| --- Day changed Wed Apr 28 2010 | ||
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| fenn | red green blue yellow white black | 01:16 |
|---|---|---|
| fenn | black prints really nice.. need to get more of that | 01:17 |
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| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone. | 05:28 |
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| kanzure | http://makerblock.com/2010/04/open-source-monopolies-unicorns-and-perpetual-motion-machines/ | 06:34 |
| kanzure | http://www.slideshare.net/adafruit/open-source-hardware-and-the-web | 06:35 |
| kanzure | http://www.flickr.com/photos/tags/opensourcehardware/ | 06:37 |
| kanzure | http://freedomdefined.org/OSHW | 06:38 |
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| kanzure | http://www.scivee.tv/ is probably like jove? | 06:47 |
| kanzure | "citizen scientists and their contributions to internet-based chemistry" http://www.scivee.tv/node/14770 | 06:47 |
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| * kanzure heads over to the frost bank building | 07:46 | |
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| kanzure | hm it turns out they have my dad's name on record | 08:31 |
| kanzure | (i'm here for completely different, coincidental reasons) | 08:32 |
| * kanzure is in DLA piper | 08:32 | |
| kanzure | "The President just approved $8 billion in loan guarantees to build a new conventional nuke plant in the State of Georgia. All of the new plants being | 08:39 |
| kanzure | considered rely on federal loan guarantees for construction financing. What this means is that nuke plants are not economically viable without federal (taxpayer)" | 08:39 |
| kanzure | "assistance. Under current planning there would be a minimum of 8 new plants with $80-$100 billion in federal loan guarantees. In addition to this subsidy | 08:39 |
| kanzure | there are also operating subsidies for nukes." | 08:39 |
| * kanzure wonders what a "zwitterion" is | 08:44 | |
| kanzure | "I have a graduate student who is trying to classify a system that he has created. He is using one substance that is a zwitterion and one substance that starts off neutral. The two combine to form a molten, low-melting complex. | 08:44 |
| kanzure | He would like to know if there are other substances of this nature and whether they have been classified as ionic liquids or eutectic solvents." | 08:44 |
| kanzure | "We have tried a few different searches to determine if other such substances exist, mostly using keyword searches in SciFinder, Inspec, Compendex, ISI, and Scopus. We tried a few structure searches, mostly in SciFinder, Reaxys, and Gmelin CrossFire, but we didn't get much." | 08:44 |
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| genehacker | whoa, it cost $100,000 in energy to make 1 kg of mechanosynthetic replicators | 09:08 |
| genehacker | in energy terms that is VERY energy intensive | 09:09 |
| genehacker | ~ 20,000 KWh/kg | 09:10 |
| JayDugger | A zwitterion names an ion with a charge of -2 or +2, IIRC. | 09:12 |
| JayDugger | What are eutectic solvents? | 09:13 |
| genehacker | in comparison, injection molding takes ~3 KWh/kg and RepRap takes 6-20 | 09:13 |
| genehacker | http://www.molecularassembler.com/KSRM/Figures/4.42.JPG | 09:13 |
| JayDugger | When the NRC charges US$4.5 million per reactor (not power plant, just 1 reactor) in annual licensing fees, loan guarantees make a certain amount of sense. | 09:14 |
| JayDugger | Hard to turn a profit with anything small, but building extra-large sizes for profitability makes iterative learning very hard and the failure's costs very high. | 09:15 |
| JayDugger | Even with these man-made disadvantages, fission still powers a good fraction of human civilization. Not bad for a technology under a century old. | 09:16 |
| JayDugger | And in further comparison, I can buy a RepRap, and Freitas probably writes his usual paper machinery. (If we had atomic precision, we could expect it to cost this much to build to atomic precision.) | 09:17 |
| JayDugger | And even so, a good many products don't need atomic placement accuracy of <10e-10. | 09:19 |
