024x768_scrot.png is because it's randomly putting parts together | 23:08 |
| kanzure | it's not even searching for the first compatible part | 23:08 |
| ybit | yup, and it continues to do so: http://ybit.ath.cx/images/2009-10-29-230238_1024x768_scrot.png | 23:08 |
| kanzure | oh there's also the problem with the round brick that i still don't understand | 23:08 |
| ybit | which is? | 23:09 |
| kanzure | what you're seeing. | 23:09 |
| ybit | hmm | 23:09 |
| kanzure | sorry, i got confused. you're seeing the problem with the round brick | 23:09 |
| kanzure | fenn: what's the brick that should never ever be used as the starting brick? | 23:10 |
| ybit | np, so what is the problem exactly... and why does it matter that you can't rotate the lego bricks if you can rotate the view? | 23:10 |
| kanzure | the bricks have an orientation in the CAD file | 23:12 |
| kanzure | because of this, when you make a new 2x2 lego brick, it has the same orientation as in the CAD file | 23:13 |
| fenn | the round brick gets messed up for some reason (something to do with the coincidence detector) | 23:13 |
| kanzure | that orientation in the CAD file is not expressive of all possible orientations of the lego.. | 23:13 |
| kanzure | this is a terrible explanation | 23:13 |
| kanzure | what if you have 2 bricks that need to go together, how do you "rotate the view" to fix /that/? | 23:14 |
| fenn | ybit: you can rotate the connection between two bricks by 90 degrees right? | 23:14 |
| fenn | ybit: but we dont have any code for that yet because i havent implemented kinematics (which would allow you to rotate around one stud) | 23:14 |
| ybit | kinematics via ODE? | 23:16 |
| * kanzure twitches http://www.iso.org/static/payment-template.html | 23:16 | |
| kanzure | yeah i was thinking of just importing pyODE | 23:16 |
| * ybit removes any trace of his talk in hsv *shudder* | 23:17 | |
| * kanzure spots free software on iso.org https://store.iso.org/isoweb/js/filterlist.js | 23:19 | |
| kanzure | it's a gnu saffari | 23:19 |
| ybit | haha, the payment-template :D | 23:20 |
| ybit | you might be known as the guy who pirated ISO before long :) | 23:20 |
| ybit | and Nature | 23:20 |
| ybit | so fenn, what are you working on currently in skdb? and you kanzure? | 23:22 |
| ybit | what is the timeline here, what are you both realistically hoping to complete within about 2 months? | 23:22 |
| ybit | kind of hard to write a tutorial if it doesn't work, but this is what i was hoping to figure out, why it doesn't work and where my energy can be used (aside from putting up a wiki on bkero's server) | 23:23 |
| fenn | umm.. another wiki would not be helping anything | 23:24 |
| ybit | i'd like to work on getting the first tutorial out, which would be a spaceport (ala base plates) | 23:24 |
| fenn | ok we dont have any way to load 'saved' lego configurations | 23:24 |
| ybit | fenn: the wiki is djangit or hatta, for the website.. for people to share what they have (later on) | 23:24 |
| fenn | on the other hand i'm not sure i really want to do too much with legos, it's sort of endless | 23:25 |
| ybit | it's nothing to it, it's a matter of just running it | 23:25 |
| ybit | are you referring to the number of parts? | 23:25 |
| fenn | yeah | 23:25 |
| fenn | have you played with lego digital designer? | 23:26 |
| ybit | no | 23:26 |
| fenn | well, making a clone of that would be pretty cool | 23:26 |
| fenn | i had the same idea from the beginning as ldd | 23:26 |
| fenn | but it shouldn't be all about legos | 23:26 |
| fenn | i really dont think it's time for a tutorial yet | 23:27 |
| ybit | of course, but i would like to get to that point | 23:27 |
| fenn | ok well.. /me looks at todo list | 23:28 |