| JayDugger | Heck, I doubt you could expose many drugs to the air for very long with ruining that rate. (I admit that's a WAG.) | 09:19 |
| genehacker | yeah | 09:20 |
| genehacker | the point is proposed molecular assemblers are incredibly inefficient | 09:20 |
| JayDugger | Point taken. Does he emphasize the designs exist for easy analysis, not optimal production? | 09:21 |
| genehacker | I'm not sure | 09:22 |
| genehacker | I think they need to redesign mechanosynthesis to be less energy intensive | 09:22 |
| JayDugger | Well... | 09:23 |
| genehacker | the thing is the process generates lots of heat, they're trying to get rid of the heat by pumping it out | 09:23 |
| genehacker | biological systems reuse the heat I think | 09:24 |
| JayDugger | we have a range of manufacturing techniques that vary, depending on the end product among other things. | 09:24 |
| JayDugger | Some take a great deal of energy at high density, | 09:24 |
| JayDugger | Others--less so. | 09:24 |
| genehacker | what else takes 20,000 kwh/kg of product produced? | 09:25 |
| JayDugger | Compare hot house agriculture with open air farming. | 09:25 |
| JayDugger | Off the top of my head? | 09:25 |
| genehacker | off the top of your head | 09:25 |
| JayDugger | Armor ceramics? | 09:25 |
| genehacker | I doubt it | 09:25 |
| JayDugger | I admit: another guess on my part. | 09:25 |
| JayDugger | Do microchips take that much energy to make? | 09:26 |
| JayDugger | Fuel rods for atomic power plants? | 09:26 |
| JayDugger | Radionuclides for cancer therapies? | 09:26 |
| genehacker | maybe | 09:26 |
| JayDugger | Guesses all, I confess. | 09:26 |
| genehacker | maybe radionuclide | 09:26 |
| JayDugger | Yeah, but that one's a bit of a cheat, since it has such small product mass. | 09:27 |
| JayDugger | Perhaps jewelry-quality synthetic gems? | 09:27 |
| JayDugger | I expect, given the high energy input and the low error rate of Freitas's examples, that the given design represents only a small spot in the design space. Other designs might trade-off error rate for lower energy, or higher speed. | 09:31 |
| JayDugger | We don't generally mill forks and spoons from solid metal nowadays, much less use EDM. | 09:32 |
| JayDugger | Stamping costs much less for a low-precision product like silverware. | 09:32 |
| JayDugger | Happy reading, genehacker! | 09:34 |
| JayDugger | Good morning, everyone. | 09:34 |
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| genehacker | so let's see it here it takes 0.17 MJ per 2 gram DRAM | 09:35 |
| genehacker | yeah stamping cost way less | 09:35 |
| genehacker | 23 KW/kg of 32 MB dram | 09:38 |
| genehacker | that's surprising | 09:38 |
| genehacker | *23 KWh/kg | 09:38 |
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| kanzure | http://wyss.harvard.edu/viewevent/43/new-directions-in-synthetic-biology | 13:45 |
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| hundred-ideas | any suggestions on best DNA stain to use for electrophoreses, or where to buy it? | 13:49 |
| hundred-ideas | I've referred to http://bitesizebio.com/2008/03/03/ethidium-bromide-the-alternatives/ | 13:49 |
| kanzure | avoid ethidium bromide | 13:50 |
| kanzure | cyberstain or whatever is the standard these days | 13:50 |
| kanzure | sybergold or something? | 13:50 |
| kanzure | gah i forget the name | 13:50 |
| hundred-ideas | sybrsafe | 13:50 |
| kanzure | thanks. | 13:50 |
| hundred-ideas | sybrgreen, and sybrgold? | 13:50 |
| kanzure | hundred-ideas: hey, let me send you a demo of the flashmob stuff | 13:52 |
| kanzure | one sec | 13:52 |
| hundred-ideas | wow, so it's not sms? | 13:53 |
| kanzure | it can do sms and voice :) | 13:53 |
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| kanzure | hi quantumkat | 15:20 |
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| JayDugger | Good evening, everyone. | 17:33 |
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| kristianpaul | JayDugger: hey there | 17:48 |
| bkero | Someone here know about bicycles? | 17:49 |
| * kanzure wonders where dave went | 17:50 | |
| kanzure | he runs a custom bicycle fab shop here in austin | 17:50 |
| kanzure | and recently took fenn's hextatic parts | 17:50 |
| ybit3 | can i has an alternative gradient magnetometer and an x-ray difractometer plz? | 18:11 |
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| kanzure | ybit3: depends on the price. link me to an ebay auction and i might be able to spot the cash. | 18:30 |
| fenn | meh: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/02/magazine/02self-measurement-t.html?pagewanted=2 | 18:33 |
| fenn | er, http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/02/magazine/02self-measurement-t.html | 18:33 |
| * fenn rides to dojo to study cs229 | 18:34 | |
| kanzure | oh look it's gary | 18:34 |
| kanzure | wow fenn got in the nytimes before i did | 18:34 |
| kanzure | impressive | 18:34 |
| fenn | i'm older, it's not fair | 18:35 |
| fenn | let's see if i can ride to palo alto caltrain before the train gets there | 18:35 |
| ybit3 | kanzure: heh, i don't think you want to spend ~$10k | 18:36 |
| kanzure | ybit3: maybe i do | 18:38 |
| kanzure | god damn it, when i tell you people i have money, *I MEAN IT* | 18:38 |
| kanzure | jf;k;kjf;kjf | 18:38 |
| kanzure | :P | 18:38 |
| JayDugger | Didn't you want to have some dental work? | 18:38 |
| ybit3 | okay okay, calm down, we can spend your money, no need to get frustrated, not just hand it over | 18:38 |
| kanzure | JayDugger: want? No, it was kind of forced on me by others. | 18:38 |
| ybit3 | s/not/now | 18:38 |
| kanzure | err | 18:38 |
| kanzure | heh | 18:38 |
| kanzure | don't know if it works like that though :D | 18:39 |
| JayDugger | Your own teeth, I guess. :/ | 18:39 |
| kanzure | well, it was just some dental work that had to be done | 18:39 |
| ybit3 | it's as simple as giving a donation via paypal to heathmatlock@gmail.com | 18:39 |
| kanzure | i'm not going to do donations | 18:39 |
| kanzure | only specific items and things to buy, preferably. | 18:39 |
| JayDugger | Considered LASIK? | 18:39 |
| ybit3 | think of it more of an investment that may never pay off | 18:40 |
| kanzure | JayDugger: why are you suggesting things like this to spend money on? | 18:40 |
| kanzure | i mean, why not manufacturing tools/toys? | 18:40 |
| JayDugger | Self-improvement has a good yield. | 18:40 |
| ybit3 | good attitude takes your further though | 18:40 |
| JayDugger | How often will you use tool X? | 18:40 |
| JayDugger | How often will you use your eyes? | 18:40 |
| kanzure | doesn't lasik have some threshold at which point it no longer offers an improvement | 18:40 |
| ybit3 | congrats on making it to nytimes fenn :) | 18:41 |
| JayDugger | Yeah, I don't think it affects presbyopia, and not everyone's a candidate. | 18:41 |
| * kanzure nods | 18:41 | |
| kanzure | on the other hand, | 18:41 |
| kanzure | it's probably the last place fenn wants to be | 18:42 |
| JayDugger | You can wait for refractive lens exchange to reach FDA approval, though. | 18:42 |
| ybit3 | what? are you kidding me kanzure? he won't stop talking about it in #noisebridge | 18:42 |
| ybit3 | (kidding) | 18:42 |
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| JayDugger | That will affect presbyopia and extreme farsightedness. | 18:43 |
| ybit3 | kanzure: what's too expensive? | 18:53 |
| ybit3 | $10k? | 18:53 |
| kanzure | no | 18:53 |
| ybit3 | $15k? | 18:53 |
| ybit3 | hehe, you know where this is going | 18:53 |
| kanzure | that's why i'm not going to let you do big giant cash wads all at once | 18:54 |
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| fenn | kanzure can i get a bluetooth tooth implant? | 19:30 |
| fenn | then you can hear the delicious sounds of me eating orange chocolate sherbet | 19:32 |
| fenn | (the real reason i'm at the dojo today) | 19:32 |
| fenn | i dont see why this isn't a real buyable-now product: http://www.impactlab.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/bluetooth-tooth-304.jpg | 19:37 |
| fenn | "not valid in alaska, hawaii, or any lunar colony" | 19:38 |
| jrayhawk | same reason most awesome thing never get made: liability issues | 19:45 |
| fenn | well i'm down to make a tooth that does more than chew | 19:51 |