| ybit | that's the goal, now how to get there, what needs to be implemented... hmm. that's a good idea | 23:28 |
| ybit | fenn: still though, what are you working on in skdb currently? | 23:28 |
| fenn | i'm not doing anything in skdb currently | 23:29 |
| fenn | this morning i was answering samrose's question about metric screws which reminded me i'd never finished some of the threads code i was working on | 23:29 |
| fenn | so i'll probably finish that first if i do work on anything | 23:30 |
| ybit | kanzure: what are you working on? | 23:30 |
| ybit | i'm assuming you mean tonight or within the next day. | 23:30 |
| ybit | fenn ^ | 23:30 |
| fenn | ybit: why? | 23:31 |
| ybit | i'm just wondering | 23:31 |
| ybit | 23:28 < ybit> that's the goal, now how to get there, what needs to be implemented... hmm. that's a good idea | 23:31 |
| fenn | you probably would have gotten a better answer 2 months ago | 23:32 |
| fenn | i'd like for someone to investigate ODE.. maybe a simple demonstration of lego bricks falling or something | 23:32 |
| ybit | why aren't you working on skdb? | 23:33 |
| fenn | burnout | 23:33 |
| fenn | it doesn't do anything interesting enough to hold my attention | 23:33 |
| fenn | i should be working on this wearable thing while i still have access to my electronics gear | 23:34 |
| fenn | hah | 23:34 |
| fenn | i'm such a dumbass, i passed up myvu crystals at $119 buy it now on ebay | 23:36 |
| fenn | ybit: what have you been doing lately? | 23:38 |
| genehacker | you have a heads up display fenn? | 23:40 |
| fenn | not yet | 23:40 |
| fenn | i know you're all probably sick of hearing about it | 23:40 |
| ybit | fenn: last week i wasted time brainstorming names, had a site up by this week, and am now realizing that we need a cad file for a baseplate | 23:42 |
| ybit | also wasted time with audio voice recording explaining the site, meant to be overlayed on an animation | 23:42 |
| genehacker | there's a new heads up display coming out with 800*600 resolution | 23:43 |
| fenn | yeah yeah whatever | 23:44 |
| fenn | it's not $170 on ebay though is it | 23:44 |
| ybit | and there was a lot of cherrypy and cheetah documentation read | 23:44 |
| fenn | and probably huge goggly obtrusion sticking off your face | 23:44 |
| genehacker | also does the pressure angle of an involute change along the length of the involute? | 23:44 |
| fenn | ybit: did you ever do anything with cherrypy? | 23:44 |
| ybit | about as much as kanzure did :P | 23:45 |
| fenn | well, uh, hm. why doesnt anyone do anything useful :P | 23:46 |
| ybit | the cheetah templates this week was a nice surprise | 23:46 |
| fenn | i mean just add some cherrypy functions to the existing code, and it'll do stuff! | 23:50 |
| ybit | ? | 23:50 |
| fenn | that's the whole point of cherrypy right? | 23:50 |
| ybit | doing stuff? | 23:50 |
| ybit | i thought that was nike's job. | 23:50 |
| fenn | that you dont have to design a website | 23:50 |
| fenn | you just add stuff to the existing code | 23:51 |
| --- Log closed Thu Oct 29 23:51:00 2009 | ||
| --- Log opened Thu Oct 29 23:51:27 2009 | ||
| -!- kanzure [i=bryan@dhcp-84-36.me.utexas.edu] has joined #hplusroadmap | 23:51 | |
| -!- Irssi: #hplusroadmap: Total of 27 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 27 normal] | 23:51 | |
| ybit | you didn't miss anything | 23:51 |
| ybit | fenn: so the point is to allow other potentially interested beings to join in on the fun | 23:52 |
| -!- Irssi: Join to #hplusroadmap was synced in 74 secs | 23:52 | |
| ybit | oh, i read incorrectly, that's python package deps, poo | 23:54 |
Generated by irclog2html.py 2.15.0.dev0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at mg.pov.lt!