| jrayhawk | eating while on the phone would be very unpleasant for the other parties involved | 19:52 |
| fenn | it would be more for input anyway | 19:52 |
| fenn | i dont think you'd get a very good sound from a tooth microphone | 19:53 |
| fenn | could be wrong | 19:53 |
| jrayhawk | You guys should get cozy with the bmezine community. They have a lot of experience in the field ofbeing guinea pigs to amateur surgeries and implantations. | 19:53 |
| fenn | also you could offer it to schizophrenics that think the government has implanted radio tooth for mind control blah blah | 19:57 |
| fenn | then they'd know what a real tooth implant is like | 19:57 |
| fenn | jrayhawk: or maybe not | 19:59 |
| fenn | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dental_tourism | 20:11 |
| JayDugger | Such a tooth might serve well for in-mouth chemical analysis while eating, and with sufficient work, tracking the microorganism population of the mouth. | 20:15 |
| JayDugger | Mouth pH over time might not take too much work. | 20:18 |
| JayDugger | IANAD(entist). | 20:18 |
| ybit3 | kanzure: the gradient magnetometer, it requires a water-cooled electromagnet typically, a dc power supply that can sweep current at up to 50A, a lock in amplifier, and a hall probe. the rest of the system could be home built, with time and a little expertise. the magnet/power supplies can be done, but you don't come across them frequently, and all this on the order of 10-12K | 20:23 |
| fenn | umm, what for? | 20:23 |
| ybit3 | the x-ray system, er, i give up on it for now | 20:23 |
| fenn | 50A MRI machine? | 20:24 |
| JayDugger | What use had you for an x-ray source? | 20:24 |
| katsmeow-afk | weld crack detection | 20:24 |
| ybit3 | i dunno, i've been reading up on nanomaterials lately | 20:24 |
| ybit3 | i was wanting to experiment with the magnetism of some materials JayDugger | 20:25 |
| JayDugger | Ah. | 20:26 |
| JayDugger | Good night, all. | 20:26 |
| ybit3 | gn | 20:26 |
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| -!- ybit3 is now known as ybit | 20:26 | |
| -!- ybit is now known as ybit3 | 20:26 | |
| ybit3 | well, kanzure, there you go, if you need a formal proposal, i can do that. | 20:27 |
| * ybit3 sleeps before 8 hours of census work | 20:27 | |
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| fenn | dammit. now i dont remember who i'm supposed to email about this stupid magazine article | 21:21 |
| * bkero giggles. http://ftp.osuosl.org/pub/ubuntu-releases/.pool/ubuntu-10.04-desktop-amd64.iso | 21:50 | |
| -!- klafka [~klafka@cpe-66-66-5-254.rochester.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep] | 21:57 | |
| fenn | why is that funny?kero: | 22:04 |
| bkero | It doesn't come out until tomorrow | 22:05 |
| kanzure | fenn: isn't 1kfriend.ly supposed to solve that "now i dont remember who i'm supposed to email about this stupid magazine article" problem? | 22:27 |
| fenn | exactly | 22:32 |
| fenn | do you even have the host name? | 22:33 |
| kanzure | no, it's $70/year | 22:34 |
| fenn | damn those prehensile libyans! | 22:35 |
| katsmeow-afk | http://www.fusor.net/ | 23:00 |
| fenn | shock wave fusion? | 23:04 |
| fenn | isnt that just bubble fusion with extra money thrown at it? | 23:04 |
| katsmeow-afk | i wasn't studying it, i just tossed it out as a possible means to power makerbot things | 23:05 |
| fenn | uhh.. no | 23:08 |
| katsmeow-afk | don't need "free electricity"? | 23:08 |
| fenn | they only use like 50W | 23:08 |
| fenn | less than a refrigerator | 23:08 |
| * katsmeow-afk is going to shut up now, knowing that any more words will only make more people more angry at her | 23:09 | |
| fenn | grr! stupid kat! | 23:10 |
| * kanzure pokes the other kat | 23:10 | |
| fenn | sigh. i suck at doing homework | 23:10 |
| bkero | watch this instead: http://vimeo.com/10149605 | 23:26 |
| fenn | woah i wanna play that game so hard i could spend someone else's money on it | 23:29 |
| quantumkat | Does anyone know of any neuroscience podcasts or videos? I don't mean neuroscience news or anything like "the neuroscience of creativity," but something more like a lecture? | 23:36 |
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